Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2009-07-17

Parrot | source cross referenced

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Time Nick Message
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00:09 dalek cardinal: 295dd7b | (Ted Reed)++ |  (2 files):
00:09 dalek cardinal: Implement << for Arrays; test included.
00:09 dalek cardinal: review: http://github.com/cardinal/cardinal/commit​/295dd7b5f2f042f7d217fcb3879f867881ab8936
00:11 kid51 msg mikehh:  When you see this during 'make codetest':  manifest_tests fail - #   Failed test 'No need to regenerate MANIFEST' -- it simply means that someone added/deleted files without updating MANIFEST and/or MANIFEST.SKIP.  Someone needs to run tools/dev/mk_manifest_and_skip.pl.
00:11 purl Message for mikehh stored.
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00:15 kid51 Coke: ping
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01:49 dalek TT #841 created by jkeenan++: t/examples/namespace.t is failing
01:51 dalek parrot: r40128 | jkeenan++ | trunk/docs/dev/fhs.pod:
01:51 dalek parrot: Removing file as per https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/694.
01:51 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40128/
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01:52 dalek TT #694 closed by jkeenan++: docs/dev/fhs.pod:  Is this file still relevant?
02:04 kid51 Can anyone run a Smolder report on Win32?
02:04 kid51 ... or perhaps I should say:  Would someone please run a Smolder report on a Win32 system?
02:05 kid51 Our last report was 7 hours ago.  I believe the reasons for many of the test failures observed then have been corrected; would appreciate corroboaration.
02:09 dalek TT #40 closed by jkeenan++: t/pmc/exceptions.t unexpectedly passes
02:15 mikehh kid51: yup - so I gathered - I was just reportin' it
02:28 kid51 mikehh:  thanks.
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04:05 cotto bacek_at_work, pingu
04:33 dalek TT #842 created by pmichaud++: [DEPRECATED]  NQP  PIR q:to:...
04:40 dalek TT #843 created by pmichaud++: PGE will assume {*} at end of every regex
04:41 dalek parrot: r40129 | pmichaud++ | trunk/DEPRECATED.pod:
04:41 dalek parrot: Add some deprecations for NQP and PGE.
04:41 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40129/
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05:21 dalek parrot: r40130 | allison++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles (2 files):
05:21 dalek parrot: [build] Use direct substitution instead of a makefile variable for
05:21 dalek parrot: 'ld_out' and 'cc_o_out', since Solaris strips the extra space at the end
05:21 dalek parrot: when assigning to a makefile variable, but requires the space in the
05:21 dalek parrot: call. Resolves TT #700. Thanks to Andy Dougherty for the patch.
05:21 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40130/
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06:01 GeJ Hello everyone
06:03 GeJ FYI, since r40128 (removal of docs/dev/fhs.pod) parrot's configure step will fail at init::manifest.
06:04 GeJ the file is listed in MANIFEST on line 451.
06:06 chromatic Let me confirm that (but I'm sure you're right).
06:07 cotto GeJ, fixed
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06:07 GeJ Also did make html for good measure, and it didn't seem to complain about the missing file.
06:07 dalek parrot: r40131 | cotto++ | trunk/MANIFEST:
06:07 dalek parrot: [MANIFEST] rerun manifest update script after recent file removal
06:07 dalek parrot: GeJ++ for noticing
06:07 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40131/
06:08 cotto it's easy to forget the steps involved in adding or removing a file
06:08 GeJ Although it doesn't seem to be happy with docs/book/draft/ch03_pir.pod
06:09 GeJ cotto, chromatic: thanks
06:10 cotto These are good things to be looking at before a release.
06:13 GeJ running `make fulltest`
06:15 cotto especially on your machine
06:18 GeJ hum... it stopped early. :-/
06:21 GeJ I'm not fluent in Makefile, so could someone be kind enough to explain the difference beteween fulltest and fulltest_all. I have an idea and I would like to know how much I'm wrong about it.
06:22 moritz GeJ: fulltest aborts after the first test block which results in a failure
06:23 GeJ moritz: that was my guess. thanks
06:28 bacek_at_work cotto: pongu
06:29 cotto bacek_at_work, why does HashIteratorKey (and some other code from the branch) return PMCNULL or -1 instead of throwing an exception?
06:29 bacek_at_work cotto: to preserve old behavior...
06:30 cotto Won't that make such code fail in potentially unexpected ways?
06:31 bacek_at_work It will. But changing behavior without deprecation notice is really bad idea.
06:31 moritz well, you still have a chance to put one in for 1.4
06:32 cotto Now's a really good time.
06:32 * cotto feels like a broken record
06:32 cotto I've only got one song, but everyone will know what it is.
06:33 cotto clock?
06:33 purl cotto: LAX: Thu 11:33pm PDT / CHI: Fri 1:33am CDT / NYC: Fri 2:33am EDT / LON: Fri 7:33am BST / BER: Fri 8:33am CEST / IND: Fri 12:03pm IST / TOK: Fri 3:33pm JST / SYD: Fri 4:33pm EST /
06:33 NotFound Play it, Sam.
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06:40 bacek_at_work So, if we can put some broad deprecation warning in 1.4 stated something like "All hashes/array/iterators will be revisited"
06:41 cotto yes.  Actually the merge should probably have waited until aftr 1.4 since it changes an existing  behavior.
06:41 cotto the next best thing is a deprecation notice
06:42 cotto I do like having saner code, though.
06:43 bacek_at_work cotto: branch didn't change behavior.
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06:45 bacek_at_work But I thinking about opening another branch for final cleanup which implies changing of behavior
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06:45 Su-Shee hi
06:45 GeJ wow... servus
06:45 bacek_at_work O! Can we put deprectation notice for few VTABLEs?
06:45 GeJ forget the 'wow...' part.
06:45 bacek_at_work Like "nextkey"
06:45 purl GeJ, I didn't have anything matching 'wow...' part
06:47 cotto bacek_at_work, I'd run it by chromatic or The Architect but it makes sense with your refactoring work.
06:47 chromatic An email to the list would be great.
06:48 bacek_at_work I'll try to compose it later tonight. After investigating TGE failure in Lua.
06:50 cotto Mmmm.  Legacy.
06:55 * cotto goes to sleep
06:55 cotto good night
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08:49 mikehh 1 failure - examples_tests FAIL - All Others PASS (pre/post config, smolder, fulltest) at r40131 - Ubuntu 9.04 amd64
08:50 mikehh t/examples/namespace.t FAILs - this test seems to rely on hash order
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09:04 mikehh rakudo builds on parrot r40131 - make test/make spectest PASS
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09:29 dalek rakudo: 3d5f23c | moritz++ | docs/architecture.svg:
09:29 dalek rakudo: [docs] shiny chart of Rakudo's architecture (svg)
09:29 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3​d5f23c88d046fd6dcb6d8c8e2858a72e9765e86
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10:11 dalek parrot: r40132 | bacek++ | trunk (2 files):
10:11 dalek parrot: [pmc] Add StringIterator.shift_pmc and pop_pmc. fperrad++ for reporting
10:11 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40132/
10:12 bacek seen fperrad
10:12 purl fperrad was last seen on #parrot 30 days, 13 hours, 27 minutes and 21 seconds ago, saying: Whiteknight, when I encoured the same problem, I send a email (with my IP) to osuosl support  [Jun 16 20:40:01 2009]
10:12 bacek oh...
10:19 bacek mikehh: r40133 should make you happy :)
10:21 dalek parrot: r40133 | bacek++ | trunk/t/examples/namespace.t:
10:21 dalek parrot: [cage] Fix t/examples/namespace.t to not rely on Hash keys order.
10:21 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40133/
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11:05 Infinoid happy Friday
11:05 moritz TCIF!
11:06 Infinoid thank cotto!
11:14 moritz particle: I took a look at prophet (the offline bug tool you mentioned the other day)... do you know where I can find documentatioin for it?
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11:26 mikehh bacek: should make us all happy - Big Grin - testing now
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11:49 mikehh Woo Hoo - All Tests PASS  (pre/post config, smolder, fulltest) at r40133 - Ubuntu 9.04 amd64
11:49 whiteknight very nice!
11:51 bacek it is not...
11:51 whiteknight ???
11:51 * bacek EPICLY FAILING to grok Lua failure...
11:52 mikehh I really now need to set up some other test platforms on this system - I need to install i386 - and then set it up as a Guest vm on amd64
11:54 bacek mikehh: Did you ever check TapTinder? You can probably combine your effort with mj41's to bring more comprehensive testing for Parrot.
11:54 bacek TapTinder?
11:54 purl TapTinder is probably software development tool - http://taptinder.org . For Parrot project running on http://tt.perl6.cz/ and reporting build failures to #parrot channel as ttbot.
11:55 mikehh I was going to run make cover once I get my i386 setup going
11:56 mikehh that's going to take a few hours
11:57 mikehh what we need to look at is when we get a failure in our languages, or elsewhere - to put in the appropriate tests
11:57 bacek mikehh: few??? I took whole night on my laptop when I tried it. Consider sharing coverage report with everyone! :)
11:59 bacek Who is TGE owner/expert/pumpkin? I'm totally stuck...
12:12 whiteknight bacek: I believe Allison may be the owner ofthat
12:13 whiteknight or, at least the last-known owner
12:13 bacek *sigh*
12:14 moritz it always boils down to the same few people how don't have enough spare time :)
12:14 * bacek start thinking about "unmerge" keys_revamp branch.
12:15 whiteknight don't do that
12:16 whiteknight What is failing in Lua?
12:16 bacek whiteknight: why? There is some dark parts in Parrot which aren't covered by tests. And some (even Parrot's) "consumers" relying on such parts.
12:16 bacek whiteknight: Check mail from fperrad++
12:17 bacek * Lua
12:17 bacek Cannot find the attribute 'past' (Lua::Grammar::top on node
12:17 bacek Hash) that you asked for.
12:17 bacek it's a message from TGE
12:17 whiteknight well, that's a problem of needing more tests
12:19 whiteknight is TGE creating any 'Iterator' PMCs directly?
12:19 bacek may be.
12:20 bacek But I preserved current behaviour in branch
12:24 bacek ok. In TGE/Tree.pir _scan_node looks very suspicious.
12:28 mikehh rakudo faills 1 test/2 subtests - t/spec/S12-attributes/instance.rakudo - Failed tests:  121-122
12:28 moritz mikehh: when you run that test again, does it fail every time?
12:29 moritz mikehh: it has been failing for me once yesterday, but never again since
12:38 nopaste "bacek" at 114.73.164.9 pasted "Hash brokeness in Rakudo" (21 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/17301
12:38 bacek moritz: it's definitely failing from time to time...
12:55 bacek ok. I have to sleep on all this failures.
12:55 * bacek must sleep
12:55 purl $bacek->sleep(8 * 3600);
12:55 bacek See you tomorrow
12:59 mikehh moritz: it passed the previous time I ran the trests
13:03 mikehh moritz: I just ran it ./perl6 t/spec/S12-attributes/instance.rakudo - it passed the first time then failed
13:07 dalek TT #844 created by gerd++: [PATCH] building Rakudo from an installed Parrot
13:08 mikehh moritz: i ran it about 6 times and it kept failing - I then ran make  t/spec/S12-attributes/instance.t - it failed
13:08 moritz mikehh: ok, thanks
13:08 mikehh I then ran ./perl6 t/spec/S12-attributes/instance.rakudo again and it passed 4 times before failing
13:12 mikehh maoritz: I have just run it 10 times - passed 6 failed 4
13:13 mikehh moritz: same failures 121-122
13:14 mikehh sorry sa/maorizt/moritz/
13:14 mikehh whatever
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13:27 * Coke wonders if there's a way to ask IRSSI to display the # of lines queued up after the -- more -- prompt.
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13:29 Coke "will be revisited" is too vague a deprecation notice.
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13:56 dalek parrot: r40134 | fperrad++ | trunk/src/pmc (5 files):
13:56 dalek parrot: [cage] a lot of consting
13:56 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40134/
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14:23 dalek parrot: r40135 | fperrad++ | trunk/src/pmc/hash.pmc:
14:23 dalek parrot: [cage] fix warning
14:23 dalek parrot: warning: 'box' might be used uninitialized in this function
14:23 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40135/
14:37 dalek parrot: r40136 | particle++ | trunk/src/pmc/hash.pmc:
14:37 dalek parrot: [cage] use best practice for pmc null comparison, fix whitespace for '=' alignment
14:37 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/40136/
14:37 particle omg! i committed something!
14:41 Coke given a copy of parrot_test_run.tar.gz, how can I upload this?
14:48 * Coke guesses that TT #845 is the answer.
14:50 dalek TT #845 created by coke++: separate tool for uploading to smolder
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16:01 Coke there's still no way to subclass a .Sub and use a vtable override on invoke, right?
16:01 Coke (as a way of wrapping a sub)
16:03 mikehh All Tests PASS  (pre/post config, smolder, fulltest) at r40136 - Ubuntu 9.04 amd64
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16:03 * Coke wonders how much overhead it would involve if a .Sub subclass HAD-A anon .Sub that it dispatched the invoke to.
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16:04 Coke then the sub could do any prep work it wanted, and .tailcall if it didn't care to do postprocessing.
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16:07 dalek TT #844 closed by pmichaud++: [PATCH] building Rakudo from an installed Parrot
16:07 pmichaud stupid trac... I didn't mean for that ticket to be closed
16:09 particle stupid user.
16:09 whiteknight yeah, Trac has a bunch of errors between the seat and the keyboard :)
16:10 * particle wishes his former employer would stop paying him
16:10 pmichaud Sorry, it's trac that is stupid in this case.  I *wanted* to reply to the ticket in email, but trac won't let me do that.
16:14 whiteknight oh, nevermind
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16:14 whiteknight (there are plenty of bugs between my chair and my keyboard, but I guess that's a personal problem)
16:15 Coke tcl has a thing where you can import procs from one namespace into another. You can then force a "forget" of the namespace later, or ask where this command originally was defined. I am pondering updating TclProc to proxy these requests, but am wondering if this sounds more like a job for a TclNamespace.
16:15 Coke (which doesn't exist yet.)
16:15 pmichaud well, same here.  It's just that in this case trac forced me to go out of my way to contribute knowledge to the ticket, and in so doing I managed to click a wrong button that resulted in the wrong thing happening.
16:15 Coke ('forget' is un-import.)
16:20 Coke pmichaud: I just poked again on TT #49 - it was originally being pushed by Infinoid, I think, but I don't know if we've pinged OSU about it since months ago.
16:20 mikehh rakudo (3d5f23c) builds on parrot r40136 -  make test/make spectest(up to r27602) PASS - Ubuntu 9.04 amd64
16:23 Coke to answer my own question, I think I need to create a TclNamespace with TclNamespaceEntries
16:23 mikehh t/spec/S12-attributes/instance.rakudo is still intermittent - passes 3 fails twice 121-122
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16:40 Coke is any language doing export/import yet?
16:41 Coke (namespace has an export_to, but no way that I see to declare /what/ is exportable. I presume that's supposed to be handled by a subclass that overrides that method.)
16:50 nopaste "coke" at 72.228.52.192 pasted "namespace doesn't respect CTX_HLL?" (28 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/17308
16:53 pmichaud Coke: Rakudo is doing export/import.  The exported symbols are held in special (sub)namespaces
16:54 Coke so if you have something in Foo::Bar, the exports are in Foo::Bar::.exports ?
16:54 pmichaud Foo::Bar::EXPORT::ALL
16:55 Coke ok. and those are meant to be inspectable by end users?
16:55 pmichaud (other tags are possible, such as Foo::Bar::EXPORT::default)
16:55 pmichaud in the Perl 6 case, yes.
16:55 Coke right. tcl's going to want to keep that hidden.
16:55 pmichaud essentially I think that each hll will have to decide how it keeps track of exports (more)
16:56 pmichaud Tene++ and others have been working on making that information available via the compiler object
16:56 pmichaud but in the case of loadable modules, it does mean that the module being loaded needs to register its export information somewhere.
16:56 Coke seems like you'd want it in the namespace object.
16:56 pmichaud well, as your nopaste shows, getting custom namespace objects in place is currently a problem.
16:57 pmichaud and in the case of cross-hll import+export, it's the compiler object that is likely to have the translation knowledge, instead of the namespace.
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16:57 pmichaud (also, it's easy to get a hold of a compiler object -- not always so easy to get hold of namespace objects)
16:57 chromatic That nopaste looks fixable.
16:57 pmichaud anyway, in your nopaste, the problem is that the subs are loaded (into their namespaces) before the :init sub executes
16:58 Coke ok, let me switch that to :immediate.
16:58 Coke ah, good catch.
16:58 Coke fixed.
16:58 pmichaud the problem I see with :immediate, though, is that I don't know that it survives through .pbc generation.
16:59 chromatic That should still store the map in PBC.
16:59 pmichaud i.e., if the .pir is pre-compiled to .pbc, I don't know that it will remember the map
16:59 chromatic If it doesn't, that's a bug too.
17:00 Coke I think I can work with this for now, and move a bunch of my namespace logic into the actual NS object.
17:00 Coke just trying to get NS import, origin, and forget working properly.
17:02 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "hll map fails with :immediate" (41 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/17309
17:03 chromatic Lovely.
17:04 Coke I would imagine that either the interpreter should also be saved out (including the hll mapping state), or that :immediate subs should get saved for freezing, or that there should be a :tag that means "immediate, but after compilation to bytecode"
17:05 Coke but I would expect that to work. (my NS example just generates the wrong type when run from PBC, no nasty assertion failures)
17:05 whiteknight or, another option, we all just ignore the failure and work around it
17:05 chromatic HLL mapping needs to save STRING names, because there's no guarantee that they'll have the same type number later.
17:05 chromatic It also needs to save class declarations so it can recreate them.
17:06 pmichaud what if we map to an anonymous class?  string names won't help us there.
17:06 pmichaud (I guess we can say "no mapping to anonymous classes")
17:06 chromatic Yeah, you need some moniker to recreate the mapping.
17:07 nopaste "pmichaud" at 72.181.176.220 pasted "namespace version of failure with :immediate and hll_map" (47 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/17310
17:08 pmichaud part of the problem is that :immediate subs don't really "save for freezing"
17:09 pmichaud we need something that means "freeze, but execute immediately upon load"
17:09 pmichaud where "immediately upon load" means "even before loading the rest of the bytecode"
17:12 pmichaud afk, lunhc
17:12 Coke seems like keep track of all the immediates and freezing them as inits would do the trick.
17:14 chromatic That may work as a first step.
17:14 chromatic I'm not sure we always know which of them we need to freeze, though.
17:14 TimToady feels like there's some needed abstraction missing
17:15 PerlJam This sounds like the same thing as why perl 5 got CHECK and UNITCHECK
17:15 PerlJam (or similar anyway)
17:16 chromatic In this case it's not that we need to *run code* during PBC loading, it's that we need to *define and map types*.
17:23 Coke chromatic: yes, but to do that up front we're running code. is it easier to rerun that code or to save the results of the mappings?
17:23 Coke easier/better/makes fluffier puppies.
17:24 Coke the problem, I think, is that this state is in the interpreter - are we freezing the interpreter? if so, when we thaw it, what happens to the interpreter we were just using?
17:24 chromatic I'm not sure what the right answer is, but I think it's helpful to keep in mind the specifics of the problem we need to solve.
17:25 Coke someone should open a ticket.
17:34 pmichaud the issue is that we don't have a way to define new types short of running code.
17:35 pmichaud (at least part of the issue)
17:35 Tene Tickets don't squash bugs.  Commits squash bugs.
17:35 Tene ;)
17:37 PerlJam pmichaud: and the current mechanism generates :immediate subs to run that code?
17:37 pmichaud PerlJam: no.
17:38 pmichaud PerlJam: the current mechanism doesn't provide appropriate hooks to map types such as namespaces or subs.
17:38 pmichaud in rakudo, new types are created by :load :init subs
17:39 pmichaud (because :immediate subs get lost in .pbc files)
17:41 Coke partcl's using :load, as we don't compile down to PBC and are always load_bytecode'd atm.
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18:28 dalek rakudo: faf91f9 | pmichaud++ | docs/spectest-progress.csv:
18:28 dalek rakudo: spectest-progress.csv update: 415 files, 11802 passing, 2 failing
18:28 dalek rakudo: Failure summary:
18:28 dalek rakudo:     S12-attributes/instance.rakudo 121 - Can initialize one attribute based on another (1)
18:28 dalek rakudo:     S12-attributes/instance.rakudo 122 - Can initialize one attribute based on another (2)
18:28 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f​af91f9103926661b7deb2a2e230ae1e9c4f2a10
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22:32 dalek decnum-dynpmcs: r112 | darbelo++ | trunk/aux/decTest/src/pct/ (2 files):
22:32 dalek decnum-dynpmcs: Push the PCT decTest parser forward, it now emits PIR that looks like it might
22:32 dalek decnum-dynpmcs: be correct, despite the fact that it's not runnable yet.
22:32 dalek decnum-dynpmcs: review: http://code.google.com/p/decnu​m-dynpmcs/source/detail?r=112
22:33 darbelo make clean
22:33 purl make clean is fuxord, no worky
22:33 darbelo Agh. Wrong window.
22:35 dalek TT #846 created by jkeenan++: Add 'testing' to Component pane in Trac
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22:44 nnunley pmichaud: ping
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22:48 nnunley I almost have the nqp bootstrap passing all tests.
22:49 nnunley Trying to figure out why string_literal doesn't respect excaped literals, and how the pir c<inline:,> is taken advantage of by the current pir version.
22:50 nnunley chromatic: The leaks I saw last night were caused by attempting to bind methods to an undefined class.
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22:54 chromatic That's odd; I wonder how it did that.
22:56 nnunley chromatic: I know what I have to break in nqp in order to get back into that state.  I'll see if I can come up with a minimal testcase in pir based on what it emits.
22:57 chromatic That would be great.
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