Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2010-03-02

Parrot | source cross referenced

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 Whiteknight ash_: no worries. I'll try to give you all the free publicity my own blog can generate
00:01 ash_ sure, i guess, i was more thinking input from someone that knows how to do this stuff, but publicity works too
00:02 Whiteknight ash_: Tell me more about the project. Does it use Parrot at all?
00:03 Whiteknight or is it completely separate?
00:03 ash_ not currently
00:03 ash_ its completely seperate
00:03 ash_ i am doing an independant study with a professor on compilers
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00:04 ash_ so my goal over the coarse of the semester for learning purposes was to implement a toy-ish language, nqp seemed like a small enough subset of perl 6, so i thought i could work with that
00:04 Whiteknight okay, so you're implementing all your own datatypes and everything?
00:04 AndyA joined #parrot
00:05 ash_ well, i have the llvm support for some runtime features, but its a pretty bare bones vm
00:05 Whiteknight ok
00:05 ash_ you get ints, and floats really, since they represent everything else, chars are ints, bools are ints, etc.
00:05 cognominal joined #parrot
00:07 ash_ i may switch up the backend if the llvm is to much of a pain, but for now i am still just learning about how compiles work (i am reading the dragon book and Crafting A Compilers, along with a Flex & Bison: Text Processing Tools to know how to use the tools i am working with)
00:07 Whiteknight ash_: All very cool stuff
00:08 Whiteknight you interested in doing an GSOC project this summer?
00:08 ash_ yeah
00:08 Whiteknight We're trying to get lots of interested students
00:11 ash_ i looked into how other projects are doing some of the stuff i do, like macruby and rubinius which both implement ruby, but in two very different ways
00:13 ash_ macruby replaces the builtin vm for the llvm, but doesn't actually have the ruby objects represented as llvm objects
00:13 ash_ ie, a ruby object is an int (32 or 64 bits long, its really the pointer to the object) in the macruby vm, and it passes the int around to the built in C functions
00:15 ash_ rubinius builds the objects using llvm types, if you say to enable the llvm as its jit, as well as builds the run-time code with the llvm, so its kinda interesting, how one project only uses the llvm for a single specific part of the runtime, while the other tries to immerse itself into the llvm as much as possible
00:15 treed Except for true, false, nil and FixNums.
00:16 treed Those are stored as enums/literal values.
00:16 ash_ does it store string constants in the llvm code too?
00:17 treed I mean in Ruby itself.
00:17 treed I have no idea how macruby or rubinius handles that.
00:18 treed I've just investigated Ruby as part of my Cardinal work.
00:18 ash_ got ya
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00:31 cotto_work and suddenly
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00:43 davidfetter smell that? do you smell that? netsplits, son! nothing else in the world smells like that.
00:47 bacek cotto_work, I read Ops2c::Utils.pm... It's kinda awful...
00:55 snarkyboojum joined #parrot
00:56 cotto_work yeah
00:56 cotto_work that's one of the parts that's not worth emulating
00:57 bacek indeed.
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01:00 kid51 joined #parrot
01:00 * cotto_work heads home
01:00 purl Slacker!
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: 1c30f4a | wilkie++ | kernel/ (2 files):
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: Simplifying
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/1c30f4acfe695a2dfe623d2d2d025c9aae4b2800
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: dc5bf87 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/pci.d:
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: Documentation additions.
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/dc5bf87c71bc778b4d2d502deab2fa082b518b21
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: 80f7b29 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/ (2 files):
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: Added implementation of PCI config writes.
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/80f7b2964aebd9f296c7c0e9baa9462fdb79ec04
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: a8159b9 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/ (2 files):
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: Added implementation of PCI config reads.
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/a8159b943d94d79763a598f321fd045aa20d757d
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: 8410c21 | wilkie++ | kernel/ (3 files):
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: Added some implementation to PCI stubs. Fixed ioIn for Cpu.
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/8410c21ccd925d78aa9e82f6973a4807cc5bda80
01:22 dalek parrot-MT19937: 75b5a62 | wilkie++ | kernel/dev/pci.d:
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: Enumerate ALL devices.
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/75b5a620b79e2af2dcc76d64401dcf6d4e6e3af2
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: 53d1869 | wilkie++ | kernel/dev/pci.d:
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: Fixed documentation.
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/53d1869b1cb0a95b3110f3b927b636d830afb55d
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: 6a5c818 | wilkie++ | kernel/dev/pci.d:
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: Working PCI scanning.
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/6a5c81842f40d89a46d81147b2456e83b0fed99f
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: 7cf44f8 | wilkie++ | kernel/ (4 files):
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: Adding PCI device scan.
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/7cf44f8e2ef95e6889301d3daccf6b054724e037
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: 5513338 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/ (2 files):
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: Fixing up PCI implementation.
01:23 dalek parrot-MT19937: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/55133381b92c9cfcd047c34bc628a27e72720b87
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 1c30f4a | wilkie++ | kernel/ (2 files):
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Simplifying
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/1c30f4acfe695a2dfe623d2d2d025c9aae4b2800
01:23 dalek primitivearc: dc5bf87 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/pci.d:
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Documentation additions.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/dc5bf87c71bc778b4d2d502deab2fa082b518b21
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 80f7b29 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/ (2 files):
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Added implementation of PCI config writes.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/80f7b2964aebd9f296c7c0e9baa9462fdb79ec04
01:23 dalek primitivearc: a8159b9 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/ (2 files):
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Added implementation of PCI config reads.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/a8159b943d94d79763a598f321fd045aa20d757d
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 8410c21 | wilkie++ | kernel/ (3 files):
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Added some implementation to PCI stubs. Fixed ioIn for Cpu.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/8410c21ccd925d78aa9e82f6973a4807cc5bda80
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 75b5a62 | wilkie++ | kernel/dev/pci.d:
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Enumerate ALL devices.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/75b5a620b79e2af2dcc76d64401dcf6d4e6e3af2
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 53d1869 | wilkie++ | kernel/dev/pci.d:
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Fixed documentation.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/53d1869b1cb0a95b3110f3b927b636d830afb55d
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 6a5c818 | wilkie++ | kernel/dev/pci.d:
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Working PCI scanning.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/6a5c81842f40d89a46d81147b2456e83b0fed99f
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 7cf44f8 | wilkie++ | kernel/ (4 files):
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Adding PCI device scan.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/7cf44f8e2ef95e6889301d3daccf6b054724e037
01:23 dalek primitivearc: 5513338 | wilkie++ | kernel/arch/x86_64/architecture/ (2 files):
01:23 dalek primitivearc: Fixing up PCI implementation.
01:23 dalek primitivearc: review: http://github.com/xomboverlord/xomb/commit​/55133381b92c9cfcd047c34bc628a27e72720b87
01:23 dalek gil: 45ce665 | (Daniel Nordberg)++ | django_histograms/templatetags/histograms.py:
01:23 dalek gil: Context required.
01:23 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/45ce665a629274d4e3869326a17619505f5f0e3e
01:23 dalek gil: 2bff8e0 | (Daniel Nordberg)++ | django_histograms/utils.py:
01:23 dalek gil: Fixes: filter() keywords must be strings.
01:23 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/2bff8e012338471820435a4f334e445d4a206836
01:23 cotto oh noes
01:24 dalek gil: 776c6c8 | (Daniel Nordberg)++ | README.rst:
01:24 dalek gil: Updated readme.
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/776c6c8e36deb08a9ba7687a4a4c239eb5e1c91d
01:24 dalek gil: 6a80bba | tzangms++ | django_histograms/utils.py:
01:24 dalek gil: remove print statement in utils.py, coz it cause mod_wsgi problem:
01:24 dalek gil:     "IOError: sys.stdout access restricted by mod_wsgi"
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/6a80bba4cedef5715e31d8d7e6de81c501109331
01:24 dalek gil: c93442d | tzangms++ | django_histograms/template​s/histograms/report.html:
01:24 dalek gil: make the report histograms graph better looking.
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/c93442d902b81b0add973cb7e09456af8c1211b1
01:24 dalek gil: 06de537 | tzangms++ | django_histograms/ (2 files):
01:24 dalek gil: make the graph more flexible with dynamic value.
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/06de537b519e54ec150bff092f43c37b647f336c
01:24 dalek gil: 5d5e4c8 | tzangms++ | django_histograms/utils.py:
01:24 dalek gil: remove assertion parentheses in utils.py.
01:24 dalek gil: it causes SyntaxWarning.
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/5d5e4c83214a52a83dbe85a3ed45e4f691ac042d
01:24 dalek gil: 8841dcf | (David Cramer)++ | django_histograms/utils.py:
01:24 dalek gil: fix for division by 0
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/8841dcf4d19dfbf002f3d7058f4011cb9bb7e018
01:24 dalek gil: d65af79 | (Alex Gaynor)++ |  (2 files):
01:24 dalek gil: Remove some tabs.
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/d65af79c86508e1d8ae9622814913019dbf5442f
01:24 dalek gil: e1050c2 | (Alex Gaynor)++ |  (4 files):
01:24 dalek gil: more whitespace'
01:24 dalek gil: review: http://github.com/alex/django-admin-histograms/​commit/e1050c2031e357fe6bc970569fb962bef7d7a0c0
01:24 dalek fun: 91f65b7 | (Jeremy Kemper)++ | activesupport/ (2 files):
01:24 dalek fun: Ruby 1.9: fix MessageVerifier#secure_compare
01:24 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/91​f65b714b7018a74402ee02a000b19a090ad556
01:24 dalek fun: 896475c | (Michael Koziarski)++ | activesupport/ (2 files):
01:24 dalek fun: Revert "Ruby 1.9: fix MessageVerifier#secure_compare"
01:24 dalek fun: This reverts commit 91f65b714b7018a74402ee02a000b19a090ad556.
01:24 kid51 Uh-oh! dalek GOING BERSERK again!  Paging Infinoid or diakopter!
01:24 dalek fun: MessageVerifier was never in 2.2
01:24 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/89​6475c192c4aad833b980fee07785925f04dc47
01:24 dalek fun: 26306f9 | (Michael Koziarski)++ | actionpack/lib/action_control​ler/session/cookie_store.rb:
01:24 dalek fun: 1.9 compatible secure_compare
01:24 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/26​306f9292f59a6b7fbacbb4369583944e36701d
01:24 dalek fun: 095cf91 | (Beau Harrington)++ | activesupport/lib/active_s​upport/multibyte/utils.rb:
01:24 dalek fun: Remove redundant checks for valid character regexp in ActiveSupport::Multibyte#clean and #verify.
01:24 dalek fun: [#3181 state:committed]
01:24 dalek fun: Signed-off-by: Jeremy Kemper <jeremy@bitsweat.net>
01:24 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/09​5cf9135b3ae2e3f88effec9a47e4ae30a71940
01:24 dalek fun: 76e971e | (Michael Koziarski)++ | actionpack/lib/action_control​ler/session/cookie_store.rb:
01:24 dalek fun: Dup the arguments to string compare so we can use force_encoding.
01:24 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/76​e971ecfbb55981ce6ee6ee97dc7d35c511a3f0
01:24 dalek fun: 8d354bc | (Jeremy Kemper)++ | activesupport/ (2 files):
01:24 dalek fun: Use Encoding.default_external, not _internal
01:24 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/8d​354bc792265ce8d125cbd868663b42fdbf8c9f
01:24 dalek fun: e9a5ef4 | (Jeremy Kemper)++ | activesupport/test/multibyte_utils_test.rb:
01:25 dalek fun: Silence warning for Encoding.default_external=
01:25 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/e9​a5ef475586f9565ea783632d6a4a25ce1aa874
01:25 dalek fun: 63f9426 | (Jeremy Kemper)++ | activesupport/Rakefile:
01:25 dalek fun: Ruby 1.9 compat: no . in load path
01:25 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/63​f9426d455af0fcf25c20bb7bb8fdfd9a4b79a8
01:25 dalek fun: a60779f | (Jeremy Kemper)++ | activesupport/lib/active_support​/core_ext/time/calculations.rb:
01:25 dalek fun: Ruby 1.9: fix Time#beginning_of_day inaccuracy due to subtracting a Float
01:25 dalek fun: review: http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/a6​0779f7e69a7045a308844e9464d7d6b9cac94d
01:25 dalek fun: 785281a | (Gabe da Silveira)++ | actionpack/ (2 files):
01:25 dalek fun: Make sure strip_tags removes tags which start with a non-printable character
01:25 mikehh dalek has lost it again
01:26 cotto he's just doing what he's told
01:27 mikehh I rekkon, but he/she/it has bin told somethin' wrong
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01:28 mikehh back again
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01:31 * cotto ducks
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02:03 Whiteknight fun is a legitimate parrot-based project
02:06 [hudnix] joined #parrot
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02:11 Tene Whiteknight: look at the message, though
02:11 Tene 18:25 <+dalek> fun: review:
02:11 Tene http://github.com/rails/rails/commit/a6​0779f7e69a7045a308844e9464d7d6b9cac94d
02:11 Tene 'fun' isn't hosted in the 'rails' repo.
02:19 treed yeah, this was happening the other day
02:19 treed github keeps fucking up their feeds
02:20 treed infinoid was going to add some checking to make sure that the URL matches the project URL
02:20 Tene s/ their feeds// IMO
02:20 treed I haven't seen any additional fuckery.
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02:24 dalek parrot: r44577 | tene++ | branches/exceptions_refactor/src (2 files):
02:24 dalek parrot: Work around a bug somewhere with attributes in subclasses of PMCs.
02:24 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44577/
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02:55 cotto Would an ops2c change removing one of the magic macros require a deprecation cycle?
02:55 cotto (the macro being HALT() in this case)
02:55 Austin Would that macro work in dynops?
02:56 cotto It's processed by ops2c into some runcore-dependent code, so yes.
02:56 Austin Then it probably requires deprecation.
02:57 * cotto is tempted to nuke it anyway
02:57 Austin Heh.
02:57 Austin I'm with you.
02:57 cotto must .... resist ...
03:01 kid51 my internet connection has been flaky all night.  I've gotten booted off my primary nick 3 times tonight.
03:01 kid51 Verizon
03:01 kid51 (... as if I needed to state the obvious)
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03:08 * kid51 observes how bad much of the C code generated by CPAN modules with XS is
03:09 kid51 Our C code throws *much* fewer warnings
03:14 cotto That'll be nicer when our C code runs as quickly as most of the XS C in CPAN.
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03:32 Infinoid poor dalek.  trying the link sanity checker again
03:32 Infinoid (sorry about the spam once again)
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04:21 cotto NotFound, were you planning on committing that patch to imcc that avoided redundant consts in the PackFile const table?
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04:39 cotto msg NotFound Were you planning on committing that patch to imcc that avoided redundant consts in the PackFile const table?
04:39 purl Message for notfound stored.
04:50 dukeleto 'ello
04:52 cotto 'hello
04:53 dalek parrot: r44578 | cotto++ | trunk/lib/Parrot (3 files):
04:53 dalek parrot: [ops2c] replace opsarraytype with opcode_t and remove supporting code
04:53 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44578/
04:53 dalek parrot: r44579 | cotto++ | trunk (2 files):
04:53 dalek parrot: [ops] replace HALT() with equivalent code, remove ops2c code dealing with HALT
04:53 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44579/
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05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: 3951a4d | (Martin Kealey)++ | t/pmc/fixedpmcqueue.t:
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: Improve basic tests; check overflow & underflow behaviour
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/parrot-data-structur​es/commit/3951a4ddb27f56dba198b0880543ba6f6ae2ceba
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: 163662d | (Martin Kealey)++ | t/pmc/fixedpmcqueue (3 files):
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: Improve tests (apply same tests to all versions)
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/parrot-data-structur​es/commit/163662dbd8f314f427bab2ba2650299b843b6dc3
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: f1b7711 | (Martin Kealey)++ |  (6 files):
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: Bugfix
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures:  - FPQ_ITEMS() raised divide-by-zero before size was set
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures:     (get rid of modulus operations)
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: Changed Integer coercion to return .elements()
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: Added .capacity() to return (apparent) allocated size
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: More tests, with better descriptions
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: More unification of the 3 different source files
05:54 dalek parrot-data-structures: review: http://github.com/Whiteknight/parrot-data-structur​es/commit/f1b771187049bb5f7dbc5aad9b3f7697ff1ce142
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06:32 dalek parrot: r44580 | mikehh++ | trunk/lib/Parrot/Ops2c/Utils.pm:
06:32 dalek parrot: fix codetest failure - trailing whitespace
06:32 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44580/
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07:00 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#32457), fulltest) at r44580 - Ubuntu 9.10 amd64 (gcc with --optimize)
07:00 snarkyboojum where would I find the "standard" documentation for the parrot compiler toolkit (if such a thing exists?). I've looked in the compilers/pct directory at README.pod etc but not having much luck tracking stuff down
07:01 snarkyboojum is it http://docs.parrot.org/parrot/latest/html/​docs/book/pct/ch03_compiler_tools.pod.html ? :)
07:02 mikehh a good start
07:02 purl i guess a good start is the perldoc for files in compilers/PGE - but I feel my pain. documentation comes last after code, tests, and then maybe examples, it seems.
07:03 snarkyboojum sweet - will have a look. thanks
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07:05 dalek parrot: r44581 | bacek++ | branches/rm_cflags/src/ops/core.ops:
07:05 dalek parrot: Fix core.ops syntax.
07:05 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44581/
07:05 dalek parrot: r44582 | bacek++ | branches/rm_cflags/src/ops/core.ops:
07:05 dalek parrot: Remove redundant 'goto NEXT'
07:05 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44582/
07:05 dalek parrot: r44583 | bacek++ | branches/rm_cflags/lib/Parrot/Op.pm:
07:05 dalek parrot: Remove Parrot::Op.full_body. 'auto' vs 'non-auto' ops separated by op pragma and handled in OpsFile
07:05 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44583/
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07:47 mikehh I have just been testing rm_cflags branch and I got a codetest failure with t/codingstd/trailing_space.t
07:47 mikehh # Trailing space or tab char found in the following files:
07:47 mikehh # /home/mhb/rm_cflags/config/gen/makefiles/root.in 1408
07:48 mikehh this is actually a tab starting the line
07:49 mikehh now I have always been extra careful working with files that generate make files as AFAIK make requires tabs
07:50 mikehh but looking at the root.in there are a lot of places where tabs are not present, where they should be
07:51 mikehh let me check the makefile
07:53 mikehh ok the makefile has the requisite tabs
07:55 mikehh looking at the generating file root.in I think it needs some serious tidying up
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08:26 dalek parrot: r44584 | mikehh++ | branches/rm_cflags/config/gen/makefiles/root.in:
08:26 dalek parrot: fix codetest failure - trailing spaces/tab
08:26 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44584/
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10:16 purl moritz was last seen on #dbix-class 1 days, 1 hours, 2 minutes and 1 seconds ago, saying: Caelum: poor thing  [Mar  1 09:14:39 2010]
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11:26 dalek parrot: r44585 | bacek++ | branches/ops_pct/compilers/opsc/t/03-past.t:
11:26 dalek parrot: Update test plan. Yes, I know...
11:26 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44585/
11:26 dalek parrot: r44586 | bacek++ | branches/ops_pct/compilers/opsc (3 files):
11:26 dalek parrot: Generate all Ops variants during parsing
11:26 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44586/
11:26 dalek parrot: r44587 | bacek++ | branches/ops_pct/compilers/opsc/t/05-opsfile.t:
11:26 dalek parrot: Update test
11:26 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44587/
11:26 dalek parrot: r44588 | bacek++ | branches/ops_pct/compilers/opsc (2 files):
11:26 dalek parrot: Assign codes to Ops during parsing.
11:26 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44588/
11:26 dalek parrot: r44589 | bacek++ | branches/ops_pct/compilers/opsc/src/Ops/Op.pm:
11:26 dalek parrot: Remove Ops::Op.full_body stub. It's useless.
11:26 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44589/
11:27 dalek parrot: r44590 | bacek++ | branches/ops_pct/ext/nqp-rx/src/gen/settings.pm:
11:27 dalek parrot: Update nqp settings
11:27 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44590/
11:27 dalek parrot: r44591 | bacek++ | branches/ops_pct/compilers/ops​c/src/Ops/Compiler/Actions.pm:
11:27 dalek parrot: Add stub for munching body in ops2c style.
11:27 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44591/
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13:12 whiteknight good morning, #parrot
13:14 Coke bacek_at_work: you know you changed the rm_cflags branch?
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13:16 Coke mikehh: aside from mismatched indent levels on some things, and use of tabs where spaces would do, what sort of makefile cleanups are you referring to?
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13:24 Coke mikehh: ah, you broke the build. :|
13:29 Coke msg bacek - what's up with the commits to rm_cflags branch?
13:29 purl Message for bacek stored.
13:38 dalek parrot: r44592 | coke++ | branches/rm_cflags/config/gen/makefiles/root.in:
13:38 dalek parrot: Makefiles are /supposed/ to have tabs; fix the build.
13:38 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44592/
13:46 Coke mikehh: my formatting thoughts for the makefile were: use tabs only where required by rules, use 4-space indent for any line-continuations.
13:46 Coke but that can wait until rm_cflags gets merged back.
14:18 mikehh Coke: I was thinking of makinbg the indenting consistent.
14:20 Coke ok. see previous send. =-)
14:23 mikehh Coke: I get a failure in t/steps/auto/warnings-01.t (post-config) - test 17
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14:26 mikehh there are plenty of situations in root.in where there should be tabs but they are inserted in the configuration
14:28 Coke mikehh: no.
14:28 Coke You're saying there should be MORE tabs?
14:28 mikehh yes
14:28 Coke if we were missing tabs, the build would break.
14:29 Coke can you give me an example of where you think there should be a tab but isn't?
14:29 Coke (unless it's on a rule that is almost never built...)
14:35 mikehh Coke: apologies - there are lots of tabs in config/gen/makefiles.root.in
14:35 mikehh config/gen/makefiles/root.in
14:35 purl config/gen/makefiles/root.in is what generates parrot/Makefile
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14:38 mikehh I must have not done a proper make realclean when I tested, also must have messed up searching fore tabs in root.in compared to corresponding makefile
14:39 mikehh have always iused a different editor when working with *.in files rather than kate, which is set to remove tabs and trailing spaces
14:51 whiteknight kid51: ping
14:53 Coke mikehh: yes. there are supposed to be lots of tabs in root.in. =-)
14:53 mikehh Coke: I am not even sure how the file got into the test anyway - something mnust have been very odd - codetest passes now, even with the tabs
14:54 mikehh must
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14:57 mikehh obviously not thinking straight at the time, and my system must have been doing something odd, had some sleep since then
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15:04 NotFound cotto: ping
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15:11 Coke mikehh: =-)
15:22 * Coke encourages other parrot folks to fill out http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/ParrotFaces
15:27 Coke trac-- # keeps losing my creds when i try to edit a (*&#$ page.
15:28 mikehh rm_cflags branch:
15:28 mikehh post-config FAIL - t/steps/auto/warnings-01.t - Failed test:  17
15:28 mikehh all other tests PASS (pre-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#32464), fulltest at r44592 - Ubuntu 9.10 amd64 (g++ with --optimize)
15:28 Coke trac rant: reports with grouped results should have a way to pick one of the values to report on.
15:28 Coke mikehh: that test doesn't fail for me.
15:29 Coke what did you run to run that test?
15:29 mikehh I'll paste it
15:30 dalek tracwiki: v2 | coke++ | ParrotFaces
15:31 dalek tracwiki: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/P​arrotFaces?version=2&amp;action=diff
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15:36 nopaste "mikehh" at 94.10.106.203 pasted "post-config test failure in rm_cflags branch" (35 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/19835
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15:50 whiteknight purl msg kid51 I'd like to work towards a fix on TT #1074. Can you take a look? I'll be happy to do the work if you can point me in the right direction. I don't really know where the flags are retrieved from Perl or where those flags are used to consruct the compiler commandline. If you can point me to those places I would be much appreciated! Thanks.
15:50 purl Message for kid51 stored.
15:51 whiteknight The problem with ticketing systems, such as Trac (but by no means limited to Trac) is that tickets can build up in there and there's no real functionality to get them dealt with in an automated way
15:52 whiteknight In Trac, for instance, there is no requirement that a ticket be assigned, or that it even be properly categorized when it is created
15:52 whiteknight much less properly named
15:52 whiteknight (though I can't imagine how the software would detect a "good" or "bad" name)
15:53 whiteknight There's also no way to associate deadlines with tickets, so once they fall off the front page there's no real way to bring them back to the forefront
15:54 Coke whiteknight: I just took 1074.
15:54 whiteknight Coke++
15:55 Coke before seeing this thread.
15:55 whiteknight Coke: like I said above, I'd gladly fix it if I knew where to look
15:55 Coke it's going to be fixed by the rm_cflags branch.
15:55 whiteknight oh, sweet
15:56 Coke mikehh: that test is invalid.
15:57 Coke it assumes that c89 is a valid option on gcc OR g++, and it's only valid on gcc.
15:57 dalek TT #114 closed by coke++: Win32 build failure due to incorrect `make` detection
15:58 Coke er, -std=c89
15:58 Coke so, in this branch at least, that option is ignored. (if it's not ignored in trunk with g++ that's a bug that is soon to be fixed.)
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16:06 whiteknight Coke: is there an ETA on that branch?
16:14 Coke I have to re-fix optimize. it's the only thing left that CFLAGS used to do.
16:15 Coke and that will be a similar fix: break out optimize to a separate @config_var@, use that in the build steps, and allow per-file customization of optimization.
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16:16 Coke (without this, some non-gcc compilers will choke as they cannot optimize certain files in certain conditions)
16:20 cotto NotFound, pong
16:21 NotFound cotto: I have no plans about that patch, but I can ask at #ps if you are interested.
16:21 cotto sure.  It looks like a good patch.
16:21 NotFound Ok
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16:34 shockwave Howdy.
16:35 shockwave Currently, I'm working on breaking up expressions into the proper PIR sequence. If I have something like so:
16:35 shockwave (1 + 2) * (3 / 4)
16:35 purl 2.25
16:35 shockwave and that results in (sudo) PIR:
16:36 shockwave T0 = div 3, 4
16:36 shockwave T1 = add 1, 2
16:36 shockwave T2 = mul T0, T1
16:36 shockwave Is that wrong?
16:36 shockwave I mean, division is being performed before addition.
16:36 shockwave I know the answer is the same, but,
16:36 shockwave If the operands are function calls, with side effects, then the call order is not what one would expect.
16:37 shockwave Does anyone have an opinion on the matter?
16:37 whiteknight no, that probably is the wrong order
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16:37 whiteknight which compiler are you using, PCT?
16:37 Austin Actually, it's a language decision. If you have a language spec, it should be precise about order of evaluation.
16:37 shockwave whiteknight, no. Mine.
16:38 Austin If you're writing your own language, then you get to specify any constraints about ordering.
16:38 whiteknight shockwave: okay, what kind of algorithm are you using for th parser? recursive descent or LR/LALR?
16:38 shockwave whiteknight, this is after the parser. But, is LALR.
16:39 shockwave But this particular question is not related to how the syntax tree was constructed.
16:39 shockwave but to how the expression is broken up.
16:39 shockwave Which happens post.
16:40 shockwave Austin, I would like to be similar to C, C++, C#, Java.
16:40 shockwave I'm guessing they are similar.
16:40 Austin That should be completely false.
16:40 whiteknight what should be completely false?
16:40 shockwave Austin, what should be false?
16:40 Austin The grammar will specify "operator precedence" and "operator associativity"
16:40 Austin Which will construct the parse tree in a fashion that determines the order of operations.
16:40 whiteknight exactly, hence my wanting to know which parser you were using
16:41 shockwave Austin, it does. But after wards, one can breakup those things however.
16:41 whiteknight shockwave: makes more sense for the parser to do the ordering right the first time
16:41 Austin Only if your language doesn't specify otherwise.
16:41 whiteknight but, that's neither here nor there. You're right that the order above is not what I would expect
16:41 NotFound shockwave: C and C++ make no guarantees about the order of evaulation of function calls in such cases.
16:41 Austin All the C languages, including Java, are left-to-right.
16:42 shockwave NotFound, you're right. I do recall that.
16:42 Austin There's a set of "sequence points" *within which* you may re-order computations.
16:43 Austin So if you say     a+1 == 0 && b - 1 > a, there's a list of which things you may reorder, but then there are places where your reordering stops.
16:43 shockwave whiteknight, the parser does place the operation in the proper order. But some transformation needs to take place in order to output PIR code. I'm at that transformation phase.
16:43 Coke whiteknight: er, ETA... sometime this week, maybe. =-)
16:44 shockwave I think I have enough info to perform some Googling. I'll hit you guys back with what I find.
16:45 NotFound shockwave: if you want to grant some order, you can lose some performance.
16:46 shockwave NotFound, performance is important, of course. But, sanity is even more important.
16:47 NotFound shockwave: the C point view about that is like: in the places where want to be sure about the order of evaluation and clearly show it in the code, wite the code that way.
16:48 NotFound s/wite/write
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16:49 NotFound In places where you don't care, let the optimizer play.
16:51 shockwave NotFound, I'm trying to create some clear rules for myself of whether evalution order matters or not (as long as the answer is the same). I though the answer was going to be a little more clear, but if the C language doesn't guarantee evalution order, then there's a reason. I'm looking for related info, now.
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16:53 shockwave http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-u​s/library/2bxt6kc4(VS.71).aspx
16:53 shockwave Search for 'is not defined'
16:56 whiteknight oh yes Microsoft, the bastion of authority for the C language standard
16:57 whiteknight they would know all about the language since they've been (poorly) implementing an outdated version of it for the last 21 years
16:57 whiteknight well, they haven't been implementing it for 21 years, but they havent moved to a more recent standard
16:58 dalek rakudo: e3f183e | jonathan++ | src/cheats/use.pir:
16:58 dalek rakudo: Don't crash in use if we don't find a namespace with a matching name.
16:58 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e​3f183e16dcb72c23c52616021341a4d7dd61507
16:58 dalek rakudo: 6867a56 | jonathan++ | src/Perl6/Actions.pm:
16:58 dalek rakudo: Try to do use actually at BEGIN-ish time, and fix up routine traits so they can see a block's signature.
16:58 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6​867a569545c9723d38e2c135ee89d004ae225eb
17:00 NotFound shockwave: the reasons are mainly to allow the optimizer look for the better way, and being unable to find a way approvable for the standard board members at the time.
17:02 shockwave NotFound, interesting.
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17:07 dukeleto 'ello
17:07 whiteknight hello duke
17:07 dukeleto whiteknight: top of the localtime() to ya
17:08 whiteknight dukeleto: I'm thinking about putting together a branch to fix the test failures that pop up in icc. You interested?
17:08 whiteknight mostly some stupid arithmetic errors and negative zero errors
17:15 cotto_work hi
17:16 whiteknight hello cotto_work
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17:18 kurahaupo A small proposal that's come out of some work on parrot-data-structures: add a standard method (tentatively called .capacity()) to all aggregate containers. For fixed-sized ones it returns the actual limit, for resizable ones it returns "Inf" or MAXINT or -1 or ... something
17:19 kurahaupo It's intended use is so you know how many more elements you can push/unshift/hash-set before the container gets "full", without it throwing an "I'm full" exception.
17:19 kurahaupo Comments?
17:19 purl Comments are lying. next_for_GC *is* the GC marking mechanism right now
17:20 kurahaupo purl: comments are for people who can't read the code
17:20 purl no idea, kurahaupo
17:21 whiteknight well, I like the idea
17:22 kurahaupo What's an appropriate value for .capacity() to return on a resizable container, particularly in "int" context?
17:23 dukeleto whiteknight: sure, that sounds great!
17:23 dukeleto kurahaupo: that sounds like an interesting idea
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17:26 * kurahaupo wonders if we have standard MAXINT/MININT values?
17:28 kurahaupo And what should .capacity() return on a fixed-sized container which hasn't had its size set yet? (Still under contruction)
17:29 * kurahaupo wonders if 'size-limited' would be a better description than 'fixed-size' for containers where their .elements() ranges from 0 to some set maximum
17:29 dukeleto kurahaupo: does any language implement something like .capacity() already?
17:30 kurahaupo Bit hard-pressed to think of a language that provides size-limited arrays at all.
17:31 kurahaupo If they're truly fixed-sized then .capacity() == .elements() (even if most of the elements are junk)
17:31 kurahaupo If they're resizeable then there's no (logical) capacity limit
17:32 kurahaupo (but you might run out of swap space)
17:32 kurahaupo Perhaps "some very big number that reflects available memory" might be an appropriate answer?
17:33 kurahaupo (To the question of what a ResizableFoo.capacity() should return)
17:33 dukeleto kurahaupo: what is your use-case for needing .capacity()?
17:34 PerlJam kurahaupo:fortran, pascal, cobol   (languages that provide size-limited arrays)
17:36 PerlJam dukeleto: are you handling gsoc this year?
17:38 kurahaupo perljam++ thanks
17:38 dukeleto PerlJam: yep. the application period for organization is March 8-12
17:38 kurahaupo dukeleto: using arrays to implement queues, stacks, etc, but with limited size so that they're easier to make thread-safe
17:39 kurahaupo i.e. the storage blob doesn't move about
17:39 kurahaupo A side benefit is they're faster because the blob does move (i.e. get copied)
17:40 kurahaupo s/does/does not
17:41 kurahaupo In particular, it's possible to write a lock-less queue between two threads using a ring-buffer model.
17:43 dukeleto kurahaupo: that sounds useful. I need to start hacking on PDS...
17:45 nopaste "whiteknight" at 173.12.37.77 pasted "failures with ICC for dukeleto++" (19 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/19838
17:46 whiteknight PDS is really turning out to be a cool testbed for trying out new data types
17:46 whiteknight we have several queue and stack implementations, complete with tests and benchmarks
17:47 kurahaupo Just don't be surprised if things are broken at times :-)
17:50 whiteknight dukeleto: http://70.42.42.150/app/public​_projects/report_details/32466
17:53 kurahaupo Using set_integer_native to adjust the size of an array seems a bit ugly to me. I mean, sure, if it's primary use is as an "indexable" thing you just adjust the top end. But if it's used as (say) a queue, which end do you move? Similarly having get_integer_native == elements seems a bit forced.
17:54 kurahaupo In PDS we've hijacked it to set the size-limit rather than the current size, but that's a hack too.
17:55 kurahaupo WhiteKnight: we have a test for isnull returning true on a fixedsizedwhatever that hasn't had its size set. Is it even possible to make that work? I don't think there's a vtable entry for isnull() ...
17:56 NotFound kurahaupo: what is the purpose of having a method that returns "something" ?
17:57 * kurahaupo thinks that sounds very Zen
17:57 kurahaupo isnull is not a method
17:57 kurahaupo nor a vtable entry
17:58 Tene I've always been bothered by weird use of vtables like that.
17:58 kurahaupo It's more like Parrot's approximation of C's "ptr == NULL"
17:58 Tene $1 = PMC_IS_NULL($2);
17:59 kurahaupo PMC_IS_NULL is defined as (pmc == NULL || pmc == PMCNULL)
17:59 kurahaupo IIRC
17:59 dukeleto Tene: yes, i agree. some vtable methods get used in peculiar ways
18:00 kurahaupo If you don't have an object then you can't invoke a method on it. That's what "null" means...
18:00 dalek parrot: r44593 | whiteknight++ | branches/fix_icc_failures:
18:00 dalek parrot: creating a new branch to fix test failures with ICC
18:00 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44593/
18:01 kurahaupo (But just in case you try, behind the scenes is a singleton object called PMCNULL)
18:01 NotFound kurahaupo: null means null, is a value, not a fragment of documentation.
18:02 kurahaupo Which is why PMCNULL exists, so that it can avoid simply SIGSEGV if you try to use it as an object
18:04 kurahaupo Coming back to "what's the purpose of a method that returns "something"?", the point is that null refers to a specific singleton object, and "being null" isn't a property of any other object, so it's the wrong question to ask.
18:04 kurahaupo IMHO
18:05 * kurahaupo suspects there may be some other weird objects that do have nullity, but he hopes not
18:06 NotFound kurahaupo: I think that's a wrong answer, but to each his own.
18:08 kurahaupo It's yet another weird outcome from having objects-are-always-reference​s-unless-they're-primatives.
18:08 * kurahaupo hates that model.
18:09 * kurahaupo narrowly avoids going into a rant about the benefits of single-assignment
18:11 kurahaupo NotFound: what does "null" mean to you?
18:12 NotFound kurahaupo: I'm not in metaphisical mood.
18:13 dukeleto whiteknight: those failures don't look that bad. i got to download and install the free version of icc somewhere
18:14 dukeleto whiteknight: do you think fiddling with hints is needed, or just changing some tests?
18:14 kurahaupo Let me put it in less metaphysical terms. Is null a value, or is nullity a property of (potentially) any object?
18:15 kurahaupo (Does it tie to referential equality?)
18:15 whiteknight dukeleto: no, those failures really aren't that bad. I think most of them are issues with negative zeros not being returned from the Intel math library. In some cases I think we could just output those values manually if needed
18:17 dukeleto whiteknight: we shouldn't be testing for an exact zero if floating point is involved. it may just need to be changed to is(x,y,msg,1e-8)
18:17 whiteknight dukeleto: sure, I don't really know the exact nature of all these failures
18:18 whiteknight some of these damn tests really need to be converted over to be pure-PIR and use test_more.pir
18:18 bubaflub whiteknight: anything i can help with?
18:20 dukeleto bubaflub: yes!
18:20 Coke tests for explicit -0 should probably be done as string compares.
18:21 bubaflub dukeleto: point me in the right direction and i'll hack away
18:21 dukeleto bubaflub: whiteknight and i are trying to get parrots test suite to pass on icc
18:21 bubaflub do i need to recompile my parrot to use icc?
18:21 dukeleto bubaflub: here is where you can download it for free: http://software.intel.com/en-us/artic​les/non-commercial-software-download/
18:22 dukeleto bubaflub: yes, you need to recompile
18:22 dukeleto bubaflub:
18:22 dukeleto bubaflub: perl Configure.pl --cc=icc --link=icc --ld=icc
18:23 bubaflub ok, i'm downloading now
18:23 dukeleto bubaflub++
18:23 bubaflub wow, 1 GB
18:23 whiteknight setup of ICC can be a bit of a pain in the ass
18:23 whiteknight but it's proprietary software, so you have to expct that
18:23 dukeleto bubaflub: which platform are you going to use icc on?
18:23 bubaflub i'll prolly saturate my work connection
18:23 bubaflub Mac OS X
18:23 purl Mac OS X is, like, the best OS EVAR and not stupid like macosx and windoze and $olaris or possessed of lots of stupid shiny slippery visual junk
18:24 bubaflub purl, forget Mac OS X
18:24 purl bubaflub: I forgot mac os x
18:24 dukeleto bubaflub: that is good, i don't think anybody has tried that. Unexplored territory!
18:25 bubaflub about ~28 minutes till i'm where the sidewalk ends
18:25 dukeleto bubaflub: sounds good
18:27 dukeleto bubaflub: these are the test failures that whiteknight is seeing on icc: http://nopaste.snit.ch/19838
18:27 Coke (icc) someone install that on feather, willya?
18:27 dukeleto Coke: good idea
18:27 purl dukeleto: Good Idea: Cleaning up litter. Bad Idea: Cleaning up kitty litter.
18:28 bubaflub dukeleto: at least the random is random enough
18:28 dukeleto bubaflub: the random tests having passing TODOs is expected, you can ignore those
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18:28 bubaflub dukeleto: i know, it was a poor attempt at a joke
18:29 dukeleto bubaflub: you fail ;)
18:46 Tene parrotsketch?
18:46 purl somebody said parrotsketch was a status meeting for parrot core committers held every Tuesday at 18:30 UTC in #parrotsketch
18:46 Coke I thought that time was rong.
18:47 cotto_work it's +2 hours from that
18:47 dukeleto #ps is in just under 3 hours
18:47 Coke no, parrotsketch is a status meeting for parrot core committers held every Tuesday at 20:30 UTC in #parrotsketch
18:47 purl okay, Coke.
18:47 Tene oh, I know!  I'll pre-post!
18:47 dukeleto 1:30pm PST for the west-coasters in here
18:48 cotto_work dukeleto, it's 12:30 PST
18:51 dukeleto cotto_work: if so, the parrot google calendar is wrong
18:51 dukeleto it would be nice to get that fixed
18:51 Coke the calendar is correct.
18:51 Coke ... at least, as the guy who set it up, I'm pretty sure it is.
18:51 dukeleto cotto_work: you are thinking about the old time, then
18:51 dukeleto cotto_work: it *used* to be 12:30pm PST, IIRC
18:52 Coke time?
18:52 purl hmmm... time is 18:52:28 2010 and (did you mean "clock"?) or flowing like a river or the fire in which we burn
18:52 Coke clcok?
18:52 purl hmmm... clcok is clock or cock
18:52 Coke clock?
18:52 purl Coke: LAX: Tue 10:52am PST / CHI: Tue 12:52pm CST / NYC: Tue 1:52pm EST / LON: Tue 6:52pm GMT / BER: Tue 7:52pm CET / IND: Wed 12:22am IST / TOK: Wed 3:52am JST / SYD: Wed 5:52am EST /
18:53 chromatic joined #parrot
18:53 Coke hurm.
18:53 cotto_work It's 1853 UTC now
18:54 Austin How about -1
18:54 purl it has been said that -1 is always a scalar number. The OUTPUT of sqrt() is a different value
18:55 Austin n/m
18:55 Coke when viewed in GMT sans DST, the PS meeting is from 8:30pm to 9:30pm.
18:56 Coke meeting is at 3:30pm eastern.
18:56 Coke so 12:30 pacific sounds right.
18:57 * Coke checks his DST setting...
18:57 dukeleto now i am confused
18:57 Coke 90 minutes.
18:57 purl 90 minutes is a long time
18:58 dukeleto so is the calendar wrong?
18:58 Coke no.
18:58 Coke looks right here.
18:58 Coke what time is the calendar showing you?
18:58 Coke (you're not using your PS3 to check it, are you?)
18:59 dukeleto the calendar say 1:30pm for me. I am using a darwin-x86 box, with the correct time and date
18:59 Coke dukeleto: google calendar doesn't care what your system says. what does your google calendar account think your time zone is?
18:59 whiteknight dukeleto, bubaflub: t/op/aritmetics.t, test 21:
18:59 whiteknight not ok 21 - 1
18:59 whiteknight # Have: 0
18:59 whiteknight # Want: -0
19:00 Coke (presuming you're looking at it through the web.)
19:00 whiteknight so I think it is a case of just not returning -0 from some things
19:00 Coke dukeleto: (and it's 11 am there, yes?)
19:00 dukeleto Coke: my gcal is set to GMT-8 Pacific Time
19:00 dukeleto Coke: yes, 11am here
19:01 Coke ok. mine is set to GMT-5, and the event is showing at 3:30pm.
19:01 dukeleto whiteknight: what is the actual test for that failure?
19:01 Coke and it's 2pm here.
19:01 whiteknight set $N0, 0; neg $N0; $S0 = $N0; is($S0, "-0")
19:02 whiteknight so very straight-forward
19:05 bubaflub dukeleto: whoops, i got the wrong icc.  there is a .DMG for Mac OS X.  gettin' that now
19:06 Coke dukeleto: the calendar timezone is set to "GMT+00 NO DST"
19:06 dukeleto Coke: why, why, why?
19:06 Coke because that's the correct timezone for the meeting?
19:07 Coke the meeting doesn't move with DST.
19:07 dukeleto Coke: is the meeting at 1:30pm or 12:30pm PST? My calendar says 1:30pm and it sounds like you are saying it is at 12:30pm. This is very confusing
19:07 Coke dukeleto: the meeting is at 20:30 UTC
19:08 cotto_work you can use date --utc
19:08 dukeleto cotto_work: date --utc
19:08 dukeleto date: illegal time format
19:08 Coke the meeting is in in about 80 minutes.
19:08 cotto_work Hmmm.  wfm
19:09 dukeleto Coke: Ok. All i am saying is, anybody looking at the parrot google calendar, in the west coast, is shown the wrong time.
19:10 Coke dukeleto: if I set my google calendar setting to pacific time, the meeting shows at 12:30
19:10 Coke so, it seems to just be you.
19:10 Coke or, more correctly, "not me". I can't reproduce your problem. :(
19:12 whiteknight Parrot_str_from_num calls Parrot_sprintf_c,which calls Parrot_vsprintf_c, which calls Parrot_vsprintf_s, which calls Parrot_sprintf_format.
19:12 Coke Is anyone else seeing the PS event NOT at 20:30 UTC?
19:12 whiteknight that's an awful lot of work to get a string representation of a float
19:13 bubaflub Coke: i'm seeing it correctly.  i'm in CST
19:13 Coke invoking c functions is cheap!
19:13 chromatic Look, the XS fallacy from Perl 5 creeping into Parrot!
19:14 * particle sees parrotsketch weekly meeting on his google calendar at 12:30pst
19:17 joeri joined #parrot
19:17 * dukeleto slaps forehead
19:17 dukeleto Coke: sorry about that. I was looking at the end of the month, after DST has changed. My calendar is fine. This is what I get for trying not to drink coffee in the morning
19:19 NotFound dukeleto: Eating it, instead?
19:19 particle subcutaneous injection.
19:20 dukeleto NotFound: I abstained from coffee this morning. this is what I get
19:22 NotFound dukeleto: you need INTERCAL instrucion: ABSTAIN ABSTAINING
19:22 cotto_work joined #parrot
19:23 * Coke wonders if we need TODO anymore.
19:26 chromatic axe it
19:29 bubaflub dukeleto: icc is installing right now on my machine; i'll run the test suite in a second
19:29 dukeleto bubaflub: cool beans
19:30 dukeleto cotto_work: date -u is UTC on darwin. date --utc works on linux
19:30 cotto_work oic
19:31 Coke ah. optimize is one of the places where we steal values from perl5's config.
19:32 Coke gcc is -O2. anyone else have a value?
19:39 cotto_work joined #parrot
19:42 dukeleto Coke: what exactly are you asking?
19:42 bubaflub dukeleto and whiteknight: i'm seeing a lot more warnings on a plain ole make with icc.  is this something we should be concerned about?
19:43 whiteknight bubaflub: no, I don't think so
19:43 whiteknight that's a configuration problem, probably
19:43 chromatic I thought icc was pickier too.
19:43 bubaflub whiteknight: ok.  i'm running `make coretest` right now
19:43 Coke perl -MConfig -e'print $Config{optimize},"\n"'
19:43 whiteknight chromatic: I think it is, yes
19:44 Coke with rm_cflags branch, we can work on making icc warnings clean.
19:44 bubaflub Coke: i get -Os
19:44 Coke bubaflub: what's your OS?
19:44 bubaflub Mac OS X
19:45 bubaflub 10.6.2
19:49 bubaflub dukeleto: all the icc errors seem to be dealing with -0
19:50 dukeleto bubaflub: sounds about right
19:51 bubaflub dukeleto: though on t/op/trans_old.t, the print statement on line 337 looks superfluous
19:51 particle that's an easy fix... config->has_negative_zero
19:52 dukeleto bubaflub: yes you can delete the print statement
19:52 bubaflub dukeleto: ok, i'll delete it and commit
19:52 dukeleto bubaflub: and particle has good advice. all tests dealing with -0 should consult config[has_negative_zero]
19:53 bubaflub particle++
19:53 dukeleto bubaflub: if has_negative_zero is false, the test should be for a normal 0
19:54 bubaflub dukeleto: ok, i'll start patching the files.  i've got a non-icc build that i can try it against just to make sure i don't break things
19:54 Coke if has_negative_zero is false, just skip the test. no?
19:54 Coke We already have tests for zeros.
19:54 dukeleto Coke: i guess that makes sense. Yes.
19:54 dukeleto bubaflub: what Coke said
19:54 bubaflub dukeleto: roger wilco.
19:54 dukeleto bubaflub: that is even easier. easy karma!
19:56 cotto_w0rk joined #parrot
19:57 dalek parrot: r44594 | bubaflub++ | trunk/t/op/trans_old.t:
19:57 dalek parrot: this print statement isn't necessary and messes up TAP output
19:57 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44594/
19:57 * dukeleto caffeinates before #ps to preclude further facepalming
20:00 chromatic Maybe the negative zero tests need their own file.
20:01 Coke PS in 30
20:03 dukeleto chromatic: not a bad idea.
20:04 kurahaupo joined #parrot
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20:09 bacek joined #parrot
20:09 kurahaupo 'morning Bacek
20:09 nopaste "NotFound" at 213.96.228.50 pasted "avoid_duplicate_string.patch for #ps discusion" (44 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/19839
20:10 brooksbp joined #parrot
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20:12 dukeleto bacek: o hai
20:12 dukeleto bacek: #ps is in 20 mins, and you are awake!
20:12 Coke bacek: PING.
20:12 cotto_work That sounds important.
20:15 Coke Tene: see TT#789
20:15 Coke msg Tene see TT#789
20:15 purl Message for tene stored.
20:15 kurahaupo Bacek appears to be in Guangzhou today
20:16 Coke the 2.1 milestone was open. I just closed it.
20:16 * bacek yawns
20:16 Coke bacek: did you mean to apply changes to branches/rm_cflags?
20:16 Coke they didn't seem to make sense in the context of the branch, so I assume you misfired git-svn.
20:17 bacek Coke, erm... Which one?
20:17 kurahaupo darn, s/Guangzhou/Australia/
20:17 * kurahaupo made a typo on "whois IP-address"
20:17 bacek Coke, ouch... Yes, my fault.
20:17 Coke looks like r44581,2,3
20:18 bubaflub dukeleto: it looks like my Parrot::Config setting 'has_negative_zero' is set to 1 when compiling parrot with icc
20:18 bacek Coke, sorry, I'll revert them in branch and reapply in trunk
20:18 Coke danke.
20:19 Coke bubaflub: check out the config step and see how it's checking that.
20:19 Tene Coke: 789 is about non-register attrs.  My problem is with a PMC attr.  Exception doesn't have non-register ATTRs.
20:19 Coke Tene: hokay.
20:19 dukeleto bubaflub: that is the bug. it shouldn't. or some kind of flag needs to be passed to icc to turn on negative zeros
20:20 Tene Coke: Thank you, though.
20:20 Coke dukeleto: if we're not passing the flag, how is the config step guessing it has them?
20:20 bubaflub Coke and dukeleto: ok.  i'm checking out now
20:20 Coke bug in the config step.
20:20 chromatic +1 from me on that patch, NotFound.  I've tested it locally and think it's good.
20:21 cotto_w0rk joined #parrot
20:27 Coke dukeleto: are you volunteering to be the parrot gsoc guy this year?
20:27 cotto_work dukeleto, put me on the list for mentoring a gsoc student
20:27 Coke ... and why are you double posting?
20:27 cotto_work it's to make it look like got twice as much done
20:28 dukeleto Coke: i was trying to paste correctly
20:28 dukeleto Coke: egggzactly
20:28 dukeleto Coke: I will be the organization adming for The Perl Foundation and Parrot Foundation, if that is what you are asking
20:28 dukeleto admin, even
20:28 cotto_work #ps in 2
20:28 * dukeleto puts coffee in his beer helmet
20:28 Coke dukeleto: ok. have you talked to the Pafo board about this?
20:29 Coke because I just found out just now, I think.
20:29 dukeleto Coke: I've talked to particle, he is on board as the backup org admin. Does that count? Who do I need to talk to?
20:30 dukeleto Coke: you are right, i have been busy and have not sent out any announcements yet
20:30 dukeleto Coke: i have been meaning to write a blog post for a long time now.
20:30 particle i speak for the board, pafo will participate, and i'll be backup org admin.
20:30 particle lunch &
20:30 dalek parrot: r44595 | bacek++ | branches/rm_cflags (2 files):
20:30 dalek parrot: Revert r44581-44583. They are not belong to branch. Coke++, bacek--
20:30 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44595/
20:31 Coke particle: if you're speaking for the board, please keep the board in the loop. danke.
20:32 Coke surprises bad. even good surprisses.
20:32 bubaflub dukeleto: the plot thickens - when i run the c code behind the config test (to see if there is a negative zero), it outputs "-0"
20:32 dukeleto cotto_work: please jump on this list: http://groups.google.com/group/tpf-gsoc
20:32 bubaflub so the config step is correct in determining if the compiler handles -0
20:32 dukeleto bubaflub: DUN DUN DUN. we may be dealing with a bug in icc or parrot core, then
20:32 bacek #ps in -2?
20:33 dukeleto bacek: #ps now!
20:33 bubaflub dukeleto: yeah.  bummer.
20:33 dukeleto bubaflub: look at it from the other direction. A fun puzzle to solve!
20:33 Coke bubaflub: what does ./parrot-config has_negative_zero say?
20:34 cotto_w0rk joined #parrot
20:34 bubaflub Coke: 1
20:34 bubaflub dukeleto: for certain values of fun
20:34 dukeleto what is the proper email to send announcements to the board?
20:35 dukeleto Coke: i assumed that when I talked to particle, he was a representation of the board, but I just haven't had time to send out all the proper announcements, yet
20:35 Coke dukeleto: you're fine.
20:35 Coke he surely is.
20:36 Coke parrot-directors@lists.parrot.org
20:36 lbr joined #parrot
20:36 dukeleto Coke++
20:38 dukeleto Coke: i just sent a quick email to the board
20:38 Coke dukeleto++
20:40 kurahaupo joined #parrot
20:42 allison joined #parrot
20:45 snarkyboojum joined #parrot
20:46 payload joined #parrot
20:46 chromatic Tene, there's only one test failing on the branch, but it's a doozy.
20:46 Tene I seem to be gathering inertia again.  I'm hopeful about getting things done this week.
20:46 chromatic Basically I think we need to instantiate a PMCProxy in stage 2 init for every PMC that has methods, and store the methods in there, and change the default PMC's method lookup to go through the PMC proxy.
20:47 whiteknight allison: have you seen my proposal on TT #1468? Would love some feedback
20:47 dalek parrot: r44596 | bacek++ | trunk/src/ops/core.ops:
20:47 dalek parrot: Fix core.ops syntax.
20:47 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44596/
20:47 dalek parrot: r44597 | bacek++ | trunk/src/ops/core.ops:
20:47 dalek parrot: Remove redundant 'goto NEXT'
20:47 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44597/
20:47 dalek parrot: r44598 | bacek++ | trunk/lib/Parrot/Op.pm:
20:47 dalek parrot: Remove Parrot::Op.full_body. 'auto' vs 'non-auto' ops separated by op pragma and handled in OpsFile
20:47 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/44598/
20:47 bubaflub dukeleto: strange, 'atan n4, -0.0, -0.0' is returning 0
20:48 brooksbp_ joined #parrot
20:48 bubaflub i.e. setting N4 to 0
20:48 Coke ISTR that's platform specific.
20:48 Tene oh man, that's way outside of anything I've worked on yet.
20:48 Tene I except it'll be interesting to investigate.
20:49 Andy joined #parrot
20:49 Coke Tene: nice fruedian slip.
20:49 Tene Coke: eh?
20:49 Tene Ah.
20:49 Coke er, freud.
20:49 Tene :)
20:49 chromatic It's not too awful, but it's intrinsic to starting the system so it's annoying to debug.
20:50 bluescreen joined #parrot
20:51 dukeleto bubaflub: very interesting
20:52 bubaflub dukeleto: should i dig down into the op itself?
20:52 dukeleto bubaflub: can you keep notes of all the odd stuff you find out about icc? i don't want it to get lost in a see of irclogs
20:52 dukeleto bubaflub: sounds like it
20:52 bubaflub dukeleto: sure thing.  new ticket on trac?
20:52 dukeleto bubaflub: parrot core may be casting incorrectly somehow
20:53 dukeleto bubaflub: sure!
20:53 bubaflub dukeleto: do we have one open for icc fixes or no?
20:53 bubaflub (i know we have a branch somewhere)
20:53 Topic for #parrotis now Parrot 2.1.1 Released! | http://parrot.org/ | Tasks: PCC deprecations hackathon on Saturday, TT #389 branch
20:54 allison Tene: yes, that's my expectation on ordering too
20:54 allison whiteknight: I'll take a look at  TT #1468
20:54 Tene So, rebranching and then patching imcc would be a good first task for someone.
20:55 chromatic I can do the IMCC change if no one else wants to.
20:55 allison Tene: aye, anyone can pick it up
20:56 dukeleto bubaflub: i don't think we have a TT for icc yet
20:56 bubaflub dukeleto: i'm on it now; i'll letcha know the number in a sec
20:57 allison two big things from there are fixing the src/call/args.c functions to handle the new order, and fixing PASM test failures
20:57 chromatic Is someone capturing this in task order?
20:57 chromatic Or is it already in task order?
20:58 allison chromatic: there's not a predetermined order, because 5 things need to happen at once before it works
20:58 chromatic By the way, we only have three defects in Coverity.
20:58 AndyA joined #parrot
20:58 allison chromatic: pick any one, watch the flames rise, and knock off the others until the tests pass again
20:59 patspam joined #parrot
21:00 bubaflub dukeleto: #1488 - i'll keep my notes in there
21:01 bubaflub "Rorschach's journal - the ICC is a cold and unforgiving beast."
21:01 dukeleto bubaflub: lulz
21:02 lbr bubaflub: not the Internet Chess Club
21:02 bubaflub lbr: hahaha, nah, the Intel C Compiler
21:02 dukeleto chromatic: is the coverity output somewhere web-accessible?
21:03 chromatic Only if you have a Coverity account.
21:03 chromatic Those are easy to get though.
21:04 allison whiteknight: yes, TT #1468 is headed in the right direction, need to work out the details (not this PCC refactor, but another one after)
21:05 dalek tracwiki: v161 | chromatic++ | WikiStart
21:05 dalek tracwiki: Weekly priorities for 02 March 2010
21:05 dalek tracwiki: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/W​ikiStart?version=161&amp;action=diff
21:12 Coke twitter block added to parrot.org
21:12 dalek TT #1488 created by bubaflub++: fix test suite when building with ICC
21:13 dukeleto Coke: i am not seeing a change. did you push the changes live? maybe my cache hates me?
21:13 dukeleto bubaflub++
21:13 Coke dukeleto: it's cached.
21:13 Coke login to see the changes.
21:13 Coke drupal?
21:13 purl drupal is a php CMS framework at http://drupal.org or an application platform though
21:14 Coke parrot.org?
21:14 purl well, parrot.org is drupal?
21:14 Coke parrot.org is also aggressively cached.
21:14 purl okay, Coke.
21:14 cotto_w0rk joined #parrot
21:14 Coke dukeleto: try http://www.parrot.org/?nocacheIhateit
21:17 dukeleto Coke: cool! It filters our RT's ? or is that a bug?
21:17 dukeleto s/our RT's/out RT's/
21:18 dukeleto Coke: looks snazzy. Coke++
21:18 Coke dukeleto: it's just a cut and paste of whatever JS twitter.org provided.
21:18 Coke let me see if there's a RT option.
21:18 NotFound dukeleto: "When dinosaurs still used punch cards" Good title for a movie.
21:20 Coke I see no option to include RTs
21:20 dukeleto NotFound: yeah! We should totally make it. "A short film about the pre-history of programming"
21:20 dukeleto Coke: it is not a big deal, just wondering. What you have is 1000x better than nothing. nice work!
21:20 dukeleto Coke: is that some kind of customizable widgety thing?
21:21 NotFound With the FX effects crew from "Minesweeper, The Movie"
21:21 Coke http://twitter.com/goodies/widget_profile
21:21 Coke feel free to give me a version that looks different, I'll include that.
21:22 dukeleto Coke: nice. i hadn't seen that
21:23 dukeleto Coke: i think that sidebar will add a little life to our site. sometimes it goes long spans without any updates
21:23 NotFound Just in case soemone doesn't know that infamous filem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHY8NKj3RKs
21:23 Coke drupal-- # it's caching everything.
21:24 bubaflub dukeleto: from what i'm seeing about the icc bugs, it seems like icc doesn't actually handle -0 correctly
21:24 bubaflub i.e. the failure on t/pmc/float.t
21:24 bubaflub i've got probably the simplest test case on the parrot_shell and it just doesn't handle -0
21:24 bubaflub i'll update the ticket with more goodness
21:24 Coke it may just be that parrot is expecting a platform that can print -0 to also generate -0 in all cases, when that isn't the case.
21:25 Coke all has_negative_zero promises is that -0 prints as -0 and not 0.
21:25 bubaflub Coke: exactly what i was thinking.  perhaps it can handle sprintf-ing a -0, but beyond that it can't do anything else
21:25 dukeleto bubaflub: awesome! We want as much evidence as we can before we tell the icc devs "you got bugs, man"
21:26 dukeleto Coke: interesting. maybe we need to split that config key into more than one?
21:28 bubaflub Coke and dukeleto: perhaps we can just change the config test to make sure beyond printing -0.  that would flag the ICC as not having a negative zero and the tests will pass.
21:30 Coke dukeleto: i don't think we've spec'd what we plan to do with -0. we could certainly have more -0 flags if we actually agreed what parrot should be doing with them.
21:30 NotFound We can't just explictly check for -0 in the print functions, instead of guessing how to make the clib print it?
21:31 Coke NotFound: we are.
21:32 Coke that's what the neg_0 test is doing.
21:32 dukeleto are there any low-level function that will just tell you the sign of number? that might be better that doing a string equality on "-0"
21:32 NotFound Oh, sorry
21:32 Coke wonder how long we've been getting comment spam on parrot.org
21:33 riffraff joined #parrot
21:33 Coke GAH DRUPAL STOP CACHING EVERYTHING.
21:33 bubaflub dukeleto: so what's weird is that there is a failure in t/op/sprintf.t that is basically the exact the same thing that the config step does
21:34 Coke note that the config step is using a straight printf; the sprintf opcode is jumping through more hoops.
21:35 Coke drupal says it only caches anonymous users, but it's lying. :|
21:35 Coke (*&#$.
21:38 Coke gah. I disabled caching and it is still caching.
21:38 cotto_work joined #parrot
21:38 Coke "I heard you like caching so I cached your caching so you can cache while you cache."
21:40 Coke ARGH>
21:40 Coke does anyone know how to disable caching in drupal?
21:40 chromatic Fire.
21:41 Coke http://www.parrot.org/admin/settings/performance - caching mode: "disabled", "minimum cache lifetime"-none. save settings. ... caching is still enabled.
21:41 bubaflub Coke: there is a module for it (http://drupal.org/project/cache_disable)
21:41 bubaflub which i find kinda funny
21:42 bubaflub and according to http://blog.kfirbreger.com/2009/05/2​9/how-to-truly-disable-drupal-cache/ you'll have to hack the planet to *actually* disable the cache
21:42 Coke holy (&*@#$# crap.
21:43 Coke I would settle for a big red button that said "kill cache".
21:43 Coke my current complaint: you can't even /pretend/ to disable the cache.
21:43 Coke I cannot make the "disabled" cache setting stick.
21:44 dukeleto Coke: I have nothing polite to say about Drupal, so I will say nothing.
21:45 elmex joined #parrot
21:46 Coke I deleted all the comment spam from the first page of news/
21:46 Coke so painful, will not bother doing more.
21:49 dukeleto Coke++
21:49 dukeleto Coke: maybe we need to add a CAPTCHA-thingy to comment?
21:49 dukeleto Coke: i find that only allowing OpenID or CAPTCHA for comments gets rid of a lot of spam
21:52 Coke there does not seem to be a builtin captcha option.
21:52 Coke if someone can find a drupal plugin for that, I'll ask the admins to install it.
21:52 dukeleto Coke: http://drupal.org/project/captcha
21:57 Coke ticket with osu opened.
22:00 patspam joined #parrot
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22:05 Coke bacek++
22:06 bacek Hey, I already got my karma. Twice...
22:06 patspam joined #parrot
22:09 bubaflub dukeleto: check out http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1488 for all my sleuthing.  as far as i can tell, ICC does handle negative zeroes but somewhere in the parrot innards it gets lost
22:10 bubaflub dukeleto: i gotta head to class, but i'll be back on later tonight to do some more poking around
22:11 bacek NotFound, take a look at PackfileConstantTable PMC get_or_create_constant.
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22:16 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#32468), fulltest) at r44598 - Ubuntu 9.10 amd64 (g++ with --optimize)
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22:55 shockwave The doc for opcode 'and' says: Short-circuiting logical and. Returns $2 if it's false, else returns $3.
22:55 shockwave I'm not sure if that's what I need. What I'm looking for is:
22:56 shockwave $I0 = and 0, 1 # false
22:56 shockwave Like the C '&&' operator.
22:57 shockwave From the description, it sounds like this 'and' opcode doesn't work like C's.
22:57 Austin So why is that not what you need?
22:57 cotto_work clock?
22:57 purl cotto_work: LAX: Tue 2:57pm PST / CHI: Tue 4:57pm CST / NYC: Tue 5:57pm EST / LON: Tue 10:57pm GMT / BER: Tue 11:57pm CET / IND: Wed 4:27am IST / TOK: Wed 7:57am JST / SYD: Wed 9:57am EST /
22:57 shockwave Austin, Returns $2 if it's false
22:57 Austin Right.
22:57 shockwave Oh
22:57 shockwave ah, I'm dumb.
22:58 shockwave Thanks, Austin. I suck.
22:58 Austin I won't say anything if you won't.
22:59 shockwave Though, I won't blame myself toooooo much. I spent most of my energy getting the order of operations working properly.
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22:59 shockwave I get it working, though.
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23:13 mikehh rm_cflags branch:
23:13 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#32469), fulltest) at r44598 - Ubuntu 9.10 amd64 (gcc with --optimize)
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23:55 dalek rakudo: 9921175 | jonathan++ |  (3 files):
23:55 dalek rakudo: Start to tease apart abstract roles (the name for the whole set of possible parameterizations) and concrete roles (a particular variant) in the type system, and tweak infix:<does> to take advantage of it. Probably more to come on this, but it's a start.
23:55 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/9​921175cc4b7a7560fe075bf198633743b6fe22c
23:55 dalek rakudo: 32a9461 | jonathan++ | src/core/traits.pm:
23:55 dalek rakudo: Start to put back of and returns traits a bit more. We don't enforce return type constraints yet, however.
23:55 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3​2a94612620d920d6bcdb1d6f7fd1a2e364ebbb8

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