Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #mojo, 2011-04-13

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:50 perlrocks Twitter: "ran on the SpeedyCGI mojolicious! CGI script seems to start writing bad as when you deploy." (ja) --clicktx http://twitter.com/clicktx​/status/57968739991293952
00:53 perlrocks Twitter: "CGI:: App Catalyst can only be touched mojo was beginning to worry about directions or to learn. However Mojolicious:: Lite But I did feel that easy to write. But somehow." (ja) --clicktx http://twitter.com/clicktx​/status/57969602650574848
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02:21 jdixon ok, I feel stupid here.
02:21 jdixon on /logout, I'm setting $self->session( expires => 1 ) and even undef'g my username value. But somehow it's persisting even though the cookie is not.
02:23 jdixon sri or marcus perhaps?
02:23 jdixon looking for the cluestick.
02:26 jdixon ok, I think I got it. can't undef that. has to be set to ''.
02:28 jdixon argh, wtf.
02:28 purl hmmm... argh, where is that damn Tiger release
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02:32 jdixon this is fucking bizarro.
02:32 jdixon chrome devtools tells me there are no cookies
02:33 jdixon but I reload the page and can dump a full $user object to stderr.
02:33 jdixon grr
02:34 jdixon whoa.
02:34 jdixon ok, mojo daemon is caching objects.
02:34 jdixon didn't expect that.
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02:55 jdixon ok, it's daemon --reload biting me in the ass again.
02:56 jdixon use vars ($obj) is persisting through reloads.
02:56 jdixon whew
02:57 tempire Coro is hella interesting
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06:33 Christian good morning
06:33 purl Lies!
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07:38 perlrocks Twitter: "nginx + FCGI mojolicious tried to move on. Just like that. Services and make something." (ja) --nyarc666 http://twitter.com/nyarc66​6/status/58071439340879872
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08:07 sri good morning
08:07 purl For you maybe.
08:14 perlrocks Twitter: "Learned in training today. How to move a nginx + fcgi mojolicious & js using the debugging tools in a convenient" (ja) --nyarc666 http://twitter.com/nyarc66​6/status/58080548274454528
08:14 sri jdixon: i'm not even going to ask why you tried to store something temporary in something global
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10:14 sri dku: looks like you're spot on with support for multiple perl web servers in phenona
10:15 sri (looking at the competition currently ignoring perl)
10:16 sri vmware is taking the same route
10:16 sri they assign your node app a port via env var and start the process for you
10:16 sri that's pretty much it
10:17 sri and all monitoring is via actual http requests
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10:49 sri tempire: what's really cool about Coro is that it allows non-blocking db queries to happen from inside templates
10:51 * Debolaz wrote a module called DBIx::Coro once that added support for this.
10:51 Debolaz Only PostgreSQL was supported. :-)
10:51 sri i'll use it for mongodb
10:52 sri iterating over mongodb cursors without blocking, will be quite cool
10:54 sri whats also cool is that a coro plugin can be disabled for testing
10:55 sri so you get all the benefits of blocking for debugging, and the scaling benefits of non-blocking in production
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11:16 GitHub179 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * ff77e1b (3 files in 3 dirs): added experimental xml attribute to Mojo::DOM - http://bit.ly/hHzY7z
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11:25 GitHub11 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * 86f2f8b (2 files in 2 dirs): cleanup - http://bit.ly/gqwvLQ
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12:41 * crab finally returns home, after two weeks
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12:43 koban sri: unnecessary return? https://github.com/kraih/mojo/blo​b/master/lib/Mojo/Message.pm#L56
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12:45 sri koban: indeed
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12:45 GitHub158 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * dae5679 (1 files in 1 dirs): fixed typo - http://bit.ly/dSZh5x
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12:47 GitHub116 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * eb8a2ba (1 files in 1 dirs): cleanup - http://bit.ly/e9YgvN
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13:01 crab i've been running hypnotoad in production behind nginx for a week or so now, and i'm very happy with it.
13:02 sri mine is running for 187 days now :)
13:07 jdixon sri: you're absolutely right. that was a really bad idea. I was being lazy, trying to populate $user info in under().
13:07 jdixon refactoring complete.
13:07 sri if my calculations are not wrong this one even started with an experimental prototype, before hypnotoad even entered github
13:09 sri quite cool
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13:30 elb0w Does mojo::useragent require all of mojolicious to be installed?
13:31 elb0w sri
13:32 moritz why would you want to partially install a distribution?
13:32 elb0w to use Mojo::UserAgent
13:32 elb0w or bytestream
13:32 elb0w or url
13:32 moritz then just install it
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13:33 moritz cpan Mojolicious # and you're fine
13:33 elb0w yes I agree
13:33 moritz or even better, cpanm :-)
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13:33 elb0w but I was recommending Mojo::UserAgent to someone and someone retorted its silly to install everything for just that
13:33 elb0w and to use LWP instead
13:34 moritz you can just as well argue that it's silly to install LWP for just that
13:34 elb0w yeah not bout to go toe to toe with mst about arguing whose right haha
13:35 moritz I just don't get it. Disc space is cheap. Maintenance effort scales with the number of installed distributions and dependencies, not with actual disc size usage
13:35 elb0w I agree
13:35 dku especially with a 0-dependency dist
13:36 * elb0w is very much for mojo
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13:40 moritz elb0w: for the sake of argument: http://deps.cpantesters.org/?module=LWP%3A​%3AUserAgent&perl=5.12.1&os=any+OS
13:40 moritz elb0w: LWP also installs a web server
13:40 elb0w haha
13:41 elb0w thats funny
13:41 moritz (for testing, probably)
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13:42 yko elb0w: Mojo::UA requires Mojo::Base, Mojo::IOLoop and Mojo::URL at least
13:43 moritz probably ByteStream too
13:43 dotan Sad truth is every module installation has a fixed minimum overhead, so installing the whole of mojolicious is faster than it would be to install Mojo::UA with it's deps if each was it's own distro.
13:43 yko why should mojo team ships each of that packages separately? Just because of someone so greedy tries to save 2mb of disk space?
13:43 moritz dotan: agreed
13:43 moritz though the computational overhead is really small
13:45 elb0w whats MojoX?
13:45 purl it has been said that MojoX is mostly deprecated
13:45 yko MojoX is deprecated!
13:45 yko purl, MojoX?
13:45 purl it has been said that MojoX is mostly deprecated
13:45 elb0w no Mojo::Redis then?
13:45 yko MojoX::Redis should be alive
13:45 yko und3f actively maintains it
13:46 moritz 'deprecated' in this context means 'you're discouraged from writing new modules in the MojoX:: namespace', I believe
13:46 yko just namespace MojoX is deprecated, dont _create_ packages there
13:46 yko moritz++
13:47 elb0w Why would you want Mojo::JSON over JSON::XS?
13:47 yko because of XS i think
13:47 yko and because JSON::XS is not in core maybe
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13:48 elb0w I really like ByteStream
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13:49 yko it should be easy to replace i t with any other package: http://mojolicio.us/perldo​c?Mojo/Message#json_class
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13:55 elb0w lol I think I started a mojo vs #perl@freenode war
13:55 elb0w sri lol.
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14:06 sri that happens every few weeks
14:07 elb0w haha my bad, just suggested someone use Mojo::UserAgent
14:07 elb0w and it began
14:07 sri some people can't process new ideas
14:07 sri but that's ok
14:07 elb0w for what its worth, I tried both catalyst and mojo and I enjoy mojo 10x more
14:08 elb0w as both end user / developer
14:09 sri the fact that i'm mostly responsible for the catalyst user experience too makes this a bit weird :)
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14:15 Debolaz Like I stated a bit late in the discussion, Mojo is for me just a better alternative than Catalyst and Dancer (For different reasons). There are several things I don't like about Mojo, I just like the alternatives less. :)
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14:28 sri hmm, wonder how to deprecate Mojolicious::process
14:29 sri it's a method that was meant to be overloaded
14:29 sri ideas?
14:29 purl no idea, sri...
14:30 sri :(
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14:42 Christian nice evening to you all
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14:48 GitHub144 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * d722a22 (2 files in 2 dirs): deprecated Mojolicious process method in favor of the on_process attribute - http://bit.ly/gINUHQ
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14:57 perlrocks Twitter: "Still playing with coroutines and #mojolicious, this will come in handy for the #mongodb client. ;) http://t.co/DrU2RpH #perl" --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/58181858575392769
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15:14 perlrocks Twitter: "You will actually be able to do non-blocking #mongodb queries from within templates. ;) http://t.co/AvJR5O5 #perl #mojolicious" --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/58186234832502786
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15:49 stephan48 sri: that sounds scary...
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15:54 sri stephanj: but it isn't
15:54 sri *stephan48
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16:14 sri interesting, rails will default to coffeescript instead of javascript
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16:32 gabb coffeescript is tidy
16:32 gabb reminds me of Funode:
16:32 gabb http://blog.fogus.me/2011/04/12/​node-js-is-dead-long-live-node/
16:33 sri it's a really heavy prereq
16:33 sri means they depend on a javascript engine being installed, usually node.js
16:33 gabb some people REALLY dislike the js syntax
16:33 sri just look at node.js code
16:33 sri spaghetti callbacks
16:34 gabb yea, thats (to my understanding) what the guy behind Funode is complaining about (and apparently fixing)
16:34 gabb I couldn't agree with him more on: "My problem with Javascript has always been that expertise is defined more in terms of understanding its faults rather than its features."
16:35 gabb and for your pleasure: "The Funode Way will include: [...] -coroutines [...]" :P
16:36 sri coroutines + non-blocking is indeed cool
16:36 gabb k, time to download new neo4j release
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18:02 perlrocks Twitter: "MojoMama!! You can now nominate a mother and tell us why she should receive a mojolicious makeover valued at a... http://fb.me/VlxSmv6v" --bibisalonnyc http://twitter.com/bibisalon​nyc/status/58228463076777984
18:02 sri lol
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18:27 yko let's nominate sri as MojoPapa
18:30 sri \o/
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18:53 elb0w sri, I assume that Mojo::URL will encode by default
18:56 sri elb0w: testing would have been easier than writing the sentence ;)
18:57 elb0w lies :D
18:58 sri https://github.com/kraih/mojo/​blob/master/t/mojo/url.t#L247 # but we support even the really funky stuff
18:58 sri IRI and IDNA
18:59 sri "mojo get ☃.net"
19:00 sri :D
19:01 sri i'm sure you meant something simpler, but i rarely get to show off this stuff :/
19:01 elb0w haha
19:01 elb0w no thats actually exactly what I wanted
19:01 sri \o/
19:01 elb0w :)
19:01 elb0w listening to this http://thechangelog.com/post/4557774334/episode-​0-5-6-vim-with-drew-neil-tim-pope-and-yehuda-kat
19:02 elb0w theyve been talking about colors for vim for like 10minutes now
19:02 elb0w lol
19:02 sri colors deserve our attention
19:04 * sri can't stand vim buffer management
19:04 * yko loves solarized colors now
19:04 elb0w man paypal fuckin sucks
19:04 elb0w I didnt like solarized
19:04 elb0w too blue
19:04 yko i use it in console, so i have black bg
19:05 sri i use a twilight console theme
19:05 elb0w sri can I see?
19:05 yko don't like it in gui - i can't breathe in that smoke
19:05 elb0w I use this at home http://elbowrage.com/BEA-UTIFUL.png
19:05 elb0w just random code opened to show it
19:06 elb0w ignore the php
19:06 elb0w doing a project for someone in it
19:06 elb0w :(
19:07 yko yayks. looks like someone splashed acid :)
19:07 elb0w http://elbowrage.com/mevspaypal.png
19:07 elb0w thats at work
19:07 elb0w modified jellybeans
19:08 yko and you just said that talking for 10 minutes about colors is too much, hehe
19:08 sri http://twitpic.com/2o3twl http://twitpic.com/3yt1xf # my custom macvim themes
19:08 sri i'm mostly back to textmate now though
19:08 elb0w thats nice
19:09 elb0w is that a standard twilight theme?
19:09 sri nope, both homemade
19:09 elb0w can I get your twilight? :P
19:09 elb0w I like it
19:09 yko i managed to switch my terminal to 256 colors only yesterday. shame on me
19:09 sri the second is mostly a true twilight adaption
19:09 elb0w iterm2
19:10 elb0w for mac
19:10 elb0w has 256
19:10 * sri just noticed that he actually deleted iterm2 again after crashing a few times
19:10 sri my terminal is mostly unspectacular now, just a twilight grey background
19:11 elb0w theme
19:11 elb0w :(
19:12 elb0w Do you like sublime?
19:12 elb0w I like the minimap thing
19:18 sri https://gist.github.com/918201
19:18 sri https://gist.github.com/918202
19:19 sri https://gist.github.com/918204 # no, this one actually
19:20 elb0w wow these guys are supposed to be vim pros
19:20 elb0w they talk about textmate
19:20 elb0w and emacs more than anything
19:21 elb0w thanks btw sri, checking it out now
19:21 elb0w nice
19:21 elb0w very clean
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19:28 GitHub8 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * 16961f3 (1 files in 1 dirs): fixed typo - http://bit.ly/fmrU3a
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19:36 sri http://twitpic.com/4kgomp/full # screenshot of my current environment
19:38 sri i like sublime btw. but it is just not there yet
19:39 perlrocks Twitter: "@wdf_vrt Nothing besides the mojolicious bundle." --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/58253079606329344
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19:43 rindolf Hi all. How do I set the status response on a Mojolicious::Lite app?
19:44 * sri waves
19:44 rindolf http://search.cpan.org/perl​doc?Mojo::Message::Response - I see here something called "code".
19:44 rindolf Is it only numeric?
19:45 sri yes
19:45 rindolf sri: OK.
19:45 perlrocks Twitter: "@kraih digging mojolicious though. i'm going to use it for the web frontend to for our malware sandbox intelligence gathering setup." --wdf_vrt http://twitter.com/wdf_vrt​/status/58254579795623936
19:46 rindolf sri: oh, and meow! What's up?
19:48 sri cold beer and the latest episode of castle i hope :)
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19:58 rindolf sri: nice.
19:58 elb0w this is cool, I could actually just make this PayPal IPN and PDT thing im building a mojo plugin when im done
19:58 sri \o/
19:59 rindolf If my CGI app is show.cgi how do I handle /path/to/my/cgi/show.cgi?mode=random ?
19:59 tempire sublime is going to take over the world.
19:59 tempire eventually
19:59 elb0w tempire, its not opensource there will always be hesitations
19:59 tempire bah
19:59 tempire windows took over the world
20:00 tempire I want the minimap in my macvim
20:00 elb0w haha
20:00 elb0w yeah agreed on that
20:00 elb0w rindolf mojo lite?
20:01 rindolf elb0w: yes, a Mojo::Lite app.
20:02 elb0w did you check here? http://mojolicio.us/perldoc?Mojolicious/Lite#toc
20:02 elb0w look for "A Little Bit Of Everything"
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20:06 sri we do not dispatch based on query parameters
20:06 elb0w Didnt know that
20:07 rindolf Now I'm getting into http://homepage-test.shlomifish.org​/humour/fortunes/show.cgi/show.cgi
20:07 rindolf I was at ./show.cgi (without the trailing slash) and I redirected to "./show.cgi", id => $str_id and got the extra '/'.
20:08 sri you're need to let the cgi mindset behind, this a whole different way to develop web apps
20:10 rindolf sri: :-S
20:10 sri *-'re
20:10 elb0w I had the most fun with this when I just dove into the full Mojolicious
20:11 elb0w Did anyone ever do the geolocation for mojo?
20:11 sri what's mojo specific about geo location?
20:11 elb0w I still need to do something with http://dev.elbowrage.com/util/whereami and dev.elbowrage.com/util/whereis/8.8.8.8
20:11 elb0w You said to make a plugin for it
20:11 sri quite sure i've seen a google maps example app with geo location though
20:12 elb0w yeah think it was mine
20:12 sri :D
20:12 elb0w http://dev.elbowrage.com/gui/whereami
20:12 elb0w that one
20:12 purl somebody said that one was sartak's fault even
20:12 * sri remembers
20:13 elb0w havent done anything with mojo lately aside from this paypal stuff, been swapped :(
20:13 sri geo location is a hot topic, no matter what kinda plugin you release i'm sure it will get used
20:13 elb0w yeah, I wanted to make an algorithm to take in a list of geo servers and try to give the best answer
20:14 sri rindolf: i would really suggest a fresh start with the lite tutorial
20:14 rindolf sri: OK.
20:14 elb0w I just dove into hypnotoad + mojolicious and was fine
20:16 sri mojolicious is rather opinionated software, learning the defaults is usually more fun that starting customizing it right away
20:17 * sri opens the first beer, ask question at your own risk from now on!
20:18 elb0w o wow my mojo server just crashed
20:18 elb0w wtf
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20:18 elb0w first time ive seen hypnotoad do that
20:19 sri you mean the master?
20:19 elb0w yeah it just died
20:19 elb0w the whole process
20:19 purl somebody said the whole process was kind of annyoing
20:19 sri on USR2?
20:19 elb0w no just randomly
20:19 elb0w refreshed the page
20:19 elb0w it just didnt go
20:19 elb0w checked process and it went down
20:19 sri i've never seen that
20:20 elb0w yeah me either, im just messing with you. Enjoy the beer :)
20:20 sri !@#$%^&
20:20 elb0w lolll\
20:21 sri I'LL FIND YOU!
20:23 sri you're messing with the wrong evil robot here, just so you know!
20:28 elb0w lmao
20:28 elb0w argh i think paypal should hire me
20:28 elb0w for doing all this shit
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22:21 sri https://github.com/rails/rails/commit/9f09aeb82731​77fc2d09ebdafcc76ee8eb56fe33#commitcomment-340720 # lol
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22:48 GitHub135 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * 470d74f (2 files in 2 dirs): updated WebSocket implementation with payload masking (ietf-07) - http://bit.ly/eBKieY
22:48 GitHub135 left #mojo
22:49 sri things got simple again
22:49 sri looks like the last big decision is finally made and websockets could theoretically go stable

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