Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #moe, 2013-03-01

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:16 awwaiid stevan_, yeah, that's what I was bashing my head against last night
00:16 awwaiid I changed the expression stuff to be consistently left-recursive all the way down, but it still choked on ->
00:17 awwaiid I can push my interrim stuff up if you like (all tests pass)
00:27 moe [moe] awwaiid pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/kMIBng
00:27 moe moe/master ce63b54 Brock Wilcox: Fix consistency in left-recursion of expression ops
00:27 awwaiid huh. I think I fixed it after all.
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01:56 stevan_ awwaiid: excellent, yeah I was working on that exact fix during my conf call this afternoon
02:17 stevan_ awwaiid++
02:17 stevan_ moe> my %h = { one => 1, two => 2, three => 3 }; %h->keys
02:17 stevan_ ["one", "three", "two"]
02:17 stevan_ moe> my %h = { one => 1, two => 2, three => 3 }; %h->values
02:17 stevan_ [1, 3, 2]
02:17 stevan_ moe> my %h = { one => 1, two => 2, three => 3 }; %h->kv
02:17 stevan_ [["one", 1], ["three", 3], ["two", 2]]
02:17 awwaiid interesting that ** is actually right-associative
02:17 stevan_ moe> my %h = { one => 1, two => 2, three => 3 }; %h->pairs
02:17 stevan_ [one => 1, three => 3, two => 2]
02:17 stevan_ moe> my %h = { one => 1, two => 2, three => 3 }; %h
02:18 awwaiid what?! we have VARIABLES?
02:18 stevan_ {one => 1, three => 3, two => 2}
02:18 stevan_ moe>
02:18 stevan_ it works again :)
02:18 stevan_ yes sir
02:18 stevan_ and methods
02:18 awwaiid who'da thunk it
02:18 stevan_ no args passed to method
02:18 stevan_ or chaining
02:18 stevan_ but we have that
02:19 awwaiid why you say no chaining?
02:19 awwaiid I think chainging works fine. just that nothing returns something that is chainable :)
02:19 stevan_ well, maybe we do
02:19 stevan_ ah yeah probably
02:20 stevan_ I should add in some of the methods for arrays
02:24 awwaiid I guess the stuff on the right of -> should be pretty flexible... esp since -> isn't always method invocation
02:27 awwaiid assuming perl5 style ->(..), ->[..], ->{..}
02:30 stevan_ well, no, I removed that
02:30 stevan_ no dereference syntax
02:32 awwaiid tricksty of you
02:32 awwaiid maybe I can talk you into it if I convince you that ->() is just a fancy way of spelling ->apply?
02:33 stevan_ maybe
02:33 awwaiid :)
02:34 stevan_ I am not philosphically against it
02:34 stevan_ but i am philosophically against the difference between my %h = (..) and my %h = {..}
02:34 stevan_ references are confusing
02:34 awwaiid I'd be happy to ditch it, don't get me wrong. just that nagging desire for some degree of compat without rewriting everything ever
02:35 awwaiid you know
02:35 stevan_ yeah, I agree
02:35 awwaiid maybe I'll just write an alternate parser mode or something
02:35 stevan_ yeah, that works
02:35 stevan_ I am also pondering a PPI based transformer
02:36 stevan_ and a Perl::Critic based syntax checker
02:36 awwaiid ya
02:36 stevan_ to help track down issues
02:53 moe [moe] stevan pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/nGOPkw
02:53 moe moe/master 030be75 Stevan Little: adding in shift
02:53 stevan_ moe> my %h = { one => 1, two => 2, three => 3 }; %h->keys->shift
02:53 stevan_ "one"
02:53 stevan_ awwaiid: you were correct, it works
02:54 awwaiid YAY
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03:20 kthakore hi awwaiid
03:21 awwaiid hi kthakore
03:22 kthakore HI!
03:22 kthakore how are you?!?
03:22 awwaiid pretty darn good
03:22 awwaiid busy busy :)
03:22 awwaiid you coming down for dcbpw2013?
03:23 kthakore doing ok. dcbpw2013?
03:24 kthakore no I don't think so. I am leaving my masters soon, which means less steady money, to work fulltime for my two startups... so I has no money
03:24 awwaiid http://dcbpw.org/ DC-Baltimore Perl Workshop on April 20 in Baltimore, MD
03:24 awwaiid ah, yeah
03:24 awwaiid well
03:24 awwaiid if you get lost and end up in Baltimore, there is likely to be some Moe hacking going on :)
03:41 kthakore cool
03:41 kthakore sure!
03:41 kthakore awwaiid: I am trying to make it for yapc::na
03:41 kthakore awwaiid: GUES WHAT!
03:44 awwaiid what?!
03:45 kthakore SDL2 API is stable!
03:45 kthakore we are makeing libperl-SDL2
03:45 kthakore all rendering is OPENGL
03:45 kthakore :D
03:51 awwaiid crazyness!
03:53 kthakore for sure
03:54 hobbs ALL GLORY TO THE OPENGL
03:58 kthakore kinda yea
04:38 kthakore hobbs: well. It just makes a lot of stuff faster for newer gpu/systesm.
04:38 kthakore systems*
04:38 kthakore it is kinda nice to have one API to opengl/directx/whatever else
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15:50 moe [moe] prakashk pushed 2 new commits to prakashk/builtins: http://git.io/m4_h9A
15:50 moe moe/prakashk/builtins 7bc49d7 Prakash Kailasa: mkString is simpler to make string from list.
15:50 moe moe/prakashk/builtins f7d363a Prakash Kailasa: beginnings of REPL options and pretty-print AST
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17:46 sahadev are chomp and chop methods on MoeStrObjects intended to be destructive (like Perl)?
17:49 stevan_ sahadev: yes, we should follow perl
17:51 sahadev In that case, perhaps, Moe could introduce new immutable versions of these methods that return the changed value?
17:51 perigrin chomp()r
17:51 perigrin and chop()r
17:51 jasonmay chomped?
17:52 sartak ruby gets that right :)
17:52 sartak chomp vs chomp!
17:52 jasonmay yeah
17:52 perigrin chomp! just seems like ti should be more emphatic
17:52 perigrin like "Exceptions bedamned CHOMP I TELL YOU CHOMP"
17:53 PerlJam why should moe even have chop?
17:53 doy +1
17:55 PerlJam sartak: yeah, ruby get it's right that there should be some syntactic designation on mutators, but I tend to agree with perigrin  :)
17:56 stevan_ "foo"->:D #chomp
17:56 phaylon been thinking about mutable primitives a couple days ago. got a bit stumped at how to keep people from doing $obj.attr.chomp on ro attributes
17:56 phaylon well, besides introducing immutable variants one way or the other
17:57 stevan_ "foo"->:D =* ~ # immutable chomp
17:57 perigrin "foo"->:| # immutable chomp ... no teeth.
17:57 stevan_ I was implying that it would be eaten, digested and pooped out
17:57 stevan_ that what the ~ was
17:58 perigrin ... genehack I think needs to discuss both digestion and boundries with you.
17:59 genehack how the eff did i get dragged into this?+
17:59 * perigrin moves the "re-implement BSS Roulette" higher up hsi TODO list though.
18:00 * PerlJam wonders if mutator/non-mutator dichotomy could be unified with the ref-to-substr in some way
18:01 perigrin w26
18:01 stevan_ so I am not entirely against something like chomp!
18:02 stevan_ and honestly, the fact they we not immutable always annoyed me
18:02 stevan_ but I want to pick my battles as to where I deviate from Perl 5
18:03 stevan_ once the mop is in place, it should be possible to say String->add_method( "chomp!" => &immutable_chomp ) if you wanted
18:03 phaylon hey, my toy language has $obj.foo?! as valid syntax, you can't piss off people more than that :)
18:03 jnap I mostly lurk here but that might be a bit of stuff you don't want to try smoking, I've seen chop and chomp used all over in evil ways.
18:04 stevan_ phaylon: have you looked at some scala code??
18:04 phaylon nah :)
18:04 phaylon but hey .foo?! in my context even makes sense. ? means "call method only if it exists" and ! means "chained method calls on the same object"
18:05 phaylon so I'm keeping it
18:05 perigrin er so $obj.foo?!.bar?!.baz?! ?
18:05 perigrin !
18:06 phaylon yep :)
18:07 phaylon same as $obj.foo?!().bar?!().baz?!()
18:07 phaylon it also has $obj.&foo for instance method refs that curry the invocant, that won't allow !
18:08 * stevan_ would like a little of what your smokin there
18:08 stevan_ seems like good stuff
18:09 phaylon heh
18:11 phaylon well, it's a mixture of p5, p6, python, ruby and scheme. the ruby part is assumed. never used it.
18:11 phaylon still gotta see what I can steal from moe :)
18:13 stevan_ phaylon: is your code public?
18:13 phaylon yea, but only got the lexer for now, still thinking about compilation strategy since I'm going through chicken
18:14 phaylon https://github.com/phaylon/pryllc
18:15 phaylon my "design docs" (read my notes.txt) aren't public. too much stupid stuff in there :)
18:16 stevan_ nice
18:17 stevan_ I havent touched scheme in years
18:17 phaylon I love it, just haven't got enough use for it
18:58 moe [moe] rfdrake opened pull request #63: IfNode rewrite (master...ifnode_rewrite)  http://git.io/sOlHNQ
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19:36 moe [moe] stevan pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/Uzut6A
19:36 moe moe/master 6cf4fa1 Robert Drake: IfNode rewrite
19:36 moe moe/master d066086 Stevan Little: Merge pull request #63 from rfdrake/ifnode_rewrite...
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22:18 moe [moe] stevan pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/K6N30g
22:18 moe moe/master 4eae862 Stevan Little: compilation error fixed
22:18 moe moe/master 254899d Stevan Little: make setNativeValue protected (only the internals of the class should use it) and try and remove outside usage of getNativeValue as well
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