Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #crimsonfu, 2015-03-08

crimsonfu - sysadmins who code

| Channels | #crimsonfu index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:27 tfhartmann joined #crimsonfu
01:14 pdurbin cruxybox
02:04 prologic heh
06:34 JoeJulian joined #crimsonfu
12:55 larsks prologic: Have you see alpine linux? Busybox + a package manager...but not related to crux.
12:55 larsks It makes for great minimal docker images.
13:09 prologic not sure if I have
13:09 prologic got a link?
13:13 pdurbin huh. "Alpine uses its own package management system, apk-tools" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpine_Linux
13:19 prologic ta
21:25 pdurbin prologic: fancy new stuff. I had never heard of https://matt.ucc.asn.au/dropbear/dropbear.html nor http://troglobit.com/finit.html
21:32 prologic yeah :)
21:33 prologic all of which my os are using
21:33 prologic finit is great btw
21:33 prologic lovely init system
21:33 prologic my main concern now is a package manager
21:33 prologic but it's hard to decide on what language to write it in
21:33 pdurbin I'm not used to the new init systems.
21:33 prologic of all the alternative I've considered
21:33 prologic I think finit is the simplest t ouse and get your head around
21:34 prologic and has just the "right" number of features
21:34 prologic although I'm in talks with the dev to optionally drop inetd support
21:34 prologic and I'm not really using the plugin system either
21:37 pdurbin I guess the older init systems work well enough for me and my modest needs.
21:39 prologic sure they do :)
21:39 prologic you have no choice :)
21:39 prologic haha
21:41 pdurbin :)
21:41 pdurbin prologic: so wait, you're going to write a new package manager?
21:45 prologic yes
21:45 prologic I believe so
21:45 prologic and finding it hard to choose a decent language
21:45 prologic one that's not so low level that you spend all your time writing code and dealing with pointers
21:45 prologic but one that isn't so high level that when it's compiled or bundled it's just full of cruft and bloat
21:45 prologic e.g:
21:46 prologic A Go "Hello World!" yields you ~1.8MB alone
21:46 prologic throw in a few networking and http client libraries (i.e: a simple app to get the contents of a web uri) 5.6MB!
21:46 prologic makes me think Go is worthless as a systems programming language with such hugh runtime dependenices
21:46 pdurbin I just read an interesting article about rewriting a C++ program/service in Go. It wasn't all good news.
21:47 prologic yeah
21:47 prologic nevermind any other pitfalls of Go
21:47 prologic so I'm not really favouring Go at this point for a no. of reasons
21:47 prologic I'd no sooner write it all in Python
21:47 prologic and just bundle it with pyinstaller
21:47 prologic which ends up like
21:47 prologic hello: 4.2MB
21:47 prologic get: 5.2MB
21:48 prologic and that's by adding the requests library
21:48 pdurbin "I feel the outcome was suboptimal" https://togototo.wordpress.com/2015/03/07/fulfilling-a-pikedream-the-ups-of-downs-of-porting-50k-lines-of-c-to-go/
21:48 * prologic reads
22:41 prologic so
22:41 prologic we're going with the name: Val
22:41 prologic Val LInux
22:41 prologic https://github.com/vallinux/base
22:51 pdurbin prologic: short for Valhalla?
23:04 prologic no
23:04 prologic Swedish for "Choice"
23:04 prologic Val is the Linux that lets you choose!
23:04 prologic :)
23:04 prologic we'll likely have packages for all common things you'd expect
23:04 prologic XFCE, GNOME, KDE, etc
23:05 prologic still trying to get integrated Docker into it to
23:05 prologic why not :)
23:05 prologic but need to work out a few dependency issues
23:06 prologic mkfs.ext4 (default fs used by devmapepr)
23:06 prologic and iptables
23:23 tfhartmann joined #crimsonfu
23:33 pdurbin prologic: ah so it can be a desktop. or for a laptop. (I see an issue for wifi support.) not just for servers
23:37 tfhartmann joined #crimsonfu
23:45 prologic *nods*
23:46 prologic we're just re-inventing the wheel so to speak I guess
23:46 prologic and redoing some decisions other distros have made
23:46 prologic :)
23:46 prologic haha
23:46 pdurbin prologic: what's wrong with CRUX?
23:47 prologic nothing per say
23:48 prologic but recent poor communications from the core dev team has led me to this
23:48 prologic all over a silly thing really
23:48 prologic the introduction of start-stop-daemon from debign
23:48 prologic it had the potential to break live systems if you werne't careful
23:48 prologic luckily I caught the change in time
23:48 prologic also our aging SysVInit usage
23:49 prologic and whilst CRUX's ports and package utliite s are awesome and great
23:49 prologic it does get a bit tedious sometimes
23:49 prologic it would be better IHMO to support the CRUX style Pkgfile(s) and ports
23:49 prologic but have first class support for binary packages
23:49 prologic built form those sources
23:49 prologic so we intend to remain compatible in that sense with CRUX
23:49 prologic compatible with their Pkgfile format
23:49 prologic and the built packages they produce
23:49 prologic essentially TGZ
23:51 pdurbin so it's kind of a fork of CRUX
23:54 prologic cool
23:54 prologic Val builds perfectly on Debian/Ubuntu
23:54 prologic not a fork as such
23:54 prologic probably more a variant
23:54 prologic we actually haven't forked CRUX in any way :)
23:55 prologic we may possibly be compatible with Arch's PKGBUILD and packages too
23:55 prologic I mean why not right :)
23:55 prologic leverage other people's hard work :)
23:55 prologic so the package manager will have to be quite resilient and smart
23:56 pdurbin gonna support rpms and debs too?
23:56 prologic in theory we could
23:56 prologic but probably not in the early stages
23:56 prologic reason being is they are more complex package formats
23:56 prologic whereas CRUX and Arch share the same package format really
23:56 prologic TGZ / Tarballs
23:57 prologic and if you recall Arch's PKGBUILD is a direct deriviate of CRUX's Pkgfile
23:57 pdurbin ah. didn't know that
23:57 prologic we're going to support the same Pkgfile directly
23:57 prologic btu with some backwards compatible changes
23:57 prologic yeah
23:57 prologic Arch is basically CRUX in every way
23:57 prologic they didn't fork CRUX though
23:57 prologic but they learned enough about CRUX"s internals to build what Arch is today
23:58 prologic we watched their development happen
23:58 prologic and the original authors asking lots of questions in #crux
23:58 prologic :)
23:58 prologic quite a few years ago now

| Channels | #crimsonfu index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary

crimsonfu - sysadmins who code