Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #mojo, 2011-09-11

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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04:20 GitHub106 [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/dIhQyw
04:20 GitHub106 [mojo/master] added experimental mojo_lib_dir and slurp_rel_file methods to Mojo::Home - Sebastian Riedel
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09:50 perlrocks Twitter: "Hypnotoad mode of production is mojolicious # ish character of something. Gael hypnosis? http://t.co/SfYLFRi" (ja) --purasiibo http://twitter.com/purasiib​o/status/112825386064289793
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15:26 * sri yawns
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15:52 GitHub131 [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/D9svXg
15:52 GitHub131 [mojo/master] cleanup - Sebastian Riedel
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16:03 GitHub152 [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/BA4O5w
16:03 GitHub152 [mojo/master] better comment - Sebastian Riedel
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16:43 sri metaperl__: you might like one of my last commits
16:44 sri Mojo::Home->mojo_lib_dir
16:45 tempire well
16:46 tempire pokes everyone
16:46 tempire guess what tomorrow is?
16:46 Skylos Monday. :((
16:46 tempire that is true.
16:46 tempire But it's a SPECIAL MONDAY
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17:00 Sjors Hey all :)
17:00 Skylos hola.
17:04 sri tempire: you should have tagged the tweet ;p
17:05 Skylos its mojocast monday?
17:05 tempire doh
17:05 tempire Skylos: good guess!
17:12 Skylos hooray!
17:33 sri this is so stupid, os x ships with mod_perl and mod_php but no mod_fastcgi
17:35 Skylos heh.
17:39 sri think i'll replace homebrew with macports again
17:40 Skylos mmm, port?
17:41 tempire why not just make a homebrew formula?
17:41 tempire it's super easy
17:41 tempire better than dealing with macports, methinks
17:41 Skylos homebrew port
17:42 sri it doesn't seem like making a formula for mod_fastcgi will be easy
17:43 sri only mod_ formulas i could find don't even work right
17:43 tempire you could make an apache one that compiles it in
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17:43 sri i've not even found an apache formula yet that works right
17:44 sri i've had multiple formulas break recently, it starts to get a little annoying
17:44 mspo try pkgsrc
17:47 mspo or just build mod_fcgi.  it comes with mod_so
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17:51 sri tempire: anyway, what do you mean with i could make an apache formula that compiles it in?
17:51 sri mspo: i know i can patch shit together, but i'm using os x so i don't have to do that
17:52 sri what i need is a test environment for fastcgi that can be replicated easily
17:52 sri for mojolicious unit tests
17:53 sri tempire: you do realize mod_fastcgi is not in apache core?
17:54 mspo sri: mod_fcgid
17:54 purl well, mod_fcgid is for shared hosting platforms
17:54 sri mspo: ?
17:54 sri how does that solve any of my problems?
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17:57 mspo sri: I think mod_fcgid is the replacement for mod_fastcgi
17:58 sri are you even listening?
17:59 mspo this: 13:52 <@sri> what i need is a test environment for fastcgi that can be replicated easily
17:59 mspo ?
17:59 * sri gives up
18:01 sri at this point i'm actually considering just to deprecate fastcgi support in mojolicious
18:02 mspo sri: oddly, my mac has mod_fastcgi.so in /usr/libexec/apache2
18:03 sri then it must be old
18:03 mspo 10.6
18:04 sri see
18:04 mspo but it could be old I guess
18:04 Skylos lalala -woof
18:05 mspo sri: what's an acceptable value for replicated easily?
18:06 sri brew install mod_fastcgi
18:06 sri but i'm starting to like the idea of deprecating fastcgi support
18:07 sri it's getting rather unpopular and we have plack as a fallback
18:09 mspo <shrug>
18:10 mspo I haven't decided which deployment I like the most
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18:16 sri anyone here would want to adopt Mojo::Server::FastCGI?
18:16 sri *+that
18:16 sri extracting it into a separate module might be a good idea
18:17 sri guess i'll ask the list, and if nobody is interested just drop the whole thing
18:35 sri http://groups.google.com/group/mojolicio​us/browse_thread/thread/a2e0991fcca92b4e
18:35 sri it's up for adoption
18:39 * sri pokes tempire, crab and marcus
18:43 marcus hey
18:43 marcus sri: I'm on vacation in sicilly :)
18:43 sri slacker!
18:43 purl it has been said that slacker is like lazy bum
18:43 * marcus listens to the crickets
18:43 * Skylos crickets.
18:43 purl i heard crickets was http://dilbert.com/fast/2008-11-30/
18:44 perlrocks Twitter: "Mojo::Server::FastCGI is up for adoption. http://t.co/eALIlF9 #perl #mojolicious" --kraih http://twitter.com/kraih/status/112959710340186112
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19:00 GitHub197 [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/9uYCKA
19:00 GitHub197 [mojo/master] removed Mojo::Server::FastCGI so it can be maintained as a separe distribution - Sebastian Riedel
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19:01 sri now please someone adopt it
19:01 Skylos sry bzy
19:03 marcus oh, there's not even a FCGI one on cpan anymore since nobody wanted to adopt it
19:03 marcus guess omega and friends are using the FCGI::Engine PSGI support
19:04 marcus server engines are going the way of the dodo I guess =)
19:07 sri well, they prolly wouldn't have existed if they didn't predate PSGI ;p
19:12 marcus hmm
19:12 marcus Mo seems similar to Mojo::Base
19:13 sri and both seem similar to Class::Accessor::Fast :)
19:13 sri which now also uses "has"
19:14 marcus heh, http://api.metacpan.org/sou​rce/INGY/Mo-0.20/lib/Mo.pm # so ugly
19:14 marcus is there an actual gain from formatting in that way?
19:15 marcus sri: Mojo::Base doesn't have BUILD tho? :)
19:16 sri i think the goal is to make it easier for people to cut n paste Mo into scripts
19:16 sri at leats that's my impression after reading the first rating
19:26 Sjors Mojo::Server::FastCGI split off the normal distribution? :(
19:26 Sjors dang
19:27 sri give me another option
19:27 Sjors is it broken?
19:27 sri it's untested
19:27 Sjors would it be hard to write tests for it?
19:27 sri be my guest and try ;p
19:27 sri it's insanely hard
19:28 Skylos <3 tests
19:28 Sjors I was about to start using a Mojo application in a FastCGI environment
19:28 Sjors but didn't, yet
19:31 marcus Sjors: why not use PSGI for deployment?
19:31 marcus it supports FastCGI
19:33 * sri hates having to make the hard decisions
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19:37 Akron Damn ... I am using FCGI on a shared webhoster. Unfortunately I am not in the server stuff, so I can't help with that.
19:37 sri FCGI is not affected
19:38 sri just FastCGI
19:40 Akron Oh - sorry. I think I meant FastCGI. I am so dumb in these things, I even don't know the difference. To much Windows developing in the past I guess, where nothing else than cgi worked properly.
19:41 sri that's another problem, the FastCGI binding doesn't work on widows
19:42 Akron Hm. Okay ... have to figure out how I can change the system so it will work in the future.
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19:56 Sjors marcus: don't know what PSGI is?
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20:43 GitHub112 [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/nokckg
20:43 GitHub112 [mojo/master] improved CGI tests - Sebastian Riedel
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20:48 stephan48 i have got a user class in which i need a reference to the storage, is it safe to just stuff a ref to the storage into an accessor in the user class?
20:50 Skylos is it your user class?
20:51 stephan48 mh?
20:51 purl i heard mh was a unix commandline-based mail user agent or at http://www.ics.uci.edu/~mh/ or Men's Health magazine or a "women's magazine" for men or Getty's way of saying hm or your way of saying hm
20:52 stephan48 i am currently writing it
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21:22 GitHub137 [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/Beu9RA
21:22 GitHub137 [mojo/master] cleanup - Sebastian Riedel
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21:54 tempire I didn't release mod_fcgi wasn't in the core
21:54 tempire I've only used fastcgi once, and I didn't like it
21:54 tempire it's why I was so excited about hypnotoad
21:55 tempire I'd be excited about plack if I deployed new stuff often
21:55 tempire if you're going to phase it out, though, the docs have to be explicit about how fastcgi is bobo, and "this is how you accomplish the same thing using plack/hypnotoad
21:56 tempire it should be something that people don't have to search around to find out about
21:57 tempire does fcgid not do everything that fastcgi does?
21:58 tempire huh.  I just got an influx of mojocasts followers on twitter.
21:58 tempire wonder where that came from.
22:07 perlrocks Twitter: "9-10AM PST on Mojocast Mondays is a critical time; upvotes on hacker news and reddit spreads the good word. Viva la revolucion! #mojolicious" --mojocasts http://twitter.com/mojocast​s/status/113010747721777153
22:08 sri tempire: i've actually already phased it out
22:08 sri now waiting for someone to take it over
22:09 sri and i'm not sure what you mean with the docs thing
22:09 tempire I'm referring to someone searching docs/wiki for fastcgi stuff and finding old stuff that doesn't work.
22:09 tempire sure way to drive folks away
22:10 sri afraid that's not really something i can do :/
22:10 tempire without a reference to, "here's how you should do this…"
22:11 tempire looks like mst beat you to your M module
22:11 sri if anyone wants to help with the fastcgi thing, please say so
22:11 tempire *crickets*
22:12 sri well, this change will be bumpy if i don't get help
22:13 sri it prolly will cost a few users
22:13 sri but it's not like there's a choice
22:14 sri if i allow grabage to pile up we'll just end up in a drupal situation
22:15 sri actually i'm quite sure nobody will even step up to adopt the module
22:15 sri they just insist i magically find a solution to make it all go away :)
22:16 sri http://www.unleashedmind.com/​en/blog/sun/the-drupal-crisis # drupal situation btw.
22:17 * tempire now feels bad for not caring about fastcgi
22:17 tempire drupal situation mirrors everything that's wrong with a standard corporate environment
22:18 tempire not having ever needed a cms, I'm ok if they all die.
22:18 * Skylos manages your content with H OS
22:19 sri drupal was not bad
22:19 tempire ugh
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22:36 chansen sri: you could steal from this <https://github.com/chansen/p5-net-​fastcgi/blob/master/eg/runfcgi.pl>, writing a FCGI client isn't that hard
22:37 sri chansen: i'm done with fastcgi, too much time for too little gain
22:38 chansen ok
22:38 sri if i had the free time i'd rather work on SPDY :)
22:40 tempire hmm.  my squarespace hosting of mojocasts isn't as awesome as I'd hoped.
22:42 Skylos tsk
22:48 rwstauner is there a better option than fastcgi for apache shared hosting environments?
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22:48 sri fastcgi is ok for shared hosting
22:48 rwstauner i'm searching docs now to see if fcgi could be handled by psgi/plack so that the effort doesn't need to be duplicated
22:49 sri plackup -s FCGI myapp.pl
22:50 rwstauner i see that, but don't yet know how to set that up via apache conf
22:52 rwstauner maybe you just make a small app.psgi that uses the Plack::Handler to wrap the mojo app?
22:53 rwstauner i assume that's doable, just don't know the exact semantics yet
22:53 rwstauner but it seems to me like that would be ideal
22:53 rwstauner that's half of the reason for psgi in the first place
22:55 rwstauner doing that would make middleware easy/normal/consistent to stick-in, too
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23:16 tempire sri: did you do something with mojolicious, coro , and message passing a while back?
23:17 sri tempire: just some experiments
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23:34 GitHub101 [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/BldR7w
23:34 GitHub101 [mojo/master] added another PSGI recipe - Sebastian Riedel
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23:34 tempire I'm torn about html5 video.
23:34 sri that example should help a lot
23:34 tempire It doesn't work perfectly 100% of the time like flash does.
23:35 sri there is no going back now!
23:35 tempire sometimes it does weird things, like requiring page reload
23:36 tempire sometimes fade transitions make it look like it's 4 frames per second video
23:38 sri i love liz lemon
23:39 sri 30 rock gets better and better
23:57 rwstauner sri: thanks for that last commit... i've been fumbling with that and just figured out the plackup part... hopefully that doc will help others ;-)

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