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IRC log for #mojo, 2016-08-11

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Time Nick Message
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02:39 sri Phil21: don't think a few days more or less matter much :)
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05:41 mpapec it is worth noting that writing REST interface is hard to write properly, although protocol itself claims for itself to be simple
05:45 mpapec also quite often REST apologist themself can't even agree on what is the color of shit, so in that light SOAP looks intuitive and joy to work with :/
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06:07 Lee mpapec: come see my talk at YAPC::EU :D
06:37 mpapec Lee: Bikeshedding? :)
06:37 mpapec http://act.yapc.eu/ye2016/talk/6711
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06:38 Lee that's the one :)
06:38 mpapec I hope it will be video streaming like it was for YAPC:NA
06:38 Lee there's an abridged version here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSUYZh5HdWQ
06:39 mpapec Lee++ tnx
06:39 mpapec so is there a hope for rest? :)
06:39 Lee there's no hope for anything
06:40 Lee but it doesn't matter :p
06:40 mpapec :-)
06:41 mpapec I don't know your standpoint but I'm pretty frustrated with it
06:42 mpapec it discourages me writing anything rest as I know in advance that it wont be "proper"
06:42 Lee :) the talk explains my thoughts (and the solution)
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11:26 mpapec somewhat OT, http://www.globalresearch.ca/lead-attorney-in-anti-clinton-dnc-fraud-case-mysteriously-found-dead/5540288
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13:18 shoorick Hello!
13:18 shoorick How can I debug exception in testing mode?
13:18 shoorick My Mojolicious::Lite app works OK as a daemon. I can even get desired URL via ./app.pl get /desired/url, but I've got status 500 instead of 200 when I tried to get same URL in test mode.
13:18 shoorick I print some debug messages via $self->app->log->debug but these messages are visible when app execute command deamon or get. When I run test I see nothing.
13:20 jberger you can set MOJO_LOG_LEVEL=debug in your environment
13:20 jberger I think that is the var, let me check to be sure
13:20 jberger yes: http://mojolicious.org/perldoc/Mojo/Log#level
13:21 shoorick Yep, it works. Thanks!
13:21 jberger cool
13:41 sri omg, a michael phelps overwatch meme on the reddit frontpage
13:41 sri so glad i started playing, or i wouldn't get it ;p
13:51 Jonis ;p
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14:39 Grinnz the reaper one? lol
14:43 sri yea :D
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15:55 sri so this just happened https://github.com/kraih/mojo-pg/issues/29#issuecomment-239204797
16:16 Phil21 sri: we'll have to form a Mojo squad one night and pwn noobs or whatever it is we're supposed to do
16:16 Phil21 I play largely to allow my son to kick my ass
16:16 sri i'm a noob :(
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16:17 sri only hit lvl 25 yesterday, still finishing up the ranking matches :)
16:17 Phil21 hehe, I think I played 2 ranked matches so far
16:18 Phil21 I just quick match
16:18 Phil21 I love playing Junkrat, but being good at the game is basically being decent at every toon
16:18 Phil21 which... who got time fo' 'dat
16:19 sri oh, i didn't check yet, are overwatch regions separate?
16:19 Phil21 hmm, probably
16:19 Phil21 Blizzard more or less keeps with it's US west/east/euro/au
16:19 Phil21 same datacenters
16:20 Phil21 WoW has a US central facility in Dallas
16:20 Phil21 at least last time I paid attention to it
16:20 Phil21 used to fix routing problems when our guild members we having issues during raids
16:20 Phil21 s/we/were/
16:21 Phil21 (if you want to be a guild badass, fix peering between AT&T and Comcast during an active raid with a phone call and 5 minutes :)
16:21 sri oh, overwatch has a special global play feature!
16:22 Phil21 ah, nice
16:22 sri so i can just change the region and keep all my progress
16:22 Bean that's pretty nifty
16:22 Phil21 blizzard seems to be on the cutting edge for ops, in terms of gaming companies
16:22 sri yay, we could do a mojo team some time
16:22 Phil21 kinda neat to see
16:22 Phil21 yeah, that'd be fun
16:22 Phil21 my kid can join so we don't totally suck :)
16:22 sri Phil21: hahahahahaha.... you need to tell that the hearthstone eu servers
16:23 Phil21 sri: hehe, I said for a gaming company :)
16:23 Phil21 they universally suck at it
16:23 Phil21 but blizzard is like 10x better than the next
16:23 sri i guess that could be
16:23 Phil21 we've handled some AAA title launches, the server/network infrastructure
16:23 Phil21 and incompetent isn't really a strong enough word
16:23 Phil21 it's not a money issue, they spend tons on hardware
16:24 Phil21 they just lack the operational capability to utilize it
16:24 Phil21 anything more than like "we get a huge server and put all the things on it!!!! then when it gets full copy it!!"
16:24 Phil21 is pretty much a non-starter :)
16:24 Grinnz_ Overwatch is one of the few games as heavily dependent on servers as it is which had no launch day issues aside from a 15 minute delay from the announced time :P
16:24 Phil21 yep
16:24 sri dunno, blizzard consistently screws up launch days, servers are just down for 24 hours
16:25 Phil21 they were forced into being semi-competent by WoW's insane scale
16:25 Phil21 sri: compared to WoW launches back in the day, or even warcraft...
16:25 Phil21 today is much better
16:25 Phil21 WoW was effectively unplayable for like 2 weeks after launch
16:26 Phil21 I guess the one other server infra team in gaming-land I respect is eve online
16:26 Phil21 more than blizzard :)
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16:26 sri i remember, was a wow player from vanilla to lich king
16:26 Phil21 ah, nice
16:26 Grinnz_ eve's infrastructure is a bit unique
16:26 Phil21 so you played real wow, I like it
16:27 jberger lost a few years to it, if I've heard the stories correctly :-P
16:27 Phil21 I played exact same era, lich king made it too ezmode lost interest
16:27 sri pvp mostly, two gladiator titles!
16:27 Phil21 plus everyone grew up and got kids and stuff
16:27 Phil21 I played with a Java dev department for a bank
16:27 Phil21 sri: nice, I was decidedly not good at pvp :)
16:27 Phil21 had a few server firsts (nothing close to world/region) in raiding though
16:28 sri yea, there is just no way i ever get good at a game again... there is just no time
16:28 Phil21 yeap
16:28 Bean eve and everything about it is just wonderful
16:28 Phil21 my only strategy these days with my son (15 yrs) is to just find cheap shit to do to him
16:28 Phil21 overwatch just get good with one toon
16:29 Phil21 hearthstone I just google decks that are luck-based but cheap
16:29 Phil21 so I either lose bad or like one-shot him :)
16:29 Phil21 I can maintain the allusion of being halfway decent without the time investment
16:29 Phil21 illusion :/
16:30 sri overwatch surprised me a little, for an fps it's really creative with the different classes
16:30 sri like, i love the idea of a healing sniper
16:31 Grinnz_ she's pretty fun to play, if a bit challenging
16:33 sri what i don't like is how some classes are not competitive, like winston or mercy
16:36 Grinnz_ winston is actually very competitive in pro, he does best on a well coordinated team
16:36 sri animation cancelling magic to get better dps is also iffy, but i guess you gotta give something to the hardcore players
16:36 Grinnz_ i still like to play some winston if the situation calls for it
16:37 Grinnz_ discord orb, reaper, and roadhog melt him, but there's ways around that
16:48 sri been watching pros on twitch a bit and no winston so far
16:48 doc I think I have a reasonable question!
16:49 sri oh noes
16:49 Grinnz_ Winston is used almost 100% of the time on king of the hill along with Zarya
16:49 Grinnz_ so his usage rate mostly depends on how many of the maps played are king of the hill lol
16:50 Grinnz_ seems to be around 20-30% outside king of the hill
16:50 Phil21 winston played on a decent team is a giant pita
16:50 Grinnz_ more often offense than defense which makes sense with his mobility
16:50 Phil21 it's pretty rare to see though in pub
16:51 Grinnz_ http://www.gosugamers.net/files/images/features/2016/august/AtlanticShowDownInfographic-1.jpg and https://www.reddit.com/r/Competitiveoverwatch/comments/4x7t9q/overwatch_hero_meta_report_dont_panic/ are some interesting reads
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16:53 doc Can you run two independent apps on Morbo?  (i am working on one that processes REST requests and then one that uses the user agent to make requests and process the response)
16:54 doc or, alternatively, how can you do this?  via hypnotoad for one and morbo for the other?
16:55 pink_mist you can run two morbos without problem -- just use different ports ... or you could check out the Mount plugin
16:55 Grinnz_ just using the user agent doesn't necessitate a whole separate app
16:55 pink_mist that's also true
16:55 Grinnz_ maybe you can explain a little more what you're trying to do?
17:00 sri Grinnz_: heh, those stats are weird, think i have yet to see a king of the hill match without junkrat and dva ;p
17:01 Grinnz_ the meta's always shifting and different teams always have different ideas
17:01 doc I am working on one app that returns data (as json) based on REST routes.  I think I understand this.  I would like to mock up another app that would interact the first.  I know you can run user agent to interact with the app, without running it as an app.  That's definitely what I'll do in the beginning.
17:01 sri doc: http://mojolicious.org/perldoc/Mojolicious/Guides/Routing#Mount-applications
17:02 doc thanks!
17:02 Grinnz_ you don't wnat an app to request to itself, so if you want to make requests to the first app, it should be a separate app running on a separate port
17:02 doc yes
17:07 doc on another note, the mojocasts.com seems to only have access to the casts via the Vimeo links.  I don't know if it is no longer being maintained, but those videos are really helpful for beginners.  I hope they don't disappear!
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17:17 jberger tempire: ^^
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19:07 cpan_mojo Mojolicious-Command-generate-lexicon-0.996 by UNDEF https://metacpan.org/release/UNDEF/Mojolicious-Command-generate-lexicon-0.996
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19:25 bit_shifter If I'm using all angular on the frontend for a single page app and mojo is the backend REST API and session management, does it still make sense to use mojo's layout/template system?  Or should I just serve static html files?
19:26 preaction i use the templates to make sure that my URLs are right, also to change the markup according to what environment i'm in (tell users they're in the Testing environment and they should be using Production instead)
19:26 preaction so i generally make sure that all my partials are run through the template engine, even if i don't have any template directives inside
19:29 bit_shifter What do you mean by making sure the URLs are right?
19:29 preaction i can use <%= url_for "named route" %> instead of using the path
19:30 bit_shifter Ah, gotcha
19:30 preaction so if my routing changes, i still get the right url for it
19:31 preaction i had a set of boilerplate i was going to make a module out of, but now it's locked at $job[-3] and i can't get to it...
19:31 bit_shifter Yeah, I suppose it does give you more flexibility all around
19:31 bit_shifter Ah, that's too bad
19:33 preaction in addition to making sure all the partials were run through the template parser, i also use npm to fetch my js, and AssetPack to bundle it up (so the node_modules directory needs to be dealt with)
19:34 Grinnz_ the frontend guys take care of all the javascript/css crazy, now they're doing some webpack thing
19:35 Grinnz_ never know what's going on over there :P
19:37 preaction i prefer to at lease pretend they're part of the same project, since there's never enough docs to where one part could be implemented without looking at the other
19:37 Grinnz_ oh sure
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19:38 preaction i was working on a project that required i run 3 different commands to build it: the perl stuff (carton install), the js stuff (npm install; bower install; gulp serve)
19:39 preaction ... so 4
19:39 Grinnz_ we were using bower, and then we were using grunt, and now i think we're ditching both
19:40 lluad preaction: This is why I have a makefile to run npm etc. :)
19:40 Grinnz_ considering the grunt build was getting up to around 20 minutes...
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19:41 preaction right, except nobody knows that Makefiles are super easy to write
19:41 Grinnz_ yeah, but they're gross
19:41 lluad Webpack is the new hotness, at least for another couple of weeks.
19:41 Grinnz_ lluad: :)
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19:41 preaction i don't see how they're gross, except for that one tab character thing that your editor magically handles for you
19:42 preaction but grunt/gulp are basically the same thing anyway
20:23 batman Grinnz_: what about assetpack?
20:24 Grinnz_ I mentioned it to them but we've never tried it. they already had all these setups
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20:28 batman Grinnz_: ok
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21:13 sri Grinnz_: what's your overwatch rank? i'm a pretty lousy 37 now ;p
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21:39 genio ALL HAIL: https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--vBUd35um--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/ikjmt1fhfrk54wpldsoj.gif
21:42 pink_mist lol
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22:03 Grinnz_ sri: https://www.overbuff.com/players/pc/Grinnz-1170
22:03 Grinnz_ i started at 46, dropped to like 36, then managed to get up to 52 or so before dropping again
22:04 Grinnz_ competitive mode is very streaky and very luck based as far as what teammates you get and who you get matched against
22:04 Grinnz_ the actual luck based coinflip mode doesn't help either, which they are leaving in till the end of the season for whatever reason
22:06 jberger genio++
22:11 Grinnz_ now i wont be climbing much because i'm spending more time in quickplay to get these stupid event lootboxes :P
22:11 Grinnz_ competitive mode is too slow for levels
22:25 sri that's me https://www.overbuff.com/players/pc/kraih-2445
22:26 sri from every single lootbox i get tracer stuff so far...
22:29 Grinnz_ if that includes the event tracer skin i'm jealous :P
22:29 sri both legendaries
22:29 Grinnz_ she has like 2 versions of the t-racer skin, 2 versions of the punk skin, and 2 summer event skins
22:29 sri got 3 tracer legendaries in level boxes... no joking
22:30 Grinnz_ guess you're a tracer main now :P
22:30 Grinnz_ i really should play tracer more, i used to play her a lot
22:31 Grinnz_ a lot of times you go up against teams that have no idea how to deal with tracer and it's great
22:31 Grinnz_ but torbjorn is really annoying as her
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23:52 circ-user-AFscJ Hi, I'm new to mojolicious and wanted to use hypnotoad to perform sofware upgrade but this is causing the old manager to die even if some of its workers are still busy with a task. Is there a way for the old manager to only die after its works are idle ?
23:54 circ-user-AFscJ Oh how do I get a better username here ?
23:54 Grinnz you can increase https://metacpan.org/pod/Mojo::Server::Hypnotoad#graceful_timeout but that means it will take longer to upgrade of course
23:54 Grinnz oh, and you may want to increase https://metacpan.org/pod/Mojo::Server::Hypnotoad#upgrade_timeout
23:57 circ-user-AFscJ Ok thanks Grinnz. I'll have a look at those two settings. It would have been nice if the old manager will stop accepting connection but only dies when all its workers have finished any on going tasks.
23:58 Grinnz /nick newnickname to change nickname
23:58 ayokh75 Cool thanks mate.
23:59 Grinnz trouble is that an ongoing request dispatch could go on indefinitely, hence the timeouts
23:59 Grinnz and if it's non-blocking it won't be caught by the heartbeat timeout
23:59 ayokh75 Yep you  have a point there. I'll check those two settings now.

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