Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #mojo, 2011-04-15

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:11 elb0w_ sri
00:11 elb0w_ u there
00:58 perlrocks Twitter: "DOM perl-sizzle like and want to choose, I wrote Riedel's. "Mojo:: Client tried to use the" http://t.co/6kHQBIY" (ja) --purasiibo http://twitter.com/purasiib​o/status/58695644201750530
01:23 perlrocks Twitter: "Mojolicious Perl framework document only in English and Japanese. How Japan's mania for Perl to know how many w" (ja) --brain_apple http://twitter.com/brain_app​le/status/58701827264364544
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02:24 perlrocks Twitter: "[Mojolicious] Mojolicious:: Renderer was useful. Use it. http://t.co/Y1GpphL" (ja) --purasiibo http://twitter.com/purasiib​o/status/58717274672078848
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02:51 perlrocks Twitter: "I tried adding # mojolicious correct translation. / Mojolicious - GitHub http://htn.to/ij1ova" (ja) --kits_ http://twitter.com/kits_/status/58724080274255872
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04:09 * tempire jumps
04:09 * tempire kris krosses
04:09 * tempire jumps again
04:10 * tempire simmers unicorn meat in a pan
04:10 * tempire distributes it to the channel members
04:10 * tempire sprinkles mojolicious on it
04:11 tempire DELICIOUS
04:11 purl it has been said that DELICIOUS is social bookmarks; most popular -> http://del.icio.us/popular/ or crazy or holy crap fmh is a (rich) nutcase or candy. candy is delicious
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04:22 tempire omg
04:22 tempire sri: curl -Is slashdot.org | egrep '^X-(F|B)' | cut -d \- -f 2
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06:39 Christian morning
06:40 * yko waves
06:41 koban hi ppl
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06:48 crab i have a /foos/:foo_id bridge and some routes under it, like /delete and /show
06:48 crab can i also somehow create a route for /foos/:foo_id.pdf under the same bridge?
06:49 crab rather than having to do, e.g. /foos/:foo_id/:foo_id.pdf or similar?
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07:37 stephanj crab: i would say yes
07:37 yko crab: $r->bridge('/foos')->to('auth')->route('/:foo_id', foo_id => qr/\.pdf^/)->to(...);
07:37 yko $r->bridge('/foos')->to('auth'​)->route('/:foo_id)->to(...);
07:38 stephanj by not prepending the route definition by / i would assume
07:38 yko hmm. damn, you don't need to define bridge twice there
07:38 yko you should try both versions and say us which one works!
07:39 yko or find your one that works and tell us :)
07:41 yko i would say something like that https://gist.github.com/1175626eac15c7165e31
07:41 crab stephanj: your assumption would be wrong.
07:41 stephanj k
07:41 crab i tried that, but it didn't work.
07:42 crab yko: the problem is that my bridge needs the id
07:42 yko than you realy need to define bridge twice
07:43 yko i'm not sure if it would works, but you should try
07:43 crab ok.
07:44 yko similar cunstruction, but bridge should eat whole path and route sould be ampty i think
07:44 yko *empty
07:44 yko and you may need to use wildkard placeholders for bridge to catch exactly id
07:45 yko something like /foos/(*foo_id).pdf maybe and then make foo_id strict with regexp
07:47 perlrocks Twitter: "It is possible to read any file on your system when you use #mojolicious server :( https://github.com/kraih/mojo/issues/114 #perl" --vtivti http://twitter.com/vtivti/status/58798533746245632
07:48 su-bzero_ epic
07:51 perlrocks Twitter: "Please @kraih RT: @vtivti: It is possible to read any file on your system when you use #mojolicious server :( http://bit.ly/dOst9k #perl" --sharifulin http://twitter.com/shariful​in/status/58799489791692800
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08:23 perlrocks Twitter: "#mojolicious Issue 114 fixed in my fork on github, pull request sent." --perlninja http://twitter.com/perlninj​a/status/58807587755405312
08:24 perlrocks Twitter: "@vti thats a feature for easier data sharing #mojolicious" --und3f http://twitter.com/und3f/status/58807787601403904
08:24 perlrocks Twitter: "@vtivti also, next time, try some responsible disclosure. #mojolicious" --perlninja http://twitter.com/perlninj​a/status/58807962596155392
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08:51 GitHub121 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * b098549 (4 files in 4 dirs): fixed critical security issue that can expose files on your system and prepared emergency release
08:51 GitHub121 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * e74de48 (1 files in 1 dirs): fixed typo
08:51 GitHub121 mojo: master commits 769b502...e74de48 - http://bit.ly/eCqMIK
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09:08 perlrocks Twitter: "Mojolicious 1.16 by KRAIH - http://frepan.org/~kraih/Mojolicious-1.16/" --cpan_new http://twitter.com/cpan_ne​w/status/58818852137607169
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09:12 sri making blog post, explaining vtis irresponsibility
09:12 PerlNinja I already ripped him a new one in DM on Twitter too ...
09:12 memowe sri: CPAN =~ s/1\.16/1.17/
09:12 sri memowe: ?
09:12 memowe Twitter: "Mojolicious 1.16 by KRAIH
09:13 sri ?
09:13 memowe Shouldn't it be release 1.17?
09:13 sri get to the point, i really don't have time to waste right now
09:13 sri no
09:13 memowe Oh, OK.
09:13 memowe Never mind.
09:13 sri just the bugfix, nothing else
09:14 memowe good luck.
09:14 purl You'll need it.
09:33 crab wait, cpan allows you to re-release the same version now?
09:34 sri doubt that
09:34 purl doubt that is, like, going to happen
09:36 crab oh, then i must have misunderstood. i thought memowe was saying 1.16 was already released. but i follow git, so i never realise what the version number is.
09:39 sri http://blog.kraih.com/mojolicious-​116-emergency-release-please-upgr
09:42 sri hmm, twitter outage :S
09:42 PerlNinja again? :(
09:42 perlrocks Twitter: "New blog post, #mojolicious 1.16 emergency release, please upgrade! http://t.co/fxyUw2E #perl" --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/58827625266819072
09:49 sri ok, posted to blog, twitter and mailing list
09:49 sri not much more we can do i guess
09:53 PerlNinja ok since everything's back to normal, a question! :D ... if you send hypnotoad a USR2 signal for a hot deployment, does it actually sit around reloading classes, or does it start up fresh processes?
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10:02 sri PerlNinja: fresh processes
10:02 sri it's fork+exec+fd inheritance
10:03 sri that's why you can upgrade even Perl and system libraries at runtime
10:04 sri also the reason it is unix only
10:05 PerlNinja that's what i needed to know :) ok cool
10:05 sri <3 unix
10:05 PerlNinja indeed
10:05 PerlNinja deploying app servers and keeping them updated now got easier since they can pretty much restart themselves if they pull in an update from the update server
10:06 PerlNinja <3++
10:06 sri that's exactly what hypnotoad was made for :)
10:07 sri effortless zero downtime upgrades
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10:15 sri yay, finally breakfast
10:22 perlrocks Twitter: "koorchik's Perl blog: Mojolicious 1.16: Emergency release, all updated! http://ff.im/BcaDX" (ru) --planetperlru http://twitter.com/planetper​lru/status/58837505239289856
10:23 PerlNinja sri: breakfast? i'm about to go for dinner :P
10:39 stephanj i need to have a wrapper around a process which sends tons of STDIN/STDOUT stuff, and providing a api for restarting it(secured by https client certs), could i abuse mojolicious for it?(providing me a api to open sockets and so on)
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10:50 perlrocks Twitter: "Sebastian Riedel (sri): Mojolicious 1.16: Emergency Release, Please Upgrade! http://bit.ly/dGvuss" --perlironman http://twitter.com/perlironm​an/status/58844743135801344
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10:58 perlrocks Twitter: "Meh... http://blog.kraih.com/mojolicious-​116-emergency-release-please-upgr #perl #mojolicious" --bacek http://twitter.com/bacek/status/58846592417009664
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11:12 sri stephanj: theoretically yes, documentation for complicated use cases like that is slim though
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11:38 sri \o
11:38 sri o/
11:38 sri \o/
11:47 * crab attaches lead weights to sri's arms
11:47 sri o
11:48 Foxcool joined #mojo
11:49 perlrocks Twitter: "у кого на mojolicious production? https: / / github.com/kraih/mojo/issues/114" (fil) --bappoy http://twitter.com/bappoy/status/58859549171531777
11:52 PerlNinja sri: that's more like amputation...
11:52 crab armputation?
11:55 arpadszasz left #mojo
11:55 perlrocks Twitter: "Security vulnerabilities happen, what's important is how you deal with them. #mojolicious #perl" --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/58861102146129920
11:56 moritz sri++ # so true
11:57 sri may i have my arms back?
11:57 * sri keeps typing with his nose
11:57 crab heh
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12:36 perlrocks Twitter: "Mojolicious: Emergency release, please upgrade! http://t.co/eAmhepN" --ranguard http://twitter.com/ranguar​d/status/58871381181472769
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12:46 Ranguard http://perlnews.org/2011/04/mojolicio​us-emergency-release-please-upgrade/ <- fyi
12:50 sri Ranguard++
12:53 * Ranguard waves
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13:07 crab btw, sri, (a) thanks for the cookie+hook change, (b) do you have any suggestions about my /:blah_id.pdf route question?
13:07 crab (which is: can i have a bridge on /:blah_id and write routes under it for both /3.pdf and /3/foo, or do i need separate bridges?)
13:10 PerlNinja one route and one bridge?
13:10 PerlNinja looks similar to something i did ... cant remember how i fied that up
13:17 sri crab: why not just two routes?
13:18 sri you can theoretically solve just about everything with a complicated regex, but if two routes are easier to read i'd go with it
13:19 moritz .oO( and if regexes won't do, you can embed code into the regex )
13:19 moritz now I'm just being evil
13:20 sri the good kind of evil
13:23 elb0w wat? emergency update?
13:24 moritz security fix
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13:24 * tempire whips out his sherrif hat
13:24 tempire The big one.
13:24 purl Bigger than yours, tempire
13:32 sri "We’re just a couple of regular guys, walking down the street, with a small cowboy."
13:34 sri http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1092026/ # really funny
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13:36 crab sri: good enough for me
13:38 elb0w /usr/bin/make install  -- FAIL
13:38 elb0w wtf?
13:38 elb0w I have old mojo
13:38 elb0w why would it do that
13:38 elb0w ah nvm
13:38 elb0w lmao
13:49 perlrocks Twitter: "Bug in mojolicious. Extra upgrade. It's a shame." (ru) --s0151 http://twitter.com/s0151/status/58889696104816640
13:55 crab yeah, a bug in software, what a shock.
14:00 PerlNinja The nerve... how dare there be a bug in software!
14:00 koban` it's a bad translate - better translate is 'what's a pity'
14:01 crab oh, fair enough then.
14:02 crab i'm annoyed with myself for not catching that bug
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14:19 sri russian translations somehow always sound more harsh than they actually are
14:20 sri or meant to be actually
14:20 sri i bet russian is a good language for swearing too :)
14:21 moritz it is :-)
14:21 sri hard to beat german though
14:22 moritz bacek on #parrot always says that english is only his 4th language: russian, rude russian, very rude russian and then english :-)
14:22 sri lol
14:23 PerlNinja wait, there is a difference between russian and very rude russian?
14:24 PerlNinja russian swearing > dutch swearing > german swearing ... also... dutch has much more tasty variety in ways to tell people to please die in a fire
14:25 sri that sounds convenient
14:31 PerlNinja what, the fire part or the tasty variety?
14:34 sri those are not the same?
14:35 PerlNinja well, one does lead to the other ... bbq in general is nice :D
14:36 Christian nice weekend toi you all
14:37 elb0w lol
14:37 elb0w Nice comments in Mojo::ByteStream
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14:38 sri they are even kinda on topic :)
14:38 elb0w yes the old people extraction
14:38 sri xD
14:39 PerlNinja old people extraction =/= bbq :P
14:39 PerlNinja unless that's what you do after you extract...
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14:46 elb0w what is SUPER::new ?
14:53 perlrocks Twitter: "Or critical updates. And this then. "@ Kraih: New blog post, # mojolicious 1.16 emergency release, please upgrade! Http://t.co/GW0vGgL # perl"" (ja) --purasiibo http://twitter.com/purasiib​o/status/58905778391752704
14:57 elb0w sri why do I use ByteStream instead of util?
14:57 elb0w is it just a wrapper?
14:57 elb0w I could do Mojo::Util::url_unescape $string no?
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15:05 sri bytestream predates util
15:05 elb0w oh so its for legacy?
15:05 sri most people prefer the bytestream api for high level stuff
15:05 elb0w yeah
15:05 elb0w Reading through mojo source
15:05 elb0w its very clean
15:05 sri we added util for better performance on ht elower levels
15:05 sri *the
15:06 elb0w trying to teach myself about using objects in perl
15:06 elb0w creating*
15:06 sri SUPER is the next base class btw
15:07 elb0w hmm
15:09 elb0w lesson is never try
15:09 elb0w haha
15:09 sri i was about to suggest reading Mojo::Base to understand perl oo, but i suppose the optimizations make it not such a good example
15:09 elb0w yeah im reading that now
15:09 elb0w Its good, I like saying wtf
15:09 elb0w makes me read deeper :P
15:09 sri it's basically all about sub new
15:10 sri and bless
15:10 elb0w yeah I feel if I get those down ill have a better grasp of writing perl modules
15:10 elb0w Right now I just export methods
15:10 sri big step forward then
15:11 sri the fact that there are like a gazillion ways to do higher level perl oo can be a bit confusing though
15:11 elb0w Yeah, thats perls claim to fame though right? 50 ways to do 1 thing
15:11 sri i think the most important parts you need to learn are bless and @ISA
15:12 elb0w yeah was reading this http://docstore.mik.ua/ore​lly/perl/prog3/ch12_05.htm
15:12 elb0w had some mentions
15:12 sri once you grok @ISA SUPER will make sense too
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15:15 elb0w my $ws = '    '; :o
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15:16 elb0w gonna put a funny message there
15:16 sri try MOJO_BASE_DEBUG=1
15:16 sri $ws is there to make it readable
15:17 PerlNinja I still don't understand why people push Moose so hard. These days if you admit to doing perl OO the "oldschool" way you get laughed at
15:17 sri "MOJO_BASE_DEBUG=1 mojo get http://mojolicio.us"
15:18 sri PerlNinja: i've not seen that yet
15:18 * PerlNinja has gotten in a habit of using Mojo::Base outside mojolicious projects too ... it works...
15:19 PerlNinja I've seen it a few times so far, I kind of like the idea behind Moose but it's a slow slow piggy
15:19 sri two years ago it was a bit like that, but even the moose hardliners became moderates by now
15:20 PerlNinja meh, I see people advocate Moose and use all the wrong reasons to do it, mostly "oh it cuts down on boilerplate code and you get this funky type validation too!" - from a language point of view it's nice, practically what i care about is something that works, can be maintained, and doesn't require 2342 dependencies to be installed ... aaanyway.. I stop ranting now :D
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15:23 mateu PerlNinja: try Moo :)
15:24 sri well, i think people should at least learn moose, to be able to make a decision for themselves
15:26 PerlNinja well yeah
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15:26 GitHub173 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * e6d8aca (1 files in 1 dirs): cleanup - http://bit.ly/hC3AnJ
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15:26 PerlNinja not saying avoid it, just that if someone has made the decision not to use it, that shouldn't be a hot topic or something
15:26 mateu imho, one should at least have a good reason to not use it.
15:26 sri you should know the rules before you're allowed to break them :)
15:27 PerlNinja mateu: my reasons are: it's slow during app start, requires too many dependencies, and sometimes gets in the way of what i want to do
15:28 mateu PerlNinja: thus my Moo recommendation.
15:28 PerlNinja the latter part probably being more an indication that i tend to write things that are best left unwritten :)
15:28 mateu yeah i'm wondering what you mean by "gets in the way"
15:28 PerlNinja well
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15:29 PerlNinja hypothetical situation (*cough*): I need dynamic accessors. I either solve it with autoload, but since that's considered a no-no when you're Moosing... now tell me how that's done with Moose :)
15:29 PerlNinja s/accessors/attributes/
15:30 mateu I'm not a Moose expert, just a user, but I'm pretty sure there's a way without autoload.
15:30 sri oh noes... a new minor xcode update with a 4.5gb download :S
15:31 mateu ouch
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15:32 PerlNinja i hate xcode
15:32 sri btw. has anyone seen a good example for moose role usage yet?
15:32 PerlNinja mateu: well, that's what I've been trying to find out for a *long* time, I'm still looking
15:33 PerlNinja sri: not really, I still don't see the point of a role when you can use inheritance to more or less get the same effect
15:33 mateu PerlNinja: have you asked on #moose?
15:34 PerlNinja mateu: a long time ago, which is when i got jumped on by a few characters in there for my non-Moose-believing
15:34 mateu PerlNinja: did they stone you?   :)
15:34 PerlNinja almost :P
15:34 sri roles are really cool in theory, but i've not seen them used well in practice yet
15:34 sri architecture astronauts :)
15:34 PerlNinja the only use case I could see with a role
15:34 mateu I find roles useful for composing in DB connection
15:35 PerlNinja is to have pluggable extensions on an existing module
15:36 PerlNinja mixing in bits and pieces and such but thinking about a use case i've got no idea, the only software i'd see it used is a forum .. and you can't do that in the first place because most frameworks don't allow easy restarting or reloading .. mojolicious being the exception :D
15:37 mateu I also found a nice fit for roles in Algorithm::Simplex where I created a solve role that works on three different models.
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15:54 TheCritic http://pastebin.com/SQW30r7A failure to install MojoX::Session from CPAN
15:54 TheCritic advice?
15:54 purl TheCritic: Use `unqualified' people or http://p-cos.blogspot.com/20​07/12/origin-of-advice.html
15:55 crab don't use MojoX::Session
15:55 TheCritic recommendation for sessions in mojo?
15:55 PerlNinja crab: what's wrong wth MojoX::Session? :P
15:56 sri is it maintained again?
15:56 crab TheCritic: http://toroid.org/ams/etc/m​ojolicious-session-cookies
15:56 crab PerlNinja: it fails to install from CPAN
15:56 sri crab++
15:56 PerlNinja okay besides that
15:56 purl besides that is a really good CD
15:57 PerlNinja mojolicious built-in sessions are browser-bound, not user bound
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15:57 crab what does that mean?
15:57 purl That boy needs therapy.
15:57 * sri strangles purl
15:57 PerlNinja crab: it means that if you log in, and i keep your session data in mojolicious sessions, if you then go and use another computer with another browser, you log in again, then the data from your first session isn't available
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15:58 PerlNinja they're two totally different session stores, given that the data is stored in a cookie - cookies don't transport well between browsers :)
15:58 sri that's really not what sessions are meant for
15:58 crab you shouldn't be doing that
15:58 PerlNinja sri, okay, so what is meant to do things like this?
15:58 crab if you want to store state, do it on the server and identify it using the cookie. don't store gobs of data in the cookie.
15:58 sri PerlNinja: a model
15:58 PerlNinja yeeees....
15:58 PerlNinja and that's what MojoX::Session does, crab
15:59 sri you are abusing sessions
15:59 TheCritic well, thats what it would do if it installed
15:59 PerlNinja no, because I use MojoX::Session
15:59 sri using it instead of a database
15:59 sri sessions should be used for state keeping, that's all
16:00 TheCritic state, street 1, street 1, zip, all that :)
16:00 sri or better, short term state keeping
16:00 sri as in temporary
16:00 crab istr vti saying once that mojox::sessions was written before the built-in sessions, and it wasn't very useful any more
16:00 sri TheCritic: that sounds more like a user profile that belongs in a database
16:01 TheCritic no, it sounds like my very bad sense of humor... I'll save it for my wife :)
16:01 crab save it in a cookie
16:01 TheCritic I was playing on the 2 different uses of the word "state"
16:01 * sri scratches head
16:01 TheCritic exactly, sorry
16:01 sri argh
16:02 sri back on topic, imo there is only one good reason to store session data server side
16:03 sri and that would be a security constraint
16:03 sri if the server side needs to be able to reliably delete sessions
16:04 sri if that constraint does not apply for your use case the built in sessions should be perfectly fine
16:04 sri and even in that one case you can get away with a token stored in the model layer and a cookie session
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16:30 perlrocks Twitter: "koorchik's Perl blog | | Pearl Blog - Mojolicious 1.16: Emergency release, all updated! http://goo.gl/fb/aFJ5R" (ru) --geekspot_ru http://twitter.com/geekspot_​ru/status/58930105782767616
16:40 elb0w Since you guys are on sessions atm. Am I doing this right in this system im building. I am validating a user when they login against the database. If its valid I create a generated session id + maping to that user in the db and store the session id in the cookie as well. Then anypage the user goes to I check his cookie session id against the db id and fetch whatver data I need if its valid
16:40 elb0w Is that logic correct?
16:41 sri why do you generate your own session id?
16:41 elb0w this isnt mojo
16:41 sri oh
16:41 elb0w its some crappy php project I have to do for a client
16:42 elb0w I just havent done this manually and figure you guys are the ones to ask
16:43 elb0w yarg
16:45 stephanj sri: but still with client side sessions, you could store a id in it and then just mark it as invalid if you dont like that session anymore
16:46 stephanj ah overade you already named that option
16:46 sri :)
16:46 stephanj overread*
16:47 stephanj does mojo provide a way to use sockets? or is IO::Socket still best way?
16:47 sri there's an event loop built in
16:47 sri http://mojolicio.us/perldoc?Mojo/IOLoop # this is what daemon and useragent use
16:48 stephanj cool :)
16:48 stephanj can it use client side ssl certs?
16:48 stephanj yap
16:48 stephanj absolutely cool
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16:52 GitHub88 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * 3996e94 (1 files in 1 dirs): pod cleanup - http://bit.ly/dNmBgm
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16:54 sri stephanj: here are some useragent tests with certificates https://github.com/kraih/mojo/blo​b/master/t/mojo/user_agent_tls.t
16:55 sri maybe that helps a bit
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16:58 sri actually scratch that
16:58 sri https://github.com/kraih/mojo/b​lob/master/t/mojo/ioloop_tls.t
16:59 sri those tests might be pretty much exactly what you want
17:00 sri tempire did a good job there
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17:04 stephanj tempire++ # nice thanks :)
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17:04 stephanj i plan to use the Mojo::IOLoop in a little tool which should monitor and manage a process
17:05 stephanj to make it possible for my client to connect to it and start/stop it f.e. or send something to STDIN
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17:36 PerlNinja gah, long live my dsl provider
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19:33 rindolf Hi all.
19:33 * sri waves
19:34 yegor Is it possible to prevent loading of some default plugins like tag_helper and ep(l?) renderers?
19:34 sri nope
19:34 sri they are considered built ins
19:34 rindolf It may be disappointing, but I've given up on converting http://homepage-test.shlomifish.org/humour​/fortunes/show.cgi?id=means-what-you-think to Mojolicious::Lite . Instead, I converted it to use CGI::Minimal instead of CGI.pm. I've still done the Insurgent Software web app in M::L.
19:35 sri they are plugins because they seemed like good examples
19:41 PerlNinja rindolf, why give up on converting, because of.... what? :P
19:41 sri he started with a cgiapp app
19:41 sri and wants to keep query param based dispatching
19:42 sri converting won't be much fun
19:42 rindolf sri: it wasn't CGI::Application - it was plain CGI.pm.
19:42 sri just as awful :)
19:43 sri seriously, the best way to learn mojolicious is by starting fresh, trying to port conventions from other frameworks will only result in tears
19:46 elb0w couldnt you do show/?
19:46 rindolf elb0w: I'd rather not.
19:46 rindolf elb0w: it will mess with my hyperlinks.
19:46 elb0w ah
19:46 PerlNinja rewrite rules are awesomesauce...
19:47 perlrocks Twitter: "Hilarious, @chromatic_x just mocked me for reinventing a wheel that i originally invented (6 years ago for #catalyst). :) #perl #mojolicious" --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/58979665620107264
19:47 elb0w thats a lot of work
19:47 elb0w for everything
19:47 elb0w id start fresh
19:47 elb0w I love my mojo server it just feels clean
19:48 PerlNinja so would i, but i bet you can catch all your old hyperlinks with a single rewriterule
19:48 PerlNinja fortunes/show.cgi?id=foo -> fortunes/show/foo
19:48 PerlNinja ta-dah
19:49 sri or even a mojolicious internal hook to make it portable
19:49 rindolf PerlNinja: but I'm also linking to "./shlomif.html#foo"
19:49 PerlNinja ah, yeah, see now i remember... chromatic was the one that jumpd on my case for saying i thought moose was cool but i'd stick to my own ways of doing perl OO
19:49 rindolf PerlNinja: which would break if I use "/show.cgi/foo"
19:49 PerlNinja rindolf: yeah, but what does that html file do
19:50 PerlNinja if you just have a link anchor in there then that solves the problem anyways since you get the content out of the cgi anyway
19:50 PerlNinja and if you're using the hash to do some ajax requests
19:50 PerlNinja problem still solved :)
19:50 rindolf PerlNinja: http://www.shlomifish.org/h​umour/fortunes/shlomif.html - it contains a long list of all the fortunes.
19:50 rindolf PerlNinja: with their texts and is part of the flow.
19:50 PerlNinja yes... and that file is generated how?
19:50 rindolf It's like a UNIX (1) fortune file - only as spiffy XHTML.
19:51 rindolf PerlNinja: from shlomif.xml using an XSLT stylesheet.
19:51 PerlNinja okay so how is that file generated
19:51 rindolf Well, I wrap it in some Website Meta Language glue.
19:51 rindolf http://www.shlomifish.org/h​umour/fortunes/shlomif.xml - from this.
19:51 PerlNinja okay and the xml file is generated?
19:51 rindolf PerlNinja: the XML file is maintained by hand.
19:52 PerlNinja so.. umm
19:52 sri Oo
19:52 PerlNinja you can still link to shlomif.html#foo
19:52 rindolf I later parse the XHTML files and populate an SQLite database.
19:52 PerlNinja i don't see the problem with the links you know
19:53 rindolf PerlNinja: yes, but if I have a / after the "show" or "show.cgi" script it will make it complicated.
19:53 PerlNinja since the xslt apparently takes the id from fortune id="foo"  and just tacks it on the end of your show.cgi url
19:53 PerlNinja and i don't see what makes it complicated to have a / in there ...
19:53 rindolf PerlNinja: right.
19:53 rindolf PerlNinja: well, I prefer to keep it in the same directory so I can do <a href="shlomif.html#foo">
19:54 rindolf Or also do some ../../ links to the other sections in my homepage.
19:54 rindolf It really is a simple script.
19:54 PerlNinja relative links are bad mmkay :P
19:54 rindolf PerlNinja: they are? Why?
19:54 yegor imho these three plugins (tag_helper, ep, epl ) are related only to template rendering - so if i choose another way to do template  stuff (Template::Semantic in my case) then they just consume memory and pollute namespace
19:54 sri yegor: very little
19:54 purl i heard very little was in git for DBIC at the mo
19:55 PerlNinja pain to relocate things - one way or the other it is but links starting with ../ are usually nasty
19:55 sri especially with copy on write in serious deployment environments
19:55 PerlNinja yegor: memory consumption is what, 1kb at most? couple kb at most? such a waste :D
19:55 PerlNinja is today "let's bash Mojolicious" day or something/
19:55 perlrocks Twitter: "Hey Mojo, the early nineties called. They want their path traversal vuln back. https://github.com/kraih/mojo/issues/114 #perl" --dozykraut http://twitter.com/dozykrau​t/status/58981845899018240
19:55 sri lol
19:56 PerlNinja heh
19:56 sri PerlNinja: you must be on to something there
19:56 PerlNinja the 90's keep calling a lot of people about path vulnerabilities
19:56 PerlNinja it's the single most reocurring vulnerability that keeps getting me paid outrageous consulting fees
19:56 sri but in the end people will remember that we had a serious issue fixed in an hour after report
19:56 sri so it's all good
19:57 PerlNinja oh it's all good, I just don't have patience for people who blabber about things they know jack all about just so they can be seen being all internet-tough
19:58 PerlNinja rindolf, anyway, i was thinking a bit ... why maintain an xml file by hand, generate an html file from it, and then parse that to populate an sqlite database? why not  maintain the database, dump the xml, xslt and that html file, and let mojolicious generate the shlomif.html page and the view tsuff
19:58 PerlNinja stuff*
19:58 PerlNinja i mean, the way you're doing it now is like, bizarro world
19:59 rindolf PerlNinja: well, most of my site is static HTML.
19:59 rindolf PerlNinja: I generate it offline from templates.
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20:00 rindolf PerlNinja: but I preferred to create a single server-side script for displaying an individual fortune cookie.
20:00 yegor sri: ok
20:00 rindolf PerlNinja: there's also Fiction-Text -> Fiction-XML -> DocBook 5/XML -> XHTML
20:00 PerlNinja yeah okay but then if you're generating things offline anyway
20:01 PerlNinja why not build the full structure for fortunes anyway
20:01 PerlNinja you dont need a cgi script to display a fortune if you already have that content, so why not generate a static file for it
20:01 PerlNinja i mean, nothing wrong with generating static html but either generate it all static, or run it all dynamic - mixing and matching tends to lead to headaches in the future
20:03 rindolf PerlNinja: hmmm....
20:04 rindolf PerlNinja: well, I didn't want to have over a thousand individual files.
20:04 rindolf PerlNinja: and more as I add more fortunes.
20:04 PerlNinja so why generate static then :)
20:04 PerlNinja you're either generating static files for performance reasons
20:05 PerlNinja or ... well.. if there's no performance reasons, might as well ditch the static generating and go dynamic with some clever caching
20:05 PerlNinja anyays
20:06 PerlNinja anyways too...
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20:07 PerlNinja see i'm getting all agitated, and i forget to tag shit on twitter
20:07 PerlNinja fweep
20:09 perlrocks Twitter: "hey @dozykraut, the 90's keep calling about path vulnerabilities to a lot of people, who take way longer to fix it than #mojolicious did." --perlninja http://twitter.com/perlninj​a/status/58985404967288833
20:10 * PerlNinja is feeling a bit combative
20:13 perlrocks Twitter: "On a discussion about #mojo #perl about my #unix #fortune cookies script - http://bit.ly/ekCBD8 . It's not easily mojoliciousable." --shlomif http://twitter.com/shlomif​/status/58986318667067392
20:13 rindolf perlrocks++
20:18 PerlNinja it does yes :D
20:19 PerlNinja today is a good day, i finally got around to telling someone on twitter to shut their piehole ... *checks another item off his bigassed todo list of life*
20:19 elb0w weird im getting error Mojo::UserAgent:661 [15309]: IO::Socket::SSL 1.37 required for TLS support.
20:20 elb0w but I just did a cpan and installed it
20:20 elb0w and I have 1.39
20:20 elb0w why would I get this issue?
20:21 elb0w sri, any idea?
20:22 elb0w could be an apache worker didnt get it, just restarted it lets see if that was it
20:23 sri must be @INC
20:24 sri btw. use "mojo version"
20:40 PerlNinja Anyone see something weird about a cat that eats fish food?
20:44 jamesw cutting out the middle man?
20:47 PerlNinja I guess, cat just wandered in here and managed to open up a bag of fish food we keep for the fish in the pond in the back yard... read the ingredients of the fish food: shrimp meal, fish meal ...
20:47 PerlNinja fucking fish man... cannibals, every last one of them
21:00 sri PerlNinja: could be a bug
21:00 purl No, it's a feature.
21:01 sri oh... fishfood is fish
21:01 PerlNinja I'm getting a soylent green vibe
21:01 sri totally
21:01 PerlNinja my cat... might be a pod-cat
21:01 PerlNinja o_O
21:03 sri X_x
21:14 perlrocks Twitter: "kraih / mojo: Mojolicious: Perl Duct Tape For The HTML5 Web! http://bit.ly/eOnN5j #all #github" --githubtrends http://twitter.com/githubtre​nds/status/59001755056349184
21:15 sri oh neat
21:17 perlrocks Twitter: "#mojolicious is a trending repo on #github now! :) http://t.co/YjZq0GR #perl" --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/59002454938890240
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21:42 GitHub183 mojo: master Sebastian Riedel * 25dc5d8 (1 files in 1 dirs): updated credits - http://bit.ly/hORor9
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21:43 sri PerlNinja: sorry, forgot to give you credit for the first half of the fix
21:45 PerlNinja oh, no prob
21:46 PerlNinja I don't care about credits :D just figured better to get a fix out there that fixes the example case so at least there's some breathing room to get a proper fix going
21:49 perlrocks Twitter: "Sharks in the water... http://post.ly/1u3u0  #mojolicious #perl" --perlninja http://twitter.com/perlninj​a/status/59010454495825920
21:52 sri PerlNinja++
21:53 PerlNinja eh, just my opinion... i tend to get a bit vicious when it''s 5am and i haven't slept yet
22:14 sri now chromatic is just trolling :)
22:17 sri nn
22:17 sri Zzz
22:50 dku PerlNinja++ # good post
22:51 PerlNinja thx
22:51 PerlNinja before i sleep, i'm going to feed chromatic...
22:53 dku yeah, he be trollin
22:59 perlrocks Twitter: "Feeding the troll http://post.ly/1u4ji  #chromatic_x #mojolicious #perl" --perlninja http://twitter.com/perlninj​a/status/59028021952253952
23:00 PerlNinja yeah unfortunately he's trolling a bit out of his depth
23:10 dku i think you meant @chromatic_x, not #chromatic_x? ;)
23:15 dku definitely losing some respect for him right now; i really like his blog and the book, but his response is just wrong
23:22 PerlNinja dku: no, just wanted to tag it like that - i might have more to bitch about him :P
23:22 PerlNinja well, he's pretty smart about what he writes about
23:23 PerlNinja it's just that he's one of those people that thinks only about architecture and not about real world deployments
23:23 PerlNinja or real world circumstances for that matter
23:23 PerlNinja like the chroot comment - his MovableType install sure as shootin' isn't in a chroot jail, because putting it there will break it in seriously hideous fashion, so.. myeah
23:25 jamesw i have MT in a chroot
23:30 mateu hmm, I can proxy to an app in nginx at location / but when I try location /something/ it finds the app but no routes.
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23:48 PerlNinja jamesw: lot of work huh? :)

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