Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2009-02-24

Parrot | source cross referenced

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:02 cotto You're right, although Parrot would have been broken since my NCI ATTR conversion if that code ran during make test.
00:03 jonathan ah, fail...
00:04 cotto (If there were a test failure, I would have caught it and converted the Bound_NCI PMC too.)
00:09 AndyA joined #parrot
00:15 kid51 joined #parrot
00:17 NotFound I'm not sure what a NCI method call is supposed to be. Just a NCI function call that takes a PMC as his first argument?
00:19 rg kid51 :) i have a question for you. is there already a ticket somewhere documenting the test problems when parrot is using a different compiler from perl?
00:26 Whiteknight cotto: Bound_NCI is used
00:26 Whiteknight I need to find where, but I know it is
00:26 Whiteknight I don't know what it is *
00:28 kid51 rg:  Not sure I understand you.  Parrot ought to use any C-compiler ... though we have vastly more experience with GCC.  What do you mean by "different compiler from perl"?
00:29 NotFound Is used in object.pmc
00:29 rg there are a number of tests in t/steps/ that appear to test the compiler that they get from perl's configuration (in my case gcc).
00:29 Whiteknight yeah, and in default.pmc
00:30 rg if that compiler can't be found (because i'm using sun's cc for parrot) then those tests fail.
00:30 kid51 Ah!
00:31 kid51 This has nothing to do with perl (i.e., nothing to do with the Perl 5 you use to run Configure.pl).
00:31 kid51 It has everything to do with your OS and your C-compiler.
00:32 kid51 Can you paste output of Configure.pl (including any command-line options you use with it)?
00:32 NotFound But do we have some test were an NCI call is used as method on an object?
00:32 rg Configure.pl works just fine. but the tests don't seem to pick up those options.
00:32 rg when doing a make test i mean.
00:33 kid51 Alright, can you paste result of 'perl Configure.pl --test'?
00:33 kid51 That will run all pre- and post-configuration tests, including t/steps/*.t.
00:34 rg sure, just a second
00:34 Topic for #parrotis now Parrot 0.9.1 Released | http://parrot.org/ | 451 RTs left!
00:36 nopaste "rg" at 62.216.218.102 pasted "perl Configure.pl --test output" (181 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15703
00:39 NotFound I inserted an 'abort()' in the object.pmc usage of Bound_NCI and all test pass. So this feature is at least seriously undertested
00:42 kid51 rg:  I'm not surprised at those failures.  They reflect a long-standing problem we've had with Sun/Solaris.
00:43 kid51 rg:  If you look at config/init/hints/solaris.pm, you will see that it differs significantly from the hints files for all other actively maintained OSes.
00:43 rg are you sure it's just solaris? i can't think of another platform where gcc wouldn't be available
00:44 Whiteknight NotFound, it does look like a very complicated case where it gets invoked
00:44 NotFound Whiteknight: I'll try to use it in embed.t
00:45 kid51 rg:  The hints file for Solaris uses callbacks:  Parrot::Configure::Data::settrigger(), gettrigger() and deltrigger().
00:46 Whiteknight NotFound: Yeah, that looks like what's needed. You have to define the Class in C through an embedding, and then write the method in C
00:46 kid51 Those P::C::Data methods were written by Andy Dougherty, who also wrote the relevant code in config/init/hints/solaris.pm.  The latter is the only hints file that uses those callbacks.
00:47 Whiteknight Although the way it does invocation looks pretty arcane, I'm not happy about that
00:47 NotFound Whiteknight: I'll try first to create a class in pir and use add_method with an nci sub
00:47 kid51 rg:  What the callbacks do is, in a subsequent config step, set a trigger that goes off in a yet later config step.
00:48 kid51 rg:  Which means that the config steps are not, in a certain sense, self-contained.  Which means that tests such as those in t/steps/, which assume that the config steps are (more or less) self-contained, won't work.
00:49 kid51 rg:  IIRC, Andy D's rationale for that approach was to be able to try out different C-compilers, including gcc, on Solaris.
00:50 kid51 rg:  But it means that Solaris, in effect, is configured differently by Parrot from all other OSes.
00:51 kid51 rg:  Andy D advocates this use of callbacks during configuration.  And since (a) he's the principal author of Perl 5's Configure (or so I was told) and (b) for a long time he was the only person developing on Solaris, his opinion has to be given weight.
00:52 kid51 rg:  But I have never been very happy with that approach, because it means that the configuration steps can never be fully tested on that OS.
00:53 kid51 Now, some (perhaps, a lot of) people will say, "As long as Configure.pl completes, why bother to test the individual configuration steps at all?"
00:53 kid51 I don't share that opinion, needless to say.
00:54 kid51 But it does mean that we no longer include the pre- and post-configuration tests in the set of tests covered by 'make test'.
00:55 kid51 And that's where things are likely to remain until we purge all the Perl 5 from the Parrot configure/build process and scrap Configure.pl entirely.
00:56 kid51 ... unless someone (hint, hint) actually wants to be Parrot's porter to Solaris, a role that is currently unfilled.
00:56 rg well the easiest "fix" would be not to run the offending tests on solaris
00:57 rg heh, i guess i was asking for that ;) however my main motivation for trying to run parrot on solaris was to help out with a 64bit big endian platform for rurban.
00:57 kid51 True.  And if you'd like to submit a patch for that, I'll give it serious consideration.  As I said, I'm not surprised that it was those three config steps that experienced the failures.
00:57 dalek parrot: r36950 | allison++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/dynoplibs.in:
00:57 dalek parrot: [build] Convert Makefile for generating dynamic opcodes to a proper
00:57 dalek parrot: makefile with real dependencies, instead of generating a Perl script
00:57 dalek parrot: with hardcoded paths in it. Partially resolves TT #338, as part of
00:57 dalek parrot: TT #238.
00:57 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36950/
00:57 kid51 rg:  For the purpose of helping out rurban, I don't think you need to worry about those tests.
00:59 kid51 If Configure.pl gives you a Makefile that you can then use to build parrot, then that's all you need.
00:59 kid51 In general, we do not yet have "porters" who have/take overall responsibility for making sure that Parrot works on a given platform/OS combination.
01:00 rg well my idea was to run smolder tests on solaris, and that doesn't look too good when you constantly have failing tests.
01:02 kid51 Hmm, does that mean that 'make smolder_tests' still runs the configuration tests?  I guess so.
01:02 kid51 Speaking of smolder tests, we've got some failures on Linux ... which is not good.
01:03 * kid51 reconfigures and rebuilds on Linux.
01:03 rg if make test does, i would guess make smoke does.
01:04 kid51 Oh, I guess I thought that we had restricted 'make smolder_test' to the set of tests run by 'make coretest'.
01:04 rg i think the linux failure are a new test in embed.t that notfound added some hours ago. i was waiting for my own smolder to confirm ;)
01:04 kid51 rg:  So we have two alternatives:
01:05 kid51 (1) Patch to exclude those failing step test files on Solaris.
01:05 NotFound rg: what linux?
01:05 purl it has been said that linux is linux is linux by another name. or 80% of the world's top 500 super computers right now and the number one embedded system http://broadcast.oreilly.com/2008/10​/how-linux-supports-more-device.html
01:05 rg smolder is only adding --archive --send-to-smolder as args to harness
01:05 kid51 (2) Additional 'make' target to do smolder report with only the tests performed by 'make coretest'.
01:06 kid51 NotFound:  See http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/pu​blic_projects/report_details/18282
01:06 shorten kid51's url is at http://xrl.us/behbbg
01:06 kid51 ... which smolder run appears to have used lots of optimization.
01:08 kid51 ... as did http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/pu​blic_projects/report_details/18282, probably by the same tester.
01:08 shorten kid51's url is at http://xrl.us/behbbg
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01:08 NotFound kid51: strange, linux i386 is where I'm working
01:08 purl working is a good approximation.
01:09 kid51 NotFound:  I'm merely reporting Smolder tests, such as this one:  http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/pu​blic_projects/report_details/18285
01:09 shorten kid51's url is at http://xrl.us/behbbt
01:10 kid51 My own Smolder report just started running.  It'll take ~ 10 minutes.
01:10 rg i don't know what happened for 18285. that's a lot of failures.
01:12 kid51 Perhaps r36949 or r36950.
01:12 rg he picked up 36949. looks like you also need at least 36950
01:12 kid51 Probably there were some errors in 36949 that allison corrected in r36950.  She used the same log message in both commits.
01:13 * kid51 is testing at 36950.
01:14 rg kid51: so do you think i should open a ticket about the solaris test failures?
01:15 kid51 If you open such a ticket, will you take it?
01:15 * kid51 is seeing test failures on Linux at 36950.
01:15 rg as far as excluding the tests, yes. i'm not sure i'll have the knowlege or time for a proper fix.
01:16 kid51 Many failures in t/dynpmc/*.t.
01:17 kid51 Well, we can collaborate on it.  I don't have Solaris available for testing, so we'd have to rely on you for that.  But I could code review any patch you submit.
01:17 rg i find it interesting, that the smolder 18285 didn't fail embed.t like 18282
01:18 kid51 It would mostly be along the lines of 'skip all tests if $^O =~ /solaris/i'  (pseudo-code)
01:18 kid51 http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/pu​blic_projects/report_details/18286
01:18 shorten kid51's url is at http://xrl.us/behbcq
01:19 kid51 seen allison?
01:19 purl allison was last seen on #parrot 5 days, 21 hours, 20 minutes and 50 seconds ago, saying: Infinoid: cool  [Feb 18 03:58:28 2009]
01:21 rg kid51: i'll try again to have a closer look at the tests and get back to you in a few days
01:21 kid51 Thanks:  Feel free to email me.
01:22 kid51 oops
01:23 rg ok, my smolder is done aswell :)
01:23 rg i'm failing the same 27 tests, but not embed.t. so i guess 18282 was a fluke
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01:27 * kid51 creates https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/368 for those failures.
01:28 kid51 rg:  Yes, do get back to me on that.  We definitely need Smolder reports on Solaris, and we shouldn't allow these config step test failures to pose an obstacle to that.
01:34 * rg is wondering if he should run smolder tests more than once per day.
01:35 rg it has to be allison's change in r36949. r36948 is fine.
01:36 kid51 rg:  No particular harm in that.  Some smokers do it hourly, but that's probably excessive.
01:37 NotFound Looks like the BoundNCI must be created in the add_method vtable function of the class pmc to be useful.
01:37 rg well there is such a thing as too much information ;)
01:37 * kid51 presumes that allison will spot TT 368 ... and goes to dinner.
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02:35 Whiteknight NotFound, you find a way to test BoundNCI?
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03:30 dalek parrot: r36951 | jkeenan++ | failed to fetch changeset:
03:30 dalek parrot: Add new 'make' target 'smolder_coretest'.  Want to generate a Smolder report,
03:30 dalek parrot: but only on those tests covered by 'make coretest'?  Now, you can call 'make
03:30 dalek parrot: smolder_coretest'.
03:30 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36951/
03:32 kid51 See http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/pu​blic_projects/report_details/18290 for an example of 'make smolder_coretest'.
03:32 shorten kid51's url is at http://xrl.us/behbsa
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06:59 dalek parrot: r36952 | allison++ | trunk/MANIFEST.generated:
06:59 dalek parrot: [install] A few more PMC resource files needed by Partcl.
06:59 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36952/
07:12 alvar joined #parrot
08:07 dalek parrot: r36953 | fperrad++ | trunk/t/configure/034-step.t:
08:07 dalek parrot: [makefile] initialize value before tests, fix TT #369.
08:07 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36953/
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08:19 dalek rakudo: 1fa37c0 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | src/ (2 files):
08:19 dalek rakudo: first shot at implementing Str.split in Perl
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​fa37c08fc6e453152b0490e88fafeedf02de430
08:19 dalek rakudo: 215ad17 | (Moritz Lenz)++ |  (4 files):
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behcez
08:19 dalek rakudo: add Any.split(stuff) and Str.split(Str)
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/2​15ad17a2bb74e2cae1ffb57af8503f5f3d24dd4
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behce3
08:19 dalek rakudo: 1fe71b8 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | src/setting/ (2 files):
08:19 dalek rakudo: work around Rakudo bugs to get Str.split working
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​fe71b857196282d3f3d6c2348a2b881f5d48dc3
08:19 dalek rakudo: fa51bd7 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | src/ (2 files):
08:19 dalek rakudo: implement Str.comb in pure Perl 6
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f​a51bd792ce46be845a0c9bffe17e407cd9eedf5
08:19 dalek rakudo: 92d94aa | (Moritz Lenz)++ | Test.pm:
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behce5
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behce7
08:19 dalek rakudo: [Test.pm] don't autothread over ok(), is()
08:19 dalek rakudo: Previously calls to tests subs would would do autothreading unless a negation
08:19 dalek rakudo: was involved - which is an implementation detail and should be hidden.
08:19 dalek rakudo: Now no test function should autothread at all, which is usually what the test
08:19 dalek rakudo: write expects.
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/9​2d94aa49ef4cdd720b870ff204c69beb3a069b3
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behce9
08:19 dalek rakudo: 108dfb5 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | src/builtins/any-str.pir:
08:19 dalek rakudo: Str.index() should work when the search string is "0"
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​08dfb52792ae607f6c83b3975eaf255620648a6
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behcfb
08:19 dalek rakudo: 0e7dd5e | (Moritz Lenz)++ |  (3 files):
08:19 dalek rakudo: Merge branch 'master' into str_split_in_setting
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/0​e7dd5e27a5ebe74d206b397b9b5236e20b8a3cb
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behcfd
08:19 dalek rakudo: 592bd42 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | src/setting/Str.pm:
08:19 dalek rakudo: fix previous merge, and remove workaround
08:19 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5​92bd426d696d5b9e0e35f6a9aa46408206886b8
08:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behcff
08:19 dalek rakudo: 2cc539b | (Moritz Lenz)++ | src/setting/Str.pm:
08:20 dalek rakudo: much saner handling of limits in Str.split
08:20 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/2​cc539b10378b01a2bcae37e205ebee2614aaecb
08:20 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behcfh
08:20 dalek rakudo: e074bf4 | (Moritz Lenz)++ | src/setting/Str.pm:
08:20 dalek rakudo: fix Str.split for zero-width matches
08:20 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e​074bf4a59b22ce96e33736016ac99294fc4e98d
08:20 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behcfj
08:20 jimmy wow!!
08:20 jimmy karma Moritz Lenz
08:20 purl moritz lenz has karma of 56
08:20 jimmy karma (Moritz Lenz)
08:20 purl (moritz lenz) has neutral karma
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08:38 dukeleto how can I get permission to create tickets on trac.parrot.org ?
08:40 moritz dukeleto: get an account where you also give trac your email address
08:40 moritz dukeleto: and confirm that email address
08:41 dukeleto moritz: sweet deal, I just got the confirmation email and now I am creating a ticket :)
08:41 dukeleto moritz: thanks for the clarification though, i was a bit confuse
08:42 moritz dukeleto: it *is* confusing, and badly documented
08:42 dukeleto I am trying to write a parrot test using pasm_output_is and I am getting : # attempt to access code outside of current code segment
08:42 dukeleto # current instr.: '(null)' pc 12 (/Users/leto/svn/parrot/t/​op/arithmetics_12.pasm:6)
08:43 dukeleto what does that particularly mean?
08:44 dukeleto test is here: http://pastey.net/108882
08:56 dukeleto just created https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/370
09:03 cotto dukeleto, you're the third person to mention being confused by that in the last 2 days.
09:04 dukeleto cotto: yeah, the error message should really say "go verify your email so you can create a ticket" or somesuch
09:06 cotto I'm raising the issue tomorrow at the weekly #parrotsketch meeting.  Thanks for mentioning it.
09:07 dukeleto no problem, gladly someone was here to push me in the right direction
09:08 cotto Someone often is.
09:19 dalek parrot: r36954 | fperrad++ | trunk/MANIFEST.generated:
09:19 dalek parrot: [MANIFEST] re-sort
09:19 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36954/
09:19 cotto I hope that's not the last re-sort.
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09:54 dalek parrot: r36955 | cotto++ | trunk/src/packfile.c:
09:54 dalek parrot: [codingstd] remove extra space after if
09:54 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36955/
09:57 dalek parrot: r36956 | fperrad++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/dynpmc.in:
09:57 dalek parrot: [build] fix linking, add missing libraries (crypto & gdbm)
09:57 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36956/
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10:01 dalek parrot: r36957 | cotto++ | trunk/src/pmc:
10:01 dalek parrot: [PMC] switch Iterator to ATTRs
10:01 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36957/
10:13 dalek parrot: r36958 | cotto++ | trunk/src/pmc/iterator.pmc:
10:13 dalek parrot: [PMC] use PMCNULL instead of NULL in Iterator
10:13 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36958/
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10:46 mikehh r36956 appears to break parrot on linux i386 - cc: libcrypto.lib: No such file or directory
10:47 mikehh from cc -o  md2.so md2.o -L/usr/local/lib  -Wl,-rpath=/home/mhk/parrot/blib/lib -shared -O2 -g -L/usr/local/lib -fPIC -L/home/mhk/parrot/blib/lib -lparrot libcrypto.lib
10:48 mikehh make[1]: *** [md2.so] Error 1
10:49 mikehh make: *** [dynpmc.dummy] Error 2
10:53 moritz same here
10:54 cotto It's nice when not me breaks something.
11:04 dalek parrot: r36959 | fperrad++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/dynpmc.in:
11:04 dalek parrot: [build] fix configuration logic, != is not available
11:04 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36959/
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11:08 dalek parrot: r36960 | fperrad++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/root.in:
11:08 dalek parrot: [install] remove win32 specific
11:08 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36960/
11:16 dalek parrot: r36961 | fperrad++ | trunk/MANIFEST.generated:
11:16 dalek parrot: [install] A few more PMC resource files needed by Lua & WMLScript.
11:16 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36961/
11:18 mikehh my gmail has gone AWOL
11:27 mikehh builds ok - testing now
11:34 mikehh still getting dynpmc failures - http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/pu​blic_projects/report_details/18298
11:34 shorten mikehh's url is at http://xrl.us/behco6
11:38 mikehh probably from r36949/r36950
11:45 dalek lua: 7b09a8c | (Francois Perrad)++ | config/makefiles/pmc.in:
11:45 dalek lua: build with installed tree
11:45 dalek lua: review: http://github.com/fperrad/lua/commit/7b​09a8c055d214c7ed24c64a6f9e160f45c3e6c6
11:45 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behctv
11:48 jimmy joined #parrot
11:49 dalek wmlscript: 8907885 | (Francois Perrad)++ | config/makefiles/pmc.in:
11:49 dalek wmlscript: build with installed tree
11:49 dalek wmlscript: review: http://github.com/fperrad/wmlscript/commit​/89078854c816e58bde21ee2c7731d549dd90aa74
11:49 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behct3
11:59 dalek parrot: r36962 | NotFound++ | trunk:
11:59 dalek parrot: [examples] add embed example
11:59 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36962/
12:04 dalek parrot: r36963 | fperrad++ | trunk/tools/dev/mk_language_shell.pl:
12:04 dalek parrot: [install] refactor targets 'clean'
12:04 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36963/
12:04 NotFound Can someone take a look at examples/embed and give me some feedback?
12:11 mikehh BTW 10 more dynpmc tests passed between r36953 and r36960
12:13 mikehh sorry 11 - r36953 failed 27 and r36960 failed 16
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12:29 NotFound #IF(win32 and cc!=gcc):LIB_CRYPTO := -lcrypto
12:29 NotFound 67#ELSE:LIB_CRYPTO := libcrypto.lib
12:29 NotFound WTF?
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12:36 dalek parrot: r36964 | NotFound++ | trunk/src/extend.c:
12:36 dalek parrot: [cage] add missed ASSERT_ARGS
12:36 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36964/
12:39 dalek parrot: r36965 | NotFound++ | trunk/include/parrot/packfile.h:
12:39 dalek parrot: [cage] update packfile.h headerizing
12:40 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36965/
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13:39 dalek parrot: r36966 | NotFound++ | trunk:
13:39 dalek parrot: [cage] Fix Parrot_set_executable_name declaration
13:39 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36966/
14:04 Infinoid rg1: Thanks for the patch.  I did the counting in a different way that won't result in undef warnings, and I made the output format consistent with the other plugins
14:04 mikehh The failing dynpmc tests all fail with Class 'foo' not found
14:05 mikehh for MD5, SHA etc
14:05 Infinoid rg1: I had also changed some other things related to this module (detection of changeset fetch timeout), which screwed up the indentation and made me merge it manually.  I'm going to throw the whole lot up on my git server, to help that in the future
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14:19 mikehh actually t/dynpmc/foo.t passes so I shouldn't have used that as an example
14:20 dalek parrot: r36967 | NotFound++ | trunk/t/oo/subclass.t:
14:20 dalek parrot: [t] DO oo/subclass.t 'set the value of a non-constant key PMC'
14:20 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36967/
14:21 mikehh t/dynpmc/md2.t, t/dynpmc/md4.t, t/dynpmc/md5.t, t/dynpmc/ripemd160.t,
14:22 dalek joined #parrot
14:25 mikehh t/dynpmc/sha.t, t/dynpmc/sha1.t, t/dynpmc/sha256.t and t/dynpmc/sha512.t fail with Class 'MD2'. 'MD4' etc  not found
14:30 rg infinoid: thanks. i hope i'll find that if i think of anything else i'd like changed ;)
14:40 octo moritz: Is `parrot-dev at lists.perl.org' the correct list address? Sure it's not `parrot-dev at lists.parrot.org'?
14:40 moritz octo: it's lists.parrot.org, sorry if I said that wrong previously
14:41 octo moritz: That explains why the mail wasn't delivered ;)
14:42 octo lists.perl.org / x3.develooper.com doesn't even have a MX record..
14:42 moritz right, the perl lists all go to perl.org directly
14:42 davidfetter does gerd pokorra hang out here?
14:47 dalek rakudo: 70d9081 | jnthn++ | src/setting/Pair.pm:
14:47 dalek rakudo: Use $.key rather than self.key etc in Pair.pm; improvement suggested by moritz++.
14:47 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7​0d9081a0b5fcafc9984f152a3a4701792cf5cd6
14:47 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behdau
14:49 NotFound "a Polish programmer has succeeded in installing a copy of Windows 3.1 on his Nokia N95"
14:49 NotFound Wrong channel, sorry
14:49 jonathan Can he try installing Parrot on it next? ;-)
14:52 Infinoid rg: git://squawk.glines.org/botnix-plugins
14:52 NotFound Some day I'll try to build parrot for Nintendo DS
14:52 Infinoid NotFound: I'd smoke that
14:53 * davidfetter hands Infinoid a lighter
15:05 jan joined #parrot
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15:46 dalek parrot: r36968 | NotFound++ | trunk/examples/embed/lorito.c:
15:46 dalek parrot: [examples] add --start option to lorito
15:46 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36968/
15:50 PacoLinux joined #parrot
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16:30 DietCoke joined #parrot
16:30 DietCoke any drupal wizards here?
16:31 dalek parrot: r36969 | NotFound++ | trunk/examples/embed/lorito.c:
16:31 dalek parrot: [examples] add several runcore options to lorito
16:31 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36969/
16:35 Tene_ joined #parrot
16:40 dalek wmlscript: 6ee6800 | (Francois Perrad)++ |  (22 files):
16:40 dalek wmlscript: reorg tree source
16:40 dalek wmlscript: review: http://github.com/fperrad/wmlscript/commit​/6ee6800821ac8a0c4ada4c7c0d3faabc0baab995
16:40 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behdn2
16:40 dalek wmlscript: a98ce86 | (Francois Perrad)++ |  (4 files):
16:40 dalek wmlscript: update paths in Makefiles
16:40 dalek wmlscript: review: http://github.com/fperrad/wmlscript/commit​/a98ce86e78783a46799d2ba26301a8576c2dcf6f
16:40 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behdn4
16:40 dalek wmlscript: 0feb8bb | (Francois Perrad)++ | .gitignore:
16:40 dalek wmlscript: update .gitignore
16:40 dalek wmlscript: review: http://github.com/fperrad/wmlscript/commit​/0feb8bbfd0345fdc94071fbd0af29198b99d1daf
16:40 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behdn6
16:40 dalek wmlscript: a7e17a1 | (Francois Perrad)++ | config/makefiles/ (3 files):
16:40 dalek wmlscript: re-run tools/dev/mk_language_shell.pl (simply expanded variables)
16:40 dalek wmlscript: review: http://github.com/fperrad/wmlscript/commit​/a7e17a12216abd39d9c7d9af104e3f7be448952f
16:40 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behdn8
16:41 riffraff joined #parrot
16:44 Coke I added the parrot calendar to the main site.
16:44 Coke (don't need drupal wizards any more. =-)
16:44 NotFound Drop all wizards
16:50 * Coke waits for suggested calendar events to rolll in.
16:54 jan joined #parrot
17:07 particle 1171/60
17:07 purl 19.5166666666667
17:08 Infinoid Coke: nice.  the height attribute on that calendar iframe is a little small tho, it cuts off the bottom here
17:08 Infinoid it might be showing some extra text here, because I haven't set up a local timezone so it's explaining about GMT
17:09 particle Infinoid: here too
17:09 particle coke++
17:10 Infinoid looks good now
17:14 dalek parrot: r36970 | NotFound++ | trunk (3 files):
17:14 dalek parrot: [core] make explicit the assumption about non-empty signatures in src/call/ops.c
17:14 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36970/
17:15 * particle probably can't make parrotsketch, again
17:16 moritz neither can I
17:16 particle coke, others: i want to propose a 0-day bug policy. all smoke failures must be fixed within 24 hours, at least until 1.0
17:16 particle thoughts?
17:16 purl i like cheese
17:17 particle purl: you smell like roquefort
17:17 purl particle: huh?
17:17 PerlJam particle: must be fixed or ... ?
17:17 particle commit reverted
17:17 particle + public flogging by purl
17:18 PerlJam so ... we smoke after each commit?
17:19 PerlJam or, how do you know which commit broke things?
17:19 PerlJam who is responsible for finding and reverting the commit?
17:19 particle it's not a perfect system. we know between which two commits on the same smoke platform something broke
17:19 particle the community is responsible
17:20 particle i'd love for someone to take a leading role, though
17:22 PerlJam um ... it sounds good to me except for that "community is responsible" part  :)
17:23 particle well, the community is responsible for releases, code review, and commits. why not checking smokers and reverting bad commits?
17:24 PerlJam because all of those are community initiated events.  reverting a commit that breaks a particular platform is not.
17:25 Infinoid here we go, applying cosmic numerological significance to the ascii string "1.0" again
17:25 geof joined #parrot
17:25 Infinoid if we're going to do something like that, I'd vote for doing it forever and ever after, amen.
17:26 particle Infinoid: this is forever-and-ever
17:26 Infinoid In that case, I have no problem with it :)
17:26 particle trunk shouldn't break smokers from now on.
17:26 particle you want to fail tests? do it in a branch
17:26 particle we can smoke branches, too
17:26 particle it'd be nice to have an integration branch just for that purpose
17:26 Infinoid and in fact, we probably should do so more often
17:28 mikehh joined #parrot
17:29 Infinoid "integration branch"?  e.g. blead?
17:29 particle sure
17:30 Infinoid interesting idea
17:31 particle develop in blead, or in private branches then merge to blead, merge to trunk when smokes all pass, release from trunk
17:32 Infinoid in this case, trunk is really just a long-running prerelease branch
17:32 particle trunk smoke failures are reverted
17:32 particle yep
17:32 particle makes it something rakudo could target, for example
17:33 PerlJam sounds good
17:33 Infinoid things will get out of sync if you revert them from trunk, though.  You'd have to maintain some kind of "waiting patches" queue out of tree to make that work
17:33 Infinoid or revert them from both trunk and devel
17:34 particle well, it shouldn't happen, as merge to trunk should happen after green smoke from blead
17:34 PerlJam If the commit could automatically be reverted and a ticket created that has the patch and a note that it causes failure and on which platform, that might be nice  :)
17:34 particle but perhaps that means there's poor blead smoke platform coverage
17:34 Infinoid Sure, it won't happen, except when it does. :)
17:34 particle perljam: indeed. automation is key to making this process work
17:35 Infinoid Oh, I like the autoticket idea
17:35 PerlJam particle: with sufficient automation, you can ignore what I said earlier about the community being responsible.
17:35 Infinoid and autoassigned to the committer
17:37 Infinoid Of course, if the act of reverting it breaks something else, your script will have to be a little smarter
17:37 PerlJam Infinoid: and a bot could carp on #parrot about it too  (It's too easy to imagine an actual parrot squawking  "Infinoid broke the build on OSX!" or somesuch :-)
17:38 particle :)
17:39 dalek parrot: r36971 | NotFound++ | trunk/t/op/arithmetics.t:
17:39 dalek parrot: [t] add rounding Inf/NaN test, TT #37 dukeleto++
17:39 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36971/
17:41 Theory joined #parrot
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17:47 particle hrmm. this plan won't work until smokers report build/config failures, too.
17:48 Infinoid you'll have to retrain everyone to talk about "trunk r12345" or "blead r12345", not just r12345
17:48 pmichaud wouldn't blead and trunk be in the same repo?
17:49 Infinoid yes, but trunk will have a subset of the changes in blead
17:49 moritz this sounds like a big infrastructure to solve a problem that isn't actually all that big
17:49 pmichaud oh, I see .
17:51 moritz the problem seems to be more of a social one - people  don't want to revert other people's commits for social reasons
17:53 particle well, it's also a way we can get a release-ready-anytime culture
17:54 particle but i'm not so sure that's the highest priority
17:54 particle we could have trunk = blead, and stable = branches/release
17:55 particle so occasionally, when trunk passes all smokes, merge to branches/release
17:55 particle that tends to discourage last-minute pre-release commits, which imo is a good thing
17:56 wknight8111 joined #parrot
17:56 PerlJam particle: maybe make that part automatic too.
17:56 PerlJam smoke at regular intervals and if all pass, automatically merge to a release branch
17:56 PerlJam (that may not be possible though)
17:57 particle yep, need a good size list of platforms to smoke on
17:57 particle i'd like to talk to amazon about using ec2
17:58 pmichaud I chatted with amazon about it already.
17:58 pmichaud the guy I talked to said it probably wouldn't be of much benefit to us if we're looking for platform variety.
17:58 pmichaud because ec2 is all about platform sameness.
18:01 particle no, it's not
18:01 particle that might have been a chat some time ago
18:02 particle they're x86/x64 (no sparc), but have bsd, suse, rhel, win, etc
18:02 pmichaud okay, then that's changed since I chatted, yes.  And yes, this was 12-18 months ago.
18:02 particle cygwin, debian/ubuntu
18:03 particle yeah, they've come a *long* way since then.
18:03 pmichaud anyway, at the time I talked to the amazon guy he said it's so easy (and relatively cheap) to set up an ec2 account that we should just do that.
18:04 particle yes, but i'd prefer free to cheap :)
18:04 pmichaud we could certainly do it that way as proof-of-concept, and then if we decide we need bigger support go for free.
18:04 particle yep
18:04 pmichaud rather than wait for free access before we see if it even works.
18:04 NotFound Or even better, that amazon pay us ;)
18:05 PerlJam NotFound: it could happen.
18:05 NotFound Errrr... donate, be careful with PR X-)
18:17 allison joined #parrot
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18:29 dalek parrot: r36972 | fperrad++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/dynpmc.in:
18:29 dalek parrot: [build] all digest PMC are grouped
18:29 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36972/
18:32 cotto Coke, do you still have a Drupal question?
18:34 chromatic joined #parrot
18:34 cotto Coke, nm
18:39 chromatic masak, is RT #62730 really still a problem?
18:39 rurban joined #parrot
18:39 chromatic cotto, did you figure out the NCI struct val thing?
18:40 cotto nope
18:41 cotto The conversion is fine, but I don't have a solution to the workaround in TT #365.
18:43 particle joined #parrot
18:44 cotto Util++
18:44 cotto api sanity ftw
18:45 chromatic Hm, I remember at PDS storing the memory allocated to hold the JITted function in the NCI's struct val.  Is that it?
18:48 cotto That may be what's happening.
18:49 cotto If I initialize PMC_struct_val, Parrot dies trying to execute whatever's at that value.
18:49 chromatic That was to fix a memory leak, where we never freed that memory.
18:49 chromatic There's code in the NCI PMC that checks for a JITted flag.
18:49 chromatic Somewhere in invoke, I think.
18:50 cotto yes
18:58 dalek parrot: r36973 | fperrad++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles (2 files):
18:58 dalek parrot: [makefile] refactor targets 'clean'
18:58 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36973/
19:03 particle nopaste?
19:03 clunker3 http://pasta.test-smoke.org/ or http://paste.husk.org/ or http://nopaste.snit.ch:8001/ or http://rafb.net/paste or http://poundperl.pastebin.com/ or http://paste.scsys.co.uk/
19:03 purl nopaste is at http://nopaste.snit.ch/ (ask TonyC for new channels) or http://rafb.net/paste or http://poundperl.pastebin.com/ or http://paste.scsys.co.uk/ or App::Nopaste or tools/dev/nopaste.pl or at http://www.extpaste.com/ or http://paste.scsys.co.uk (for #catalyst, #dbix-class, #moose  and others)
19:05 particle ...i thought we did away with encapsulation in the great war of 89
19:06 chromatic Get off my lawn, grandpa.
19:13 diakopter when building on VC++9sp1 (cl.exe v15.00.30729.01), cl doesn't like the space between -Fo (cc_o_out) and the filename... (it ignores the option)
19:13 chromatic Maybe Microsoft will allow spaces in filenames one of these years.
19:14 cotto aim high
19:14 octo Hahahahaha ;)
19:14 diakopter well, cl -c -Fo"dyn lexpad.obj" DWIM, but cl -c -Fo dynlexpad.obj ...  doesn't work
19:15 NotFound Maybe -Fo means -Fo""
19:15 dalek tracwiki: v116 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
19:15 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=116&action=diff
19:15 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beheez
19:19 dalek tracwiki: v22 | cotto++ | PMCUnionDeprecationTasklist
19:19 dalek tracwiki: add reason for UnionVal deprecation
19:19 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/PMCUnionD​eprecationTasklist?version=22&action=diff
19:19 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behefb
19:32 dalek tracwiki: v117 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
19:32 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=117&action=diff
19:32 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behegz
19:32 dalek tracwiki: v118 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
19:32 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=118&action=diff
19:32 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beheg3
19:32 dalek gil: fd374b9 | (Francois Perrad)++ |  (2 files):
19:32 dalek gil: re-run tools/dev/mk_language_shell.pl
19:32 NotFound Talking about windows, can someone take a look at examples/embed and check if it can build on windows?
19:32 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/fperrad/gil/commit/fd​374b90ad264e7e4df636bb00e5322dfd4de979
19:32 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beheg7
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19:40 dalek tracwiki: v119 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
19:40 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=119&action=diff
19:40 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beheh2
19:44 dalek tracwiki: v120 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
19:44 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=120&action=diff
19:44 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beheig
19:44 dalek parrot: r36974 | cotto++ | trunk/DEPRECATED.pod:
19:44 dalek parrot: [DEPRECATED] add Bound_NCI and Slice to deprecated PMC list
19:44 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36974/
19:45 diakopter all the '$(CC_OUT) ' need replaced with '$(CC_OUT)' in config/gen/makefiles/dynpmc.in and config/gen/makefiles/dynoplibs.in     $(CC_OUT) should already have a trailing space on the configurations that require it.  at least, it does on some of them.
19:48 dalek tracwiki: v121 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
19:48 diakopter should I file an RT bug report for that?
19:48 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=121&action=diff
19:48 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behei9
19:48 dalek tracwiki: v122 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
19:48 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=122&action=diff
19:48 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behejb
19:48 dalek tracwiki: v9 | allison++ | ParrotLongTermRoadmap
19:48 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Parrot​LongTermRoadmap?version=9&action=diff
19:48 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behejd
19:48 chromatic It should be fixable without a patch, diakopter.
19:49 diakopter ( :P not by me since I haven't signed a CLA and such)
19:51 chromatic Yeah, but I'm testing it now.
19:51 diakopter oh, cool.
19:56 dalek parrot: r36975 | chromatic++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles (2 files):
19:57 dalek parrot: [config] Removed unnecessary space after CC_OUT expansion in dynops and dynpmc
19:57 dalek parrot: Makefiles (reported by diakopter).
19:57 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36975/
20:00 diakopter chromatic: neat, thanks.
20:00 diakopter NotFound: I can try the examples/embed when this finishes building
20:00 NotFound diakopter: ok, thanks
20:03 chromatic Hm, t/src/embed.t #5 segfaults for me.
20:04 NotFound chromatic: platform?
20:04 chromatic x86 Linux 32 bit
20:05 NotFound Works fine for me
20:05 dalek tracwiki: v123 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
20:05 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=123&action=diff
20:05 dalek tracwiki: v124 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
20:05 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behemw
20:05 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=124&action=diff
20:05 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behemy
20:05 chromatic 0xb7de535a in Parrot_io_STDOUT (interp=0xb7cef1f3) at src/io/api.c:647
20:05 chromatic 647     {
20:05 chromatic (gdb) bt
20:05 chromatic #0  0xb7de535a in Parrot_io_STDOUT (interp=0xb7cef1f3) at src/io/api.c:647
20:05 chromatic #1  0x0804881c in hello ()
20:05 chromatic #2  0x095ff5af in ?? ()
20:05 chromatic #3  0xb7e1dcb3 in Parrot_NCI_invoke (interp=0x958b008, pmc=0xbfe19834,
20:05 chromatic next=0x96503bc) at ./src/pmc/nci.pmc:320
20:06 diakopter chromatic: actually same with '$(LD_OUT) ' in at least those two files...
20:07 Infinoid nice corrupt interp pointer
20:07 NotFound chromatic: which runcore?
20:08 chromatic slow core (standard)
20:09 diakopter chromatic: wait, here's more
20:10 dalek tracwiki: v125 | allison++ | ParrotRoadmap
20:10 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Par​rotRoadmap?version=125&action=diff
20:10 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/behem8
20:10 dalek parrot: r36976 | cotto++ | trunk/docs/project/release_manager_guide.pod:
20:10 dalek parrot: [docs] update release manager guide to reflect recent numbering scheme decisions
20:10 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36976/
20:11 cotto allison, trac's milestone numbers have been updated.
20:11 allison cotto: excellent, thanks!
20:11 Theory_ joined #parrot
20:12 diakopter chromatic: same problem (both LD_OUT and CC_OUT) in tools/dev/mk_language_shell.pl
20:13 chromatic Is this the right place to fix it, rather than the spot in Configure that sets the cc_out variable?
20:14 chromatic I don't doubt that it needs fixed.  I'm just curious if it's a one-versus-many fix.
20:15 NotFound chromatic: I think a signature is wrong, let me check...
20:15 diakopter yes; each platform/configuration/hint should define the ones that (optionally) need a space as having a space, and the ones that cannot accept a space (ms vc15) as without the trailing space
20:16 chromatic I thought that might be the case.  Thanks for confirming.
20:16 diakopter it's defined correctly for msvc (without the space)
20:16 diakopter yw
20:17 rurban NotFound: test embed on win32 since which revision? I have r36906 and don't want to update now
20:18 dalek parrot: r36977 | NotFound++ | trunk/t/src/embed.t:
20:18 dalek parrot: [t] fix a nci signature in embed.t
20:18 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36977/
20:18 NotFound rurban: don't worry, no urgency
20:19 rurban I just bought 2GB ram for my laptop so I can run several vmware images also here
20:20 * diakopter mistakenly bought a laptop with a bios editor that won't allow Intel VT to be activated. :|
20:20 diakopter won't make that error again.
20:21 rurban NotFound: I started fixing examples/c/test_main.c though. This is very similar
20:21 chromatic Yeah, don't buy laptops.
20:22 rurban chromatic: I'm 3 weeks on a trip and am forced to laptop
20:22 dalek parrot: r36978 | chromatic++ | trunk (3 files):
20:22 dalek parrot: [config;dev] Removed more trailing spaces for $LD_OUT and $CC_OUT in Makefiles.
20:22 dalek parrot: The platform-specific configuration probes add trailing spaces for platforms
20:22 dalek parrot: which allow it.  Not all platforms (MSVC 9, for example) do.  Thanks to
20:22 dalek parrot: diakopter for diagnosing this.
20:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36978/
20:22 rurban diakopter++
20:23 rurban diakopter: without IVT you cannot run 64-bit images?
20:24 rurban Because that's my problem right now
20:24 diakopter yeah
20:24 rurban shit, thanks a lot!
20:24 * diakopter ducks
20:25 rurban because I got a Intel Core2 with x86-64 cpu
20:25 rurban but VirtualBox fails to initialize debian64, solaris64 and so on
20:26 diakopter your bios might let you turn it on.  mine is Sony.  :|
20:26 dalek tracwiki: v1 | cotto++ | ParrotVersionNumbers
20:26 dalek tracwiki: initial version, mostly copy/paste from Allison's proposal on parrot-dev
20:26 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Parro​tVersionNumbers?version=1&action=diff
20:26 shorten dalek's url is at http://xrl.us/beheq2
20:26 dalek parrot: r36979 | NotFound++ | trunk/examples/embed/Makefile:
20:26 rurban I have Dell d820
20:26 dalek parrot: [examples] make embed Makefile more portable
20:26 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36979/
20:27 Infinoid my thinkpad has an option for VT
20:27 diakopter the cmos address for the setting is known for some Sonys, but not for mine (yet).  and I'm not about to spend the 10^n hours to [figure out how to] find/fix it.
20:29 rurban NotFound: $(CC) $(CCFLAGS) -c -I ~/parrot/include lorito.c sounds wrong
20:29 rurban ~/parrot
20:29 rurban `bla` will also not work on  cmd.exe
20:30 rurban I think $(SHELL bla) will do it
20:30 rurban But I'll test it first, after my reboot
20:31 * rurban reboots to IVT
20:31 particle rm -f isn't portable either
20:32 particle NotFound: please see perldoc ExtUtils::Command
20:32 Hinrik OOJJJJ
20:32 Hinrik
20:32 Hinrik oops
20:33 diakopter I think he's in prison?
20:33 NotFound particle: I try to avoid to depend on perl, the example is now intended to be used in a parrot development tree but that can change.
20:37 particle NotFound: parrot depends on perl
20:38 particle you can't build parrot portably without it
20:38 NotFound But the example is not building parrot, is linking with an already built parrot library
20:39 particle either depend on perl, or mark the example (and test) as your-platform-only
20:40 jonathan Does anyone remember or have a reference handy to how to make something "does array"?
20:40 jonathan So you can use it with :flat?
20:40 diakopter NotFound: $(LD) -o is not right....  you need $(LD_OUT)
20:40 particle notfound: or maybe 'fails on win32'
20:41 particle jonathan: pir, or c?
20:41 jonathan particle: pir
20:41 jonathan C is easy ;-)
20:42 NotFound diakopter: You mean parrot_config ld_out ?
20:43 jonathan I'm sure I remember someone hitting this recently-ish, but I forget who.
20:44 diakopter NotFound: yes.  instead of '-o ' (no intervening space)
20:44 NotFound diakopter: I see, thanks
20:44 particle jonathan: i think it was cotto
20:46 diakopter I guess it might be a good idea to cache a bunch more of the config-(platform-)specific makefile values in parrot_config, such as "rm -rf" and the rest of ExtUtils::MM stuff
20:47 chromatic Hm, so that the Makefiles themselves don't have to have them.
20:47 chromatic That's a good idea.
20:48 NotFound We already have a lot of that
20:48 NotFound rm_f => '$(PERL) -MExtUtils::Command -e rm_f'
20:51 diakopter ooo you're building parrot.exe hotpatchable on msvc ;)
21:03 rurban joined #parrot
21:03 dalek parrot: r36980 | NotFound++ | trunk/examples/embed/Makefile:
21:03 dalek parrot: [examples] make embed Makefile more portable
21:03 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36980/
21:06 rurban diakopter: my dell laptop Latitude D820 supports IVT. It's called VMM there. I need an admin to turn it on for me though.
21:06 octo According to docs/embed.pod, `Parrot_find_global_cur' will return `PMCNULL' if the symbol is not found. `Parrot_find_global_cur' internally calls `Parrot_find_global_n' which does the following: return PMC_IS_NULL(res) ? NULL : res;
21:06 octo Which is the intended behavior, `PMCNULL' (as documented) or `NULL' (as coded)?
21:07 GeJ Good morning everyone
21:07 octo Morning ;)
21:08 rurban ocot: I think the docs has to be fixed. But better ask in the parrot-dev list
21:08 rurban s/ocot/octo/
21:09 octo rurban: Okay, thanks
21:09 NotFound octo: to be on the safe side, check that the returned value !PMC_IS_NULL instead of some value.
21:10 octo NotFound: Okay.. But I guess `PMCNULL' is NOT `((void *) 0)' so that exactly these problems are found, right..?
21:12 chromatic There's a Null PMC -- a singleton -- we use sometimes.
21:13 mikehh joined #parrot
21:15 octo While I'm changing this in docs/embed.pod, could one of you verify or correct the description of those flags, perhaps? <http://paste.debian.net/29027>
21:19 NotFound octo: I think the doc is incorrect anyway, because none of embed.h and extend.h does include global.h
21:20 chromatic octo, I'm not sure anyone understands those flags, unless we wake up leo or chip by saying their names.
21:20 octo NotFound: It worked without `<parrot/parrot.h>' up to the point where I needed `Parrot_find_global_cur', so just executing some PBC is possible without it..
21:20 NotFound And the EXAMPLES in that doc file uses #include parrot.h, wich is explicitly forbidden.
21:20 octo chromatic: Okay, thanks
21:21 octo NotFound: Oh, okay.. What else do I use then?
21:21 NotFound octo: nothing for a now. I'm working on it but takes time.
21:22 octo NotFound: Okay, since I basically want to find out if reentrancy is possible to the extent I need, I'll stick with parrot/parrot.h for now ;)
21:22 NotFound What I'm using in the example and test is to take use the namespaces directly.
21:24 octo You lost me.. How do you use the namespace directly?
21:24 NotFound octo: for testing and development, fine, but document and examplify incorrect usage, not fine.
21:24 NotFound octo: see examples/embed/lorito.c
21:24 octo NotFound: Already put this in front of the #include in docs/embed.pod: /* FIXME: Inclusion of <parrot/parrot.h> is actually forbidden. */
21:24 octo Will do
21:26 octo Uhm, there is no file called `lorito.c'. Nor is there a directory named `embed'..
21:27 octo .. in the sources
21:27 NotFound octo: you need the current cvs release
21:28 NotFound I mean svn
21:28 octo I'm having the Git repository from repo.or.cz.. Last commit is Tue Feb 24 00:56:17 2009 +0000
21:29 NotFound Too old, we work fast ;)
21:29 octo Hehe, okay
21:29 NotFound Take a look at t/src/embed.t then
21:30 rurban seen rg
21:30 purl rg was last seen on purl 6 hours, 57 minutes and 59 seconds ago, saying: <private message>
21:30 octo That exists at least ;)
21:31 rurban notfound, particle: embed failing on win32 is too bold. only failing on msvc with cmd.exe. mingw and cygwin work fine as I assume
21:31 NotFound rurban: you mean the example or the test?
21:32 rurban makefile.vc would be the normal solution for this problem
21:32 NotFound They are not directly related
21:32 rurban NotFound: yes, the example with the new description
21:32 NotFound Ah, fine
21:33 NotFound I'm working on both at the same time, sometimes is confusing %-)
21:33 rurban or better: makefile.msvc
21:33 rurban on perl5 we have win32/makefile.vc elsewhere we are more verbose
21:35 rurban but using perl for helping embedders would be preferred I guess
21:35 NotFound rurban: I don't have msvc and my knowledge of it is a decade old, if someone wants to maintain it, fine.
21:35 gryphon joined #parrot
21:36 rurban I'll give it a try then
21:37 NotFound The long term solution IMO will be to use parrot to help parrot embedders, not perl5, but in the meantime...
21:40 rurban cygwin works fine for loriito
21:40 NotFound Nice :)
21:40 rurban now mcvs and mingw...
21:42 rurban PATH=$PATH:/parrot_directory is wrong on an already installed parrot
21:43 rurban I got the wrong include dir: parrot/embed.h: No such file or directory.
21:43 rurban PATH=/parrot_directory:$PATH is better
21:44 NotFound rurban: that's the problem we talked last week about the installed path and includes
21:44 octo Amazing: As soon as you do it right, it starts working..
21:45 NotFound Ah, you mean working in dev tree while having other parrot instaled?
21:46 rurban yes, also parrot_config includedir instead of parrot_config prefix is much better
21:46 NotFound rurban: I think you are right
21:46 rurban parrot_config includedir => /usr/include
21:47 NotFound rurban: includedir gives me /usr/local/include, that's wrong working in the devel tree
21:47 rurban true, bad for testing
21:49 NotFound Anyway, this example is one day old, no need to make it perfect today;)
21:51 rurban one more catch: lorito$(EXE): lorito$(O)
21:55 NotFound Done
21:57 dalek parrot: r36981 | NotFound++ | trunk/examples/embed/Makefile:
21:57 dalek parrot: [examples] some fixes in emebed/Makefile
21:57 rurban I cannot find $(SHELL ..) or `` for nmake though. I guess we have the user to fill that in.
21:57 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36981/
21:58 rurban maybe ron knows that for nmake
22:01 dalek parrot: r36982 | allison++ | trunk/docs/project/release_manager_guide.pod:
22:01 dalek parrot: [doc] Add a note to release manager's guide about marking Trac milestones as completed.
22:01 rob joined #parrot
22:01 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36982/
22:03 particle typically it's cmd /c
22:04 particle ... > file
22:04 particle then read into a var
22:08 Coke pmichaud: remember my comment about having to update our svn usage? based on a faulty assumption about version numbers. carry on.
22:11 nopaste "rurban" at 93.210.233.45 pasted "NotFound: Now I've got a problem: the msvc linker is strict." (10 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/15711
22:11 octo What's the preferred method to get patches? Via email or via Trac?
22:12 rurban unresolved external symbol _Parrot_pbc_load and 3 more not exported
22:12 diakopter rurban: libparrot.lib needs created with its exported hints
22:12 rurban yes, the dllattributes are missing
22:12 chromatic octo, trac is better.
22:12 diakopter or, pass in the .def file /DEF:filename
22:12 NotFound rurban: What is the problem? Lack of decoration in extern header?
22:12 chromatic We can't miss them there.
22:13 octo chromatic: Okay
22:13 NotFound I mean extend
22:13 rurban we don't create a def file yet, with correctly attribute them, but only win32 strictly requires it.
22:13 rurban I'll try to fix it...
22:17 dalek parrot: r36983 | rurban++ | trunk/examples/embed (2 files):
22:17 dalek parrot: [examples] msvc fixes for examples/embed
22:17 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36983/
22:18 rurban particle: read into a var might be tricky. but we can create an incude file
22:18 particle err, sorry, yeah, include file.
22:20 rurban NotFound: wait a bit. maybe I'm too old with my msvc6 dir here
22:21 octo Sorry, but I guess I need your help again: The `str_key' argument to `Parrot_make_namespace_keyed_str' is documented as `NULL okay', but the argument is then passed on to `internal_ns_keyed_str' where a NULL pointer raises an exception. Unfortunatly, I have no idea what the intended behavior is.. :/
22:23 Andy joined #parrot
22:25 NotFound octo: good catch
22:25 Infinoid octo: good catch indeed.  I'd say remove _NULLOK from the Parrot_make_namespace_keyed_str and see if anything breaks :)
22:26 Infinoid oh, that change will require "make headerizer" to update the ASSERT_ARGS definitions.
22:26 NotFound octo: Why were you calling with NULL, just for testing?
22:26 octo You'll have to change a bunch of functions then.. `Parrot_store_global_s' for instance..
22:26 Infinoid if those functions are not written to handle NULL pointers, then that's a good thing
22:27 octo NotFound: Didn't know how to get the global namespace, and `Parrot_store_global_s' said it's okay to pass NULL..
22:27 octo So, in `Parrot_store_global_s' I've done this:   if (str_key == NULL) { ns = CONTEXT(interp)->current_namespace; } else { previous action }   Is that reasonable?
22:29 Infinoid is current_namespace the HLL root?
22:29 NotFound octo: note that that function is not in extend or embed usage, then it can be reasonable that they don't have a full check of his arguments.
22:29 octo Infinoid: I have no idea what `HLL' stands for, leave alone what `HLL root' *is* ;)
22:29 Infinoid octo: high level language (e.g. rakudo, partcl, etc)
22:29 rurban High Level Language
22:30 Infinoid So HLL root for rakudo would be the top level rakudo namespace
22:30 octo What I wanted to do was add a new subroutine (in form of a PMC) to a simple test script without any namespaces really..
22:30 octo So, yes, HLL root is probably what I wanted..
22:30 NotFound octo: you get the global namespace with Parrot_get_root_namespace, in embed.h
22:31 octo Maybe I should use `Parrot_get_ctx_HLL_namespace(interp)' in the NULL handling of `Parrot_store_global_s'?
22:31 Infinoid is parrot root == HLL root?  (I'm not being sarcastic, I really have no idea)
22:31 particle no
22:31 NotFound Infinoid: no, is 'parrot' inside root
22:32 cotto It's nice to see the version number thread devolve into silliness.
22:32 diakopter rurban: http://web.archive.org/web/20041011160658/http:​//www.spiff.tripnet.se/~iczelion/importlib.html
22:32 shorten diakopter's url is at http://xrl.us/behfdk
22:32 rurban NotFound: msvc6 works fine. my error (old build)
22:33 diakopter (maybe not related)
22:33 NotFound rurban: fine
22:33 rurban diakopter: thanks. I know a better tool: dllwrap
22:34 rurban NotFound: It even works without the PATH= part
22:34 rurban just calling lorito.exe fails when not finding libparrot.dll
22:34 NotFound octo: getting the HLL from context in a external function is risky, you get the HLL of the sub that is calling it, and that may not be the desired
22:34 Infinoid cotto: hey, at least I didn't suggest TAI64NA (accurate to the attosecond)
22:35 NotFound rurban: I don't know if there is a win32 equivalent of LD_RUN_PATH
22:35 rurban PATH=
22:35 rurban syntax  set PATH=N:\usr\src\perl\parrot\parrot-msvc6;%PATH%
22:36 NotFound octo: to add a sub and find it easily from pir you need to put it in the 'parrot' namespace
22:37 rurban NotFound: for mingw we would need another special Makefile when using cmd.exe. maybe particle's trick will be better
22:37 octo NotFound: I'm trying to register that function right after the interpreter has been started up, not from an external frunction..
22:38 NotFound octo: external to parrot itself
22:40 octo NotFound: All I'm just calling `Parrot_store_global_s' from outside Parrot..
22:40 NotFound octo: there is a test of that in t/src/embed.t , "Insert external sub in namespace", but I'm not sure about from what release number
22:42 NotFound octo: well, I don't used that function in the examples because is the wrong way, at least in the current state
22:42 octo NotFound: Ah, I think I see now what's done there.. I was always looking for functions like *store*..
22:44 NotFound Get the current release and look at lorito code, is cleaner than the tests
22:45 szabgab joined #parrot
22:46 octo I got it ;)
22:47 NotFound Uh, not, in lorito that feature is not used yet :-X
22:47 rurban btw: we still need the win32 manifest stuff for 1.0 who's doing that. there's even no todo ticket for this
22:47 octo I meant, I got it working, not I got the new revision.. Guess I'll solve the revision issue by getting some sleep and hoping that the Git repository is updated in the meantime..
22:48 NotFound octo: I hope so
22:49 NotFound octo: sorry if the current way is convoluted, but these are the first steps to make the embedding work without inappropiate workarounds
22:52 octo NotFound: No problem, I'm just totally new to Parrot and don't understand most of what I'm doing ;) So if I start asking dumb^Will-informed questions, please do point me to the appropriate documentation ;)
22:53 NotFound octo: the questions will help us to write that documentation ;)
22:55 octo Okay, I'm off to bed.. Good night (+ timezone correction), talk to you later..
22:58 rurban oops, midnight. I leave also, bye
23:05 mikehh joined #parrot
23:25 Whiteknight joined #parrot
23:26 bacek_ joined #parrot
23:27 rurban does FREEZE_ASCII 1 dont work anymore? I get a src/io/api.c:231: failed assertion 'pmc'
23:37 dalek parrot: r36984 | coke++ | trunk/DEPRECATED.pod:
23:37 dalek parrot: Fixup file to be more user-facing
23:37 dalek parrot: - Convert all ticket references to linked URLs
23:37 dalek parrot: - standardize formatting slightly
23:37 dalek parrot: - add release numbers where some were skipped
23:37 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36984/
23:40 cotto rurban, I don't think it's ever worked.
23:40 rurban but a good idea though
23:41 cotto rurban++ if you can make it work
23:41 rurban naa, I think I have nbetter things todo right now.
23:41 cotto It would be nice.
23:42 rurban If I'm really desperate at freeze/thaw then maybe
23:42 Coke (if it doesn't work, let's rip it out.)
23:42 cotto I'll file a tt and see if it gets any takers.
23:43 rurban The most useful information would be if it ever worked, and would are the major points to watch for.
23:44 rurban The failing assertion is just a missing pmc arg to Parrot_io_flush
23:44 rurban NULL vs PMCNULL I guess
23:47 rurban Nope. It's dying in a an exception: Unknown PMC type to thaw 0
23:47 rurban p *io
23:49 dalek parrot: r36985 | NotFound++ | trunk (2 files):
23:49 dalek parrot: [cage] drop NULLOK modifier in Parrot_make_namespace_keyed_str str_key arg
23:49 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36985/
23:54 cotto ticket filed
23:54 rurban At least the freeze shift functions ARE portable now. I checked that
23:57 dalek parrot: r36986 | rurban++ | trunk/src/pmc_freeze.c:
23:57 dalek parrot: [cage] update TODOs
23:57 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/36986/
23:58 Tene joined #parrot

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