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| Time | Nick | Message |
|---|---|---|
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| 01:23 | dalek | r29660 | jkeenan++ | trunk: |
| 01:23 | : Merge revisionpm branch into trunk. Cf.: | |
| 01:23 | : http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/[…]lay.html?id=56948. Refactor | |
| 01:23 | : Parrot::Revision and add tests, including one new test file. | |
| 01:23 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29660 | |
| 01:25 | r29661 | jkeenan++ | trunk: | |
| 01:25 | : Revert to previous version due to unintentional commit of several lines. | |
| 01:25 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29661 | |
| 01:27 | r29662 | jkeenan++ | revisionpm: | |
| 01:27 | : Branch has been merged into trunk and is no longer needed at head. | |
| 01:27 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29662 | |
| 01:27 | r29663 | jkeenan++ | revisionpm-29566: | |
| 01:27 | : Branch to which tag corresponded has been deleted, so tag may go as well. | |
| 01:27 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29663 | |
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| 01:40 | dalek | r29664 | Whiteknight++ | gsoc_pdd09: |
| 01:40 | : [gsoc_pdd09] Fixes to implementation: | |
| 01:40 | : * Added long-missing support for GC_trace_normal and GC_trace_stack_FLAG | |
| 01:40 | : * Re-added trace_system_areas() into Parrot_dod_trace_root() | |
| 01:40 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29664 | |
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| 01:51 | dalek | r29665 | Whiteknight++ | gsoc_pdd09: |
| 01:51 | : [gsoc_pdd09] Make GC_finish_FLAG consistent with the other flags. | |
| 01:51 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29665 | |
| 02:10 | r29666 | Whiteknight++ | gsoc_pdd09: | |
| 02:10 | : [gsoc_pdd09] Improve flag logic to account for flag interdependencies | |
| 02:10 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29666 | |
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| 05:00 | Tene | purl: coke? |
| 05:00 | purl | rumour has it coke is mailto:will coleda.com or just a figurehead. or http://coke-floats.blogspot.com/ or DietCoke or a pest |
| 05:15 | Psyche^ joined #parrot | |
| 05:18 | Tene | I kinda fixed Coke's hll map problem. |
| 05:19 | japhb | OK, Tene, drop the other shoe ... |
| 05:36 | dalek | r29667 | japhb++ | trunk: |
| 05:36 | : Merge branch 'benchmarks' | |
| 05:36 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29667 | |
| 05:37 | japhb | tewk, chromatic: Not only does it seem to work (well at least, not explode) to treat a ManagedStruct with named members as an array, it seems to be the fastest way to fill at least a small ManagedStruct. See examples/benchmarks/float4.pir |
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| 09:52 | masak | there's a significant chance Perl 6 will be much about cross-language communication (of data and calls) |
| 09:53 | I'm backlogging yesterday's conversation | |
| 09:55 | Perl 6 could end up in a position where it makes such communication very easy | |
| 09:55 | but it will take a lot of work | |
| 09:59 | moritz | Perl 6 is one of the languages that actually acknowledges the existance of other languages ;-) |
| 09:59 | Whiteknight joined #parrot | |
| 10:04 | donaldh | Yeah, that was an interesting discussion. |
| 10:04 | HLL interoperability is one of the things that makes Parrot really attractive | |
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| 10:47 | kid51 joined #parrot | |
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| 12:09 | dalek | r29668 | jkeenan++ | parallel: |
| 12:09 | : Add some basic tests. | |
| 12:09 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29668 | |
| 12:18 | Tene | japhb: there might be a timing problem. I'm not sure. I fell asleep before verifying it. |
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| 12:52 | barney joined #parrot | |
| 13:05 | japhb | Tene: fair enough |
| 13:09 | masak, moritz, donaldh: yeah, I'm with Coke on this one ... Parrot is selling itself not just on the capability to *host* multiple languages, but to get them to interoperate. I want 1.0 as much as anyone, but 1.0 without interop is a non-starter in my mind. If Perl 6 (or Rakudo and thus PCT) force that, so much the better. :-) | |
| 13:10 | donaldh | japhb: hopefully I captured that in my notes http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes |
| 13:12 | japhb | donaldh: thanks, reading ... |
| 13:13 | moritz | japhb: good to hear. I don't think the perl 6 specs actually enforce a particular level of interaction with other languages (except perl 5 perhaps), but it does describe the hooks |
| 13:15 | donaldh | It sounds like we have a fair amount of work to do before it is a reality tho. |
| 13:15 | japhb | moritz: nodnod. I suspect that it will end up being the standard-bearer anyway, because outside people are going to want to test the interop capabilities as we enter the beta phase, and Perl 6 does seem to have more written in that vein than most other languages. |
| 13:17 | donaldh: yes, but very important work. "Sudden change in programming landscape" important. | |
| 13:18 | donaldh | agreed. |
| 13:18 | moritz | should I create a ticket? |
| 13:18 | donaldh | I had assumed that it was closer to a reality. |
| 13:19 | dalek | r29669 | bernhard++ | trunk: |
| 13:19 | : [Pipp] PHP 5.3 is the reference implementation. | |
| 13:19 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29669 | |
| 13:19 | donaldh | I guess there should be a ticket. But that will not help raise the visibility of the subject. |
| 13:19 | Perhaps a blog would help. | |
| 13:20 | moritz | donaldh: but then we have a ticket ;-) |
| 13:20 | japhb | donaldh: I knew that HLL_map was incomplete (and I was getting nervous because of how long the Rakudo folks have been working around it, seemingly avoiding the main problem) -- I didn't realize that it wasn't just the implementation, but the whole design that was not done. |
| 13:20 | donaldh | s/blog/blog entry/ |
| 13:20 | blogs don't help per-se ;-) | |
| 13:21 | japhb | moritz, donaldh: Yes, a ticket is in order. Because then RT-watchers will keep pinging the list if the ticket languishes. |
| 13:21 | donaldh | :D |
| 13:21 | moritz | ok, I'll write one |
| 13:21 | donaldh | japhb: Is that what you do? |
| 13:21 | japhb | donaldh: And yes, blog entry in order. If we can get more than one person doing so, that would be good .... |
| 13:22 | donaldh | How long do patches normally sit in the new state for? |
| 13:22 | * donaldh | has submitted a couple. |
| 13:22 | japhb | donaldh: Nope. There are a couple people who do, though. kid51 comes to mind, but there are definitely others. |
| 13:23 | donaldh | japhb: did you have a go at making the opengl driver accessible from Rakudo ? |
| 13:23 | moritz | donaldh: depends on the subsystem, how big the changes are, how easy or hard they are to verify |
| 13:23 | japhb | donaldh: Oh, that's a weak point. I've definitely been unhappy about tickets left in new state, but unfortunately I don't know enough of the core yet to be a patch manager. Sigh. |
| 13:24 | gryphon__ joined #parrot | |
| 13:26 | * donaldh | thinks that a quick hack of 'use' is in order so that .pir and .pbc libs can be 'use'd |
| 13:26 | japhb | donaldh: I keep bugging jonathan and pmichaud to make it possible, because I have a pile of Perl 5+i OpenGL code that I really want to port to Perl 6. |
| 13:27 | Both of them keep saying basically "Yes, we know it's really important, we know a lot of people are asking, we're not ready for that yet. But soon, we promise." | |
| 13:27 | "Soon" is a getting to be a four letter word on this topic .... | |
| 13:28 | donaldh | Yes, I'd like to start a wee project in Perl 6 but this is a gating feature. |
| 13:28 | Infinoid | donaldh: (from new ticket discussion above) you're talking about RT #56824 and #56828? |
| 13:28 | japhb | I didn't just write the Parrot OpenGL bindings out of the goodness of my heart. ;-) |
| 13:28 | Infinoid | japhb: to be fair, they've been getting closer and closer to that for quite some time now |
| 13:29 | * donaldh | wishes ChatZilla wouldn't make rt numbers clickable (as channel names). |
| 13:29 | apple-gunkies | closer to "soon"? :) |
| 13:30 | Infinoid | for smaller and smaller values of "soon" :) |
| 13:31 | japhb | Infinoid: I know, and I'm not mad, or complaining that they're not doing useful stuff -- I'm going to want all of the stuff in Perl 6 that they're working on now, when I port the main corpus -- but I'm frustrated that I can't even start *testing*, or finding out what improvements I need to make to OpenGL.pir, and getting started on that. |
| 13:32 | donaldh | japhb: agreed. I am astounded at the rate of feature development as it is. But I'd like to be able to contribute to the things I need so much and I don't see a way to contribute. |
| 13:32 | japhb | Which is why I'm happy to be talking to fperrad, who is starting to use OpenGL.pir in a HLL ... he's just writing a ton of PIR to manually re-wrap OpenGL.pir into Lua, which is OK as a stop-gap, but not where we want to be. |
| 13:32 | donaldh: exactly. | |
| 13:34 | donaldh | Infinoid: yes, those two tickets. |
| 13:35 | Infinoid | ok, great. #56824 looks relatively harmless for everyone except cygwin, though I don't know why it didn't work on cygwin. (unless your arguments to memalign are totally different from mine on linux.) |
| 13:35 | anyway, I can commit that after tests finish | |
| 13:35 | donaldh | okay, cool. |
| 13:36 | Infinoid | I'm going to stare at #56828 a little longer :) |
| 13:36 | japhb | donaldh: Looking at your HLL_map notes, it's worth including the pros and cons of changing the M*N direct mapping problem to the M+N map-source-to-base-then-base-to-target method. |
| 13:37 | donaldh | Infinoid: It appears that cygwin memalign expects both the start _and_ size to be aligned. And it expects to be aligned on 64k boundaries 8-( |
| 13:37 | moritz | RT #57190 for HLL Interop |
| 13:39 | japhb | moritz: thank you |
| 13:40 | donaldh | moritz++ |
| 13:40 | moritz | japhb: no problem |
| 13:40 | Infinoid | yeah, that's bizarre. but fair enough, donaldh++ for diagnosing it |
| 13:42 | japhb | moritz++ # Good "ticket is closable when" section |
| 13:42 | Infinoid | donaldh: regarding #56828: any chance you can write a test for it? I believe those formats are tested in t/pmc/nci.t. |
| 13:42 | moritz | we should make that a requirement for non-bug RT's |
| 13:42 | donaldh | Infinoid: I was surprised that #56828 wasn't already implemented. I wondered if one of the other signature chars was meant to do void** |
| 13:43 | japhb | donaldh: Would you mind including a link to this morning's discussion in your HLL_map notes, since moritz's ticket points interested parties to your notes? |
| 13:43 | donaldh | Infinoid: yes, I'll try amd write a test. |
| 13:43 | japhb: yes, I'll do that. | |
| 13:43 | japhb | donaldh: thansk |
| 13:43 | er thanks | |
| 13:45 | donaldh | japhb: just reading the backlog. I think Tene was referring to a specific problem Coke was having with HLL_map not working for ResizablePMCArray. |
| 13:47 | japhb | nod. But "I kinda fixed Coke's hll map problem." demands *some* form of follow up. :-) |
| 13:47 | dalek | r29670 | infinoid++ | trunk: |
| 13:47 | : [config] Apply patch to test_exec_cygwin.in from RT#56824. donaldh++ | |
| 13:47 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29670 | |
| 13:53 | r29671 | bernhard++ | trunk: | |
| 13:53 | : [Pipp] Regenerate MANIFEST, after inadvertedly adding a file. | |
| 13:53 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29671 | |
| 13:56 | donaldsealgair.com | Intra-HLL Mapping Notes: |
|
| 13:56 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes | |
| 13:58 | japhb | donaldh++ |
| 13:58 | dalek | donaldsealgair.com | Intra-HLL Mapping Notes: |
| 13:58 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes | |
| 14:00 | donaldh | I suspect that TIMTOWTDI will come into force for HLL interoperability. |
| 14:01 | Because the community will desire all the pros without any of the cons. | |
| 14:08 | DietCoke joined #parrot | |
| 14:08 | DietCoke | (hll_map) I didn't see a commit, but I saw a comment from tene. |
| 14:09 | my original test case was malformed in that it wouldn't work even if the original bug was fixed, but there's still an underlying bug. | |
| 14:13 | japhb, tene: you stil lhere? | |
| 14:15 | paco joined #parrot | |
| 14:18 | japhb | DietCoke: yes |
| 14:19 | donaldh: Oh, and shouldn't it be 'Inter-HLL' rather than 'Intra-HLL'? | |
| 14:20 | donaldh | yes, probably. |
| 14:20 | purl | Really? Probably? Are you Certain it's not certain? Are you sure it's unsure? I think you need to look harder. |
| 14:20 | donaldh | lol |
| 14:20 | thanks purl. | |
| 14:23 | japhb: any other pros and cons? | |
| 14:23 | dalek | r29672 | bernhard++ | trunk: |
| 14:23 | : [Pipp PCT] Add test for closures, or anonymous subs, that works with php5.3-200807221230 | |
| 14:23 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29672 | |
| 14:26 | japhb | donaldh: M+N might force the issue of moving more HLL container types into Parrot, when any two languages share a significant semantic or collection type that the current PMCs don't support. That could be both a pro and a con .... |
| 14:27 | donaldh | Yesterday I was advocating shared PMC implementations with HLL namespaced methods. This is quite similar. |
| 14:27 | Agreed, it could be a pro and a con. | |
| 14:28 | japhb | M+N might not just dumb things down, but be really slow. |
| 14:28 | donaldh | Also true. |
| 14:28 | And be forced to copy. | |
| 14:28 | japhb | Yes. |
| 14:29 | re: freeze/thaw -- this makes sense to me, but only as a fallback; I don't think it should be the generic method, since it's practically guaranteed to be slow. | |
| 14:30 | But it sure is nice to know that if all else fails, or there is no existing mapping (for user-generated types, for instance), there's always something that will minimally work. | |
| 14:31 | DietCoke | wow. nothing like subscribing to the smolder failed RSS feed to make you want to TODO failing tests! |
| 14:31 | japhb | DietCoke: heh |
| 14:31 | DietCoke | I highly recommend it for someone else so I don't have to. |
| 14:31 | * japhb | looks pointedly at a cloud |
| 14:31 | * donaldh | hides behind his coffee. |
| 14:32 | DietCoke | looks like netbsd is failing one 'atan' test. |
| 14:32 | http://smolder.plusthree.com/a[…]395#first_failure | |
| 14:33 | japhb | For M+N, it might be nice to be able to apply a hint, or even manually run the proper conversion, when the default conversion path loses too much, but another path might work better. |
| 14:36 | Actually, from my OpenGL experience, it's clear that it's nice to be able to generate a foreign language's container, and manipulate it within the source language as an opaque object with lots of methods. The "at worst, everything is an object" design. | |
| 14:37 | donaldh | japhb: re moving HLL PMCs into parrot, both approaches benefit from that. |
| 14:37 | japhb | PDL, OpenGL::Array, ctypes I'm guessing, and so on |
| 14:37 | donaldh | Yes. I'm guessing that is what would be required by a PIR implementation of DBI. |
| 14:38 | An opaque PMC that has db drivers behind it and HLL OO methods in front of it. | |
| 14:38 | japhb | donaldh: yes, but whereas M*N can get away with *not* moving the HLL PMCs to Parrot, by just doing the direct conversion from HLL to HLL, the M+N method will probably force the issue. |
| 14:39 | donaldh: nodnod | |
| 14:40 | Speaking of which, It's been a while since I've seen timbunce talking about DBI 2 around here ... though I've missed a few days, so he could have snuck in. :-) | |
| 14:40 | donaldh | I haven't ever seen timbunce talking about DBI. |
| 14:40 | japhb | donaldh: Did I get the wrong name? |
| 14:40 | * japhb | checks .... |
| 14:40 | donaldh | I was thinking of asking if the project is alive or not. |
| 14:41 | japhb | Nope, that's right. |
| 14:41 | DietCoke | no, you got the right name. |
| 14:42 | japhb | He was here quite a while ago saying he wanted to take everything he'd learned from years of Perl DBI, fold in good stuff from other HLL DBI implementations, and create an uber-DBI for Parrot. At the time IIRC he was calling it DBI 2. |
| 14:42 | donaldh | But then I'm in the UK so might not have tz overlap. |
| 14:42 | I googled the subject and found a proposal from 2004 called DBDI. | |
| 14:43 | Tene | DietCoke: no, there was no commit. I can't get wireless to connect at the hotel. |
| 14:43 | DietCoke: also, I'm much more likely to get work done when I stay offline, so I didn't try very hard. I was reporting from my phone. | |
| 14:45 | * donaldh | hates wikis. They are the victim of browser shortcuts that lose edits. |
| 14:46 | japhb | donaldh: either he had a newer proposal, or it's been a lot longer than I thought. |
| 14:46 | donaldh: s/\. They/ that/ | |
| 14:46 | moritz | karma socialtext |
| 14:46 | purl | socialtext has karma of -6 |
| 14:46 | moritz | socialtext-- # i can confirm it sucks |
| 14:47 | japhb | Someone forwarded me a job posting recently from socialtext. I had a bad feeling about it, even though I don't use it myself, so didn't pursue. |
| 14:49 | donaldh | I use confluence at work. At least it auto saves. |
| 14:49 | nopaste | "tene" at 63.131.52.132 pasted "fixes coke's problem" (14 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/13631 |
| 14:50 | Tene | DietCoke: ^ is the patch that fixes it. It passes tests, but I haven't committed because I'm unsure if I also need to patch parrot_fetch_arg_nci() in the same file. |
| 14:50 | I'm reading it right now. | |
| 14:50 | I'm not sure what it does, and the "not yet documented" doesn't help. :) | |
| 14:52 | Eh, I'll patch it and see if the tests pass. | |
| 14:53 | japhb: ping | |
| 14:53 | japhb | pong |
| 14:53 | Tene | japhb: do you know what parrot_fetch_arg_nci() does? |
| 14:53 | DietCoke | br |
| 14:53 | b | |
| 14:53 | DietCoke joined #parrot | |
| 14:54 | Tene | Eh, looks good, I'll commit after tests pass. |
| 14:54 | japhb | Tene: not off the top of my head, but I'm happy to try being a second pair of (really tired) eyes ... |
| 14:55 | Tene | japhb: I'll just use grep. :) |
| 14:55 | japhb | way ahead of ya. :-) |
| 14:55 | dalek | donaldsealgair.com | Intra-HLL Mapping Notes: |
| 14:55 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes | |
| 14:55 | DietCoke | tene: that patch seems to fix my issue with Tcl. |
| 14:56 | dalek | donaldsealgair.com | Intra-HLL Mapping Notes: |
| 14:56 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes | |
| 14:56 | donaldsealgair.com | Inter-HLL Mapping Notes: |
|
| 14:56 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes | |
| 14:56 | donaldsealgair.com | Parrot: |
|
| 14:56 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]/index.cgi?parrot | |
| 14:57 | DietCoke | Tene: RT for that is http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Ticket/[…]lay.html?id=56958 if you would like to claim and resolve. |
| 15:00 | tene++ | |
| 15:00 | dalek | r29673 | tene++ | trunk: |
| 15:00 | : Fetch the proper type from the HLL mapping for ResizablePMCArray | |
| 15:00 | : when processing slurpy params. | |
| 15:00 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29673 | |
| 15:00 | r29674 | coke++ | trunk: | |
| 15:00 | : [tcl] remove faux-executable on clean | |
| 15:00 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29674 | |
| 15:02 | Tene | DietCoke: you said your example was flawed? TCL can work fine now? |
| 15:04 | Coke++ # Gives me easy problems to fix. | |
| 15:35 | * japhb | gets done cleaning up multiple projectile vomits from sick kid |
| 15:35 | japhb | Tene, are you still looking for help, or all done now? |
| 15:36 | timbunce joined #parrot | |
| 15:37 | _timbunce joined #parrot | |
| 15:39 | Tene | japhb: I'm not sure I'm correct about what that function is for, so I can' tbe certain I didn't break something, but all tests pass the same, so I'm not looking for help anymore. |
| 15:40 | japhb | gotcha |
| 15:40 | Tene | I just asked you 'cos of all your NCI stuff. |
| 15:42 | dalek | r29675 | bernhard++ | trunk: |
| 15:42 | : [Pipp] Move some comment tests from hello.t into comments.t. | |
| 15:42 | : Add a TODO test WRT to end of line comments. | |
| 15:42 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29675 | |
| 15:49 | r29676 | coke++ | trunk: | |
| 15:49 | : [tcl] remove workaround for RT#56958, now resolved | |
| 15:49 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29676 | |
| 15:54 | r29677 | coke++ | trunk: | |
| 15:54 | : [tcl] http://code.google.com/p/partc[…]sues/detail?id=58 | |
| 15:54 | : Rename more __ subs. | |
| 15:54 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29677 | |
| 15:54 | r29678 | coke++ | trunk: | |
| 15:54 | : [tcl] skip more spec tests we can't pass. | |
| 15:54 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29678 | |
| 16:03 | japhb | _timbunce: Your DBI-on-Parrot project came up earlier today -- is that still in the works? |
| 16:04 | dalek | r29679 | bernhard++ | trunk: |
| 16:04 | : [Pipp] More TODO test cases with three end of line comments | |
| 16:04 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29679 | |
| 16:05 | _timbunce | Whoever just spoke to me, please repeat. My irc transcript is empty for some reason. |
| 16:05 | moritz | 18:03 <@japhb> _timbunce: Your DBI-on-Parrot project came up earlier today -- is that still in the works? |
| 16:05 | Infinoid | _timbunce: [09:03] <@japhb> _timbunce: Your DBI-on-Parrot project came up earlier today -- is that still in the works? |
| 16:05 | heh. | |
| 16:05 | _timbunce | testing |
| 16:05 | moritz | he, two echo bots ;-) |
| 16:05 | * Infinoid | high-fives moritz |
| 16:06 | japhb | And I didn't even have to repeat myself. :-) |
| 16:06 | timbunce joined #parrot | |
| 16:06 | japhb | welcome back |
| 16:06 | purl | my mind is.. not going. |
| 16:06 | DietCoke | Tene: I've already removed the workaround in tcl based on that ticket. Thanks. |
| 16:07 | timbunce | Thanks japhp. Colloquy is acting odd for me. No transcript and I couldn't post anything. |
| 16:07 | You at OSCON? | |
| 16:08 | japhb | timbunce: I wish ... but no. |
| 16:09 | nopaste | "barney" at 84.154.57.31 pasted "Confused why three comments are parsed differently from two comments" (82 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/13632 |
| 16:11 | timbunce | japhb: the dbi on parrot project hasn't made much progress lately. My immediate goal is to use GlueGen and the parrot embed api to embed parrot in Java. I got stuck on some OS X JNI linking issues and didn't get back to it. |
| 16:13 | japhb | timbunce: What stalled the DBI on Parrot project? Too big a goal all at once? |
| 16:13 | DietCoke | ... didn't he just answer that? =-) |
| 16:14 | timbunce | japhb: I got stuck on some OS X JNI linking issues and didn't get back to it. |
| 16:14 | donaldh | Yet somehow parrot embedded in Java is a more achievable goal. |
| 16:14 | DietCoke | timbunce: I think jeff horwitz has stolen your killer app thunder, btw., with mod_parrot. |
| 16:14 | japhb | DietCoke: perhaps I misunderstood. I thought he said DBI-on-parrot got stuck for reason unstated, and SEPARATELY, Parrot-embedded-in-Java got stuck on JNI problems. |
| 16:15 | timbunce | DietCoke: I'm not in need of killer app thunder, I've got NYTProf for that :) |
| 16:15 | pmichaud | barney: in the grammar I'm looking at, a comment can be either: (1) whitespace, (2) a single line of '//' (but not more than one), or (3) a /* ... */ sequence. It's not possible to combine these together. |
| 16:16 | s/comment/<?ws> | |
| 16:16 | japhb | timbunce: And that looks damn skippy. Someone convince Debian and DAG to package it, so I can use it at work .... ;-) |
| 16:16 | pmichaud | I suspect it's the "single line of //" that is causing comments to parse funny |
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| 16:17 | timbunce | japhb: I'm hoping to find someone at OSCON to help with the JNI linker issues. I should also write up a presentation about the strategic value of the approach I'm trying to take. |
| 16:17 | donaldh | timbunce: is there anything worth sharing from the DBI-on-parrot project? |
| 16:19 | timbunce | donaldh: not yet. Effectively dbi-on-parrot is blocked waiting on embed-parrot-in-java. Anyone want to help with that? |
| 16:20 | pmichaud | afk # travel to oscon |
| 16:21 | japhb | timbunce: why are you tying dbi-on-parrot to embed-parrot-in-java. Planning to use jdbc as a backend? |
| 16:22 | Oh yeah, excellent punctuation, me. | |
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| 16:24 | timbunce | japhb: JDBC as the API definition, JDBC test suite as the test suite. Plus allow java developers access to all parrot code - which is a big deal given that there must be several orders of magnitude more Java developers than parrot developers right now. If just a tiny percentage cross that bridge to help with parrot it would be great. |
| 16:24 | japhb | NODNOD |
| 16:25 | donaldh | hence the "strategic value" comment earler. |
| 16:25 | japhb | What does JDBC do right that DBI 1.x did not? (Feel free to point me to a paper or slideware, if this is a FAQ) |
| 16:25 | timbunce | japhb: trouble is I'm trying to embed one VM I don't know (parrot) into another VM I don't know (Java) on a platform with unusual dynamic linking (OSX). |
| 16:26 | japhb | Oh, then you should have no problems then! |
| 16:26 | donaldh | I'd have thought that libparrot.so could be build with no surprising dependencies. |
| 16:27 | I have embedded libperl.so in Java before so may be able to help. | |
| 16:27 | japhb | And as I recall we (Parrot) use a magic linking flag on OS X that papers over a lot of our ... issues. |
| 16:28 | donaldh | But I probably wouldn't try it on Cygwin (my current platform) |
| 16:28 | japhb | I think it might have been tetragon who explained some of that to me, but I've forgotten the details |
| 16:28 | timbunce | japhb: JDBC is mature, feature rich, stable, documented, and has a good test suite. The *DBI-to-DBD* interface has *none* of those. |
| 16:28 | DietCoke | timbunce: (NYTProf) I saw that. looks verrrry nifty. |
| 16:29 | I wish I got paid to perl so i'd have more reason to use it. =-) | |
| 16:29 | particle | 25/18.6 |
| 16:29 | purl | 1.34408602150538 |
| 16:29 | timbunce | DietCoke: Thanks. It's been a blast to work on. |
| 16:29 | japhb | timbunce: ah. I only have to use the top DBI API, so I see none of the warts, I suppose. |
| 16:30 | As soon as I read the posts on NYTProf, my first reaction was: I want *that* for Parrot .... | |
| 16:30 | barney | pmichaud: Thanks for the eyeopener. Somehow there was an implicit '+' on <ws> in my mind. |
| 16:30 | * donaldh | is just reading timbunce's NYTProf blog entry. |
| 16:30 | japhb | It's the DWIM/. |
| 16:33 | particle | 13/8 |
| 16:33 | purl | 1.625 |
| 16:35 | dalek | r29680 | bernhard++ | trunk: |
| 16:35 | : [Pipp] A saner <ws> token. pmichaud++. | |
| 16:35 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29680 | |
| 16:38 | particle | i can get a processor that's 35% faster, and uses 35% less power that works with my mobo? for a few hundred dollars? sign me up. |
| 16:39 | japhb | whiteknight's journal entries are suddenly (as in the last couple hours) missing from http://www.brokd.com/psoc08/ |
| 16:39 | particle: in reference to? | |
| 16:39 | particle | OT |
| 16:40 | oh, replacing my 1.86GHz 80W clovertown with a 2.5GHz 50W Harpertown | |
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| 16:41 | moritz | japhb: complain to diment at gmail.com (Kieren Diment), he runs the aggregator |
| 16:42 | japhb | particle: ah |
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| 16:45 | japhb | moritz: done, thanks for address |
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| 17:27 | Limbic_Region | salutations all |
| 17:28 | * moritz | greets Limbic_Region |
| 17:29 | * Limbic_Region | has lost his motivation and asks that if anyone finds it that they return it ASAP |
| 17:31 | * moritz | sold it on ebay already, together with his own motivation |
| 17:31 | * Infinoid | bought it on ebay and is never giving it back! |
| 17:31 | japhb | Limbic_Region: Loud music with a strong, fast beat. It's like absorbing motivation sonically. |
| 17:31 | sonicly? | |
| 17:31 | hmmm | |
| 17:32 | Infinoid | aurally? |
| 17:32 | moritz | acustically? |
| 17:32 | particle | Limbic_Region: http://www.richardsimmons.com/ |
| 17:32 | Limbic_Region | japhb - I think I would need one of those fancy directional speakers so that only I could hear it - I live in a cube farm for the government |
| 17:33 | moritz | they are called "head phones" I believe ;-) |
| 17:33 | japhb | headset -- with a boom mic, it looks like you're on an important call while your eardrums are being pleasantly assaulted. |
| 17:35 | Limbic_Region | no, head phones (unless really expensive) bleed sound |
| 17:37 | japhb | Limbic_Region: how much is your motivation worth, when you figure your hourly rate? |
| 17:37 | Infinoid | I have a pair of studio cans which totally rock. people always glance at me in surprise when I start pulling them off and suddenly they can hear how loud my music is. |
| 17:38 | japhb | (Like the old joke about how expensive a helmet to buy: "How much is your head worth?") |
| 17:38 | Limbic_Region | japhb - I work for the government so I get paid regardless. OTOH, I have personal projects I would like to finish - so quite a bit |
| 17:38 | japhb | there you go -- consider it an investment in your personal happiness. :-) |
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| 18:45 | DietCoke | Tene: ping. |
| 18:46 | nopaste | "DietCoke" at 193.200.132.135 pasted "slurpy hll test" (38 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/13633 |
| 18:47 | DietCoke | eh. check your email. =-) |
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| 19:02 | dalek | r29682 | coke++ | trunk: |
| 19:02 | : [HLL] RT#56958 - add a test to avoid regression. | |
| 19:02 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29682 | |
| 19:10 | * japhb | chuckles at donaldh's cons for using YAML for Inter-HLL mappings |
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| 19:35 | dalek | r29683 | coke++ | trunk: |
| 19:35 | : [codingstd] Update to version of Perl::Critic that includes an exception we had to add manually before. | |
| 19:35 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29683 | |
| 19:39 | r29684 | coke++ | trunk: | |
| 19:39 | : [HLL] Objects also work fine for .slurpy pmc HLL mappings now. | |
| 19:39 | : but you have to make sure they're actually defined when you try to do the | |
| 19:39 | : mapping, so use an :immediate sub to make sure of it. (tene++) | |
| 19:39 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29684 | |
| 19:39 | Tene | karma tene |
| 19:39 | purl | tene has karma of 108 |
| 19:39 | Tene | Hmm. |
| 19:40 | 2*2*3*3*3 | |
| 19:40 | purl | 108 |
| 19:40 | Tene | Nice number. |
| 19:40 | moritz | 2**2*3**3 |
| 19:40 | purl | 108 |
| 19:43 | cotto_work | If someone with c-fu could update the patch in #46681 to fix the missing } in STRERROR_R_EXCEPTION and simplify that macro to be POSIXy if _GNU_SOURCE is undefined, I'd be much obliged. |
| 19:43 | Tene | Exactly. |
| 19:44 | cotto_work | I can do it from home later, but having the change here for testing would shorten the cycle. |
| 19:45 | Andy joined #parrot | |
| 19:47 | cotto_work | If somebody's up for that, ping me when it's in RT so I can test it. |
| 19:59 | Tene | I wonder if we shouldn't throw an exception on an attempt to run .HLL_map on a type ID that hasn't been defined yet. |
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| 21:29 | cotto_work | Whiteknight++ #eating cookies in chromatic's honor |
| 21:32 | dalek | r29685 | Whiteknight++ | gsoc_pdd09: |
| 21:32 | : [gsoc_pdd09] update to trunk r29684 | |
| 21:32 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29685 | |
| 22:18 | pmichaud | ...use an :immediate sub? |
| 22:19 | could we have a way instead to dynamically control HLL mapings at runtime? | |
| 22:19 | :immediate subs are Evil. | |
| 22:20 | in Rakudo's case, using an :immediate sub won't help or work. | |
| 22:20 | (or if it does, it'll be because we're doing everything in an :immediate sub.) | |
| 22:30 | dalek | r29686 | jkeenan++ | parallel: |
| 22:30 | : Refactor steps to pull hard-coded lists of files into the step object's data | |
| 22:30 | : structure. Add some basic tests. Some tests in gen_parrot_include-01.t need | |
| 22:30 | : fixing yet. | |
| 22:30 | diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/pa[…]evision?rev=29686 | |
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| 22:39 | dalek | chromaticwgz.org | Inter-HLL Mapping Notes: |
| 22:39 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes | |
| 22:41 | chromaticwgz.org | Inter-HLL Mapping Notes: |
|
| 22:41 | link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/[…]hll_mapping_notes | |
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| 23:20 | Andy | coke: Some day I will remember to drop the "s" in URLs. |
| 23:22 | Whiteknight | "s" is so bourgeois |
| 23:22 | The working class doesn't need this letter of oppression | |
| 23:24 | Infinoid | or any form of literacy whatsoever |
| 23:25 | all that stuff is an impediment to writing syntactically correct lolcode | |
| 23:27 | Whiteknight | IM IN UR ALFABAT KILLIN UR LETTERZ |
| 23:27 | Infinoid | 5 out of 5 grammatically challenged felines prefer "Z". Down with "S"! |
| 23:27 | Patterner | Hooray for the working cla! |
| 23:31 | Whiteknight | WE R TEH WORKIN CLAZZ |
| 23:35 | Infinoid | I don't know what's worse... that I've just wasted the last 10 minutes catching up on ICHC, or that it only took me 10 minutes. |
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| 23:47 | cotto_work | ichc++ |
| 23:47 | Whiteknight | ichc? |
| 23:47 | cotto_work | purl-- |
| 23:47 | purl | cotto_work: excuse me? |
| 23:48 | cotto_work | ichc is is http://icanhascheezburger.com |
| 23:48 | purl, ichc is is http://icanhascheezburger.com | |
| 23:48 | purl | OK, cotto_work. |
| 23:48 | cotto_work | ichc? |
| 23:48 | purl, ichc? | |
| 23:48 | purl | cotto_work: bugger all, i dunno |
| 23:48 | cotto_work | purl's not getting smarter |
| 23:49 | purl, ichc is http://icanhascheezburger.com | |
| 23:49 | purl | OK, cotto_work. |
| 23:49 | cotto_work | purl, ichc? |
| 23:49 | purl | cotto_work: i haven't a clue |
| 23:52 | Infinoid | purl-- |
| 23:52 | purl | Infinoid: sorry... |
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