Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #mojo, 2013-04-14

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12:53 good_news_everyone [mojo] kraih created plack_env from master (+0 new commits): http://git.io/tSzBcA
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12:54 good_news_everyone [mojo] kraih deleted plack_env at b1dfa58: http://git.io/cpk8Xg
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12:58 good_news_everyone [mojo] kraih created plack_env (+1 new commit): http://git.io/ns3VsQ
12:58 good_news_everyone mojo/plack_env b98f89f Sebastian Riedel: added support for PLACK_ENV as an alternative to MOJO_MODE
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12:59 sri marcus, crab, jberger, tempire: a proposal for 4.0 (since it's a backcompat braking change)
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12:59 travis-ci [travis-ci] kraih/mojo#478 (plack_env - b98f89f : Sebastian Riedel): The build passed.
12:59 travis-ci [travis-ci] Change view : https://github.com/kraih/mojo/commit/b98f89fb5cb9
12:59 travis-ci [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/kraih/mojo/builds/6327650
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13:00 sri i hate plack code leaking out of Mojo::Server::PSGI... but there's not much of a choice for setting the mode
13:01 sri one such case exists already though https://github.com/kraih/mojo/blob/ma​ster/lib/Mojolicious/Commands.pm#L32
13:05 sri another problem could be people having a global PLACK_ENV set in their environment when installing mojolicious... which can make tests fail
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13:56 jberger sri: would it make sense to have a single place, probably a class, where these kinds of detection take place
13:56 jberger ?
13:57 jberger say Mojo::Mode->new->detect_mode() and Mojo::Mode->new->detect_server_env()
13:57 jberger then at least its all in one place
13:57 jberger just an idea
13:59 jberger then again, I know you don't like tiny classes like that would likely be
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14:16 sri jberger: what's the gain?
14:18 jberger minimizes " i hate plack code leaking out of Mojo::Server::PSGI"
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14:19 sri jberger: if anything, it makes it worse imo
14:19 sri you have to write more plack specific unit tests to test the same amount of features
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14:21 jberger but you only have one place to go to find these kinds of detection logics, not search about for them wherever they may be throughout the codebase
14:22 sri they are only in Mojolicious::Commands
14:22 jberger </devilsadvocate>
14:22 jberger and now in mojolicious
14:22 jberger nm, not a great idea
14:22 sri the patch has not been accepted
14:23 sri you could just as well move the mode detection stuff to Mojolicious::Commands
14:23 jberger keeping it in one place seems sensible
14:24 sri oh wait, chicken and egg problem
14:24 sri app->commands is not instantiated at the time... since app is not instantiated
14:25 sri no... actually i'm wrong :)
14:28 sri only problem then would be method names... since the current one uses a generic Mojolicious::Commands::detect
14:28 sri anyway, my proposal is off the table
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14:30 good_news_everyone [mojo] kraih deleted plack_env at b98f89f: http://git.io/ER-2Mw
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14:34 sri jberger: the PLACK_ENV thing usually comes up again every 6 months... then nobody knows where to put it and it gets forgotten again
14:34 sri this was the 4th time i believe :o
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14:43 jberger hehe
14:43 jberger well in that case, put it where it needs to be
14:44 jberger I don't use plack, so I'm not aware of the problems inherent
14:45 sri i just brought it up again because i had to point out that "plackup -E production" doesn't work with mojolicious for this benchmark https://github.com/pfig/FrameworkBenchmarks/co​mmit/e101d0cecd32e51c784d43e075697a27296fb68d
14:47 sri not like that benchmark isn't totally flawed already anyway
14:47 sri my $id = int rand 10000 + 1; # seriously?
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16:26 jberger why even have a database benchmark test?
16:27 jberger doesn't this just test the database speed essentially?
16:27 jberger if it doesn't then your framework is in trouble!
16:45 sri it can also test the quality of the database client if done right
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16:45 sri with a limited amount of data everything stays in memory
16:46 sri which makes the randomness so much worse, you have no clue when it hits the cache and when the hd
16:46 sri of course you have to account for network latency too
16:47 sri bottom line, most people suck at benchmarks and are easy to manipulate
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18:16 sri oh, defiance starts today
18:17 sri some good scifi would be nice for a change
18:17 Britzel Defiance?
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18:17 sri http://www.tv.com/shows/defiance/
18:18 sri oh wait, the countdown is wrong, it starts monday Oo
18:18 Britzel ah, ok
18:19 Britzel Just finished an excellent SciFi book...
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19:13 Fatalnix so looking into the documentation of Mojolicious, I think it's safe to assume that the plugin system mostly stays out of your way, allowing me to use the internal plugin system to handle plugins the way that I would like to handle them quite easily?
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19:42 jberger Fatalnix, the plugin system basically just lets you move code from the startup method to another file, there really is no more going on than that
19:43 Fatalnix ah, that's good, so you're saying that it makes it simple for a plugin to load a websocket / add indexes, etc?
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19:52 jberger "load a websocket"? do you mean define a websocket route? Not sure what you are asking here
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20:01 Fatalnix yeah sorry
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22:43 jberger can I go off topic for a minute?
22:43 jberger what do people do about languages you've used, but are maybe not proficient in on your CV
22:43 jberger ?
22:44 denisboyun Why is showing error "Can't locate object method "hook" via package" when I'm trying "$self->hook( before_render ..."
22:44 jberger is $self the app or a controller?
22:44 denisboyun in controller
22:45 jberger hook is an app method
22:45 jberger try $self->app->hook( ...
22:46 jberger that said, are you sure you want to be setting a hook from in a controller?
22:46 jberger (its possible that you might be)
22:54 buu jberger: I rate my language skills in level of competency
22:54 buu Like I mention Java but I include it on the lower tier
22:54 jberger buu: I like that, not beating about the bush
23:01 preaction I specifically say how many years of experience i have in a language. i spent about a year toying with Java, so it goes on the bottom of the list with (1 year) next to it.
23:02 preaction i've also used a 3-tier "fluent, average, novice" rating
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23:24 jberger buu, preaction, hmmm I really like the idea, but I don't know how to do it without going into page 2
23:25 jberger :-)
23:25 preaction page 2 is fine
23:25 preaction though i have 3 columns across the page, one for programming languages, two for software/systems
23:27 jberger and you don't also have to make room for research experience
23:27 jberger good problem to have, I know
23:28 preaction fair enough. but i'd emphasize the skill set most relevant to the company i'm applying for
23:28 * jberger hates writing these, expects most people do
23:29 jberger worst case scenario is the computer side of Argonne National Lab where I will need both
23:29 jberger but then I guess two pages is probably ok
23:29 jberger worst case from targeting I mean
23:29 jberger because they will need both
23:38 buu Yeah, I think 1 page is nice to have but not required
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