Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #padre, 2009-09-14

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:42 Fayland joined #padre
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02:05 SvenDowideit_ joined #padre
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02:09 mohsen joined #padre
02:17 SvenDowideit__ as padre is at the forefront of perl UI-ness
02:17 SvenDowideit__ is anyone working on or know of a perl equivalent to meld?
02:22 mohsen SvenDowideit__: no, if u found one, let me know
02:32 Ryan52 SvenDowideit__: why?
02:32 SvenDowideit__ cos i keep using meld, but it doesn't work on all my computers
02:32 Ryan52 oh.
02:32 SvenDowideit__ takes quite a bit of effort if i'm on my osx box
02:33 SvenDowideit__ i've not bothered to poke trying it on my windows box
02:33 SvenDowideit__ whereas padre's pretty cross platform in comparison
02:34 SvenDowideit__ no, wait, 'because Perl is the one true way' :}
02:34 Ryan52 mayeb we could write a Padre plugin for that.
02:35 SvenDowideit__ maybe, but that would then reduce its applicability
02:35 SvenDowideit__ still, if there was one, i'd use it :)
02:42 mohsen is there any gui diff tool written with wxwindows?
02:43 SvenDowideit__ dunno :)
02:46 Ryan52 mohsen, SvenDowideit__: why don't you two write one? :)
02:46 * SvenDowideit__ mumbles some excuse, and then wonders the same thing
03:32 garu meld++
03:33 garu Ryan52, there's already an "external diff tool" option in the properties dialog, though I'm not sure it is working at all
03:34 garu but meld should be somewhat cross-platform as well, being written in python and all
03:34 garu so "because Perl is the one true way" might be the response you're looking for, yeah :)
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05:24 Sewi gm
05:39 Hyppolit svn: r7870 | Sewi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7870
05:39 Hyppolit Speed-Up status bar
05:39 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
05:51 rindolf joined #padre
05:54 szabgab gm
05:54 szabgab any of you know how the web sites on sourceforge get updated?
05:55 Sewi szabgab: You mean, how to add a project?
05:55 szabgab specifically I found the source of http://wxperl.sourceforge.net/ in SVN, changed it, committed back to SVN
05:55 szabgab but it is not (yet ?) reflected on the real site
05:56 szabgab (apparently I have commit bit there ;-)
05:56 szabgab rindolf, you are an sf user, right?
05:56 rindolf szabgab: sourceforge?
05:56 szabgab yes
05:56 rindolf szabgab: to some extent.
05:57 rindolf I'm mostly on berlios.de
05:57 Hyppolit svn: r7871 | Sewi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7871
05:57 Hyppolit Fixed a use of uninitlized value error
05:57 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
05:57 szabgab so how are the sf project websites maintained?
05:57 rindolf szabgab: there is an interface for it on http://sourceforge.net/
05:57 rindolf With various services.
05:58 rindolf Bug tracker , downloads/mirrors , task list, CVS/svn/git/hg/bzr . etc.
05:58 rindolf News.
05:58 rindolf The works.
06:06 szabgab and how do I maintain the project web site?
06:07 rindolf szabgab: using ssh/rsync I think.
06:07 rindolf Not sure.
06:07 rindolf There is a howto about it.
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06:12 Alias heya
06:13 rindolf Hi Alias
06:17 szabgab Alias, good afternoon
06:25 azawawi joined #padre
06:25 Alias It's interesting that prove doesn't work in Padre, but does on the systme
06:26 Hyppolit svn: r7872 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7872
06:26 Hyppolit [Padre] Bundled latest perlopref.pod with the following changes (cowens++):
06:26 Hyppolit [Padre] separated X[Y] and (X)[Y] and fixed them
06:26 Hyppolit [Padre] massive changes based on feedback from Philip Potter and Telemachus
06:26 Hyppolit [Padre] fixed typo in %
06:26 Hyppolit [Padre] added "X" and qq(X)
06:27 Hyppolit [Padre] added %{X} and fixed issues with @{X}
06:27 Hyppolit [Padre] change position of some of the terms
06:27 Hyppolit [Padre] added a class to each operator
06:27 Hyppolit [Padre] fixed links and line length
06:27 Hyppolit [Padre] added ${X}, ${X}[Y], @{X}, and more to index ops
06:27 Hyppolit [Padre] changed all uses of ' to "
06:27 Hyppolit [Padre] added deprecated use of ~~X to mean ~(~X)
06:27 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/doc/
06:27 azawawi good morning :)
06:29 szabgab good morning
06:29 azawawi I see no announcement of Padre 0.46
06:30 azawawi part of it is my fault, I slept yesterday a lot :)
06:30 azawawi and i didnt nag him...
06:32 azawawi Alias: the next step in the evolution of the help search for Perl Operators  is match the current line using PPI...
06:32 szabgab Ryan52, ping ping ping
06:32 azawawi Alias: for example X{Y} or X or Y
06:32 Ryan52 azawawi: pong pong pong
06:32 Ryan52 err
06:32 Ryan52 szabgab
06:32 Ryan52 bleh
06:32 * Ryan52 has copy and paste failure..
06:32 azawawi Ryan52: :)
06:33 rindolf Ryan52, azawawi : hi. What's up?
06:33 Ryan52 hi rindolf
06:33 rindolf Did mst fix the diversity statement, yet?
06:33 azawawi Ryan52: POST /announcement/Padre/0.46/please
06:33 szabgab we have serious announcement deprivation
06:34 Ryan52 oops
06:34 * Ryan52 fixes
06:34 azawawi Ryan52++
06:35 szabgab and we should also announce the new Windows package and link to it from the main web page
06:36 azawawi I slept thinking that the Padre armada was on the move :)
06:36 szabgab I wonder how does the Padre armada look like in your dreams :-)
06:36 RogerL joined #padre
06:36 rindolf azawawi: it all was on the move except for the four ships that were sent to seek the Dread Pirate Robert.
06:37 szabgab new mibbit user
06:37 szabgab anyone tried http://strawberryperl.com/pack​ages/padre-standalone-0.45.msi ?
06:37 azawawi nop
06:37 azawawi not found...
06:38 szabgab wow, so where is it?
06:38 azawawi idk
06:39 Hyppolit svn: r7873 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7873
06:39 Hyppolit [Padre] Updated Changes
06:39 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
06:39 Ryan52 azawawi: what's the difference between "Bundled latest perlopref.pod to gain more Perl operator documentation" and "Bundled more Perl Operators documentation"?
06:39 szabgab Alias, do you know where did CSJewll put the new padre stand alone msi?
06:39 RogerL Hi, have installed Padre + Strawberry 0.41 - then followed instructions in Getting Started on Windows - the upgrade instructions ran, but there were a lot of error messages saying prerequisites were wrong versions etc. Tried to do the first Perl 5 script instructions - when clicking on  File   New    Perl 5 Script the Padre program closed. Any suggestions?
06:40 azawawi Ryan52: to give credit to cowens...
06:40 Alias http://strawberryperl.com/down​load/padre-standalone-0.45.msi
06:40 Alias The /packages/ directory is where we keep all the zip files with libwhatever
06:40 szabgab RogerL, the crash is a known bug in 0.41
06:40 szabgab so you need to finish the upgrade
06:40 szabgab what Windows?
06:40 RogerL Using Vista
06:40 azawawi Ryan52: I would like you to include a link to his project in your announcement
06:41 azawawi Ryan52: since we're using it heavily now
06:41 szabgab RogerL, we had some really bad experience with Vista recently
06:41 azawawi Ryan52: http://github.com/cowens/perlopref
06:41 Alias joined #padre
06:41 szabgab azawawi, we need to do something with Vista thing
06:41 szabgab azawawi, Alias  we need to do something with Vista thing, this keeps byting us
06:41 RogerL Am downloading 0.45 and will try
06:41 szabgab RogerL, let's try to see how to upgrade
06:42 azawawi the ProcessStream problem?
06:42 RogerL Assume I must uninstall 0.41?
06:42 szabgab RogerL, that's actually is a good idea
06:42 szabgab yes
06:42 szabgab uninstall
06:42 RogerL OK - will let you know how I go Thanks
06:43 Alias Vista thing?
06:43 Alias The whole reboot on install problem?
06:43 Ryan52 azawawi: okay.
06:43 szabgab the whole cannot upgrade and no command line thing
06:44 szabgab Actually the biggest suffering was due to an antivirus
06:44 szabgab so it is not Vista itself
06:44 azawawi avira...
06:44 azawawi i hate it!
06:44 szabgab so forget it for now
06:46 azawawi http://perlgeek.de/blog-en/perl-6/when-we-re​ach-100-percent-we-did-something-wrong.html
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06:53 szabgab Ryan52, I think that announcement text is ok but you should mention the DISPLAY thing for the Fedora people
06:53 szabgab that we know about it not working
06:53 Ryan52 I'm not so sure that it's new.
06:54 szabgab and afaik you can only sent to padre-dev, I'll forward to the padre-news
06:54 szabgab Ryan52, I am quite sure that it was working in the previous release
06:54 Ryan52 oh. does it fail for you too?
06:54 szabgab or the release.pl would have blown up
06:54 szabgab yes
06:54 Ryan52 oh.
06:57 Ryan52 sent.
06:58 Ryan52 while I'm on IRC...anybody here know French?
06:59 szabgab Ryan52, thanks, resent to news, now you only need to setup a blog
06:59 szabgab Ryan52 try jq
06:59 Hyppolit svn: r7874 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7874
06:59 Hyppolit [Padre] Fixed crash when inserting a special value without any document
06:59 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Menu/
07:00 Ryan52 jq looks to be not around.
07:01 Hyppolit svn: r7875 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7875
07:01 Hyppolit [Padre] The daily Perl tidy... :)
07:01 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Menu/
07:02 Hyppolit svn: r7876 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7876
07:02 Hyppolit add download Padre Standalone 0.45
07:02 Hyppolit trunk/template.padre.perlide.org/tt/pages/
07:03 El_Che Ryan52: I do speak some french
07:04 Ryan52 El_Che: how do you say "I wonder...". just that simple. :)
07:05 JRWeiss joined #padre
07:05 El_Che Je me demande
07:05 El_Che Je me demande si ...
07:06 Ryan52 not what google translate told me. I knew that thing would get me in trouble. :P
07:06 Ryan52 thanks!
07:06 El_Che heeh
07:06 szabgab Ryan52, just don't forget the blog please!
07:07 szabgab do you already have a blog?
07:07 El_Che Ryan52: what did it say? marveille?
07:07 Ryan52 El_Che: ummm, I don't know what it said..
07:07 Ryan52 tho I swear it said something else a few minutes ago! :P
07:07 Ryan52 szabgab: working on it.
07:12 Ryan52 szabgab: http://blog.ryan52.info/
07:12 Ryan52 installed wordpress a year ago...I knew it would come in handy eventually! =P
07:13 Ryan52 szabgab: okay, so can you add that to Padre's planet..and where else should I get it added to?
07:13 azawawi http://blog.ryan52.info/?p=3
07:13 szabgab Ryan52, talk to #epo-ironman on this server to be included
07:14 szabgab and http://perlsphere.net/ too
07:14 azawawi Ryan52: needs some editing regarding word wrapping...
07:14 szabgab and also add it to the about page in template.padre.perlide.org/data/stash.yml
07:15 szabgab I think I'll remove the whole padre planet thing and link it back to the about.html page
07:22 Ryan52 azawawi: okay, I think it might be better now.
07:22 Ryan52 szabgab: my blog is submitted to both places now.
07:23 szabgab Ryan52, great, just nag them on IRC to get your blog included
07:23 azawawi Ryan52: maybe change a couple of these http links, and fixing those bullet points to be more modern...
07:23 szabgab and add it to the trunk/template.padre.perlide.org/data/stash.yml  file
07:24 Ryan52 azawawi: the bullets being strange looking are I guess the WP theme..
07:24 Ryan52 and I have no idea how to edit the theme. :P
07:25 Ryan52 link fixed tho.
07:25 azawawi maybe indentation?
07:25 azawawi yeah it looks cooler now
07:25 azawawi section after Padre now supports the following extensions needs more indenting...
07:26 Ryan52 oh yes it does.
07:26 * Ryan52 wonders if he can put an <ul> inside of another <ul>
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07:27 azawawi hmmm
07:27 Ryan52 yes I can.
07:28 azawawi Ryan52: scan it again please for more links... tickets, cpan modules, Padre, Perl 5, Perl 6
07:28 Hyppolit svn: r7877 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7877
07:28 Hyppolit update version number on download page
07:28 Hyppolit trunk/template.padre.perlide.org/tt/pages/
07:28 azawawi Ryan52: that way google crawler links things better
07:28 Hyppolit svn: r7878 | ryan52++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7878
07:28 Hyppolit add the 0.46 release blog entry
07:28 Hyppolit trunk/template.padre.perlide.org/data/
07:28 azawawi Ryan52: thus more free marketing...
07:30 RogerL joined #padre
07:33 RogerL Could not uninstall 0.41 from Control Panel (just hung) - so deleted the strawberry folder. Installed 0.45 - seemed OK - did not try upgrading - tried First perl 5 script - when I tried to run the black window just opened & closed immediately - what do I do now - I am a complete newby to perl - should I try Activestate plus a text editor instead?
07:33 Ryan52 azawawi: more links now...does it look okay?
07:35 azawawi Ryan52: cool, just one last comment ticket:536 => remove it... and link to the ticket title
07:35 azawawi Ryan52: and remove Bundled latest perlopref.pod to gain more Perl operator documentation... it is duplicated now
07:35 szabgab RogerL, I just uninstalled 0.41 successfully
07:36 szabgab you might need to hang out here while you are trying your steps and ask us for help
07:36 Hyppolit svn: r7879 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7879
07:36 Hyppolit [Padre] Fixed duplicate item in Changes. Ryan52++
07:36 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
07:36 szabgab so for example now I would open the windows explorer
07:37 szabgab and delete c:\strawberry
07:37 Ryan52 okay, I think it's good now. phew.
07:37 szabgab RogerL, actully wait
07:37 azawawi Ryan52++, Ryan52++
07:37 azawawi :)
07:37 szabgab now I see you managed to install 0.45
07:37 RogerL OK
07:37 szabgab so that's good
07:38 szabgab then don't delete c:\strawberry ;-)
07:38 szabgab keep it
07:38 RogerL OK
07:38 szabgab we know about the opening and closing window and it was fixed in 0.46 so we need to upgrade Padre now
07:39 szabgab see the Howto/upgrade on the padre web site
07:39 RogerL Will do
07:39 szabgab RogerL, btw are you from the Homework group?
07:39 azawawi Ryan52: i'll follow-up with a blog post linking to yours in a couple of days explaining some of the features.
07:40 azawawi ah,...
07:40 azawawi Ryan52: you know what's missing from Changes?
07:40 szabgab azawawi, I think the blogs are great but I think we should either link to them from the main Howto page (or from the Features) page
07:41 szabgab or copy some of the blog content to our site as well
07:41 azawawi Ryan52: common beginner errors.. who did that? was it Sewi?
07:41 Sewi yes
07:41 Sewi What is broken? :-)
07:41 azawawi Sewi: you forgot to add it to Padre Changes :)
07:41 Sewi I made it work, guess the original work was from szabgab
07:41 Sewi ok
07:41 Sewi yes, I forgot
07:42 Sewi I'm still unsure what is important enough to be added
07:42 azawawi i think it is an important thing to add
07:42 szabgab basically everything is important :-)
07:43 szabgab I think we only exempt from the updating the translations
07:43 Sewi azawawi: Are you currently editing it or should I add it?
07:43 azawawi Nop svn up and edit it... :)
07:44 jq Ryan52: pong
07:44 Hyppolit svn: r7880 | Sewi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7880
07:44 Hyppolit Changes
07:44 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
07:44 Sewi done
07:45 azawawi yeah but you did that in 0.46 right?
07:45 Sewi Hmm, 46 was released this weekend... seems you're right :-)
07:46 RogerL RogerL back - not from any group - just an old Aussie hacker trying something new - currently installing upgrade - looking a lt cleaner so far
07:46 Hyppolit svn: r7881 | Sewi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7881
07:46 Hyppolit Changed Changes
07:46 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
07:46 Ryan52 jq: too late, El_Che answered my question :)
07:46 jq ok
07:46 Alias RogerL: An old aussie hacker from where?
07:46 Alias <-- Sydney
07:46 RogerL Melbourne!
07:46 azawawi Ryan52: could you please add the common beginner checks feature to your blog post ?
07:46 azawawi Ryan52: i know i asked a lot :)
07:47 azawawi Sewi: thanks
07:47 jq it seems we gained a few padre hackes, given the volume of tickets updated
07:47 Ryan52 azawawi: done
07:48 azawawi alright, Ryan52++, Sewi++
07:48 Sewi jq: Yes, it was also some kind of frustating, the last weekend when some tickets got fixed, twice as much new tickets were added :-)
07:48 szabgab jq, Sewi El_Che azawawi and other non-Englsih speaker,  what do you think about a push in write some content about Padre in your languages?
07:49 jq a good chunk of them were new feature requests, not bugs
07:49 RogerL Upgrade worked fine - blackwindow shows results of print plus 'press any key to continue...'  - looking good - thanks
07:49 szabgab either a blog entry on your blogs (And then link them from the about page) or a page on our web site?
07:49 jq szabgab: nope, i'd like to keep my blog english only
07:49 Sewi szabgab: I don't know, where to write :-(
07:49 jq since it's syndicated on english sites, i prefer keep it this way
07:50 azawawi RogerL: that was fixed in 0.46
07:50 jq i'm getting frustrated when seeing a blog title that sounds interesting but that i cannot read because written in chiness / russian / spanish / etc
07:50 szabgab jq, Sewi then if you just could write up something - a single page explaining about padre - and add it to the padre web site?
07:50 Sewi szabgab: Do we have a really working manual for installing on Win?
07:50 RogerL As a complete newbie to Perl, but a 30+ years experience programmer where should I go next with perl and padre?
07:51 jq RogerL: check padre's trac, pick up a bug that you feel interested about, and try to tackle it
07:51 szabgab Sewi, I try to keep an entry on the Howto page
07:51 Sewi RogerL: For questions: perlmonks.org
07:51 jq hmm, complete perl newbie? then forget what i said
07:51 azawawi RogerL: I would also buy Perl Cookbook and learn from the examples... cookbooks are the best.
07:51 jq azawawi: but a bit outdated, isn't it?
07:52 szabgab right now I am going to update it with the info to install 0.45 and upgrade it
07:52 szabgab I have the cookbook and quite dislike it
07:52 azawawi jq: yeah but for someone experienced wanting to do task X, it is pretty useful
07:52 RogerL Thanks - appreciate all your help!
07:52 szabgab RogerL, do you have any idea what would you like to use Perl for?
07:52 jq azawawi: yup. but pretty low-level, and doesn't really leverage cpan
07:52 Sewi szabgab: Okay, please drop me a line when you're done and I'll translate it to my software-tips-and-tricks page.
07:53 szabgab Sewi, in German?
07:53 Sewi yes
07:53 azawawi jq: i totally agree with that
07:53 RogerL I have developed a small membership and non-profit accounting system in python using sqlite and wxPython - would like to try similar - I'm into CRUD!
07:53 szabgab IMHO you could already start by a general explanation of what Padre is
07:54 szabgab The begining perl book is online and free of charge
07:54 Sewi It's not that big, but Google likes it. I'm collecting some howtos there. It will include a "what-is-it" for Padre once I add the installation howto.
07:54 szabgab but I am not sure how good it is
07:55 RogerL Also need to print reports and package software to distribute to non IT-specialists
07:55 szabgab RogerL, you can start reading any perl code using Padre and try pressing F2 on anything that is not clear
07:56 szabgab if it is still not clear or if f2 does not know what you marked, let us know so we can fix F2 ;-)
07:56 szabgab and what you need to know is that all the extensions of Perl are on CPAN
07:56 szabgab and you can search cpan here: http://search.cpan.org/
07:57 szabgab so for SQLite you would look for DBD::SQLite and for wxPerl you need the Wx package
07:58 RogerL Thanks - will follow up on that - signing off - thanks for help!
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08:00 user_2746 pwhich perl    gives    Undefined subroutine &main::which called at C:\strawberry\perl\bin/pwhich line 44.
08:02 user_2746 which is not that surprising give the following line in the code:
08:02 user_2746 use File::Which ();
08:04 szabgab Alias, I guess this is yours http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/570
08:31 Hyppolit svn: r7882 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7882
08:31 Hyppolit getting started with Padre standalone on windows
08:31 Hyppolit trunk/template.padre.perlide.org/tt/pages/
08:46 szabgab Sewi, the how was updated
08:47 Sewi szabgab: thx
08:48 szabgab though I meant the howto :-)
08:48 Sewi szabgab: I'll look at it later, need to go now...
08:50 szabgab JRWeiss, if you have time I'd really like to see some descriptions of what testing features you would like to see added to Padre
08:51 JRWeiss szabgab, not sure what you mean by testing features
08:51 JRWeiss do you mean things like capture of trafic and replay
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08:51 szabgab the things we discussed the other day, features of WinRunner and co that we might want to implement
08:52 szabgab yes record/replay and also what needs to have GUIs?
08:53 JRWeiss I will start withthe ability to put together a list of test cases and test data and run these this is along the line of KDT (Keyword Driven Testing)
08:54 JRWeiss this is the base for planning the tests and then running them (with scripting in the midle)
08:54 JRWeiss I will also try to describe requirments for object recognition which is needed in order to activate the GUI functioanlity
08:55 szabgab will you write some kind of a simple specification or use case for us?
08:55 JRWeiss OK
08:55 szabgab you might want to open a new page on the wiki and work on it
08:56 szabgab it is ok to change it as frequently as you want
08:56 JRWeiss that is a good idea
08:56 JRWeiss I am going to take the windows "Calculator" as my AUT (Application under Test)
08:56 szabgab btw when you are editing a page there is a link to "wiki formatting"
08:57 szabgab yes, that's my standard thing I am testing :-)
08:57 szabgab OTOH you might take Padre itself as the AUT
08:58 JRWeiss I will look at wiki formating
08:59 JRWeiss Padre isa good test case but is written in Perl therfore I expct it to be easier to handle.  the tool we want should be able to interact withother applications from environments less familure and less friendly to perl
09:00 szabgab I think the point would be to disregard the fact that it is written in Perl and take it as a black box
09:00 szabgab after all we are mainly talking about black box testing, right?
09:01 JRWeiss That is good in theory but once you try to identify objects and so and you are dealing withthe underlying classes and ID's for identification you can't realy ignore the infrastructure.
09:01 szabgab sure
09:01 JRWeiss total black box GUI testing uses X,Y cord and mouse down and mouse up commands.
09:01 JRWeiss these scripts are Totaly not maintainable and not reliable
09:01 szabgab in the meantime I'll try to write a plugin that start the recognition process
09:02 JRWeiss that will be good
09:03 JRWeiss take into acount the need to identify objects by one or more attribute like ID or index or caption or a combination of these
09:03 szabgab oh I start with what I can do now and then we'll see
09:04 JRWeiss the goal is also to expose the methods available to be perfromed once the object has been identified (select, check, is in focuse, set focus, etc)
09:05 szabgab I think that part is really far from us now
09:05 szabgab first we need to think about the framework of testing
09:05 szabgab then about the areas where perl has strengths
09:05 szabgab (eg. telnet, networking, web application testing)
09:06 szabgab desktop GUI application is actually a lot weaker in Perl than the others
09:06 szabgab desktop GUI application *testing* is actually a lot weaker in Perl than the others
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09:32 JRWeiss szabgab, maybe would should better define our goal for the testing project.  I thought our goal was to overcome the weekness of perl in testing GUI
09:33 szabgab that is a longer term goal
09:35 szabgab IMHO the shorter term is to make it easier to start using perl for testing in general
09:35 JRWeiss If we want telnet and web app and netwokring, why is object recognition an issue at all?
09:36 szabgab for telnet I guess it is not
09:36 JRWeiss we can focus on data transfer capturing (which I understadn we have to a degree now)
09:37 JRWeiss what we need in this case is more a way to setup expected results and comparison
09:37 szabgab maybe a record replay for a telnet session?
09:42 szabgab ok, let me try to clarify, I'd like to start adding all kinds of plugins to Padre that will help us attract the commercial testing world - those who are using WinRunner and co. now. In this field there are certain areas where perl is stronger and other where it is weaker
09:42 szabgab the weaker part is the GUI
09:42 JRWeiss Much of my added value will be in testing GUI application
09:43 szabgab nevertheless I'd like start with both
09:43 szabgab or all of them
09:43 szabgab JRWeiss, and in test management I think
09:43 JRWeiss OK for GUI like I said object recognition
09:43 JRWeiss for test mamangement KDT
09:44 JRWeiss nad for everything result verification
09:44 JRWeiss as far as networking and telnet I need to see what Padre has and then think of what needs to be enhanced
09:45 szabgab oh that's easy :-)
09:45 szabgab Padre has nothing now :-)
09:45 szabgab but there are perl modules not yet integrated to use any protocol
09:45 szabgab e.g. Net::Telnet
09:45 JRWeiss I thought you sadi it had something like a sniffer
09:47 szabgab oh that
09:47 szabgab it is a very basic thing that is probably not working any more and it is only to sniff http connections
09:48 szabgab of course it can be extended to sniff anything
09:51 JRWeiss Ok so i will work on defining the networking requirments as well
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09:58 szabgab CSJewell, good morning
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10:34 szabgab bbl&
10:54 CSJewell Good "morning"
10:54 CSJewell (sorry, was on rdp. didn't see a thing.)
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11:22 waxhead evening all...
11:26 rindolf Hi waxhead
11:31 meironc hi szabgab
11:33 meironc szabgab please could you take a look at this code and help me understand why the input does not work. http://pastebin.com/m11658ea7
11:41 rindolf meironc: don't use bare filehandles.
11:41 rindolf meironc: and use three-args opens.
11:41 rindolf And <STDIN> should probably be <> ( short for <ARGV>)
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15:03 Hyppolit svn: r7883 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7883
15:03 Hyppolit first step for the Padre::Plugin::GUITest
15:03 Hyppolit trunk/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-GUITest/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-GUITest/lib/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-GUITest/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-GUITest/lib/Padre/Plugin/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-GUITest/t/
15:12 Hyppolit svn: r7884 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7884
15:12 Hyppolit typo
15:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Kate/lib/Padre/Plugin/
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15:19 Sewi There is a question about Padre, ActiveState and Strawberry: http://www.perlmonks.org/?node_id=795154
15:20 * azawawi reads
15:23 szabgab Corion and the demons :-)
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15:40 szabgab Sewi, ok, I think I spammed PerlMonks enough now
15:48 Alias Yay for 0.46 fixing the forced EOL conversion
15:49 azawawi :)
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15:52 Sewi szabgab :-)
15:52 mib_3iuz10 looks good
15:52 Sewi szabgab: http://surfio.de/info/padre_installation.html
15:53 * Alias works on fixing File::Which
15:54 Alias Which co-incidentally needs me to implement Test::Script script_runs testing
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16:25 CSJewell Alias: Did you get my message about Portable::Dist?
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16:35 szabgab CSJewell, I have created several tickets related to the Stand Alone Padre  http://padre.perlide.org/trac/report/14
16:36 szabgab and put them together with some other issues in the "downstream" category
16:37 szabgab CSJewell, is there any way people can help you accelerate the improvements in the Padre Stand alone packaging?
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16:38 csanchez Hi
16:39 CSJewell Let me get back to you on that, szabgab - I'm running out the door atm.
16:39 szabgab when you get back you can get back
16:43 csanchez I'm trying to install Padre on MacOSX 10.5.8, I'm using Perl 5.10 and wxWidgets 2.8.10 from macports, but when I try to install from cpan, I got this: Padre needs at least version 2.8.8 of wxWidgets. You have wxWidgets 2.8.4
16:44 szabgab csanchez, have you followed the instructions on the Download page?
16:46 csanchez szabgab: yes, but I don't know why I still get this: Wx Version: 0.74 wxWidgets 2.8.4
16:47 szabgab I don't have a mac but  I think there is perl an wxperl on and that might be the source of confusion
16:47 csanchez I did: cpan Alien::wxWidgets, then wxPerl -MCPAN -eshell, and got that error ..
16:47 szabgab or that the wxWidgets or Macports lie
16:48 szabgab did you let Alien::wxWidgets compile its thing?
16:49 csanchez yes, it take a lot of time
16:49 csanchez and then: The installation of wxWidgets is finished.
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16:50 csanchez if I use only: cpan Padre, I got this: Padre requires a perl built using threads
16:51 szabgab I am so out of my league regarding Mac
16:52 csanchez yes, me also, I'm a mac newbie, I use Linux all the time, but I have this mac now, and I trying to install Padre here
16:54 szabgab have you installed Aline using wxPerl?
16:54 csanchez aptitude install padre, and that's all ;)
16:54 csanchez szabgab: no
16:55 szabgab so that's how the description starts at http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/Download#OSX
16:55 csanchez you mean Alien?
16:55 szabgab yes, I just cant type :-)
16:55 csanchez jeje, yes I did: cpan Alien:wxWidgets
16:56 szabgab nope
16:56 szabgab that uses perl and not wxPerl
16:56 csanchez hmm, I see
16:56 csanchez let my try with wxPerl then
16:57 szabgab oh I see there is also the "lazy way"
16:57 csanchez I just see "lazy way" and I did that
16:57 csanchez yes :D
16:59 szabgab so we'll see if the other way works and then we can rename this to the "lazy and incorrect way "
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17:14 garu Ryan52++ # 0.46 released!
17:16 rhebus joined #padre
17:16 rhebus hello all
17:17 rhebus for "Perl->Check for common (beginner) errors", how do I know it's done anything?
17:17 rhebus I just ran it on a program of mine, and got no feedback at all -- is it working and hasn't found anything to report, or did it not run at all?
17:20 csanchez szabgab: brb, I let you know if it works
17:24 szabgab rhebus, I am not sure if it is already working
17:25 szabgab try writing   use warning;   without an s , I think that should be one of the issues
17:25 rhebus szabgab: ok it's working, but there's no feedback on success
17:25 szabgab rhebus, ticket ?
17:26 rhebus will check
17:26 szabgab should go under "perl help"
17:26 azawawi rhebus: common (beginner) errors is also enabled on run (F5)
17:27 azawawi rhebus: so it always checks before running a Perl 5 script...
17:28 szabgab maybe it would be better if it was working as the syntax checker
17:28 azawawi szabgab: without the message box...
17:28 szabgab so on every save but also while  you write the code
17:29 szabgab with red marks under the problematic code
17:29 azawawi szabgab: i guess having stuff as warnings in the syntax check panel is the right thing to todo
17:29 azawawi szabgab: that also...
17:29 azawawi szabgab: that's why i said we need "Problems" instead of "Syntax check" :)
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17:30 rhebus ticket filed
17:30 azawawi szabgab: so we can put also Perl tidy warnings there
17:30 szabgab rhebus ty
17:30 azawawi szabgab: s/tidy/critic/
17:30 azawawi szabgab: :)
17:30 rhebus azawawi++ definitely think those should be combined
17:31 szabgab "no indentation?" "go to jail an skip one round"
17:32 szabgab azawawi, could you try the new GUITEst plugin?
17:32 szabgab it is in svn only
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17:34 DCOLLINS Hmm. This is the wrong channel for this, but I seem to be unable to use the perl6 'for @array -> my $thingy {}' construct due to a "Statement not terminated properly" near "-> my $thingy", but removing the 'my' works fine. Perhaps is this a bug or is the documentation just wrong?
17:35 azawawi i think in perl 6 my is implicit
17:36 azawawi DCOLLINS: but im not 100% sure
17:36 DCOLLINS Is it in loops? Ok then, the docs that shipped with my Almost Six included the my, but I shall go without and see what happens
17:37 azawawi yeah in loops
17:37 DCOLLINS right you are. Thanks :)
17:37 azawawi try for 1..10 -> $x { say $x; } say $x;
17:37 szabgab_mibbit DCOLLINS: no need for my there
17:37 DCOLLINS yep
17:38 szabgab_mibbit the pointy things are just subroutines and parameters are declared automatically
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17:43 CSJewell szabgab: Sent a reply to one of the tickets.  (wanted to "wontfix" that, but as we're not going to go for logo certification [that COSTS, by the way], all I can do is say "this isn't very well liked" and go ick.)
17:44 CSJewell I'm copying in a VM to check on 569.
17:46 szabgab_mibbit so let's leave that ticket as it is for now
17:47 rindolf Alias: here?
17:47 CSJewell rindolf: at his 4am?
17:47 rindolf CSJewell: don't know.
17:47 rindolf CSJewell: he made a CPAN upload a while ago.
17:48 CSJewell Guess he is awake, then.
17:48 szabgab_mibbit he has a bot doing that
17:54 rhebus what do you think the best way would be to insert a subroutine at the end of the document?
17:54 azawawi rhebus: above the selected stuff?
17:54 rhebus clearly there are two conditions: 1) if there is an __END__, we ignore everything after it, and 2) if there is a final statement 1; in a module, we want to insert before that too
17:55 rhebus azawawi: what do you mean?
17:55 rhebus I'm looking at the extract subroutine functionality btw
17:58 CSJewell Going to have to log out.
17:59 azawawi rhebus: im thinking when you select a couple of lines that you want to extract... find the first selected line and insert your subroutine there
17:59 azawawi rhebus: like using this http://www.yellowbrain.com/s​tc/selnpos.html#getselstart
18:02 szabgab_mibbit I think it is better to insert right after or before the current sub
18:02 szabgab_mibbit there can be __END__ there can __DATA__ and I think a couple of other things at the end
18:03 szabgab_mibbit rhebus: do you have a blog?
18:04 Sewi szabgab: Did you see the link?
18:04 szabgab_mibbit I think inserting right where you took it out from is not the right place as that might be in the middle of another functions
18:04 szabgab_mibbit Sewi:  to yellowbrain ?
18:05 szabgab_mibbit Sewi: which link?
18:08 rhebus szabgab_mibbit: no blog
18:09 rhebus azawawi: yeah what szabgab_mibbit said; the selected code is the code to be extracted, so you can't use it for finding where to insert the new subroutine
18:09 rhebus eclipse puts new extracted routines at the end of the class
18:09 rhebus *in java, that is
18:09 rhebus right I'm afraid I have to go :(
18:10 Alias OK, I've uploaded new Test::Script and File::Which
18:10 Alias That should make the whole pwhich problem go away
18:11 szabgab Alias, ty
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18:11 Alias Been meaning to deal with some stuff related to them for a while
18:13 Hyppolit svn: r7885 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7885
18:13 Hyppolit Updating Test::Script and File::Which dependencies
18:13 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
18:26 Sewi szabgab: http://surfio.de/info/padre_installation.html
18:27 szabgab_mibbit oh yes
18:27 szabgab_mibbit there is  huge popup advertisement though
18:27 Sewi It's page-wide, sorry.
18:28 szabgab_mibbit anyway we should link to that page from somwehere in Padre
18:28 szabgab_mibbit maybe the about page
18:29 Sewi I planned to start a blog as soon as I got time to do it.
18:45 Hyppolit svn: r7886 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7886
18:45 Hyppolit [GUITest] turn functions into method
18:45 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-GUITest/lib/Padre/Plugin/
18:46 szabgab_mibbit Sewi: what do you think about writing a page in German describing Padre ?
18:46 Sewi You could take the text for a German installation page on the padre website.
18:47 szabgab_mibbit Sewi: so a page in German that describes Padre and has the instructions on how to install it
18:47 szabgab_mibbit Sewi: will you add it to Padre ?
18:47 Sewi Yes, this what I did on the page.
18:47 szabgab_mibbit to the web site?
18:48 szabgab_mibbit I don't know how that page should be called but we could start by calling it german.html or padre_in_german.html
18:48 Sewi I could try, but not today, sorry. We need to elect new political heads soon and in 15 minutes starts a TV show with three of the five people who got chances.
18:49 Sewi They didn't say anything useful until now (only things like "The way is right!" or "We have the power") and I'ld like to see them where they can't hide of questions :-)
18:50 szabgab naive :-)
18:50 Sewi :-)
18:51 Sewi Anyway, it's hard for me to write German about Padre as all I do and think about it is in English :-)
18:57 Hyppolit svn: r7887 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7887
18:57 Hyppolit [Padre] Fixed ticket:573 "ESC does not close About window"
18:57 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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19:13 Hyppolit svn: r7888 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7888
19:13 Hyppolit [Padre] Fixed CRLF pollution in previous commit
19:13 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
19:22 Hyppolit svn: r7889 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/7889
19:22 Hyppolit [Padre] A better fix to ticket:573
19:22 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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