Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #darcs, 2014-04-03

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
03:30 mizu_no_oto joined #darcs
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04:04 sm mornfall: what would be the advantage of having this feature on darcs hub ? who would use it ?
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05:38 Heffalump presumably anyone who wanted to check out a darcs repo via git - but if it was read-only it doesn't seem all that useful
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08:12 mornfall sm: the advantage is that a) people don't need to set it up and b) you can now ask people without darcs to test development versions between betas
08:12 mornfall sm: walking users through building darcs (and in the worse case, GHC) is not a viable strategy
08:13 mornfall sm: and sadly, many university users don't have root access to their machine and software requests are served with long delays if at all
08:13 mornfall so the reality is, I either make tarballs or ask them to wait for next beta
08:15 mornfall another issue is services that have git plugins but not darcs plugins (i.e. most of them)
08:16 mornfall CI, analysis (think ohloh), ...
08:17 mornfall I guess most projects that use darcs can ignore the wider ecosystem, but it's kinda inconvenient for the bigger repos
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17:31 sm mornfall: I see..
17:32 sm so... it would be a convenience for folks who know git but not darcs, to get a readonly+history copy of your project (and other hub-hosted projects) ?
17:33 mornfall sm: well, the 2.8 ermine binary seems to solve some of the use-cases
17:33 sm and would allow hub repos to be processed by git-aware reporting tools
17:33 mornfall sm: so yes, it mostly becomes a matter of convenience
17:33 sm ermine - I'm not sure what that is ?
17:33 mornfall sm: darcs.net -> download, there's 1 linux (32b) binary
17:34 mornfall sm: I guess most people don't have ARM chromebooks yet :) not for development anyway
17:34 mornfall 32b x86 that is
17:34 mornfall it's packed by ermine and seems to run on many systems
17:34 mornfall so that's reasonable for people that can't install darcs in other ways
17:35 mornfall but they still need to be OK downloading a binary from the internet and running it :-)
17:35 sm providing git access to hub repos is orthogonal to providing fresh darcs binaries, isn't it ?
17:36 mornfall sm: it serves some of the same purposes
17:37 mornfall sm: as I said earlier, git is available much more often on company/university/... equipment for which you can't install software
17:37 mornfall sm: doing a roundtrip to the IT department about getting darcs is painful
17:37 mornfall but if you can use a static binary that's probably a good-enough alternative
17:39 sm I'm not totally clear on your scenario - if someone's on a machine where they can't install darcs, aren't they unlikely to be able to install ghc and build a git-fetched darcs ?
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17:40 sm the idea of building more git-ness into darcs hub is certainly intriguing, especially if it could be done cheaply
17:41 sm but I also wonder at what point it makes more sense to just use git
17:43 mornfall sm: not darcs, other hub-hosted projects
17:43 sm ok
17:43 mornfall also, the last guy with whom I ran into this did Haskell, so had GHC -- but not darcs :)
17:44 mornfall he got it built with cabal install in that case
17:45 sm having darcs hub generate tarballs would work equally well for that particular use case, right
17:45 mornfall using darcs makes sense if you core team has a darcs-based process that works, I guess
17:45 mornfall yes, that too
17:46 mornfall (although git is still "nicer" in many ways in this respect)
17:46 mornfall (you see history, you can update easily...)
17:46 sm true, assuming basic git-fu
17:47 mornfall there's still the integration issue though... last time I switched CI system I had to write a darcs plugin
17:47 mornfall but not many people are willing or even able to do that
17:48 mornfall (sometimes you can't take couple days off just to combine your VCS with your CI)
17:49 mornfall and yes, every time something like this happens I'm forced to re-evaluate whether it's worth sticking with darcs or moving the process over to git
17:49 sm what keeps you on darcs right now ?
17:49 mornfall the existing process
17:50 sm aha
17:50 mornfall which is fairly comfortable, compared to what I have seen with git so far
17:50 mornfall we are coordinated fairly well, so no conflicts
17:50 mornfall it might become more difficult if the team grows over time
17:50 mornfall will see
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21:51 nebnesknarf hi there
21:52 nebnesknarf today i resolved an issue in darcs (one i reported myself)
21:52 nebnesknarf attached the patch to the ticket, is that correct?
21:53 nebnesknarf or should i rather use darcs send?
21:54 rdesfo joined #darcs
21:56 nebnesknarf anyone of the core people online?
21:57 rdesfo I've only submitted one small patch and I sent it via email to <darcs-devel@darcs.net>
21:57 rdesfo you can create a patch with darcs send -O and email it as an attachment
21:57 nebnesknarf thanks
21:58 rdesfo just a heads up I'm not part of the darcs team so that might not be the official way, but it worked for me
21:58 nebnesknarf ok
22:09 nebnesknarf btw, default address seems to be patches@darcs.net nowadays
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22:29 rdesfo nebnsesknarf: ok thanks
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22:39 nebnesknarf ha, i managed to set up esmtp and can now darcs send --mail
22:41 nebnesknarf strange: now i get a bounce mail from bugs@darcs.net saying that i am not subscribed bla bla
22:42 nebnesknarf but i sent to patches@
22:42 nebnesknarf seems the darcs mail setup is screwed somehow
22:48 Heffalump erk
22:48 Heffalump what did it say you are not subscribed to?
22:49 Heffalump patches@darcs.net should be the right place
22:49 nebnesknarf quote: Your mail to 'bugs' with the subject\ndarcs patch: resolve issue2314: output-auto-name in defaults file\netc
22:50 nebnesknarf darcs tells me: Successfully sent patch bundle to: patches@darcs.net
22:50 Heffalump hmm. <vague attempt to invoke kowey>
22:51 Heffalump where's the ticket you attached it to?
22:54 Heffalump ah, you're Ben Franksen, that makes me a bit less confused about tickets
22:55 Heffalump however I am still thoroughly confused by the darcs mail setup
22:57 Heffalump ok. I can't fix this now as I don't even understand it and I ought to be in bed. The ideal thing for you to do would be to login to the bug tracker and use "Create new patch". I'd also be fine with sorting it out myself if you just resend, changing the recipient to me using darcs send --to ganesh@earth.li
22:58 Heffalump hmm. Someone appears to have successfully sent a patch by what looks like the standard route this morning.
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23:08 nebnesknarf yes I am the same; can i change my username on the bug tracker?
23:09 Heffalump to nebnesknarf?
23:09 nebnesknarf yes
23:09 nebnesknarf so I am easier recognized here ;-)
23:09 Heffalump try changing it in the "Your Details" link on the left hand side
23:10 Heffalump there's a "Login Name" field there
23:10 nebnesknarf will do (OTOH I wouldn't have known that you are Ganesh either...)
23:10 Heffalump :-)
23:11 nebnesknarf Hmmm, maybe the problem has to do with my two email accounts
23:11 Heffalump it wasn't so much the coordination with the bug tracker, rather that I'd never seen your username before
23:11 Heffalump your nickname that is
23:11 Heffalump you have 'bf' and 'bfr' on the bugtracker
23:12 Heffalump it does appear to have a setting for "Alternate addresses" instead if you want to merge them
23:12 nebnesknarf yes but that is too common on IRC
23:12 nebnesknarf I just changed it to nebnesknarf and added my private email address
23:13 Heffalump which one? I can't see any changes in the user list.
23:15 nebnesknarf oops, it didn't work
23:16 Heffalump did it reject the change? I can probably try making it as an admin but I'm not entirely certain if there would be any bad consequences.
23:16 nebnesknarf i don't know why i always fight with web forms
23:16 Heffalump FWIW I have half a plan to migrate from roundup to darcsden.
23:16 Heffalump so this setup won't persist indefinitely, I hope
23:16 nebnesknarf now it tells me ben.franksen@online.de is already in use WTF
23:16 Heffalump oh, you have ben.franksen too :-(
23:17 nebnesknarf it is well possible
23:17 nebnesknarf how do I setup things so tat both addresses work?
23:18 Heffalump I'm still not quite sure why your patch was rejected, as I found the logs where it ought to have been visible and couldn't see any sign of it at all.
23:18 Heffalump So in short, I don't know. I do know that my account has my primary email address listed in "E-mail address" and my work address listed in "Alternate E-mail addresses", but I don't know what actual impact that has
23:19 Heffalump I might be able to understand the rejection of your patch better if you send me the bounce message as an attachment (ganesh@earth.li)
23:19 nebnesknarf will do, just a moment
23:21 nebnesknarf done
23:22 nebnesknarf btw, I am in the process of refactoring the whole module (Darcs.UI.ArgumentDefaults)
23:23 Heffalump oh, now I understand. The system relies on the list admin moderating the queue.
23:23 Heffalump which I can do.
23:24 Heffalump well, I partially understand. Anyway, hopefully your patch is now going through.
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23:24 Heffalump what I don't quite understand is what I should do to stop your patches being moderated in future.
23:26 nebnesknarf could it be that I send from my private address but the patch author is my work address?
23:26 Heffalump pass
23:27 Heffalump for now I think I'm going to hope that kowey gets invoked at some point and remembers how this should work
23:28 Heffalump I can't really see why everyone's patches wouldn't get moderated as things stand, but I'm sure mine don't.
23:28 nebnesknarf ok, I can wait a bit for kowey to jump in
23:28 Heffalump for now prod me on IRC to moderate the queue :-)
23:29 nebnesknarf for now I have just a small typo fix in a haddock comment, will send now
23:30 nebnesknarf 'nother small problem: I just switched to my freshly compiled darcs
23:31 nebnesknarf and it wants to create a patch index. that takes WAY to long (just hit Ctrl-C)
23:31 Heffalump well, it should be once-only, but it's a fair point
23:33 nebnesknarf anyway I sent the patch so it should be in your queue now (or soon)
23:58 dolio So, now my cache is messed up using a 7.6.3 compiled darcs somehow... :)
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23:59 dolio I think it might have happened when I did a get with --no-working-dir.
23:59 dolio And it's only messed up for one repo.

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