Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #padre, 2010-01-07

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:01 Hyppolit svn: r10076 | ddn123456++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10076
00:01 Hyppolit Updated dutch translation.
00:01 Hyppolit Initial dutch plugin translation added by Dirk De Nijs.
00:01 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-Plack/share/locale/
00:46 Hyppolit svn: r10077 | zipf++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10077
00:46 Hyppolit Updated Spanish translation
00:46 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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01:24 Hyppolit svn: r10078 | zipf++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10078
01:24 Hyppolit Updated Spanish Catalyst plugin
01:24 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Catalyst/share/locale/
01:41 Hyppolit svn: r10079 | zipf++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10079
01:41 Hyppolit Updated Spanish Catalyst plugin
01:41 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Catalyst/share/locale/
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06:15 Sewi joined #padre
06:15 Sewi gm
06:32 SvenDowideit joined #padre
06:38 Alias__ hi
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07:54 * Alias__ ponders if he can make Save Intuition for for Changes files
07:54 Alias__ or Makefile.PL even... that could be useful
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08:12 Hyppolit svn: r10080 | bruck++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10080
08:12 Hyppolit Updated Hebrew translation.
08:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
08:14 jq Alias__: ping
08:14 Alias__ pong
08:15 Alias So, where were we
08:15 * Alias just has to quickly release 5 modules
08:15 Alias Start talking :)
08:16 jq ok. freedesktop is in
08:16 jq however, i don't know what to do for my_data
08:16 Alias Full method coverage?
08:16 jq full method coverage
08:16 Alias Was that patch of any use?
08:17 jq a bit
08:17 Alias Goodo, so he'll be happy at least
08:17 Alias Which is good
08:17 jq but not that much
08:17 jq but tell him it was a good starting point
08:17 Alias Most people don't mind if the patch changes a lot, as long as it was of some use and their intent is realised
08:18 jq also, detection based on -d /etc/xdg is in
08:19 jq now, what i miss:
08:19 jq - a my_app_data_dir() (or whatever) that would be my_data()/perl/dist/Foo-Bar
08:20 Alias Right, the second tier stuff
08:20 jq - a my_config() (or whatever) that should be implemented in all drivers
08:20 marcela joined #padre
08:20 jq - a m_app_config_dir() that would be my_config()/perl/dist/Foo-Bar
08:20 * Alias prefers latin layering
08:20 jq ?
08:21 Alias general -> specific
08:21 Alias Thus, "my" -> "type" -> "subtype"
08:21 jq my_config_app() ?
08:21 Alias It doesn't read as enlgish/german properly, but it sorts better
08:21 jq i don't care as long as it exists :-)
08:21 Alias Right
08:22 Alias One of these days I should try and come up with a metric for that rule
08:22 Alias There's probably some machine-learning decision tree logic you could apply to the problem
08:22 jq one thing to note in freedesktop driver: some things are overridden by env vars, which is not possible for users_*()
08:22 Alias jq: Alternatively...
08:23 * Alias ponders how to express this
08:23 Alias File::HomeDir->dist( File::HomeDir->my_data, 'Foo-Bar' )
08:23 Alias Or something
08:23 Alias Where you have one method ->dist that does the (perl|Perl)/dist/Fist-Name for everything
08:24 Alias So things like File::ShareDir and M:I could easily reuse it
08:24 jq that's an idea
08:24 Alias That said, it makes the code much more ugly instead of just my_data_dist
08:24 jq well, file::homedir could propose both
08:25 Alias But the pattern of "perl" -> "dist vs class" -> "name"
08:25 Alias is very common
08:25 Alias Or at least, it is in my head
08:25 jq ->dist() for other modules, and my_data_dist() for module user
08:25 Alias Which is 50% change it will be in general in the future :)
08:25 Alias chance
08:26 jq (on an unrelated note: i implemented "dzil run" which has been merged by rjbs)
08:26 Alias great
08:27 jq back to file::homedir - how are we moving on?
08:27 Alias One less potential special case added too deep that will bite us later :)
08:27 * Alias is releasing modules
08:27 Alias 3/5 done
08:27 Alias I'll do a dev of homedir as 6
08:27 Alias Lets get the FreeDesktop code to prod and digested by the downstream packagers first
08:27 Alias If we get that wrong, adding more weirdness on top will just compound the problem
08:28 Alias I want to be sure that debian/et-al packaging groups are happy
08:28 Alias Maybe we should create a (rare for my repo) branch for the additional stuff
08:28 jq not needed
08:28 jq i'm not that in a hurry
08:28 Alias ok
08:29 jq but i'll be able to package homedir for mandriva quickly
08:29 jq however, i'm not packaging dev releases...
08:29 Alias At the very least, adding a ->dist and ->module pair for the just creating the relative "perl/dist/blah" stuff should be no problem
08:29 Alias Without integrating them
08:29 Alias jq: Dev release is there for first round, public commentary
08:30 Alias jq: If everyone is happy (or nobody complains at least) we'll move it to a prod release for you guys
08:30 Alias This channel has an unusual number of downstream lurking :)
08:30 jq ok.
08:30 Alias So it should be an easier thing that most thing
08:31 Alias Is Mandriva a derived distro these days?
08:31 Alias And RPM or deb?
08:31 jq not derived, although some spec files are inspired by fedora
08:31 jq rpm based
08:31 Alias ok
08:32 Alias My normal criteria for "widespread downstream agreement" is Fedora + (SUSE || Mandriva) + (Debian || Ubuntu) + (no screams from Gentoo)
08:32 Alias Between Ryan52 and you we cover the middle two
08:33 Alias And in general the Gentoo people are quite capable of taking care of themselves :)
08:33 * Alias tries to remember who was doing Padre fedora packaging, and if they were lurking
08:34 marcela Alias: that would be me
08:34 Alias aha!
08:34 jq so we have: fedora + mandriva + debian on the channel?
08:34 Alias yep :)
08:35 Alias Padre is RATHER shiny to packaging people
08:35 jq quite unusual indeed
08:35 szabgab and Strawberry too :-)
08:36 Alias marcela: Can you please review http://svn.ali.as/cpan/trunk/Fi​le-HomeDir/lib/File/HomeDir.pm and http://svn.ali.as/cpan/trunk/File-Hom​eDir/lib/File/HomeDir/FreeDesktop.pm for compliance with Fedora or whatever
08:36 jq Alias: speaking of packaging - t/04 still fails due to nowarnings: http://kenobi.mandriva.com/queue/failur​e/cooker/contrib/release/20100107074801​.jquelin.kenobi.23218/log/padre-0.530.0​-1mdv2010.1/build.0.20100107074813.log
08:36 Alias marcela: Just to make sure it's going to work right when it's time to package it
08:36 * Alias looks
08:36 marcela Alias: I'm quite busy, I'll try later
08:37 Alias marcela: It's fine, there's a little bit of time
08:37 jq Alias: put a big WARNING (even i used the caps this time) saying that my_* will change on unixes using a freedesktop
08:37 jq hi szabgab btw
08:37 jq Alias: at the end of the log
08:37 Alias jq: One common method is to use the Makefile.PL to look for a previous lower-than-the-API-change version of the module already installed
08:37 Alias Maybe we should roll that in
08:38 Alias That's a VERY interesting warning, btw
08:38 Alias It's interesting that loading the config triggered gtk initialisation
08:39 Alias And then the specific error is one I've never seen too
08:39 Alias jq: It's a pity your build machines are headless
08:39 Alias jq: You don't really get much of a chance to run much of the test suite
08:40 jq Alias: i could run them in xvfb, but that exposes all sort of other problems
08:40 szabgab hi jq
08:40 Alias ok, I need to get these dists shipped before I get too distracted :)
08:40 Alias jq: I know :)
08:40 jq so i removed the xvfb run by now
08:40 Alias jq: Was it you that had issues with the Test::NeedsDisplay thing?
08:40 jq and if the nowarnings keep trashing the tests, i'll even remove the tests themselves. :-|
08:40 Alias (which is the thing that automates the xvfb stuff)
08:41 Alias jq: If 04-config REALLY needs a DISPLAY, then we just skip on no display and your problem is fixed
08:41 jq i'd be glad having a t/04 skipping on nodisplay
08:41 jq and yes, i think the issues were related to Test::NeedsDisplay
08:41 Alias Really, it shouldn't NEED a display
08:41 Alias So that test should just run normally and pass
08:42 Alias The fact it touches Wx at all means something is wrong
08:42 jq needs fixing
08:42 Alias Will do
08:43 Alias shortly
08:43 Alias We <3 downstream
08:43 Alias OK, new train of Aspect:: modules are released
08:43 Alias Doing the HomeDir dev now
08:44 Alias Looking again at that Wx error (while svn updates) that's a curious stack trace
08:44 Alias Padre::Config::Host::write calls Padre::Current->main...
08:44 Alias That shouldn't really be necesary
08:45 Alias Or at least, it's going to trigger Padre::wx loading
08:45 Alias Which is where the bug lies
08:48 Alias You know, once this FreeDesktop stuff is on prod, it's a fairly reasonable candidate to finally bump to 1.00
08:48 Alias It's the functionality gap I've been waiting to close
08:49 jq great.
08:53 Alias heh, _default_thingy? :)
08:53 Alias Nice name
08:55 Alias hrm
08:55 Alias IO::File now requires 5.6
08:55 Alias But hopefully that shouldn't be a problem
08:55 jq i took it from the patch :-)
08:55 Alias Wonder why he didn't just do it the old fashioned way
08:56 jq don't know either, i didn't want to bother and copied this part
08:56 Alias yeah
08:56 Alias I might just switch it over to old school 2-arg
08:56 jq go on, be my guest :-)
08:56 Alias He might have done it as an alternative to his normal use of lexical 5.8 handles
08:57 Alias Should we be caching the results of parsing that file
08:57 Alias Or does it only run once
08:58 jq the patch was caching, i don't anymore
08:58 Alias oh?
08:58 jq because user is allowed to update it
08:58 Alias true
08:58 jq and it's even written in the spec
08:59 Alias Does it say anything about timing though?
08:59 jq no
08:59 jq also, note that this file is chmoded 600 (at least on my machine)
08:59 jq so users_*() will revert to default
08:59 Alias That's ok
08:59 jq most of the time
08:59 Alias users_ is notoriously unreliable in most places
09:00 Alias Which is somewhat as it should be
09:00 Alias I may end up killing most of them other that users_home entirely
09:00 Alias than
09:00 Alias I only really leave it on the chance that someone is doing interesting things as roo
09:00 Alias root
09:00 Alias And on some subset of operating systems, that might be useful
09:01 jq ok
09:01 Alias Actually, FreeDesktop probably now has THE best implementation as far as users_ goes
09:01 Alias Since Windows and Mac involve system calls
09:01 * jq brags
09:01 jq :-)
09:02 waxhead joined #padre
09:02 waxhead hey everyone
09:02 waxhead 1 hour  for the next release
09:02 Alias Fine by me
09:03 Alias hrm
09:03 waxhead well it's paid off.. the translation report looks pretty good...
09:03 Alias Excellent
09:03 Sewi waxhead: We need to add some strings before the release :-)
09:03 waxhead I need to get some of the names for some languages that appear to be languishing
09:03 Alias jq: What is _my_thingy supposed to return if it can't find a value?
09:03 Alias jq: undef?
09:04 waxhead Sewi, I don't htink so!  :)
09:04 jq Alias: undef
09:04 jq it seems that returning undef when no suitable answer is found is the way homedir goes
09:05 Alias Yup
09:05 * waxhead just picked the first cucumber from the garden tonight
09:05 Alias I tried exceptions in a couple of dev releases, but it was way too cumbersome
09:05 Alias Since you really have NFI on any arbitrary system if those directories exist
09:05 Alias So I went with undef for "doesn't exist" and exception for "errors in the process"
09:06 Alias The values returned are guarenteed to exist, but we don't guaretee to return a value
09:08 jq back in a few
09:08 Alias ok
09:14 Sewi Alias: #786: what is different to the current solution?
09:14 Hyppolit #786: File Monitoring 2.0 (new enhancement) [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/786 ]
09:15 Alias Sewi: In Ultraedit (which I'm using as my model for "correct") it doesn't do any gui actions if the application isn't in the foreground
09:15 Alias You shouldn't need to actively monitor anything if Padre isn't in use
09:16 Alias And once you know a file has changed, you shouldn't have to continue to monitor it
09:16 Alias And so on
09:16 Alias And we don't handle deleted files properly still, I seem to recall
09:16 Sewi ok, I didn't include "app focus" in "document focus".
09:17 Sewi Deleted files are handled but I didn't try out #810 yet
09:17 Hyppolit #810: File monitoring issue (new defect) [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/810#comment:1 ]
09:17 Alias So right now, you're only monitoring the active file?
09:17 Sewi When doing svn update, the popup is shown only for the current active document.
09:18 Alias ok
09:18 Sewi But Padre doesn't care if the app has focus.
09:18 Alias ah
09:18 Alias We should probably make the raw timer do it
09:18 Alias return unless appfocus
09:18 Alias Or disable the timer entirely, and start firing it again when the app recoveres focus
09:18 Sewi yes, and I don't know if a check is forced on document (tab) change.
09:19 Alias hrm
09:19 Alias Possibly even Window, rather than app
09:19 Alias So that if you have a Find dialog open, you don't get file changed popups
09:19 Alias yeah, we may want to fire a hard immediate file check on initial document focus
09:19 Alias Although probably not a blocking check
09:19 Alias Show document, then do the check
09:20 Sewi I'm using a 20-second-interval for checking (to limit sshfs overhead) and I think it takes some time after tab change for Padre to detect changes
09:20 Alias ... and reset the timer in the process
09:20 Alias Is the check currently blocking?
09:20 Sewi Schedule a background check for +1 second when the document is shown.
09:20 Alias Someone really needs to start learning the Wx non-blocking IO apis
09:20 Sewi I don't know if it's blocking.
09:21 Alias Where someone probably includes me :)
09:21 Alias I suppose if it's done in a thread it would be enough
09:21 Sewi waxhead: I'd like to see #799 as blocker - it's really bad behavior.
09:21 Hyppolit #799: DirectoryBrowser jumps to top on doubleclick (new defect) [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/799 ]
09:21 * Alias notices that
09:21 Sewi Alias: sure
09:21 Alias Something in the ->refresh code isn't shortcutting properly if nothing has changed
09:21 Alias Probably came in when the new locking logic landed
09:22 Alias And directory ->refresh hasn't adapted yet
09:27 Alias ok
09:27 Alias File::HomeDir 0.90_01 pushed
09:27 Alias My release automation only runs as raw ::Unix, so I'm not entirely sure my chances were safe
09:27 Alias But they compile safely at leasty
09:27 Alias But they compile safely at least
09:28 Alias Checking the 04-config problem now
09:29 Sewi waxhead: blocker for the next release, not for today's one. Sorry, forgot this
09:29 Alias Sewi: I'll know where the solution probably is, I'll see if I can fix it in time
09:29 Alias Well, where it probably is anyway
09:30 waxhead what??? now??
09:30 waxhead make test passes here.. who has a failing test?
09:30 Alias jq
09:30 Alias He's running on the headless Mandriva packaging machine
09:30 Alias It's blocking downstream
09:30 Alias Gimme 15 minutes
09:30 waxhead Alias, sure thing...
09:31 waxhead there's 30min until 2100 anyway.. :)
09:31 Alias goodo
09:33 waxhead Alias, take you time, when your done and it's working I'll kick off the releae
09:33 Hyppolit #817: SVN Plugin: Reload all files from disk after update run (new enhancement) [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/817 ]
09:35 Alias weird
09:36 Alias jq: According to the code I'm looking at, 04-config.t is set to skip on no DISPLAY
09:36 Alias Although I wonder if that was true in 0.53
09:37 Alias Ah, apparently it wasn't skipping at the time
09:37 Alias "since r9888 this needs DISPLAY"
09:37 Hyppolit Changeset #9888 http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/9888
09:37 waxhead isn't that how it works on windows?
09:37 waxhead no DISPLAY on windows
09:38 Alias The idiom is unless ( $ENV{DISPLAY} or $^O eq 'MSWin32' ) { skip_all ... }
09:38 Alias But 04-config is only testing the configuration subsystem
09:38 Alias Which should NOT have to load Wx
09:38 waxhead oh
09:39 Alias It's supposed to load WITHOUT using Wx, so that we can query it before we start up Wx
09:39 waxhead so are we right to release?
09:39 Alias sorta
09:39 Alias Let me fiddle a bit
09:39 jq back
09:39 waxhead Alias, NP.... ping me when you're done
09:40 Alias waxhead: Is the release documentation in a wiki? If so, it might be worth adding "if possible, ensure the test suite passed without $ENV{DISPLAY}"
09:42 Alias hrm
09:42 Alias So Wx isn't LOADED
09:42 waxhead Alias, yeah it is..
09:42 Alias Then what the hell
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09:45 Alias hrm
09:45 Alias not ok 229 - Wx was not loaded during config write
09:45 Alias That seems a bit, well, wasteful
09:46 Alias oh dear
09:47 Alias It's my fault
09:47 Alias I added a special case to handle ->write before we had created ::Main
09:47 Alias I forgot to take into account that it's not really allowed to know that
09:47 Alias Since it violates encapsulation
09:52 waxhead So are we right to roll out a release?
09:52 Alias no
09:52 Alias almost
09:52 waxhead ok..
09:52 Alias Just validating my fix
09:52 waxhead szabgab, ping
09:52 szabgab yupping
09:53 waxhead cool.. just checking you're around.. I'll have a release for you tonight I expect
09:53 szabgab Alias, the no DISPLAY is being tested during the regular release process
09:54 Alias ok
09:54 szabgab release.pl does it
09:54 Alias Then it didn't work properly, or something
09:54 Alias A failure got through to jq's build system
09:54 szabgab last time we just used the --nodisplay flag :-)
09:54 Hyppolit svn: r10081 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10081
09:54 Hyppolit Padre::Config::Host->write no longer accidentally loads the entire gui application stack
09:54 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Config/ trunk/Padre/t/
09:54 szabgab as we had the issue but wanted to release anyway
09:55 Alias ah
09:55 Alias :)
09:55 szabgab or maybe it is --nonodisplay?
09:55 Alias Then this time, someone just skipped the test entirely that was warning about the bug
09:55 Alias Instead of actually, say, checking to see if it was a bug :)
09:55 szabgab we have an elevated carpet
09:55 Alias I've made the error message WAY more explicit now :)
09:56 szabgab lots of things can go underneath
09:56 Alias ya
09:56 Alias nice analogy, missed it for a second
09:56 Alias ok, so jq's config bug is fixed
09:56 Alias What was the other one? the directory refresh thing?
09:57 Alias Apparently I have 4 minutes to fix it :)
09:58 waxhead ha.. you think you'll do it?
09:58 Sewi Alias: #799
09:58 Hyppolit #799: DirectoryBrowser jumps to top on doubleclick (new defect) [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/799 ]
09:58 Alias I do suspect it's a one line fix
09:58 Alias So maybe
09:58 Alias The question is, can I do it safely
09:59 Sewi Fix it for 0.55
09:59 Alias Unless I can see the error in the next minute or so, I will
09:59 Alias I'm only fixing it if it's eyeball'able simple
09:59 waxhead I think so... orrrr... I could write up all the blog stuff and then do the release...
09:59 Alias nah, it's ok
09:59 Sewi 1min till deadline :-)
10:00 Alias ok, it's not a one line fix
10:00 waxhead ok. done then.. I'll kick off the release...
10:00 Alias Yup
10:00 Alias Sewi: I think we should probably audit all of the ->refresh methods to make sure they know if/when to shortcut properly
10:00 Alias Sewi: It looks like, until the locking code landed, the caller was expected to know when to shortcut
10:04 Hyppolit svn: r10082 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10082
10:04 Hyppolit add the Google Analytics code to the blogs pages as well
10:04 Hyppolit trunk/blogs.padre.perlide.org/templates/
10:05 Hyppolit svn: r10083 | waxhead++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10083
10:05 Hyppolit Tidy for release 0.54
10:05 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Config/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/ trunk/Padre/script/ trunk/Padre/t/
10:08 Hyppolit svn: r10084 | waxhead++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10084
10:08 Hyppolit Version bump to 0.54
10:08 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Action/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Config/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/DB/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/DocBrowser/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Document/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Document/Perl/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Document/Perl/QuickFix/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/File/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Plugin/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Plugin/PopularityContest/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Project/ trunk/Pad
10:08 szabgab jq, are you still around ?
10:08 jq szabgab: yes
10:09 szabgab I need some help with my git svn foo
10:09 szabgab I have a local git svn mirror of padre
10:09 patspam szabgab: re your git blog post, I wished Padre was using git instead of svn when writing Padre::Plugin::Plack for the sake of private micro-commits
10:09 waxhead does it really matter with the plugins though?
10:09 patspam so that I could experiment and make commits along the way, privately before releasing
10:09 szabgab you see I am also using it already
10:10 szabgab so I have a local branch
10:10 waxhead if the plugin is yours, you should feel free to commit to all the time.. :)
10:10 Sewi Alias: The arrows for folding work without focus-click.
10:10 jq szabgab: what's your problem?
10:10 szabgab git co -b dev
10:10 szabgab with some changes
10:10 szabgab then I now git svn rebase -ed
10:10 szabgab how do I merge master to  dev ?
10:10 szabgab git co dev
10:11 szabgab git merge master
10:11 szabgab is that?
10:11 patspam it's a mindset thing, when I'm starting out on a new idea I like to keep it private
10:11 jq yes, but you might prefer rebasing
10:11 jq that is:
10:11 jq git co dev
10:11 jq git rebase master
10:11 jq this way, you'll have a linear history
10:11 szabgab ok and then I make some more changes to dev
10:12 jq which git svn will be able to apply commit by commit instead of a big blurb merging all commits into one
10:12 szabgab and do some more rebases of master as people make changes
10:12 jq yes
10:12 szabgab and then when I want to push my changes out
10:12 szabgab git co master
10:12 szabgab git rebase dev
10:12 jq no
10:12 szabgab git svn dcommit ?
10:12 jq git co master
10:12 jq git merge dev
10:12 jq git svn dcommit
10:12 szabgab why do I merger there and not rebase them?
10:13 jq you don't want to rebase the master, which is the official, published history
10:13 jq rebase rewrites history
10:13 jq so it's ok to rebase your local branch
10:13 jq but not the official, published one
10:13 szabgab ok
10:13 jq moreover, you rebase a branch that has been forked of another
10:13 szabgab I got part of that :-)
10:14 jq so if you rebase master on dev, that's as if you say that "child" dev is now the "parent" of the original "parent" of dev
10:14 jq (don't know if i'm clear :-) )
10:14 szabgab my head is exploding
10:15 jq forgot about this.
10:15 szabgab but I have a flu so I am not sure :-)
10:15 jq just learn: "rebase only on private branches"
10:15 szabgab sure but I     svn rebase master
10:15 jq git svn is different :-)
10:16 szabgab or not master
10:16 szabgab whatevet
10:16 szabgab r
10:16 jq it's not pure git, since it interfaces a different scm
10:16 szabgab that's why we need a gui for Git so people like me don't screw it up
10:16 dam szabgab: when you rebase $A to $B, $A is first reverted to the first commit that is both in $A and $B, lets name that commit $X. It is the branch point. Then $A gets the commits from $B that are after $X, then the commits from $A that were made after the branch point are replayed. At the end you get $A to look like it was branched off the HEAD of $B
10:16 szabgab stop it please, I beg you :-)
10:16 szabgab I read like 3 tutorials already
10:17 dam oh, then the only thing you are missing is screwing it up several times :)
10:17 szabgab and after that I managed to screw up another repository
10:17 dam keep going :)  this is how I learnt it
10:17 szabgab but only once so fa
10:18 szabgab let's do it on someone else repository :-)
10:18 jq szabgab: http://consttype.blogspot.com​/2008/10/git-on-rebasing.html
10:19 szabgab after git rebase master  I got a conflict
10:19 szabgab I hate it
10:19 szabgab why can't we just use a locking vcs :-)
10:20 jq szabgab: the 80s called, they want their vcs back
10:20 szabgab the 80 year olds?
10:21 szabgab ;)
10:21 Hyppolit svn: r10085 | waxhead++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10085
10:21 Hyppolit tag Padre-0.54
10:21 Hyppolit tags/
10:21 szabgab yeah 0.54! waxhead++
10:21 waxhead yep.. clean as this time...
10:23 szabgab jq,  so after   git rebase master     it tells me there was a conflict, after resolving run      git rebase --continue
10:23 szabgab can I trust it?
10:24 szabgab or shall I say    git rebase master --continue ?
10:25 dam szabgab: you "git add conflict/file/path" first, then git rebase --continue # no master, the current state is saved in .git/
10:26 jq you can trust it
10:26 jq git records the various branches you were working on
10:27 szabgab dam, it did not tell me to git add ...
10:28 dam git add tells it that you're done with the resolution
10:28 szabgab but when I run git rebase -continue then it tells me :-)
10:29 waxhead szabgab, can you pick up the file..?
10:29 szabgab doing so now
10:30 szabgab not good
10:30 szabgab why is the filename 054 and not 0.54 ?
10:30 szabgab and how could that happen?
10:30 waxhead szabgab, because I can't type...
10:30 waxhead use 0.54..
10:31 szabgab downloding now
10:32 jq url?
10:32 szabgab pip http://perlide.org/downloa​d/source/Padre-0.54.tar.gz
10:33 waxhead let me know if you hit any issues.. if none I'll upload to cpan
10:34 szabgab installing now
10:34 jq padre 0.54 on its way to mandriva buildsystem
10:35 szabgab all tests pass
10:36 Alias Testing...
10:37 szabgab how is that I did not have a problem with the future ?
10:40 Alias PASS
10:40 Alias Because he's on a fortuitous combination of settings
10:40 waxhead what future?
10:40 Alias It's somewhat random, depending on where files are written, saved, exported and packaged
10:41 Alias waxhead: Sometimes stuff I release gets timestamped in the future
10:41 Alias waxhead: Which tends to freak out make
10:41 waxhead that's a neat trick
10:42 Alias Usually because something somewhere in the chain isn't completely dealing with our GMT+11 right
10:42 Alias And with 15-20 hours to the US, it's particularly obvious
10:42 Alias I used to have to set my Windows time 2 days in the past to build strawberry
10:42 waxhead ok, Padre-0.54 has been uploaded to pause
10:43 szabgab waxhead++
10:44 szabgab and thanks for the translators as well !
10:44 waxhead yeah, we did well this time with the translations.. I'll use the next cycle to see if I can ping some of the previous translators to see if we can get a few more updated
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10:49 Hyppolit svn: r10086 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10086
10:49 Hyppolit enable error message when there is no comment character for the current document type
10:49 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
10:49 Hyppolit svn: r10087 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10087
10:49 Hyppolit move the menu_view_mimes function from the Padre::Document class to Padre::MimeTypes and fetch the list of all the mime-types now
10:49 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Menu/
10:49 Hyppolit svn: r10088 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10088
10:49 Hyppolit add Padre::Document::Config type to handle the commenting out of Apache Conf files
10:49 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Document/
10:49 Hyppolit svn: r10089 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10089
10:49 Hyppolit update Changes
10:49 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
10:49 szabgab waxhead, you missed the date in the Changes file :-)
10:49 waxhead ARGH!!!
10:50 waxhead bugger.
10:52 waxhead I'll fix that now..
10:52 waxhead szabgab, is your change you listed for 0.55 ?
10:52 Alias heh
10:52 * Alias has a specific test in his release.pl to make sure he hasn't overlooked the Changes file
10:52 szabgab yes, I waited for the release and pushed the changes now
10:52 Alias You might want to steal it
10:52 jq seems to pass
10:53 Hyppolit svn: r10090 | waxhead++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10090
10:53 Hyppolit So I forgot to do this before the 0.54 release... sigh!
10:53 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
10:53 szabgab using the new git-foo I learnt
10:53 Alias It wouldn't be the first time
10:53 waxhead Alias, add it to the release script..
10:53 Alias wxahead: It requires that the Changes file be formatted like mine are... I'm not sure they are
10:53 waxhead Alias, I've been getting up early and walking... so I'm tired at the end of the day.. :(
10:54 Alias But a simple test looking for "to be released" might work
10:54 * Alias & # food
10:54 waxhead Alias, ok.. I'll have a look adding something to the release script
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11:30 Alias Wow, the guys doing the sync project have certainly done quite a bit of work
11:30 waxhead what sync project?
11:31 waxhead oh.. that sync project...
11:31 Alias yeah
11:31 Alias BTW
11:31 waxhead that's pretty cool.. how did that come about
11:31 * Alias would love this model for our website
11:31 Alias http://www.openoffice.org/
11:31 Alias With the simple task-specific landing
11:32 waxhead that's nice
11:32 waxhead web design sucks
11:32 Alias It came about because some guys from UWO wanted to do a "real" open source project instead of a made up one
11:32 waxhead it's really painful
11:32 waxhead and I'm really bad at it
11:32 waxhead Alias, did they contact you?
11:32 Alias And since they do Perl stuff, and had discovered Padre, I guess they thought that Padre was sufficient not-finished for them to do something
11:33 Alias One of the two hangs out here
11:33 sjn 12:30 <@waxhead> what sync project?
11:33 Alias So we discussed for a while what job would be both significant, well known, and didn't have anyone doing it already
11:33 Alias So they could basically start from scratch and treat it as a full waterfall cycle
11:34 sjn URL?
11:34 Hyppolit svn: r10091 | waxhead++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10091
11:34 Hyppolit Added link to release post
11:34 Hyppolit trunk/template.padre.perlide.org/data/
11:34 Alias sjn: There isn't one
11:34 Alias I'm acting as their supervisor for the project, to their professor
11:34 Alias I've asked if we can publish everything as they go along, and it should be ok
11:34 waxhead cool...
11:35 Alias I'll publish the specs (or they will) once I'm done marking it
11:35 waxhead sjn, alias makes mention of it in his blog post about padre 2010
11:35 Alias I did
11:35 waxhead http://use.perl.org/~Alias/journal/40077
11:35 Alias oh wait
11:35 * Alias read that as s/makes/make/
11:36 waxhead right.. my job is done for the night..
11:38 Sewi waxhead: You missed something :-)
11:39 waxhead I'm gettin' old... can't handle too many late nights.. well it's all the early mornings.
11:39 waxhead Sewi, what???
11:39 Topic for #padreis now Latest Padre is 0.54, for installation see http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/Download | Log: http://perlide.org/irclogs/ and http://irclog.perlgeek.de/padre/today | Pasting: http://scsys.co.uk:8001
11:39 Sewi :-)
11:39 waxhead oh.. that's right.. thanks
11:39 Sewi yw
11:40 waxhead now i can go.. :)
11:44 waxhead night everyone
11:51 szabgab no mail announcement..
11:52 szabgab I'll send one
12:03 Alias Clearly we need a checklist :)
12:03 Alias Or a better one
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12:08 Sewi It's included in the Wiki page
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12:50 abraxxa is there a keyboard shortcut to decrease the indention of a selected block of line? like tab increases it but the other direction?
12:58 daxim shift+tab, unsurprisingly
13:13 Alias :)
13:17 abraxxa i tried all combination with shift, alt and ctrl...
13:17 abraxxa weird, didn't work in the file before, works in the one i tested now
13:17 abraxxa thanks
13:17 abraxxa maybe both should be added to the edit menu with the keyboard shortcut displayed
13:25 jq padre::plugin::perl6 doesn't work anymore since padre::debug doesn't exist anymore in padre 0.54
13:36 szabgab jq, I think I fixed that in svn but maybe have not released the fixed perl6 plugin?
13:37 szabgab abraxxa, I agree that we should have it somewhere in the menu system with its action to make it searchable
13:37 szabgab maybe you can write the patch ?
13:42 jq szabgab: it misses a release then
13:47 Hyppolit svn: r10092 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10092
13:47 Hyppolit update to version number 0.62 before release
13:47 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Perl6/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-Perl6/lib/Padre/Plugin/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-Perl6/lib/Padre/Plugin/Perl6/
13:48 szabgab hmm I cannot use the release.pl from the git-svn checout
13:50 Hyppolit svn: r10093 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10093
13:50 Hyppolit tag Padre-Plugin-Perl6-0.62
13:50 Hyppolit tags/
13:51 szabgab jq, 0.62 sent to pause
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14:01 mj41 Hi. Is PPI vs. UTF-8/Czech characters reported ... see http://tapir2.ro.vutbr.cz/​tmp/padre/padre-czech.bmp ?
14:01 Hyppolit Changeset #2 http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/2
14:03 szabgab mj41, not yet
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14:56 Alias PPI and unicode... eep
14:56 Alias We have something of a checkered relationship :)
14:57 Alias ah
14:57 Alias Looks like something is confusing bytes vs characters
14:57 Alias The positions reported by PPI are going to be character positions
15:05 * cmihai gives this locale business a spin.
15:05 Alias :)
15:05 Alias oh?
15:06 cmihai I guess I don't quite get the hang of it yet. Exported LANG, created and transalated a bit of stuff in a new .po, made a new build, though it's not picking it up.
15:06 cmihai I'm missing some vital clue here. Any idea where to clue up?
15:07 cmihai I did add a line to lib/Padre/Locale.pm too.
15:07 Sewi You're using the svn trunk and dev.pl to run Padre?
15:07 Alias Are you adding a new language?
15:07 cmihai yup
15:08 Alias Which one?
15:08 cmihai Just more curious about how this is supposed to work at this point.
15:08 cmihai ro_RO
15:08 Alias Romanian?
15:08 cmihai Yeah
15:08 Alias Neat
15:08 Alias Not as good as our long-desired Hindi translation, but still excellent
15:09 Alias <--- Wants to hit the magical "5 billion people can use Padre natively"
15:09 Alias Lack of an Indian translation makes that tricky :)
15:09 cmihai This only gets you like 23 million or something :-).
15:09 Alias True
15:09 Alias But it's Eastern Europe, and that means there's little software firms and stuff around
15:09 Alias So that's positive
15:10 Alias What fallback pattern are you going to use, out of curiosity?
15:11 Alias Straight to English?
15:11 Alias Or via Russian?
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15:11 Alias I guess if you are doing a translation straight up, it won't matter
15:11 cmihai Most of the buggers should know English and bits of French, Russian for the old timers
15:11 szabgab Alias showing his lack of geopolitics :-)
15:12 cmihai :-)
15:12 Alias szabgab, of all the places in the world that I'm utterly ignorant of geopolitics, eastern europe is by far the place the least relevant when you are in Australia :)
15:12 cmihai Oy :-). Anyway.
15:12 Alias heh
15:13 Alias So straight to English then
15:13 Alias Pity
15:13 cmihai To be honest I doubt anyone would actually use a localized versions, I'm yet to meet an it guy who doesn't speak English.
15:14 Alias That's not entirely the point though
15:14 Alias We do some interesting little tricks
15:14 Alias If you happen to have installed the local operating system in an official Romanian locale, we boot up in that locale automatically
15:15 Alias So if you start Padre on a Romanian computer, it SHOULD just immediately come up in the local language
15:15 cmihai Fair enough.
15:15 Alias That's the effect we want, anyway
15:15 Alias The reality is a little more mixed
15:15 Alias :)
15:15 Alias And the fallback strategies are interesting
15:15 daxim fall back to italian?  :p
15:15 Alias If you start Padre in Portugal, you get a Brazillian translation
15:16 cmihai http://pastie.org/770173
15:16 cmihai Anyway, I'm probably missing a few bits of info. Any page I can read up on those? Eg: at this point English comes up.
15:16 cmihai 0.54 ver btw.
15:16 * Alias points any anyone OTHER than the native english speaker that doesn't know crap about this .po stuff
15:17 szabgab locale?
15:17 Alias Alias points at...
15:17 cmihai LANG=ro_RO.utf8. mc for example comes up in Romanian.
15:17 szabgab Hyppolit, locale is http://padre.perlide.org/t​rac/wiki/TranslationIntro
15:17 Hyppolit locale was unknown
15:17 Hyppolit locale is now http://padre.perlide.org/t​rac/wiki/TranslationIntro
15:17 szabgab cmihai, try that link
15:17 cmihai Oh, you meant the bot. Fair enough.
15:18 Alias heh
15:18 Alias :)
15:19 szabgab cmihai, do you have the case of the file correctly?
15:19 cmihai And I edited Locale.pm and added it like Hungarian was added.
15:19 cmihai Case of the file?
15:19 szabgab oh , the file name is ro-ro.po right ?
15:20 szabgab in share/locale/
15:20 cmihai Yeah. I overkilled by putting it all over the place, ro.po, ro-ro.po :-). No luck.
15:20 szabgab have dev.pl  created the .mo file when you launched padre?
15:21 szabgab if you have an svn checkout of trunk/Padre
15:21 szabgab then it should be in the share/locale/  directory
15:21 cmihai I have dev.pl, that's what I use to start it.
15:21 cmihai Not sure what you mean by the .mo file.
15:22 szabgab and when you run dev.pl it should generate the share/locale/ro-ro.mo file based on the same .po file
15:22 szabgab it is the compiled version of the translatio
15:22 szabgab n
15:22 cmihai Ah, yeah, it's created.
15:22 cmihai Wasn't me :-). So I guess it did it.
15:23 cmihai Ah, it's empty.
15:23 szabgab there you have an issue
15:23 szabgab try to see the code of dev.pl where it generates the mo file
15:24 szabgab and run that from the command line to see what might be the problem
15:24 daxim if you were using a plain editor for the po file, you might have introduced a syntax error
15:24 cmihai Emacs :-)
15:24 cmihai Yeah, it's possible.
15:25 Alias Better to use one of the proper translation tools
15:25 daxim I assume it has got a mode for po?  if not, try Lokalize (KDE4)
15:25 Alias We even rejiggered the internals a bit to support the dedicated tools
15:26 cmihai Yup
15:27 cmihai I copied over a french translation and it works.
15:27 cmihai I guess I broke the syntax and failed to notice. Thanks ;-).
15:27 szabgab Alias, I recall there was a module to create a small cpan repository for testing - not CPAN::Mini but one that can create stuff on the fly
15:28 Alias szabgab, have a look through RJBS's search.cpan page
15:28 daxim or BDFOY
15:28 Alias Brian did the backpan stuff
15:28 szabgab CPAN::Faker
15:28 Alias But I think Rick did all the synthetic packaging/index/repo stuff
15:28 daxim MyCPAN-App-DPAN
15:29 szabgab rjbs
15:29 Alias Yeah, Faker
15:29 daxim too many ways to do it  :/
15:29 Alias That was it
15:29 cmihai I'll see if I can install Emacs po-mode or one of the other tools. I've been meaning to poke around with this translation business for a while now. Thanks again :-).
15:29 * Alias is starting to burn out on Aspect
15:30 Alias (and wants to maybe go back to hacking Padre again a bit more)
15:30 Alias Alas, major features left to implement in Aspect for $work
15:30 szabgab cmihai, I used poedit a bit
15:30 szabgab on ubuntu
15:30 szabgab it is simple and stupid
15:31 szabgab (can tell you there is a problem in a line but cannot show it, you have to go manually to the .po file and fix it)
15:32 cmihai szabgab: Oh. It looks pretty nice I guess.
15:35 cmihai Yup, I've got my translation working. Cool stuff :-).
15:49 szabgab cmihai, do you have an account on our trac?
15:52 cmihai szabgab: nope :-)
15:52 szabgab trac?
15:52 Hyppolit trac is http://padre.perlide.org/trac and also http://padre.perlide.org/trac/register
15:52 szabgab create one
15:52 szabgab so I can give you commit bit
15:54 abraxxa padre crashes on the second find in files every time
15:54 cmihai Done :-) username: cmihai
15:55 szabgab ok, you can commit your translation now
15:55 szabgab welcome to the Padre team :-)
15:56 bricas shouldn't http://perlide.org/translations/ be under padre.perlide.org specifically?
15:56 szabgab abraxxa, that's not good
15:56 szabgab bricas, yes it should
15:56 cmihai Thanks :-). I'll re-write it locally to get diacritics right first though. See your around.
15:56 szabgab one day when I am done with my other admin duties
15:56 * cmihai teleports home
15:57 szabgab cmihai, just commit
15:57 abraxxa szabgab: do you need anything from me or does it happen for you too?
15:57 szabgab and fix
15:57 szabgab and commit again
15:57 szabgab id does not happen to me
15:57 szabgab id/it
16:00 abraxxa i do a find in files and immediatly the same search again with the ack tab open
16:00 abraxxa the first two options in the search dialog are checked
16:01 szabgab abraxxa, please open a ticket
16:01 szabgab I don't really have time now to deal with Padre much
16:02 abraxxa it doesn't crash when there are no search results
16:03 szabgab bricas, I see you have not touched CPANHQ for a while
16:03 abraxxa doesn't happen now
16:03 bricas szabgab: *sigh* no.
16:04 szabgab do you have plans when?
16:06 bricas soon? :)
16:07 bricas we have a new logo, and a real designer who will be helping me this year (work started just before xmas)
16:08 szabgab I have started to work on CPAN::Forum again
16:09 szabgab err
16:09 szabgab what is [off] ?
16:10 bricas http://moritz.faui2k3.org/en/ilbot # see "privacy"
16:11 szabgab ah
16:11 szabgab but we have Hyppolit logging too
16:11 szabgab just the directories are read only now :-(
16:11 bricas i'm not too worried, really.
16:12 szabgab anyway, I am going to incorporate some CPAN search and other ideas in CPAN::Forum
16:12 szabgab something I was putting off for too long
16:15 bricas cool. :)
16:16 bricas schwern's gitpan stuff gives me some ideas for cpanhq, if i ever get coding on it :P
16:22 szabgab I hope I have some time for it now,  CPAN::Forum needed a fix for a long time and it still a lot of work
16:22 szabgab but at least I am writing tests now
16:29 Getty you got so much work szabgab
16:29 Getty actually its a wonder that you even earn money beside your perl stuff ;) (or dont you??? hehe)
16:29 szabgab no I don't
16:29 Getty how you life?
16:29 szabgab If I had work I would not have time to play with stuff
16:30 szabgab my wife works :-)
16:30 Getty LOL
16:30 Getty not really now?
16:30 Getty you are one of that dudes who sits in the house all day, getting paid by wife?
16:30 szabgab she really does
16:30 Getty unbelievable :)
16:30 Getty but still, even with your 24/7 timeslice you got too much todo
16:30 szabgab yes indeed
16:31 Getty let me take over Hyppolit :-P
16:31 szabgab and I freaking out because of that
16:31 Getty then one is gone, elsewhere i wait 6 months for testing new version
16:31 Getty we still want registration activation via bot
16:31 Getty ;)
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19:08 cmihai Hello again. I've got a patch for the ro_RO lang, it would be great if I could get a review to see if I've done things right. Locally it works though. Some things were a bit different from the wiki.
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19:14 cmihai http://aix.sytes.net:8888/10 the patch.
19:18 cmihai http://aix.sytes.net:8888/11 workflow I've used. Please let me know if I'm on to something or completly out of whack :-).
19:32 cmihai Can't open perl script "/home/gabor/worl/padre/trunk/Padr​e-Plugin-Perldoc/pom_starter.pl": - Perldoc plugin is a bit hardcoded too, but I guess you already know that :-).
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21:56 run4flat Hey folks, I've got some issues and I'm not quite sure where I should begin...
21:56 run4flat I should probably start by saying that I have Padre working on my laptop and it is wonderful
21:56 run4flat however, it's not working quite right on my desktop
21:57 run4flat I have reported problems in the past with screen flicker, and I figured it was a setup error...
21:57 run4flat so I nuked my /usr/lib/perl/... folder and re-installed everything from CPAN
21:57 run4flat now that problem's mostly gone
21:57 run4flat but, something is awry with my Help window
21:57 run4flat it's not formatting any of the text
21:58 run4flat I'm using Padre 0.53 at the moment
21:58 run4flat maybe an upgrade would fix the issue.
21:58 run4flat Anyway, I was wondering if anybody had any idea where I should start
22:01 run4flat I just noticed that Padre 0.54 is out, so I'm installing that now
22:01 run4flat but any ideas about where to look - assuming this continues - would be appreciated.
22:05 run4flat OK, I've installed Padre 0.54 and it's still a problem.
22:05 run4flat I'm guessing it's a messed-up installation, but I'm not sure what needs to be reinstalled
22:05 run4flat any ideas?
22:07 cmihai run4flat: you mean the text is all squished?
22:08 run4flat yep
22:08 cmihai Linux?
22:08 run4flat yes
22:09 cmihai Yeah. I've noticed that too with .53 and .54 on Linux. Help and stuff like that.
22:10 cmihai What Linux?
22:10 run4flat Thing is, it seems to be working fine on my laptop, which is pretty much identical - Ubuntu 9.10 and Padre 0.53 or 0.54
22:12 cmihai Try exporting the cpan -a module list or something
22:12 cmihai From one machine to the other.
22:12 run4flat ok, lemme see...
22:12 cmihai Or at least diff it.
22:13 run4flat well, I always figured I could get a list of every installed module, but never knew how
22:14 run4flat I'll try to compare them and see what we get
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22:21 run4flat Well, there are a lot of differences...
22:23 run4flat And Diff did a terrible job finding the differences for me
22:25 cmihai Put'em in an array and find the intersections. Then eliminate those :P
22:25 kthakore ho run4flat
22:25 kthakore hi
22:25 run4flat hello kthakore
22:25 kthakore run4flat: sup! I have something to show you!
22:25 kthakore run4flat: direct write to memory from perl
22:25 run4flat should I hop over to #sdl?
22:25 run4flat ooh
22:25 kthakore run4flat: yup
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22:26 run4flat cmihai - I'll see what I can do.  :)
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23:28 run4flat left #padre
23:45 Hyppolit svn: r10094 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/10094
23:45 Hyppolit A little minor cleanup before trying to link in the new config_perlcritic setting
23:46 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-PerlCritic/lib/Padre/Plugin/

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