| Time |
S |
Nick |
Message |
| 01:58 |
|
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Tene joined #november-wiki |
| 04:58 |
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Tene_ joined #november-wiki |
| 05:11 |
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masak joined #november-wiki |
| 06:46 |
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ihrd joined #november-wiki |
| 06:48 |
|
ihrd |
OH HAI! |
| 06:48 |
|
zarah |
oh hai ihrd |
| 06:48 |
|
ihrd |
I am found our grant founded right now |
| 06:48 |
|
ihrd |
http://news.perlfoundation.org[…]ants_results.html |
| 06:49 |
|
zarah |
ihrd's link is also http://tinyurl.com/dfy7zc |
| 06:51 |
|
ihrd |
masak, Tene_: we are faced with the big work :) |
| 06:52 |
|
masak |
aye :) |
| 06:53 |
|
masak |
I think I should reply about the naming thing. |
| 06:53 |
|
masak |
personally, I find nothing wrong with the name 'Web'. |
| 06:54 |
|
masak |
and I don't think outsiders are necessarily in a position to determine if it's the right name for a Perl 6 web module. |
| 06:54 |
|
masak |
but I agree that it might be problematic, and I think we should discuss it on #perl6. |
| 06:54 |
|
masak |
and then make a decision based on that discussion. |
| 07:05 |
|
ihrd |
masak: "Web" -- okay for me |
| 07:05 |
|
masak |
ihrd: aye, for me too. |
| 07:06 |
|
masak |
ihrd: do you understand the fears of the people saying that it would be 'opinionated'? |
| 07:07 |
|
ihrd |
actually no |
| 07:07 |
|
masak |
ok. I do, so allow me to explain. :) |
| 07:07 |
|
ihrd |
for my It is just short and logical name |
| 07:08 |
|
masak |
these people are people used to CPAN, where when you decide on a name, that name is taken FOREVER. |
| 07:08 |
|
ihrd |
this is first web-framework in perl6, so we take simplest name :) |
| 07:08 |
|
masak |
if it's a bad module, it's basically a wasted good name. |
| 07:09 |
|
masak |
these people believe that if we take such a good name, we have to make a _really_ good module. |
| 07:09 |
|
ihrd |
if our framefork will by bad, we just rewright it |
| 07:09 |
|
masak |
ihrd: I love your belief in our ability. :) |
| 07:10 |
|
ihrd |
and I`m sure we will do rewrite it, because a lot of good projects I know rewrited |
| 07:10 |
|
masak |
ihrd: it's like this: there are many ways we could go wrong in this, and our product will be unusable for future Perl 6 programmers. |
| 07:11 |
|
masak |
I acknowledge this -- we are going to make mistakes, and they might even be fatal. |
| 07:11 |
|
ihrd |
I do not belive we make Web.pm ideal for the first attempt |
| 07:11 |
|
masak |
agreed. |
| 07:11 |
|
masak |
we will approach this by trial and error. |
| 07:11 |
|
masak |
or rather, wise empiricism. |
| 07:13 |
|
ihrd |
and at last, people who woried about 'they take good name, but make bad module' always can send patches, and start to commit better code |
| 07:14 |
|
masak |
ihrd: aye, and that works because we're not on CPAN yet. |
| 07:14 |
|
masak |
ihrd: my point is that the poeple who complain about the name tend to forget that. |
| 07:14 |
|
ihrd |
I like how Ruby community do -- Rails + Merb = Rails 3, cooperation! |
| 07:14 |
|
masak |
:) |
| 07:14 |
|
masak |
is Merb also Rack-powered? |
| 07:15 |
|
ihrd |
yes |
| 07:15 |
|
ihrd |
and Rails 3 will be Rack-powered too |
| 07:15 |
|
* masak |
really likes Rack |
| 07:15 |
|
masak |
I think we should steal it. |
| 07:15 |
|
ihrd |
I need to read more about it |
| 07:16 |
|
masak |
I'll try to make a writeup today about my/our plans, and push it to the Web repo. |
| 07:16 |
|
ihrd |
I still do not see how it works inside |
| 07:16 |
|
masak |
ihrd: hang on, I'll send you a good link. |
| 07:16 |
|
masak |
http://rubymanor.org/videos/rack/ |
| 07:16 |
|
ihrd |
okay |
| 07:16 |
|
zarah |
masak's link is also http://tinyurl.com/9cysqs |
| 07:17 |
|
masak |
zarah: you are a smart girl. |
| 07:17 |
|
zarah |
masak: I'm so smart I scare myself. Over. |
| 07:18 |
|
ihrd |
my internet connection is slow, can I donwload this video? |
| 07:18 |
|
masak |
hm, maybe. |
| 07:18 |
|
masak |
I'll check. |
| 07:19 |
|
ihrd |
argh. my ff die when it trying to open it |
| 07:19 |
|
masak |
apologies. |
| 07:20 |
|
masak |
aye, it's downloadable from this page: http://www.slideshare.net/danw[…]rack-presentation |
| 07:21 |
|
zarah |
masak's link is also http://tinyurl.com/63hqv8 |
| 07:21 |
|
ihrd |
thank you! |
| 07:22 |
|
ihrd |
pm RPN calculator looks good |
| 07:22 |
|
masak |
sorry? |
| 07:22 |
|
ihrd |
ah, but thisi is just presentation |
| 07:22 |
|
ihrd |
I will try to found video |
| 07:22 |
|
ihrd |
I http://use.perl.org/~pmichaud/journal/38580 |
| 07:23 |
|
zarah |
ihrd's link is also http://tinyurl.com/d7bm67 |
| 07:25 |
|
masak |
ihrd: 'try to find', not 'try to found'. 'found' is a verb meaning, for example, 'to create a foundation/association/company'. |
| 07:25 |
|
masak |
I don't often correct you, but here there's a real risk of misunderstanding. :) |
| 07:25 |
|
ihrd |
yes, sorry |
| 07:25 |
|
masak |
no problem. keep writing English, it's going great! |
| 07:26 |
|
ihrd |
I do not use English about 2 weeks and lost my shape :) |
| 07:26 |
|
masak |
ah, nice RPN calculator. quite idiomatic Perl 6. |
| 07:26 |
|
masak |
tsss :) |
| 07:27 |
|
ihrd |
yes! |
| 07:27 |
|
ihrd |
I like methods on topic |
| 07:27 |
|
ihrd |
I do not exactly why |
| 07:27 |
|
masak |
I like methods on topic too. |
| 07:27 |
|
ihrd |
but I like ol that .method; .method: 'fooo'; .yet_another_method |
| 07:27 |
|
masak |
but I often confuse .foo with self.foo :/ |
| 07:27 |
|
Tene_ |
especially nice with given {} |
| 07:27 |
|
masak |
I'm a bit skeptical to using invocant colon, ever :) |
| 07:28 |
|
masak |
I think it confuses the code. |
| 07:34 |
|
ihrd |
hm, I like to use it when it help my to avoid parentheses inside parentheses |
| 07:34 |
|
masak |
ihrd: viklund and I had a fairly hard-to-track-down logical bug in November because of a colon once. |
| 07:35 |
|
ihrd |
in my code I think |
| 07:35 |
|
masak |
might be. |
| 07:35 |
|
masak |
even before that, I thought they were unnecessary. but that really turned me off them. |
| 07:35 |
|
ihrd |
plz explain my, what happend |
| 07:35 |
|
masak |
I think parentheses are much clearer. |
| 07:35 |
|
masak |
ihrd: I'll try. |
| 07:35 |
|
masak |
but I don't remember exactly. |
| 07:36 |
|
masak |
maybe if I find the commit... |
| 07:36 |
|
ihrd |
can you find related commits? |
| 07:36 |
|
masak |
I'll try. hold on. |
| 07:43 |
|
masak |
aye, found the commit. it's 0d9df05. |
| 07:44 |
|
masak |
see the second chunk, the one with 'CONTENT =>'. |
| 07:45 |
|
masak |
so, what happened was that we didn't see the colon, and the link_maker and extlink_maker arguments went to read_page instead of .format |
| 07:46 |
|
masak |
...and as I said, we realized this after rubbing our eyes in disbelief for the better part of an hour. :) |
| 07:46 |
|
masak |
somehow the args were defined when we sent them in to the method, but not when they got there! :) |
| 07:57 |
|
ihrd |
sorry, I hang up with some work-related stuff |
| 07:57 |
|
masak |
ok. no problem. |
| 07:57 |
|
ihrd |
back now and read irc log |
| 07:58 |
|
ihrd |
ah, I see |
| 07:59 |
|
ihrd |
but I thing this is happend only because you do not expect colon here |
| 08:00 |
|
ihrd |
this is my code |
| 08:00 |
|
ihrd |
mb you see my blog post about that notation |
| 08:01 |
|
masak |
no. URL? |
| 08:01 |
|
ihrd |
$minimal.format($.storage.read_page: $page) better then $minimal.format($.storage.read_page($page)) for my |
| 08:02 |
|
ihrd |
but looks like it my own whim |
| 08:02 |
|
masak |
ok. I understand your reasons, but I prefer to be consistent and use only parentheses. |
| 08:05 |
|
ihrd |
I hope this is not code standard |
| 08:06 |
|
masak |
no, it's just a personal preference of mine. |
| 08:10 |
|
ihrd |
do TPF send any instruction to you? |
| 08:10 |
|
ihrd |
about grant |
| 08:10 |
|
ihrd |
who will be our grant manager? |
| 08:11 |
|
masak |
Adrian Howard. |
| 08:12 |
|
ihrd |
nice name :) |
| 08:21 |
|
masak |
ihrd: I just forwarded you and Tene_ the emails about it. I didn't see before that they were only sent to me. |
| 08:27 |
|
ihrd |
ok |
| 08:29 |
|
ihrd |
too vague name.. hm |
| 08:31 |
|
ihrd |
what is GC? |
| 08:31 |
|
ihrd |
GC members? |
| 08:31 |
|
moritz_ |
grant commitee |
| 08:31 |
|
masak |
"Grant Committee", I guess. |
| 08:32 |
|
masak |
moritz_++ # draws the fastest |
| 08:32 |
|
ihrd |
Ah, yes |
| 08:32 |
|
ihrd |
thank you both |
| 08:32 |
|
moritz_ |
masak++ # better spelling ;-) |
| 08:33 |
|
masak |
moritz_: I have a rule for that specific word: two m's, two t's and two e's. :) |
| 08:33 |
|
ihrd |
) |
| 08:33 |
|
ihrd |
hm.. mb Muagamba? |
| 08:35 |
|
masak |
sorry, what? |
| 08:37 |
|
ihrd |
just joke, another vague name |
| 08:37 |
|
masak |
ah, ok. :) |
| 09:03 |
|
masak |
ok, I just pushed an early PLAN file to the web repo. |
| 09:04 |
|
masak |
my work will mainly focus on that file this week, preparing runnable example code that I think will work on top of different layers of Web. |
| 09:04 |
|
masak |
comments welcome on the (very little) text I have written so far. |
| 11:34 |
|
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ihrd left #november-wiki |
| 12:44 |
|
moritz_ |
masak: care to add me as a commiter to html-template? |
| 12:44 |
|
moritz_ |
(I can also fork if you prefer that workflow) |
| 13:06 |
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p6eval joined #november-wiki |
| 14:05 |
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Tene joined #november-wiki |
| 14:28 |
|
masak |
moritz_: I don't mind adding you as a committer, but let's try the fork/pull request thing if that's ok by you. I need the practice. :) |
| 15:08 |
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p6eval joined #november-wiki |
| 15:21 |
|
moritz_ |
masak: ok |
| 15:39 |
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p6eval joined #november-wiki |
| 15:43 |
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p6eval joined #november-wiki |
| 15:47 |
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p6eval joined #november-wiki |
| 15:55 |
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p6eval joined #november-wiki |
| 18:53 |
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Tene_ joined #november-wiki |
| 19:20 |
|
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PerlJam joined #november-wiki |
| 19:21 |
|
PerlJam |
greeble. |
| 19:22 |
|
masak |
hoj. |
| 19:22 |
|
* PerlJam |
reads the backlog |
| 19:22 |
|
PerlJam |
Rack is nice (as is rails 3) There's some good to be copied from there. |
| 19:24 |
|
* masak |
is really happy today from all the discussion |
| 19:24 |
|
PerlJam |
happy coders are good coders :) |
| 19:25 |
|
PerlJam |
where's the mailing list? |
| 19:26 |
|
masak |
http://groups.google.com/group/november-wiki |
| 19:26 |
|
zarah |
masak's link is also http://tinyurl.com/awn2o7 |
| 19:26 |
|
PerlJam |
thanks |
| 19:27 |
|
* PerlJam |
reads about "Waves" |
| 19:30 |
|
PerlJam |
inheritable config is interesting. |
| 19:30 |
|
masak |
aye. |
| 19:30 |
|
PerlJam |
the "layers" though look like they map to roles really well. (runtime roles as mst was saying) |
| 19:31 |
|
masak |
indeed. |
