Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2009-11-17

Parrot | source cross referenced

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:03 japhb Ah well, guess it will have to be a generic tweet then.
00:03 Whiteknight how do I switch which branch I am on in git?
00:03 japhb 'git checkout <branch>'
00:04 japhb If you want to create a new local branch at the same time, it's 'git checkout -b <new_branch>'
00:04 Austin git branch
00:04 purl git branch is a user command; if that format changes it'll break my one-liner
00:04 japhb To see branches and current branch, 'git branch' with no arguments
00:05 dukeleto 'ello
00:05 japhb o/
00:05 Austin WhiteKnight: I think 7 git branch  uses a '*' to indicate the current branch.
00:06 treed It does.
00:06 purl if you say so...
00:06 dukeleto japhb: i will try to write more tests to make sure that win32 is failing tests again :)
00:06 japhb dukeleto, actually, making any platform fail will work.  ;-)
00:06 japhb We're woefully undertested.
00:07 dukeleto git branch -a shows all branches,including remotes
00:07 japhb It would be nice to get complete coverage of Glue.pir and Util.nqp, and a complete set of invalid & missing arg tests for plumage.
00:08 japhb with the most recent tests reorg, it should be easier to see what's missing there.
00:08 dukeleto japhb: ok
00:08 japhb Doing a complete set of functional tests for plumage is going to be harder, so that's lower priority.  "low hanging fruit" and all that.
00:10 dukeleto japhb: also, i started nqptap: http://github.com/leto/nqptap (you and pmichaud have commit access)
00:10 dukeleto japhb: it is just a skeleton right now, but i am going to properly test the test harness
00:10 Coke anyone here familiar with setting up a google group that tracks an existing mailing list?
00:10 Coke seen allison?
00:10 purl allison was last seen on #parrot 2 days, 23 hours, 11 minutes and 41 seconds ago, saying: japhb: there is definitely also room for introductory documentation separate from src/  [Nov 14 00:58:11 2009]
00:10 japhb dukeleto, ah, very cool.
00:10 japhb dukeleto++
00:12 japhb Coke, no ... though I've been seeing some serious hate directed at Google Groups lately because of an apparent total lack of the anti-spam technology that gmail has ....
00:12 Coke if we're mirroring a mailing list, that doesn't matter so much.
00:12 dukeleto dcolish: take a look at tools/dev/mk_language_shell.pl in the parrot repo for how to start a new language
00:13 pmichaud Coke: basically I think it's (1) create the group, (2) subscribe the group to the mailing list
00:13 pmichaud at least, that's what I've done for the groups I've used
00:14 japhb dukeleto, nqptap's CREDITS still refers to Kea.  Also, you may want to s/nqp/parrot-nqp/g.  Or not.  Or mention both.
00:15 japhb Coke, assuming you can limit posts to being only from the mirrored list, yes.  (I don't happen to know, I haven't tried to do that.)
00:15 dcolish dukeleto: ran that, so now i have a languages/haskell dir in my parrot tree
00:16 he_ Hmm, I'm looking at the t/pmc/threads.t test failing, at http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/public_pr​ojects/report_details/29968#first_failure
00:16 japhb dukeleto, And of course I hope to see an nqptap.json in Plumage's metadata soon.  ;-)
00:16 he_ The "Invalid shared object handle" error message comes from ld.elf_so.
00:17 he_ specifically from _rtld_dlcheck(), which is a static function, called from dlclose() and in some cases from dlsym().
00:17 he_ So what magic does parrot try to do which NetBSD's ld.elf_so balks at?
00:17 dcolish so what is the simplest grammar tool to use for starting a new language
00:18 japhb Grrr.  ping.fm fail.
00:19 Whiteknight joined #parrot
00:21 Whiteknight okay, I deleted a branch locally. How do I make that branch disappear from github?
00:21 dukeleto japhb:here is your ping.fm gold watch
00:21 dukeleto dcolish: congrats!
00:21 japhb dukeleto, OK where did the gold watch meme begin?
00:21 Austin squaak?
00:21 purl i think squaak is languages/squaak or the language in kj's tutorial at parrotblog.org or http://svn.perl.org/parrot/trunk/languages/squaak/
00:21 dcolish :) well now i need to actually do work
00:21 dukeleto japhb: thanks for the heads up. will fix those soon and give plumage a .json metadata file as soon as nqptap works :)
00:22 japhb :-)
00:22 dukeleto japhb: the movie "Speed" maybe? it probably existed before that
00:22 Austin dcolish:  http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Parrot_Virt​ual_Machine/Squaak_Tutorial/Introduction
00:22 dcolish excellent, thank you Austin
00:22 dukeleto dcolish: squaak is a good example, but some of the tools have improved since then
00:22 Austin tutorial?
00:22 purl tutorial is http://search.cpan.org/dist/Catalyst-M​anual/lib/Catalyst/Manual/Tutorial.pod
00:23 japhb Wow, Speed was 15 years ago.
00:23 Austin no, tutorial is the Parrot interpreter tutorial at  http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Parrot_Virt​ual_Machine/Squaak_Tutorial/Introduction
00:23 purl okay, Austin.
00:24 Coke kid51?
00:24 purl kid51 is probably now going to live dangerously.
00:24 Coke jkeenan?
00:24 purl well, jkeenan is kid51
00:24 Coke kid51 email?
00:25 dukeleto dcolish: other questions?
00:25 dcolish none for now
00:25 dcolish i'm going to go over the tutorial tonight
00:25 dukeleto dcolish: recently we got a new NQP, called NQP-rx. it makes some things in the PCT a lot easier, but most languages currently built on parrot use PCT, not NQP-rx
00:26 dukeleto it just landed in parrot a few days ago, hasn't been in a release yet
00:26 dukeleto but it is definitely the best way to write a HLL
00:26 dcolish i built from svn today so i might have it then
00:26 japhb dcolish, you definitely do.
00:26 dukeleto but getting to know the PCT is definitely worth it as well
00:26 dukeleto dcolish: yes, you do. it is in ext/
00:26 treed dukeleto: Are there any guides for converting yet?
00:27 dukeleto treed: converting languges on PCT to NQP-rx?
00:27 treed Yeah.
00:27 dukeleto treed: that is a great question for pmichaud
00:27 treed Heh.
00:27 dukeleto treed: at least a guide would be very helpful
00:27 dukeleto dcolish: NQP-rx makes defining the grammar/actions simpler
00:28 japhb Also, a lot of stuff that was possible but painful in old NQP is now much easier.
00:28 dcolish i'm used to yacc grammars so anything like that and i'll feel right at home
00:29 treed PCT used Perl6 Regex
00:29 treed I'd be surprised if NQP-rx didn't.
00:29 treed It's pretty nice.
00:29 japhb dcolish, you're going to wonder how you ever used yacc once you get used to Perl 6 Grammars.
00:29 dcolish heh cool
00:29 pmichaud I still need to write a tutorial, too
00:29 pmichaud ETOOMANYCOOLTOYS
00:30 japhb pmichaud, MAKE MORE TOYS!  ;-)
00:30 pmichaud the new toolkit available through nqp is way cooler than what pge/pct provided
00:30 pmichaud especially with the protoregexes
00:30 dukeleto dcolish: http://github.com/leto/kea/blob/3aedd24bd17​36eb8f3514bd0f8a3dfd0ec73ccd0/kea-compiler for an example of NQP-rx
00:31 dukeleto pmichaud: tutorials would be greatly appreciated :) i can help, since i was gonna write one if you didn't get around to it soon :)
00:31 japhb pmichaud, on a serious note -- I'm beginning to be blocked on not having one of the "globals" solutions from http://wiki.github.com/per​l6/nqp-rx/plumage-requests ....  In fact, I could actually make some progress "coding in the dark" in a few places if I even know which one(s) you *plan* to make work.
00:34 dcolish dukeleto: is factor related to forth at all?
00:35 plobsing joined #parrot
00:35 japhb dcolish, yes, via Joy, IIRC.
00:36 darbelo dcolish: It's a stack language. How could it not be?
00:36 japhb dcolish, see http://factorcode.org/ and http://concatenative.org/wiki/view/Factor
00:36 * dcolish realizes the sillieness of the question only moments after asking
00:36 chromatic It's not necessarily a silly question.
00:36 pmichaud japhb:  I'll see if I can remove the block.... one moment
00:36 Austin japhb: I've got solutions for a bunch of those requests in Kakapo. (If only I could get strings to work.)
00:37 chromatic I thought PostScript had a Forth heritage, but it doesn't.
00:37 dukeleto dcolish: Factor borrows heavily from stack language culture
00:37 pmichaud japhb: I'm not likely to do lexical import anytime soon
00:37 pmichaud japhb: I can probably get @GLOBALS::ARGS to work
00:37 pmichaud and contextuals looking in namespace, at least for read.  Not sure about binding, though.
00:37 dcolish chromatic: fwiw, wikipedia says postscript has a lisp heritage
00:38 japhb pmichaud, \o/  # thank you!
00:38 dukeleto dcolish: Factor devs describe it as "forth with batteries"
00:39 japhb Chuck Moore would cringe.
00:39 Austin japhb: Specifically:  (1) I use a dependency queue for load/init ordering, so with some explicit specs I can get startup dependencies done. (2) I've got import/export, including a "global" namespace. (3) I've got class/subclass declarations, using attributes.
00:39 dcolish dukeleto: heh, i'll have to look at it more, i've always been fascinated with the stack langs
00:39 dukeleto dcolish: ok, i am adding you to the kea github repo now :)
00:39 dcolish lol
00:39 dcolish i better stop before i'm involved with every project under the sun!
00:40 japhb Austin, I would love to be able to use a common set of such libraries.  Unfortunately, I can only do so if you can get shipped with parrot.  :-/
00:40 japhb *can get *kakapo*
00:40 Austin Actually, you need to ship a kakapo release with plumage.
00:40 Austin (IOW, copy the .pirs)
00:41 japhb Austin, plumage will be shipping with Parrot, so same difference.  ;-)
00:41 mikehh joined #parrot
00:41 Austin Right. So copy the pirs into plumage and you're done.
00:42 Austin Actually, it's more than that, but I'll send you a merge eventually.
00:45 japhb Austin, have you done a PaFo CLA?
00:45 Austin Nope.
00:45 dukeleto dcolish: ok, you are on the kea gtihub repo now
00:46 dcolish dukeleto: excellent
00:46 dukeleto dcolish: looks like you need to have 48 more repos to catch up to my level of "involved with every project under the sun" :)
00:46 dcolish heh
00:47 dukeleto dcolish: please add yourself to CREDITS
00:47 dcolish k
00:47 japhb Austin, the other roadblock is that I'm not allowed to put anything into Plumage unless the author has done a PaFo CLA.
00:47 Austin Okay.
00:48 japhb So please do.  ;-)
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00:50 dukeleto japhb: you can accept a patch, but no one can actually commit to plumage with a PaFo CLA, right ?
00:50 dukeleto japhb: i don't think there is anything wrong with you accepting a patch into plumage from someone who hasn't signed the CLA
00:53 dalek TT #1278 created by coke++: remove MT19937 from stdlib
00:55 mikehh joined #parrot
00:55 dalek parrot: r42539 | coke++ | trunk/DEPRECATED.pod:
00:55 dalek parrot: Add a notice for this DEP ticket.
00:55 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42539/
00:56 particle joined #parrot
00:59 mikehh joined #parrot
01:04 dalek matrixy: 98e5607 | Whiteknight++ |  (4 files):
01:04 dalek matrixy: apparently all my complex changes from branch didn't make it through the merge, or whatever. Re-add some stuff
01:04 dalek matrixy: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/matrixy/commi​t/98e56078d741014e4dd6dfe38528173134899c64
01:04 dalek matrixy: 82ca237 | Whiteknight++ | src/ (2 files):
01:04 dalek matrixy: fix another issue from the missing complex code
01:04 dalek matrixy: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/matrixy/commi​t/82ca237eafe6a66d7e698b577c8b528ee8eed920
01:04 dalek matrixy: 1e7df46 | Whiteknight++ | t/300-transpose.t:
01:04 dalek matrixy: fix the plan on transpose.t
01:04 dalek matrixy: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/matrixy/commi​t/1e7df466c1fbe9b754501ef0eff6c9d44478645d
01:10 dalek matrixy: 6591db1 | Whiteknight++ | src/builtins/conj.pir:
01:10 dalek matrixy: separate out conj() into it's own file, as per standards
01:10 dalek matrixy: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/matrixy/commi​t/6591db1fc4b9ad328a865591d4f076409988cae8
01:12 kid51_at_dinner make fulltest: Linux/i386: no special configuration options:  PASS at r 42538
01:12 cotto_work That's a good sign given tomorrow's release.
01:14 kid51 results soon for darwin/ppc
01:17 cotto_work goto home;
01:20 * Coke grumbles at svn.
01:21 Coke I wish to revert a commit that involved a few deletions.
01:22 Coke I don't see a one liner for this. (tortoise svn gets this right...)
01:25 particle joined #parrot
01:30 pmichaud I need to update NEWS and DEPRECATED for the release.  Will do that in a couple of hours.
01:32 dalek TT #1279 created by pmichaud++: Parrot prefers libraries in build tree to installed tree or current ...
01:36 Ryan52 when's the next parrot release?
01:37 chromatic Tomorrow.
01:37 purl o/~ the sun will come out.. tomorrow.. o/~ or the National Day of Slayer, and the National Emo Kid Beatdown day, by http://www.nationaldayofslayer.org/ and http://community.livejourna​l.com/wtf_inc/2805832.html or tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow creeps in this petty pace or mañana or free for all or another day or the name of the pitcher
01:37 Ryan52 nice.
01:38 Ryan52 allison: mind if I make another upload to debian experimental after the release? do you want to review it again or can I just do it?
01:51 dalek tracwiki: v1 | plobsing++ | Lorito
01:51 dalek tracwiki: initial thoughts
01:51 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wik​i/Lorito?version=1&amp;action=diff
02:03 dalek TT #608 closed by coke++: user mailing list (parrot-users) with an associated google group
02:06 dalek TT #1280 created by jimmy++: [patch]removed unused codes in oo.c
02:06 dalek TT #917 closed by coke++: What mailing lists should parrot.org host?
02:07 dalek parrot: r42540 | coke++ | trunk (3 files):
02:07 dalek parrot: re-add mt19937 to the stdlib (See TT #1278)
02:07 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42540/
02:07 tetragon joined #parrot
02:09 Coke AOOOGA.
02:09 Coke parrot-users now exists.
02:09 Coke (has for some time, but just twisted allison++'s arm to setup the google groups stuff.)
02:10 Coke if you're a dev, please consider joining to help out the users.
02:20 diakopter rakudo: $_="hihi"; .=="hihi".say
02:20 diakopter oop.
02:26 dalek TT #1281 created by coke++: Remove graph coloring register allocator from IMCC
02:27 japhb dukeleto, My understanding (IA *SO* NAL) from the last time this came up is that by committing a patch, I am claiming that the copyright stuff is OK.  For small patches, that's probably rarely an issue.  For a large change, with lots of new files, I don't think I can just do it without myself getting the approximate equivalent of a PaFo CLA -- so no reason to do that, rather just insist that major new stuff be sent from someone who has alr
02:27 japhb eady submitted a PaFo CLA.
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: d7b50d4 | pmichaud++ |  (5 files):
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: Add @XYZ::foo and $GLOBAL::bar variables.
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: review: http://github.com/perl6/nqp-rx/commit/d​7b50d4037b4b298109963e0888a8c76d497e9c7
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: 2925cff | pmichaud++ |  (2 files):
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: Contextuals also look in the global namespace.
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: review: http://github.com/perl6/nqp-rx/commit/2​925cffccf2186dc2ea3055dd2fa8193c066149f
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: 49c429d | pmichaud++ | src/stage0/ (3 files):
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: Bootstrap update for package vars and contextuals in global scope.
02:28 dalek nqp-rx: review: http://github.com/perl6/nqp-rx/commit/4​9c429dfe0be4b848dcf32c2789e1b95c7e6f9d4
02:30 kiwichris joined #parrot
02:36 dalek TT #1282 created by coke++: OS.cwd returns platform specific slashes...
02:36 pmichaud japhb: r42541 is your friend.  :-)
02:37 Coke pmichaud: you said you had a comment to make on http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Tic​ket/Display.html?id=59576 that would let us close it, any chance you can poke at that tonight?
02:38 dalek parrot: r42541 | pmichaud++ | failed to fetch changeset:
02:38 dalek parrot: [nqp]:  Update with latest contextual and package var improvements.
02:38 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42541/
02:44 dalek TT #1283 created by coke++: rethrow should keep the backtrace of the original 'die'
02:53 cconstantine joined #parrot
02:54 japhb pmichaud++ # thanks again, I will check it out tomorrow
03:00 dalek TT #1284 created by coke++: Integer PMC missing math methods
03:01 cconstantine joined #parrot
03:10 dalek TT #1285 created by coke++: Some files generated by Configure.pl should be generated by Makefile
03:16 dalek TT #1286 created by particle++: method overload in pir subclass of pmc pccmethod leaves object undefined
03:17 kid51 Belated report:  make fulltest passed on darwin/ppc at r 42538
03:20 dalek TT #1287 created by coke++: Move thread check into Parrot_exit()
03:22 mokurai1 joined #parrot
03:23 dalek TT #1288 created by coke++: Limit the required interface for PMCs
03:26 * Coke tries to parse Bob Rogers's email client's "reply-to" format.
03:26 * Coke fails.
03:29 pmichaud Coke: RT #59576 closed.
03:35 janus joined #parrot
03:39 Coke pmichaud++
03:59 dalek TT #1289 created by coke++: Review/Consolidate test infrastructure in t/codingstd and t/distro
04:02 Coke who owns irclogs.perlgeek.de ?
04:03 PerlJam ITYM irclog.perlgeek.de
04:04 Coke ITYKWIM.
04:04 purl i think itykwim is I Think You Know What I Mean
04:04 cotto Coke, moritz
04:05 Coke msg moritz IWBNI irclog.perlgeek.de knew that #dddd could also mean trac tickets.
04:05 purl Message for moritz stored.
04:11 dalek rakudo: d3a573b | (Solomon Foster)++ | src/setting/ (2 files):
04:11 dalek rakudo: Add Rat.abs.  When doing abs(Any), just redispatch to self.abs rather than taking +self.
04:11 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d​3a573b8d755baded05497950f7929b32e562184
04:12 dalek TT #1290 created by chromatic++: Produce Single PBC from Multiple PIR Files with -o
04:26 dalek TT #1291 created by coke++: update make headerizer to work with PMCs too.
04:26 Coke NotFound: ping.
04:26 Coke msg NotFound can you look at migrating http://rt.perl.org/rt3/Tic​ket/Display.html?id=39117 ?
04:26 purl Message for notfound stored.
04:28 Austin Actually, Coke, IWBNI if one of those url-rewriting bots would put those links directly into chat. Then the logs could just log what the bot said.
04:30 PerlJam Austin: I don't think so.  More bot-noise is not a good thing.
04:33 PerlJam (though if it were logging an internal monologue that contained the URLs but that didn't make it on-channel, that would be neat I think)
04:36 dalek TT #1292 created by coke++: Correct destruction of PackFile objects
04:39 cotto Coke, I was going to reject that Array ticket after #ps tomorrow, assuming that people were ok with its deprecation.
04:39 dalek TT #1293 created by cotto++: Array PMC freeze/thaw/visit broken
04:41 Austin PerlJam: I haven't had a botnoise problem since I started /ignore-ing them. But given that #123 gets displayed as a link to another IRC channel, having the bot come along with the right url strikes me as worth seeing.
04:54 Coke #123 is just text here.
04:55 Coke if the recommended course of action is to ignore the bots, why have them spew?
04:55 Coke cotto: certainly there's no point in cleaning up array if we're deleting it.
04:55 Coke cotto: I wouldn't just ask at #ps, I'd open an RFC ticket.
04:56 Coke and at this point, let's transfer the tickets even if we think they /might/ be rejected in trac soon.
04:56 Coke RT: down to 13 tickets.
04:57 Coke msg allison I dealt with 4/5 of your tickets in exchange for the google groups. Hopefully someone else will migrate the last one. (I'm hoping pmichaud peeks at it.)
04:57 purl Message for allison stored.
04:57 Austin Coke: Different folks care about different stuff. I have no interest, for example, in seeing all the latest commits. Others may not care about tickets.
04:58 Coke Austin: fair enough.
05:22 * Coke hopes those 13 tickets are gone by tomorrow. =-)
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06:28 dalek tracwiki: v2 | cotto++ | Lorito
06:28 dalek tracwiki: add some counterpoints and clarifications to the opcode proposition
06:28 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wik​i/Lorito?version=2&amp;action=diff
06:39 kiwichris joined #parrot
06:43 NotFound Coke: gone
06:44 NotFound with the wind.
06:44 TiMBuS joined #parrot
07:04 uniejo joined #parrot
07:09 diakopter microsoft released the source to .NET micro framework 4.0 under the Apache 2.0 license..
07:10 bacek joined #parrot
07:10 cotto hi bacek
07:11 bacek aloha cotto
07:14 * cotto pictures "bacek of today" with Hawaiian shirt bacek
07:15 bacek cotto I'm in pretty boring style today...
07:15 cotto I have a Hawaiian shirt.  I feel loud whenever I put it on.
07:17 bacek I actually have couple of them.
07:18 bacek cotto, btw, I tried to update ops_pmc to trunk. 97 conflicts...
07:20 cotto I'm not sure how that's possible.  I didn't think there were even 97 changes outside of compilers/opsc.
07:21 bacek probably git-svn borked somehow
07:21 cotto either way, svn--
07:22 bacek May be create new branch, copy compilers/opsc across and bring life in this project
07:22 cotto I hate that the best way to deal with branches involves clobbering the history periodically
07:22 cotto yeah
07:22 dukeleto 'ello
07:22 cotto I'd also recommend checking the diff between the most recent merge point and the branch to see what we changes outside of compilers/opsc.
07:23 cotto hi dukeleto
07:23 bacek hi dukeleto
07:23 bacek cotto, it's in config/ for generating opsc Makefile
07:29 cotto I'd expect fewer than 97 conflicts for that change. ;)
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07:43 cotto bacek, I don't think that message went where you wanted it to go.
07:43 bacek cotto which one???
07:44 bacek oh shit..
07:44 cotto Merge Party!
07:44 bacek yak...
07:44 bacek sorry...
07:44 purl It's okay, bacek.
07:45 cotto It's fine.  I think it's funny since there don't appear to be any important sekrits in the message.
07:45 chromatic Is there beer?
07:46 * cotto ponders what kind of beers would be good when merged
07:47 bacek It wasn't... But I still wonder how bloody thunderbird managed to send it to wrong list?
07:47 moritz uhm
07:47 moritz isn't today release day?
07:48 moritz oh, I see, the branches were merged, but not in trunk, right?
07:48 bacek cotto: "Carlton Draught"
07:48 cotto moritz, I think it's from bacek's work
07:49 moritz oh, ok
07:49 bacek moritz, it was for my $dayjob... Actually it was sent to both lists...
07:49 * moritz was a bit puzzled by the unfamiliar names
07:49 nbrown joined #parrot
07:51 fperrad joined #parrot
08:11 * cotto goes to sleeeeeeeeeeeep
08:14 dalek parrot: r42542 | fperrad++ | trunk/NEWS:
08:14 dalek parrot: [NEWS] revert r42467, see TT #1278
08:14 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42542/
08:16 barney joined #parrot
08:24 mikehh joined #parrot
08:32 nbrown joined #parrot
08:46 * japhb posts his #parrotsketch report about 10 hours early ...
08:46 japhb And now, off to bed.  g'night, all.
08:48 dalek parrot: r42543 | barney++ | trunk/NEWS:
08:48 dalek parrot: Added news about the deprecated Mersenne twisted pseudorandom number generator.
08:48 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42543/
08:50 chromatic One quick bugfix for pbc_to_exe coming, barney.
08:51 dalek parrot: r42544 | chromatic++ | trunk/tools/dev/pbc_to_exe.pir:
08:51 dalek parrot: [pbc_to_exe] Fixed pbc_to_exe to allow the generation of installable
08:51 dalek parrot: fakecutables when the source PBC has a directory path (RT #57236).
08:51 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42544/
08:53 barney No hurry
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08:55 dalek parrot: r42545 | barney++ | trunk/NEWS:
08:55 dalek parrot: Added news about parrot-users.
08:55 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42545/
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09:41 mikehh barney: when are fixin' to do the release
09:54 barney I plan on 13:00 UTC
10:10 Topic for #parrotis now Release of Parrot 1.8.0 starting at 13:00 UTC | Latest modified TT's: http://icanhaz.com/parrotbugs
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10:22 dalek parrot: r42546 | barney++ | trunk/docs/project/release_manager_guide.pod:
10:22 dalek parrot: Moved an announcement to committers into item 0.
10:22 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42546/
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10:58 dalek parrot: r42547 | mikehh++ | trunk/t/op/comp.t:
10:58 dalek parrot: fix test failure on g++ 4.4.1 (with --optimize) on i386 - TT #1275
10:58 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42547/
11:00 mikehh I still want to try and sort out TT #1142 before the release
11:05 mikehh at least the testing side so we don't get TODO passes
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11:13 barney mikehh: yes, please go ahead
11:18 nbrown joined #parrot
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12:02 barney Is META.yml still needed? If not I'll create a TT to remove it.
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12:05 dalek parrot: r42548 | barney++ | trunk/README:
12:05 dalek parrot: Removed reference to Bundle::Parrot.
12:05 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42548/
12:06 moritz barney: I think the stable releases go to CPAN, so then a META.yml is necessary
12:07 moritz where stable = deprecation checkpoint releases
12:11 dalek parrot: r42549 | mikehh++ | trunk/t/pmc/eval.t:
12:11 dalek parrot: fix test so it only sets TODO for testr on amd64 with cc-gcc and not g++
12:11 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42549/
12:11 dalek parrot: r42550 | barney++ | trunk/docs/parrot.pod:
12:11 dalek parrot: [doc] Minor change in wording.
12:11 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42550/
12:13 dalek TT #553 closed by barney++: [CAGE] Remove Bundle::Parrot from README?
12:14 barney moritz: I'll ask allison, CPAN is no longer mentioned in release_manager_guide.pod
12:18 dalek parrot: r42551 | barney++ | trunk/README:
12:18 dalek parrot: [doc] Point to the correct files with platform info.
12:18 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42551/
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12:46 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, smoke (#29980), fulltest) at r42550 - Ubuntu 9.10 amd64 (g++ with --optimize)
12:52 barney mikehh++
12:53 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, smoke (#29981), fulltest) at r42551 - Ubuntu 9.10 amd64 (gcc with --optimize)
12:53 mikehh have we time to run tests on Ubuntu 9.10 i386?
12:55 barney doing that right now
12:55 mikehh ok I'll leave it to you
13:05 mikehh messages
13:09 whiteknight joined #parrot
13:12 whiteknight good morning #parrot
13:15 pmichaud good morning, #parrot
13:16 pmichaud eta to release?  I might have some NEWS updates
13:19 whiteknight barney said he was going to start around 9:00AM european time
13:20 whiteknight I don't remember which timezone he said specifically
13:20 moritz see /topic
13:20 moritz that's, uhm, 20 minutes ago :-)
13:20 pmichaud 09:54 <barney> I plan on 13:00 UTC
13:20 whiteknight oh. I must be going blind. moritz++
13:21 pmichaud I never see the topic in the chans.
13:21 pmichaud so, too late for NEWS updates?
13:21 * moritz has a handy topicdiff script for irssi
13:21 pmichaud I notice that "make install" isn't listed in NEWS.
13:21 pmichaud oh, wait, there it is.
13:22 pmichaud having most of the bullet items start with "The "  makes it a bit more difficult to scan.  :-|
13:23 pmichaud barney: ping
13:26 plobsing joined #parrot
13:27 whiteknight I think barney is at $day_job
13:29 dalek parrot: r42552 | whiteknight++ | trunk/src/multidispatch.c:
13:29 dalek parrot: [mmd] remove RT #45959 note from the source here. That ticket has been rejected and this is not the correct place to be evaluating MMD candidates for fitness.
13:29 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42552/
13:29 pmichaud so, too late to commit changes to NEWS ?
13:30 Coke I haven't seen any messages either way.
13:30 whiteknight just commit it
13:30 Coke I would sneak them in.
13:30 whiteknight worst case scenario: it doesn't make it into the tarball
13:30 Coke (at which point it's prewritten for next time.)
13:30 barney pmichaud: go ahead with NEWS
13:31 Coke EEK it's barney.
13:31 Coke barney?
13:31 purl barney is a big, purple piece of shit, or gettin' jiggy wid it or see 'grimace'. or purple dupa or o/` I love you / You love me / We're a happy family / with a great big hug /and a kiss from me to you / Won't you say you love me TOO! /`o
13:31 Coke botsnack
13:31 purl :)
13:33 tetragon joined #parrot
13:35 dalek parrot: r42553 | whiteknight++ | trunk/src/embed.c:
13:36 dalek parrot: [embed] Remove old comment for RT #46155. This code isn't used and causes confusion. If we find actual memory leaks later we can create a new ticket
13:36 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42553/
13:38 pmichaud news updates committed
13:39 pmichaud (r42554)
13:39 dalek parrot: r42554 | pmichaud++ | trunk/NEWS:
13:39 dalek parrot: [NEWS]:   NEWS updates
13:39 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42554/
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13:45 dalek parrot: r42555 | barney++ | trunk/NEWS:
13:46 dalek parrot: Added details about merged branches.
13:46 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42555/
13:46 dalek parrot: r42556 | whiteknight++ | trunk/src/exit.c:
13:46 dalek parrot: [exit] Remove note for RT #46403
13:46 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42556/
13:56 lucian joined #parrot
13:56 barney Any more outstanding commits? (Running 'make fulltest' now)
13:58 dalek TT #1294 created by doughera++: Build failure on OpenBSD 4.6 -- missing dependency?
13:58 Coke barney: assuming that I'm one of the few people that can update docs.parrot.org, lemme know when you get to that step.
14:00 barney Coke: will do
14:00 Coke barney: #1294 looks like something we should try to fix if we can. doing a checkdepend run...
14:00 whiteknight Coke: how does one get the ability to update docs.parrot.org?
14:02 dalek TT #1295 created by whiteknight++: Should FixedPMCArray autovivify nested arrays on set_*keyed()?
14:02 Coke whiteknight: at the moment, you need an account on parrotvm.osuosl.org
14:03 Coke though certainly we could setup something to do it automatically pretty easily.
14:03 Coke "check out the tagged release; run make html; copy over the appropriate directories" would pretty much do it.
14:03 whiteknight ...and now I have no RT tickets. 7 left
14:04 barney whiteknight++
14:05 Coke that leaves particle (5), infinoid (1), and allison (1).
14:05 Coke whiteknight++
14:12 barney Coke: Looks loke foo2 depends on foo
14:13 Coke barney: looks like all those deps are handrolled and don't include the pmc header files anyway.
14:13 * Coke added some comments to the ticket.
14:13 Coke someone can do a patch job for the release, but the dynpmc deps should be handled just like the PMC deps.
14:15 * Coke ponders resurrecting his "one makefile to rule them all" strategy.
14:16 einstein joined #parrot
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14:18 Coke ah. both gmake and nmake support the 'include' directive; is anyone using a make variant that doesn't?
14:18 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, smoke (#29986), fulltest) at r42556 - Ubuntu 9.10 amd64 (g++ with --optimize)
14:19 Coke :q
14:19 Coke ww
14:20 Coke if we had a bunch of generated ".mak" files, where would we put them?
14:20 mikehh I get with smoke #29986 - 11,611 ok, 0 failed, 271 todo, 574 skipped and 0 unexpectedly succeeded
14:23 bluescreen joined #parrot
14:26 mikehh looking at various recent smoke reports we get 1 failure on MSWin32/i386 - t/op/time.t - not ok 9 - sleep_n slept for at least the integer amount of time specified
14:28 mikehh 1 failure on solaris/sparc32 but none on sparc64
14:29 dalek parrot: r42557 | barney++ | trunk/config/gen/makefiles/dynpmc.in:
14:29 dalek parrot: Added explicit dependence   foo2$(O): foo.c foo2.c  (TT #1294).
14:29 dalek parrot: Assuming the *.h are built along the *.c files.
14:29 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42557/
14:34 barney I've seen Test OS.readdir in t/pmc/os.t http://smolder.plusthree.com/app/pu​blic_projects/report_details/29987
14:40 payload joined #parrot
14:43 Coke is that the same mswin32 failure we always get?
14:43 Coke someone needs to go through and create tickets for those and TODO them.
14:43 mikehh no - new one
14:43 Coke (smoke needs to be green.0
14:44 Coke huh.
14:44 Coke I'd have known that if it was normally green. =-)
14:47 Coke what is  src/string_private_cstring.h in MANIFEST.generated?
14:47 mikehh we had a failure before with t/op/time.t that seems to have been fixed and now a new failure with t/pmc/os.t - mon MSWin32/i386 at r49556 - thats from smoke reports - I haven't got that platform available
14:48 mikehh r42556
14:48 patspam joined #parrot
14:54 * Coke solicits feedback on a make suggestion.
14:54 Coke s/make/build/
14:57 bubaflub joined #parrot
14:57 barney if the ReadDir - test is skipped on ( $MSWin32 && $MSVC ), why should it work with gcc ?
14:57 patspam1 joined #parrot
14:59 whiteknight GeJ fixed the failure in time.t yesterday
14:59 whiteknight or, I committed his fix
14:59 whiteknight (it was my typo that broke the test)
15:04 mikehh got to go out for an hour or so - bbl
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15:33 barney Is it just me, or it http://smolder.plusthree.com/ down?
15:36 plobsing_ joined #parrot
15:36 allison barney: (from earlier question) only the Jan and July releases go up on CPAN
15:38 dalek website: coke++ | parrot-users list created!
15:38 dalek website: http://www.parrot.org/news​/parrot-users-list-created
15:38 barney allison: ok
15:40 Coke http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakudo_Perl - someone should mention why "way of the camel" is appropriate. =-)
15:41 Coke only 7 tickets left to migrate to trac. How long until #ps?
15:42 plobsing joined #parrot
15:46 Coke pmichaud, allison: RT #44471 seems to still be an issue, and pmichaud's suggested workaround doesn't.
15:47 Coke (so if someone can steal RT#44471 and transfer it to trac, +1)
15:47 * Coke does it. :|
15:48 plobsing_ joined #parrot
15:50 allison Coke: rejected it
15:51 allison Coke: (#44471) the patch is wrong, and it's really just one additional test for TT#389, so I added it as a note there
15:53 plobsing joined #parrot
15:53 Coke that leaves one ticket that infinoid opened, 4 from jerry, one from leo.
15:54 allison Coke: looking at Leo's...
15:55 dalek TT #1296 closed by coke++: :vtable is ignored when :anon
15:56 allison Coke: Leo's RT #35391 is one of those really vague ones, that hasn't been closed because no one's quite sure what it's about
15:56 * barney is going ahead with the release
15:57 Coke allison: implement file:spec:catdir for non-windows.
15:58 Coke barney++
15:58 allison Coke: aye, it gets into that later in the ticket comments, but the initial task is unusuable
15:59 plobsing_ joined #parrot
15:59 allison Coke: I'll take a stab at translating it to a sensible TT
15:59 whiteknight barney++
16:00 whiteknight I have developed a particular dislike of vague tickets
16:01 Coke allison: (initial unusable) yes.
16:02 dalek TT #1297 created by Infinoid++: PackFile_Constant_unpack_pmc should call Parrot_thaw_constants(), not ...
16:02 dalek parrot: r42558 | barney++ | trunk (9 files):
16:02 dalek parrot: [release] Prepare for Parrot 1.8.0
16:02 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42558/
16:02 Coke RT: 5
16:05 Coke .. 4
16:05 dalek TT #1298 created by particle++: opcodes, warnings, and exceptions
16:05 allison Coke: any idea where particle's work on File::Spec::catdir for windows lives?
16:07 particle iirc File/Spec.pir has been removed. it was never used, anyway, and the file::spec api on which it was based is *ugly*
16:07 Coke allison: no, that's why i assigned it particle years ago. =-)
16:07 Coke RT: 3
16:08 allison Coke: this is looking to me like an external module kind of thing, does that get a ticket?
16:08 dalek TT #1299 created by coke++: create tests for Config/JSON.pbc
16:09 Coke allison: particle just said it had been removed. if so, reject the ticket.
16:09 allison Coke: will do
16:09 Coke (and please cc the list.)
16:10 allison Coke: rejected, but before I saw the request to cc the list
16:11 plobsing joined #parrot
16:11 allison 2 tickets left!
16:12 Coke allison: just reply to the last reply and cc the list with that.
16:13 whiteknight I'm really starting to believe that we need to completely rethink constant PMCs. It's really not a good implementation that we have now
16:13 allison Coke: okay, done
16:14 whiteknight TT #1297 really drives that point home
16:14 whiteknight TT #956 is a big related issue too
16:15 whiteknight I think we need to be looking much more aggressively at a generational system
16:15 dalek TT #1300 created by coke++: sysinfo_s opcode incomplete
16:16 Coke I do not want to migrate 40817, but will do so tonight if I am not beaten to it.
16:16 allison whiteknight: there are lots of definitions of "constant" other than "excluded from GC", we might need to move toward one of them
16:16 Coke finding if any of the patches are salvagable would be a good first step.
16:16 Coke s/any/the latest/
16:17 Coke ah. actually, I think I can reject the ticket outright.
16:17 Coke BOOYAH.
16:17 allison Coke: yes, that's where I'd lean
16:19 Coke (just had to read through the whole thing to kid51++'s assessment at the end.)
16:20 whiteknight allison: agreed. I would prefer constant meant "immutable" as opposed to "uncollectable"
16:20 allison Coke: kid51++ summary is excellent
16:20 NotFound For those who asked the meaning of 'winxed', here's a FAQ: http://winxed.org/
16:21 allison Coke: it's one of those bits of knowledge hidden away in a ticket that I wish we could capture somewhere more permanently
16:22 allison Coke: "Here's why we have MANIFEST.generated"
16:22 whiteknight RT: 0?
16:22 moritz karma RT
16:22 purl rt has karma of 29
16:23 allison whiteknight: yes, they're really orthogonal features (there's no reason we couldn't have a mutable PMC that's kept out of GC)
16:23 Coke rt++
16:23 whiteknight allison: we don't want to keep it out of GC entirely, especially if it has child objects that need to be marked
16:23 whiteknight I can see cases where we don't want the PMC to be collected though
16:24 allison whiteknight: immutable still would have to have immutable children, though
16:24 whiteknight doesn't currently (I agree that it should)
16:26 NotFound Empty? Zero? Hurrah!
16:28 dalek parrot: r42559 | barney++ | tags/RELEASE_1_8_0:
16:28 dalek parrot: tagged release 1.8.0
16:28 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42559/
16:29 whiteknight barney++
16:31 Coke WOOT. beat the release.
16:31 mokurai joined #parrot
16:31 whiteknight w00t indeed
16:32 Coke Now someone fix my (*#&@$(#& segfaults. =-)
16:32 dalek TT #1301 created by coke++: Update RT references in repository/wiki
16:32 Coke allison: any feedback on my makefile cleanup suggestion?
16:32 darbelo joined #parrot
16:32 allison Coke: mailing list or ticket?
16:33 Coke allison: mailing list
16:33 Coke I figured I'd get some feedback before making a ticket.
16:33 * allison looks...
16:33 purl looks are free today :)
16:33 Coke whiteknight: is TT #1276 closable?
16:33 whiteknight looking
16:34 Coke TT 1.8.0 tickets - https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/query?stat​us=assigned&amp;status=new&amp;status=reo​pened&amp;group=status&amp;milestone=1.8 ... these either need to be closed or have their milestone bumped/cleared.
16:34 whiteknight yeah, I think I will close it. The issue still exists, but is really part of the "taking too much config infomation from Perl5's defaults" problem
16:34 whiteknight I have not been able to get it to build with strawberry perl but MSVC compiler
16:35 Coke and I think that's a combination we don't have to bend over backwards to support.
16:35 whiteknight does build with strawberry perl and mingw, or MSVC and activeperl
16:35 whiteknight fair. I'll close it
16:35 Coke danke.
16:35 allison Coke: it looks like a sensible, gradual refactor, good improvement
16:36 Coke k. I'll see about doing some splitting first to make sure 'include' works as expected.
16:36 allison Coke: I'm not sure about platform support for includes, it's worth running a small test
16:36 Coke yah. figured I'd do the first one as a patch and ask for feedback.
16:36 Coke nmake and gmake look doable.
16:36 Coke figured that's 90% if not 100
16:37 Coke any suggestions for where to keep .mak files?
16:37 allison Coke: would config/ work?
16:37 Coke config/build ?
16:38 allison (we're moving toward fewer top-level items and directories, so moving things downward)
16:38 Coke works for me.
16:38 dalek TT #1276 closed by whiteknight++: Parrot does't build on Win32 with MSVC
16:38 allison there will probably be a top-level build/ directory that contains everything that will be installed
16:38 allison config/build works, or config/make
16:38 barney ftp://ftp.parrot.org/pub/pa​rrot/releases/devel/1.8.0/ has landed
16:38 whiteknight barney++
16:39 allison barney++
16:39 darbelo barney++
16:39 whiteknight barney: change the topic?
16:39 purl whiteknight: that doesn't look right
16:39 Coke config/make works.
16:40 allison Coke: hmmm... looking at the existing directories in config/ I'd go with config/make. they're all confused, and hard to tell what goes where
16:40 allison config/make nice and clear
16:41 allison whiteknight: what's the status of :call_sig? partially implemented?
16:42 allison whiteknight: (I just re-encountered your nopaste message about it, but nopaste has expired the code blocks)
16:43 kj joined #parrot
16:43 whiteknight allison: I committed that naive first attempt I sent you. Am going to rework it this week hopefully to not suck
16:44 Coke yay, good news from andy.
16:44 Topic for #parrotis now Parrot 1.8.0 Zygodactyly released | Latest modified TT's: http://icanhaz.com/parrotbugs
16:44 whiteknight raises a slight question: What types of objects can I use as a :call_sig on the caller's side?
16:44 allison whiteknight: is there a ticket for that? would be good to have a record of the progress, in case someone else wants to pick it up
16:44 whiteknight allison: will create a ticket, yes
16:44 dalek tracwiki: v6 | allison++ | AllisonTasklist
16:44 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/All​isonTasklist?version=6&amp;action=diff
16:45 allison whiteknight: it's polymorphic, should accept anything with the necessary interfaces
16:45 allison whiteknight: (which is currently only CallSignature, but anything could mock it)
16:45 allison whiteknight: (or subclass it)
16:45 allison Coke: ah, make and dmake too, excellent
16:46 whiteknight allison: okay, is there a role or something that we can check for? My initial attempts ran into problems trying to be too permissive, which lead to a lot of very ugly special-purpose code
16:46 whiteknight or do we not check, and jsut assume that a :call_sig has the necessary interfaces (allowing "VTABLE not found" exceptions to handle the problems)?
16:47 allison whiteknight: how about we declare CallSignature as "provides callsig", and then check for it?
16:47 whiteknight okay, we can do that
16:47 allison whiteknight: then anything else that provides callsig is agreeing to provide the complete interface of CallSignature
16:48 whiteknight allison: Okay. Then it would be a very good idea to document exactly what that interface is
16:48 whiteknight can work on that this week
16:49 Coke whiteknight: that's a deficiency of provides in general.
16:49 barney ./parrot tools/util/crow.pir --type=text    is broken
16:49 Coke well, that sucks.
16:49 purl The rock is now off.
16:55 whiteknight purl has been hanging around in #perl too often. She has a very dirty mind
16:55 purl whiteknight: huh?
16:56 whiteknight I know, purl, it is confusing
16:57 cotto joined #parrot
16:58 whiteknight dukeleto: ping
17:10 kj joined #parrot
17:18 Coke barney: generating docs from RELEASE_1_8_0 ...
17:18 whiteknight purl msg dukeleto: mind if I join on to the nqptap project?
17:18 purl Message for dukeleto stored.
17:24 barney Coke: tnx
17:26 Coke barney: PITA to do this from a tag. you have a release lying about?
17:32 dalek website: barney++ | Parrot 1.8.0 "Zygodactyly" Released!
17:32 dalek website: http://www.parrot.org/news/2009/Parrot-1.8.0
17:33 dukeleto whiteknight: pong
17:33 dukeleto whiteknight: will add you nowishly
17:33 whiteknight i msg'd you
17:33 whiteknight w00t. dukeleto++
17:33 cotto_work barney++
17:34 dukeleto barney++
17:35 whiteknight dukeleto: I also have a git question for you
17:35 whiteknight I merged the pla_integration branch of matrixy into head and deleted the branch locally. How do I get it to disappear from github too?
17:36 moritz git push origin :pla_integration
17:36 dukeleto what moritz said
17:36 whiteknight the colon on front deletes it?
17:37 dukeleto whiteknight: git push remote foo:bar means push foo to the remote branch bar. if foo = NULL => delete remote
17:37 * cotto_work wishes people were octadactyls
17:37 dukeleto delete the remote branch bar, i mean
17:38 whiteknight ok
17:39 whiteknight yay! worked! moritz++ dukeleto++
17:39 bubaflub i have to google how to delete a remote branch on github about once a week
17:40 dukeleto bubaflub: hola! yes, it is slightly non-intuitive until you git-warp your brain
17:40 whiteknight I have stacks of printed git cheatsheets, and still can't ever find the commands I want
17:44 Coke is there a way to use sftp to do plain ftp?
17:44 darbelo Coke: nopes.
17:44 darbelo Different protocol.
17:44 Coke is there a way to use http to download parrot?
17:45 * darbelo has no idea.
17:45 Coke Doesn't appear to be. what is this, 1989?
17:46 darbelo Well we *do* restrict ourselves to C 89.
17:46 cotto_work That's surprising.
17:46 whiteknight I can't imagine that my brain is ever going to be compatible with git. I use it, but it's command line interface makes no intuitive sense whatsoever
17:47 bubaflub well, now what little grasp i had on svn is now gone
17:47 dukeleto whiteknight: you are on nqptap now. feel free to make stuff work
17:47 bubaflub git is so much easier esp. branching
17:47 whiteknight dukeleto++
17:47 dukeleto purl, nqptap is nqpTAP - TAP (Test Anything Protocol) Harness for NQP (NotQuitePerl) https://github.com/leto/nqptap
17:47 purl OK, dukeleto.
17:47 dukeleto anybody else want a commit bit to nqptap?
17:48 darbelo dukeleto: Hook me up.
17:48 dukeleto darbelo: done
17:48 cotto_work nqptap?
17:48 purl i think nqptap is nqpTAP - TAP (Test Anything Protocol) Harness for NQP (NotQuitePerl) https://github.com/leto/nqptap
17:48 darbelo Busy untill next week, but I'll dive in later.
17:51 lucian joined #parrot
17:54 pmichaud Coke:  (RT #44471)  -- change my workaround to be    .sub "" :vtable('get_integer')     (i.e., no :anon flag)
17:54 dalek tracwiki: v121 | barney++ | WikiStart
17:54 dalek tracwiki: Parrot 1.8.0 released
17:54 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/W​ikiStart?version=121&amp;action=diff
17:54 Coke pmichaud: think allison already rejected the ticket.
17:55 pmichaud yeah, just noticed that
17:55 pmichaud anyway, the workaround should just avoid the :anon flag altogether
17:55 pmichaud time for lunch here
18:01 pmichaud #ps in 30  (I will miss it, though)
18:04 Coke barney: docs.parrot.org updated.
18:04 Coke and for 1.9.0, I'll have a script to make it easier. =-)
18:08 dalek rakudo: 68d5c37 | (Kyle Hasselbacher)++ | tools/update_passing_test_data.pl:
18:08 dalek rakudo: tools/update_passing_test_data.pl will fork according to $ENV{TEST_JOBS}
18:08 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6​8d5c37f9f129c36977f8152b730346f7ad67278
18:08 * Coke is bemused that our ftp links are http://www redirects and that our http links are http://ftp ...
18:09 barney Is any of https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/query?stat​us=assigned&amp;status=new&amp;status=reo​pened&amp;group=status&amp;milestone=1.8 resolvable ?
18:09 barney Otherwise I promte it to 1.9.0
18:10 Coke we can review it during PS, I suppose.
18:10 barney Coke++
18:11 dalek TT #583 closed by coke++: http download links should be exposed on download page
18:17 chromatic joined #parrot
18:22 allison Coke: http://ftp.parrot.org/releases/
18:22 allison Coke: (was backscrolling, see you found it)
18:27 allison Coke: our http redirects probably should go to the http:// way of downloading the files (for consistency)
18:27 allison Coke: the http download didn't exist when we first created the http redirects
18:29 bacek joined #parrot
18:30 mikehh I make it #ps time
18:44 dalek TT #1302 created by Util++: PIR todo() is frequently misused
18:47 joeri joined #parrot
18:51 nbrown joined #parrot
18:59 Zak joined #parrot
19:01 dalek tracwiki: v1 | chromatic++ | DevelopmentPriorities
19:01 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=1&amp;action=diff
19:01 dalek tracwiki: v2 | coke++ | DevelopmentPriorities
19:01 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=2&amp;action=diff
19:02 * whiteknight had to choose between GC and JIT. Not sure if he chose wisely
19:03 chromatic This is for 2.0, remember.
19:04 Coke chromatic: ... I thought it was for /this week/
19:04 whiteknight I think big
19:04 * Coke signs.
19:04 * Coke sighs, even.
19:04 whiteknight maybe we shoudl break up that page "This month", "next 3 months", "next year", etc
19:04 Coke I miss bugzilla.
19:05 dalek tracwiki: v3 | whiteknight++ | DevelopmentPriorities
19:05 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=3&amp;action=diff
19:05 dalek tracwiki: v4 | coke++ | DevelopmentPriorities
19:05 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=4&amp;action=diff
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19:08 dalek tracwiki: v5 | chromatic++ | DevelopmentPriorities
19:08 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=5&amp;action=diff
19:09 bubaflub Util: i might be guilty of misusing todo() ( TT #1302)
19:10 Coke (away)
19:12 Util bubaflub: you are not alone :) Watch the ticket for my update showing how the current interface encourages misuse.
19:13 bubaflub Util: ok.  if ya point out where i'll put up some patches for my tests.
19:16 Coke (back)
19:18 dalek tracwiki: v6 | cotto++ | DevelopmentPriorities
19:18 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=6&amp;action=diff
19:19 Coke someone clobbered my edit.
19:19 Coke trac--
19:19 Coke trac--
19:19 Coke trac--
19:19 Coke trac--
19:21 bubaflub karma trac
19:21 purl trac has karma of -15
19:21 bubaflub sounds about right
19:21 dalek tracwiki: v7 | coke++ | DevelopmentPriorities
19:21 dalek tracwiki: That was not a 2.0 priority but a RIGHT NOW priority.
19:21 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=7&amp;action=diff
19:22 Coke cotto_work: so, right now, you can replace Array.pmc with a copy of RPA.pmc
19:24 dalek TT #1303 created by cotto++: [DEPRECATION] Array PMC
19:24 cotto_work Coke, I'd much rather leave it as-is and clobber it after the 2.0 release.
19:25 cotto_work I hate code duplication like that, even for doomed code.
19:33 lucian joined #parrot
19:35 mikehh joined #parrot
19:35 pmichaud back
19:39 Coke cotto_work: you could duplicate it programmatically... but leaving it there to rot is fine too.
19:40 dalek parrot: r42560 | coke++ | trunk/docs/parrothist.pod:
19:40 dalek parrot: coke > Will ; mark supported releases; ws to highlite the last supported rel.
19:40 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42560/
19:44 hercynium joined #parrot
19:45 mikehh joined #parrot
19:47 zak_ joined #parrot
19:48 dalek TT #1304 created by dukeleto++: Parrotcode.org docs show up before parrot.org on web searches
19:56 mikehh joined #parrot
20:00 chromatic msg bacek_at_work <chromatic> Who has the responsibility of creating the merged Context/CallSig PMC and where does it happen?
20:00 purl Message for bacek_at_work stored.
20:00 chromatic <allison> ultimately, the responsibility is the caller's. unlike currently, where the context is created inside invoke, if they're merged the context will be created long before reaching the invoke vtable
20:04 allison chromatic: I think the second half of that message wasn't stored
20:04 chromatic msg bacek <allison> ultimately, the responsibility is the caller's. unlike currently, where the context is created inside invoke, if they're merged the context will be created long before reaching the invoke vtable
20:04 purl Message for bacek stored.
20:04 chromatic msg bacek_at_work <allison> ultimately, the responsibility is the caller's. unlike currently, where the context is created inside invoke, if they're merged the context will be created long before reaching the invoke vtable
20:04 purl Message for bacek_at_work stored.
20:04 chromatic That ought to do it.
20:06 dalek tracwiki: v7 | allison++ | AllisonTasklist
20:06 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/All​isonTasklist?version=7&amp;action=diff
20:06 whiteknight I think that's a very good idea. It gives us the ability to access the callee's context before we even invoke it
20:07 whiteknight chromatic: do you have a general estimate for how much work it will take to merge CallSignature/Context?
20:08 chromatic I haven't looked at the branch, but it seemed like bacek had it mostly working.
20:08 chromatic I think it's mergeable for 1.9.
20:08 chromatic ... in the amount of work it should take.
20:09 dalek tracwiki: v8 | dukeleto++ | DevelopmentPriorities
20:09 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=8&amp;action=diff
20:12 lucian joined #parrot
20:12 dalek tracwiki: v9 | whiteknight++ | DevelopmentPriorities
20:12 dalek tracwiki: Remove my suggestion for now.
20:12 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=9&amp;action=diff
20:13 whiteknight I need to pick somehing better
20:13 dalek parrot: r42561 | coke++ | trunk/docs/intro.pod:
20:13 dalek parrot: docs cleanup
20:13 dalek parrot: - refer to trac (web)
20:13 dalek parrot: - use say, not print "\n"
20:13 dalek parrot: - just point to download page, don't duplicate it
20:14 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42561/
20:15 * pmichaud reminds folks that https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/RakudoTasklist might be a good pool of ideas
20:16 * darbelo wants IMCC dead.
20:16 dukeleto pmichaud: i didn't even know about that
20:16 dukeleto KILL KILL KILL IMCC
20:16 dukeleto purl, imcc?
20:16 purl i guess imcc is the c of parrot or the problem or the intermediate code compiler
20:16 whiteknight kiling IMCC might be the best idea, yes
20:16 whiteknight so that will have my vote then
20:16 dukeleto purl, imcc is also will be murdered soon
20:16 purl okay, dukeleto.
20:17 chromatic pmichaud, can you think of a couple of representative NQP-rx examples which would be good to profile?
20:17 mikehh joined #parrot
20:17 dukeleto chromatic: plumage's test harness would be a good one
20:18 dukeleto chromatic: it is a "real world" example
20:18 chromatic Can you add those to your Valgrind benchmark suite?
20:18 darbelo dukeleto: doesn't that spend too much time running other programs?
20:19 dukeleto chromatic: which exact versions of everything do you want benchmarked?
20:19 chromatic I don't know; I haven't run any tests yet.
20:19 darbelo A test harness spends most of it's time waiting for the tests to run.
20:19 chromatic Oh.
20:19 dukeleto darbelo: you can just give it a no-op test that prints out some TAP. the time spent in test can also be subtracted
20:19 chromatic Let's start from the current HEAD and progress.
20:19 dukeleto darbelo: a test harness spends time parsing TAP streams
20:19 pmichaud chromatic: A good representative NQP-rx example would be the NQP source itself :)
20:20 dukeleto chromatic: which version of NQP-rx, the one in parrot core?
20:20 NotFound That's the beauty of bootstraping.
20:20 pmichaud i.e., run nqp on the src/NQP/Grammar.pm and src/NQP/Actions.pm files from the nqp-rx repository
20:20 pmichaud just run them with --target=pir
20:20 pmichaud i.e.
20:20 pmichaud ./parrot nqp-rx.pbc --target=pir Grammar.pm
20:21 dukeleto pmichaud++ # what he said
20:21 dukeleto pmichaud: does nqp-rx have any benchmark scripts in the repo? i would be interested in writing some
20:22 dukeleto pmichaud: can i get a commit bit on nqp-rx to make branches, or do you want me to fork on github and do pull requests?
20:22 chromatic I'm adding STRINGNULL right now, but I'll look at the benchmark profile shortly.
20:22 pmichaud dukeleto: not as yet.  I've been thinking it would be useful to rewrite some of the parrot benchmarks into nqp and see how much we lose (and where/why)
20:23 pmichaud dukeleto: what are you wanting to branch/add ?
20:23 darbelo chromatic++; STRINGNULL++
20:23 Coke dukeleto is also unaccountably violent.
20:23 purl okay, Coke.
20:24 chromatic I'd like to see NQP ports of PIR benchmarks.
20:24 Coke first step in killing imcc is allowing pirc to be swapped in via a config option.
20:24 Coke (then we can see where all the tests fall down.)
20:25 dukeleto pmichaud: i want the ability to create topic branches in nqp-rx, for when I want to add tests and/or benchmark scripts
20:25 dukeleto Coke: :)
20:25 dukeleto Coke++ # config option to choose pirc
20:25 NotFound Coke: First step will be rewritting main options and arguments parsing, in order to be able to do that.
20:25 pmichaud dukeleto: what's your github id?
20:25 dukeleto pmichaud: leto
20:26 pmichaud dukeleto: you now have a commitbit.
20:26 pmichaud You can commit tests and examples directly to the master branch, if you wish.
20:26 dukeleto pmichaud: thanks, much appreciated! should I add myself to CREDITS or something?
20:27 pmichaud dukeleto: sure
20:27 darbelo NotFound: Somebody had posted code to turn command line options into a FPA of Strings a while back. Is that available anywhere?
20:27 dukeleto pmichaud: sounds good, I will do some nqp-rx hacking later today! thanks again!
20:27 darbelo Or maybe it was a RPA
20:27 NotFound darbelo: I don't remember seeing that.
20:28 darbelo It happened around the time cotto started the profiling runcore.
20:28 pmichaud command line arguments already come in as an RSA, I think
20:28 cotto_work pmichaud, not all of them.
20:28 NotFound darbelo: but I remember some comments about the need of processing options before creating an interpreter.
20:29 cotto_work only the ones after the script to be run (foo.pir, x.nqp, etc)
20:29 cotto_work er, hll.pb, etc
20:29 cotto_work *pbc
20:29 pmichaud cotto_work: right.
20:30 darbelo NotFound: Thinking about it, we might need a two pass scheme for options.
20:30 cotto_work The trick is that to use an RPA for CLI args you need Parrot to be somewhat initialized.
20:31 payload joined #parrot
20:31 darbelo cotto_work: Exactly. If the GC is selectable on the command line, we can't really allocate PMCs.
20:31 NotFound And if we want to do it right, we need some information about locale and charsets.
20:31 NotFound Assuming they are always utf8 is wrong.
20:32 NotFound More general, any assumption  is wrong.
20:33 whiteknight cotto had nopasted a routine to convert argc/argv into an FSA at one point
20:33 darbelo NotFound: We could do a 'first pass' that initilaizes parrot based on good old getopt-ish options.
20:33 whiteknight I don't think that code ever got put in
20:34 NotFound darbelo: getopt is not ansi std
20:34 cotto_work istr doing something like that
20:34 whiteknight it's trivial code to rewrite if needed
20:35 darbelo NotFound: I said "getopt-ish"
20:35 NotFound darbelo: we already have that.
20:36 darbelo NotFound: Yes, in IMCC. We need it out of IMCC.
20:36 Coke NotFound: we can link in /both/ imcc and pirc and just make pirc trump imcc as the compiler.
20:36 NotFound darbelo: include/parrot/longopt.h
20:37 Coke (as a first pass. but doing it right++)
20:37 NotFound Is not dependant on imcc, just used by it.
20:38 bacek_at_work good morning
20:38 cotto_work hi bacek_at_work
20:38 darbelo Ok, we can start by moving that into the main parrot executable.
20:41 Coke leto: pinged the perl.org admins to see how they can help us with that TT.
20:45 fperrad seen barney
20:45 purl barney was last seen on #parrot 2 hours, 34 minutes and 59 seconds ago, saying: Coke++
20:46 Coke pmichaud: message for you on parrot-users. =-)
20:46 purl Message for you stored.
20:47 Coke purl, you idiot!
20:47 purl Coke: what?
20:47 Coke purl, owner?
20:47 purl owner is hachi, see also #purl
20:47 Coke purl: msg hachi "pmichaud: message for you on parrot-users." causes a message for "you" to be saved. ^_O?
20:47 purl Message for hachi stored.
20:48 hachi hah
20:48 hachi for the record, you could just see if I'm awake too
20:54 Coke oh, didn't even figure you'd be in here. =-)
20:54 Coke hio. =-)
20:56 dukeleto hola
20:56 purl bonjour, dukeleto.
20:56 dalek tracwiki: v10 | whiteknight++ | DevelopmentPriorities
20:56 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=10&amp;action=diff
20:57 nopaste "chromatic" at 72.87.39.97 pasted "Symbol visibility problem with STRINGNULL; any thoughts?" (109 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/18737
20:57 chromatic My C fu is low today.
20:58 dalek TT #1305 created by darbelo++: [DEPRECATION] The IMAGE_IO structure.
20:59 chromatic I understand what the error means, but I don't understand why: blib/lib/libparrot.so: undefined reference to `STRINGNULL'
20:59 chromatic ... nor from where.
21:00 dalek parrot: r42562 | darbelo++ | trunk/DEPRECATED.pod:
21:00 dalek parrot: Add the IMAGE_IO structure and associated VTABLEs to DEPRECATED.pod
21:00 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42562/
21:00 NotFound chromatic: Do you define it?
21:00 Coke (in a .h that is included by a C file?)
21:01 Coke (or a linked in C?)
21:01 NotFound The .h just declares it, it also needs to be defined.
21:01 whiteknight darbelo++
21:01 whiteknight fixing freeze/thaw and making them sane would be awesome
21:02 NotFound Don't remember now where is PMCNULL defined...
21:02 whiteknight cd include/parrot && ack PMCNULL
21:02 chromatic A few lines before STRINGNULL in parrot/interpreter.h
21:02 Andy_ or ack PMCNULL include/parrot
21:02 darbelo whiteknight: I can, at best, disentagle them from the string and io guts.
21:03 darbelo Fixing is a bigger endeavor than I can tackle right now.
21:03 chromatic As far as I can tell, PARROT_DATA PMC    *PMCNULL; and PARROT_DATA STRING *STRINGNULL; should do the same thing.
21:03 whiteknight darbelo: that would be enough
21:05 dalek nqp-rx: 19c51c8 | duff++ | CREDITS:
21:05 dalek nqp-rx: Add myself to CREDITS
21:05 dalek nqp-rx: review: http://github.com/perl6/nqp-rx/commit/1​9c51c8f4148c20d65cb0f31a82b44d03c208985
21:08 NotFound chromatic: src/pmc.c:68
21:09 chromatic Ah.
21:10 chromatic Because PARROT_DATA does extern "C" and... yes.
21:11 NotFound In C++ jargon, is declared but not defined.
21:11 chromatic http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/3674
21:11 chromatic I don't speak crazy.
21:16 dalek parrot: r42563 | chromatic++ | trunk (3 files):
21:16 dalek parrot: [string] Added STRINGNULL.  Now we can use it appropriately instead of assuming
21:16 dalek parrot: that a NULL STRING represents STRINGNULL.
21:16 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42563/
21:17 chromatic Now comes the fun part.
21:17 ttbot Parrot trunk/ r42563 i386-linux-thread-multi make error http://tt.ro.vutbr.cz/file/cmdout/146922.txt ( http://tt.ro.vutbr.cz//buil​dstatus/pr-Parrot/rp-trunk/ )
21:18 darbelo fixing the build?
21:18 NotFound I'm going to check if we have char * NULL nci tests...
21:19 cognominal joined #parrot
21:21 chromatic Ugh, that's a non-optimized build, isn't it?
21:21 darbelo Yep.
21:21 cotto_work very broken atm
21:23 chromatic No problems here.
21:23 Coke chromatic: broken for me here also non-optimized.
21:23 chromatic Did anyone realclean first?
21:23 Coke always
21:23 nopaste "darbelo" at 190.192.220.13 pasted "bt of build failure on OpenBSD i386" (17 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/18739
21:23 darbelo I realcleaned.
21:24 chromatic Oh, I see.
21:25 Coke ORLY?
21:25 purl YA RLY.
21:25 darbelo Coke: It's a violated assertion. A encodingless string got created.
21:25 NotFound chromatic: I assume that for a 't' NCI type we'll want to convert a STRINGNULL to a NULL char * for argument, and the recyprocal for return type, isn'it?
21:26 Coke NotFound: sounds reasonable.
21:26 chromatic Yes, I think so.
21:26 dalek parrot: r42564 | chromatic++ | trunk/src/string/api.c:
21:26 dalek parrot: [STRING] Ensured that charsets and encodings get initialized before
21:26 dalek parrot: initializing STRINGNULL.  This should fix any compilation errors from r45263.
21:26 dalek parrot: review: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/42564/
21:27 NotFound I'll try to add a test for that.
21:29 Coke chromatic: that's better.
21:29 darbelo chromatic: WORKSFORME
21:29 Coke chromatic: "not in the constant table", but PObj_constant_FLAG ?
21:31 Util I'll be back in 90 minutes. I still have more to say on TT#1302.
21:32 Coke I wonder why we can't just tack on an optional isTODO flag to is and have it modify the description of the test file.
21:35 ttbot Parrot trunk/ r42564 MSWin32-x86-multi-thread make error http://tt.ro.vutbr.cz/file/cmdout/146983.txt ( http://tt.ro.vutbr.cz//buil​dstatus/pr-Parrot/rp-trunk/ )
21:36 theory joined #parrot
21:36 darbelo _STRINGNULL
21:36 darbelo ??
21:36 darbelo Where did that freaking underscore come from?
21:36 darbelo MSVC--
21:37 GeJ Good morning everyone.
21:37 NotFound darbelo: C decorations
21:37 Coke NotFound: we'd expect that on any c++, yes?
21:37 Coke guessing it needs a PARROT_API
21:38 NotFound Coke: C++ ones are a lot worse.
21:39 darbelo Oh, it's a *linker* error. I had totally misread that.
21:39 darbelo Still. MSVC--
21:39 NotFound I think parrot_debugger must use the function, not the macro.
21:39 chromatic Coke, the constant table is a cache.  It *is* in the constant pool.  Subtle.
21:40 Coke too subtle for me. as long as it makes sense to you. =-)
21:41 chromatic parrot_debugger should probably use the function, but it might also need to include parrot/interpreter.h
21:41 chromatic ... which seems like a bad place for these macros.
21:41 darbelo It does #include "parrot/embed.h"
21:42 darbelo We might want to give embedders access to STRINGNULL.
21:42 chromatic That should pick it up then.
21:42 NotFound Maybe we need a parrot/internals.h header instead of using macros IN_CORE style.
21:43 darbelo I only see one use of STRING_IS_NULL() at line 255
21:43 dalek tracwiki: v11 | japhb++ | DevelopmentPriorities
21:43 dalek tracwiki: Add documentation goal with subgoals
21:43 dalek tracwiki: https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Develo​pmentPriorities?version=11&amp;action=diff
21:43 NotFound darbelo: and then we'll have the most unstable vm in the world.
21:43 chromatic When every .c file includes parrot/parrot.h, we have to rebuild a lot of code.
21:45 darbelo NotFound: Huh?
21:45 NotFound darbelo: if we make it viewable, it gets modifiable. A little mistake and... BLAM!
21:46 Coke chromatic: I'm fixing that.
21:46 Coke er, no i'm not.
21:46 Coke (I'm fixing a bunch of other things, but not that. =-)
21:47 darbelo Oh. I got embed/extend mixed up again, didn't I?
21:47 jan joined #parrot
21:49 NotFound Uh... I think the NCI t thing already has a problem. Looks line PCC is converting a returned NULL to an empty string.
21:51 Dex joined #parrot
21:52 NotFound I'll look better at that tomorrow, too late for such a subtlety.
21:53 cognominal_ joined #parrot
21:57 darbelo dukeleto: ping
21:58 dukeleto darbelo: pong
21:59 darbelo You did some work on the debugger, right?
22:03 darbelo In main(), starting at line 247, what's the point of compiling that snippet of code if there's no arguments?
22:04 dukeleto darbelo: let me see
22:05 dukeleto darbelo: i didn't write that code and I have no idea :)
22:05 dukeleto darbelo: Infinoid would know
22:07 darbelo Nevermind, without it it has no runloop and segfaults before the (pdb prompt)
22:09 NotFound darbelo: I wrote that. I silly, but people asked for a quick way to start without any pbc loaded.
22:10 darbelo Yeah, PDB_run_code(), unsurprisingly needs code to run ;)
22:19 cognominal_ joined #parrot
22:22 cotto_work .
22:22 darbelo ..
22:22 cotto_work That's what I get for examining the back of my keyboard.
22:36 zak_ joined #parrot
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22:49 Coke dukeleto: you posted to parrot-users without joining! (blah)
22:49 jan joined #parrot
22:51 dukeleto Coke: i need to do that, ooops
22:58 dukeleto Coke: i am on parrot-users now
23:00 mokurai left #parrot
23:04 dukeleto languages?
23:04 purl i think languages is https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Languages
23:09 lucian joined #parrot
23:10 Whiteknight joined #parrot
23:10 darbelo plparrot
23:10 purl it has been said that plparrot is the postgres+parrot integration project or http://github.com/leto/plparrot
23:12 zak_ joined #parrot
23:13 cognominal joined #parrot
23:16 Zak joined #parrot
23:26 darbelo dukeleto: ping
23:28 nopaste "darbelo" at 190.192.220.13 pasted "Explodey PL/Parrot Configure.nqp for dukeleto." (12 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/18743
23:29 Whiteknight joined #parrot
23:36 dukeleto darbelo: pong
23:37 darbelo dukeleto: see http://nopaste.snit.ch/18743
23:37 darbelo PL/Parrot Configure.nqp went kaboom.
23:37 dukeleto darbelo: that configure.nqp is just for show :)
23:37 dukeleto darbelo: look at HOWTO
23:38 dukeleto darbelo: but it should work, in theory. we need to be able to detect pg_config
23:38 dukeleto darbelo: also, i think that worked on some nqp, maybe not the one the you have
23:38 Whiteknight did the parrot_nqp binary disappear from this newest release?
23:38 dukeleto since nqp still has no version number, this is getting annoying
23:38 dukeleto Whiteknight: parrot-nqp now
23:38 darbelo Whiteknight: it transformed into parrot-nqp
23:39 Whiteknight ah, yes
23:39 darbelo dukeleto: I thought HOWTO was post-Configure. I'm using nqp that whips with parrot.
23:39 darbelo s/whips/ships/
23:39 dukeleto darbelo: i think i may have only tried nqp-rx master, not nqp-rx-in-parrot-core
23:40 * dukeleto thinks about whipping with parrot
23:40 dukeleto ETOOMANYNQPSWITHNOVERSIONNUMBERS
23:41 darbelo old nqp is nqp.pbc, new nqp is parrot-nqp, and even newer nqp is 'nqp'
23:41 japhb Now that parrot-nqp exists, just use it, and consider Parrot's revision to be the version number of nqp-rx.  pmichaud seems to be doing this from time to time himself even.  :-)
23:42 japhb Barring an ~1 day delay, there's really not much point in riding nqp HEAD
23:43 darbelo japhb: Until 2.0 then the deprecation police will lock you up if you break compatibility.
23:44 Whiteknight pla Configure.nqp is broken now
23:44 * Whiteknight is pumped about that
23:44 japhb darbelo, only parrot_nqp is right now subject to that deprecation policy, not parrot-nqp
23:44 darbelo unless we declare all of ext/ to be excepted from such things.
23:44 nopaste "kiwichris" at 58.172.130.100 pasted "RTEMS: examples/json/postalcodes.pir fails" (9 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/18744
23:45 darbelo Whiteknight: you want to run it with parrot $(BUNCH_OF_ARGS) nqp.pbc
23:45 darbelo That't the 'old' nqp left there until 2.1 to comply with the deprecation policy.
23:45 Whiteknight darbelo: I don't understand
23:46 darbelo the parrot-nqp fakecutable is the new not-totally-compatible nqp-rx that we imported from pmichaud's github repo.
23:47 darbelo the old nqp that shupped with parrot 1.7 is still available in pbc form, but there is no fakecutable anymore.
23:48 Whiteknight okay, so what do we have to do to make Configure.nqp work with nqp-rx?
23:48 Whiteknight I had been lead to believe that it wasn't a backwards-incompatible change
23:49 darbelo Whiteknight: The only incompatibility is the lack of a fakecutable. The nqp that can tun our Configure is still shipped and installed.
23:49 darbelo s/tun/run/
23:49 japhb Whiteknight, it's very close to compatible, but not quite.  Thus having to keep the old one for two more releases.
23:49 Whiteknight darbelo: that's all well and good. How do we make Configure.nqp work with the fakecutable?
23:49 Whiteknight I'll fix it once I know what the differences are
23:50 japhb Whiteknight, is your Configure.nqp forked from Plumage's?  If so, just diff against Plumage's master copy.
23:50 darbelo japhb and dukeleto know that better than I do.
23:50 japhb Plumage always uses parrot-nqp (the NQP-rx checked into parrot) for everything now.
23:51 Whiteknight japhb: is there are particular diff or diff range I can plunder?
23:51 japhb Whiteknight, looking
23:51 darbelo Whiteknight: I can do it for you. Gimme a sec.
23:52 japhb http://gitorious.org/parrot-plumage/parrot-​plumage/blobs/history/master/Configure.nqp
23:52 japhb Looks like just the top 3 commits there
23:54 darbelo Whiteknight: Did it.
23:54 Whiteknight w00t
23:54 Whiteknight darbelo++
23:55 darbelo Whiteknight: pushed it.
23:55 darbelo It was an issue with load_bytecode()
23:56 Whiteknight ok
23:56 pmichaud the new version of nqp is   nqp-rx.pbc
23:56 pmichaud and parrot-nqp
23:56 pmichaud the old parrot_nqp fakecutable is now gone
23:56 dalek parrot-linear-algebra: 9b112a2 | darbelo++ | Configure.nqp:
23:56 dalek parrot-linear-algebra: Update Configure.nqp to work with the new nqp-rx in parrot.
23:56 dalek parrot-linear-algebra: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/parrot-linear-algebr​a/commit/9b112a2ddd942f170b87993e4ecb235e6bb9eb22
23:56 darbelo pmichaud: Maybe we should have kept the old fakecutable.
23:56 pmichaud sorry, nqprx.pbc
23:56 pmichaud darbelo: the old fakecutable has only been around for < 1 month
23:57 pmichaud it would just cause confusion.
23:57 japhb Oh man, would it.  The current state is bad enough.
23:57 japhb (I understand the reasons for the current situation, but it's quite a FAQ)
23:57 pmichaud eh, it's not that bad.
23:58 pmichaud if you want to use the old nqp, you continue to use nqp.pbc, as before.
23:58 pmichaud if you want to use the nqp, you use parrot-nqp
23:58 pmichaud if you want to profile the new nqp, use nqprx.pbc
23:58 pmichaud that's it.
23:58 pmichaud s/use the nqp/use the new nqp/
23:59 japhb *I* understand it.  I'm just saying people who weren't actively involved, but just kindof peripherally watching, for the last couple months ended up confused.  Not much we can do about it, just the way these things go.
23:59 japhb I guess I should be happy that so many people had even half an eye on it.  ;-)

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