Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2008-11-13

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Time Nick Message
00:01 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
00:01 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
00:05 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
00:05 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
00:08 chromatic Coke, I'm not sure that production handles the non-quoted case.
00:09 AndyA joined #parrot
00:12 chromatic target DOT sub_label_op seems to do it.
00:19 Coke joined #parrot
00:21 nopaste "chromatic" at 69.64.234.10 pasted "Coke: Disallow Bareword Method Names in PIR" (31 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14558
00:21 chromatic Oh sure, then he quits.
00:21 chromatic Let's see how much of the test suite that breaks.
00:22 chromatic Lots.  Nice.
00:26 Coke joined #parrot
00:27 chromatic Coke:  http://nopaste.snit.ch/14558
00:34 Psyche^ joined #parrot
00:35 pmichaud particle: ping
00:39 Coke chromatic: already on it. danke!
00:40 chromatic The build doesn't complete.  It's working.
00:50 particle pmichaud: pong
00:50 pmichaud I have some meta-questions about the summit, if you have time.
00:50 particle i have meta-time.
00:51 pmichaud is there a semi-formal agenda or plan for the meetings, beyond what's already on the wiki?
00:51 particle no
00:51 pmichaud I was thinking that perhaps we should do it in a modified unconference style
00:51 particle it's on my todo list, if it ever gets done
00:51 pmichaud unless you or allison have other notions of how it should be organized
00:51 particle i was thinking along the same lines
00:52 particle care to wikify your ideas?
00:52 pmichaud I can do that, yes, but wanted to go over them conversation style first if possible
00:52 particle k
00:52 pmichaud I'm thinking that we spend the first X minutes of the conference identifying/brainstorming topics that people might want to cover at the conference
00:53 pmichaud then, people can vote on what they feel is the most important to discuss
00:53 pmichaud since there are relatively few at the summit, I think we keep things down to at most two tracks
00:54 particle we may have only one room
00:54 particle but weather may allow us to have outdoor sessions
00:54 purl Try a 4-letter station code (see http://weather.noaa.gov/weather/curcond.html for locations and codes)
00:54 pmichaud that's another reason to keep the number of tracks down
00:54 pmichaud most unconferences take place within a single (albeit large) room
00:54 pmichaud that way people can overhear things from other discussions, or switch discussions in the middle if needed
00:54 particle yes, i don't yet know our resource constraints
00:55 pmichaud I'm also thinking that for any given topic (or topics), we set a time limit for discussion to keep things moving
00:55 pmichaud if we get to the time limit and feel we need to discuss it more, we put it back in the pool of things to talk about and see what people thing
00:55 pmichaud *think
00:56 pmichaud i.e., we can extend time on the topic if people think it's important, but we don't allow ourselves to spin wheels on one topic when we have others we want to address
00:56 particle indeed
00:57 pmichaud anyway, that's what occurred to me a bit earlier -- I can write it up on the wiki if you want
00:57 particle this all fits in with what i was thinking
00:57 pmichaud I'm fine if there's another approach that you/allison/others want to take, but I figure it's better to have at least one strategy going in than to try to devise one when we're there.
00:58 particle i figured i'd write it up on the plane ride down, but i may just have to sleep
00:58 pmichaud okay, I'll write it up now and we can invite comments.
00:58 pmichaud thanks.
00:58 particle thank you
01:15 Whiteknight joined #parrot
01:28 dalek r32582 | coke++ | trunk:
01:28 dalek : use of bareword method names is [DEPRECATED]
01:28 dalek : This clears up all the usages present if you remove the feature and run 'make'
01:28 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32582
01:29 Coke chromatic: there's one chunk.
01:29 pmichaud Coke: perhaps try nqp, next -- it'll catch a bunch.
01:29 Coke yah, but only during 'make test'.
01:30 Coke guessing PCT has a bunch of hidden ones.
01:30 Coke (like, embedded in emit() calls.)
01:30 pmichaud it shouldn't have too many -- by the time I was building PCT I was pretty well in the habit of quoting my method calls.
01:30 pmichaud PGE has quite a few, though, because at the time I was being advised -against- using the quotes.
01:33 Whiteknight joined #parrot
01:35 pmichaud particle: (and others)  -- posted my thoughts at http://www.parrot.org/parrot-d​eveloper-summit-2008-schedule
01:38 pmichaud updated with link to agenda topic ideas
01:38 pmichaud feel free to modify, trash, ridicule, or comment as appropriate.
01:44 Whiteknight has the parrot test harness been changed recently?
01:44 Whiteknight because it's being much more verbose then I remember it being
01:45 jimmy joined #parrot
01:46 Whiteknight verbose isn't a bad thing, unless it isn't suppoesd to be happening
01:48 chromatic Did you upgrade to Test::Harness 3?
01:48 Whiteknight ...should I have?
01:49 Whiteknight (the short answer is "no")
01:49 chromatic That would explain part of it.
01:50 pmichaud I had the same reaction when I first saw T::H::3 output
01:50 pmichaud "much more verbose"
01:51 Zaba_ joined #parrot
01:54 Whiteknight anything else I need to update, while I'm in here?
01:54 Whiteknight I can't keep track of all the damn dependencies
01:54 pmichaud where is "here"?
01:54 purl "here" is probably better than "there"
01:54 Whiteknight "here" is "sudo cpan"
01:55 pmichaud ah.
01:55 Whiteknight purl, forget "here"
01:55 purl Whiteknight: I forgot "here"
01:55 Whiteknight :)
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02:05 Whiteknight I installed T::H::3, and it's still very verbose output on "make test"
02:06 pmichaud oh, I think you might've misinterpreted.  TH3 generates far more verbose output than its predecessors
02:06 pmichaud s/far //
02:06 Whiteknight oh. Then I did misinterpret
02:06 pmichaud so, if something happend on your system that installed TH3, you would see more verbose output than you were used to.
02:07 pmichaud this could come from upgrading perl, or perhaps upgrading a distribution
02:07 Whiteknight i don't think I upgraded anything, but I might have just forgotten
02:08 Theory joined #parrot
02:08 pmichaud it could still be something else, too -- but I know that installing TH3 surprised me with parrot 'make test' output.
02:21 jimmy nopaste
02:21 jimmy nopaste?
02:21 purl nopaste is probably at http://nopaste.snit.ch/ (ask TonyC for new channels) or http://rafb.net/paste or http://poundperl.pastebin.com/ or http://paste.scsys.co.uk/ or App::Nopaste or tools/dev/nopaste.pl or at http://www.extpaste.com/
02:21 Coke make TEST_JOBS=3 test more than makes up for the verbose output. =-)
02:28 nopaste "jimmy" at 220.232.135.246 pasted "[PATCH]Removing _config instead of using sysinfo to only get os_name" (149 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14559
02:29 dalek r32583 | allison++ | pdd22io:
02:29 dalek : [pdd22io] Update test description and expected output.
02:29 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32583
02:30 chromatic The first chunk looks wrong, but the rest is fine, jimmy.
02:30 jimmy hello, where?
02:31 chromatic -    *File::Spec::Unix
02:31 chromatic +    File::Spec::Unix
02:31 jimmy this file had created.
02:32 dalek r32584 | allison++ | pdd22io:
02:32 dalek : [pdd22io] Strip the 'print' method of a FileHandle down to a single PMC
02:32 dalek : parameter. Vastly simpler code, and it actually works. (Before it was
02:32 dalek : autoboxing everything passed to it as an integer, not particularly useful.)
02:32 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32584
02:32 jimmy * means this file had not be created.
02:33 jimmy and Now Unix seems to be created.
02:34 Theory joined #parrot
02:34 jimmy chromatic:Is there anything wrong ?
02:35 chromatic No, it looks reasonable.
02:36 Zaba joined #parrot
02:44 pmichaud http://www.pmichaud.com/perl6/lexical.txt updated.  I _think_ I have the autoclose semantics correct here -- now I can go back to implementing.
02:47 Whiteknight pmichaud++
02:48 pmichaud I might need some (pardon the pun) pointers on getting the GC and ref_count semantics right.
02:49 pmichaud but I'll get the basic in place first.
02:49 pmichaud *basics
02:49 TimToady if only the basics were a bit more basic...
02:50 dmknopp left #parrot
03:00 Zaba joined #parrot
03:17 jimmy hello chromatic
03:17 jimmy there is something wrong
03:18 jimmy t\pmc\config.t should not be patched.
03:21 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
03:21 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
03:24 nopaste "Jimmy" at 220.232.135.246 pasted "[NEW PATCH]Removing _config instead of using sysinfo to only get os_name" (136 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14560
03:27 Coke chromatic++ # || testing fixes
03:33 dalek r32585 | coke++ | trunk:
03:33 dalek : bareword method names are [DEPRECATED].
03:33 dalek : Remove one explicit test for it.  ('make test' works now)
03:33 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32585
03:35 jimmy hello coke, please help me to do a test for the patch
03:42 Coke ?
03:45 Coke pmichaud: ping
03:48 Coke pmichaud: nevermindpong
03:49 solarion joined #parrot
03:53 Zaba_ joined #parrot
03:54 Coke ok, pmichaud ping again.
03:56 pmichaud pong
03:56 Psyche^ joined #parrot
03:56 solarion Have you seen the Ars article?
03:59 pmichaud Coke: pong
04:00 Coke nqp is failing because callmethod is passing an unquoted methodname, which is generating the old foo.methodname syntax.
04:00 pmichaud okay.
04:00 pmichaud I can fix.
04:00 Coke but if I change the format thre to always do foo.'methodname', then other bits fail, because they come in with "'s already.
04:00 pmichaud oh, that's odd.
04:01 pmichaud then the unquoted method name is the bug.
04:01 Coke 17-class.t does it.
04:01 pmichaud that helps.
04:01 Coke "new" and "foo" show up with quots.
04:02 pmichaud aha, it's handle_types that's the issue.
04:02 Coke yes. should that be passed in with quotes?
04:02 pmichaud yes.
04:03 Coke isn't that extra work?
04:03 Coke (for the folks using pct?)
04:03 pmichaud no, it's internal to PCT
04:03 Coke ah.
04:03 pmichaud nopaste coming.
04:03 Coke ok, I can fix that.
04:03 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "patch for handle_types" (13 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14561
04:04 pmichaud oh, there are a couple of other instances
04:04 pmichaud lines 658 and 1174
04:05 pmichaud PCT already puts quotes around any method names coming from callers -- it looks like we just forgot the quotes for the purely internally generated ones.
04:06 Coke there we go.
04:06 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "update patch for handle_types (untested)" (31 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14562
04:06 Coke fixed locally.
04:06 Coke ah.
04:06 Coke Yup. that matches what I just did. whee.
04:06 Coke if you want to apply that, you can.
04:06 pmichaud Coke++
04:06 pmichaud you've tested, so I'll let you apply.
04:07 Coke well, I've tested it in my modified copy of parrot.
04:07 pmichaud okay, I can do it.
04:08 Coke danke.
04:09 pmichaud r32586
04:09 * Coke goes through some languages...
04:09 dalek r32586 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
04:09 dalek : [pct]: Make sure callmethod quotes method names (Coke++)
04:09 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32586
04:12 Zaba joined #parrot
04:22 dalek r32587 | coke++ | trunk:
04:22 dalek : [cardinal] use of bareword method names is [DEPRECATED]
04:22 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32587
04:27 dalek r32588 | coke++ | trunk:
04:27 dalek : can't use .return instead of tailcall; use of bareword method names is [DEPRECATED]
04:27 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32588
04:27 dalek r32589 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
04:27 dalek : [rakudo]:  Add a .PARROTCLASS method, to report the real type.
04:27 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32589
04:29 stockwellb joined #parrot
04:29 stockwellb For PIR is there a way to *goto .end* without having to create label for nothing?
04:29 particle it's called .return () :)
04:31 jimmy hello particle
04:31 stockwellb Ah so you can use that like in higher level languages.
04:31 particle hi jimmy
04:33 stockwellb @particle, I think I've finished rewriting names.t. Now what should I do?
04:33 particle stockwellb: you should take a look at examples/tutorial/
04:34 particle you should read docs/submissions.pod, just like jimmy should do :)
04:34 stockwellb Damn pods, us lazy folk should really commit them to memory :)
04:35 stockwellb I was all happy too, now I've got more homework!
04:35 jimmy i had a patch ,can you take a look at it ?
04:35 Coke rant to language maintainers. if something is deprecated, stop using it.
04:36 Coke particle: in jimmy's defense, perl.org is slow.
04:36 particle jimmy: my client doesn't accept files
04:36 particle perl.org should be a bit faster, spam has dropped ~33% this week
04:37 nopaste "Jimmy" at 220.232.135.246 pasted "Patch for particle" (136 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14563
04:37 particle McColo isp has been taken down
04:38 jimmy particle: i pass it to nopaste
04:38 particle thanks jimmy, i'll review, build parrot, apply, and test
04:38 particle wow, coke touched a lot of files
04:38 jimmy rt.perl.org had stop worked.
04:39 jimmy oops,my poor english!
04:40 particle if rt isn't working, please email rt-admin@perl.org
04:40 pmichaud Coke:  (rant)  how long has the bareword form been deprecated?
04:40 particle i haven't noticed, but i haven't looked at rt in a week or so
04:40 particle pmichaud: a long time iirc
04:41 Coke pmichaud: 0.6.4 it could have been removed.
04:42 stockwellb If I'm rewriting a test, do I still the patch to parrotbug?
04:43 particle damn, anyone have $900 to spare? i crave 8 faster cpus
04:43 particle stockwellb: yes, all patches should be in rt tickets, unless they're small (like jimmy's) which can be nopasted here when folks are around
04:43 pmichaud baloney.
04:43 purl i guess baloney is just smashed hot dogs
04:44 stockwellb rt tickets? I don't understand.
04:44 particle parrotbug@parrotcode.org is an email address that submits entries to parrot's rt queue
04:44 pmichaud According to svn, the deprecation notice was added r30039, 2008-08-05
04:44 pmichaud that wasn't *that* long ago.
04:44 pmichaud 3 months.
04:44 purl hmmm... 3 months is standard, unless its like holiday (vacation) cover or something
04:44 dalek r32590 | coke++ | trunk:
04:44 dalek : [lisp] remove unsupported .return syntax, and [DEPRECATED] bare method names
04:44 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32590
04:44 stockwellb what is rt?
04:44 purl hmmm... rt is just RT (http://bestpractical.com/rt) or (:rt3) or (: rt bugs) or Obra's trouble ticketing system or the first IBM RISC workstation (http://www.contrib.andrew.c​mu.edu/~shadow/ibmrt.html) or the bombsquad or the Right Thing or very very capable and open-source or an application framework that bundles a ticketing system or obra's baby or SOOOO slow :-S or email mailto:perlbug-owner@perl.org for access
04:45 chromatic Sure, but it refers to RT #45859, which is over a year old.
04:45 pmichaud sure, but no official decision was ever made on that ticket, afaict
04:45 pmichaud I remember that #45859 was a point of discussion, but I never saw that an official decision was made.
04:45 particle pmichaud: my apologies, it's been deprecated unofficially in my head much longer than officially, i guess
04:46 pmichaud and I heard musings from allison (July OSCON hackathon) that it wasn't completely decided yet.
04:46 chromatic I think the decision was in a #ps meeting a few months ago.
04:46 particle i think chromatic is right
04:46 chromatic August sounds right.
04:46 jimmy i had posted 3 email to rt. nothing is created.
04:47 particle jimmy: it's possible your email address is getting mistakenly blacklisted
04:47 particle an email to rt-admin@perl.org about that might help
04:47 particle i expect a different spam threshold there
04:48 particle or i could send an email there if you give me your address
04:48 pmichaud purl, forget 3 months
04:48 purl pmichaud: I forgot 3 months
04:48 jimmy ok, i don't know why my email address was be blacklisted.
04:48 particle jimmy: perl.org servers get *a lot* of spam
04:49 particle occasionally there are false positives
04:49 pmichaud hey, why didn't ChangeLog get updated in the october release?  ;-)
04:49 particle holy crap, ted stevens is losing in alaska. by 3 votes.
04:50 pmichaud I kinda expected that.
04:50 particle probably a careless release manager
04:50 pmichaud how's frankenberry doing in MN?  ;-)
04:50 jimmy noon break.
04:50 jimmy :)
04:52 davidfetter joined #parrot
04:52 particle i think that's 220 votes or so
04:52 particle they've forced a manual recount there
04:53 Zaba_ joined #parrot
04:55 jimmy i will send an email to rt-admin, thank particle.
04:56 particle i hope sarah palin makes it into the senate. i didn't get enough coverage of her quirky and fun accent.
04:57 chromatic How do you have a Minnesota accent in Alaska?
04:58 pmichaud I think you can see Minnesota from Alaska.
04:58 particle i can see rakudo from here.
04:58 pmichaud afk # bbiah
04:59 stockwellb @particle, I've submitted the patch. Thank you.
05:07 dalek r32591 | coke++ | trunk:
05:07 dalek : [m4] bare method names are deprecated
05:07 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32591
05:07 dalek r32592 | particle++ | trunk:
05:08 dalek : [CAGE] use sysinfo op for querying 'osname'
05:08 dalek : patch courtesy of jimmy++, with modifications
05:08 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32592
05:08 Coke lua?
05:08 purl i guess lua is at http://www.lua.org/
05:10 stockwellb rt?
05:10 purl somebody said rt was just RT (http://bestpractical.com/rt) or (:rt3) or (: rt bugs) or Obra's trouble ticketing system or the first IBM RISC workstation (http://www.contrib.andrew.c​mu.edu/~shadow/ibmrt.html) or the bombsquad or the Right Thing or very very capable and open-source or an application framework that bundles a ticketing system or obra's baby or SOOOO slow :-S or email mailto:perlbug-owner@perl.org for access
05:10 Coke rt is our issue tracker.
05:11 particle rt is also http://rt.perl.org/rt3/
05:11 * particle kicks purl
05:11 * purl bites particle!
05:11 particle particle wins.
05:11 stockwellb I was seeing if purl would answer what rt explicitly was. as in the r and the t.
05:11 particle rt is also Request Tracker
05:11 particle rt?
05:11 purl well, rt is just RT (http://bestpractical.com/rt) or (:rt3) or (: rt bugs) or Obra's trouble ticketing system or the first IBM RISC workstation (http://www.contrib.andrew.c​mu.edu/~shadow/ibmrt.html) or the bombsquad or the Right Thing or very very capable and open-source or an application framework that bundles a ticketing system or obra's baby or SOOOO slow :-S or email mailto:perlbug-owner@perl.org for access
05:11 stockwellb Request! that makes sense.
05:12 * particle stares at purl
05:12 * purl sticks her tongue out at particle
05:12 stockwellb This is the first IRC channel that I've ever been in on. Purl is... well interesting.
05:13 * particle pets purl
05:13 purl don't mess with me
05:13 particle botsnack
05:13 purl thanks particle :)
05:14 stockwellb particle, so I rewrote a test and submitted it. I was expecting fanfare, confetti and cheering crowds. Did I do something wrong? :)
05:15 chromatic Four years later, I still expect those too!
05:16 stockwellb I looked around and at first I though maybe there was a special house mod that I needed.
05:16 bacek joined #parrot
05:16 stockwellb @chromatic you sent me sbemail a week or so ago. My kids ate that site up!!
05:17 particle stockwellb++
05:17 particle karma stockwellb
05:17 purl stockwellb has karma of 3
05:17 particle stockwellb <3 karma
05:18 stockwellb My 2nd grader draws Trogdor all the freeking time now.
05:18 chromatic I draw Trogdor all the time now!
05:18 chromatic I'm getting good at drawing the more different S.
05:18 chromatic Everyone's excited and confused.
05:19 stockwellb sbemail was good humor at a time when I needed it.
05:19 stockwellb thank you.
05:20 stockwellb It's pumpkin time. I hope the confetti doesn't fall out of the ceiling while I'm sleeping. It would be shame to miss it.
05:25 dalek r32593 | coke++ | trunk:
05:25 dalek : [rakudo] bare method names are deprecated
05:25 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32593
05:25 cotto coke++ #I'm glad I'm not being deprecated.
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05:44 bacek joined #parrot
05:45 pmichaud (fanfare, confetti, cheering crowds)   I wrote a regular expression engine in PIR.
05:45 pmichaud So far the biggest cheers I've received have been for my LOLCODE lightning talk.  :-|
05:45 pmichaud just goes to show that kittens trump working code.
05:46 chromatic Biggest cheers I've had are for writing a quine which turns itself into an executable which can turn other PIR programs into executables.
05:46 pmichaud chromatic++  # that's one of my favorits
05:46 pmichaud *favorites
05:46 chromatic You didn't check favorites for NULLness before dereferencing it.
05:46 pmichaud I knew it was non-NULL already.
05:51 * Coke watches.. .venture bros?
05:51 * MariachiElf cheers for all those who've written working code.
05:51 pmichaud Is that like Mario Bros?
05:51 jimmy i love pipp and perl
05:52 * MariachiElf brings out a marching band and lines the streets with people who throw confetti at the developers while cheering loudly and with much fanfare
05:53 chromatic Ugh, why are returns_signature and current_returns properties of the interpreter and not the context?
05:53 * MariachiElf wonders if purl could be programmed to cheer at folks who have code commits when they enter the room after their commit
05:55 cotto I'm happy with the autokarma.
06:00 MariachiElf Nah - you guys deserve fanfare and confetti in my book
06:01 MariachiElf Especially the younger/newer developers
06:01 jimmy debugging is mod_perl is difficult, anybody know  mod_parrot will be the same?
06:04 MariachiElf I always thought the difficulty was getting a meaningful debugging tool attached to the right thread -- I mean debugging mod_* is difficult -- I couldn't see mod_parrot being any different just because it's parrot
06:05 MariachiElf Although you might be able to get VM trace saved off......
06:07 MariachiElf I'm thinking something like an instruction dump that the VM executed --- like a packet dump from the netwrok --- tying the results back to code, especially given that there's multiple languages involved seems like it would be difficult
06:07 jimmy i just want to see error info in the browser,not apache log, like php
06:07 jimmy by default.
06:08 chromatic I can't see mod_parrot doing that by default.  It's a security flaw.
06:10 MariachiElf I can't see mod_parrot doing that by default for a number of other reason
06:10 MariachiElf I could see a default exception handler at the top of the executed code that does it
06:11 MariachiElf I could see several ways to do it --- just not "by default"
06:11 chromatic A configuration, sure... but not by default.
06:17 jimmy but i can not make the error log showing in the browse with mod_perl
06:18 jimmy err, in the browser.
06:19 MariachiElf Implement "log differently"
06:19 MariachiElf err "log"
06:19 MariachiElf How are you trying now?
06:20 jimmy Is there any documentation to configure it?
06:24 * MariachiElf doesn't know if mod_perl has any such option
06:24 dalek r32594 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
06:24 dalek : [p6object]:  Add 'add_method' method to P6metaclass.
06:24 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32594
06:25 Theory joined #parrot
06:25 chromatic Hm, the throw op is clearly wrong.
06:25 chromatic ;
06:25 chromatic PMC            *resume = new_ret_continuation_pmc(interp, ret);
06:25 chromatic VTABLE_set_attr_str(interp, $1, const_string(interp, "resume"), resume);
06:25 chromatic dest = Parrot_ex_throw_from_op(interp, $1, resume);
06:26 chromatic That third argument should be an opcode_t *, not a PMC.
06:26 pmichaud throw op blow up?
06:27 chromatic I'm looking at those assertion failures in Rakudo.
06:27 pmichaud ahhh, excellent.
06:27 pmichaud Here's the one that I found earlier.
06:29 solarion are there gtk+/gnome bindings for parrot yet?
06:29 chromatic solarion, to my knowledge no one has worked on them yet.
06:29 solarion dang
06:30 solarion is it likely to be difficult?
06:32 pmichaud svn up -r 32568; <build parrot>; cd languages/perl6;
06:32 pmichaud make t/spec/S02-literals/radix.t # works
06:32 chromatic Time-consuming, yes.
06:32 chromatic Looks like die is wrong too.
06:32 pmichaud ./parrot perl6.pbc t/spec/S02-literals/radix.rakudo # kaboom
06:32 pmichaud ...although now that I think about it, the problem with that test could be in the radix conversion code in perl6str.pmc
06:33 pmichaud oh, except I think I didn't apply that patch yet.  never mind.
06:34 cotto seen barney
06:34 purl barney was last seen on #parrot 1 days, 15 hours, 39 minutes and 34 seconds ago, saying: is goining out to do some chore  [Nov 11 14:54:34 2008]
06:35 solarion pretty long chore.  :)
06:35 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "radix.t abort when run directly" (319 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14564
06:36 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "radix.t works when run from 'make'" (6 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14565
06:39 pmichaud if I reduce radix.t so that it only contains the one set of tests (the ones that abort), then it runs fine from the cmd line.
06:39 pmichaud anyway, that's what I have at the moment.
06:40 chromatic That's confusing.
06:41 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "last set of tests runs fine when run directly" (49 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14566
06:49 solarion perhaps I should package parrot 0.8 for intrepid
06:50 solarion any plans on making a parrot CPU, perhaps on a FPGA?
06:52 * solarion was just reminded of lisp machines
07:00 elmex joined #parrot
07:08 cotto what's <.foo> mean in a grammar?
07:10 Zaba_ joined #parrot
07:11 moritz cotto: call subrule foo, but don't capture its result
07:12 cotto Isn't that the same as <?foo> ?
07:12 cotto nm
07:12 moritz I think <?foo> is a zero-width assertion
07:13 moritz oh wait, it used to be called <?foo>, but that has changed
07:13 cotto <?foo> matches before foo
07:14 pmichaud <?foo>   # zero-width assertion
07:14 pmichaud <.foo>  # non-capturing subrule
07:15 pmichaud it helps to remember that <?foo> is the opposite of <!foo>
07:17 moritz so what's the difference between <?foo> and <before foo>?
07:17 pmichaud they're effectively the same.
07:17 moritz ok
07:17 pmichaud <before foo>  provides a way to see anything that <foo> might've captured.
07:18 pmichaud oh, and it would have to be   <before <foo>>
07:18 moritz right
07:18 pmichaud <?foo> is generally more efficient.
07:19 dalek r32595 | chromatic++ | trunk:
07:19 dalek : [ops] Fixed parameters passed to Parrot_ex_throw_from_op() -- the third
07:20 dalek : parameter is an opcode_t *, not a PMC *.
07:20 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32595
07:25 dalek r32596 | chromatic++ | trunk:
07:25 dalek : [src] Tided some code.  No functional changes.
07:25 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32596
07:31 uniejo joined #parrot
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07:51 iblechbot joined #parrot
08:05 dalek r32597 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
08:05 dalek : [rakudo]: Fix objectref semantics for Match objects (RT #60456, chrisdolan++)
08:05 dalek : * Refactor setup of mutable/immutable builtin types
08:05 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32597
08:20 dalek r32598 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
08:20 dalek : [rakudo]:  Change .PARROTCLASS to .PARROT, so we can add more information.
08:20 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32598
08:33 pmichaud time for sleep
08:34 pmichaud I was hoping to get to the lexicals implementation tonight, but at least I have the design done.  Perhaps I can squeeze it in tomorrow morning.
08:36 szbalint it's great how you get things done while I'm asleep
08:36 szbalint gotta love timezones
08:36 szbalint ;)
08:51 konstantin joined #parrot
08:59 cosimo joined #parrot
09:02 Ademan joined #parrot
09:02 cotto perl6: say %*VM<config><revision>
09:02 polyglotbot OUTPUT[get_pmc_keyed() not implemented in class 'Undef'␤current instr.: '_block11' pc 40 (EVAL_12:23)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;eval' pc 866 (src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:501)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;evalfiles' pc 1141 (src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:631)␤called from Sub
09:02 polyglotbot ..'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;command_line' pc 1320 (src/PCT/HL...
09:02 cotto silly out-of-date evalbot
09:10 bacek joined #parrot
09:16 moritz cotto: works in #perl6 ;)
09:21 cottoo joined #parrot
09:21 cottoo left #parrot
09:31 MariachiElf joined #parrot
09:32 konstantin joined #parrot
09:32 tomyan joined #parrot
09:37 konstantin "parrot: error while loading shared libraries: libparrot.so.0.8.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory"
09:37 konstantin any suggestions?
09:39 konstantin i did Configure.pl, make, make reallyinstall, cd languages/cardinal, make, parrot cardinal.pbc
09:41 konstantin ok, has something to do with make reallyinstall
09:41 konstantin ../../parrot cardinal.pbc works fine
09:42 cotto yup.  Installing isn't recommended yet.
10:12 masak joined #parrot
10:21 masak pmichaud++ # .PARROT
10:28 cosimo joined #parrot
10:30 Zaba joined #parrot
10:36 barney joined #parrot
10:38 jimmy i had sent a email to rt-admin@perl.org, nothing happened.
10:40 cotto barney, ping
10:40 jimmy my email is zhuomingliang@yahoo.com.cn, could anyboy help me?
10:41 cotto jimmy, what's your problem?
10:41 dalek r32599 | fperrad++ | trunk:
10:41 dalek : [Markdown]
10:41 dalek : use .tailcall
10:41 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32599
10:41 jimmy maybe my email address had be blacklisted by rt.perl.org.
10:42 cotto I can't remember who admins that.
10:43 jimmy thanks
10:43 dalek r32600 | bernhard++ | trunk:
10:43 dalek : [unlambda] Adapt to recent changes.
10:43 dalek : Note that a maintainer is sought.
10:43 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32600
10:45 barney cotto: pong
10:45 cotto In Pipp's grammar, is there any reason that inline_sea_*_tag is separate from code_*_tag?
10:45 dalek r32601 | bernhard++ | trunk:
10:45 dalek : [doc] Status updates for some languages
10:45 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32601
10:47 cotto It seems redundant.
10:49 * barney is looking at grammar.pg
10:49 dalek r32602 | bernhard++ | trunk:
10:49 dalek : [lazy-k] .return  ->  .tailcall
10:49 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32602
10:53 dalek r32603 | fperrad++ | trunk:
10:53 dalek : [Lua] lib
10:53 dalek : use .tailcall
10:53 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32603
10:56 barney I think the whole thing is buggy, when there are different tag styles in a file
10:56 cotto I'm sure you're correct, but I still want to handle such code correctly.
10:57 cotto If Pipp discriminates against crappy code, it won't be a very good PHP implementation.
10:58 gmansi joined #parrot
10:58 barney I mean that Pipp is buggy
10:59 cotto that too
11:00 barney Reason for the  inline_sea_*_tag is e.g. HTML within a funktion
11:01 cotto btw, do you know that it's not necessarily HTML, but anything outside PHP tags that's printed directly?
11:02 cotto I'm close to getting that working, but something's adding a phantom newline to the output.
11:02 barney You mean short tags and echo tags within the HTML ?
11:02 cotto I mean that the "sea" can be arbitrary text.
11:03 barney I thought that's PHP. The 'sea' doesn't have to be HTML
11:04 cotto I think we agree.
11:06 cotto eoq
11:07 barney I think in the grammar we need a variable for 'current tag style' and match for 'appropriate end tag'
11:08 barney This leaves the special cases: SEA a start of file, SEA at end of file
11:08 Lorn joined #parrot
11:09 cotto a.k.a the much-loved PHP bug where there's an easily-missed space before the opening <?php tag.
11:09 barney the inline SEA reduce to: <Appropriate end tag>   <SEA>  <any code start tag>
11:10 barney Lucky me, I never had to do any PHP work
11:11 cotto tuit shortage?
11:12 barney @work I always could do my web applications in Perl 5
11:12 dalek r32604 | fperrad++ | trunk:
11:12 dalek : [Lua] compiler
11:12 dalek : use .tailcall
11:12 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32604
11:12 dalek r32605 | fperrad++ | trunk:
11:12 dalek : [Lua] no std lib
11:12 dalek : use .tailcall
11:12 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32605
11:13 cotto happy hacking.  I need sleeps.
11:14 * barney trying to build a test case for the 'our' problem in NQP actions
11:14 barney Good nite, cotto
11:14 cotto night, barney
11:17 dalek r32606 | bernhard++ | trunk:
11:17 dalek : [codingstd] remove trailing whitespace
11:17 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32606
12:00 dalek bernhard.schmalhofer@gmx.de | Pipp:
12:00 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.​org/parrot/index.cgi?pipp
12:14 jimmy joined #parrot
12:15 jimmy what does the libparrot.a file do?
12:15 jimmy i had 99.3M size
12:15 jimmy it had 99.3 size
12:19 moritz its 21M here
12:20 masak 22M :)
12:20 jimmy i don't know why it is so large. all the source code is only 50M
12:20 jimmy my os is windows XP.
12:20 dalek r32607 | bernhard++ | trunk:
12:20 dalek : [docs] two more status updates
12:20 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32607
12:20 moritz on gcc you can tell the compiler to optimize for size
12:21 moritz with -OS
12:21 jimmy i downloaded the official package for windows.
12:23 moritz probably the answer is "it's that large because nobody cared to make it smaller"
12:25 jimmy i don't know hot build parrot in windows xp now.
12:27 jimmy so...it a bit difficult for me  to test parrot.
12:29 moritz I know that particle and jonathan are using parrot under windows, so if you have specific questions you might try to ask them
12:29 moritz but I'm pretty sure it's documented somewhere
12:30 jimmy thanks moritz. i will try it.
12:31 moritz there's a README_win32.pod file in the root directory
12:33 jimmy got it.
12:42 jimmy there is a bad words in the README_win32.pod at the bottom.
12:42 moritz "Last updated: 22 July 2008"
12:42 moritz could be worse
12:42 purl Could be Shlomi
12:42 moritz *g*
12:43 masak :)
12:43 masak jimmy: what word, 'XXX'?
12:43 masak 'François'?
12:43 jimmy GCC/mingw32 support was added in 0.1.2 (Fran�ois Perrad)
12:43 jimmy Fran�ois Perrad
12:43 masak jimmy: ah.
12:43 masak jimmy: no, that word is perfectly ok.
12:44 masak jimmy: it's your editor that's misconfigured.
12:44 moritz it looks like latin-1 in that file
12:44 masak ah, maybe it shouldn't be? should files be UTF-8?
12:44 moritz that's not nice, since most other files are utf-8, I think
12:45 moritz but older perldocs had problems with utf-8
12:45 jimmy ah, in chinese env, any editor looks like a wrong word by default, such as editplus, firefox
12:45 masak jimmy: ni shi zai zhongguo ma?
12:46 jimmy you can speak chinese? and so can kj.
12:46 masak a little. after a year and a half of studies.
12:46 jimmy i am chinese.
12:47 masak wo shi ruidian ren.
12:47 jimmy ah kj can speak a little chinese too.
12:47 masak does this look ok? 我是瑞典人
12:47 moritz that looks all greek to me ;)
12:48 jimmy �����ɣ��㻹���������뷨
12:48 masak ouch. that didn't transfer well at all :/
12:48 moritz now *that* was b0rked
12:48 jimmy yes, looks ok
12:48 moritz we usually speak UTF-8 in here
12:48 masak jimmy: yours didn't :/
12:49 jimmy ni shuru de zhongwen xianshi zheng que
12:50 jimmy i am using utf-8 with mIRC
12:50 masak jimmy: duibuqi, wode zhongwen shuiping bu gou :/
12:50 masak wo kanbudong...
12:51 jimmy nothing, my english is poor too. the chinse words you typed is display ok here.
12:51 jimmy diplayed ok here.
12:52 masak goodie. that's what you said, right?
12:52 jimmy yes.
12:52 masak makes sense now. :)
12:53 masak 'shuru', nice word. I'll remember that.
12:54 jimmy hey masak, welcome to chinese and welcome to shenzhen.
12:54 masak jimmy: thank you :)
12:54 masak jimmy: nide zhongwen mingzi jiao shenme?
12:54 jimmy Zhuo Mingliang
12:55 masak wo shi Mai Gao.
12:55 masak nice to meet you.
12:55 jimmy i think my mirc translate not by utf8
12:56 jimmy http://irclog.perlgeek.de/parrot/today can not show my words too.
12:56 jimmy nice to meet you.
12:56 jimmy Mai Gao is you chinese name? or ruidan name?
12:56 masak zhonggo de.
12:57 masak zhongguo* de.
12:57 jimmy can you type is with chinese words?
12:57 masak 卖高
12:58 jimmy not good chinese name.
12:58 jimmy if it is the right words.
12:58 masak it's not too late to switch, I guess.
12:58 masak 麦高, sorry.
12:58 jimmy good name now.
12:59 masak phew :)
13:00 jimmy it seems to transliterate by english name.
13:00 masak aye.
13:00 masak Carl Masak
13:01 jimmy how old are you? if it is not secret.
13:01 masak 27.
13:01 jimmy i am just 25.
13:02 jimmy had you been in china?
13:02 masak mei quguo.
13:02 jimmy kj had been beijing for a month..
13:03 * masak should maybe have said 'mei daiguo'...
13:03 jimmy welcome to shenzhen. i think english is more poor than your chinese. haha
13:04 jimmy pooer
13:04 masak jimmy: don't be so sure. :) we've basically exhausted my conversation abilities now...
13:05 masak jimmy: if I ever pass through Shenzhen, I will look you up. thank you.
13:06 jimmy welcome, do you have any other IM tool?
13:06 masak not really. I have a Jabber account through my Gmail address, but I'm rarely online.
13:07 masak IM tends to make distract me from work, and I like to get things done. ;)
13:07 jimmy yes.
13:07 masak s/make //
13:08 masak jimmy: how did you learn about Parrot?
13:08 jimmy by perl
13:09 jimmy perl is not very widely used in china. because poor chinese documation, and not well be spreaded
13:10 jimmy err. documentation
13:10 masak jimmy: which scripting language would you say is largest in China?
13:10 jimmy many
13:11 jimmy like java ,php , c/c++/, and js
13:11 dalek r32608 | bernhard++ | trunk:
13:11 dalek : [t] Integrate TestGrammar.pg into new test script complete_workflow.t
13:11 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32608
13:11 jimmy php documention is not poor.
13:11 masak I'd only count PHP and js as scripting languages, though.
13:11 masak yes, PHP's documentation is remarkably good.
13:11 jimmy then java and c/c++
13:11 masak jimmy: know about p3rl.org?
13:12 jimmy python is spreaded now in china now, some funs translate the documentation to chinese.
13:13 jimmy i do not know.
13:13 rob joined #parrot
13:13 masak jimmy: it's an accessible way to get Perl documentation.
13:14 jimmy but i have compile it to chm by myself.
13:14 masak (it's in English, though.)
13:14 masak chm?
13:14 purl chm is but compiled, indexed, html.
13:14 masak aha.
13:14 jimmy it is still english, so perl is not well spreaded.
13:15 jimmy powerful purl!!
13:15 masak indeed.
13:15 jimmy i works with php, and i want php can works on parrot too.
13:16 masak that's where Pipp comes in.
13:16 jimmy yes. thought it is slow coded.
13:16 jimmy slowly
13:17 jimmy so i tried to transplant to do some simple function.
13:22 masak jimmy: I know the feeling. A few of us are writing a wiki engine in Perl 6 (called November), and we often have to translate things down to more basic primitives, as workarounds until all the Perl 6 features are in place.
13:25 jimmy cool! it is a expecting day.
13:25 moritz rakudo: for 'a2b3d'.split(/\d/) { .uc.say }
13:25 polyglotbot OUTPUT[A␤B␤D␤]
13:26 moritz rakudo: for 'a2b3d'.split(/\d/) { .trans(['a'] => ['a']).say }
13:26 polyglotbot OUTPUT[too few arguments passed (2) - 3 params expected␤current instr.: '_block25' pc -339657562 ((unknown file):-1)␤called from Sub '_block25' pc 367 (EVAL_13:132)␤called from Sub '_block11' pc 79 (EVAL_13:27)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;eval' pc 866
13:26 polyglotbot ..(src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:501)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;evalfiles' pc...
13:26 moritz rakudo: for 'a2b3d'.split(/\d/) { "$_".trans(['a'] => ['a']).say }
13:26 polyglotbot OUTPUT[too few arguments passed (2) - 3 params expected␤current instr.: '_block25' pc -339433712 ((unknown file):-1)␤called from Sub '_block25' pc 367 (EVAL_13:132)␤called from Sub '_block11' pc 79 (EVAL_13:27)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;eval' pc 866
13:26 polyglotbot ..(src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:501)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;evalfiles' pc...
13:26 moritz rakudo: for <a b> { "$_".trans(['a'] => ['a']).say }
13:26 polyglotbot OUTPUT[a␤b␤]
13:27 jimmy powerful!!
13:27 masak moritz: let me know if you find a workaround. :P
13:27 masak jimmy: the error you just saw was from a bug discovered the day before yesterday.
13:27 moritz masak: I understand why the first one failed, but why doesn't "$_" return a true Perl 6 string?
13:27 jimmy rakudo: say 'hello, Mai Gao'
13:27 polyglotbot OUTPUT[hello, Mai Gao␤]
13:27 moritz rakudo: for 'a2b3d'.split(/\d/) { "$_ ".trans(['a'] => ['a']).say }
13:27 polyglotbot OUTPUT[too few arguments passed (2) - 3 params expected␤current instr.: '_block25' pc -339535342 ((unknown file):-1)␤called from Sub '_block25' pc 377 (EVAL_13:135)␤called from Sub '_block11' pc 79 (EVAL_13:27)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;eval' pc 866
13:27 polyglotbot ..(src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:501)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;evalfiles' pc...
13:27 masak moritz: beats me.
13:28 moritz even when I add more stuff to the string
13:28 masak moritz: thus far, I've found no way to promote a string to Rakudo space.
13:28 masak let me know if you do.
13:28 moritz masak: have you tried using it as a hash key?
13:28 masak no.
13:29 moritz rakudo: for 'a2b3d'.split(/\d/) { my %h = ($_ =>1); say %h.keys.[0].trans(['a'] => ['a']) }
13:29 polyglotbot OUTPUT[too few arguments passed (2) - 3 params expected␤current instr.: '_block25' pc -339461244 ((unknown file):-1)␤called from Sub '_block25' pc 434 (EVAL_15:150)␤called from Sub '_block11' pc 79 (EVAL_15:27)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;eval' pc 866
13:29 polyglotbot ..(src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:501)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;evalfiles' pc...
13:29 moritz well, nice try ;)
13:29 masak aye ;)
13:30 masak rakudo: <hello, Zhuo Mingliang>.join(' ').say
13:30 polyglotbot OUTPUT[hello, Zhuo Mingliang␤]
13:35 jimmy rakudo: <Hello, Mai Gao>.join('').say
13:35 polyglotbot OUTPUT[Hello,MaiGao␤]
14:11 Coke yay, lua update.s
14:13 rdice joined #parrot
14:15 jimmy rakudo : <hello>.join('').say(' ')
14:16 masak rakudo: <hello>.join('').say(' ')
14:16 polyglotbot OUTPUT[too many arguments passed (2) - 1 params expected␤current instr.: 'parrot;Perl6Object;say' pc 615 (src/gen_builtins.pir:391)␤called from Sub '_block11' pc 44 (EVAL_10:18)␤called from Sub 'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;eval' pc 866 (src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:501)␤called from Sub
14:16 polyglotbot ..'parrot;PCT;HLLCompiler;evalfiles' pc 1141 (src/PCT/HLLCompiler.pir:63...
14:16 masak jimmy: well spotted! :)
14:16 masak is this a new one, or is it the same PGE thing again?
14:17 masak oh, wait
14:17 masak rakudo: <hello>.join('').say
14:17 polyglotbot OUTPUT[hello␤]
14:17 masak nvm.
14:17 jimmy i just try it. hehe
14:17 masak jimmy: it's either invocant or argument, not both.
14:19 jimmy masak: truth, i know nothing about perl6 but perl5
14:20 masak rakudo: 'hello'.say; say 'hello'
14:20 polyglotbot OUTPUT[hello␤hello␤]
14:20 masak jimmy: these two are equivalent.
14:21 masak jimmy: if you are interested, check out the Synopses. http://spec.pugscode.org/
14:22 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:22 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:22 jimmy thanks,i had read it ever.
14:22 dalek r32609 | coke++ | trunk:
14:22 dalek : [lua] bare method names are [DEPRECATED]
14:22 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32609
14:23 gryphon joined #parrot
14:23 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:23 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:23 dalek r32610 | coke++ | trunk:
14:23 dalek : [pheme] bare method names are [DEPRECATED]
14:23 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32610
14:24 jhorwitz joined #parrot
14:25 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:25 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:26 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:26 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:27 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:27 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:27 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:27 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:30 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:30 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:34 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:34 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:35 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:35 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:36 dalek bruce.stockwell@gmail.com | Starting at the bottom:
14:36 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parro​t/index.cgi?starting_at_the_bottom
14:36 jimmy what is this?
14:36 purl this is, like, on CPAN in at least five places
14:36 jimmy ?
14:36 masak jimmy: don't listen to purl.
14:37 masak jimmy: I think it's someone editing that page, and dalek (a bot) reporting the activity.
14:37 masak it shouldn't repeat itself so much, if you ask me.
14:39 jimmy yes
14:46 jimmy somebody editing this page.
14:47 dalek r32611 | bernhard++ | trunk:
14:47 dalek : [HQ9plus] slight simplification of the driver
14:47 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32611
14:47 dalek r32612 | coke++ | trunk:
14:47 dalek : [dotnet] bare method names are [DEPRECATED]
14:47 dalek : This is just the build; more deprecation may be lurking in the test suite.
14:47 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32612
15:13 dalek r32613 | coke++ | trunk:
15:13 dalek : cwd() isn't a builtin
15:13 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32613
15:17 pmichaud purl, forget this
15:17 purl pmichaud: I forgot this
15:18 dalek r32614 | coke++ | trunk:
15:18 dalek : Resolve RT #45859. remove [DEPRECATED] bare method names from PIR
15:18 dalek : chromatic++ for the imcc updates to excise the syntax from PIR.
15:18 dalek : Update the no-longer-TODO test to match actual error syntax.
15:18 dalek : Get the last few straggler languages & compilers.
15:18 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32614
15:26 dalek r32615 | coke++ | trunk:
15:26 dalek : RT #45859; remove last docu-reference.
15:26 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32615
15:30 hercynium joined #parrot
15:32 Andy joined #parrot
15:38 dalek r32616 | coke++ | trunk:
15:38 dalek : fixup heading level so we know which functions these aren't.
15:38 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32616
15:42 Lorn joined #parrot
15:45 dalek r32617 | julianalbo++ | trunk:
15:45 dalek : fix deprecated pir syntax in OpenGL module
15:45 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32617
15:49 Coke NotFound: if we built that .pir into a pbc during 'make', that would have been caught.
15:50 NotFound Coke: we do
15:50 Coke ... odd, when I did 'make', I didn't see an error.
15:50 Coke thanks for the catch.
15:50 NotFound Coke: Did you have all required headers and libs for opengl?
15:50 Coke nope.
15:51 NotFound I suppose is only built when configure detectes them.
15:51 Coke I would expect it to build anyway.
15:51 Coke (and then fail at runtime.)
15:51 Coke ah well. glad you caught it.
15:53 Zaba joined #parrot
15:53 NotFound purl: messages?
15:53 purl To access purl's messages, msg me with the word "messages".
16:09 masak joined #parrot
16:24 dalek r32618 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
16:24 dalek : [rakudo]:  Fix ?? !! associativity (RT #57980, chrisdolan++)
16:24 dalek : * Patch courtesy Chris Dolan
16:24 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32618
16:26 pmichaud afk # lunch
16:27 dalek r32619 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
16:27 dalek : [rakudo]: spectest-progress.csv update: 219 files, 4590 passing, 0 failing
16:27 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32619
16:31 davidfetter joined #parrot
16:39 dalek r32620 | bernhard++ | trunk:
16:39 dalek : [PCT] A first stab at complete_workflow.t.
16:39 dalek : PAST generation is still broken.
16:39 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32620
16:49 Theory joined #parrot
16:53 rindolf joined #parrot
16:53 rindolf Hi all.
16:54 masak rindolf: y0
16:54 rindolf masak: hi.
16:54 rindolf masak: I think I read your blog on use.perl.org
16:54 masak rindolf: could well be.
16:54 rindolf masak: yes, you're the guy who says "X years ago today"
16:54 masak :) yes.
16:55 masak I'm doing a November drive.
16:55 rindolf masak: ah.
16:55 rindolf masak: a la NaNoWriMo?
16:56 masak don't know about that one.
16:56 masak ah, that one. no, the goal here is to benefit November, the project.
16:57 masak not writing for writing's sake.
16:57 * moritz finds the analogies highly amusing ;)
16:58 masak moritz: finding a context is the lot of Man. :)
16:59 masak I gotta go now. but thank you for reading my blog -- it warms my heart. :)
17:04 ruoso joined #parrot
17:08 * Coke adds masak's blog to his roll.
17:08 Coke (roll) is that what the kids are calling it these days?
17:08 Coke blog roll?
17:08 Coke blogroll?
17:08 Coke purl?
17:08 purl yes, Coke?
17:08 Coke purl, scooby snack.
17:08 purl Rank roo, Coke!
17:10 Coke msg particle should we update DONORS.pod to reflect adivsory board members?
17:10 purl Message for particle stored.
17:11 gryphon joined #parrot
17:14 particle aye
17:14 dalek r32621 | coke++ | trunk:
17:14 dalek : This opcode is already gone.
17:14 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32621
17:16 dalek r32622 | bernhard++ | trunk:
17:16 dalek : [t] Append the generated code to the PIR driver,
17:16 dalek : this might be less confusing
17:16 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32622
17:17 apeiron joined #parrot
17:18 dalek r32623 | bernhard++ | trunk:
17:18 dalek : [perl] Slight beautification in Parrot::Test
17:19 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32623
17:36 Coke barney: ping
17:37 Coke barney: nevermind.
17:39 apeiron joined #parrot
17:40 gryphon joined #parrot
17:56 barney coke: I get failures for Parrot::Test
17:56 barney haven't looked into it yet
18:15 konstantin joined #parrot
19:17 chromatic joined #parrot
19:29 dalek r32624 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
19:29 dalek : [pheme]:  Change deprecated 'get_array' to 'list' (RT #54000).
19:29 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32624
19:42 dalek r32625 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
19:42 dalek : [rakudo]:  any, all, none Junctions now act like sets (RT #60444, bacek++)
19:42 dalek : * Patch courtesy Vasily Chekalkin <bacek@bacek.com>
19:42 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32625
20:19 pmichaud Coke:  just sent a patch for RT #54000
20:50 bacek_ good morning
20:51 masak joined #parrot
20:52 Auzon joined #parrot
20:59 moritz it seems that 'make spectest' ignores the files in t/spec/integration/
21:00 moritz at least I can't find them in the output
21:00 moritz can anybody please confirm that, and if true, open a ticket?
21:03 moritz no, they are just run last, although they are first in the list
21:04 pmichaud doesn't 'make spectest' just run the things that are in t/spectest.data ?
21:04 pmichaud ohhhh, I see
21:04 pmichaud I think that one of the harnesses alphabetizes the list
21:04 pmichaud so it thinks that 'i' comes before 'S'  (probably case insensitive)
21:05 dalek r32626 | moritz++ | trunk:
21:05 dalek : [rakudo] add tests for RT #60482 to spectest.data
21:05 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32626
21:05 pmichaud are things in t/spec/integration part of the "official suite"?
21:07 particle yes
21:08 particle they integrate pieces of the spec
21:08 pmichaud weird.  but okay.
21:08 particle so they don't belong under one particular spec classification
21:08 pmichaud I think they should probably run last, then.
21:08 particle i agree
21:09 particle tests should probably run as ordered in the file
21:11 masak that would make the most sense, yes.
21:11 kid51 joined #parrot
21:20 pmichaud Can we get masak's use.perl posts aggregated into planetsix.perl.org ?
21:21 pmichaud I just now noticed them but hadn't noticed them previously.
21:22 bacek pmichaud: I have question about 'new lex'. How it interact with Junctions autothreading? AFAIU we can create methods during runtime _after_ creating closure.
21:23 pmichaud bacek: I don't think it affects anything.
21:23 pmichaud junction autothreading is all about dispatch.
21:24 bacek for now the solution is that a capture_lex operation on a MultiSub
21:24 bacek should perform capture_lex on each of its component Sub PMCs
21:25 bacek If we will add additional Sub to MultiSub it will not be captured. Or I'm totally wrong?
21:25 pmichaud you're wrong.  capture_lex is a runtime operation.
21:25 pmichaud so it will do whatever subs happen to be in the MultiSub
21:25 pmichaud ... is it possible to come up with a way to rebind things such that it doesn't work?  probably.
21:26 pmichaud but I'd need to see a Perl 6 example before I'll really worry about it.
21:27 bacek multi sub foo($a) {
21:27 bacek };
21:27 bacek sub get_foo() {
21:27 bacek return &foo;
21:27 bacek };
21:28 bacek get_foo()($j)
21:28 pmichaud no problem there, as foo gets its capture_lex performed as soon as the program is run.
21:29 pmichaud (not to mention that it doesn't have any outer lexical variables :-)
21:29 bacek pmichaud: ok :)
21:31 bacek any particular bug/issue/feature for rambling developer with little bit knowledge of parrot/rakudo? :)
21:32 pmichaud hmmmm
21:32 dalek r32627 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
21:32 dalek : [rakudo]:  Encourage Parrot String PMCs to promote to Rakudo Str.
21:32 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32627
21:33 pmichaud do we have any ripe rt tickets?
21:34 bacek pmichaud: no idea. I looked through rt queue recently. Closes some old bugs. But there is no that I can fix in couple of hours
21:34 pmichaud we're down to 153 :-)
21:37 pmichaud 151.
21:39 donaldh joined #parrot
21:39 pmichaud I wonder if #57444 can be closed.
21:40 bacek #59552 and #59560 good candidates for apply and close
21:41 bacek +1 for closing #57444
21:50 dalek r32628 | pmichaud++ | trunk:
21:50 dalek : [rakudo]:  Encourage Parrot String to become Rakudo Str *inplace*.
21:50 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32628
21:51 bacek this one should fix masak's bug about substr
21:51 pmichaud maybe
21:51 pmichaud it doesn't help if someone does a method call on a String, but once it gets assigned somewhere it gets promoted
21:52 pmichaud and masak's bug with substr (the one we discussed yesterday) is more of a lexicals bug than a string bug
21:52 Theory joined #parrot
21:54 hercynium joined #parrot
21:57 dalek r32629 | julianalbo++ | trunk:
21:57 dalek : kill several unused variables and avoid some empty loop body warnings
21:57 dalek diff: http://www.parrotvm.org/svn​/parrot/revision?rev=32629
21:58 chromatic Wow, that SVN::Web output is very nearly distinguishable for people with red-green colorblindness.
22:02 NotFound chromatic: at least the tags have a class attribute, so his style can be override by the user.
22:03 chromatic That's good, for users who find themselves getting headaches from squinting and leaning close to the screen, who know how to make their own stylesheets for every SVN::Web installation they visit, I suppose.
22:06 NotFound Providing a high contrast alternate stylesheet will be nicer.
22:06 chromatic I can't figure out where this stylesheet comes from.  It looks different from the one bundled in SVN::Web.  The classes look different.
22:06 chromatic http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/css/trac/diff.css
22:07 NotFound href="http://www.parrotvm.org/svn/css/trac/svnweb.css"
22:07 NotFound The HTML is poorly indented, BTW
22:08 chromatic I need to step away from the computer now anyway.  I'm nauseated.  (No exaggeration.)
22:08 japhb chromatic: How severe is your color blindness?
22:12 Whiteknight joined #parrot
22:22 AndyA joined #parrot
22:24 ruoso joined #parrot
22:25 masak pmichaud: what's the status of the given/loop lexicals catastrophe?
22:26 chromatic japhb, not very severe.
22:27 japhb chromatic: ditto.  It's there, it's annoying, but I've seen worse (npi).  My step-grandfather (no blood relation) was completely color blind -- i.e. no color vision at all, just greyscale.
22:28 chromatic It's just severe enough that I notice myself getting headaches when trying to distinguish hues too close together.
22:29 japhb nodnod.
22:30 bacek pmichaud: wow, small patch for Junction and big post in blog :)
22:30 japhb Perhaps it's worth trying to convince the SVN::Web developers to distinguish by shade or font weight in addition to hue.  Changing upstream would make it easier across the web.  Of course, that's only once various hosts have upgraded, and that could take a while ....
22:31 chromatic I don't think Parrot's SVN::Web installation uses the same colors, though.
22:33 japhb Annoying, that.  Why bother to change the defaults, if not with the express purpose of making it easier to read?
22:34 chromatic It could be an older version.
22:34 pmichaud bacek: well, if one combines that patch with the refactoring I did earlier in the week, I suspect the Junction modifications are bigger than the blog post.
22:35 pmichaud masak: I finished the lexical design last night, but got sidetracked when I started the implementation.  Plus Coke++ was adding a lot of changes to trunk so I wanted to let that settle out before starting on the lex implementation again.  (more)
22:36 pmichaud however, I'm planning to do whatever it takes so that I can go into the summit with a basic lexicals reimplementation in place, so that I can get chromatic, jonathan, allison, others to help debug it in time for the release if possible.
22:36 pmichaud since I got the design written out last night, I'm thinking the implementation will be relatively easy (as long as I'm not having to chase down lots of dependencies in the existing core code)
22:37 NotFound Adding an alternate stylesheet is just a line of html (and the stylesheet, of course). And wait for IE implements a menu option to switch to it ;)
22:37 pmichaud masak: on the plus side, I think I've got some assistance for the String <-> Str issues
22:37 pmichaud assigning a Parrot String to a scalar causes it to convert to a Str
22:37 pmichaud my $a = %ENV<HOME>;   say $a.PARROT;   # Str, not String
22:37 masak pmichaud: very good news.
22:38 masak I've just poured all my frustrations into today's blog post.
22:38 pmichaud yes, I saw that.
22:38 pmichaud (and liked it.)
22:38 pmichaud (the post, that is, not that you were frustrated.)
22:38 masak no, today's.
22:38 masak I'm just about ready to hit the "Save" button
22:38 pmichaud ohhhhhh
22:38 masak but maybe I can throw in some of the good news, then.
22:38 pmichaud I look forward to seeing it then.
22:39 Limbic_Region joined #parrot
22:39 masak pmichaud: today I've described the whole chain of mayhem.
22:39 pmichaud right now I'm writing a post about .PARROT and Str
22:40 masak nice.
22:40 Limbic_Region pmichaud - do you blog anywhere about parrot other than your use.perl journal?
22:42 pmichaud rakudo.org
22:42 purl somebody said rakudo.org was http://rakudo.org
22:42 pmichaud use.perl gets all of the posts, though.
22:42 pmichaud and then I copy to other blogs like rakudo.org and/or parrotblog.org
22:42 pmichaud if you follow use.perl you get them all.
22:45 pmichaud new post: http://use.perl.org/~pmichaud/journal/37870
22:50 masak new post: http://use.perl.org/~masak/journal/37871
22:53 pmichaud Parrot strings are called "String", not "Str"
22:53 * masak fixes
22:53 chromatic That sig_pmc assertion failure looks like an IMCC problem, specifically when running an :immediate sub.
22:54 chromatic I dug through runloop and exception handling code last night, and I can't see that there's anything wrong (that I didn't fix).
22:57 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "new cleaned up version of code (for masak, from use.perl post)" (25 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/14575
22:58 chromatic Anyone with spare time and a strong stomach might look into do_1_sub_pragma in src/packfile.c for a likely culprit.
22:58 masak pmichaud: you mean it works already?
22:58 masak in what universe?
22:58 pmichaud note the $paragraph = $paragraph lines.
22:58 pmichaud *line.
22:58 masak urk.
22:58 masak but still much better.
22:59 pmichaud that will be fixed as soon as I clean up parameter binding
22:59 pmichaud when parameter binding is fixed even that won't be necessary
22:59 masak so this is in HEAD? or just your wc?
22:59 pmichaud head.
22:59 masak cool.
22:59 pmichaud as of r32627
22:59 masak I'll change it in November immediately, and add another postscript to the blog post.
23:01 bacek ./perl6 split.pl
23:01 bacek Cannot assign to readonly variable.
23:01 bacek split.pl from pmichaud's nopaste
23:02 masak bacek: I'm recompiling, but that actually sounds like it could happen. wonder why pmichaud didn't get that, then.
23:02 pmichaud odd, it worked for me.  You're correct that it's readonly, though.
23:02 masak bacek: which revision are you running?
23:02 pmichaud I don't know why I didn't get that.
23:02 pmichaud but just assign to a different variable, then
23:02 masak heh.
23:02 bacek r32596
23:02 pmichaud r32596 is old
23:03 pmichaud right now the assignment is the important thing -- assigning a Parrot String causes it to become a Str.
23:03 pmichaud for that matter, one could do:
23:03 pmichaud $parameter.Scalar()
23:03 pmichaud which would force it to upgrade.
23:03 masak I hope this is a passing idiom.
23:03 pmichaud oh certainly
23:03 purl That's another fine mess you've gotten us into....
23:03 masak purl: :)
23:03 purl masak: Unbalanced parentheses (too many ')')
23:03 pmichaud it's a workaround, for sure.
23:04 masak good.
23:04 pmichaud as I said, once we get parameter binding working properly your original code will work
23:04 pmichaud and once HLL mapping is working, the .split will return Str instead of String
23:04 masak aye.
23:04 masak I don't expect HLL interoperability to be all ponies and lollipops, but I don't expect it to be unnecessarily ugly either.
23:06 pmichaud most of what you're experiencing here is simply the Parrot guts poking out through Rakudo.
23:06 pmichaud none of this would've shown up if String didn't already have a .trans method.
23:07 masak I realize that.
23:07 masak how unfortunate. :P
23:08 pmichaud anyway, I do like today's post also.
23:08 pmichaud it gives a flavor of how things are going (or not going)
23:08 pmichaud I have to go fetch dinner for the family... bbiaw
23:09 masak pmichaud: thanks. will sleep very soon. see you tomorrow.
23:09 pmichaud much of tomorrow I'm on a plane, but i'll be around.
23:09 masak oki.
23:10 pmichaud I hope to have good lexical news, too.
23:10 pmichaud anyway, bbl.
23:11 davidfetter joined #parrot
23:12 * masak will dream of good lexicals tonight
23:13 masak chromatic: :)
23:14 masak chromatic: I'll look into making a t-shirt. sounds like a fun idea.
23:20 chromatic I've told obra that a Best Practical shirt should read "I write code so you don't have to."
23:21 masak :)
23:22 Theory joined #parrot
23:38 Auzon joined #parrot

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