Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #padre, 2011-10-01

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Time Nick Message
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03:12 Hyppolit svn: r16588 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16588
03:12 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
03:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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06:23 Hyppolit svn: r16589 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16589
06:23 Hyppolit Move sprintf() out of Wx::gettext() to fix translatability
06:23 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Document/Perl/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
06:31 Hyppolit svn: r16590 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16590
06:31 Hyppolit Load Sort::Versions only if necessary
06:31 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
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07:12 Hyppolit svn: r16591 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16591
07:12 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
07:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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07:46 bowtie gm
08:25 Hyppolit svn: r16592 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16592
08:25 Hyppolit Document: make 'encoding' property public
08:25 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/
08:26 Hyppolit svn: r16593 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16593
08:26 Hyppolit new_document_from_string now accepts an optional encoding
08:26 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
08:29 Hyppolit svn: r16594 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16594
08:29 Hyppolit new_document_from_string: update doc
08:29 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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09:13 Hyppolit svn: r16595 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16595
09:13 Hyppolit Fix encoding of the Perl filter user code
09:13 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
09:18 Hyppolit svn: r16596 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16596
09:18 Hyppolit comment out un-needed dependency
09:18 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
09:23 dolmen bowtie: if it is unneeded, remove it completely
09:24 bowtie dolmen, thanks, I was going to do it in 2 passes :)
09:24 bowtie next time i will just do one pass :)
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09:47 Hyppolit svn: r16597 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16597
09:47 Hyppolit tidy-up, remove unwanted comments
09:47 Hyppolit added two composed methods
09:47 Hyppolit add a test file
09:47 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/ trunk/Padre/t/
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10:07 Hyppolit svn: r16598 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16598
10:07 Hyppolit PerlFilter fixes:
10:07 Hyppolit - specify source encoding
10:07 Hyppolit - use a sandbox package to avoid letting the user pollute the PerlFilter package
10:07 Hyppolit - when "$_ for both" is selected, really use $_ as output
10:07 Hyppolit - compile the user source only once for map/grep instead of at each line: the
10:07 Hyppolit user code is wrapped in a sub
10:07 Hyppolit - fail at the first error in user code at run time
10:08 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
10:24 Hyppolit svn: r16599 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16599
10:24 Hyppolit add test for image used by About
10:24 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/t/
10:30 Hyppolit svn: r16600 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16600
10:30 Hyppolit Update french translation.
10:30 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
10:43 Hyppolit svn: r16601 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16601
10:43 Hyppolit "Smart" translation for Padre is deprecated because it is a bad idea.
10:43 Hyppolit So fix the default setting to use only full string translation.
10:43 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-FormBuilder​/lib/Padre/Plugin/FormBuilder/
10:45 Hyppolit svn: r16602 | dolmen++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16602
10:45 Hyppolit Fix end-of-line consistency in Changes
10:45 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-FormBuilder/
10:49 bowtie dolmen, do you want me to regenerate About and Patch dialogs for you to test against?
10:50 bowtie or are you going to re-gen them all ?
10:50 dolmen it looks like it has already been done
10:51 dolmen unless you did commit some lately?
10:51 dolmen with the default "Smart translation" setting?
10:52 bowtie dolmen, they were against smart, not Naive
10:52 dolmen So, please regenerate
10:52 bowtie which was the default
10:52 bowtie ok will do
10:53 dolmen Anyway, the About is severely broken. But this requires a FBP::Perl fix for unicode support.
10:53 dolmen half of the names of the developers have non-ascii characters and FBP::Perl doesn't support that at the moment
10:54 dolmen (and FBP::Perl should also to mark some strings as non-translatable)
10:55 dolmen s/also to/also allow to/
10:56 bowtie dolmen, I am aware that FBP::Perl is acting like a Gutenberg press, a-z and A-Z :)
10:56 dolmen my name is "Olivier Mengué" and that bothers me.
10:56 bowtie the main purpose was to use a Dialog and remove the html display
10:57 bowtie I accept that, but I did not impose this limitation, sorry
11:02 Hyppolit svn: r16603 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16603
11:02 Hyppolit re-gen Patch dialog
11:02 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/FBP/
11:02 bowtie dolmen, I have just re-gen locally no changes to About, but Patch uploaded for you :)
11:12 Hyppolit svn: r16604 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16604
11:12 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
11:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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11:31 Hyppolit svn: r16605 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16605
11:31 Hyppolit tweak, make composed methods private
11:31 Hyppolit update test file accordingly
11:31 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/ trunk/Padre/t/
11:33 bowtie dolmen, info, when I tried to use charters like "é" FBP::Perl failed to gen and just left a blank space
11:33 dolmen yes, I tried that too
11:33 dolmen bowtie: https://rt.cpan.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=71377
11:35 bowtie dolmen, About could be changed to make every name dynamic and pre-load before display, but heck it's static data, so should be in dialog,
11:36 bowtie Alias, when is FBP::Perl going to support extended charters so as to appease our translators?
11:36 dolmen this is dynamically done anyway due to how FBP::Perl creates code
11:38 bowtie I concur, It also strips leading spaces as well,
11:41 bowtie dolmen, can we overload in P-P-FormBuilder-FBP.pm
11:42 bowtie Opps s/FBP.pm/Perl.pm/
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13:33 Hyppolit # 1338 :  Opening a File not in Project kills Padre (new defect) [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/1338 ]
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15:12 Hyppolit svn: r16606 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16606
15:12 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
15:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
17:20 Hyppolit svn: r16607 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16607
17:20 Hyppolit some more tweaks
17:20 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/FBP/
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17:25 tome howdy all
17:26 bowtie tome, hi
17:27 bowtie tome, some Q's if i may :)
17:29 tome Qs for me? sure!
17:30 bowtie 1, what is the default terminal in mac world?
17:32 tome at face value, Terminal.app
17:32 bowtie 2, if you use Config; what is the value of $Config{osname}
17:32 tome (c) Apple
17:32 tome but I don't know if it's based on anything
17:32 tome I use ITerm2 and didn't use terminal.app for a while
17:33 bowtie terminal.app is apple equ of xterm yes
17:33 tome darwin
17:33 tome yes
17:33 tome bowtie: are you taking over the OSX work!?:)!
17:33 bowtie $Config{osname} = darwin yes
17:33 tome yes
17:33 bowtie no,
17:34 tome hehe
17:34 tome I'm still here
17:34 bowtie I was think I would like to use something else other than xterm in linux
17:35 bowtie so it makes sense to think about all os
17:35 tome ah, In the past I've used rxvt, gnome-terminal, and a bunch of Visor like terminals that I forgot the names of, aterm,
17:36 tome I guess I usually end up with some gnome-terminals running 'cause they are good enough... Iterm2 on OSX is pretty rocking.
17:36 bowtie I was thinking of adding darwin to About sys-info, followed by uname -r
17:37 bowtie that's cool, so Iterm2 if install then gnome-terminal else terminal.app
17:37 tome sorry, I was mixing systems
17:37 tome Iterm2 on OSX
17:38 bowtie ok osx, Iterm2 else terminal.app yes
17:38 tome on linux if I have an x11 running I'll normally have gnome utils installed (though not use the desktop manager) but they usually are enough to run gnome-terminal
17:38 tome or, rxvt, aterm
17:38 tome I'm sure there are newer alternatives, recently I was using a Visor like terminal but I forget it's name
17:39 tome basically it slides down from the top of the screen when you press your control sequence
17:39 tome so it's always around but not in the way
17:39 bowtie I supposed we need to think about kde as well
17:40 tome the internets like http://extragear.kde.org/apps/yakuake/
17:41 bowtie Q3, what's the default svn version?
17:41 bowtie client
17:41 tome on my system it's currently svn, version 1.6.16 (r1073529)
17:41 Hyppolit Changeset #1073529 http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/1073529
17:42 tome but I have no idea about other OSX machines
17:42 bowtie tome, thanks for that, :)
17:42 tome I don't manually update my svn or anything, so I'm *guessing* it's the same on most modern Macbook Pros running Lion
17:44 bowtie tome, do About, Patch, Find-File, and new diff margin markers all work in osx ?
17:46 tome Hi bowtie, I'm sadly going to have to try that in like 1-2 hours, sorry!
17:46 tome lets see if I can kick off a compile, damn perl... no compile breaks
17:48 bowtie tome, thats ok, it's just it makes sense to ask the OSX guru to test though :)
17:48 tome yeah I've got a lot of questions for him/her too, when does he come in?
17:48 bowtie try looking in the mirror :)
17:54 tome uh oh, the about dialog does not open for me in the most recent SVN : )
17:55 tome nevermind that, probably some issue on my local box
17:57 bowtie tome, dose the test 97_help_about.t run?
17:57 tome actually i mean literally I do not have a menu that contains Padre about
17:57 tome something must be funny in my env.
17:58 bowtie tome, Help -> About
17:58 tome Invalid or empty options for config 'editor_style' at lib/Padre/Config.pm line 86
17:58 tome ahhhhh
17:58 tome There it is
17:58 tome thanks bowtie
17:58 tome I was looking in the wrong place
17:59 tome Ram 0.0
18:00 tome this is great!
18:00 bowtie I get that to when running perl dev
18:00 tome cool
18:00 bowtie but it fills out in normal app
18:01 bowtie is there any info that a OSX guru would want to collate?
18:01 tome To be honest I don't think we have any OSX-guru problems right now to my knowledge
18:02 tome I think we do have some OSX problems
18:02 tome related to the menus and stuff
18:02 tome more to do with the GUI tookit
18:02 tome toolkit
18:02 tome but that's just my opinion
18:03 bowtie these blogs of new stuff might help: http://ahmadzawawi.blogspot.com/201​1/09/padres-new-find-in-files.html
18:03 tome awesome!
18:04 bowtie also: http://ahmadzawawi.blogspot.com/201​1/09/padres-new-find-in-files.html
18:04 tome Current bugs list (needs to be re-vaildated) http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/osxbugs
18:04 bowtie tome, Ahmad M. Zawawi (azawawi) stuff is really cool
18:06 bowtie also: http://padre.perlide.org/tr​ac/wiki/Features/EditPatch
18:08 tome for me the biggest issue (and one I haven't yet tried to fix:) ) is that when Padre is packaged as a DMG, we cannot automatically install plugins using menus, but technically I think I can change that.
18:09 tome Just need 2 days or so to code+test
18:10 tome also, keyboard shortcuts are wrong on many menus for osx.
18:13 gyles19 Not every distro is using gnome.  I hope you're not hardcoding gnome-term into padre.
18:18 bowtie gyles19, no but it would be nice to use a different external terminal and allow the user some choice, what do you think?
18:18 tome isn't there some way to launch a default terminal?
18:18 tome is there a terminal:// uri or something like that?
18:19 gyles19 Classic *nix defines that a user's environment will contain a TERM variable that points to their preferred terminal app.  Mine is 'xterm'
18:19 bowtie tome, yes, linux get's xterm by default.
18:19 tome definitely linux should respect TERM env var
18:19 tome unless there is a better way to do it
18:20 tome osx has TERM_PROGRAM=iTerm.app
18:20 tome though I have no idea if that's standard on all OSX installs
18:20 gyles19 There is also a COLORTERM variable but I suspect that is gnome-specific.
18:20 tome (TERM on osx is xterm, btw)
18:20 tome I was hoping there was some system mapping for a terminal program... like default web browser
18:21 bowtie I am happy with Env TERM,
18:21 gyles19 I would say look at TERM, if it's not there, try xterm on linux, that should be a symlink, if nothing else.  Linux itself doesn't really have system mappings the way Windows does.  Gnome has implemented something like that, but it's gnome specific.  (There are a lot of things about gnome that irk me but inertia keeps me using it.  I prefer KDE.)
18:21 bowtie I have: TERM=xterm
18:21 bowtie COLORTERM=gnome-terminal
18:22 gyles19 Now, one problem I have noticed with those terminal windows, they lead to a lot of zombie processes.  I haven't tracked down exactly how, though.
18:23 tome TERM makes sense for me too, it'll do ok on OSX (it will launch X11 and then xterm, instead of Term.app, but anyone can set TERM if they want.
18:23 tome OSX needs bit of refinement on that.
18:23 gyles19 You can certainly make a padre preference for what terminal app the user prefers.
18:24 tome true, I guess on windows they aren't used to setting env vars for things, so it would be a hassle if it was Only env var related.
18:24 gyles19 Is there a reason to force OSX to follow *nix processes?  It seems that launching X11 for an xterm when there's a non-X11 equivalent is overkill.
18:25 gyles19 Well, Perl itself suggests a fair few environment variables already (PERL5LIB, etc.) so allowing Padre to recognize one if it's present isn't that onerous.
18:26 tome absolutely! I was just saying that TERM=xterm on my osx, and when launched, xterm by default runs X11.
18:26 gyles19 Now, one thought I had myself... you're launching a terminal simply to display the results of something, right?  It's not an interactive session in that terminal window, correct?
18:27 tome sorry now that I think about it more, setting env var may not work on OSX easily
18:27 tome people are running Padre not from the command line, but via the DMG
18:27 tome (spotlight, double click, etc.)
18:27 tome I wonder if TERM_PROGRAM is set on other OSX systems
18:27 tome i have only 1 to test on : (
18:28 gyles19 My experience with OSX is helping mac customers debug their networking, and I often resort to a terminal window because I can use *nix commands to find what I want.
18:28 gyles19 I have access to a mac-mini at work, I think it's still running 10.5.
18:29 tome cool, can you run ENV on it at some point and see what env vars are set?
18:29 gyles19 Sure.
18:29 gyles19 As I recall, it's a pretty-standard-looking *bsd shell but I wasn't looking at it that closely.
18:30 tome yup, but the default terminal program (Term.app) is not an x11 app
18:30 gyles19 It doesn't need to be.
18:30 tome right, but TERM env var is set to xterm, not to Term.app
18:30 gyles19 Generally speaking, I mean.
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18:31 tome so if Padre were to use TERM, it would launch X11 and then xterm
18:32 gyles19 Wouldn't you have the default terminal app reflect the OS it's running on, anyway?
18:32 gyles19 For myself, when I'm writing a script and have some non-interactive output to display, I use xmessage for this, not xterm.
18:33 tome xmessage on OSX launches X11 : )
18:33 gyles19 Yes.  but I'm using linux.
18:34 gyles19 xmessage is an old-school display dialog tool and rather ugly, it's using the old motif toolkit, so it would look odd next to Padre.  There may be a gnome equivalent... but I dont' think xmessage will be as prone to the zombie problem.
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18:38 bowtie cool, thanks for that, so it's Env COLORTERM else Env TERM then?
18:39 tome I don't think that's the right solution for OSX
18:39 tome and I have no idea about Windows... but I'm not certain on there either
18:39 bowtie tome, is there another env var we should use in stead?
18:42 tome I think you can use TERM_PROGRAM on osx
18:43 tome no no i am stupid
18:43 tome : ) nothing new
18:43 tome that encodes the Current program that launched the terminal you are in
18:44 tome sorry I don't know an Easy way to do this on OSX right now. At least using TERM would Work... but is not optimal
18:49 bowtie tome, many thanks
18:50 tome I'll read up on this and see if I can optimize it for OSX
19:12 Hyppolit svn: r16608 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16608
19:12 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
19:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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20:58 Hyppolit svn: r16609 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16609
20:58 Hyppolit added support for gnome-terminal in run_command,
20:58 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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21:06 dolmen bowtie, tome: $ENV{TERM} is not the name of a terminal application. $ENV{TERM} is the entry name in the terminfo database.
21:16 tome makes sense, just like TERM_PROGRAM on OSX is the name if the program that actually started the current terminal.
21:16 tome it just so happens that xterm is also an app name
21:18 tome there must be a good way to find a terminal app?
21:18 bowtie tome, I test it first, centos = debian = ubuntu TERM=xterm  also COLORTERM=gnome-terminal on ubuntu, hence no damage
21:18 bowtie just need a test for OSX now
21:20 tome bowtie: let me know how I can help
21:21 bowtie tome, did you read mod to run_command
21:22 tome sorry I have no idea what you're talking about :FFFFDDDD
21:23 bowtie tome, follow link r16609
21:23 Hyppolit Changeset #16609 http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16609
21:24 tome What's the big picture here bowtie
21:24 tome why are we running a xterm
21:24 tome *term
21:25 tome and not just sending out to the 'output' tab like all other IDEs
21:25 tome not doubting what we're doing, just curious
21:25 tome 'cause it seems non-standard right?
21:25 bowtie the output dose not support user input or colour
21:26 bowtie snap
21:26 tome you mean Padre's output window doesn't support those things?
21:26 bowtie yes
21:27 bowtie tome, try running a simple test programme and you will notice the colour has been striped
21:28 tome when you say color do you mean your program uses some kind of term library to include color codes in the output?
21:28 tome that seems relatively uncommon to me, but maybe I'm crazy
21:28 bowtie yes, such as prove
21:29 bowtie prove -lv == run this test
21:29 tome i guess most IDE's do their own 'prove' so that you can easily click on the errors and go to the files. If we push test execution to an xterm, we lose the ability to do that connection right.
21:30 bowtie yes, i agree
21:32 tome bowtie: what's the best way to test this changeset?
21:33 bowtie run a script and a test then switch output, padre_output and terminal
21:36 tome Use of uninitialized value $ENV{"COLORTERM"} in string eq at /Users/tom/Projects/PadreBuild/​svn/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Main.pm line 2826.
21:37 bowtie thanks for that
21:37 tome prob need to check defined on that {}
21:37 tome same for {TERM}
21:37 tome but on the plus side
21:37 tome it put both my STDERR and STDOUT onto the new xterm
21:38 tome (i think it may be confusing that they are merged?)
21:41 tome I would personally prefer three 'buffers' STDIN, STDOUT, STDERR (or, a STDIN that takes input).  But that's obviously a big change : )
21:42 bowtie tome do you want to add test as you can test it,
21:43 bowtie thanks
21:43 tome bowtie: I don't know how to automate the test, so not sure how to add it.
21:43 tome but I'm curious shouldn't the test be cross-platform ?
21:44 bowtie no problems
21:58 Hyppolit svn: r16610 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16610
21:58 Hyppolit catch missing env, thanks tome++
21:58 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
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21:59 bowtie tome, yes should be cross platform, one step at a time,
22:00 tome i'm curious to see the test once you write it, to learn the interfaces we have
22:03 bowtie I need to ask if  $Config{osname} is allowed in wx-Main.pm
22:03 bowtie then we can test for darwin
22:06 tome there are other tests in the code
22:06 tome for darwin
22:06 tome there is actually a utility method for it
22:06 tome Padre/Contant.pm Padre/Util.pm Padre/Perl.pm
22:07 tome looks like Constant is the right one??
22:07 tome (Util is commented out)
22:08 bowtie I was thinking of combing it with File::Which::which('Iterm2')
22:11 bowtie tome, do you want to add this as I can not test or confirm correct format for launching Iterm2
22:15 tome The default 'terminal' program available on all OSX is Terminal.app
22:17 bowtie ok so if darwin and Iterm2 then Iterm2 else Terminal.app
22:24 tome Sure, I mean I think the idea of using some env variable or other config is good, but as a first implementation what you've done sounds reasonable.  BTW just checked and iTerm.app is the app name (not sure if which will find it actually, I think it depends on the path that Padre is run with
22:25 bowtie hold on while I add the unix and Mac bits
22:30 Hyppolit svn: r16611 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16611
22:30 Hyppolit add os check in run_command
22:30 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/
22:31 bowtie tome, I have left you a marker all yours now
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23:12 Hyppolit svn: r16612 | szabgab++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/16612
23:12 Hyppolit Update the messages.pot file
23:12 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/share/locale/
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