Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #crimsonfu, 2015-01-15

crimsonfu - sysadmins who code

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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14:28 pdurbin if anyone would like to come to lunch on Tuesday with me and a founder of http://openhatch.org please let me know. codex larsks tfhartmann
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15:09 pdurbin and a very cool person who works there: http://irclogs.jackgrigg.com/irc.freenode.net/openhatch/2015-01-15#i_3546403
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17:22 semiosis ejabberd is great but so frustrating.  ubuntu packages dont support mysql, but they run at boot.  upstream install includes mysql support, but won't start at boot.  argggh
17:35 pdurbin is the e for erlang?
17:35 pdurbin whorka: I can't believe you'd never heard of https://twitter.com/php_ceo
17:40 semiosis yes
17:40 semiosis the e is for erlang
17:40 semiosis and for extremely frustrating
17:43 pdurbin searchbot: lucky mostly erlang
17:43 searchbot pdurbin: http://mostlyerlang.com/
17:44 pdurbin they have a nice podcast though
17:49 pdurbin let it crash
17:54 bear if your using ejabberd I would recommend prosody instead
17:55 semiosis i'm ready to throw this thing out the window
17:55 semiosis finally get the db working and now some obscure bug prevents login
17:55 semiosis people saying they had to compile latest erlang from source to get past it
17:55 semiosis wtaf
17:56 semiosis bear: all i need is TLS encryption and server-managed shared buddy list.  this is a private chat server for our small company, everyone is on a single buddy list
17:56 bear yea, that's why I prefer prosody - it tracks the latest xmpp requirements, uses lua which is a much saner language to debug/work with and is very stable
17:56 semiosis bear: can prosody do that?
17:56 bear yep
17:56 semiosis thanks!
17:57 bear stock prosody from the debian/ubuntu package will get you that
17:57 semiosis oh another thing i need, no local storage
17:57 pdurbin semiosis: you know bear is on some XMPP board, right?
17:57 bear you can use sqlite, mysql, flat file, ... all in the config
17:57 semiosis this is running on a transient ec2 instance
17:57 semiosis woooo!
17:57 semiosis my hero
17:57 semiosis pdurbin: did not know that
17:57 bear http://prosody.im/doc/mysql
17:58 bear last year I was the chairman of the XSF Board
17:58 bear this year I took a break :)
17:58 semiosis nice
18:02 semiosis and prosody has their own upstream apt repo! \o/
18:03 semiosis glad i decided to complain in here :)
18:04 pdurbin that's what #crimsonfu is for
18:04 dotplus bear: do you happen to whether hipchat/slack/whatever the cisco thing is called are built on top of prosody/ejabberd/something opensource or whether they each have their own thing?
18:04 * pdurbin high fives tfhartmann
18:05 bear yea, cisco's chat service uses xmpp on the backed IIRC
18:05 bear the original "Jabber" team got bought by cisco way back
18:06 bear webex and it's variants
18:06 dotplus They all use XMPP, I was wondering if you knew about the whether server implementations were prosody/ejabberd/whatever
18:07 bear I haven't looked that deep
18:08 dotplus no worries, just curious and it sounded like you might be more likely to know than a quick stfw might reveal
18:10 bear you can always point xmpp.net at the domain - it will spit out what it discovers
18:17 dotplus interesting, but that only appears to look at security aspects dns, tls protocols/ciphers, not server software.
18:19 bear hmm, I thought it reported server signatures...
18:21 bear ah - they have s2s blocked for it - so server guessing is blocked
18:33 semiosis sadly the groups feature in prosody doesnt store in the db, and afaict from the docs there's no wildcard... i would have to edit the config file every time we add/remove a user
18:33 semiosis bear: does that sound right?
18:33 semiosis or am i missing something
18:34 bear yea, I think your missing something
18:34 bear group - do you mean a group of users?
18:34 semiosis http://prosody.im/doc/modules/mod_groups
18:35 semiosis says i have to explicitly list the usernames
18:35 bear ah
18:35 semiosis but i just want one group with all users
18:35 bear let me ask if they have that set so you can use a bot to configure...
18:36 semiosis thx
18:41 semiosis maybe i'll submit a patch to add that feature :)
18:41 bear :)
18:42 semiosis i can live with this text file config for now
18:42 bear the prosody devs are all in europe, so getting an answer can be slow
18:42 semiosis deploying a new server image when someone joins/leaves the company isn't *that* big of a deal
18:42 bear they are a friendly lot - you can jump on their chat room and ask anything
18:42 semiosis i'm sure i will
18:42 bear you could probably update the config and then just use prosodyctl command to bounce the group module
18:43 bear it would be a -HUP type config update
18:43 semiosis this is an immutable server image
18:43 bear oof
18:43 bear so yea, a patch to get it to use a data store instead of a flatfile would be most welcome
18:47 semiosis i was thinking a patch to support a wildcard term for all registered users
18:47 semiosis and still using flatfile
18:48 semiosis that seems like an easier patch to start with
18:48 bear ah - yea
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19:10 dotplus semiosis: won't your CM take care of that for you? or are you trying to avoid bouncing the service every time you want to add a user or something like that?
19:22 GWG I need some server advice of a different nature
19:23 GWG My server at home has ded
19:23 GWG died
19:24 GWG Trying to decide if I should go RAID 5
19:26 bear in some ways the raid question is how much the drives cost vs how long you can afford to be offline
19:27 bear if you don't mind being offline, then raid 2 (mirroring) is doable, if you don't want to be offline then raid 5 is an option
19:27 dotplus think about what you're trying to achieve. Is your data (easily) recreatable? Will you cry if it's gone? Are you going to setup monitoring (and act on any alerts!) to show when a disk goes bad? what kind of usage do you expect?
19:28 semiosis dotplus: cm only runs to build the image, once it's deployed to the cluster it's immutable
19:28 dotplus bear: raid2 is striping, raid 1 is mirroring
19:28 semiosis cluster of one in this case, autoscaling just makes sure there's one alive
19:28 bear dotplus - ah, thanks - i'm always getting that wrong
19:29 semiosis might scrap the whole IM server thing and signup for one of those SaaS products pdurbin mentioned
19:29 semiosis more trouble than it's worth
19:30 dotplus eh, I would think that for a small outfit who are already comfortable managing stuff, it's easy enough to add one more simple service
19:30 GWG I thought it was 0 and 1
19:30 dotplus but otoh, there's always the "focus on your core competencies" against that
19:30 GWG But, I've only had rare hard drive failures
19:30 GWG I just had a motherboard failure
19:31 dotplus raid Z
19:32 pdurbin that I mentioned?
19:33 semiosis [13:04] <dotplus> bear: do you happen to whether hipchat/slack/whatever the cisco thing is called are built on top of prosody/ejabberd/something opensource or whether they each have their own thing?
19:33 semiosis that definitely not pdurbin saying that
19:33 semiosis brain not working on account of cold or flu
19:33 pdurbin I think my wife's startup is using slack.
19:33 bear slack is good, but heck, you could also just go with one of the new hosted irc's
19:34 semiosis that's not going to work for us. 80% of the company is not devs
19:34 semiosis 90%?
19:35 bear slack works well then - desktop clients, mobile clents - very very non-dev friendly
19:36 bear or you can use something like gitter-im - and tie it to a private repo
19:36 pdurbin wife approval factor
19:40 dotplus Also very non-dev friendly: http://www.webex.com/projectsquared/ (Disclaimer: I work for Cisco which owns webex)
19:40 dotplus just not for that bit of Cisco. or indeed anywhere near it.
19:42 semiosis wow there sure are a lot of choices
19:43 dotplus hire me as a consultant and I will research your needs, the options, recommend something suitable and help you implement/make the most of it.
19:43 dotplus actually, I'm kidding. I don't do that sort of thing any more.
19:43 semiosis lol
19:54 semiosis project squared doesn't even have pricing info
19:54 semiosis scary
20:05 semiosis hipchat has a native linux client.  SOLD!
21:27 pdurbin man, whatever happend to http://crimsonfu.github.io/members/agoddard
21:27 pdurbin that guy was great
21:35 pdurbin and shuff. I remember shuff
21:36 pdurbin shuff and whorka: please prepare a warm welcome
22:00 whorka warming the phasers
22:08 pdurbin heh. stun is fine
22:22 shuff hey, prosody!  i love it
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23:03 Topic for #crimsonfu is now http://crimsonfu.github.com - ConfiguRatIon Management of Systems Or Network kung FU | logs at http://irclog.perlgeek.de/crimsonfu/today
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