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IRC log for #mojo, 2015-03-26

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All times shown according to UTC.

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03:03 preaction how do plugins differ from helpers? plugins can add helpers, but also add and/or change other things too?
03:04 sri they can do everything startup can do
03:04 preaction ok, right, because that's where you add them
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05:54 cpan_mojo Mojolicious-Plugin-HttpBasicAuth 0.12 by PGRAEMER - http://metacpan.org/release/PGRAEMER/Mojolicious-Plugin-HttpBasicAuth-0.12
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09:23 cpan_mojo WebService-Rollbar-Notifier 1.001002 by Zoffix Znet - http://metacpan.org/release/ZOFFIX/WebService-Rollbar-Notifier-1.001002 (depends on Mojolicious)
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09:37 cpan_mojo HTML-ExtractText 1.001004 by Zoffix Znet - http://metacpan.org/release/ZOFFIX/HTML-ExtractText-1.001004 (depends on Mojolicious)
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10:13 alexbyk Hi mojo people) Today is my birthday) Does anyone live in Odessa?
10:13 Zoffix alexbyk, HAPPY BIRTHDAY!
10:13 alexbyk Zoffix: thanks)
10:13 buu Zoffix: Quick, get rollbar to add a perl icon to their page now.
10:14 Zoffix buu, well, that's why the module was created
10:14 buu Unleash the camels of war.
10:14 Zoffix buu, they added it to "Others" though -_- https://rollbar.com/docs/items_other/
10:15 buu =[
10:21 Zoffix buu, bug them and tell them Perl needs to be more prominent :)
10:21 Zoffix Use teamwork! :D
10:21 buu Mmm teamwork
10:21 buu I actually contemplated using it for $work then I realized I don't actually want to see our errors
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11:29 mishantil My designer just admitted that he used a for-loop in the shell to convert some files. Success!
11:30 mishantil Feels good corrupting these UX-guys.
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12:25 OmarOthman I have a quick question regarding Mojo::Server::Daemon... why doesn't Ctrl^C work well for killing it from the command line? I'm using it in development all the time, and it is really annoying to have to do `ps faux` and then kill a bunch of these every now and then...
12:37 riche sri: RT on the mojoconf training tweets would be v cool
12:38 marcusr riche: shouldn't it be, how to modernize them ?
12:38 marcusr (retweeted)
12:39 riche marcusr: yeah probably, should've said "got a CGI.pm App?"
12:39 marcusr Got milk?
12:39 riche Got shit in mod_perl?
12:39 marcusr flee now
12:39 riche we were getting pretty crass at NYC.pm last night
12:40 cpan_mojo Mojo-SMTP-Client 0.08 by Oleg G - http://metacpan.org/release/OLEG/Mojo-SMTP-Client-0.08
12:40 marcusr I found a mod_perl app on our web hotel.
12:40 marcusr for sending sms
12:40 marcusr it was pretty dreadful
12:40 riche lol
12:41 riche i have been trying to convert gnatsweb from a 6k+ long CGI app (yes one file!) to mojolicious .... painful
12:42 riche I am working on doing asynchronous calls to gnatsd now ... I will have it done definitely by the conference
12:44 riche k back to work ... feels so good to be able to work purely in perl on this new initiative
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13:21 ashimema I'm a tad confused.. but hopefully it's an easy thing to fix
13:22 ashimema I've decided to do a little bit of refactoring to tidy up my app
13:22 ashimema fist thing moving controllers into their own directory
13:23 ashimema having moved them.. the top level controller still work as expected.. but if I go a directory deeper I now get: 'Class "Rebus::Controller::Api::List" is not a controller' errors..
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13:23 ashimema any hints?
13:23 purl NONE
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13:28 mishantil ashimema: forgot to `use Mojo::Base 'Mojolicious::Controller;` ?
13:28 Grinnz ashimema, package names should correspond to where the packages are found in the directory structure
13:29 Grinnz make sure the package name was updated for your move
13:29 ashimema mishantil: got the Mojo::Base lines (it was working before the move down the tree)
13:30 ashimema Grinnz.. that'lll be it..
13:30 ashimema thanks
13:30 mishantil ashimema: Then what Grinnz said. :)
13:31 ashimema cheers chaps.. I knew it would be somthing as simple as that.. brain fart ;)
13:32 ashimema much better..
13:32 ashimema what mislead me was mojo being too clever..
13:33 ashimema it magically found the modules a level up the tree.. even though I'd forgotten to change it there too
13:33 ashimema all good
13:33 Grinnz heh
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13:53 OmarOthman I have a question regarding how we start the application
13:53 OmarOthman We write a method called "startup" in the main PM for the application
13:53 OmarOthman And then we write a script that runs the application under script/my_app
13:53 OmarOthman I checked the code in lib/Mojolicious.pm and found that the startup() call happens without parameters... my question is why?
13:53 OmarOthman Why should I not be able to pass parameters from script/my_app to the application while starting it up?
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14:01 genio OmarOthman: Outside of your config file and environment variables, what would you need?
14:01 OmarOthman genio,
14:01 OmarOthman genio: It was exactly for the config file actually
14:02 OmarOthman So, my script/app reads the config, spawns a fork for some stuff, and then I call Mojolicious::Commands->start_app
14:02 OmarOthman I want to pass the config class instance that I've just created to Mojolicious::Commands->start_app
14:03 OmarOthman Currently I have to reinstantiate that in App.pm since I can't pass it
14:04 genio OmarOthman: I'm going to bow out from trying to be helpy now since you're doing something I've never really attempted.  I usually do something similar to this: https://github.com/mojoconf/MCT/blob/master/lib/MCT.pm#L21 but you're trying not to have to do that again
14:07 OmarOthman genio: I'm doing exactly that in startup(). I think you got my question right though, since I currently really read the config before that point (before startup() is called)...
14:08 genio I'm sure someone in here with a better grasp of the internals can give you the proper answer once they wake up
14:09 OmarOthman :D
14:09 OmarOthman But I see the code change for supporting that to be really minor, and I see "well, they should not need anything, so let's not implement that" not to be an insightful design guideline honestly. If everybody agrees, I'll patch the main file to do exactly that. Let's wait and see.
14:10 Grinnz_ OmarOthman: i read the config separately before the app is started, then read it again in startup; keep in mind that "startup" will be run by anything starting up the app, not just your script
14:10 Grinnz_ e.g. Test::Mojo
14:10 Grinnz_ generally i keep script/my_app to just the start_app line
14:11 Grinnz_ what are you spawning a fork for in the script?
14:12 OmarOthman Grinnz_: That's useful. But for my own case, I'll do exactly like what you've said only if I haven't received the config object.
14:12 Grinnz_ OmarOthman: the application and whatever starts it are usually kept isolated, by design
14:12 OmarOthman Well, it is a long story... not really relevant to the discussion, that's why I didn't go into details... :)
14:13 OmarOthman Grinnz_: That's a very good point. I'll consider removing that into startup().
14:13 Grinnz_ yeah, startup should be a fine place to do something like that
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14:48 cpan_mojo WWW-Crawler-Mojo 0.13 by Sugama Keita - http://metacpan.org/release/JAMADAM/WWW-Crawler-Mojo-0.13
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15:02 cpan_mojo Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo 0.001 by Helmut Wollmersdorfer - http://metacpan.org/release/WOLLMERS/Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo-0.001
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15:41 sri riche: those tweets are odd or full of typos... not sure retweeting them would be that helpful
15:41 sri better make new ones
15:41 sri "Get hip on mojo non-blocking..." wat?
15:43 cpan_mojo Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo 0.002 by Helmut Wollmersdorfer - http://metacpan.org/release/WOLLMERS/Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo-0.002
15:43 sri that course seems to actually cover Mojo::Pg!
15:43 sri https://www.mojoconf.com/2015/events/2
15:43 riche yes I asked him to add it
15:43 sri that deserves a better tweet!
15:44 sri the cgi.pm one is almost good, just the typos...
15:45 riche typos?
15:45 sri "Got CGI.pm Apps? Learn how to modernize it...""
15:46 riche yes, marcusr already covered that
15:47 riche i thought you meant the course description
15:47 jabberwok oh man, i had a client who was using some ancient Matt's Script Archive discussion board, majorly customized, filesystem as a database... if they didn't think "programming time is free", i would try and give them a cluestick again
15:47 sri ah, nope
15:48 riche ugh i see a copy paste error in the course description
15:48 riche must have been batman's md to html thingy
15:48 riche or when i was asked to change it from org-mode to md
15:48 riche whatver
15:50 sri hmm
15:52 cpan_mojo Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo 0.003 by Helmut Wollmersdorfer - http://metacpan.org/release/WOLLMERS/Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo-0.003
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16:00 riche sri: why the hmm?
16:01 sri because i unintentionally made you check, and you actually found a problem :)
16:02 riche yah and what's funny is that other ppl reviewed it too, I just wrote it once :(
16:02 riche anyways... thank you
16:02 sri looks like everyone just went tldr
16:03 riche well, one of them is the person actually delivering it :p
16:04 cpan_mojo Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo 0.004 by Helmut Wollmersdorfer - http://metacpan.org/release/WOLLMERS/Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo-0.004
16:04 riche still time to get it all straightened out.  I have to get back to my new project... yah mojolicious based
16:05 riche oh yah Mojo::Pg too
16:05 riche ah that reminds me ... need to update that based on your findings yesterday
16:10 sri definitely update, Mojo::Pg 2.01 seems to be a very good release
16:10 riche hell that deserves a CPAN New Modules RT then
16:16 sri riche: btw. any news about travel/hotel planning? rooms in the area seem already pretty overbooked
16:18 sri hotel 91 already has nothing available anymore
16:21 riche sri: planned but not executed on yet
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16:22 riche i am not planning on sticking you guys in sub budget hotel
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16:24 marcusr I'm fine with staying cheap, fwiw.
16:25 riche and although the conference is downtown, there are better areas to stay and just take subway - for example times sq
16:25 marcusr or the bronx
16:25 purl the bronx is an extremely cool name.
16:26 riche uh no
16:26 marcusr :D
16:26 marcusr I took the subway through there to get to the zoo last time I was in NYC. It looked pretty bleak.
16:26 riche there are some ok areas
16:26 riche but for the most part ... it sucks
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16:27 marcusr just stick us somewhere in brooklyn, near the brewery and the orthodox jews :)
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16:27 marcusr and the hipsters.
16:27 purl well, the hipsters is bad.
16:28 sri not like we'll be spending a lot of time at the hotel
16:29 johanl hi all
16:29 johanl looking at http://mojolicio.us/perldoc/Mojolicious/Routes/Route#to but I can't see anywhere how to specify that my controller class is MyApp::Controller::Juice::Company
16:29 johanl i.e. in a subdir to Controller/Something
16:30 Grinnz_ juice-company
16:30 sri http://mojolicio.us/perldoc/Mojolicious/Guides/Routing#Special-stash-values
16:30 johanl have tried $r->get('/juice/company')->to('juice/company#get'), but it seems to time out with "Nothing has been rendered, expecting delayed response"
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16:31 johanl @Grinnz_: thanks, will try that
16:31 johanl @Grinnz++ # great, that worked!
16:32 Grinnz_ the section sri linked describes how that controller name is munged
16:35 johanl ah, now I see it. it would be really useful if an example with that was  in some of the sample code
16:36 Grinnz_ usually that stuff is left to the guides not the module documentation (but i think i agree)
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17:03 * sri wonders how much of a difference the new Mojo::Pg will make for jberger's benchmarks
17:05 cpan_mojo Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo 0.005 by Helmut Wollmersdorfer - http://metacpan.org/release/WOLLMERS/Mojolicious-Plugin-ServerInfo-0.005
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17:12 genio That's a lot of releases in one day.
17:16 Oleg one commit - one release :D
17:17 riche next week you'll be caught up to Mojolicious
17:19 sri looks like i'm not on the no-fly list \o/
17:20 sri but what a terrible app... https://esta.cbp.dhs.gov/esta/
17:22 Oleg do you need visa to fly to US?
17:23 marcusr Oleg: depends on your country of origin
17:23 sri most european countries just need to fill out that esta form and pay $14
17:24 Oleg ah, good
17:26 sri "This field is required, but you may enter UNKNOWN"... really?
17:27 marcusr sri: SEX?
17:27 purl Sex is the question, "YES!" is the answer. or http://xrl.us/bgrq5
17:27 sri and that's the first impression us european tourists get of the us
17:27 sri like half the form is that way
17:28 riche what, that's it's wishy-washy?
17:32 sri and not very welcoming
17:34 sri and then there's stuff like http://discoveramerica.com
17:34 riche i felt the same when going to oslo last year ... the consulate in oslo effectively said "dont bother us" and i had to call the norwegian embassy in Canberra, and they were also like "don't bother us"
17:34 sri maybe put those people in charge?
17:35 riche sri: the problem is it will be as basic as possible because it needs to meet accessibility guidelines
17:35 sri wow, you'd think norway was tourist friendly
17:35 riche has to be usable by screenreaders
17:35 Adura Too cold.
17:35 purl too cold is much less nice than too hot
17:35 riche and many other assistive devices
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17:36 sri riche: don't all government sites have to be designed that way?
17:36 riche depends.
17:36 riche marketing stuff no
17:37 riche but anything having to do with legal stuff, absolutely yes
17:37 riche for example, there is a site for TSA Pre/Global Entry
17:38 riche it is about the biggest shit web app I've ever used
17:38 riche but... it passes accessibility
17:38 riche you basically can't use javascript / dynamic html
17:39 riche its all reliant on session state and postbacks
17:40 riche yah that USA site you sent ... that's a government outsourced site
17:40 riche public-private entity
17:41 riche not required to meet those standards
17:41 sri haha, so that's why, working around the laws
17:41 riche maybe, but most likely not.
17:41 riche stuff like this has been outsourced for decades across many industries, it's not considered critical govt business
17:42 riche okay back to work... just too much fun on here
17:42 * sri realizes he has not looked at the german tourism sites yet
17:45 sri haha, just the same, public funds, private entity
17:46 riche yah non critical business
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17:47 riche but most likely whatever your equivalent to the IRS is ... that will most likely be govt run
17:47 riche because... that's revenue driving business
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19:53 sri made my own mojoconf training tweet
20:08 riche sri: thanks for caring
20:11 riche wtf: http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/building-collapses-new-york-city-fire-officials-say-n330821
20:12 riche they're streaming responder footage live
20:12 sri and it's just around the corner :o
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20:13 riche yah
20:16 sri apparently if you were reading a tweet about that you got notifications from periscope with live feeds... the future is weird
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20:50 Grinnz_ future?
20:50 purl the future was tomorrow yesterday
21:02 batman riche: you have an editor, so just fix it.
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21:04 riche batman: which i did already
21:05 batman ok. excellent.
21:06 batman i only notice the mention...
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21:07 batman italy is hard on the liver :P
21:10 sri eat more pizza
21:14 Grinnz_ beer pizza?
21:21 hernan604 pizza for the liver?
21:27 sri riche: ah, you're doing early bird pricing for the mojoconf tickets, that's smart, gonna tweet that too before it runs out
21:28 sri tomorrow there will be 14 days left to get early bird tickets
22:05 Grinnz_ "Skimming over the tutorial at http://mojolicio.us/perldoc/Mojolicious/Lite" -- that's not a tutorial anymore :P
22:05 Grinnz_ from https://www.mojoconf.com/2015/events/2
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22:19 sri oh, another catalyst release, lets see how much it has grown :)
22:19 sri catalyst: 7731 lines, mojolicious: 8675 lines
22:19 sri getting closer!
22:20 sri oops
22:21 sri catalyst: 7731 lines, mojolicious: 8636 lines
22:23 sri mojolicious 1.0 started with 11247 lines actually
22:23 buu Is it a race?
22:23 sri of course it is!
22:23 buu To where?
22:23 purl To is Tonga Islands
22:23 Grinnz_ purl: forget To
22:23 purl Grinnz_: I forgot to
22:23 Grinnz_ purl: to what?
22:23 purl grinnz_: no idea
22:24 jabberwok two (2) is true, too
22:25 sri oh noes, 2.0 was 11703 lines...
22:25 sri but 3.0 went down to 9137 lines
22:25 jabberwok 45.0 will be eight lines
22:26 sri 4.0 was 8789 and 5.0 8844
22:27 sri so apparently i lied when i said it has only been shrinking :S
22:29 Grinnz_ its all those pesky features!
22:30 sri so, what do we remove next? :)
22:31 nicomen the docs
22:31 purl the docs are very good.. a lot better than some projects
22:31 sri think i'm actually out of things i want to see gone :(
22:31 Grinnz_ format detection! (/me runs)
22:32 Grinnz_ nicomen: docs dont count for those lines :P
22:32 sri tried that for like 3 major releases, but you wouldn't let me...
22:32 sri so i gues format detection is here to stay
22:32 Grinnz_ hehe
22:33 sri i also wanted to see Mojo::Server::daemonize/setuidgid gone, but way too much resistance
22:33 Grinnz_ without those it would be hard to bind to port 80
22:34 sri still quite scary
22:34 sri think many web servers on cpan are still vulnerable to the secondary group issue
22:35 sri https://github.com/kraih/mojo/blob/master/lib/Mojo/Server.pm#L77
22:35 sri scary stuff
22:35 purl somebody said scary stuff was the stuff at the beginning, and the stuff the end... and at the middle also...
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22:40 Grinnz_ unix groups are fun
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22:48 jabberwok i was pondering the best way to create a single 'app' that could serve a variety of domains, multi-tenant, and the best i could think of was putting all the config, text, and static files in various branches of one tree, all under a single unix group but with each subdir having its owners ... i really would like to get away from running dozens of WordPress installs and have a single program of mine serve out all these semi-stati
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22:50 Zoffix You got cut off at "of mine serve out all these semi-stati"
22:50 jabberwok ...all these semi-static sites.
22:51 jabberwok perhaps i'm trying to solve too many problems at once?
22:51 sri http://mojolicio.us/perldoc/Mojolicious/Guides/Routing#Mount-applications
22:51 sri ?
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22:54 good_news_everyon [mojo] kraih pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/jcLE
22:54 good_news_everyon mojo/master e4c8c9f Sebastian Riedel: explain the return value
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22:55 jabberwok yes, i have been reading that.  wondering how much or whether to worry about "routing cache disabled"
22:55 sri don't worry, benchmark
22:55 jabberwok *nod*
22:58 sri app->routes->cache->max_keys(0)
23:00 sri performance difference depends very much on your routes
23:01 jabberwok ok
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23:08 Jonis so
23:10 thowe Is there an ep Vim syntax file somewhere?
23:11 sri http://lmgtfy.com/?q=mojolicious+vim
23:12 thowe sigh, I guess I deserved that one
23:12 Jonis ;)
23:15 Jonis I'm scratching my head trying to work out the ->param changes
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