Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #padre, 2012-03-20

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Time Nick Message
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01:06 Topic for #padre is now Latest Padre is 0.94 - For installation see http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/Download | Log: http://irclog.perlgeek.de/padre/today | Pasting: http://scsys.co.uk:8001
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08:35 azawawi hi
08:35 azawawi http://www.modernperlbooks.com/mt/2012/03/inad​vertent-inconsistencies-each-in-perl-512.html
08:35 azawawi # the index and value packed into one :)
08:35 azawawi # use 5.12;
08:36 shadowpaste "azawawi" at 217.168.150.38 pasted "El_Che, bowtie... the solution i was looking for :)" (10 lines) at http://paste.scsys.co.uk/187961
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10:18 Hyppolit # 645 :  Lexically rename variable changes the screen position dramatically (and shouldn't have to) (new defect) by whumann  [ http://padre.perlide.org/trac/ticket/645#comment:5 ]
10:22 Hyppolit wiki page http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/PadrePluginFix changed by azawawi
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10:40 bowtie gm
11:12 bowtie azawawi, hi
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11:24 azawawi joined #padre
11:24 azawawi hi
11:25 azawawi bowtie: good afternoon :)
11:28 bowtie azawawi, any thoughts on using YAML::XS instead of YAML::Tiny for win32 issues
11:29 azawawi <=> :)
11:29 azawawi YAML::Tiny instead of YAML::XS, you mean?
11:30 azawawi The funny thing YAML::Old does not install cleanly
11:30 azawawi on win32
11:31 bowtie azawawi, I meant what would happen if we swapped out YAML::XS for YAML::Tiny in core
11:32 bowtie ie used YAML::XS
11:32 azawawi given its Task-related win32 problems, i guess a lot
11:34 bowtie azawawi, I only thought it might be easer in short term to use YAML::XS as fixing Task-related win32 problems as well as getting YAML::Tiny to provided better feedback, was the simple option
11:37 bowtie not forgetting the white space issue :)
11:37 azawawi http://lug.fh-swf.de/vim/vi​m-perl/screenshots-en.html
11:37 azawawi im looking at this :)
11:37 bowtie ok, will do
11:39 bowtie azawawi, O that, it's based on the bash one, which i like, but i did not get on with the perl one, but like bash one
11:43 azawawi i was thinking of perl -c in padre
11:44 azawawi its inherent unsafety
11:44 azawawi the question is
11:44 azawawi could we use PPI to mimic perl -c
11:45 bowtie azawawi, is this where p-p-tas is going ?
11:45 azawawi and then provide the user with the ability to turn on 'perl -c'
11:45 azawawi p-p-tas?
11:46 azawawi link plz
11:46 bowtie tas->fix
11:46 azawawi no
11:46 bowtie p-p-fix sorry
11:46 azawawi fix is transformation services
11:46 azawawi simplification
11:46 azawawi simplify
11:46 azawawi transform
11:47 azawawi "something" => 'something'
11:47 azawawi if expr something => something if expr
11:47 bowtie but fix is not an anagram of transformation services :)
11:47 azawawi yeah but that's what i thought of :)
11:47 azawawi i told you before im not good at naming things on the first release :)
11:47 bowtie azawawi, but at present you have to highlight the code you want to fix
11:48 azawawi aha
11:48 azawawi next patch... preview dialog + suggest fixes for all document
11:48 azawawi basically a PPI document is cool
11:49 azawawi you can really change things inside and it will spit out the final code again
11:50 azawawi https://metacpan.org/module/P​PI::Node#remove_child-Element
11:50 bowtie azawawi, yes, I get your point,
11:50 azawawi https://metacpan.org/module/P​PI::Node#add_element-Element
11:51 azawawi basically transform code to your favorite style
11:51 azawawi we offer simplify and transform
11:51 azawawi simplify is document-wide
11:51 azawawi transform is cursor-statement sensitive
11:52 azawawi http://blogs.perl.org/users/cata​lin_ciurea/2012/03/vim-ide.html
11:53 bowtie azawawi, hence it will be perl version dependant, ie produce nice pretty code using things like each and when where applicable
11:53 azawawi aha let us think of useful code transformation
11:54 azawawi e.g. you write something like print "something\n"; and you could say in modern say 'something';
11:54 azawawi how will perl users use new Perl features if they are notified by them :)
11:55 azawawi imagine transform and we show you the code in a hover tooltip window
11:55 azawawi so you compare which sugar is better
11:55 azawawi or sweeter to your taste :)
11:56 azawawi my biggest mistake in Padre help system is that im not caching across session
11:56 azawawi e.g. searching for modules everything instead of storing them in Padre DB
11:57 azawawi and offer the user a "Rebuild index" button
11:57 azawawi on startup, if there is no index, we build automatically.
11:58 azawawi let us go back to syntax check issue
11:58 azawawi what do we need by "Syntax check"
11:58 azawawi we are currently doing runtime check...
11:58 azawawi s/need/mean/
11:59 azawawi another question...
12:00 azawawi why not simply eval $code instead of perl -C as a seperate process? :)
12:05 bowtie azawawi, a simple perl -c, dose not catch our favourite auto de-ref hash-key, as use could not support but my dev environment dose
12:06 azawawi yup
12:06 azawawi so we need our own checks
12:06 bowtie azawawi, what about perl -c at different locally install perls as in perlbrew
12:06 azawawi perlbrew use?
12:07 azawawi https://metacpan.org/module/perlbrew#COMMAND:-USE
12:07 bowtie yes
12:07 bowtie after, from perlbrew list
12:08 azawawi possible option
12:08 azawawi so you mean i want padre to run on perl-5.14
12:08 azawawi but still be able to use perl 5.10
12:08 azawawi to check that error early
12:09 bowtie yes if I have use 5.010 and perlbrew list says it's available
12:09 azawawi i use it
12:09 azawawi and syntax check against it
12:10 bowtie yes,
12:10 azawawi but not magically like we do in padre by default
12:10 azawawi i hate magically
12:10 azawawi gives no option to the programmer
12:10 azawawi remember smart match... :)
12:10 azawawi it became too smart...
12:11 bowtie auto switch to perl version for testing if available locally
12:11 azawawi biggest problem with current Padre
12:11 azawawi is that it is inside some perl distro
12:11 azawawi chicken and egg
12:12 azawawi if we bootstrap it outside
12:12 azawawi i.e. mojolicious
12:12 azawawi the dependencies are really killing us :)
12:13 azawawi e.g. http://packages.debian.org/sid/padre
12:14 azawawi interesting optional dep http://packages.debian.org/sid/cpanminus :)
12:14 azawawi i didnt know that apt-get can do that
12:14 bowtie dod++
12:14 azawawi dod++
12:15 bowtie azawawi, I think that is the correct response after seeing that
12:16 azawawi bowtie: http://packages.debian.org/sid/libmojolicious-perl
12:16 azawawi http://packages.debian.org/sid/libdancer-perl
12:16 bowtie azawawi, buy in a modular environment this is the norm, look at eclipse, and all those java classes :), it's the same
12:16 azawawi less dependency = less work on maintainer's side
12:17 azawawi yeah but eclipse = IBM... :)
12:17 azawawi lots of maintainers/programmers
12:18 azawawi everyone thinks eclipse is the wonder kid
12:18 azawawi but a lot do not know that SWT is IBM's wonder kid :)
12:18 azawawi eclipse lives over SWT
12:18 azawawi SWT = compiled binaries for each platform
12:19 bowtie so now I understand your love of mojolicious, it's a free spirit :)
12:19 azawawi simple
12:19 azawawi if it works, why not?
12:20 azawawi did you see my wxWidgets 2.9.3 question on #wxperl?
12:21 dod azawawi: bowtie: for the record, I did not wrote padre dependency list myself. It was extracted from Meta.yml by dh-make-perl . Then I use cme and Config::Model to clean up and set up alternate dependencies
12:21 * dod hates managing big lists
12:21 bowtie azawawi, no, but I have been reading the links, and I now understand why p-p-moose has stopped until 2.9.3 comes along
12:21 azawawi dod: cool
12:21 azawawi bowtie: PropertyGrid... :)
12:22 bowtie dod, you still had to check it :)
12:22 azawawi bowtie: wxWebView
12:22 azawawi wxperl wx 2.9.3 discussion http://bit.ly/GAN7np
12:22 dod cme also checks available packages and versions :-)
12:22 bowtie azawawi, yes both of them, are needed to move forward
12:22 bowtie dod++
12:29 bowtie later
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12:51 azawawi dod: ping
12:51 azawawi dod: what about packaging other padre plugins? any update?
12:56 dod err, I recently updated spellcheck plugin.
12:56 dod I have moose plugin in my sight. Just need some tuit
12:57 dod Are there other interesting plugins I may have missed ?
12:57 azawawi Snippet
12:57 azawawi YAML
12:57 azawawi Fix :)
12:57 dod Fix ?
12:58 azawawi basically quickfix next gen
12:58 azawawi working on it
12:58 azawawi http://padre.perlide.org/tr​ac/wiki/PadrePluginSnippet
12:58 azawawi http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/PadrePluginFix
12:58 azawawi http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/PadrePluginPDL
12:58 azawawi PDL :)
12:58 dod Are they all on CPAN ?
12:58 azawawi Fix is not
12:59 azawawi snippet trunk is way ahead... will fix that soon :)
12:59 azawawi PDL is current on CPAN
12:59 dod All debian-perl packaging tools are based on CPAN. Having a module on CPAN is *much* easier for packagers
13:00 azawawi cool
13:00 azawawi then it is snippet, pdl
13:00 dod Whoah, Fix plugin is a killer
13:00 azawawi im working on it :)
13:00 dod I often used the first transform in emacs. I really miss it on padre :-)
13:01 azawawi link plz?
13:01 azawawi at the moment "something" is transformed into 'something'
13:01 dod the Transform if(expr) { ... } into ... if expr  transform is available in cperl-mode
13:01 azawawi cool
13:02 azawawi snippets is a killer :)
13:02 azawawi TextMate-style snippets
13:02 azawawi for<tab>
13:02 azawawi basically im leaving core to Alias (ADAMK)
13:02 azawawi and working on the plugins themselves
13:02 azawawi myself & bowtie++
13:04 azawawi http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/Plugins # reference table
13:04 azawawi ::wxWidgets also is updated
13:05 dod BTW, it there a way to fix outline for Moose attibutes declared this way:
13:05 dod my @common_str_params  = qw/default upstream_default convert match grammar warn/;
13:05 dod has \@common_str_params => (is => 'ro', isa => 'Maybe[Str]') ;
13:05 dod yes azawawi++ :-)
13:05 dod and bowtie++
13:05 azawawi sure
13:05 azawawi brb lunch &
13:05 dod oki bon appétit
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13:28 azawawi dod: im back
13:28 El_Che lo
13:29 El_Che writing a news Solaris 11 + Linux architecture
13:29 azawawi El_Che: please see the start of the irc log for today
13:29 El_Che my fingers are tired :)
13:30 El_Che I am reading diagonally
13:30 El_Che what part?
13:31 azawawi http://irclog.perlgeek.de/​padre/2012-03-20#i_5321546
13:32 azawawi and http://paste.scsys.co.uk/187961
13:35 El_Che the each?
13:35 El_Che yeah, that's great
13:35 El_Che it's been there for a while though
13:42 azawawi that's what we discussed once
13:42 azawawi having the index and value from an iteration
13:47 El_Che I remember vaguely
13:47 El_Che ok I remember now
13:47 El_Che didn't we iterate the indeces?
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13:52 azawawi yeah but this is better sugar...
13:53 Hyppolit svn: r18876 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18876
13:53 Hyppolit xt/eol.t is passing again under RELEASE_TESTING=1
13:53 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Locale/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
13:55 Hyppolit svn: r18877 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18877
13:55 Hyppolit Fix xt/copyright.t under RELEASE_TESTING=1
13:55 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Locale/ trunk/Padre/lib/Padre/Wx/Dialog/
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13:57 bowtie gm again :)
13:57 azawawi :)
14:00 bowtie azawawi, the plugin_enable issue, hrer is r18442 , sorry for delay :)
14:00 Hyppolit Changeset #18442 http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18442
14:01 bowtie this is the hold up on releasing P-P-YAML and P-P-SpellCheck
14:02 bowtie szabgab, ping
14:03 azawawi bowtie: Prerequisites missing suggest you read the POD for
14:03 azawawi bowtie: =>
14:04 azawawi bowtie: Please read the for ... because the prerequisites is missing?
14:04 bowtie azawawi, ie, your plugin passes api, but is missing a dependency. go read POD
14:05 bowtie azawawi, sure, Thats ok by me
14:06 azawawi which dependency?
14:06 azawawi in Makefile.PL
14:06 azawawi you're running it in perl dev -a mode, right?
14:07 bowtie azawawi, in the case of pp-yaml you could load the plugin, but it requires either YAML on win32 or YMAL::XS
14:08 bowtie azawawi, unless we are going to put both in Makefile.PL regardless of os
14:09 bowtie can we do os dependant requires in Makefile.PL?
14:11 azawawi sure...
14:11 azawawi requires 'YAML' if win32;
14:12 azawawi see Padre/Makefile.PL
14:12 azawawi build_padre_exe if win32;
14:12 azawawi requires 'Win32'              => '0.31' if win32;
14:12 azawawi :)
14:12 azawawi if win32; unless win32...
14:18 bowtie azawawi, ok I will go look, then up date p-p-yaml, for you to check
14:18 azawawi sure
14:20 azawawi i just wish something in padre core...
14:20 azawawi please test before/after committing :)
14:20 azawawi myself included :)
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14:33 Hyppolit svn: r18878 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18878
14:33 Hyppolit Fix xt/pmv.t under RELEASE_TESTING=1... Properly require v5.10. szabgab++
14:33 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/
14:34 bowtie azawawi, are you finding svn a bit slow today?
14:35 Hyppolit svn: r18879 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18879
14:35 Hyppolit tweak suggested by azawawi
14:35 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/
14:37 azawawi bowtie: yup
14:38 Hyppolit svn: r18880 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18880
14:38 Hyppolit Remove dead code from win32 GUI tests. Do we want it in t/ or xt/?
14:38 Hyppolit trunk/Padre/t/win32/
14:38 bowtie azawawi, ok, i will remove plugin_enable from P-P-YAML, but is still an issue for P-P-SpellCheck
14:39 azawawi the issue is...
14:39 azawawi P-P-SpellCheck is not allowed to be installed under win32
14:39 azawawi since it does not work :)
14:39 bowtie do I have Text::HunSpell or Text::Aspell installed
14:40 bowtie this can not be done in Makefile.PL
14:40 azawawi Makefile.PL is perl...
14:40 azawawi :)
14:41 azawawi Text::Hunspell to be correct :)
14:49 Hyppolit svn: r18881 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18881
14:49 Hyppolit get correct YAML to Makefile azawawi++
14:49 Hyppolit update changes
14:49 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/lib/Padre/Plugin/
14:49 * azawawi tries to compile hunspell on win32 :)
14:49 bowtie azawawi, we have to support Aspell as well as it's legacy
14:50 azawawi nop
14:50 azawawi we should focus on hunspell :)
14:50 azawawi Alien::Hunspell ? :)
14:50 bowtie see -> http://xlat-perl.blogspot.co.uk/2011/1​1/textaspell-on-win32-non-trivial.html
14:51 bowtie azawawi, dictionary don't change very much :)
14:52 bowtie azawawi, besides HunSpell files could be any where on local machine if win32
14:53 bowtie as each app uses it's own location, hence you have multiple copies to contend with
14:53 bowtie and versions
14:54 azawawi that's what im thinking
14:54 azawawi wx-scintilla like
14:54 azawawi :)
14:54 azawawi build it and get it over with :)
14:55 bowtie azawawi, if you are happy with P-P-YAML I will release?
14:55 azawawi let me clean my win32 env first :)
14:56 azawawi pm-uninstall YAML::XS YAML YAML::Tiny
14:56 azawawi scrap YAML::Tiny...
14:58 bowtie lol
14:59 bowtie but Padre core needs it, unless ...
14:59 dod azawawi: suggestion for moose plugin: an option for __PACKAGE__->meta->make_immutable; and avoid writing 'package main;' when creation a class or a role
15:00 Hyppolit svn: r18882 | azawawi++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18882
15:00 Hyppolit [P-P-YAML] Fix t/02-eol.t
15:00 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/t/
15:00 azawawi doesnt that mean you're still in the previous package?
15:00 dod uh, no. I've installed v 0.21  and reloaded plugin in moose
15:02 azawawi bowtie: rm t/* && svn up t/
15:02 azawawi bowtie: dmake test # fails...
15:02 azawawi bowtie: => eol native
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15:03 azawawi it is really bad this... svn property
15:04 shadowpaste "azawawi" at 217.168.150.38 pasted "[P-P-YAML] dmake test failure" (47 lines) at http://paste.scsys.co.uk/187972
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15:08 bowtie azawawi, what do you want ( CRLF or LF or CR )?
15:11 bowtie azawawi, see -> http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/SvnMimeTypes
15:15 dod azawawi: moose plugin is on its way to Debian/sid
15:16 bowtie azawawi, i use *.PL = svn:eol-style=native; svn:mime-type=text/x-perl
15:16 bowtie azawawi, are you sure it's not on your side
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15:25 azawawi removed t/
15:25 azawawi svn up
15:26 azawawi found a couple of one
15:26 azawawi s
15:26 bowtie azawawi, will do
15:26 bowtie azawawi, see -> http://svnbook.red-bean.co​m/en/1.7/svn-book.html#svn.advanced.props.special.eol-style
15:26 sewi Anybody having problems using the regex editor?
15:28 bowtie sewi, did it kill Padre?
15:28 sewi yes
15:29 bowtie sewi, are you using current trunk?
15:29 sewi Just while clicking the menu option -> crash
15:29 sewi current - few days
15:29 sewi r18578
15:29 Hyppolit Changeset #18578 http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18578
15:29 sewi But I'll svn up and try again later
15:30 bowtie sewi, it happened to me a couple of weeks a go, but not since, if that is of any help to you
15:30 sewi it is, I'll up any try before complaining again :)
15:32 azawawi dod++ # libpadre-plugin-moose-perl
15:33 bowtie is it me or is something wrong with svn
15:33 azawawi it is slow as hell
15:34 azawawi Hyppolit: tell szabgab svn is slow as ... :)
15:34 Hyppolit azawawi, I'll tell that szabgab when we see each other.
15:34 bowtie azawawi, I have sent e-mail to szabgab
15:34 azawawi Hyppolit: tell szabgab szabgab++
15:34 Hyppolit azawawi, I'll tell that szabgab when we see each other.
15:34 azawawi :)
15:34 bowtie can any one else give the server a kick
15:35 azawawi send it to padre-dev... just in case :)
15:42 bowtie azawawi, look like server is down :(
15:45 * azawawi home &
15:45 azawawi later :)
15:45 azawawi http://webtide.intalio.com/20​12/03/spdy-support-in-jetty/  # SPDY is here!
15:45 bowtie ok
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16:18 Hyppolit svn: r18883 | bowtie++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18883
16:18 Hyppolit update changes
16:18 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-YAML/
16:26 szabgab bowtie: server restarted
16:26 szabgab sorry
16:27 bowtie szabgab, are you having a good day?
16:27 szabgab just got home from training
16:28 bowtie szabgab, is this your's, as in marketing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Padre_%28software%29 or for waxhead to update?
16:28 szabgab bowtie: you
16:28 szabgab anyone can update it
16:30 bowtie szabgab, no, nothing to do with dyslexics, we don't do marketing, for obvious reasons :)
16:30 szabgab wyh
16:30 szabgab ?
16:31 bowtie szabgab, every body has there neish, and marketing is not mine :)
16:32 bowtie beside's thanks for kicking the server :)
16:32 szabgab that's my niche :)
16:32 bowtie szabgab, see spell checkes don't work with dyslexics
16:35 szabgab bowtie: I thik you can add to the tasks of the release manager to update the wikipedia page with the latest version number:)
16:36 bowtie szabgab, is there a wiki page with release procedure ?
16:36 szabgab there is
16:36 szabgab somewhere :)
16:37 bowtie over the rainbow ...
16:53 Hyppolit wiki page http://padre.perlide.org/trac/wiki/Plugins changed by bowtie
16:54 bowtie cpanm -v http://cpan.metacpan.org/authors/id/B/B​O/BOWTIE/Padre-Plugin-YAML-0.04.tar.gz
16:54 bowtie https://metacpan.org/module/BOWTIE/Padre-​Plugin-YAML-0.04/lib/Padre/Plugin/YAML.pm
16:57 bowtie Hyppolit, tell, azawawi to go and look at Dependencies  https://metacpan.org/module/BOWTIE/Padre-​Plugin-YAML-0.04/lib/Padre/Plugin/YAML.pm, which are not right, but also not wrong :(
16:58 bowtie dod, Padre-Plugin-YAML-0.04 should be good to go.
17:01 dod bowtie: ok. I'll package it tomorrow
17:02 bowtie dod, thanks, now you can validate yaml in Padre
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18:50 rindolf Hi all.
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20:22 Hyppolit svn: r18884 | sblandin++ | http://padre.perlide.org/trac/changeset/18884
20:22 Hyppolit Updated Padre Italian translation
20:22 Hyppolit trunk/Padre-Plugin-Fix/share/locale/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-Moose/share/locale/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-PDL/share/locale/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-ParserTool/share/locale/ trunk/Padre-Plugin-Snippet/share/locale/
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20:28 sblandin Hello there
20:29 sblandin There must be a problem in the .pot file for Padre::Plugin::YAML
20:29 sblandin It's identical to the one for Moose
20:29 sblandin Padre::Plugin::Moose
20:30 bowtie sblandin, please correct and i will paas on to azawawi, many thanks
20:31 sblandin mmmh i have to create it from source files?
20:32 bowtie sblandin, there is a dynamic process for this, I will ask azawawi.
20:33 sblandin Maybe I can do it with Poedit
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