Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #darcs, 2009-05-31

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
03:08 copumpkin joined #darcs
04:25 SamB joined #darcs
08:59 kowey joined #darcs
08:59 kowey good morning!
09:00 twb Is it?
09:00 lambdabot twb: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
09:00 twb I haven't seen any evidence
09:01 kowey are we talking morning or good?
09:01 twb The latter
09:01 twb I am not a morning person.
09:02 kowey nod... apparently non-morning people are somehow more effective than morning people
09:02 kowey or at least, can stay alert for longer than morning people can, or something like that
09:03 lelit joined #darcs
09:03 twb I don't know if I've *ever* been alert.
09:20 kowey twb: I'm pleased to report that your moin 2009-05-30 import patch applies to my rst branch
09:20 kowey *phew*
09:20 kowey my conflict resolution is going to consist of just clobbering by redoing the conversion from clean moin
09:21 kowey this means we likely lose changes made to test.darcs.net
09:21 twb Stinky.
09:21 kowey agreed
09:22 kowey we can retrieve those with darcs pull and diff though, so I'm not too concerned
09:46 kowey mornfall: I think my hashed-storage version of darcs behaves strangely when I do darcs whatsnew some_file_in_repo (it seems to show all changes)
09:46 kowey if you're not around, I'll try to follow up on this later
09:49 Heffalump does redoing the conversion make different patches, then
09:49 Heffalump ?
09:50 kowey it makes rather clean patches, actually... which is potentially surprising
09:51 Heffalump what do you mean by rather clean?
09:51 Heffalump I was asking if two successive conversions make the same patch for the same change
09:51 Heffalump (trying to understand what you meant about conflict resolution above)
09:51 kowey OK, let me see if I can unfold what's in my head without tripping over myself
09:52 kowey I've got on the one hand: a repo from 2009-03 PLUS rst conversion patches
09:52 kowey and on the other hand: a repo from 2009-03 PLUS one giant 2009-05 content patch
09:52 kowey so the rst conversion and the giant 2009-05 content patches conflict
09:53 kowey and the conflict resolution is just to re-run the conversion from the giant 2009-05 branch and copy the working dir contents over
09:53 kowey so by rather clean patches, what I meant is that that when I do a darcs record; it's as if I just added some new content in the RST format
09:54 kowey you know, a couple of hunks here and there with new content from May
09:54 kowey and this is potentially surprising if you think that the effect of a conflict is to nullify both the RST conversion and the new moin content
09:55 kowey but I guess it's not SO surprising if you think that changes that touch independent hunks don't interfere with each other
09:55 kowey does that sort of make sense?
10:11 Heffalump (sorry, was elsewhere. /me tries to digest that)
10:11 Heffalump ok, I sort of see. Why not just obliterate the old rst conversion?
10:13 kowey because it's already live
10:14 Heffalump in what sense,that people have pulled from the repo?
10:14 kowey or that they potentially have pulled from the repo
10:14 kowey it's what's been on test.darcs.net for a while now
10:15 Heffalump hmm, true, but I think people just pulled from that for experimentation
10:15 kowey the annoying thing is that I now have some kind of corruption (maybe): my repo has files that darcs whatsnew insists I removed, but I can't re-add, revert, and they're not in pending
10:15 kowey and if I darcs get my repo, it's perfectly clean
10:16 kowey hmm
10:16 kowey it's true that we are still officially in a testing phase
10:19 kowey twb: any preferences?
10:20 kowey I could either give you my incremental conversion patch, or we can start from 2009-05-30 import and re-do the conversion
10:27 kowey @tell gwern HTTP request failed with: Data/FileStore/Utils.hs:131:6-41: Irrefutable pattern failed for pattern (fn : n : res : _)
10:27 lambdabot Consider it noted.
10:28 kowey OK, I'm going to swoop in and redo the conversion from scratch, this time as one big patch
10:32 twb kowey: I abstain from having an opinion on that.
10:41 kowey wiki.darcs.net now up to date
10:53 Heffalump so now people that pulled from it previously might have a patch that shouldn't be in mainline, right?
10:53 Heffalump (which is fine, just checking on what cleanup is needed)
10:54 kowey they might have lots of patches that aren't in mainline, since the last time I did it, I broke the conversion down into a bunch of little patches
10:55 kowey plus the test patches from various folks
10:55 kowey darcs obliterate --from-tag . should do the trick
10:55 Heffalump . ?
10:55 kowey handy trick I learned from #darcs (maybe Max?), since it matches anything, it effectively works as a "from last tag" in this context
10:56 Heffalump nice
10:56 Heffalump umm, does the search page work for you?
10:56 kowey it's empty!
10:56 Heffalump it's empty if you search for anything containing spaces
10:57 kowey oh, I searched for "reordering" and it was empty... not even a no results found
10:57 kowey but searching for "darcs" worked
10:57 Heffalump oh yeah
10:57 Heffalump so it's not spaces
10:57 kowey huh, but searching for "womble" correctly returns "no results"
11:06 Heffalump hmm, interestingly I get a merge blowing up when I pull into the repo I had before
11:06 * Heffalump wonders why
11:07 kowey this is after getting rid of the first batch of RST conversion patches?
11:07 Heffalump nope
11:07 Heffalump I was planning on pulling first then removing stuff
11:08 Heffalump it just doesn't seem like the kind of scenario where a darcs 2 merge should blow up
11:08 kowey could be a good case study for camp
11:08 kowey hmm that gives us 2 real world cases of darcs-2 blowing up :-(
11:10 kowey what could be interesting actually, is to watch it blow up with one RST patch, 2 RST patches, etc (since I had broken them up so)
11:10 Heffalump I'll try that
11:13 twb kowey: Darcs 2 definitely blows up when trying to merge in patches against something "a long way back" in the current repo's history
11:13 twb That is, the further back the ancestor is, the more likely blowups are.
11:14 Heffalump it seems to be blowing up when I pull in the third RST patch.
11:14 kowey do we need to add something to the Conflicts FAQ?
11:15 kowey it'd be good if we could have a useful characterisation of what makes darcs blow up in practice
11:15 Heffalump Wed Apr 15 18:41:20 BST 2009  Eric Kow <E.Y.Kow@brighton.ac.uk> * Convert Darcs* pages from MoinMoin syntax to RST.
11:15 Heffalump actually, just that patch on its own causes the blow up.
11:15 kowey e.g. we knew that darcs 1 can blow up in doppelganger situations
11:15 kowey hmm... just that patch + the convert everything patch
11:15 twb I successfully pull all the patches that didn't introduce conflicts, one at a time
11:16 kowey so I'll bet that if we boiled down the convert everything patch to just the Darcs* patches, it should still blow up
11:18 Heffalump oh, actually it did finish in the end, just quite slowly
11:19 kowey small explosion
11:19 * Heffalump reads the patch file
11:21 Heffalump lots of duplicate, and conflictor
11:21 Heffalump but no nested conflictor
11:25 kpreid_ joined #darcs
11:40 Heffalump is darcs-users the right target for wiki patches?
11:40 Heffalump given that people can just edit the wiki directly too without such a notification
11:42 ronny does darcs have a way to group sets of patches to one virtual patch?
11:42 ronny so i can trac kfine-grained changes till a feature is done, then concat it to virtually one
11:44 kpreid_ ronny: out of curiosity, do you know any other vcs with that feature?
11:45 ronny kpreid_: hg as some extension to do that, and i belive bzr has something semilar
11:46 ronny i bleive its helpfull, to have n people collaborate with n patchs on a feature, then view that feature as one change later when the details wont matter
11:46 ronny however only view
11:46 ronny i wouldnt want to loose the details
11:46 Heffalump I agree, but darcs doesn't do it
11:46 Heffalump maybe sometime
11:47 ronny bbl, gotta go for some time
11:48 eivuokko Isn't *implementation* of (checkpoint?) tag like that currently?  There's just no interface to say which patches are part tag?
11:48 Heffalump tags just mark dependencies
11:48 eivuokko Yes, and that's what "virtual patch" would do as well?
11:48 Heffalump in theory you could use the diff between two tags to record a composite patch
11:49 Heffalump but it wouldn't compose
11:49 Heffalump a tag marks all the patches in the history when it was made, not a subset
11:49 eivuokko But it is possible to have a patch that doesn't about tag (and depend behind tag), and tag, and combine them?
11:49 ronny bacsially what i want would be a "tag" that gets a patch name and hides its direct dependencies from normal listing of changes
11:50 eivuokko Or atleast was.
11:50 eivuokko Was pretty annoying too, sometimes, near the releases.
11:51 Heffalump eivuokko: I don't understand what you mean
11:52 eivuokko If I have state s of repo, and I make a patch s -> s1.  Sametime someone makes tag on s, tag1.  It is possible to combine tag1 and s1, is it not?  Which means tag could as well just pick a set of changes, instead of all?
11:53 Heffalump but it can't leave out changes earlier in the history if those are depended on
11:53 eivuokko Yeah.
11:54 eivuokko So in interface you'd need to have difference between tag and virtual patch: Tag hides all the old changes, while virtual only hides the ones that are one edge away in graph?
11:55 eivuokko It doesn't seem so bad approximation to me -.-
12:38 kowey we could create something like a darcs-wiki@darcs.net address if that would be helpful
12:39 kowey probably a list of committers, people who could spend a few seconds to sanity check (e.g. not spam)
12:41 kowey or actually, just use darcs-devel for that
12:41 kowey but I doubt the traffic generated by the wiki will be high enough to justify this move
12:43 Heffalump but are you proposing for edits straight to the wiki to be reviewed too?
12:44 kowey nah; I'm not even proposing for the emailed changes to be reviewed, just cursory checked
12:44 kowey I figure that we don't want direct application
12:45 kowey because somebody could then submit a patch to (say) remove all the files, which is harder to do on the web
12:45 kowey ... not that anybody would do that
12:45 Heffalump fair enough
12:45 Heffalump so I'll just send what I have to darcs-users for now?
12:46 kowey yep... I can go ahead and apply this (while awaiting a policy from gwern/twb)
12:54 * kowey runs darcs optimize to avoid massive wiki bundles
13:04 tux_rocker joined #darcs
13:05 kowey hi tux_rocker, thanks for looking at Darcs.Gorsvet
13:06 kowey (that seemed like a relatively big job, so I'm feeling extra-appreciative)
13:15 ronny re
13:22 balor joined #darcs
13:31 arjanb joined #darcs
14:10 tux_rocker wouldn't it be a good idea to call Darcs.Gorsvet Darcs.HashedStorage?
14:10 tux_rocker the code in it seems to express darcs patch operations in hashed-storage library calls
14:11 tux_rocker thus forming the glue between darcs and hashed-storage
14:11 tux_rocker (or perhaps Darcs.HashedStorageUtils, like ByteStringUtils)
14:18 kowey something like that makes sense
15:07 mornfall kowey: Yes, I think that's broken now. : - (
15:08 mornfall kowey: Also, with --ignore-times it behaves differently than without.
15:08 mornfall kowey: I'll fix that (more details in my reply to Reinier, when I'm finished with it, anyawy.)
15:08 mornfall anyway*
15:10 kowey OK
15:10 mornfall The whole path restriction business is a little messy.
15:11 kowey I'm still working on my last quarter of the review and hopefully thinking about our plan for the SoC
15:13 mornfall One thing. Can the darcsit thing use a non-proportional font in the big editbox?
15:13 mornfall Editing ReST in proportional font = sucks bigtime.
15:13 kowey gwern: are you around and able to answer that one?
15:13 gwern around, yes
15:14 gwern kowey: tell me more about the request? presumably this was from a search attempt
15:15 kowey the request? you mean mornfall's question or something else?
15:15 gwern the http request
15:15 kowey I still don't follow, I'm afraid
15:15 gwern lb message
15:16 gwern HTTP request failed with: Data/FileStore/Utils.hs:131:6-41: Irrefutable pattern failed for  pattern (fn : n : res : _
15:16 kowey ah yes! hmm senility
15:16 kowey I just noticed it when I did a screen -R on gitit@darcs.net
15:17 kowey darcsit seemed to be quite happy and still running despite printing a couple of these
15:17 gwern mornfall: I don't really know what sets the font on gitit. probably the css
15:17 mornfall I guess so.
15:18 gwern are #s comments in css?
15:19 kowey I think they are either for names or classes, and I can never remember which is which
15:19 eivuokko I don't think so.  /* */ are comments, # are some sort of selector probably.
15:19 gwern because screen.css has : #editform textarea { height: 25em; width: 98%; font-family: monospace; font-size: 93%; }
15:19 gwern #editform #logMsg { width: 98%; margin-right: 1em; margin-bottom: 0.3em; }
15:19 gwern mornfall: and monospace is nonproportional, no
15:20 mornfall Hm.
15:21 mornfall It doesn't work in Opera. Gitit doesn't work at all in konqueror.
15:21 maltem joined #darcs
15:21 mornfall I wish it'd be a little more browser friendly. : - (
15:22 mornfall Preview doesn't seem to work, either.
15:22 mornfall It says There is no page '_preview'. You may create the page by clicking here.
15:23 gwern _preview? my memory tells me that there's something odd about that...
15:23 mornfall That's what I get when I click the preview button in the editform.
15:27 gwern in HEAD, it should be ___preview...
15:28 gwern kowey: how old is the gitit on wiki.darcs.net?
15:28 gwern it changed from _preview to ___preview on 19 april
15:29 kowey I don't know (I vaguely remember uploading a gitit-something in Florida)
15:29 kowey but I can update everything and upload a fresh one if that would help
15:29 gwern mornfall: you've hard-refreshed and gotten this preview problem?
15:30 gwern wonder if maybe you have stale js/css
15:31 kowey hmm... I get fatal: read error (Connection reset by peer) when I try to git pull from my gitit dir
15:33 gwern ah, I think I've got it
15:33 maltem Ok folks, I've got a bug report that I think is quite important, but the information isn't very precise, so I'm only telling this here on IRC (seems to be the perfect opportunity, with kowey and gwern around):
15:33 gwern strings tells me that the gitit binary is using ___preview, but when I look in static/ in the js, I see just _preview
15:33 gwern so the css/js in static/ has become outdated
15:33 gwern (this accords with my being able to reproduce it)
15:35 * kowey listens for maltem's bug report with interest
15:39 maltem joined #darcs
15:40 maltem Sorry, got disconnected
15:40 maltem I installed ghc 6.10.3 with extralibs, then compiled darcs
15:40 maltem I got an utterly broken darcs, pulling/getting always crashed (patches not found that were really there, ...). In the meantime I installed and upgraded some cabal packages, then tried compiling darcs again
15:40 maltem Now it works nicely.
15:41 maltem Of course, if I knew what packages caused this, I would have a proper bug report :/
15:41 kowey ghc 6.10.3 with extralibs without any updates gives you a broken darcs?
15:41 gwern getting pull failed? maybe the autoconf fell back to a no-http-functionality built darcs?
15:42 kowey did you use the cabal build method or autoconf?
15:42 lelit` joined #darcs
15:42 maltem kowey: The ./configure method
15:43 maltem gwern: It did have http functionality, it failed only after some time
15:43 gwern hum
15:43 maltem It's a shame I don't have the old source tree to see the config
15:43 gwern mornfall: ok, preview seems to be working again
15:43 kowey any recollection for the kinds of error messages?
15:45 maltem I fear I don't have any anymore
15:46 maltem I'll see if I'll do a fresh ghc install to reproduce
15:46 mornfall gwern: Thanks!
15:46 gwern kowey: we have any need for DarcsWiki.~1~/ ?
15:46 gwern or DarcsWiki-test.darcs.net/ ?
15:46 kowey gwern: I don't know what that's for
15:47 kowey the latter is the version with my first attempt at RST conversion
15:47 kowey I think we can get rid of that
15:47 gwern ok, then I'll get rid of those two. ~/ is too crowded
15:47 gwern and maybe get rid of one of these git binariezx
15:47 mornfall Hm, tough luck (no preview for me).
15:47 mornfall Maybe it's opera-related?
15:48 gwern mornfall: you hard refreshed?
15:48 mornfall Nah, just hit Edit again. It doesn't work that way? :)
15:48 kowey maltem: that's really generous on your part, if you could
15:48 gwern no
15:49 mornfall Let's try.
15:49 gwern kowey: and kowey-gitit-default.conf is inutile?
15:49 maltem kowey, so far I only found one error message pattern in an IRC log, namely: “Failed to download URL http://...gz: does not exist” (where the URL really does exist)
15:49 kowey gwern: I think so
15:49 mornfall (In konqueror, when the page view does not kill the browser, I get to edit (font is right there) but instead of preview get a blank page with just "me@foo.pw" in it.
15:50 mornfall Oh, font fixed in opera now, too.
15:50 mornfall And preview works.
15:50 mornfall \o/
15:50 gwern ok, ~/ looks much cleaner now
15:51 gwern kowey: we should probably at some point run gitit for the DWN as well
15:51 maltem kowey, ok I'll try
15:51 mornfall And I suspect `` ... `` doesn't work for multiline bits.
15:51 gwern although since gitit is taking 30% of ram, we might want to hold off on that
15:51 mornfall In ReST (or at least not in pandoc ReST).
15:51 gwern hm
15:52 gwern wish I knew how much of gitit's memory use is due to that ghc bug which won't give ram back to the OS
15:52 kowey gotta run
16:02 mornfall Hm. The pandoc ReST is useless.
16:03 mornfall Can't have verbatim blocks in a list, I guess.
16:03 mornfall If someone feels like it, DeveloperTips is an unreadable jumble from about half on.
16:03 mornfall s/like it/like fixing it/
16:15 fophillips joined #darcs
17:25 maltem boo, I could not reproduce the bug with a fresh ghc-6.10.3. I guess I had already updated some specific package...
17:26 maltem Anyways, that probably means that the bug originated from some dependency release, not from darcs itself
17:33 balor joined #darcs
17:54 tux_rocker joined #darcs
17:54 olejorgenb joined #darcs
18:05 Heffalump is there some general mechanism to make running the test suite not be influenced by things like ~/.darcs ?
18:14 tux_rocker yes. at least that is the idea. if your testsuite is influenced by your ~/.darcs that's a bug
18:15 Heffalump can't my ~/.darcs do stuff like disabling commands?
18:15 Heffalump or changing options
18:17 zooko joined #darcs
18:17 zooko The front page link with anchor text "Darcs binaries" is a broken link.
18:18 zooko Hm, the whole wiki is gone.
18:18 zooko Oh there it is.
18:18 zooko The link should be changed to http://wiki.darcs.net/Binaries
18:19 Heffalump there should be a redirect from http://wiki.darcs.net/index.html/Foo to http://wiki.darcs.net/Foo
18:19 zooko Who has the ability to update the darcs.net front page?
18:20 zooko I'm trying to get David Abrahams (C++ guru and founder of the Boost library) to use Tahoe.
18:20 zooko He says installing darcs on OpenBSD is "a nightmare".
18:20 zooko I suspect mostly just because the binaries link was broken, or else maybe he didn't see it.
18:20 zooko Because he's struggling to build ghc 6.10.3 on open bsd.
18:20 zooko I sent him the right link just now to the binaries.
18:26 Heffalump kowey does, not sure who else
18:29 tux_rocker don't the OpenBSD guys have a ports system of some kind?
18:30 gwern all the bsds do
18:31 zooko Okay, thanks folks.
18:31 zooko Gotta run get ready for a big party.
18:32 tux_rocker he should be able to build it with http://openports.se/lang/ghc, shouldn't he?
18:34 zooko The darcs wiki says that the openbsd developers recommend against using ports.
18:34 zooko See also a note I just posted to darcs-users about a *different* Tahoe contributor who is trying to build on OpenBSD/sparc64...
18:35 idnar David Abrahams uses OpenBSD? No wonder he's so grumpy ;)
18:35 zooko He's been very polite and helpful so far.
18:35 zooko He's contributed a number of bug reports to the Tahoe project.
18:35 gwern idnar: fear would make anyone grumpy
18:37 Heffalump GHC on OpenBSD on sparc? An obscure language on an obscure OS on an obscure architecture? :-)
18:40 tux_rocker the binaries on the wiki for OpenBSD are pretty old
19:02 kowey joined #darcs
19:04 * Heffalump can help with the redirect but has an annoyed baby to pacify first
19:04 kowey so we've got links from the front page to http://wiki.darcs.net/index.html/Foo and http://wiki.darcs.net/DarcsWiki/Foo
19:05 kowey OK :-) I'll continue working on understanding mornfall's patches
19:06 kowey mornfall: by the way, one of the GADT-enabled modules imports Darcs.Gorsvet (which tux_rocker pointed out could be renamed more helpfully to something like Darcs.HashedStorageUtils), which means that if I apply the invalidateIndex patch, witnesses break
19:12 Heffalump the pacification problem is beyond me and has been passed on to an expert
19:13 kowey linguistic skills will soon be a help, I imagine
19:13 Heffalump RewriteEngine On
19:13 Heffalump RewriteRule ^/index.html/(.*)$ /$1
19:14 Heffalump that's the right way to get apache to rewrite URLs as wanted
19:14 Heffalump but I'm not 100% sure where to put it - it depends on how the server is set up
19:14 Heffalump is there a config file for wiki.darcs.net in /etc/apache2/sites-enabled ?
19:14 kowey yeah, I'm trying there
19:14 Heffalump (and the obvious other line for DarcsWiki too)
19:14 kowey heh, I'm already using it for RewriteRule ^/(.*) http://darcs.net:5001/$1 [P]
19:15 Heffalump oh, right :-)
19:15 Heffalump ok, in that case short-circuit it
19:15 Heffalump i.e. put the more specific rule first and go direct to the darcs.net:5001 URL
19:15 Heffalump oh, hmm. Perhaps not
19:16 Heffalump what we actually want is a [R] so that the browser gets the right information (i.e. "this thing has moved")
19:16 kowey would this be what we want? RewriteRule ^/index.html/(.*)$ http://darcs.net:5001/$1 [R]
19:17 kowey that's before the [P] rule
19:18 kowey or actually, what I would sort of want is RewriteRule ^/index.html/(.*)$ /$1 [R] to mean "http://wiki.darcs.net/index.html/Foo has moved to http://wiki.darcs.net/Foo"
19:18 kowey and not to http://darcs.net:5001/Foo
19:18 Heffalump right
19:18 Heffalump I think that's the right way to do it
19:19 Heffalump I can't remember whether [R] defaults to permanent or temporary redirects
19:19 kowey yay! that seems to do what we want
19:20 kowey although I don't know if what's going on underneath is really what we want
19:21 kowey ah, when we've committed to using this wiki, we can finally clean up that FAQ
19:27 Heffalump ok, it's returning 302, moved temporarily
19:27 Heffalump I'll go check the syntax for 301 which is what we want
19:27 Heffalump [R=permanent]
19:29 kowey hmm
19:29 kowey so then, the returning 302 should be surprising?
19:30 Heffalump if you've already got R=permanent, then yes
19:30 kowey ok, then I'm surprised :-)
19:30 Heffalump did you reload at the right time?
19:30 kowey what does [P] mean?
19:30 Heffalump [P] is proxy
19:30 Heffalump i.e. keep this URL from the client's point of view, but serve up the page you get from this other URL
19:31 kowey don't show them the 5001 ugliness
19:31 kowey hmm... what do you mean by reloading at the right time?
19:33 Heffalump I just mean after the [R=permanent] went in
19:33 kowey OH
19:34 kowey parsing error... I somehow read the [R=permanent] to mean [R] means permanent
19:34 Heffalump oh :-)
19:34 kowey not so much a parsing error but a general brain malfunction
19:34 kowey ok, so now we should be handing out 302s
19:34 maltem gwern, in re FrontPage on reddit: Yes, I guess so. Or maybe special-case it to print "Darcs", "The Darcs Wiki", something like that
19:35 Heffalump you mean 301, which is what we are doing.
19:35 kowey I mean 301 indeed
19:35 kowey cool, thanks for spotting this and for the help!
19:36 Heffalump zooko spotted it
19:37 kowey @tell zooko thanks for spotting the URL issue with the wiki :-) Heffalump helped to add rewriting thingies
19:37 lambdabot Consider it noted.
19:37 * Heffalump now has a baby in need of further pacifying so is typing one-handed again
19:38 kowey expert has delegated back
19:38 kowey or new pacification needed rather, more likely
19:38 * Heffalump repeats a question from above: is there  a standard way to stop a test being influenced by ~/.darcs ?
19:39 kowey err
19:39 kowey by rights, the test harness should be setting HOME
19:39 kowey so that ~/.darcs gets ignored
19:39 Heffalump oh, ruight
19:39 kowey although the test has its own ~/.darcs
19:39 kowey for global things like --ignore-times
19:39 Heffalump so i should just do that myself when running a test manually
19:40 kowey yeah... I wonder if it's as easy as HOME=/tmp/blah tests/foo.sh
19:40 Heffalump it is
19:40 Heffalump ta
19:40 kowey but then why not cabal test tests/foo.sh?
19:40 Heffalump i didn't think of that ;-)
19:40 kowey :-)
19:50 Igloo Doesn't each test source something? If so, why doesn't it set $PATH?
19:51 zooko joined #darcs
19:52 kowey the test harness does add the darcs directory to the PATH
19:52 Igloo Sorry, $HOME
19:54 kowey the test harness does set $HOME
19:55 kowey my use of "should" was because I was concerned that the question meant that somehow it wasn't doing what I normally expect
20:02 Igloo Why do you need to do HOME=/tmp/blah tests/foo.sh then?
20:02 Igloo Or am I just failing to follow what's going on?
20:03 Heffalump the test harness does, the individual test scripts don't
20:03 Heffalump I'm not sure that every test includes lib
20:03 Heffalump or that it makes sense for them to be constrained so heavily
20:03 zooko left #darcs
20:03 Igloo Ah, OK
20:03 Heffalump if they set HOME themselves you couldn't tweak the env yourself
20:07 gwern maltem: don't tell me here, on reddit
20:08 maltem gwern, oo, if you so whish :)
20:40 dcoutts woo!
20:40 dcoutts 30% reduction in size of the darcs.cabal file
20:40 Heffalump woo?
20:40 Heffalump nice.
20:42 * kowey arches an eyebrow
20:43 tux_rocker dcoutts: can the smaller file still be read by older versions of Cabal?
20:43 dcoutts tux_rocker: yes but not used
20:43 Heffalump and more importantly the size change is getting rid of the redundancy
20:43 dcoutts .cabal files using this feature are required to specify cabal-version: >=1.8
20:45 Heffalump when will that be out?
20:46 mornfall kowey: HashedStorageUtils sounds quite silly to me, and moreover it's not really true either.
20:46 dcoutts Heffalump: some time before ghc-6.12
20:46 kowey OK... btw, in case I mentioned a repo where darcs+hashed-storage was mistakenly thinking that files were removed
20:46 mornfall As for witnesses, I have been asking to have them part of the normal build long time ago. Having them separate makes it pretty easy to break, and it's hard to care, really.
20:47 kowey touching _darcs/index_invalid fixed it for me - I think it's because I had a darcs with the whatsnew patch, but not the invalidate patch
20:47 mornfall Oh, ok, that's a problem indeed. You really want invalidates to happen, otherwise you'll get wonky results.
20:47 kowey is there some mechanism to automatically remember the -ftype-witnesses argument to cabal configure
20:47 tux_rocker mornfall: in what sense is it not really true?
20:48 tux_rocker kowey: shell alias?
20:48 Heffalump what's the argument against making type-witnesses build by default? Speed?
20:48 mornfall tux_rocker: In that it is not utilities for hashed storage... it's not even utilities. It's parts of Repository.Internal rewritten to take advantage of hashed storage.
20:48 dcoutts kowey: there are open tickets for that feature, lemme find it so you can add your vote
20:48 mornfall But Repository.Internal is already an awfully bad module in itself.
20:49 kowey we could enable it by default, I think speed is the only issue
20:49 kowey I was thinking we didn't want a witnesses executable to be installed, but then we could just rename that to something else, so no problem there
20:49 mornfall Heffalump: Well, I more like meant that the production binary should just compile with witnesses enabled.
20:49 Heffalump that doesn't work yet
20:49 kowey that's going to take work, not advocacy
20:50 mornfall Heffalump: That doesn't work because we never applied those patches that make all of darcs compile with those enabled, IIUIC.
20:50 Heffalump and that's because there were significant question marks over their correctness
20:50 dcoutts kowey: ah, now what behaviour do you want from this?
20:50 kowey but enabling it for the building could be useful, although it increases our build time
20:50 mornfall Yeah, which is already over the roof.
20:51 dcoutts kowey: there's a couple things I'm thinking of, one is essentially a local cabal (cabal-install) config file, like the global ~/.cabal/config
20:51 mornfall Unfortunately, I don't have time to fix everything... : - |
20:51 kowey dcoutts: I think I'm thinking of a local config file for a particular directory
20:51 kowey in this particular branch of darcs, I'd like to always configure with witnesses (or whatever)
20:52 dcoutts kowey: ok, so you could keep such a file in a repo but it'd never be allowed in a distributed package
20:52 kowey right
20:52 dcoutts kowey: it's a bit like a local .ghci file
20:53 dcoutts kowey: ok, so that ticket doesn't exist yet, it's only in our heads. Would you mind filing it, give the motivation, use case, restrictions etc.
20:53 kowey on my way!
20:54 dcoutts kowey: note, this would be a patch to cabal-install, runghc Setup would ignore it
20:54 kowey (although I think what I really want is for darcs executable and library to build without double-compilation, which would reduce the time anxiety)
20:54 kowey ;-P
20:54 dcoutts kowey: that's nearly done
20:54 dcoutts kowey: I tested that a few min ago, it's not pushed yet
20:54 kowey that's very nice news!
20:55 dcoutts kowey: it'll need a slight reorganisation of the darcs sources however, to move the bits needed for the exe into a separate dir, otherwise it'll just pick up all the local sources rather than getting the modules from the darcs lib
20:55 dcoutts kowey: I tried it just now, moving src/darcs.hs and a couple others into a new main/ dir
20:55 kowey that sounds like it would be good to have anyway
20:55 dcoutts similarly for the unit test prog
20:56 kowey dcoutts; have you seen how camp is divided into a bunch of little packages?
20:56 dcoutts kowey: I've not
20:56 dcoutts however I'm not sure it'll work for the type witness because that seems to use -D cpp flags
20:56 dcoutts that sounds like it cannot go via the library but needs to recompile the source files
20:57 kowey yeah, I guess we can live with darcs lib+exe sharing stuff; and then the witnesses having to be built separately
20:57 kowey 2x build time not as bad as 3x build time
20:57 dcoutts does the witness version build everything? or is it just a subset
20:58 mornfall kowey: (Btw., the thing about pending and hunks: these come from darcs remove.
20:58 kowey just a subset (the goal is to keep increasing that subset until it's the whole set)
20:58 dcoutts kowey: I see
20:58 mornfall kowey: Which is quite stupid IMHO, since it breaks darcs move.
20:59 mornfall kowey: A repository with hunks in pending will behave strangely. So we may want to make a case for deprecating "darcs remove" and tell people to move the file out of way if they want to get rid of it...)
21:04 kowey dcoutts: is http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/hackage/ticket/556 ok?
21:04 kowey mornfall: pending and hunks?
21:05 kowey it's very scary how I seem to be forgetting things I say only a couple of hours ago
21:06 kowey mornfall: don't forget the process lib issue, by the way... it'd be good if we could get darcs+hashed-storage on GHC 6.8 :-)
21:07 copumpkin joined #darcs
21:07 dcoutts kowey: thanks!
21:08 mornfall kowey: Well, it's a pretty stupid <whatever> bug that it doesn't work.
21:08 kowey you mean the process thing?
21:08 mornfall kowey: I guess a flag is in place, yes. But it will have to wait till 0.3.1 anyway.
21:08 mornfall Yeah.
21:09 kowey OK
21:09 mornfall Upgrading process on 6.8 screws your haskell installation? Wtf? : - )
21:09 kowey :-)
21:09 kowey I'm still trying to read Darcs.Gorsvet.unrecordedChanges and understand it
21:10 kowey hopefully early this week, I'll have time to think about SoC plans (just letting you know where I am), but things may be a bit crazy for a while :-/
21:10 mornfall I'll hopefully fix unrecordedChanges tomorrow. :)
21:11 mornfall It's got some stupid rename-related bugginess in it.
21:11 mornfall (Cf. my reply to Reinier's review.)
21:11 kowey hmm, maybe I should start with the thinking about the SoC stuff then
21:11 kowey and then look at the fixed version instead
21:12 mornfall Hm. I could maybe just look at it right away.
21:12 kowey I'll pass on two minor notes while I'm at it: what happens with old-fashioned repos?
21:12 * mornfall looks.
21:12 mornfall They should work just fine (using the index as well).
21:12 kowey and also "should unfold be called something else so that it doesn't sound like Data.List.unfold?"
21:12 kowey (sorry for the silly question)
21:12 mornfall Well, the index is sort of redundant for the old-fashioned repos.
21:13 mornfall But we may want to make a case for having an index for pristine as well, that'd maintain hashes in it. Hard to tell.
21:13 mornfall Probably not worth the hassle.
21:13 kowey right, but does hashed-storage know to read non-hashed pristine?
21:13 mornfall Sure.
21:13 kowey oh ok :-)
21:13 mornfall It knows how to read working, so...
21:13 mornfall Well I mean, it can read plain filesystem trees.
21:14 mornfall So it's trivial to make it read plain pristine, too.
21:14 mornfall (So I have.)
21:18 kowey more randomness: I'll bet fixing the witnesses is just a matter of Repository C(r u t) in Darcs.Gorsvet
21:18 mornfall Yes, sounds like it is.
21:19 kowey (right now, my staging repo is set to refuse to push patches if anything goes wrong, including witnesses breaking, so I'd like to see that fixed before I push :-) )
21:19 mornfall Tomorrow (I'm on battery power and I want to try sleeping in some 10 minutes anyway). I'm about to get unrecordedChanges fixed.
21:19 kowey same here... I'll continue trying to understand
21:21 mornfall Any chance about suggesting a name for unfold?
21:21 kowey ya know, all my attempts sounded silly, so I gave up
21:21 kowey I was pursuing ideas like "bud" or "blossom" or "bloom"
21:21 Heffalump what's the type?
21:22 mornfall : - ]
21:22 mornfall Rename Stub to Bud and unfold to blossom. Interesting. : - )
21:23 mornfall I'm fairly sure that beats the Slurp metaphor by almost an order of magnitude.
21:23 mornfall Slurpy, whatever. :)
21:25 kowey :-) OK, bedtime! (Heffalump: Tree -> IO Tree ; I think it replaces hashes with actual trees)
21:25 mornfall Well. It replaces Stub's with actual (Sub)Trees.
21:26 tux_rocker a boring suit-and-tie name could be "expand"
21:26 tux_rocker but i like "blossom" more :-)
21:27 mornfall A Stub is (IO Tree), and is just an explicit way to keep the to-be-(maybe)-executed IO action (like unsafeInterleaveIO, but under explicit control).
21:27 mornfall Well, it's really just deferred IO.
21:27 Heffalump so is it reading, or writing?
21:27 mornfall Nothing unsafe about it (unlike unsafeInterleaveIO which *is* unsafe.)
21:27 mornfall Heffalump: Just reading.
21:28 Heffalump I'd probably use a name involving 'read' or 'input' then, but 'expand' or 'blossom' are fine too. I agree 'unfold' is confusing.
21:28 Heffalump And this could turn into a bikeshed, so that's my last word on the subject :-)
21:29 mornfall :)
21:40 * gwern groans at this whole discussion. you guys!
21:42 mornfall Goodnight. :)

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