Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2009-02-05

Parrot | source cross referenced

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 rg1 No discussions yet.
00:00 rg1 or were you refering to the visualizations?
00:00 particle yes, and datasets.
00:01 rg1 seems to work without a login
00:01 particle fab, thanks!
00:09 AndyA joined #parrot
00:18 Whiteknight Does anything use the get_pointer and set_pointer vtables of the parrotinterpreter PMC?
00:22 Whiteknight because I want to try to repurpose them
00:26 particle change them and see!
00:26 purl particle: that doesn't look right
00:26 Whiteknight purl you don't look right
00:26 purl Whiteknight: i'm not following you...
00:26 Whiteknight well, if I comment them out I don't get any test failures
00:27 Whiteknight and I can build perl6 without problem, so that's a good bellweather
00:49 dalek parrot: r36369 | whiteknight++ | trunk/src:
00:49 dalek parrot: [PMC] changing ParrotInterpreter set_pointer and get_pointer to point to PMC_data() instead of PMC_struct_val. Should help with later UnionVal deprecation
00:49 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36369/
00:49 Whiteknight yeah. put that in your local checkout and smoke it
00:57 Whiteknight I think we can do the UnionVal switch over now for ParrotInterpreter and ParrotThread PMCs now
01:00 Whiteknight I just need to find all the places they are accessed
01:05 nopaste "cotto" at 96.26.202.243 pasted "ParrotInterpreter and ParrotThread info" (45 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15497
01:05 cotto there you go
01:06 Fayland joined #parrot
01:06 cotto That's everything that gets hit during make test.
01:07 cotto The line numbers may be a bit off.  I don't remember what revision I used to generate that list.
01:08 cotto Whiteknight++
01:09 Whiteknight thanks cotto+!
01:09 Whiteknight thanks cotto++!
01:10 cotto I'll attach the whole file to the wiki page.
01:12 dalek tracwiki: v | cotto++ |
01:12 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/attachment/wiki/PM​CUnionDeprecationTasklist/pmc_unionval_pmc.2.log
01:12 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beeyms
01:13 cotto Cool.  I don't even have to post a link.
01:15 Whiteknight urg, the pmc_reuse function is going to be a mess
01:15 Whiteknight that's going to have to be one of the last things updated
01:17 Whiteknight hey cotto, how is inheritence happening now? Where does the parents data struct get stored?
01:24 cotto Since I can assume single inheritance, a parent's ATTRs are stored before the child's.
01:24 cotto That way if a child is accessed as a parent, nothing breaks.
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01:26 Coke .
01:26 Whiteknight hola coke
01:27 s1n Coke: let me know when you have that write up, i might be willing to help out with the old rt tickets
01:33 szabgab joined #parrot
01:38 Coke s1n: due sunday.
01:38 Coke but basically, the plan is to close out the old tickets in place.
01:39 Coke verifying that old reports still generate the same broken output is helpful.
01:39 Coke making sure patches still apply is helpful.
01:41 Coke that's probably the limit of things that can be done without fixing things.
01:43 chromatic Adding TODO tests....
01:46 s1n Coke: verifying the tickets are still valid is all i can do at this point, so just say when and i'll do what i can to help
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02:02 Coke I don't know what you mean, "say when."
02:02 Coke when?
02:02 Coke I mean, I know what the /phrase/ means... =-)
02:09 s1n Coke: are you not a native speaker? (not an insult)
02:10 s1n by that i mean, post the article, let me know, and i'll do what i can when i can to help move the tickets over
02:11 Coke no, I'm a native speaker; I'm just confused.
02:11 Coke you don't need a go ahead; feel free to do those things right now.
02:12 Coke Thank you for any cleanup you can provide on the queue. It'll be a help.
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03:21 dalek parrot: r36370 | jkeenan++ | trunk/docs/book:
03:21 dalek parrot: Apply patch submitted by tuxdna in http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Tic​ket/Display.html?id=63036:  Correct spelling/grammatical errors in POD.
03:21 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36370/
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03:57 dalek parrot: r36371 | chromatic++ | trunk/t/op/interp.t:
03:57 dalek parrot: [t] Made a TODO test pass by avoiding buffering order issues.  See RT #52354.
03:57 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36371/
03:59 Coke kid51: I just tested the original hang in that RT you closed; it doesn't hang, so we're all cool.
04:00 Coke (it's invalid pir, so you have to change it up slightly.)
04:05 * kid51 must sleep
04:05 purl $kid51->sleep(8 * 3600);
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06:24 dalek parrot: r36372 | Infinoid++ | trunk:
06:24 dalek parrot: [cage] Fix some codetest failures.
06:24 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36372/
06:24 dalek parrot: r36373 | Infinoid++ | trunk/compilers/pirc/src:
06:24 dalek parrot: [pirc] Fix the -o flag in -b mode, for specifying the .pbc filename.
06:24 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36373/
06:28 Infinoid r36372 contains changes to imcc.y which I can't regenerate.  Does anyone have the bison/flex secret decoder ring, so they can tell me which combination of software versions successfully builds in --maintainer mode?
06:34 chromatic bison 2.3 here, flex 2.5.35
06:39 dalek parrot: r36374 | chromatic++ | trunk:
06:39 dalek parrot: [docs] Added initial version of the Parrot Support Policy (TT #244).
06:39 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36374/
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06:39 dalek tracwiki: v109 | chromatic++ | ParrotRoadmap
06:39 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/​wiki/ParrotRoadmap?version=109
06:39 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beezjp
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07:29 dalek tracwiki: v8 | jimmy++ | WhereIsIt
07:30 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parr​ot/wiki/WhereIsIt?version=8
07:47 moritz msg pmichaud when I checkout parrot below the rakudo dir 'make test' throws some errors because the t/pmc/*.t files want to run ../../parrot
07:47 purl Message for pmichaud stored.
07:53 moritz oh, and the generated makefile contains this line:
07:53 moritz t/spec : svn co http:////svn.pugscode.org//pugs//t//spec t/spec
07:53 moritz that's not working, ETOOMANYSLASHES
08:00 janus http://blog.t14g.de/wp-content/up​loads/2008/03/wtf_per_minute.jpg :)
08:00 shorten janus's url is at http://xrl.us/beezoc
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08:56 moritz rakudo: say "test"
08:56 polyglotbot OUTPUT[test␤]
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09:43 dalek parrot: r36375 | cotto++ | trunk/src/pmc/resizableintegerarray.pmc:
09:43 dalek parrot: [pmc] fix bug from UnionVal to ATTR conversion
09:43 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36375/
09:53 dalek parrot: r36376 | cotto++ | trunk/src/pmc/resizableintegerarray.pmc:
09:53 dalek parrot: [pmc] undo accidental commit
09:53 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36376/
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10:12 dalek parrot: r36377 | rurban++ | trunk/src/packfile.c:
10:12 dalek parrot: [docs] add missing function documentation
10:12 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36377/
10:22 dalek parrot: r36378 | rurban++ | trunk/config/inter/libparrot.pm:
10:22 dalek parrot: Checked cygwin dll: An old libparrot dll does no harm to cygwin. To be checked on mingw/msvc also
10:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36378/
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11:08 dalek parrot: r36379 | rurban++ | trunk/src/exec_save.c:
11:08 dalek parrot: [cage] use correctly signed index vars
11:08 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36379/
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14:22 dalek parrot: r36380 | Infinoid++ | trunk/compilers:
14:22 szbalint so far so good
14:22 dalek parrot: [imcc] Regenerate recent changes from imcc.y.
14:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36380/
14:22 dalek parrot: r36381 | Infinoid++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/languages.in:
14:22 dalek parrot: [pod] languages/Makefile needs a realclean hook to remove languages/pod/Makefile.
14:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36381/
14:22 dalek parrot: r36382 | Infinoid++ | trunk/languages/pod/pod.pir:
14:22 dalek parrot: [pod] Get languages/pod compiling.  (One of the includes was failing on case-sensitive filesystems.)
14:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36382/
14:22 dalek parrot: r36383 | Infinoid++ | trunk/src/packfile.c:
14:22 dalek parrot: [cage] Fix some trailing whitespace.
14:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36383/
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14:28 kj Infinoid++ # fixing languages/pod
14:30 sjn jonathan: ping
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14:40 Infinoid cotto++ # finding bugs in dalek's rss parser
14:42 dalek joined #parrot
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14:42 dalek allison@perl.org | Debian/Ubuntu chroot Environment Setup:
14:42 dalek link: http://www.perlfoundation.org/parrot/index.​cgi?debian_ubuntu_chroot_environment_setup
14:42 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beesjm
14:46 sjn jonathan, pmichaud, masak: I've updated the hackathon wiki page with a couple ideas... What do you think of them? (especially #3): http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl6/​index.cgi?oslo_perl_6_hackaton_2009
14:46 shorten sjn's url is at http://xrl.us/bebpnx
14:46 * masak looks
14:47 masak I'm all for it. the more hackathon, the better.
14:47 sjn good
14:48 * sjn is still a bit unsure of how to pull off a "pre-hackathon" at the conference though
14:48 sjn masak: how would you have done that?
14:48 masak sjn: not sure what you mean. :) a hackathon is a couple people sitting in the same room, hacking.
14:49 masak so, you need a room, and a time slot.
14:49 sjn yeah, but this one is at the conference
14:49 sjn which means it might be more a kind of "hackathon demonstration"
14:50 sjn at the conference venue, hopefully
14:50 PerlJam sjn: demonstrating a bunch of people sitting around with computers isn't much of a demonstration  ;-)
14:50 masak pretending to hack?
14:50 sjn dunno
14:50 masak I don't want that. :)
14:50 masak sounds highly frustrating.
14:50 sjn that's why I'm asking...
14:51 sjn how can we make it into something that's interesting and relevant so people at the conference who just "drop in" want to come to the proper hackathon?
14:51 PerlJam sjn: have pizza!
14:51 masak aye!
14:51 sjn yeah, food works :)
14:52 masak food and soft drinks.
14:52 sjn but food maketh a hackathon not
14:52 masak people demo-ing exciting things they wrote helps, I guess.
14:52 sjn PerlJam: what would you have loved to see at something like that?
14:53 sjn demos.... hm..
14:53 masak preferably demos of things that are still ongoing projects and that are hackable right away.
14:53 sjn like an "update on what I've been hacking on the last few weeks"?
14:53 PerlJam sjn: A sign saying "Parrot Hackthon" with food and drinks and people talking about parroty things makes enough of a hackathon.
14:53 PerlJam (for starters)
14:54 sjn hm
14:54 PerlJam People that want to join will see the sign (hopefully) and ask questions and such and hopefully join.
14:55 sjn yep
14:55 masak I like that.
14:55 sjn sure, but shouldn't there be.... more?
14:55 masak Perl 6?
14:55 purl Perl 6 is probably the spec, rakudo and pugs are two of the implementations.
14:56 masak purl: no, Perl 6 is amazing.
14:56 purl okay, masak.
14:56 PerlJam sjn: you could even do something like "the food and drinks cost one RT ticket closure" or something  :)
14:56 sjn haha
14:56 sjn with a "we'll help you close a ticket" stand :D
14:56 PerlJam yeah
14:56 PerlJam :-)
14:56 masak that's a great idea.
14:57 sjn and they get their name on the ticket and in the source code
14:57 PerlJam you're free to hack and hacking buys you food :)
14:57 sjn that's an awesome idea :D
14:58 sjn PerlJam: would you mind adding that idea to the wiki page? :)
14:58 sjn (say under 3.1 :)
14:59 PerlJam well, I don't understand "pre-hackathon" really.  To me, it's just a hackathon.
14:59 PerlJam Like ... what's a pre-lightning talk?  :)
14:59 sjn something that comes before the "main" lightening talk? :)
14:59 kj it's a "warm-up" session ;-)
15:00 masak pre-lightning never strikes the same spot twice.
15:00 sjn (as opposed to "post-lightening talk")
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15:08 sjn PerlJam: what would you call it instead?
15:08 particle hackathon.
15:08 purl hackathon is in the dorms' common area
15:08 particle pre-conference hackathon?
15:09 sjn it's not pre-conference... it's _at_ the conference
15:09 PerlJam then it's just a hackathon.
15:09 sjn (well, strictly speaking, it's after the regular schedule on thursday)
15:09 particle -athon connotes something ongoing, like a marathon.
15:09 particle is it ongoing, or a hacking session during regular sessions?
15:10 particle is it a hack track, where there are different hacking sessions throughout the day(s) in the same room?
15:10 sjn it's a hacking session after the talks are done, for those who want to stick around (there'll be other things happening at the venue too)
15:10 sjn perhaps for a few hours
15:11 PerlJam A hack-track would be awesome.
15:11 masak hack track hackathon.
15:11 sjn it's a one-off, as part of the Go Open conference "Meet the experts" thing
15:12 * sjn is guessing there'll be some other projects and things happening at the same time
15:13 sjn stuff that hopefully makes people want to hang around :)
15:14 sjn PerlJam: feel free to change the wiki text to something more understandable ;-)
15:16 PerlJam sjn: yeah, but then I'd have to actually login and I know I've forgotten my password  :)
15:16 particle sjn++ # conference organizing is *hard*
15:16 sjn particle: not really :-P
15:16 sjn particle: especially if someone else does the work :)
15:16 PerlJam sjn: careful ... that sounds like you're volunteering to do it all the time to me  :)
15:17 sjn PerlJam: what a wonderful opportunity to rectify that problem! :D
15:18 * sjn isn't volunteering at all :-P
15:18 alinbsp joined #parrot
15:18 * PerlJam is still waiting for the email
15:18 sjn it's called "wasting my employer's time" :-P
15:18 * sjn toddles off to get a cup of coffee
15:38 * jonathan is back
15:39 jq- joined #parrot
15:40 masak jonathan: vitajte!
15:41 sjn heya, jonathan  :)
15:42 jonathan "hackathon demonstration" - could be like, a drama. "masak: I HAZ A BUG! WE CAN HAZ RT TICKET!" "jnthn: OMG I WRITEZ THE FIX...OMFG I CAN'T USE GIT...AH FINALLY"
15:43 PerlJam jonathan: heh
15:43 jonathan But then people might think they need to learn lolspeak in order to attend...
15:43 masak jonathan: somehow, the first steps gets repeated 100 times.
15:44 kj well, that's easy with pmichaud's any-to-lolcode converter :-)
15:44 masak s/steps/step/
15:44 jonathan masak: It's a demonstration, not a complete history. :-P
15:44 masak :P
15:45 sjn jonathan: on a scene, with dramatic music, and people holding signs "FIX BUG!" shouting slogans "Christmas in april!"
15:45 moritz you also misssed OH HAI I CAN HAZ TEZT? part
15:45 masak moritz: you coming to NPW?
15:45 jonathan sjn: Hackathon page looks good.
15:45 jonathan sjn: Though later, details on how to get to it etc would be good.
15:46 PerlJam jonathan, sjn: that would make an awesome lightning  talk of sorts .  Get a bunch of people with appropriate signs and run through a hackathon demonstration by coordinated display of those signs.
15:46 sjn hehe
15:47 sjn yep
15:47 sjn jonathan: what do you think of PerlJam's idea to have "fix an RT bug for food" stand?
15:48 sjn have a*
15:48 moritz masak: no :(
15:49 PerlJam or make it a carnival game.  "Step right up! Fix a bug and win a prize!"   :-)
15:49 jonathan sjn: That means I'll come out REALLY fat and masak will come out with weight loss. ;-)
15:49 sjn hehe
15:49 masak :)
15:49 sjn jonathan: or you just hang around and help people fix bugs (they get the commit and the name in the source code)
15:50 sjn you and whoever is around to help
15:50 sjn use it as a recruiting thing
15:50 sjn get people involved :)
15:50 PerlJam sjn: that's where I thin the hack-track would be useful
15:51 PerlJam s/thin/think/
15:51 sjn PerlJam: hack-track, as in a full track, during the conference?
15:51 PerlJam yeah.
15:52 sjn not sure we have room at the conference for that. (it's easier to make things like that happen in the evening)
15:52 sjn I'd love a hack-track, but I'd also love to see people at the Perl 6 talks
15:53 sjn and the other talks
15:53 purl the other talks are japanese
15:53 jonathan sjn: I think that last year it was good that we had the morning "planning" meeting and end of day summary.
15:53 PerlJam sjn: if you could have a few long sessions with various parrot/rakudo/etc hackers shepherding people towards making contributions, maybe they'd be more likely to "get into it" on their own.
15:54 PerlJam It's just an idea.
15:54 sjn jonathan: what do you mean? (you lost me there, what are we talking about?)
15:54 jonathan At the testing hackathon in Oslo last time, in the mroning everyone got together and said what they planned to do for the day
15:54 sjn PerlJam: that's part of my ambition with the hackathon-proper after the conference
15:54 sjn jonathan: ah, yes
15:55 sjn we'll do that this time too :)
15:55 jonathan sjn: Was quite good. But also I don't remember if at the end of the day we had a "what did we achieve" bit too. But I think it's nice.
15:55 sjn we did
15:55 jonathan Doesn't need to be long (even time-limit people lightning-talk style if needed).
15:55 jonathan But was good.
15:55 jonathan I don't think people rambled on for too long last time though.
15:55 jonathan So probably no need for explicit time limit.
15:56 sjn but right now I'm more concerned about the hackathon-demo-at-thursday-evening thing
15:56 jonathan What's the goal of the demo?
15:56 sjn get people involved
15:56 jonathan To give people an idea of what a hackathon is like?
15:56 jonathan Hmm, OK.
15:56 sjn and that yes
15:57 jonathan Would it not be better as a kind of section in the intro talks?
15:57 PerlJam sjn: well, the hack-track would be ideal during the conference to snag new people and the post-conference hackathon woudl be for the serious hackers :)
15:57 jonathan While people are paying attention?
15:57 sjn and show people outside the Perl community what we're doing
15:57 jonathan I'd expect the normal talks would show people what kinda stuff is happening as well, though?
15:57 sjn yeah, probably
15:57 purl well, yeah, probably is something that needs doin/working on
15:58 * sjn smacks purl
15:58 * purl rubs her red behind.
15:59 sjn jonathan: we have the option of doing something on thursday evening, as part of the Go Open "meet the experts" thing
15:59 sjn for a couple of hours at least
15:59 jonathan Oh, OK, I didn't know that this section existed.
15:59 sjn jonathan: how would you use that time?
15:59 jonathan Is there URL aobut it?
15:59 jonathan *about
15:59 sjn it's not a "section"
16:00 jonathan OK, well, "thingy". ;-)
16:00 sjn it's something I'm considering
16:00 jonathan Ah, OK.
16:00 jonathan "Meet the experts" sounds a bit...maybe...like, "come meet celebrity programmers" or something though.
16:00 sjn we have the option, my first idea is to make it into an early start of the hackathon
16:00 sjn jonathan: yeah, it's a stupid name
16:01 jonathan A name more indicating it's a way to find out ways to get involved, is better.
16:01 sjn never mind that
16:01 jonathan But yes, I like the idea.
16:01 jonathan Like a ProjectFest
16:01 sjn something like that
16:01 jonathan So different projects can promote themselves and have things for newbies who might be interested.
16:01 sjn demos, stands, open source projects
16:01 sjn recruiting
16:01 purl somebody said recruiting was suspiciously out of place on IRC. Go to http://www.itknowledge.com/tpj/jobs.html
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16:02 sjn and community visibility (which I'm mainly thinking about)
16:02 jonathan *nod*
16:02 jonathan Yeah, something like that.
16:02 purl it has been said that yeah, something like that is what I'd do as well
16:03 sjn you know... "Perl is dead, nyah, nyah, nyah"
16:03 jonathan A way for people already involved in projects and people curious about them to get together.
16:03 sjn exactly
16:03 jonathan Without having to have the luck to catch a free moment with them around the conference.
16:03 sjn and I'm not expecting everyone to show up at the hackathon, so I'd like to make something like it available to the people right there at the conference venue
16:04 jonathan Sure
16:04 jonathan I guess you want to make more the project discovery part there rather than the actual writing code etc part of what happens at hackathons...
16:04 PerlJam a hack-track carnival with games and flashy lights sounds like the way to go  ;-)
16:04 jonathan Yeah!
16:05 sjn and if we get 120+ Perl people, plus perhaps 100-200 Go Open attendees aware of what's going on, then that might work out very well visibility-wise
16:05 jonathan Whichever project has free beer gets my interest! ;-)
16:05 sjn http://www.freebeer.org/blog/
16:06 sjn (we were considering getting some of that brewed for the conference :)
16:06 sjn doesn't look like it'll happen though :-(
16:06 jonathan :-(
16:06 jonathan Oslo beer = expensive
16:06 sjn mm
16:07 PerlJam Make a big sign that says "Perl 6 Microbrewery"  :-)
16:07 sjn "Fix an RT bug, get a Free Beer"
16:08 PerlJam you probably don't want to be handing out a pint each time though.
16:08 sjn anyhoo, if you have any ideas on how to use thursday evening at NPW, write a few words in the wiki
16:09 sjn PerlJam: yeah, let's make it a thimble-full per bug :)
16:18 Theory joined #parrot
16:20 pmichaud beer for bugs?
16:20 moritz beer *against* bugs please :-)
16:21 pmichaud rakudo:  say 'hello-world'.split(/<ws>/).perl;
16:21 polyglotbot OUTPUT[["hello", "-", "world", ""]␤]
16:22 pmichaud that seems wrongish -- seems like there either should be a "" at the front or no "" at the end.
16:23 pmichaud rakudo:  say 'hello-world'.split(/<wb>/).perl;
16:23 polyglotbot OUTPUT[["hello", "-", "world", ""]␤]
16:23 * pmichaud invites masak to submit a rakudobug.  :-)
16:23 * masak submits
16:24 particle rakudo: say 'hello world'.comb(/\S+/).perl;
16:24 polyglotbot OUTPUT[["hello", "world"]␤]
16:24 moritz pmichaud: what's wrong with it? the trailing item?
16:25 pmichaud moritz:  I can't decide if it's missing a leading item or has an extra trailing one.
16:25 moritz maybe TimToady can comment on that?
16:25 pmichaud rakudo:  say 'h w'.split(/\s*/).perl;
16:25 polyglotbot OUTPUT[["h", "w", ""]␤]
16:26 pmichaud I'm guessing "missing a leading item", but my guesses seem to be wrong more often than not.
16:30 pmichaud afk for a bit
16:33 dalek parrot: r36384 | NotFound++ | trunk/compilers/imcc/imcc.y:
16:33 dalek parrot: [imcc] fix a bison problem, TT #275
16:33 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36384/
16:35 Infinoid NotFound++ # that's been a problem for me for *months*!
16:37 NotFound Infinoid: not so fast, I don't tested it with 2.4
16:38 Whiteknight pmichaud, can you take a look at RT #37578 and see if this is still an issue for you?
16:38 Whiteknight I'm pretty sure :unique_reg fixes it
16:38 Infinoid NotFound: I'm going to test with 2.3 and then 2.4.1, one moment
16:39 NotFound I have 2.3
16:40 Andy joined #parrot
16:42 kj Infinoid: could you also run bison 2.4.1 on compilers/pirc/src/pir.y?
16:42 kj (i don't have 2.4.1)
16:43 sjn pmichaud: Tell me what you think of <http://xrl.us/bebpnx>, and especially point #3? :)
16:45 Infinoid strange, that resulted in a linker error.  trying again in a fresh checkout
16:50 Infinoid Confirmed in a fresh checkout.  (though I had to touch imcc.y to convince make to regenerate)
16:50 Infinoid /home/infinoid/parrot-dev/biso​n-test/blib/lib/libparrot.so: undefined reference to `_namespace'
16:50 Infinoid I also tested with bison 2.3; that worked fine
16:51 NotFound _namespace?
16:51 kj not sure, is there a version of bison after 2.4?
16:51 kj ISTR that 2.4 had issues...
16:51 NotFound We must not have any global symbol with that name-
16:52 Infinoid there's 2.4.1
16:52 kj yes, but I think there's a 2.53 or so
16:52 Whiteknight particle: ping
16:52 NotFound symreg.h
16:52 NotFound 111:EXTERN Namespace * _namespace;
16:52 NotFound WTF?
16:54 davidfetter joined #parrot
16:55 Infinoid it's referenced in push_namespace() in symreg.c
16:55 kj it seems, from a google search, that many projects have problems with 2.4.1
16:56 Infinoid I can just blacklist that version so gentoo stops updating me to it
16:57 NotFound Some objection to rename it as pesky_global__namespace ?
16:58 Infinoid I have no problem with that.  Though I'm not sure why I get the error with bison 2.4.1 but not with bison 2.3
16:58 kj preferably it would go into IMCC_STATE or whatever
16:58 kj the IMCC structure with global stuff
16:58 NotFound Infinoid: is declared as extern but never defined.
16:58 Infinoid does imcc 2.3 define it?
16:59 Infinoid symreg.c is code we wrote, and the reference to _namespace is dated 2007-04-18, so apparently it was there before
16:59 Infinoid ...but I don't see it anywhere in my local diff, so I'm confused
16:59 NotFound Don't know why it doesn't always fail
17:01 kj are we sure that EXTERN actually expands as 'extern'?
17:01 kj and there seems to be something in imcc/unit.h (checking..)
17:01 Infinoid kj: it's referenced on compilers/imcc/symreg.c line 133, regardless of what EXTERN does
17:02 kj oh that's not it (unit.h)
17:02 Infinoid oh, I see, if EXTERN defines to "", it'll declare it and then life is good?
17:02 kj well, if EXTERN is really expanded as 'extern', then it's not a declaration; otherwise it is
17:02 kj well, life is better ;-)
17:02 Infinoid heh :)
17:03 NotFound #ifdef PARSER_MAIN
17:03 NotFound #  define EXTERN
17:03 NotFound #else
17:03 NotFound #  define EXTERN extern
17:03 NotFound #endif
17:03 kj which in this case is really a paradox... it's not "better" (than good). Anyhoo...
17:03 kj NotFound: exactly, that's what I thought
17:03 Infinoid "It's better than bad, it's good."
17:03 NotFound This sucks
17:03 purl Nothing sucks, it only BLOWS.
17:03 kj (prototype code)--
17:03 Infinoid log++
17:04 kj but apparently EXTERN is expanded differently based on the bison version?!
17:05 particle git fetch origin && git rebase master ## get changes from github's master, and merge with my local changes??
17:05 Infinoid itym "git rebase origin"
17:06 Infinoid it's git rebase <from>, not git rebase <to>
17:06 particle sorry, i got the wrong command from the cheatsheet
17:06 Infinoid err.  I think I failed to make it any clearer.
17:06 particle git rebase master is for a new branch
17:06 particle git fetch origin && git rebase origin
17:06 NotFound The funny thing is that is used only in symreg.c, there is no need to make it extern
17:06 Infinoid git rebase master means "take my local diffs and stack them on top of the stuff in the master branch"
17:08 particle i want the equivalent of "svn up"
17:08 Infinoid yeah, "git fetch && git rebase origin"
17:08 Infinoid or if you like, git pull --rebase
17:08 Infinoid (same thing.)
17:11 Infinoid I think we can make this simple
17:11 Infinoid in your ~/.gitconfig or /etc/gitconfig or whatever:
17:11 Infinoid [alias]
17:11 Infinoid update = pull --rebase
17:11 Infinoid now "git update" works.
17:12 hercynium joined #parrot
17:12 elmex joined #parrot
17:14 particle1 joined #parrot
17:16 particle1 git doesn't seem to respect my .gitconfig, i need to modify one in every project root
17:16 Infinoid urk.
17:16 Infinoid msysgit, right?
17:17 particle1 in any case, my rebuild rakudo script (rbr.cmd) is now working
17:17 particle1 yes
17:18 Infinoid I'm gonna test msysgit a little, and bang out some bug reports if I can't find a better way :)
17:18 particle1 thanks!
17:18 particle1 i do have HOME defined, btw
17:18 particle1 so it's not that simple :)
17:19 Infinoid ok.  but they might be preferring "gitconfig.ini" or somesuch on that platform
17:19 particle1 oh, and i'm using it via windows command shell, not git bash
17:19 particle1 hrmm.
17:19 Infinoid I don't know.  if all else fails, I'll just run "strings" on their binary :)
17:19 Whiteknight particle1: Has your Inf/NaN work recently resolved RT #38887?
17:22 particle1 yes, will close now
17:22 dalek parrot: r36385 | NotFound++ | trunk/compilers/imcc:
17:22 dalek parrot: [imcc] drop EXTERN qualifier from the _namespace symbol, make it static and rename it creatively
17:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36385/
17:24 NotFound Many moons ago, there was a ticket about killing globals from imcc
17:24 particle1 kill them all!
17:24 purl http://www.monkeydyne.com/rm​cs/dbcomic.phtml?rowid=7480
17:25 kj I think the _namespace is one of the last few...
17:25 kj (hint hint ;-)
17:26 Whiteknight particle1++
17:26 particle stupid net.
17:26 davidfetter anybody @ FOSDEM?
17:27 NotFound Infinoid: can you try it again now?
17:33 Infinoid NotFound: linked successfully, running testsuite now
17:41 Infinoid NotFound: All tests successful on linux-x86-64 with bison 2.4.1
17:41 NotFound Good :)
17:46 Infinoid particle: C:\Program Files\Git\etc\gitconfig works for me
17:46 particle with no .?
17:46 particle hrmm
17:47 Infinoid yeah.  There's a 3 level config inheritance scheme... first /etc/gitconfig, then overwritten with values from ~/.gitconfig, then overwritten with values from .git/config
17:47 Infinoid I'm still not sure where the $HOME one looks.
17:47 particle ok. i have c:\usr\git\etc\gitconfig, so at least i can modify that
17:47 Infinoid try adding [test] foo = bar, and see if it shows up in "git config -l"
17:49 particle wtf.
17:49 particle added [foo2] bar2 to %HOME%/.gitconfig and it worked
17:49 Infinoid I didn't do it, I swear
17:50 particle can aliases refer to each other?
17:50 particle alias.up=update ; alias.update=pull --rebase
17:51 Infinoid I don't know.  But you can just stick whatever you want in a .cmd or .bat file and run that, if you prefer
17:51 Infinoid prefixing your command with ! means it's treated like a shell command
17:51 Infinoid more details are in 'git help config', for the interested.
17:52 particle C:\Users\particle>git up
17:52 particle Expansion of alias 'up' failed; 'update' is not a git-command
17:52 particle no worries though, fixed
17:53 particle infinoid++
17:54 Infinoid Great.  Next thing this box needs is ccache-win32.
17:54 particle seems git pull --master gives a non-zero exit if you're up to date already :(
17:54 particle annoying, but worked around.
17:55 particle ccache was easy to install config, now that i fixed parrot
17:55 particle install/config
17:55 * particle wants pmccache
17:56 Infinoid I was thinking of starting with strcache.  But they're both useful ideas
17:59 chromatic joined #parrot
18:03 mberends joined #parrot
18:03 Infinoid Ooh, doublequoting error on mingw
18:05 nopaste "Infinoid" at 96.238.213.50 pasted "mingw build failure" (47 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15502
18:06 particle ugly
18:07 elmex joined #parrot
18:09 rurban -Wl,-L blib/lib can be removed from mingw
18:11 cotto NotFound++ #pesky_global__namespace
18:14 particle 6629/145.86
18:14 purl 45.4476895653366
18:15 particle 6629/88.78
18:15 purl 74.6677179544943
18:15 particle rakudo passes 45% of the official test suite, and 74% of its regression suite
18:16 particle wow.
18:17 chromatic 7250 tests is halfway?
18:17 particle t/spec has 14586 tests
18:19 chromatic 7293
18:19 rurban Infinoid: do you fix this mingw double-quote or should I take it?
18:19 chromatic We could hit that in a month.
18:20 particle yeah, i think we can
18:21 Infinoid rurban: I'm at work, I won't have any tuits until this evening, please feel free :)
18:23 rurban hints: libparrot_ldflags   => "\"$build_dir\\libparrot.dll\"", => dynpmc: # Paths need quoting as they may contain spaces.
18:23 rurban but the path is already quoted of course
18:25 nopaste "rurban" at 212.183.50.172 pasted "fix "mingw build failure" (47 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15502" (21 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15503
18:28 rurban I'm running this through my "buildfarm" now but it should only affect mingw
18:36 nopaste "rurban" at 212.183.50.172 pasted "fix "mingw build failure" at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15502 #2" (22 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15504
18:38 Infinoid Isn't it possible (but less likely) that someone may be building parrot on unix in a directory with spaces?
18:39 * Infinoid isn't really sure this needs to be a special case
18:39 chromatic It's possible.
18:40 Infinoid Though I suppose using quotes everywhere makes the build logs ugly
18:41 rurban pwd is space poisened? hmm, unusual, but should be thought of.
18:42 rurban We could check it in advance and quote the space with \
18:43 rurban only cmd.exe cannot properly quote space with \, but there we have it quoted.
18:43 Infinoid Or just detect spaces in pwd, and only bother setting $PATHQUOTE in that case
18:43 Infinoid I dunno.
18:44 Infinoid I think that'd be nicer than just doing it in the $^O eq 'MSWin32' case
18:45 rurban true
18:45 rurban but what other chars need to be shell quoted then?
18:46 Infinoid space is by far the most common one
18:46 rurban perl5 has some qx logic to detect these chars and quote it corerctly then
18:48 rurban I'll have to leave in 15min so I won't do it either :)
18:57 nopaste "rurban" at 212.183.50.172 pasted "mingw msvcrt failures" (12 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15505
19:03 rurban mingw32-make realclean => make -C languages clean process_begin: CreateProcess(NULL, make -C languages clean, ...) failed.
19:03 rurban make <=> mingw32-make
19:04 rurban But I'm not sure if this is a kosher error, or not a wrong rsync inbetween
19:13 rurban Oh, how I love my daily solaris: "No space left on device" ZFS is awsome
19:21 Infinoid heh
19:26 particle i thought zfs fixed everything!
19:30 rurban I came up now with this solution: zfs list -t snapshot | perl -ane 'system("zfs destroy $F[0]") unless /^NAME/'
19:32 rurban ZFS is a dream if you have enough space left
19:32 rurban if not you cannot even delete files anymore, boot and login neither
19:34 * Coke wonders if he can afford to go to any parrot cons this year.
19:36 rurban rm -rf /usr/X11R6   helps, hopefully
19:42 barney joined #parrot
19:43 ask_ joined #parrot
19:44 ask- joined #parrot
19:51 Whiteknight how do I add a new core PMC to the build?
19:51 rurban makefiles/root.in
19:51 rurban config/gen/makefiles/root.in exactly
19:51 Whiteknight where in root.in? I just looked through there and couldn't find any obvious place to add it?
19:55 Coke src/pmc/pmc.num ?
19:56 rurban config/auto/pmc.pm
19:56 rurban right: src/pmc/pmc.num
19:57 Whiteknight urg, is there a way to automatically renumber this list?
19:58 particle ack -af tools/
19:58 particle or maybe ack -ag pmc tools/
19:58 Whiteknight i found the "pmcrenumber" make target
20:00 Whiteknight yeah, that worked
20:00 Coke (renumber the list) hell, that would have been useful when I was removing pmcs.
20:00 lu_zero joined #parrot
20:01 Whiteknight I've got a prototype BigNum PMC I'm playing with
20:01 Whiteknight it's mostly te BigInt PMC run through a few regexes, but it's not bad
20:01 chromatic Why do we need a separate BigInt and BigNum?
20:02 Whiteknight GMP has two completely separate sets of functions for the two types
20:02 Whiteknight plus, one doesn't have decimal points
20:03 rurban well, one is exact, the other not.
20:04 chromatic I'm not sure GMP's model is right.
20:04 Whiteknight that sounds like a problem for the GMP people
20:05 Coke no; we can use external libraries, but we should still decide what /our/ API is.
20:06 Whiteknight We have an RT ticket that requests the creation of a BigNum PMC. ergo, I am writing one
20:06 Whiteknight and when we decide that it's a stupid thing to have, we can open a second ticket to have it removed
20:06 Whiteknight ...and I'll rake in the karma on both transactions :)
20:07 chromatic I can see having Float and an Integer types, but I don't see a lot of benefit to having more than one arbitrary precision unlimited size type.
20:08 Whiteknight In which case, we would keep BigNum, since it's more general and useful then BigInt is
20:08 Whiteknight either way, we do need to write BigNum. The question is whether we keep a separate BigInt after the fact
20:08 chromatic Fair enough.
20:09 rurban BigInt is a special faster case of BigNum
20:09 Whiteknight questions like this are for the architect, I'm just a mindless grunt
20:10 barney BigInt can be abused as a BitArray
20:12 Whiteknight barney: STRINGs can do that too, and ResizableBooleanArray
20:13 barney Yes, I always thought the BigInt and  ResizableBooleanArray should be merged
20:13 NotFound Please don't abuse STRINGs
20:13 Whiteknight NotFound: we have a binary: charset that can be used to turn strings into dumb buffers
20:14 NotFound We have it? Last time I asked was considered a bad idea.
20:14 Whiteknight BigInt seems to be more infinitely growable: BigNums have machine-dependent limits on manitissa size
20:14 Whiteknight NotFound: I thought we had it
20:14 chromatic Is that a GMP limitation?
20:14 Whiteknight chromatic: yes, based on the documentation I am seeing
20:15 Whiteknight looks like the mantissa of a BigNum can be +/-INT_MAX
20:15 NotFound Whiteknight: some people seem to think that latin-1 is a sort of plain binary charset.
20:16 chromatic What about IBM's fixed decimal math library?
20:17 Whiteknight I dont know anything about IBM's library
20:19 Whiteknight you have some kind of a link for it?
20:19 chromatic http://speleotrove.com/decimal/
20:21 Whiteknight ideally, I think the BigNum and Bigint PMCs could both be wrappers over any number of math libraries, depending on what the user has on their system
20:22 chromatic Ugh.
20:23 chromatic I should elaborate.
20:23 chromatic "Ugh, installation, configuration, and run-time behavior differences problems leading to unpredictable and difficult-to-debug behavior."
20:24 IceGuest_7 joined #parrot
20:25 kj joined #parrot
20:26 Coke external libraries are ok IMO, but only if we're consistent about it.
20:29 NotFound For example, we are consistent about we use icu for unicode things, but people still complains about things that does not work without icu ;)
20:30 NotFound And when we add some quick fix to make it work, they use it to exemplarize that we have fallbacks.
20:37 szabgab joined #parrot
20:41 rurban http://speleotrove.com/decimal/#summary looks weird to me.
20:43 rurban use decimal; should be tried out as perl5 pragma first. for financial stuff
20:51 dalek parrot: r36386 | kjs++ | trunk/languages/pod:
20:51 dalek parrot: [pod] add lists for blocks and =over lists. + add 'say' builtin
20:51 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36386/
21:21 dalek rakudo: f990451 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | tools/autounfudge.pl:
21:21 dalek rakudo: [tools/autounfudge.pl] various small updates
21:21 dalek rakudo:  * follow symlinks
21:21 dalek rakudo:  * allow finer graded control over what we want to have fudged
21:21 dalek rakudo:  * a bit more documentation
21:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f​990451545fb50a378069eb748d99cb09021c70d
21:21 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/bee3zs
21:24 GeJ Good morning everyone
21:40 szabgab joined #parrot
21:41 NotFound Hey, stupid bots, you've stolen my commit message
21:52 AndyA joined #parrot
21:54 cotto parrot: r36387 | NotFound++ | trunk/compilers/imcc:
21:54 cotto parrot: [imcc] kill EXTERN macros
21:54 cotto parrot: Drop unused block_emun_flags global variable
21:54 cotto parrot: Rename is_def symbol and declare and define it without macros
21:55 cotto parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36387/
21:55 cotto all better now
21:58 NotFound But you're not a bot, aren't you?
22:04 Tene I am!
22:05 confound joined #parrot
22:07 chromatic Hm, instead of a pesky global, how about more flags on IMCC_INFO(interp)?
22:07 Infinoid No, see, that would be smart.
22:08 NotFound chromatic: the intention of the names is that someone gets rid of them.
22:08 chromatic Refactoring via verifiable baby steps is fine with me.
22:08 chromatic Hah, that's like the comment in the GC a while back that said "If you use this, it'll probably segfault."
22:09 NotFound I like better executable comments
22:09 chromatic It took less time to fix than it would have to write the comment.
22:09 NotFound Not to me, I fear touching imcc ;)
22:09 Whiteknight joined #parrot
22:10 rg would someone mind telling the newbie, why you're still fiddling with imcc when pirc is supposedly the future?
22:11 Infinoid Because pirc isn't the present yet, apparently.
22:11 NotFound rg: becuse it brokes somenone's build
22:12 Infinoid Though pirc seems to be working fine, here
22:12 Infinoid (At least, examples/pir/substr.pir gets through it and runs fine)
22:14 particle compile rakudo with it.
22:14 khatar joined #parrot
22:14 khatar hello world
22:14 purl i guess hello world is http://www.roesler-ac.de/wolfram/hello.htm
22:14 Infinoid hello khatar
22:15 szabgab joined #parrot
22:36 khatar i hope my question isn't too stupid: is it possible to write functions in haskell in order to link it to parrot through NCI ?
22:37 moritz haskell is said to have a pretty good NCI
22:37 moritz so you could probably embed parrot into haskell apps
22:37 moritz don't know how hard/easy it is the other way round
22:38 PerlJam moritz: not just probably; definitely.  audrey did it.
22:38 khatar isn't NCI here to do the opposite ? (write in haskell, use in parrot)
22:38 PerlJam (but, yeah, I'm not sure about the other way around either.  Not enouhg haskell-fu)
22:38 moritz khatar: NCI is for "write in C, use in parrot"
22:39 PerlJam khatar: if you can compile haskell code to a library with the C calling conventions, you can probably use NCI to get at it from parrot.
22:39 NotFound khatar: NCI is intended to interface with system libraries, that is, things that have a C interface.
22:41 khatar ok... so the question i have to answer isn't can NCI use haskell code but can ghc compile haskell with C calling conventions
22:41 khatar thanks guies
22:42 rurban_ joined #parrot
22:42 NotFound Alternatively, you can write a Haskell compiler in parrot
22:43 moritz ;-)
22:43 khatar NotFound, haha i'm not skilled enought fot these kind of work
22:43 NotFound And then, compile pugs with it
22:44 khatar my first attempt is to write my wiki syntax grammar
22:55 szabgab joined #parrot
23:02 dalek parrot: r36388 | NotFound++ | trunk/languages/ecmascript​/src/classes/Boolean.pir:
23:02 dalek parrot: [ecmascript] fix Boolean stringify
23:02 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36388/
23:03 szabgab joined #parrot
23:05 Whiteknight joined #parrot
23:12 Whiteknight urg, 31 active tickets outstanding for the 0.9.1 release
23:12 moritz which is... when?
23:12 moritz in 9 days?
23:13 Whiteknight 12 days
23:13 Whiteknight still, not much
23:25 szabgab joined #parrot
23:34 Whiteknight has Rakudo moved to it's own repo yet?
23:36 Whiteknight seems like TT #267 could be closed when that happen
23:38 GeJ Whiteknight: the last commit in Parrot's rakudo is 4 days old.
23:39 GeJ I believe that development moved to github.
23:39 GeJ http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commits/master
23:40 chromatic If every committer fixed two or three tickets....
23:41 Infinoid I'm too busy making new tickets
23:42 Infinoid (Translation: too busy being part of the problem.)
23:43 ron joined #parrot
23:44 Whiteknight I'm closing tickets as fast as I can
23:45 bacek_ joined #parrot
23:46 Whiteknight I can close TT #178 if I can add an extra pointer to PObj and all isomorphic objects
23:47 Whiteknight the tradeoff is that eventually we will be taking the UnionVal structure out of them, which is a net win
23:48 Whiteknight plus, that extra pointer can be added conditionally only when the MS GC is active
23:48 chromatic I'm not sure that's the right approach.
23:49 Whiteknight I don't think it is either, which is why I mention it here and not just do it and commit it
23:49 TiMBuS joined #parrot
23:49 kid51 joined #parrot
23:51 ron Does anyone know why the object pmc forwards bitwise (and/or) and compare mmd vtable functions through the proxy pmc but won't use proxy on math vtable mmd functions?
23:51 chromatic Probably an oversight.
23:54 ron Should I post a bug note including the vtable mmd functions that seem to have been left out of lib/Parrot/Pmc2c/PMC.pm (sub vtable_method_does_multi)?
23:55 chromatic If you like.  A test case would be even better.
23:56 ron Thanks - have a test case with cmp_num and hope to get to it today/tomorrow.
23:57 Whiteknight With the UnionVal gone, there won't be any pointers in a PObj at all
23:57 chromatic Evil thought:
23:58 chromatic a union containing a PObj and a GC pointer.
23:58 Whiteknight I had thought about that
23:58 Whiteknight probably going to run into all sorts of alignment problems
23:58 chromatic I wouldn't think so.
23:59 chromatic The compiler ought to pad any pointer sufficient that you can store it wherever it has to land.
23:59 ron left #parrot
23:59 chromatic As long as PObj is big enough to contain a single pointer (and it already contains one, right?) then it should work.

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