Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #padre, 2011-08-23

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:19 dj_goku Is there a way to change which perl version padre executes with?
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02:27 Hyppolit svn: r15752 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15752
02:27 Hyppolit finished
02:27 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/xt/
03:21 Hyppolit svn: r15753 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15753
03:21 Hyppolit - Task owners can now hijack status bar messages if they wish to (ADAMK)
03:21 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Role/
04:25 Hyppolit svn: r15754 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15754
04:25 Hyppolit Better debugging messages
04:25 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/xt/
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06:27 Hyppolit svn: r15755 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15755
06:27 Hyppolit Moved log bootstrapping to Padre::Wx::App
06:27 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Role/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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07:13 Hyppolit svn: r15756 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15756
07:13 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
07:13 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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08:28 Hyppolit svn: r15757 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15757
08:28 Hyppolit - The task manager can now run without the need for threads. However,
08:28 Hyppolit every task will block the foreground and makes Padre unusable, so this
08:28 Hyppolit feature is reserved for profiling Padre's performance (ADAMK)
08:28 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/xt/
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08:39 El_Che fighting with a upstram broken perl 5.14.* on solaris
08:40 El_Che for now we are stuck with 5.12.*
08:55 bowtie Alias, cool, how do we switch Padre in to non-threaded mode?
08:55 Alias You can't
08:56 Alias At the moment, you need to manually create your own task manager instance
08:56 bowtie Alias, will padre now run on Perl built without threads?
08:57 Alias Nope
08:57 Alias See where it says what the feature is reserved for?
08:57 bowtie Alias, profiling
08:58 Alias right
08:58 Alias So it's just for that
08:59 bowtie Alias, a work around to the profilers dislike of threads :)
08:59 Alias right
08:59 bowtie cool
08:59 Alias It runs background jobs in the foreground
08:59 Alias So it will be unbelievably hangy
09:00 Alias Especially on things like syntax checker
09:00 Alias I'm actually going to remove the config setting entirely, since we're really lying atm about not needing threads
09:01 bowtie I get confused easily :)
09:06 Hyppolit svn: r15758 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15758
09:06 Hyppolit Removed a method call
09:06 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
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09:48 sugar hello
09:48 Alias hi
09:48 sugar what is URL that shows localization of Padre to different languages?
09:49 sugar can't find it
09:49 sugar in percentage
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10:15 Hyppolit # 1261 :  grey lines when scrolling in Ubuntu 11.04 (new defect) by Sewi  [ http://padre.perlide.org/t​rac/ticket/1261#comment:1 ]
10:17 Hyppolit # 1297 :  Ubuntu Natty: default font is not monospaced (new defect) by Sewi  [ http://padre.perlide.org/t​rac/ticket/1297#comment:1 ]
10:18 Hyppolit svn: r15759 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15759
10:18 Hyppolit add some comments
10:18 Hyppolit comment out unused code
10:18 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Patch/lib/Padre/Plugin/Patch/
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11:02 szabgab sugar: http://perlide.org/translations/
11:03 sugar thanks, i found it =)
11:12 Hyppolit svn: r15760 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15760
11:12 Hyppolit Add test case for task manager running without threads
11:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/t/
11:18 Hyppolit svn: r15761 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15761
11:18 Hyppolit Yield before we close to give a chance for child thread events to be caught
11:18 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
11:21 Hyppolit svn: r15762 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15762
11:21 Hyppolit Document steps in the task handler, and add a $SIG{STOP} handler for any threads::kill(STOP) signals in case the parent wants to stop us in a BIG hurry.
11:21 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
11:22 Hyppolit svn: r15763 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15763
11:22 Hyppolit Spawn threads in void context, try to avoid leaving copies of variables around so hopefully we CLONE a bit less.
11:22 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
11:28 Hyppolit svn: r15764 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15764
11:28 Hyppolit Now that we can start new threads asynchronously in the background, remove the concept of a minimum number of workers. It will be just as quick to delay till they are needed.
11:28 Hyppolit Remove the ->threads accessor, as we don't want to hint that it's possible to run Padre without threads (until it is later)
11:28 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
11:33 submersible_toaster Alias: are messages supposed to be arriving @ the child with  : shared attribute ???
11:33 Alias I don't believe so
11:33 Alias From memory, when you add something to the queue it clones it
11:33 Alias Unless you add something already : shared to it
11:33 Alias Which is how we pass the queue down other queues
11:34 submersible_toaster as a storable string right
11:34 submersible_toaster that is just bizarre
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11:35 Alias Yup
11:36 Alias I cook a storable string, throw it into the shared queue, where it should be copied
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12:02 Hyppolit svn: r15765 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15765
12:02 Hyppolit Oops spelling
12:02 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Patch/lib/Padre/Plugin/Patch/
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12:28 bowtie Alias, you are aware that Project Tools and Document Tools are in cahoots with each other, neither of there sub views are working at present, I trust this is in part a side affect to your new improved task manager :)
12:28 Alias works for me
12:28 Alias But give me a minute to finish some things
12:29 Hyppolit svn: r15766 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15766
12:29 Hyppolit We now join the worker threads instead of having them detach.
12:29 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
12:30 Alias OK
12:30 Alias Try now, does Padre work for you?
12:31 submersible_toaster all borken here
12:32 Alias curious
12:32 Alias Now try with -t on
12:32 bowtie Alias, now todo works, cool, I presume the others will follow suite later :)
12:32 submersible_toaster works
12:32 submersible_toaster it seems
12:32 Alias fuck
12:33 submersible_toaster I think u have a TRACE( shift) if DEBUG someplace dummy
12:33 * submersible_toaster slaps Alias
12:33 bowtie Alias, -t and all is well :)
12:33 Alias oh!
12:34 Alias wow, that one needs a badcode
12:34 Hyppolit svn: r15767 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15767
12:34 Hyppolit oops
12:34 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
12:35 Alias Right, there we go
12:36 Alias submersible_toaster, now nothing will detach and there's a 10/sec sweep over joinable threads at the end of main window shutdown sequence
12:37 Alias The dying workers don't notify of their death still, so that won't help anything dying in the middle of something
12:37 Alias But hey, it's hopefully better
12:37 bowtie Alias, back to normal, if only I new what normal was :)
12:39 bowtie submersible_toaster, I hope svn info was helpful?
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13:01 Alias I think I'm going to have to get addicted to the new Dues Ex
13:01 Alias One minor advantage of being called Adam is that game designers seem to love using it for main characters
13:02 Alias So every now and then I get to play something awesome that talks to me directly :)
13:27 Alias Well I'll be a monkey's uncle
13:27 Alias So I've managed to get the per-thread cost down to about 16meg
13:28 Alias But couldn't make any more headway
13:28 Alias Just discovered that 16meg is the win32 minimum stack size
13:28 Alias Now 1) I don't even know what stack size f'ing means
13:28 Alias But 2) Now I know how to reduce the thread cost more
13:41 Alias aha!
13:41 Alias It's definitely bounded by stack size
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14:56 Hyppolit svn: r15768 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15768
14:56 Hyppolit - The setting threads_stacksize config options allows the tuning of the
14:56 Hyppolit thread stack size. On Win32 the default is halved to 8meg (ADAMK)
14:56 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/t/
15:01 Hyppolit svn: r15769 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15769
15:01 Hyppolit This test appears to be superfluous
15:01 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/xt/
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15:13 Hyppolit svn: r15770 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15770
15:13 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
15:13 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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15:52 Hyppolit svn: r15771 | adamk++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/15771
15:52 Hyppolit Drop Win32 stack size down to 4meg
15:52 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
16:05 bowtie szabgab, is this plugin still valid, Padre::Plugin::CommandLine.
16:05 bowtie Am I correct in assuming this is now in trunk, accessed via View -> Show Command line.
16:05 bowtie If this is the case how should the Plugin be identified?
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16:22 Alias If it's a suitable clean port, the plugin could be deprecated
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16:23 bowtie Alias, that's the question? if so how many more dose this apply to?
16:23 Alias Probably a few
16:24 bowtie Alias, is our vcs able to have a  deprecated code section?
16:24 Alias You just delete it
16:25 Alias https://fisheye2.atlassian.com/chart/padre/trunk
16:25 Alias Expand trunk there and you can see all the deleted directories
16:25 bowtie But it might be good to keep so as to inspire future plug-in developers
16:26 Alias I doubt it
16:26 Alias Most of the old plugins at this point are pretty stale
16:27 bowtie you are being nice :)
16:29 bowtie Alias, how is stack size on other os ?
16:29 Alias No idea, not my area
16:29 Alias I leave that to those with more expertise
16:29 Alias I'm just happy to be consuming less than 16meg per thread :)
16:30 bowtie any one would have thought ram was expensive :)
16:37 Alias Depends how many threads you want
16:37 Alias I've got 4 cpus and I'd like to keep them all busy
16:38 Alias The cheaper your overheads the more actual work you can do in whatever memory is available
16:38 Alias And that ram allocation is different in different places
16:38 Alias You know use Padre; uses less ram than use MooseX::Declare;
16:39 bowtie that dose not surprise me
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18:36 daGrizz ?? to Padre gurus: doc says to use "Run/Setup" menu to set command line. Problem to solve: what is correct method to set command line arg's?
18:37 El_Che In preferences
18:37 El_Che but good point
18:39 daGrizz tx, will look there. being newbie to Padre, unsure of procedure to correct/extend doc's: is it doc'd somewhere?
18:41 El_Che you mean the docs on the website?
18:42 daGrizz aye
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18:42 El_Che it's on an svn server
18:42 daGrizz pretty sure if i couldn't figure it out, someone else will have same prob
18:43 El_Che stick around, szabgab is the man with the keys
18:43 El_Che you can create a ticket with the changes of he can have a look for access
18:43 daGrizz excellent!, k.tx x2++
18:45 daGrizz l8r, all, we gone! ->poof
18:53 dj_goku Can I change which perl padre executes scripts with?
18:57 dj_goku I set run_perl_cmd to the perlbrew/bin/perl path but wildperl padre 0.90 isn't executing the script when I press F5.
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19:14 szabgab bowtie: I don't rememebr the status of those two command line things but as far as I recall they served different purposes
19:15 szabgab dj_goku: are you talking about Padre on OSX?
19:15 dj_goku szabgab: yes
19:16 szabgab last time I tried switching perls was a few weeks ago and only on linux, it worked there
19:16 bowtie szabgab, they have your name against them, they both seam to be Vi-ish, ie support e and w, and like a leading colon :)
19:17 szabgab dj_goku: but now I cannot seem to set it , checking more
19:17 szabgab bowtie: that part I remembered
19:17 dj_goku szabgab: you want me to put in a bug?
19:17 szabgab just not the details
19:18 bowtie szabgab, don't get me wrong. I like the idea of developing Plugins -> feature -> trunk, but what do we do with the code from the original plugin, that's all
19:18 szabgab dj_goku: that would be good but let's see what is the problem?
19:18 szabgab bowtie: leave it there for now
19:19 szabgab dj_goku: for me, if I set the run_perl_cmd in the advanced prefs, and then reopen the advanced prefs I don't see the value
19:19 bowtie szabgab, but as I work through the plug-ins, it is a wast of time if it is already incorporated in the trunk :(
19:19 dj_goku szabgab: so I write a test script and I want to execute it and I press F5 nothing launches nothing seems to happen. This is with 0.88/0.90 mac OSX.
19:20 szabgab dj_goku: try: Tools -> Preferences -> Language-Perl5 -> Perl Interpreter
19:20 dj_goku szabgab: right I changed that too /Users/dj_goku/perl5/perlbrew/perl​s/perl-5.14.1-usethreads/bin/perl
19:20 bowtie szabgab, I can see that it's good to have a reference from a historical point of view
19:20 szabgab dj_goku: try running padre from the command line and see if something is printed there
19:22 dj_goku works there.
19:22 dj_goku using pperl
19:22 szabgab err, setting run_perl_cmd, is now working for me too, was user error
19:23 szabgab dj_goku: what "works there"?
19:24 dj_goku how do I run padre from CLI?
19:24 szabgab I guess there is some kind of a padre executable somewhere? but I don't know where
19:25 szabgab I mean I don't know where it is in your installation
19:25 dj_goku I mean I see padre/pperl in
19:25 dj_goku but I don't know how you want me to execute something on CLI.
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19:28 bowtie szabgab, ok the 64 million dollar question, if command line is not fully functional, should it not be removed from trunk and development continue as a Plugin, until such time it is fit to be in Padre 1.0
19:32 szabgab dj_goku: normally I would just type     padre ENTER
19:32 szabgab but that assumes the directory is the PATH
19:32 szabgab if it is noth there then you might neet to type  some/path/to/padre  ENTER
19:33 dj_goku right which launches padre, but that is fine. when I say execute a script like #!/usr/bin/perl print "Hello world\n"; nothing happens not shell starts up and runs the script.
19:47 dj_goku szabgab: I can take a quick video of what I am doing.
19:49 dj_goku bbiab
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22:46 bowtie Alias_, information only, enjoy
22:46 bowtie Ubuntu natty (11.04) say threads->get_stack_size(); => 0,
22:46 bowtie ulimit -a => stack size (kbytes, -s) 8192
23:14 bowtie Alias_, Q how will Padre behave on a Perl version below 5.12.1 with the socket modifications.
23:31 bowtie Oops scoket -> stack size

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