Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #padre, 2012-03-18

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:32 spacebat joined #padre
00:34 spacebat hi
00:41 Di-ima joined #padre
00:42 spacebat I like the idea of padre, but I'm also happy with emacs... is there a clear separation in padre between back and front ends, so that emacs could be the UI?
00:49 waxhead joined #padre
00:49 waxhead hey everyone
00:55 spacebat hi
00:55 spacebat just got the padre source checked out to have a look
00:57 Hyppolit wiki page http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/Plugins changed by bowtie
01:01 bowtie joined #padre
01:01 bowtie waxhead, hi
01:02 bowtie spacebat, have a look at -> http://svn.perlide.org/padr​e/trunk/Padre-Plugin-Emacs/
01:02 waxhead hey bowtie
01:02 waxhead seen Alias around lately?
01:02 waxhead does anyone have any idea where things are at with a new release of Padre?
01:02 waxhead I see you and azawawi have bene busy with things still
01:02 bowtie waxhead, how's the part-time taxi going
01:03 waxhead not too bad... had a few days to myself, been busy getting around the place taking photos...
01:03 bowtie waxhead, do you want to try out P-P-SpellCheck from trunk against trunk ?
01:04 bowtie waxhead, have you put any more on the web?
01:05 bowtie waxhead, I am looking forward to seeing your thumb :)
01:06 waxhead my favorite album at the moment is this set from the balloon festival.... https://plus.google.com/photos/107285859​481054669999/albums/5719680145958848017
01:07 waxhead my thumb?
01:07 waxhead Yeah, I need to get back into checking Padre out.. busy with job applications still though.. I'm supposed to be doing on now, but to be honest I find them such a chore...
01:08 waxhead I'll get this sorted out and see how I go with grabbing trunk..
01:08 waxhead I guess what I hate most about them is they take up so much time and effort... and you're left questioning yourself if you even should be applying for the job in the first palce.
01:09 bowtie waxhead, thumb in front of camera :)
01:09 bowtie I will take a look later, as for now night,
01:10 bowtie left #padre
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01:37 user_4354 I'm using Padre with Strawberry perl and I'm trying to write a test using Test::Class but I keep getting the error that the class is empty.
01:38 user_4354 What am I doing wrong?
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08:35 Hyppolit svn: r18858 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18858
08:35 Hyppolit [P-P-Fix] Simplify code to use less indentations
08:35 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Fix/lib/Padre/Plugin/Fix/
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09:52 bowtie_ gm
09:55 bowtie_ Hyppolit, tell azawawi can you please take a look at P-P-YAML, when syntax checking, why dose Syntax Panel not return to defaults when fule.yaml is clean, and hi
09:55 Hyppolit bowtie_, I'll tell that azawawi when we see each other.
09:56 bowtie_ later
09:56 bowtie_ left #padre
09:58 Hyppolit svn: r18859 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18859
09:58 Hyppolit [P-P-ParserTool] Added support for Data::Printer
09:58 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-ParserTool/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-ParserTool​/lib/Padre/Plugin/ParserTool/
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10:24 azawawi joined #padre
10:24 azawawi hi
10:25 azawawi YAML::XS is buggy in win32
10:26 azawawi we should offer YAML as a replacement in win32
10:26 azawawi and provide YAML::XS error parsing
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11:46 bowtie joined #padre
11:46 bowtie azawawi, ping
11:50 shadowpaste "bowtie" at 217.168.150.38 pasted "azawawi, info only" (14 lines) at http://paste.scsys.co.uk/187652
11:51 azawawi yeah, strange, right? :)
11:51 azawawi how r u?
11:51 bowtie azawawi, when ever I send Data::Printer out put to a Padre Panel or P-P-ParserTool I get the above output full of yuck stuff
11:52 bowtie azawawi, I am good.
11:52 azawawi YAML::XS on non-win32, and YAML on win32, how about that for an idea?
11:52 azawawi till we resolve the YAML::XS bug
11:53 bowtie azawawi, are you saying P-P-YAML needs to check for win32 and use YAML::Tiny other wise use YAML::XS
11:53 azawawi not YAML::Tiny
11:53 azawawi YAML
11:53 azawawi YAML::Tiny is tiny in everything even error messages :)
11:54 bowtie lol
11:54 azawawi we can also do the following:
11:54 bowtie not even tiny one's :)
11:54 azawawi 1. allow different YAML engines for comparison
11:54 azawawi s/1.//
11:55 azawawi allow the user to select the YAML engine of choice
11:55 azawawi YAML::Syntax::BackEnd?
11:55 bowtie azawawi, I can check in plugin_enable for correct 'yaml' module
11:55 azawawi better... allow the user to select the YAML engine :)
11:56 azawawi but prefer YAML on win32?
11:56 azawawi hence in the future when YAML::XS error is fixed
11:56 azawawi no need to update our YAML plugin anymore
11:56 bowtie azawawi, what is point of letting them select something that dose not work :)
11:56 azawawi it doesnt work because of the current XS problem
11:57 azawawi which in the future *can* work once fixed by the author
11:57 azawawi make sense or not?
11:58 bowtie so we will switch to YAML for win32 then?
11:58 azawawi yup
11:59 bowtie azawawi, any idea why the Syntax Panel dose not reset correctly?
11:59 azawawi return []?
11:59 bowtie not return {}?
12:00 azawawi yeah... syntax panel sucks :)
12:00 azawawi reason... so many worked on it :)
12:01 bowtie in wx-syntax task-finish which calls $self->render; I don't think it's reset is working correctly
12:02 azawawi let me try it on ubunut
12:02 azawawi ubuntu
12:03 bowtie as the colour square on tab is not reset to green
12:04 bowtie azawawi, I think we now display all messages from YAML::XS
12:05 azawawi syntax perl works correctly but yaml is not right?
12:06 bowtie azawawi, ok what have I down now :)
12:07 bowtie azawawi, do any of the other plugins do santax correctly?
12:07 bowtie s/santax/syntax/
12:12 azawawi https://metacpan.org/source/BOWTIE/Padre-Plugin​-YAML-0.03/lib/Padre/Plugin/YAML/Syntax.pm#L40
12:13 azawawi i hate TRACE
12:13 azawawi not useful
12:13 azawawi padre should have a built-in file logger... period.
12:13 azawawi INFO, WARN, ERROR,...
12:24 Hyppolit svn: r18860 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18860
12:24 Hyppolit catch for os,
12:24 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/YAML/
12:24 bowtie azawawi, like log4 per say
12:33 Hyppolit svn: r18861 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18861
12:33 Hyppolit opps missed a dependancy
12:33 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/
12:35 Hyppolit svn: r18862 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18862
12:35 Hyppolit update
12:35 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/
12:44 bowtie azawawi, return {}; or return []; neither of them work, you can have a clean file and a red square on tab SYNTAX :(
12:51 bowtie azawawi, also why dose it show a root icon?
12:52 azawawi trace $_
12:53 bowtie it happens wx-syntax task-finish which calls $self->render;
12:54 azawawi also YAML parsing is not correct
12:54 azawawi on win32.. .that is
12:54 azawawi YAML 0.03 same problem or not?
12:54 azawawi (cpan)
12:54 bowtie azawawi, the plugin_enable only works against trunk
12:55 bowtie azawawi, don't konw using 0.4 in trunk
12:57 azawawi unity sucks...
12:58 bowtie azawawi, i use gnome_shell on ubuntu 11.10 :)
13:00 bowtie azawawi, brb 10
13:01 * azawawi 'sudo apt-get install gnome-shell' :)
13:08 azawawi bowtie: let us fork padre into pedro :)
13:11 shadowpaste "bowtie" at 217.168.150.38 pasted "azawawi, some url's for you" (10 lines) at http://paste.scsys.co.uk/187657
13:11 bowtie azawawi, what is pedro?
13:12 azawawi pedro... core light... uses Moose and modern perl :)
13:12 azawawi pedro plugins
13:13 azawawi just a dream ... ignore :)
13:17 bowtie azawawi, I just downloaded P-P-YAML 0.03 and the little green square works, but why dose it not work with 0.04 in trunk?
13:18 azawawi another dream http://www.wxperl.co.uk/binaryo​asis/2012/03/wxwidgets-293.html
13:18 azawawi bowtie: my guess, is that there is a parsing error that doesnt parse correctly
13:18 azawawi return { ... } ... issues => ()
13:19 azawawi return [];  # not {} for syntax check ok
13:19 * azawawi installs kubuntu-desktop for fun :)
13:21 azawawi rolling releases for components (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LXDE)
13:21 azawawi hmmm
13:21 azawawi plugin manager checking for latest plugins
13:21 azawawi automatically
13:22 azawawi notepad++ edit-with context menu is configured via XML...
13:24 El_Che hi
13:25 azawawi how can we enable wxWidgets 2.9.3 by default via cpan...
13:25 azawawi anyone?
13:25 azawawi i.e make --wxWidgets-version=2.9.3 (Alien::wxWidgets)
13:25 El_Che you are the expert :)
13:26 azawawi https://metacpan.org/module/Alien::wxWidgets  <options> has no documentation
13:27 azawawi hmm https://metacpan.org/source/MDOOTSON/Alien​-wxWidgets-0.56/lib/Alien/wxWidgets.pm#L41
13:31 azawawi i hate being stuck at an older version... hence Wx::Scintilla :)
13:31 azawawi 2.9.3 is a big change for us
13:33 azawawi "...It is worth pointing out that wxWidgets 2.9.3 is still regarded as a development version so you are more likely to come across problems. This is particularly true of the MacOSX port which is really a major rewrite since 2.8.12."
13:33 azawawi now here is the thing
13:33 azawawi i talked with a couple of wxwidgets developers and they're using 2.9.x
13:33 azawawi as stable lol
13:34 azawawi http://www.wxperl.co.uk/binaryoasis​/assets_c/2012/03/propgrid1-37.html
13:35 azawawi El_Che: ping
13:35 azawawi El_Che: can you confirm whether padre 0.9x is in for ubuntu 12 or not?
13:35 El_Che yes
13:35 El_Che I have the vm at work
13:36 El_Che but I thought they were at 0.90
13:36 azawawi http://packages.debian.org/sid/padre
13:36 azawawi 0.94+dfsg1-1
13:36 El_Che no
13:36 El_Che that's unstable
13:36 El_Che the froze was some time ago
13:36 azawawi http://packages.debian.org​/sid/libwx-scintilla-perl
13:37 azawawi cool but next time we'll get that, right?
13:37 El_Che http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keyw​ords=padre&amp;searchon=names&amp;exac​t=1&amp;suite=precise&amp;section=all
13:37 El_Che 0.90.ds1-1: all
13:37 azawawi not bad...
13:37 El_Che yes, in 6 month we'll get whatever is in debian at the freeze time
13:38 azawawi any update on the ppa project?
13:38 El_Che yes
13:38 El_Che it doesn't work yet
13:39 El_Che but set up everything a need, reading the docs and decided on a strategy
13:39 El_Che as much from the os as possible, the rest in a huge non-atomic padre package where everything is in /opt/padre
13:39 El_Che and a tweaked @INC
13:40 El_Che that's what other people do
13:40 El_Che I prefer the atomic approach
13:40 El_Che but I don't have the time
13:41 El_Che and we're not providing a cpan services, just padre
13:45 Hyppolit svn: r18863 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18863
13:45 Hyppolit fix for little green square's ++ azawawi
13:45 Hyppolit
13:45 Hyppolit why is Try::Catch so.....
13:45 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/YAML/
13:47 azawawi what was its problem?
13:47 azawawi $_?
13:49 bowtie azawawi, yes, but why dose try-tiny F it up, gone back to bad old eval :)
13:50 azawawi how does it ... up $_? :)
13:50 azawawi explain?
13:52 azawawi https://metacpan.org/module/Try::Tiny#Clobbering- ?
13:52 bowtie azawawi, I was using try-tiny not try-catch
13:52 azawawi what's the modern perl way?
13:52 azawawi aha...
13:53 azawawi Moose uses it :)
13:53 El_Che try-tiny seems to be preferred in a lot of places
13:53 azawawi *::Tiny is a bad way...
13:53 azawawi in my humble opinion
13:53 azawawi you try to cram things and lose functionality
13:53 El_Che wel, it does what's supposed to do
13:54 El_Che I find the ending ";" annoying though
13:54 El_Che easy to forget and introduce a bug
13:55 azawawi e.g. YAML::Tiny is cool
13:56 azawawi small and everything
13:56 azawawi until you find out that eats out leading whitespace...
13:56 bowtie azawawi, with very very tiny error messages :)
13:56 El_Che the thing is
13:56 azawawi whitespace = data
13:56 El_Che that tiny is just a sub set of things
13:56 azawawi data loss...
13:56 El_Che I wonder if it's the case for try-tiny
13:56 azawawi El_Che: yeah i know that
13:57 El_Che it looks different than try-catch
13:58 azawawi what we're seeing is the indecision problem of perl community
13:58 azawawi lots of choices
13:58 El_Che exactly
13:58 azawawi when someone says this is good,
13:58 azawawi flamewars occur
13:58 El_Che we don't dare to make things cpre
13:58 El_Che core
13:59 azawawi yup
13:59 El_Che we desperately need a core OO, core exceptions and a better threading model
13:59 azawawi or at least develop one standard one
13:59 azawawi i know competition is good
13:59 azawawi but this is just silly
13:59 bowtie we have a threading model, goodie :)
14:00 El_Che sadly we
14:00 El_Che do :)
14:02 azawawi user choice even in window managers...
14:02 bowtie I think think the idea of a threading on a single processor is quaint :)
14:02 azawawi :)
14:03 azawawi the problem today i have a headache
14:03 azawawi and my productivity is like 20%
14:03 El_Che lay down
14:03 El_Che do some reading
14:04 El_Che literature, no computers
14:04 bowtie El_Che, azawawi needs to do some gaming to recharge his batteries :)
14:05 El_Che sssssssssssssh
14:05 bowtie El_Che, I am looking forward to your first IRC bed time story, for azawawi :)
14:05 bowtie El_Che,  I am all ear's
14:06 El_Che I can point you to good books, but no irc reading :)
14:06 azawawi gaming... :)
14:07 bowtie lol
14:14 * azawawi restart... brb
14:30 Hyppolit svn: r18864 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18864
14:30 Hyppolit another tweak
14:30 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/YAML/
14:33 Hyppolit svn: r18865 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18865
14:33 Hyppolit POD tweak
14:33 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/
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14:52 azawawi hi
14:52 bowtie ho
14:52 azawawi bowtie: dont unload Try::Tiny or Moose... :)
14:52 azawawi bowtie: imagine another plugin XYZ is using them
14:52 bowtie ok will correct
14:55 azawawi thanks
14:56 bowtie what's up with trac/svn server?
14:56 Hyppolit wiki page http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/PadrePluginYAML changed by bowtie
14:56 Hyppolit svn: r18866 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18866
14:56 Hyppolit don't unload try::tiny
14:56 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/
14:58 bowtie azawawi, we need to pick a day for 0.96 to go live, I now have 2 plug-in on hold
14:58 bowtie YAML and SpellCheck
14:58 azawawi YAML... why?
14:58 bowtie hold on
15:01 bowtie plugin_enable return 1; is not supported in Padre 0.94, only in trunk, can not give more as I can not browse trunk via web, is so slow
15:02 azawawi hmmm... ? :)
15:02 azawawi again?
15:02 azawawi what about 'around' plugin_enable { } # workaround like in Moose and snippet :)
15:04 bowtie azawawi, the problem was that Padre::Plugin was only checking for an error, it did not understand return 0 or 1, it dose now :)
15:05 azawawi changeset please?
15:05 bowtie azawawi, hence if you are checking for either or CPAN module, it got confused,
15:06 bowtie I am still trying to walk browser, you will have to wait :)
15:14 szabgab El_Che: ping
15:33 El_Che pong
15:34 El_Che szabgab: pong
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15:40 bowtie azawawi, see r18442
15:40 Hyppolit Changeset #18442 http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18442
15:40 bowtie sorry for delay
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17:13 Hyppolit wiki page http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/PadrePluginYAML changed by bowtie
17:20 bowtie Hyppolit, tell azawawi what would happen if we swapped YAML::Tiny out for YAML::XS, would that fix your win32 threading issues?
17:20 Hyppolit bowtie, I'll tell that azawawi when we see each other.
17:50 Hyppolit svn: r18867 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18867
17:50 Hyppolit remove unwanted variable
17:50 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/YAML/
18:06 szabgab El_Che: as virtualbox expert I wonder if you have any clue why I cannot install 64bit guests on my virtualbox running on an ubuntu 11.10 host?
18:06 szabgab Linux pm 3.0.0-16-generic #29-Ubuntu SMP Tue Feb 14 12:48:51 UTC 2012 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
18:06 Hyppolit # 29 :  Add autocompletion (closed enhancement) by szabgab  [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/29#comment:1 ]
18:06 szabgab this is the uname -a from the host
18:07 szabgab and Hyppolit shut up please
18:08 El_Che grep vmx /proc/cpuinfo
18:08 szabgab nothing
18:08 El_Che is it an intel cpu?
18:08 El_Che amd?
18:08 szabgab intel
18:08 szabgab Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU    Q8200  @ 2.33GHz
18:09 El_Che ok; your cpu has no (para) virtualisation support
18:09 szabgab so no hope?
18:09 El_Che I need to check
18:09 El_Che but I guess no
18:09 El_Che so are you stuck with only 1 cpu support for vms
18:09 El_Che no smp there
18:09 szabgab yes I see that issue as well :(
18:10 szabgab this isn't a very new machine
18:10 El_Che well
18:10 El_Che new machines have that as well
18:10 szabgab but I have a  notebook that can have 64 bit hosts
18:10 szabgab guests I mean
18:11 szabgab oh so when I buy a new computer I need tocheck this?
18:11 El_Che yes
18:12 El_Che normal people, yes
18:12 szabgab ok, I'll consult with you :)
18:12 El_Che normal people, no i mean
18:12 El_Che you and me, yes
18:12 El_Che http://www.virtualbox.org/manu​al/ch03.html#intro-64bitguests
18:12 szabgab now I am confused, are you talking about normal people, you or me ?
18:12 El_Che hehe
18:12 El_Che normal people don't care about that
18:13 El_Che my wife has my old laptop with no vts support
18:13 El_Che she has a 32-bit vm in ubuntu
18:13 szabgab normal people have partners who know this :)
18:13 El_Che she has no idea what she runs
18:13 El_Che and no wish for 64 bit or smp guests :)
18:13 El_Che brb
18:13 El_Che kids to bed
18:13 szabgab :)
18:17 El_Che so, yes, you need to pay attention if you want different types of vms
18:17 szabgab my next computer should be a mac anyway :(
18:18 El_Che really?
18:18 El_Che migrating to osx?
18:18 szabgab I mean my son wants one :)
18:18 El_Che and he's the boss?
18:18 szabgab I have an Ubuntu desktop and a Windows notebook
18:18 szabgab so I guess I should have a Mac as well
18:18 szabgab he is the boss :)
18:20 El_Che too bad you are not allowed to virtualized mac
18:20 El_Che your household sound like a good candidate for virtualization :)
18:20 El_Che bbl - kids
18:50 El_Che back
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