Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #moarvm, 2015-09-02

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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01:46 orbus greetings moarvm folks
01:46 orbus was curious if anyone knows what the current status of moar on sparc is
01:46 orbus I spent some time last week getting it to build on solaris 10, which I finally got it to
01:46 orbus but it dumps core when I try to build nqp
01:46 orbus I had to build a newer gcc to build moar, and I'm thinking the gcc build may be no good - but figured I'd come ask if this *should* work, or if it's a no-go regardless
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01:48 Topic for #moarvm is now https://github.com/moarvm/moarvm | IRC logs at  http://irclog.perlgeek.de/moarvm/today
02:46 TEttinger orbus, I think it's a little sleepy in here right now. that sounds like an impressive amount of work you've put in though, I imagine there's a way to make it work
02:47 orbus no worries - I can ask later
02:47 orbus I've been working on it off and on
02:47 orbus aside from building gcc, it was mostly just getting the right CFLAGS to get it to build on solaris 10
02:47 TEttinger the only experience I have with sparc is with a bunch of ancient Sun Netra X1 servers that my brother's college threw out from the lab and he salvaged
02:47 orbus there was one minor patch needed in libuv
02:47 TEttinger (and they can't even run Solaris 10)
02:48 TEttinger I ended up running Debian on them
02:48 TEttinger learning how to netboot, crazy stuff for a CS novice
02:48 TEttinger sold most of em for cheap on ebay.
02:49 orbus yup, there's lots of old sparc hardware on ebay
02:49 TEttinger it does sell for considerably more than old x86
02:50 orbus it probably cost 10x as much when new too
02:50 TEttinger I'm curious if it could actually be a solaris bug and not a sparc-related bug
02:50 TEttinger gcc on solaris might have some differences?
02:50 orbus don't know - it looked like there had been some work on solaris 11
02:50 orbus well
02:51 TEttinger I know there used to be differences between make on solaris and on GNU/Linux
02:51 orbus yeah, there's sun make and gnu make
02:51 orbus sun make doesn't work at all
02:52 orbus for lots of open source software
02:52 TEttinger haha, that's exactly what I gathered from just googling anything related to building on solaris :)
02:52 orbus as for gcc, solaris 10 has gcc 3.4.3 as an optional package
02:53 TEttinger hm, is that rather old?
02:53 orbus yeah, latest is 5.2.something
02:53 orbus moar has some built-ins that were added in gcc 4
02:53 orbus or rather needs some built-ins
02:53 orbus that's why I had to build gcc
02:54 TEttinger November 4, 2004
02:54 TEttinger wow, that sounds a lot older than solaris 10
02:54 orbus but there's some notes I saw in the gcc docs after I did the build that make me think maybe I got a bad build
02:54 orbus well, gcc isn't their primary compiler
02:54 TEttinger yeah, there's the sun studio one?
02:54 orbus right
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02:55 orbus but that's $$
02:55 TEttinger mm.
02:55 orbus anyway, there were notes about needing to use specific versions of some of the library dependencies otherwise Bad Things happen
02:55 orbus so I might try again later
02:56 orbus was just curious if there was some known breakage on sparc
02:56 JimmyZ_ we are fine to run on more cpus, though the libuv patch needs to go to the upstream .
02:56 orbus I figured
02:57 orbus it's basically just they're using cfmakeraw for some tty stuff
02:57 orbus which solaris 10 doesn't have
02:57 orbus the equivalent tty settings that cfmakeraw sets are actually in the cfmakeraw man page on linux haha
02:58 orbus other than that it was all CFLAGS
02:58 orbus needed to set various defines to get it to build
02:58 orbus and of course it doesn't work yet
03:02 *¬†JimmyZ_ didn't use solaris at allūüėä
03:02 orbus I use it at work
03:03 orbus and it would be nice if perl6 worked there someday
03:03 orbus so I've just been tinkering with it
03:03 JimmyZ_ yeah
03:03 orbus jvm works but it's slooooow
03:03 orbus Hello, World takes like 5 seconds to run
03:03 JimmyZ_ only if moarvm builds on it
03:04 orbus right, well that's the first hurdle
03:04 orbus it does build
03:04 orbus and like, I can get moar to output the help message
03:04 orbus but when I tried to build nqp it dumps core
03:04 orbus so something's not right
03:04 orbus I still suspect my gcc build
03:04 JimmyZ_ yeah
03:05 orbus newer versions of gcc need like libmpc and a couple other libraries
03:05 orbus and there were notes on the gcc site about those mis-compiling with older versions of gcc
03:06 orbus and I had just grabbed the latest ones
03:06 orbus so they may be silently broken
03:06 JimmyZ_ Is it big endian?
03:06 orbus yes
03:06 orbus I saw the bug note out on github
03:06 orbus about big-endian brokenness
03:06 orbus but I saw some stuff in the irc logs suggesting that's fixed now
03:07 orbus would have to ask jnthn I guess?
03:07 orbus that's one of the reasons I stopped by the channel
03:08 JimmyZ_ not sure whether moarvm works well enough on big endian or not
03:08 orbus yeah
03:08 orbus well it's all good
03:08 orbus hopefully it will work eventually, and if I can help make that happen all the better
03:08 JimmyZ_ but we do have some code in moarvm to support it.
03:09 orbus cool
03:09 orbus I think I'll re-build gcc when I have time, see if that improves the situation
03:10 orbus I might try an older version
03:10 orbus I think anything over 4.0 will work
03:12 orbus oh
03:15 orbus hmm, yeah, think I will have to try this again
03:18 orbus for posterity, the CFLAGS I needed to set for the build were -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=32 -D_POSIX_PTHREAD_SEMANTICS -DSUNOS_NO_IFADDRS -DAO_USE_PTHREAD_DEFS
03:19 orbus notes I made:
03:19 orbus _FILE_OFFSET_BITS=32 is needed for libelf.h, which doesn't support 64 bit offsets on 32 bit compiles
03:19 orbus _POSIX_PTHREAD_SEMANTICS needed for readdir_r arguments
03:19 orbus SUNOS_NO_IFADDRS needed for libuv because Solaris 10 doesn't have ifaddrs.h
03:19 orbus AO_USE_PTHREAD_DEFS needed for libatomic_ops because we get missing symbols otherwise
03:20 orbus I tried to do a 64 bit build and more stuff broke
03:20 orbus didn't push forward on that
03:20 orbus solaris supports both 32 and 64 bit, but most userland stuff is 32 bit
03:24 JimmyZ_ so how can they use more memory on 32 bit...
03:26 orbus I think most big software packages (oracle, etc.) tend to be 64 bit
03:26 orbus it's just like ls, grep, all that stuff ships 32 bit
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09:03 dalek Heuristic branch merge: pushed 48 commits to MoarVM/even-moar-jit by bdw
09:09 dalek MoarVM/even-moar-jit: 3571e61 | brrt++ | src/jit/ (2 files):
09:09 dalek MoarVM/even-moar-jit: C90 compatibility
09:09 dalek MoarVM/even-moar-jit: review: https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/commit/3571e61ab7
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10:40 timotimo i've heard the talk brrt++ is currently giving won't have a recording available afterwards?! :(
10:40 nwc10 I see no camera
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10:40 dalek MoarVM: b335fdf | paultcochrane++ | src/6model/reprs/CStruct.c:
10:40 dalek MoarVM: Avoid possible divide-by-zero error
10:40 dalek MoarVM:
10:40 dalek MoarVM: This merely requires that the `multiple_of` variable is initialised to 1
10:40 dalek MoarVM: instead of to 0.  This change avoids a potentially nasty issue and I don't
10:40 dalek MoarVM: believe changes actual behaviour.
10:40 dalek MoarVM: review: https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/commit/b335fdf8d8
10:40 dalek MoarVM: 61ebda6 | FROGGS++ | src/6model/reprs/CStruct.c:
10:40 dalek MoarVM: Merge pull request #251 from paultcochrane/pr/avoid-divide-by-zero
10:40 dalek MoarVM:
10:40 dalek MoarVM: Avoid possible divide-by-zero error
10:40 dalek MoarVM: review: https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/commit/61ebda644a
10:40 timotimo maybe i can lobby later speakers to run a screen recorder software that also grabs audio from the mic during the talk
10:41 timotimo like OBS multiplatform
10:44 dalek MoarVM/cpp3: bfcc4b6 | FROGGS++ | / (7 files):
10:44 dalek MoarVM/cpp3: re-apply patch to add C++/NativeCall support
10:44 dalek MoarVM/cpp3: review: https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/commit/bfcc4b6b06
10:54 dalek MoarVM/cpp3: e624e11 | FROGGS++ | / (9 files):
10:54 dalek MoarVM/cpp3: re-apply patch to add C++/NativeCall support
10:54 dalek MoarVM/cpp3: review: https://github.com/MoarVM/MoarVM/commit/e624e1159f
10:55 FROGGS (forced update)
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13:16 brrt good *
13:17 FROGGS hi brrt
13:17 FROGGS brrt: how was your talk going?
13:18 brrt it went well, actually, people said i was nervous, which i was
13:18 brrt but also that they understood what i was talking about
13:18 brrt which is kind of nice :-)
13:27 brrt are you not at yapc::eu then?
13:33 FROGGS no, I was unable to afford the time+money :o(
13:39 brrt well, it's september alright, so i can imagine that
13:41 FROGGS it is more that I can't leave my wife and kids at home for two workshops/conferences in a row
13:42 hoelzro has anyone worked with pmurias at all to keep the js branch building with the MoarVM cross compiler? I'm trying to merge js & master in NQP, and I'm encountering issues that I believe are related to serialization format changes
13:44 brrt not me, aactually
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14:19 timotimo no clue :|
14:20 brrt \o timotimo
14:20 timotimo can has slides? :)
14:21 brrt oh, yes, where shall i put them?
14:21 timotimo when i read you'll answer the question "will perl6 ever be fast" at the end of your abstract, i thought you'd pull a total jnthn and whip out benchmarks that show real-life perl6 code that does a 5x over perl5 or something :D
14:22 timotimo i mean, we already do that for number-crunching with tight loops, but that's easy-peasy :P
14:22 timotimo i don't care where the slides land :)
14:28 brrt no, i haven't done that
14:29 brrt i have no spot to place them actually.... maybe at github
14:30 brrt nope, github doesn't allow it
14:40 timotimo google drive?
14:40 timotimo gimme a second
14:41 timotimo hm, yeah, google drive is probably good
14:41 timotimo then i can put it up on t.h8.lv for you
14:47 timotimo and i suppse there's also space on www.p6c.org; dunno if it serves user's "public_html" directories
14:47 timotimo even if not, you can upload it to hack and i'll pull it over onto t.h8.lv
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15:21 timotimo cat says: peeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeoäääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääääe bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbmppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
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21:06 timotimo o/
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