Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #motoactv, 2012-07-14

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
06:59 BlehTM joined #motoactv
07:34 BlehTM Is the windows software provided with the motoactv necessary to be able to communicate with the device in Fastboot mode?
08:23 dproldan joined #motoactv
08:56 [mbm] nope.
08:57 [mbm] dproldan: cool, I'd always feared that bluetooth would kill my battery and left it off
08:59 [mbm] actually some of that was shaped by my early experiences with the old software which really did drain the battery when connected
08:59 dproldan I had bad battery life with the 1.7+ version,  but I found that partial wake lock that shouldn't be there
08:59 dproldan one of the moto programs was misbehaving
08:59 [mbm] you using stock roms or some sort of custom rom?
08:59 dproldan modified Stock,  DPRom  :-)
09:00 [mbm] :)
09:00 dproldan http://forum.xda-developers.c​om/showthread.php?p=28179638
09:00 * [mbm] still needs to get around to recalibrating the touchscreen
09:01 [mbm] damn back button seems to have a bad ground reference
09:01 [mbm] basically requires me to be touching the solid metal on the back of the case before it'll register any presses of the back button
09:02 dproldan did you even upgrade to newer versions?
09:02 dproldan I hope you didn't left anything over from your tests with the touchKeys
09:02 [mbm] upgraded it probably a month ago, I'm sure there have been version since
09:03 [mbm] yeah, possible that I screwed it up somehow although I reverted everything I could think of
09:04 dproldan let me know if I can extract something from my MA for you to compare,  I have two devices now
09:05 [mbm] I know electrically what the problem is, I just don't know if it's a software configuration or hardware
09:06 [mbm] it is configurable somehow though since every touchscreen has a noise floor and you need to tweak the sensitivity
09:09 dproldan abs_params = <0x35 0xff 0x360000 0xff0000 0x0 0x30 0xff 0x320000 0xff0000 0x0>;  ??
09:09 dproldan maybe one of those params
09:11 [mbm] hmm, yeah, dunno
09:12 [mbm] the touchscreen part seems fine, I can click on whatever
09:12 [mbm] it's just the back button that's screwy
09:13 dproldan It's only the jack connector under it and the wifi/bt antenna on its right,  what' could go wrong...
09:16 [mbm] well, I did drop it and put a small chip in the screen
09:17 [mbm] while that would change the capacitance of the glass, I'd be kind of surprised if that was the actual problem
09:19 [mbm] you're basically grounding one side when you touch the glass, the other side is checked against a ground reference
09:20 [mbm] once that reference starts to float around you get problems with the touchscreen
09:21 [mbm] so if you really want to test how good a touchscreen is, there are two tricks .. place the device on a styrofoam block so that no part of the device is grounded other than the spot you're touching the screen
09:22 [mbm] or, put the device on an unstable power suply such as a cheap charger
09:22 [mbm] the styrofoam test it's likely to completely ignore you unless the sensitivity is cranked way up
09:23 [mbm] the charger test will generate fake clicks if the sensitivity is too high
09:23 dproldan Have you tried that?
09:24 dproldan the styrofoam thing?
09:24 [mbm] well, my motoactv is in that belt clip thing
09:24 [mbm] which seems to effectively isolate it
09:24 [mbm] if you take it out the the clip you naturally touch enough of the case to ground it
09:25 dproldan ok
09:26 [mbm] basically tells me that like most electronics, the motoactv is grounded to the case, and that they didn't isolate the ground for the touchscreen
09:27 [mbm] the later part of that being somewhat problematic
09:30 dproldan definitely the back is grounded  :https://picasaweb.google.com/11106758223​5558199450/MotoACTV#5728330544015842802
09:30 dproldan two cut-outs in the kapton tape
09:30 dproldan three, actually
09:31 dproldan and the corresponding pogo-pins in that daughter board
09:31 [mbm] sides either aren't grounded or they're painted in such a way that blocks them from being effective ground
09:31 dproldan sides are plastic...
09:33 [mbm] huh, you're right
09:34 [mbm] sides on mine seem to have a slightly metalic shine
09:34 [mbm] thought dyed metal or something
09:37 [mbm] so the sensitivity of your back button is fine?
09:39 dproldan yep,  both devices are fine
09:40 dproldan one is always on the rubber wristband and I added a protection to the metallic back
09:40 dproldan it is not not touching the skin at any time
09:40 dproldan the other,  I can use the back button fine,  when it's on top of a wood table
09:41 [mbm] just checking that it's not me being unreasonable
09:47 dproldan want to check proc/device-tree/System@0/I2C@0/Touch@0/Framework@0/abs_params?
09:52 dproldan mine is exactly the same as listed in your wiki
09:52 [mbm] it's still charging (dead battery)
09:52 [mbm] btw, looking at your pictures I'm surprised at how much plastic is behind the screen
09:53 [mbm] was expecting it to be a glass surface
09:54 dproldan it's a painted antenna for the wifi
09:55 dproldan it's a good design,  the antenna is just under the glass,  nothing blocks it
09:58 dproldan not like the SonyEricsson LiveView,  they put the antenna in the core of everything
09:58 dproldan http://adq.livejournal.com/pics/catalog/624/15363
09:59 dproldan display on one side,  battery and vib motor on the other
10:03 [mbm] hmm, either someone has been messing with that or the build quality really sucks
10:04 dproldan lol,  bad design
10:04 dproldan it has some capacitive buttons
10:04 dproldan and if you remove the metallic foils,  the buttons fail big time
10:05 [mbm] what's with the wires added to the screws?
10:05 dproldan they had to add all those wires to ground the phisical buttons and some of the sides of the device
10:05 [mbm] interesting
10:06 [mbm] doesn't that screw with that little rf antenna inside?
10:06 dproldan heh,  that's the problem
10:07 [mbm] wait, building a faraday cage out of the case fixes the problem?
10:07 dproldan the antenna is in a bad position to start with,  then they had to fix the capacitive problem and made reception even worse
10:07 [mbm] ah, lol
10:07 [mbm] yeah, the wires would fix the exact capacitive problem I'm seeing with my motoactv
10:08 dproldan basically, they add a ground plane, so the rference is lower
10:08 [mbm] right
10:09 [mbm] I'm actually surprised the motoactv belt clip is metal but doesn't ground to the device
10:13 dproldan If you see in the my pictures,  the are using the MA display as the ground plane for the touch panel
10:14 dproldan there's a special conducting cushion between the screen  and the PCB
10:14 dproldan the place is very "important" ,  https://picasaweb.google.com/11106758223​5558199450/MotoACTV#5728331231953138370
10:14 dproldan it needs to be HERE
10:16 dproldan that conductive piece is very thin,  maybe it's a bit dislodged/not making good contact in your device
10:16 [mbm] hmm, maybe
10:25 [mbm] any pictures showing what's behind the back button? wondering where they hid the conductive
10:28 dproldan in this picture,  you see three tabs and two pogo-pins,  https://picasaweb.google.com/11106758223​5558199450/MotoACTV#5728331231953138370
10:28 dproldan the two pogo pins are for the wifi/bt antenna
10:29 [mbm] hmm actually how do you open this damn thing?
10:29 dproldan the three tabs are touching a "box" in the top part
10:29 dproldan you open it from the touch panel
10:30 dproldan just pry your nail between the music and start labels
10:30 [mbm] what about that small indent on the top edge of the back?
10:31 dproldan I speculate that it's for inserting a tool that helps opening the device
10:31 dproldan but you can break the rubber piece they inserted there
10:32 [mbm] ok, easiest to just pry it open from the screen side?
10:32 dproldan yep,  just start between the music and start labels, and work your way to the sides
10:33 dproldan nothing gets disconnected if you don't separate both sides up to one inch
10:36 dproldan I have it opened right now
10:36 dproldan the back button still works
10:36 dproldan it's not a bad connection...
10:36 dproldan [mbm]: the back button is part of the touch panel
10:56 [mbm] yeh, insides look fine
10:58 [mbm] also looks like the chip in the screen is in a completely harmless area
11:00 dproldan if you have some fine-tip tools,  you can try reseating the connectors,  not too difficult
11:01 dproldan they have some lines painted for alignment,  just take a picture first to remember how much they need to be inserted
11:01 dproldan the flex cables into the connectors, I mean
11:13 dproldan if you ever plan to use your MA for audio:  http://forum.xda-developers.com/showp​ost.php?p=28718716&amp;postcount=2515
17:16 BlehTM joined #motoactv
17:18 BlehTM using the MotoACTV Root Tool, when you click "2. Backup Data" where exactly is the data backed up to?
17:19 BlehTM assuming people in this channel are familiar
18:29 BlehTM oops stupid me, figured it out
19:59 Quietlyawesome94 joined #motoactv
21:55 dproldan joined #motoactv
22:36 dproldan woot,  found a much better way to change the preferences colors
22:48 Quietlyawesome94 joined #motoactv
22:49 dproldan BlehTM: maybe you need to install the motorola software,  just to get the drivers installed
23:13 * [mbm] dislikes root tools; they always hide what's happening
23:14 dproldan I try to use command line instructions as a filter for who installs what I publish
23:15 [mbm] ditto
23:16 [mbm] in a way I see the simplified utilities as disruptive just from the point of view that the more popular they become the more knowledge the community loses
23:20 dproldan so,  any change to your MA after opening it?
23:26 [mbm] nope :/
23:32 CEnnis91 [mbm]: is my AnyRoot a root tool?
23:33 CEnnis91 you can technically find out how to do it, if you know where to loook
23:33 dproldan heh
23:34 [mbm] CEnnis91: points for not hiding everything behind a crapy visual basic gui

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