Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #padre, 2010-08-30

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Time Nick Message
00:06 chorny Padre tests fail in Strawberry Portable
00:16 Alias That is expectefd
00:17 Alias which ones?
00:21 chorny http://perl.pastebin.com/4AXhyqbv
00:21 chorny t/14-warnings.t
00:22 chorny I asked him to try to skip tests. Padre works, but "However, when you press F5 to run the Perl script this doesn't work"
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02:41 * Alias_ waves
02:42 Alias_ FYI, I'm back from my trip and continueing to try to finish the new directory tree
02:42 Alias_ continuing
02:45 Alias_ Would anyone be opposed to me removing the splash screen by default?
02:46 Alias_ It's really not showing for very long any more, and pre-loading the image drivers is probably wasting memory
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03:24 asarch Have you ever build Padre on OpenBSD?
03:24 asarch It seems that OpenBSD Perl doesn't support threads
03:34 Alias_ Then it's not going to work, Padre needs threads
03:35 Alias_ Although the new Task API is built so that alternative backends are at least possible
03:35 Alias_ Someone would need to build an alternative task manager that supported processes
03:35 Alias_ (somehow)
03:35 Alias_ Or we need a private Perl build on OpenBSD
03:41 Alias_ Some kind of /opt/padre with it's own Perl built in, Strawberry Professional style
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04:17 asarch I even try enabling "THREADED_PERL=true" in /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/perl/Makefile.bsd-wrapper
04:17 asarch And doing the "cd /usr/src && make build"
04:17 asarch But it fails
04:18 asarch My log: http://openbsd.pastebin.com/JWt74MjD
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05:28 Alias_ asarch: You might need to take this to #p5p
05:28 asarch Thank you very much Alias_
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09:38 Hyppolit svn: r12398 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12398
09:38 Hyppolit Added tracing to Padre::Locker specifically to report on exceptions that are thrown (and ignored) during method_decrement post-lock behaviours
09:38 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
09:40 Hyppolit svn: r12399 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12399
09:40 Hyppolit Change Padre::Cache to use methods, for cleanliness.
09:40 Hyppolit Trying to fix second-order issues in the directory tree.
09:40 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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10:10 Sewi Alias_: What about adding a "refresh" menu option to the right-click-menu of directories in the directory browser for rescanning just the current selected directory?
10:13 Alias__ I'm going to make it automatic
10:14 Alias__ In a future Wx.pm release, it will support directory nofication
10:14 Alias__ So it makes sense to do a time-based rescan in the short term, and then switch to notifier for 2 of the 3 platforms later
10:15 daxim File::ChangeNotify
10:16 Alias__ daxim: ->wait_for_events blocks the event loop
10:16 Alias__ You need something similar, but integrated into Wx (or else you burn an entire thread just for the watcher, which is a possibility too)
10:17 Alias__ Our threads are a lot lighter than they used to be, but I haven't yet added support for permanent services in the TaskManager thread accounting yet
10:18 Alias__ Sewi: Would you be ok with me removing the splash screen?
10:18 Sewi I like it and it covers the time until Padre starts.
10:18 Sewi You want to init WX later?
10:19 Alias__ Partly it doesn't work right on Unix, partly it should reduce the memory loaded before the thread spawn, which should reduce the per-thread costs more
10:20 Alias__ For me the time before Padre starts is currently way down
10:20 Alias__ 2 seconds or so
10:20 Alias__ Compared to Eclipse and IDEA, our final load is faster than their splash screen load
10:21 Alias__ BTW, get this
10:21 Sewi Remove it if it safes speed and memory
10:21 Alias__ The longest part of our startup is the one second timeout on socket connect to the non-existant single instance server
10:22 Alias__ If I could find a way to drop that to a quarter of a second, we'd almost double the startup speed
10:24 El_Che Alias__: I guess it took you a lot of work getting the threads fast? Last time I compared threads were a *lot* slower than forking
10:24 Sewi If we really want the splash back, we could add another really lightweigt process for the splash which exits after the splash is no longer needed
10:24 Alias__ That may well still be the case
10:25 Alias__ Sewi: Or use platform-specific way lower level APIs
10:25 Alias__ El_Che: They are still fairly expensive, they are just minimally expensive
10:25 Sewi Remove the splash if it improves speed and memory.
10:25 Alias__ 0.1 to 0.2 seconds per spawn
10:26 Alias__ Plus, the thread spawns themselves also happen in a thread
10:26 Alias__ So they don't block the main thread
10:26 Alias__ Which means when Padre needs a new worker, it doesn't block
10:26 Alias__ There's more wins ahead too
10:26 Alias__ If we get the stripped down Wx loader, we win even more
10:29 El_Che WOW
10:30 Alias__ It's taken no small amount of invention though
10:30 Alias__ Accumulated work of several people
10:31 Alias__ And at the end of the day, we're still not going to be faster than AnyEvent or Erlang, or even forking (on Unix with COW support)
10:32 Alias__ But at least now the cost is low enough that it doesn't matter in something as heavy as an IDE
10:32 Alias__ And it doesn't need to block
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12:47 Hyppolit svn: r12400 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12400
12:47 Hyppolit Save and restore the directory tree state as we move back and forth between projects
12:47 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Directory/
12:54 Hyppolit svn: r12401 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12401
12:54 Hyppolit Noting directory tree improvements
12:54 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
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13:25 jq Alias__: have you checked what i implemented wrt my_dist_config()? what about a 0.92_03 release?
13:26 Alias__ I'll take a look
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13:50 Hyppolit svn: r12402 | zenogantner++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12402
13:50 Hyppolit LaTeX plugin: update TODO file
13:50 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-LaTeX/
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14:38 Hyppolit svn: r12403 | zenogantner++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12403
14:38 Hyppolit wider KeyBindings dialog s.t. German translation is displayed nicer
14:38 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
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15:06 Hyppolit svn: r12404 | zenogantner++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12404
15:06 Hyppolit Shell Script plugin: comment support, added
15:06 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-ShellScript/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-ShellScript/lib/Padre/Document/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-ShellScript/lib/Padre/Plugin/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-ShellScript/t/
15:07 Hyppolit svn: r12405 | zenogantner++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12405
15:07 Hyppolit Updated German translation
15:07 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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15:35 Hyppolit #911: Syntax check results should be shown by underlining (new enhancement) [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/911#comment:1 ]
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16:16 dapatrick t/91-vi.t just failed 16/16 tests.
16:16 dapatrick Is this known?
16:17 Sewi no failures here
16:17 Sewi which OS?
16:17 dapatrick Linux.
16:19 Sewi Me too, Ubuntu 10.something
16:19 Sewi 10.04.1
16:20 Sewi Anything more than just "fail"?
16:20 dapatrick Hmm. "Parse errors: Bad plan.  You planned 16 tests but ran 0."
16:21 dapatrick Weird:
16:21 dapatrick darianp@esteban:~/workspace/Padre$ perl -c t/91-vi.t
16:21 dapatrick Segmentation fault
16:21 Sewi Looks like something running badly wrong.
16:21 Sewi make clean; perl Makefile.PL && make test
16:21 dapatrick Just did that.
16:22 * Sewi updating...
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16:23 Sewi No errors, too.
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16:25 Sewi ping szbalint
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16:25 dapatrick So, I did make test again, got a Wx symbol location error and then a kernel freeze/crash.
16:26 Sewi bad
16:26 dapatrick And I had just installed an Ubuntu update to libwxwidgets.
16:26 dapatrick I'm doing to make test again and see if I crash.
16:26 Sewi Alias did something to the Wx loading earlier today.
16:26 dapatrick Then I'm going to rebuild Wx.
16:26 Sewi But I don't really thing it should cause something like this
16:26 dapatrick (the Perl mod)
16:27 dapatrick Yeah, no.
16:27 szbalint Hyppolit: sz?
16:27 dapatrick I think it's related to my Ubuntu update.
16:27 szbalint hm.
16:27 dapatrick Okay, here I go.
16:27 Sewi szbalint: I was looking for you this time :-)
16:27 szbalint oh :p
16:27 Sewi You did WWW::Curl?
16:27 szbalint yes, still do.
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16:28 Sewi sorry with disturbing you about it here, but is there _any_ chance to get the libcurl version info?
16:29 Sewi Seems client certificates don't run with gnutls but with openssl and I want to add a check before others (or I somewhere in the future) also waste hours on this problem :-)
16:29 Sewi Add a check to my module which also might go to CPAN.
16:30 szbalint sure, just use version()
16:30 szbalint that's what I'm doing in t/08ssl.t
16:30 Sewi thanks. I tried curl_version and curl_version_info but didn't make it to version :-)
16:31 szbalint if you need an example :)
16:31 Sewi Just tried it and it works.
16:31 Sewi szbalint++
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16:32 Sewi download?
16:32 Hyppolit download is http://padre.perlide.org/download.html
16:32 Sewi sz?
16:32 Hyppolit sz is http://www.flickr.com/photos/szbalint/3812328050/
16:32 Sewi Hyppolit: sz?
16:32 Sewi Seems he doesn't like to be addressed :-)
16:32 szbalint direct addressing doesn't work yeah :)
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16:32 szbalint Sewi: what does your module do?
16:33 Sewi It's an merchant API for a prepaid card service.#
16:33 szbalint cool. :)
16:33 Sewi I'm still fighting with them to allow me to publish it.
16:33 Sewi www.cash-ticket.com
16:35 Hyppolit svn: r12406 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12406
16:35 Hyppolit browse_message calls now (sort of) overlay existing directory listing... but not very well, and it often breaks
16:35 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Directory/ trunk/Padre/t/
16:35 szbalint lately I'm getting more and more feedback for WWW::Curl. That's great :)
16:36 Alias__ I didn't touch the Wx loading
16:36 Alias__ But I'm about to
16:36 Sewi You should ask them to add it to the libcurl API list on http://curl.haxx.se/libcurl/
16:37 Sewi Alias_: Sorry, didn't follow your commits exactly enough to know if you were done or not.
16:37 Alias__ I haven't been working on it
16:37 Alias__ I've been fiddling with the directory tree
16:39 Hyppolit svn: r12407 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12407
16:39 Hyppolit - The startup splash is now disabled by default. Padre starts up very
16:39 Hyppolit quickly these days, and delaying image loading should reduce the
16:39 Hyppolit per-thread memory cost more (ADAMK)
16:39 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
16:39 Alias__ There you go :)
16:40 Alias__ Righto, to bed for me now
16:41 szbalint Sewi: it's there: http://curl.haxx.se/libcurl/perl/
16:41 Alias__ I'll continue bashing on the directory tree tomorrow, my brain has run out of juice
16:42 Sewi szbalint: oh, sorry, I looked at the API parts.
16:42 chorny Padre 0.69 startup = ~20 seconds on my slow computer. First run from reboot, second was ~10 seconds
16:43 Alias__ chorny: If you would wrap NYTPRof around that and work out where it all is, that would be awesome
16:43 dapatrick Okay, I just needed to rebuild Wx after that Ubuntu update.
16:44 El_Che lo
16:44 El_Che dapatrick: I had those crashes a long time ago
16:44 El_Che also on ubuntu
16:44 chorny Alias_: I'll try when I get free time with clear mind
16:44 El_Che was impressed to get a kernel freeze running a make test as a regular user
16:45 dapatrick Ha. Me too.
16:45 El_Che If I recall correctly it was when testing utf8 charsets
16:45 dapatrick Very straing.
16:45 dapatrick s/straing/strange/
16:45 dapatrick For me it was just after an attempt to load Wx.
16:46 El_Che I tried the same thing on an other computer and no prob. Redo the thing in the affected one and zoof: freeze
16:50 El_Che running it before and after the ubuntu wx upgrade
16:51 El_Che before is ok (this was the affected computer)
16:53 El_Che Wx loading gives an error
16:53 El_Che the first test
16:53 El_Che and makes the computer slow
16:53 dapatrick Same thing I saw.
16:54 El_Che no freeze yet, but it sounds similar
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16:54 El_Che cpu and ram usage through the rood
16:56 El_Che dapatrick: what do you mean with rebuil Wx? Wx.pm?
16:56 dapatrick Yep, Wx.pm
16:57 El_Che ok, thx
16:57 dapatrick I cpan look'ed Wx and rebuilt.
17:02 El_Che it passes the WX test, indeed
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17:53 blakew hi - when I set "use lib" with FindBin for module paths Padre thinks $FindBin::Bin is /tmp
17:54 blakew under settings -> run parameters -> current document it shows the correct path to the script however
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18:09 joerg hi there
18:10 joerg i've a problem
18:11 joerg i've tried to install padre on ubuntu 9.04 ... mean "download and setup local::lib (  http://search.cpan.org/dist/local-lib/ )" = cpan install local::lib
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18:31 blakew ..is there a recommended way of getting use lib + FindBin to work in Padre?
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18:36 blakew when I add the lib directory to current document's interpreter args with -I I still get a "Can't locate in @INC" error
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18:44 Hyppolit svn: r12408 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12408
18:44 Hyppolit links to Padre talk at YAPC::EU 2010
18:44 Hyppolit trunk/template.padre.perlide.org/data/
18:47 szabgab blakew: try setting @INC in a begin block?
18:47 szabgab BEGIN block
18:48 szabgab or set PERL5LIB before launching Padre
18:49 rindolf Hi all.
18:49 szabgab I guess running the script using F5 works well but the syntax checker not
18:49 szabgab as it saves the file in the /tmp dir
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18:54 blakew thanks szabgab- the @INC trick doesn't work with FindBin for the syntax checker either (same issue with /tmp)
18:54 blakew When I set -I switch under Preferences for the script to the absolute path of the lib directory, that doesn't seem to have any effect
18:55 blakew Run Parameters -> Current Document -> Interpreter arguments
18:57 blakew the path I give doesn't show up in the @INC error message
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19:05 blakew ok, I guess run parameters only apply to F5, not syntax checker. Is this intentional?
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19:05 chorny blakew: IMHO, yes
19:07 blakew i guess my only option then is either absolute paths or PERL5LIB?
19:07 blakew (to get syntax checking)
19:10 blakew my issue is I develop on different machines with different paths to localized ./lib directories
19:12 Sewi Sorry, but we didn't find a smart solution for this :-(
19:16 blakew what about an option to have the syntax checker use the run parameters?
19:21 Sewi Won't work - because the temporary file for syntax checking is created in a temp dir (/tmp or C:\temp usually).
19:22 Sewi perl -Ilib won't work there.
19:22 Sewi We can't create a file in the project dir because it might be remote and non-executable (or non-readable by perl -c)
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19:25 blakew thanks Sewi
19:26 Sewi There is a ticket for this.
19:27 Sewi But we didn't get a smart, always-working solution until now.
19:27 Sewi Is it possible to run perl inside Perl?
19:28 Hyppolit svn: r12409 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12409
19:28 Hyppolit improve Perl 6 coloring
19:28 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Perl6/lib/Padre/Plugin/Perl6/
19:28 Sewi Pass a $source variable to the perl library?
19:30 Sewi (with -c set)
19:37 Hyppolit svn: r12410 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/12410
19:37 Hyppolit try to answer the worries of zenogantner about the command line thingy
19:37 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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