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IRC log for #mojo, 2014-12-20

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Time Nick Message
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03:45 jberger tempire++
03:45 jberger http://blogs.perl.org/users/enkidu/2014/12/thank-you-glen-hinkle.html
03:45 jberger MOAR MOJOCASTS
03:47 mst I fucking hate screencasts
03:47 mst WHERE IS THE TRANSCRIPT
03:47 purl THE TRANSCRIPT is probably there. It's just too small to see.
03:47 mst </curmudgeon>
03:47 tempire grumpypants
03:47 jberger mst: you don't need the shiny
03:48 jberger if only nobody needed the shiny
03:48 mst yeah
03:48 mst I've been learning how sri's insane shit worked by reading the source since 2005
03:49 jberger well I don't have that long on you, but certainly I've read a lot of it
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05:36 bobbyjoe Is there any way with a helper to create a sub like this: sub foo (&@) { ... } ?
05:37 Grinnz that would be pointless since method calls ignore prototypes
05:39 bobbyjoe Interesting, so I could have a helper like ('foo' => sub { my $code = shift; } ?
05:39 bobbyjoe closures are unsupported by method calls then?
05:40 preaction closure is a feature of subs
05:40 bobbyjoe :/
05:40 preaction you could do: foo( sub { ... }, @array ) all you want
05:40 preaction but those parens render the prototype meaningless
05:40 preaction prototypes are basically instructions to the perl parser
05:42 Grinnz whatever you're trying to do you can do without prototypes
05:43 bobbyjoe I'm trying to find permutations of words in a sentence.
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15:17 * jberger yawns
15:19 * sri yawns
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16:03 jberger sri: any interest in something like this:
16:03 jberger sub Mojo::DOM::url { Mojo::URL->new($_[0]->attr('href') || $_[0]->attr('src')) }
16:04 jberger seems handy to me
16:04 jberger could even allow a pass-in attr name for extensibility
16:05 jberger sub Mojo::DOM::url { Mojo::URL->new($_[0]->attr($_[1] || 'href') || $_[0]->attr('src')) }
16:07 jberger I guess there is a strange ordering problem with that variant tho
16:08 sri can't say i'm in favor after the removal of ->val
16:08 sri i think any new HTML specific method we add would have to be really really good
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16:17 jberger here is a demo: http://sprunge.us/PAZM?perl
16:17 jberger working as an answer to this: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/24075040/mojodom-shortcut-to-get-absolute-url-for-a-resource
16:18 jberger (for the record, I was never against the removal of val :-) )
16:20 jberger pygments really does a half-arsed job of highlighting perl :-/
16:26 jberger hahahaha: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/27117591/how-do-i-get-my-mojolicious-webpage-to-display-a-graph
16:27 jberger (dave cross)++
16:50 sri jberger: stackoverflow uses prettify.js, not pygments
16:52 jberger sprunge uses pygments
16:53 sri i don't even know what that is
16:53 jberger pastie has gotten too flakey for me
16:53 sri gist?
16:53 purl hmmm... gist is https://gist.github.com/
16:54 jberger pastie fails to retrieve things
16:54 jberger gist I use mostly fire things I'm going to keep for a while
16:54 sri anonymous private gists
16:54 jberger fire? man swipe
16:54 sri i do it all the time
16:55 jberger true
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17:00 jberger I kinda like that implementation in my demo, even I'd the highlighting is bad
17:00 jberger if
17:09 jberger I imagine it might be useful for one liners too
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18:00 jberger sri: now with short circuiting at no additional lines: http://pastie.org/9791747
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18:30 buu Oh, here you are.
18:30 buu Anyone have any recommendations for adding basic forum/comment support to a mojo app?
18:30 buu There doesn't appear to be an actual mojo forum yet.
18:30 tempire buu: Yes, I have a recommendation.
18:30 tempire Create one, make it awesome.
18:30 tempire GO!
18:31 buu Please don't encourage me I've been writing perl forums for 10 years
18:31 buu I need a support group
18:33 buu Also when are you guys going to move to freenode =]
18:34 Adura Once they drop the L. Ron Hubbart server.
18:34 buu haha
18:34 buu *hubbard ?
18:34 Adura Think you know who I'm talking about.
18:35 buu I value accuracy.
18:35 buu And/or pedantry.
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19:44 jberger buu: but why share when there's so much Perl to be had here
19:46 buu jberger: Less of a ghetto affect?
19:46 buu More chances of recruits?
19:46 buu More pr?
19:48 jberger ours true that it might go a ways to let people see the perl community in action more
19:51 mst if somebody wants to create a #perl-mojo channel on freenode I'm perl group contact and responsible for the namespace so can happily help them get set up
19:55 jberger hmmmm an interesting thought
19:57 jberger that  could exist as a user's channel
19:57 jberger and for deeper questions they could be forwarded here
19:57 jberger Then again, if there was lower membership there would it make us look bad?
19:59 jberger my convos instance is already connected to freenode for fwbm
19:59 jberger sri: thoughts?
19:59 purl i like cheese
19:59 jberger nobody asked you purl!
20:06 jberger it might even help keep some of the newb stuff off sri's radar, which can help with the burnout factor
20:08 mst we often handle newbie questions in f#perl
20:08 Adura #perl-mojo-no-sri, huh? :P
20:29 buu jberger: Lots of freenode projects have #$project and #$project-dev
20:29 buu (Some awful ones have #project and #project-users)
20:30 buu But it is kind of lame to go "Oh oyou have questions about this cool perl framework well first you connect to this obscure and unpopulated different irc server then join the channel.."
20:31 buu And of course this is the network where #perl doesn't allow perl
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20:51 preaction that's changed. you can ask questions in #perl now
20:52 mst and #perl has directed newbies to #perl-help *politely* for years
20:53 mst since, well, basically sungo and I told them to knock it the fuck off with the newbie bashing
20:53 mst and then I banned anybody who didn't get the hint
20:55 buu *gasp*
20:57 jberger buu: I wouldn't prevent anyone from asking anything here
20:58 jberger but if there was a channel on a network that they were already on, I could field some of the questions that would happen to appear there
20:59 jberger cut the noise here by some fraction and increase visibility there at the same time
20:59 nicomen I'm the only one in #perl-mojo at the moment at least :)
21:00 mst buu's opinion of irc.perl.org is coloured by the fact that he adopted 'baiting apeiron and mst until they kicked him then screaming op abuse' as a hobby for several years
21:01 mst I ended up killfiling him, because I was tired of being trolled
21:04 jberger mst: since nicomen already joined I thought I should to o
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21:22 tempire What's going on with convos these days?
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21:26 jberger tempire: I'm using it happily
21:26 tempire Using your own installation, I presume
21:27 jberger I always was
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22:05 sri jberger: #mojo started on freenode and it wasn't very good
22:05 sri i would be very much against #perl-mojo
22:05 sri perl6 mojo is on topic for us
22:06 jberger sri: ok, that opinion matters
22:07 jberger I'm a little surprised to hear it though
22:07 jberger I was thinking it might help to divert some of the easy questions before they get here
22:07 sri i'm very very very much against two channels on different networks
22:08 sri we have one official channel, which can move servers, but that's it
22:08 sri a #mojo-dev channel is cool with me
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22:08 sri although, since i'm using irssi, i'm terrible at following more than one channel
22:09 jberger ok, I'm not saying I disagree, but as devil's advocate, you don't think that having a presence outside of irc.perl.org is a good idea?
22:10 sri like i said, we've done it before, it didn't work
22:11 sri and as you already noticed, a tiny freenode channel will make us look very bad
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22:12 jberger I was going to make the topic something like "unofficial channel discussing the mojolicious web framework"
22:12 sri jberger: it's not like you have a real proposal... as far as i understand you want to throw around channels and see what sticks
22:12 jberger which I was hoping would alleviate that
22:12 jberger proposal? for what?
22:12 jberger I was just going to sit on the channel and see if anyone finds it useful
22:12 sri for whatever you're talking about
22:13 sri if you want to experiment, mention the official channel in the topic, and i guess you should be ok
22:13 jberger I would query you, but then again, irssi :-)
22:13 jberger that I can certainly do
22:15 sri do you have to use a name like ##mojo for an unofficial channel?
22:15 * sri remembers freenode rules being weird
22:16 jberger mst?
22:16 purl it has been said that mst is that limey twat with delusions of grandeur or http://shadow.cat/blog/matt-s-trout or mystery science theatre or maladie sexuellement transmissible or fails at carting or location determined by a superposition or melting in sundry timezones or HATEOSAURUS REX or not webscale or perl's Dr. House or a wizard or knows the future or if you two would rather flop my cocks out and measure them than write code
22:16 mst sri: I own #perl* so we have #perl-mojo
22:16 jberger I don't know any of the rules there, its a strange and foreign land
22:16 sri i don't like #perl-mojo
22:17 mst that's the freenode-correct channel name
22:17 sri #rails, #djange, #expressjs?
22:17 sri it does not look good in context
22:19 jberger I really love that mst could be maladie sexuellement transmissible
22:22 jberger sri: until it would grow a user-base, perhaps being a little more inconspicuous is ok?
22:22 nicomen since I'm using irssi it's really easy to follow many channels ;)
22:23 mst also if people would stop DDoSing them long enough, the new group system will go live
22:23 mst and then you can register #mojo
22:23 mst there's a complete self-serve system replacing the old shit soon
22:23 mst written in Cat+DBIC :)
22:23 jberger mst: cool
22:23 nicomen #mojo is taken
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22:25 mst presumably #mojolicious isn't
22:25 nicomen thera are at least two other OS projects called mojo AFAIK ;)
22:26 nicomen a maven thingy and a chromium thingy
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22:28 sri jberger: if you do experiment, please make sure you're willing to deal with the consequences
22:28 sri jberger: shutting down a channel can be painful and take many months
22:29 mst sri: I already have a bot redirecting people from #catalyst over there onto here
22:29 mst we can add an extra channel
22:29 mst then we voice the bot
22:29 mst and +m the fucker
22:29 mst and set the topic to 'last one out turn off the lights'
22:29 jberger sri: I don't especially intend to advertise it either
22:29 sri mst: what's important to me is that someone (a single person) takes full responsibility and promises to deal with all the consequences
22:30 sri as in, you start it, you sit there the next few years redirecting people
22:30 sri i still remember the pain after we closed down #mojo on freenode
22:31 jberger if we don't have material sending people there in the first place, as soon as we would kick everyone it would be a fair-game channel again, no?
22:32 jberger listen, I'm not married to the idea either, I thought it might be a nice thing, but I'm not going to fight a battle over it either
22:32 mst sri: you didn't have my help that time. I've done this plenty of times for people :)
22:33 sri i expect the worst case
22:33 sri jberger: all 'm saying is, have a plan for the worst case
22:33 jberger but the best case is: increased visibility beyond the immediate perl community
22:34 mst sure. just please try to be pessimistic without insulting my competetnce by implication.
22:34 mst it gets old
22:34 sri wtf?
22:34 jberger ok, everyone clam down
22:35 jberger I will try this for a short time and see how it goes
22:35 jberger if it looks bad in any way, will shut it down quickly
22:35 sri i'm not even going to comment
22:35 mst and if it needs shutting down, I can make sure that happens in an orderly fashion
22:36 jberger sri: change of topic, minion rocks
22:36 purl jberger: that doesn't look right
22:36 tempire lulz
22:36 * jberger pushes purl down the stairs
22:36 * purl dodges and laughs as jberger loses balance and crashes down the stairs.
22:37 tempire We certainly haven't had a topic change in a while.
22:37 tempire Use to happen all the time.
22:37 * tempire cries for the good old days
22:37 * mst collects the tears for later use as lube
22:38 mst & # pubtime
22:38 jberger at $work, they had this spectacular system of "save a bunch of html in a temporary folder" then "put some row in the db" then they had a process which polled that every 3s
22:38 jberger a quick minion and all of that is unnessary
22:40 jberger oh, forgot the punchline, poll every 3s and if it is found convert all of it to pdf using wkhtmltopdf
22:40 buu Is watching folders complicated
22:40 jberger buu: no, but why do it at all
22:41 jberger buu: they would put conversion arguments in the db, so they needed that too
22:41 jberger it also limited them to having the db, the worker and the conversion on the same box
22:43 buu (Freenode facts: #mojo is taken, #mojolicious is not, freenode prefers you to use ##channel if it isn't run by the owners of the project in question, they have a limited system to resolve ownership disputes over channel names)
22:44 jberger buu: I am on the core team, but I will leave it up to the others if they want me to pursue this further
22:44 * tempire has no interest in a separate channel
22:45 jberger ok, that's 2 against
22:45 tempire Although it would be unfortunate if someone else took mojolicious, like some goober teenage girl
22:45 jberger hahahaha
22:45 purl LOLCON 4 reached.
22:45 tempire or some marketing "guru"
22:45 jberger tempire: did you see the email that I got sent asking to review a book on Intel's Galileo
22:46 tempire lul
22:46 tempire z
22:46 jberger I commented in here that they would ask that teenage girl to review my (or your) mojolicious book, by that merit
22:46 tempire Say yes, get a free copy
22:46 tempire Then give them a quote
22:46 tempire "Runs mah prototypes good"
22:47 tempire I only hope @mojolicious_ gets into college and starts caring about more interesting things.
22:48 sri if we decide we want to move the channel completely, i won't object, but then we do it as a new project, without #perl-* prefix
22:48 buu tempire: Not to beat this into the ground but since I mentioned it originally I was advocating a channel move, not multiple channels.
22:48 tempire oh
22:48 tempire In that case, I'm -1
22:48 nicomen omg
22:48 buu I have the general view point that the more perl projects on freenode vs irc.perl the better.
22:48 tempire I consider irc to be pretty obscure by itself
22:49 jberger see, I like having the dev side here at least
22:49 nicomen buu: you could argue that way to move to EFnet or IRCnet then, to get attention from more than open source techno freaks ;)
22:49 jberger lots of other perl projects are here, things we care about like dbi and p5p etc etc etc
22:49 jberger so that's handy
22:49 nicomen just make it a facebook group and be done with it ;-D
22:50 jberger but I know that there must be a bunch of users on freenode, and that was my motivation
22:50 tempire If we get attention, I want it to be because of sri's beautiful german face.
22:50 jberger nicomen: hahahaha
22:50 purl LOLCON 4 reached.
22:50 nicomen purl: isn't it 5 by now?
22:50 jberger tempire: I still have that picture of you and sri playing fooseball
22:50 jberger hahahahaha
22:50 purl LOLCON 5 reached.
22:50 Adura "What scares you will keep you hostage if you don’t do anything about it. #mojolicious #video #lesson"
22:51 tempire If it hasn't been turned into a meme, it doesn't exist in my world
22:51 jberger ^^ tempire: your next mojocast
22:51 tempire If someone comes up with a way to make the mojocasts monetarily beneficial, I'd make more.
22:51 tempire I even learned how to use apple motion for the next one.
22:52 tempire With fancy new 3d effects and such
22:52 sri tempire: youtube and ads? :o
22:52 jberger szabgab makes pro versions
22:52 jberger sri, that too
22:53 tempire I wonder if he actually makes $
22:53 tempire Also, szabgab and I make very different products
22:53 * sri was surprised to learn that the big youtubers make millions per year
22:53 tempire It's all about potential market.
22:54 tempire I've got some plans in my head that would include a mojocast series
22:54 buu And the 0.0001%
22:54 tempire But I haven't committed to them yet
22:54 Adura Huh, Deborah actually made a video that is a "Mojolicious Video Lesson".
22:54 tempire Oh that deborah
22:55 sri http://elixirsips.com/ # this seems to work though
22:55 sri can't be too many elixir programmers
22:55 sri although, he produces content like crazy
22:55 tempire I've thought about reducing the production quality for the purpose of making more
22:56 tempire like railscasts and this guy
22:56 tempire seems to be a better model
22:56 sri it does
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22:58 tempire Ok guys
22:59 tempire In case anyone is fearful of contributing
22:59 tempire to Mojolicious
22:59 tempire Here's your mojolicious video lesson
22:59 tempire https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HruOQhVYKBU
22:59 Adura Heh, you actually linked it...
23:00 jberger oh man, and the music
23:01 jberger rock your mojo!
23:03 tempire I really like the nsscreencast series
23:04 jberger tempire, you asked for it
23:04 jberger maladie sexuellement transmissible
23:04 jberger hahahahahaha
23:04 purl LOLCON 6 reached.
23:04 jberger tempire: this is what you asked for: http://imgur.com/gallery/6Lggwve
23:05 tempire It's a good start.
23:07 sri first time i played foosball in like 20 years :S
23:07 tempire I think for me too
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23:34 jberger why are there people commenting on my imgur post? who are these people?!
23:35 jberger don't people have better things to do than sit on the internet and comment on things?!
23:35 jberger :-P
23:35 jberger I guess it was the xkcd tag
23:40 jberger "I'm ashamed to say I've written a script to do a full clean make 100 times so I could nap." -- comment from the imgur post
23:40 jberger hehe
23:41 preaction welcome to User Submitted, enjoy your stay
23:48 nicomen mst: I miss links to the modules you are referring to in your blog

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