Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #moarvm, 2014-11-15

| Channels | #moarvm index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 [Coke] timotimo: so knowing where this memory thing is happening, how can I printf the MVMstr in code? I'l recompile and see if that shows me the string.
00:00 timotimo oh
00:00 timotimo printf'ing the MVMString's contents is a bit roundabout
00:00 [Coke] nothing about this bug is straightforward. :)
00:00 timotimo it could very well be that the pointer has become garbage
00:01 timotimo if not, you should look if the storage type is "32bit graphemes" or "rope" (which is quite unlikely, but possible)
00:15 jnthn [Coke]: Thanks for getting it down to being about MVMString. That helps a lot (in terms of reducing surface area).
00:17 timotimo jnthn: i just rewrote prefix:<!> and prefix:<not> for Bool \a to not have a jump and not load 0 and 1 as wval and decont + istrue them ...
00:17 timotimo but can we figure something like that out in spesh? https://gist.github.com/timo/de0ef5d3f5e159117d2b
00:17 jnthn timotimo: That sounds...like an improvement :)
00:17 timotimo the only thing i could think of is duplicating the last block, pasting it onto the two conditional blocks and then being able to constant-fold istrue on the wval'd objects
00:19 jnthn Guy helps land probe on comet. In response, gets reduced to tears because of his choice of *t-shirt*. WTF is wrong with our world... :/
00:19 jnthn timotimo: Yeah, it's not clear to me how to do it...
00:20 timotimo it'll be re-writing then :)
00:20 jnthn timotimo: It's some kinda backwards propagation issue
00:20 timotimo yeah
00:20 jnthn Like, we need to know what something gets used for...
00:20 timotimo i'd kind of like to have a pseudo-register in BBs that get called from if or unless that is set to 0 or 1 in the branch and eliminate constants and other things that way
00:21 timotimo new kernel, bbiab :)
00:21 jnthn :)
00:23 timotimo the thing i was hoping to get fixed by a newer kernel stayed broken :\
00:24 jnthn aww
00:25 japhb jnthn: link re: t-shirt issue?
00:26 timotimo japhb: one of the people was wearing a hawaii shirt with ladies wearing bikinis
00:27 jnthn japhb: http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-30055278
00:29 timotimo okay, that's a bit more ... risquè than just "bikini-clad ladies"
00:29 japhb Sigh.
00:31 * japhb has feelpinions on this subject, but isn't in the mood to rant
00:35 jnthn I've always found blame culture (X went wrong, QUICK LAWSUIT NOW!) ugly, and on this one I'm just sad at the pounce-on-maybe-mistakes culture that leads to a day when somebody should have been celebrating a huge scientific success instead being one they'll remember as "the day I shoulda picked another shirt" :(
00:38 lizmat joined #moarvm
00:40 JimmyZ Good morning, #moarvm
00:40 jnthn Oh my, it's morning already... :)
00:40 JimmyZ 02:00 pm there ?
00:40 JimmyZ *am
00:40 jnthn am :)
00:40 jnthn Yeah
00:40 jnthn Home later than expected sicne they cancelled all the trains...
00:41 JimmyZ Oh
00:41 timotimo it's definitely not like he's set back women in science by a decade by wearing that shirt; it was possibly not anything he even thought about
00:41 timotimo i disagree with placing blame on him
00:42 timotimo it's more or less an expression of the general "mood"/"culture"
00:42 timotimo a symptom, if you like
00:50 japhb I am personally in the camp that feels "No matter how cool your job is, work is not home -- you don't get to be your full self at work, there's a higher standard expected."  I also think it's pretty clear this was a mistake, not intentional -- but if he wears that often to work, what standard is he setting for office environment?
00:50 timotimo right
00:50 timotimo nobody dared criticise him for his ladies-shirt
00:59 jnthn It's sure as heck not a shirt I'd buy, let alone feel comfortable wearning anywhere, let alone work, fwiw. :) But yeah, I think it was almost certainly unintentional, and the internets have dealt their usual nuanceless harsh response.
01:00 timotimo oh, there's nuance in there. you just can't see it between all the rage
01:00 jnthn *nod*
01:00 timotimo oh hey
01:01 timotimo can we somehow spesh "$*OUT is almost never going to change"?
01:01 timotimo it seems like looking that up takes a big chunk of time when we do i/o-heavy benchmarks
01:01 timotimo we already cache dynamic variables in frames somewhere, but it doesn't seem to be enough? or something?
01:03 jnthn Yeah, we do cache those kinds of lookup
01:03 jnthn And if it's the same string literal used int he lookup that should be cheap...
01:04 timotimo you mean '$*OUT'?
01:04 jnthn Yes
01:04 timotimo that should come from the serialization blob
01:05 jnthn Well, the string lit comes from the string heap
01:05 timotimo that one
01:05 timotimo yeah
01:05 timotimo i hope we cache it after unboxing :)
01:05 japhb I thought TimToady++ had experimentally shown that the current caching scheme for dynamics was insufficient (average frame distance too high)
01:05 jnthn I don't think the code-gen boxes it?
01:05 timotimo oh?
01:05 timotimo jnthn: i shall have a look at some spesh log output
01:05 timotimo segfault :)
01:06 jnthn timotimo: oh, though...
01:06 jnthn Perl 6 lookups of those end up being calls to DYNAMIC
01:06 TimToady well, it's not yet optimal, I think
01:06 jnthn And we fail over to PROCESS for $*OUT...
01:06 jnthn So that misses all the caching entirely :(
01:06 TimToady but we got the average frame search from 20+ down to under 5
01:06 jnthn It's almost as if we'd like to be able to cache "I sure as heck didn't find this symbol beneath this point" too
01:06 timotimo ooooh
01:06 jnthn If we can't already
01:07 timotimo that could explain it i suppose?
01:07 jnthn I found that with the method cache fwiw
01:07 jnthn We used to waste a load of time doing MOP fallback stuff in nqp::can on the actions class for things like ws, which had no action method
01:07 jnthn Once I made the method cache authoritative so we knew a miss in it meant "there really ain't one", we got a decent win.
01:07 timotimo "OUT" doesn't even show up in the spesh log
01:07 timotimo perhaps it's *that* bad
01:08 timotimo that it doesn't even get spesh'd
01:08 TimToady we could do better caching if we allocated space for it in the pad
01:09 TimToady especially for known read-only values
01:09 TimToady otoh, single use caching isn't very useful, so you really want to cache up a level or two from the singletons
01:10 jnthn *nod*
01:10 TimToady iirc the current scheme only gets desperate and starts replacing cache entries if it finds a really long lookup
01:11 TimToady and it's also a bit ad hoc; since we have to look in each lexpad anyway, it kinda makes sense to cache values there instead of using a special frame slot
01:12 TimToady and in that case we could be smarter about usage patterns, since we could cache multiple things at any level
01:12 TimToady but that also potentially makes our lexpads not quite readonly at runtime, which is the downside
01:12 TimToady so it's not all win
01:13 TimToady you probably shouldn't trust much of what I say right now, since I'm coming down with Yet Another Cold, courtesy of family get-together-ness
01:13 jnthn Urgh
01:14 jnthn Meanwhile, I'm just about over jetlag, and am flying longhaul again in a couple of days...
01:14 * TimToady has been working on the longest-literal stuff, which turned out not to need a rebootstrap
01:14 TimToady but has other issues
01:15 TimToady currently fails a bunch of tests which may be an inordinate reliance on ordered rules in the grammar, or maybe just bugs
01:15 TimToady getting lit len to propagate up and down the nfa derivations is...fraught...
01:16 japhb jnthn: Where to this time?
01:16 jnthn japhb: South China
01:17 jnthn Just for several days.
01:17 jnthn (Work-related, not vacation this time. :))
01:18 japhb More from the same place you and masak spent a month?
01:18 jnthn Aye
01:19 jnthn masak comes to, so at least I've got somebody to tell the terrible puns I come up with during the plane trip to... :)
01:19 jnthn *too
01:19 * japhb wonders how a Swedish training company gets serious business in South China
01:23 jnthn I dunno. :) Sales is a black box that we feed the sort of stuff we like to do into, and offers of work for us to accept or run screaming from come out of. :)
01:25 japhb Heh
01:41 * jnthn gets some rest
01:42 [Coke] good sales people are a wonder. I'm kind of happy I ended up in an industry where I don't have to rely on sales. :)
03:15 synopsebot joined #moarvm
09:51 JimmyZ joined #moarvm
11:04 ggoebel111111111 joined #moarvm
14:24 camelia joined #moarvm
14:30 woolfy joined #moarvm
16:19 zakharyas joined #moarvm
17:27 nebuchadnezzar hello
17:27 nebuchadnezzar maybe the travis build matrix could be updated? https://travis-ci.org/MoarVM/MoarVM/jobs/41102955#L155
17:29 timotimo ah
17:29 timotimo yeah, could
17:29 timotimo fortunately it's entirely safe
17:51 FROGGS_ joined #moarvm
18:48 BinGOs joined #moarvm
18:54 carlin joined #moarvm
18:55 woolfy joined #moarvm
18:59 hoelzro_ joined #moarvm
19:01 Juerd joined #moarvm
19:21 nebuchad` joined #moarvm
19:22 leedo_ joined #moarvm
19:25 nine joined #moarvm
19:26 timotimo joined #moarvm
19:53 carlin joined #moarvm
20:00 Juerd_ joined #moarvm
20:00 jnthn_ joined #moarvm
20:00 Util_ joined #moarvm
20:11 [Coke]_ joined #moarvm
20:11 lue joined #moarvm
20:23 oetiker joined #moarvm
20:49 dalek joined #moarvm
21:51 ggoebel111111113 joined #moarvm
22:48 woolfy1 joined #moarvm
22:56 lizmat joined #moarvm
23:08 colomon joined #moarvm

| Channels | #moarvm index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary