Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2010-06-17

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Time Nick Message
00:10 dalek parrot: r47667 | darbelo++ | branches/gsoc_nfg/src/string/encoding/nfg.c:
00:10 dalek parrot: Commit WIP iterator additions.  The first step towards NFG literals has been taken.
00:10 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47667/
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00:22 whiteknight ash_: ping
00:22 ash_ hi
00:22 whiteknight ash_: where is your gsoc repo, again?
00:22 ash_ http://github.com/ashgti/parrot
00:22 purl http://github.com/ashgti/parrot are in there
00:23 ash_ um... purl remember that? /confused
00:23 whiteknight oh okay, the branch. the commit graph there looks like there's been no activity
00:23 ash_ gsoc_nci is the branch
00:24 whiteknight ok
00:24 whiteknight you still having that issue from earlier?
00:24 ash_ yeah
00:24 ash_ everything i have tried hasn't made a difference
00:26 ash_ are you on linux?
00:26 whiteknight yeppers
00:27 ash_ i had an issue earlier on linux with it finding the header, they didn't put it where pkg-config said it was, i ended up doing --ccflags='-I/usr/include/i486-linux-gnu/' to get it to work
00:27 ash_ so you know
00:27 ash_ thats the libffi header ffi.h and ffitarget.h
00:28 whiteknight src/nci/core_thunks.c:32:12: fatal error: 'core_thunks.str' file not found
00:28 ash_ um, i haven't ever gotten that problem...
00:28 ash_ it shouldn't be building the thunks anyway
00:28 whiteknight that's what I get on a fresh checkout
00:29 ash_ one sec let me try
00:29 cotto_work possibly a c2str problem?
00:30 whiteknight ash_: core_thunks$(o) is still included as part of a list of targets in the makefile
00:30 whiteknight ash_: which linux distro are you on?
00:30 ash_ hmmm, that doesn't sound right, i changed the config/gen/makefiles/root.in to make it not if you have libffi
00:30 ash_ ubuntu 10.04
00:30 purl ubuntu 10.04 is on slavak's laptop. Need perl 5.12 repo. ;)
00:31 ash_ you'll need the libffi headers
00:32 whiteknight ash_: the folder for me was /usr/include/x86_64-linux-gnu. I created some symlinks to get around that
00:32 whiteknight building fine now
00:33 ash_ mine always dies at: ./miniparrot -Iruntime/parrot/include config_lib.pir > runtime/parrot/include/config.fpmc
00:39 mikehh whiteknight: http://nopaste.snit.ch/21316
00:44 whiteknight mikehh: don't you ever have anything good to say? :)
00:47 whiteknight mikehh: I'll fix it in a minute, I'm building ash_'s project first
00:47 ash_ did it build whiteknight?
00:48 whiteknight ash_: yeah, failed at the miniparrot stage
00:48 ash_ any idea whats up?
00:48 whiteknight not yet. Let me fix that pod error mikehh++ reported and I'll dig into it
00:49 ash_ kk
00:49 ash_ thanks a lot for helping me, i am stumped
00:51 whiteknight no problem
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00:59 dalek parrot: r47668 | whiteknight++ | trunk/docs/book/pir/ch07_objects.pod:
00:59 dalek parrot: [docs] fix POD error that was breaking t/examples/pod.t. mikehh++ for the find
00:59 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47668/
00:59 whiteknight ash_: This problem is weird as hell
00:59 ash_ lol, and whats even more strange is on occation if i remake after its failed, it gets past that miniparrot point
01:00 ash_ so i have a feeling its sorta random, but i can't figure out whats wrong
01:05 whiteknight ash_: this is very weird
01:05 ash_ I don't think i made any changes to anything that would be causing this...
01:05 ash_ i thought
01:06 whiteknight ash_: When did this bug first appear? Which commit?
01:07 ash_ 7f2a03aad8
01:10 whiteknight why are you using string_make instead of Parrot_string_new_init?
01:11 ash_ because of the docs? http://docs.parrot.org/parrot/latest/​html/docs/pdds/pdd28_strings.pod.html said "string_make
01:11 ash_ A crippled version of a string initializer, now replaced with the full version Parrot_string_new_init."
01:12 ash_ although thats wrong too, i found out later, it should be Parrot_str_new_init
01:12 ash_ but i went back to string_make
01:13 ash_ since it didn't seem anyone else was using Parrot_str_new_init much directly, everyone seems to be using string_make so i figured the document was outdated?
01:13 whiteknight so before 7f2a03aad8, you didn't have this problem, and starting at that commit you did?
01:13 ash_ yeah
01:15 whiteknight I suggest you back out that commit (because it was pretty large) and figure out exactly which change is giving you trouble
01:16 whiteknight the casts are not likely the problem, unless there's some weird pointer arithmetic happening that I'm not aware of
01:17 whiteknight so back out that change, re-add all the casts and try, redo the makefile changes and try, etc
01:17 whiteknight I suspect the string_make line, since that's the most substantive change you made
01:20 whiteknight also, strings in Parrot are immutable, so you don't need to mark them constant or treat them constantly
01:21 ash_ alright, i just saw some places where people did use the constant flag
01:22 whiteknight ash_: yeah, it's probably a leftover. Constant flags on strings were made obsolete recently
01:22 ash_ k
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01:26 whiteknight I can't even find that damn string_make line in HEAD. too much stuff has moved
01:27 plobsing ping ash_
01:27 ash_ hi plobsing
01:28 plobsing how goes it?
01:29 ash_ still having problems with miniparrot dying, whiteknight was helping me figure out whats wrong
01:31 plobsing have you tried eliminating all uses of CONST_STRING you introduced?
01:33 ash_ i'll try that real quick
01:34 plobsing also I see you're still trying to give thunks to raw ncis. that will cause hard to track problems (although these symptoms aren't likely caused by that)
01:34 ash_ what do you suggest as an alternative?
01:36 plobsing either create a separate class for them (more work), or do what we do now and use a flag (private2) to give them an alternate code path.
01:36 whiteknight I'm heading to bed now. I haven't seen an error like this, so I don't know quite what to make of it. I'll take another look at this bug tomorrow. BAck out those changes like I suggested and see if you can narrow it down at all
01:37 ash_ you don't check pbc's into the repository do you?
01:37 plobsing we do check in some for testing purposes, but in general no.
01:38 plobsing they would break far too frequently
01:38 ash_ k, just checking, removing the CONST_STRING might of worked... (feels dumb)
01:40 plobsing why do you ask about checking in PBCs?
01:41 ash_ i just did a make and it got past the miniparrot but was complaining about pbc versions PackFile_unpack: This Parrot cannot read bytecode files with version 6.15. so i deleted the offending pbc's
01:41 ash_ just wanted to make sure they were generated
01:41 plobsing probably some PBCs don't have their dependencies quite right and aren't being remade
01:41 bacek_at_work ash_, make realclean or reconfig usually helps
01:42 ash_ i'll do that real fast
01:43 ash_ make realclean, then config and make
01:45 ash_ nope, after a make clean it still fails
01:46 ash_ i am going to go with what whiteknight suggested and just backtrack to a point were it didn't fail and then work fowards
01:46 plobsing good idea
01:49 ash_ anyone know why pdd28 (strings) suggests string_make is "A crippled version of a string initializer, now replaced with the full version Parrot_string_new_init" ? should i not use string_make?
01:51 plobsing for one, it doesn't accept an encoding argument
01:52 ash_ which one?
01:52 plobsing string_make
01:54 ash_ i thought it was string_make(interp, "CString", /* strlen */, NULL | "ascii" | "unicode" ... etc., flags);
01:55 plobsing that's charset. Parrot strings have both charset and encoding (don't ask me why).
01:56 ash_ got ya
01:56 plobsing Also, string_make throws an exception when the charset is not found. Parrot_str_new_init, OTOH, accepts CHARSET and ENCODING parameters directly, meaning you can fetch them yourself and deal with errors in possibly a more appropriate fashion.
02:01 ash_ well, i am going to try to get this working, if i get it done and make some tests for it i'll try to switch the llvm_detect branch detection over to llvm-config and start work there
02:03 plobsing once you declare it "done", I'll try and get it into an svn branch for wider testing and eventual merging
02:06 ash_ I know parts of it work, I manually forcing a signature in parts of it and it seemed to do alright
02:10 plobsing manually forcing a signature? where and how?
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02:18 ash_ well, for a while i manually crafted the signature vJP  and forced that
02:18 ash_ and the raw_nci stuff worked
02:18 ash_ (thats kinda why i think i have things close to done)
02:18 ash_ in the invoke of the NCI pmc i just built that specific signature and always used it
02:19 ash_ kinda to prove I had things right, then i switched to forcing the signature to "vJP"  and having my signature parser do the work to make sure that was right too
02:20 plobsing sounds close then.
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02:23 ash_ i am going to add a switch, if the private2 flag is set i am going to use the old nci stuff, so it will only be there for the raw_nci stuff
02:24 * Coke tries to come with a decent json representation for these html pages.
02:24 ash_ now it doesn't die when it initializes
02:24 ash_ like it was
02:39 dalek plparrot: 8267b71 | dukeleto++ | plparrot.c:
02:39 dalek plparrot: Refactor and remove dead code from plparrot.c
02:39 dalek plparrot: review: http://github.com/leto/plparrot/commit/8​267b710a5fd849c910e115bfd1443445be4ec03
02:44 ash_ plobsing: i got it working again, or part of it, its back to the PGE error
02:44 ash_ i know why miniparrot died all the time now
02:45 ash_ i changed the makefile to not build one of the thunk files because i didn't think it was needed, putting it back fixed the miniparrot error
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04:10 dukeleto How do I turn a Rakudo data structure into a Parrot data structure ?
04:10 * dukeleto has some Perl 6 code running on PL/Parrot, and is now trying to marshall data
04:11 sorear We haven't quite figured out how cross-HLL data sharing works, yet
04:12 dukeleto actually, if I could, for instance, turn a Rakudo integer into a C integer, that would help
04:12 dukeleto so Perl 6 objects have a .perl method, maybe Rakudo objects should have a .parrot method or something?
04:12 plobsing do Rakudo objects not respond to get_integer?
04:14 dukeleto plobsing: i will try that. Currently my code does a Parrot_PMC_isa on the datastructure, and none of the Rakudo datastructures return true for Integer, String or Float
04:16 sorear isa is harmful; use does instead
04:16 dukeleto sorear: touche
04:17 plobsing $isa does Harm; use does;
04:17 dukeleto sorear: Parrot_PMC_does seems to break my code which works with Parrot_PMC_isa.
04:17 * dukeleto goes and reads some source
04:18 dukeleto such as, what is the difference between Parrot_PMC_does and Parrot_PMC_does_pmc ?
04:18 dukeleto ah, I see, _pmc takes a PMC instead of a String
04:19 dukeleto plobsing: get_integer seems to just be returning 0 on a Rakudo integer
04:21 plobsing well 0 is an integer. :P
04:22 dukeleto plobsing: yes, one of my favorites. But it would be nice if 42.get_integer == 42 instead of 0 :)
04:22 dukeleto so it seems that _get_intval was removed, but I don't see it in DEPRECATED.pod . Am I missing something?
04:25 plobsing _get_intval sounds like one of the duplicated vtable-calling methods formerly in src/extend.c.
04:25 plobsing I removed them in favour of using the equivalent functions in src/extend_vtable
04:27 plobsing TT #1587
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04:31 dukeleto plobsing: that sounds good, I was wondering if that should be mentioned in DEPRECATED.pod ?
04:33 plobsing it was. in 2.3.
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04:41 dukeleto plobsing: i forgot that stuff gets deleted from DEPRECATED.pod once it is gone
04:42 dukeleto Parrot_PMC_get_class on a Rakudo object returns the empty string => :(
04:49 dalek parrot: r47669 | dukeleto++ | trunk/docs (2 files):
04:49 dalek parrot: [docs] Update docs referring to get_intval which is now get_integer
04:49 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47669/
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04:51 dukeleto abqar: welcome
05:15 sorear Why don't we have preproc/configure magic to support __attribute((deprecated)) or however you spell that?
05:16 plobsing because you hadn't volunteered yet ;-)
05:17 sorear I'm immune to volunteering under the CLA policy.
05:20 Coke dukeleto: I think you want $I0 = $some_Rakudo_Thing
05:20 Coke if in c, INTVAL foo = VTABLE_get_integer(INTERP, RakudoThingee); (whetever that expands to for embedders)
05:22 dukeleto Coke: that is Parrot_PMC_get_integer in C, and that doesn't seem to work
05:22 dukeleto Coke: where would a test for that even go?
05:23 dukeleto Coke: actually, it should probably go in t/02-embed in the Rakudo repo
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06:18 pmichaud prepare for commit flood
06:19 moritz tcurtis: pong
06:20 cotto and suddenly
06:21 dalek rakudo: ddb39d0 | (Solomon Foster)++ | t/spectest.data:
06:21 dalek rakudo: Regress range-iterator.t, because it conforms to the now-obsolete former
06:21 dalek rakudo: iterator model.
06:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d​db39d064c6e334f4d08addd30e4c02b00c20296
06:21 dalek rakudo: 6b2af44 | moritz++ | src/core/MAIN.pm:
06:21 dalek rakudo: fix all but one test in main-usage.t
06:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6​b2af44352f2bfb604e76caa5d60e28bece4dc52
06:21 dalek rakudo: 1cce3a3 | pmichaud++ | src/builtins/Junction.pir:
06:21 dalek rakudo: Adjust Junction.new so that it accepts slurpy arguments, stores $!eigenstates as
06:21 dalek rakudo: a Parcel instead of an RPA.
06:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​cce3a377daa5c2975d6e54658d59bd40e752ff1
06:21 dalek rakudo: 5e523b1 | pmichaud++ |  (2 files):
06:21 dalek rakudo: Merge branch 'list' of github.com:rakudo/rakudo into list
06:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5​e523b10cf4c90cb21d408740b71de6ed3c57772
06:21 dalek rakudo: b6cc36c | pmichaud++ | src/builtins/Parcel.pir:
06:21 dalek rakudo: Make list assignment more robust -- assigning to lists containing hashes now
06:21 dalek rakudo: works.
06:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/b​6cc36c7a0cfc89332f81a449e2cc7fc67507046
06:21 dalek rakudo: d982db1 | pmichaud++ | src/ (5 files):
06:21 dalek rakudo: Refactor postcircumfix:<{ }> in terms of .at_key and to have proper
06:21 dalek rakudo: multidispatch.
06:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d​982db182df249f562a93b85a76c4383b9f71051
06:21 dalek rakudo: 7e58a35 | pmichaud++ | src/ (6 files):
06:21 dalek rakudo: Refactor Positional to follow the model developed for Associative.
06:21 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7​e58a3531329019f9789a7e500589ffced36a10d
06:21 dalek rakudo: 8f09a6e | pmichaud++ | src/core/Positional.pm:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Fix typo in Positional slices.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/8​f09a6e34e7fd988234773afcda6a2a5d360e920
06:22 dalek rakudo: f015a83 | pmichaud++ | src/builtins/Parcel.pir:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Assignment to Whatever acts like assigning to a scalar.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f​015a83363b3f86527f63eea94947cb0091fe6f9
06:22 dalek rakudo: 465ef30 | pmichaud++ | src/core/Array.pm:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Typo in Array at_pos method.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/4​65ef30b3339fde9e9e83466951663b4fdc2f60d
06:22 dalek rakudo: 48e2e8d | pmichaud++ | src/builtins/Junction.pir:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Update eigenstates handling to use Seq for value semantics.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/4​8e2e8d0037ab9c9bac6398e36b154b986bfc818
06:22 dalek rakudo: 4cb5c39 | pmichaud++ | src/core/Match.pm:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Finally, Match does Positional.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/4​cb5c39958d6162b5579a6f2fc24160535ab5ca2
06:22 dalek rakudo: 62f2219 | pmichaud++ | src/ (5 files):
06:22 dalek rakudo: Eliminate obsolete FETCH methods.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6​2f2219aac592eb86a9476f83d8bb2a3f448e72d
06:22 dalek rakudo: 41191e9 | pmichaud++ | src/builtins/Proxy.pir:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Switch Proxy to create Perl6Scalar instead of ObjectRef.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/4​1191e96b2838aa36a96fabae921b93aa8a86e77
06:22 dalek rakudo: ffd450c | pmichaud++ | src/ (5 files):
06:22 dalek rakudo: Significant refactor of Parcel, !STORE, assignment, and the 'scalar' flag.
06:22 dalek rakudo: This cleans up a lot of holes left over from previous implementations,
06:22 dalek rakudo: and lays a good foundation for an even better solution (resolving our
06:22 dalek rakudo: hash and array vivification issues) that I'll do shortly after the
06:22 dalek rakudo: branch merge and June release.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f​fd450c03bc0d6a5350703ddba68cd47b86b4d66
06:22 dalek rakudo: e4e9822 | pmichaud++ | src/glue/regex.pir:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Fix handling of regex assertions (wasn't using a flat list).
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e​4e9822effc4828e42f08f7a15bcc391ef01b377
06:22 dalek rakudo: 70d91d4 | pmichaud++ | src/glue/dispatch.pir:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Clean up dispatch list handling (&flat instead of &list).
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7​0d91d42857a88db6c007416742641309e44cc4d
06:22 dalek rakudo: 5832221 | pmichaud++ |  (53 files):
06:22 dalek rakudo: Merge branch 'list'
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5​832221009dbb200c4b81cc03197eb2b13514668
06:22 dalek rakudo: e3eb608 | pmichaud++ | src/core/List.pm:
06:22 dalek rakudo: Restore List.rotate method.
06:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/e​3eb6081207ea208b5522daa1390debcd313be7c
06:23 tcurtis moritz: Is "my &foldable := sub ($opName) {...}" valid in Perl 6? NQP doesn't appear to support using &foldable to refer to "sub foldable ($opName) {...}".
06:25 moritz tcurtis: yes, it is
06:28 tcurtis moritz: I'm about to update my blog post and the associated example code repository with that, then.
06:29 moritz tcurtis++
06:32 tcurtis I also fixed the lack of escaping of the angle brackets in the "--target=constantfold" output in the post.
06:44 dalek parrot: r47670 | plobsing++ | branches/dynop_mapping/compilers/imcc (2 files):
06:44 dalek parrot: handle const pointer symregs slightly more appropriately
06:44 dalek parrot: makes COMPILE_IMMEDIATE=0 work
06:44 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47670/
06:44 dalek rakudo: cca4a84 | pmichaud++ | src/Perl6/Compiler.pir:
06:44 dalek rakudo: Restore backtrace handling.
06:44 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c​ca4a8411258baacbac7a540bc6e7e0c1bf88246
07:09 dalek rakudo: a5f844b | moritz++ | t/spectest.data:
07:09 dalek rakudo: enable quite a few passing test files (some of them were regressions of the list
07:09 dalek rakudo: branch, but most not)
07:09 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a​5f844b1b634d66b27069ed6fe34777067fcbb91
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08:18 dalek rakudo: 012ea2b | snarkyboojum++ | src/core/Any-list.pm:
08:18 dalek rakudo: Get rotate working for Parcel again
08:18 dalek rakudo: Signed-off-by: Moritz Lenz <moritz@faui2k3.org>
08:18 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/0​12ea2baaa27ecf0c074bde369e40a9915e867cc
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09:22 dalek rakudo: d1a7442 | moritz++ | src/core/CallFrame.pm:
09:22 dalek rakudo: fix callframe().line and .file by creating a Perl 6 hash from the annotations
09:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/d​1a7442b130036112bd7352cd7eec603e3bb520b
09:22 dalek rakudo: cb0e95e | moritz++ | src/core/CallFrame.pm:
09:22 dalek rakudo: simplify CallFrame.pm, and make a parameter optional
09:22 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c​b0e95ecf01d7d088993cd141f025b268c5bbc7e
09:28 bacek aloha, humans
09:58 mikehh bacek: anything happening in gc_massacre recently?
09:58 bacek mikehh, not really. It needs some deep tuning...
10:00 mikehh bacek: 'k, anything I can do to help?
10:02 bacek wanna tune GC? :)
10:03 mikehh :-}
10:09 wizard hi, is somewhere document with references to all predefined classes in parrot  like ResizablePMCArray, FizedPMCArray etc ?
10:12 JimmyZ wizard: http://docs.parrot.org/parrot/latest/html/pmc.html
10:13 wizard tnx
10:22 wizard I see parrot has class Timer   but I see no classes like Date or DateTime   so has parrot something to operate with dates?
10:24 moritz wizard: don't think so. dukeleto++ has been planning some work on them, iirc
10:24 moritz wizard: I'm sure your contribution would be welcome
10:25 moritz http://github.com/rakudo/rakud​o/blob/master/src/core/Date.pm might serve as an inspiration
10:25 moritz http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/​blob/master/src/core/Temporal.pm
10:26 khairul joined #parrot
10:31 wizard hmm. I'm not sure my knowledge of parrot allow me to mess up with it's source
10:31 lucian joined #parrot
10:31 wizard but I can try :)
10:37 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#34450), fulltest) at r47670 - Ubuntu 10.04 amd64 (g++)
11:14 mikehh rakudo (cb0e95e) builds on parrot r47670 - make test PASS, spectest_smolder -> #34452 (pugs r31326) FAIL - Ubuntu 10.04 amd64 (g++ with --optimize)
11:39 ruoso joined #parrot
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11:51 dalek pir: 266a544 | bacek++ |  (6 files):
11:51 dalek pir: Create "mini-framework" for testing POST output.
11:51 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/266​a544e68cbc9fb3559b2165f5b6e0b263e0182
11:52 bacek msg cotto If you are bored and want to work on PIRATE check t/post/sub.txt from http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/266​a544e68cbc9fb3559b2165f5b6e0b263e0182 :)
11:52 purl Message for cotto stored.
12:02 whiteknight joined #parrot
12:16 Coke dukeleto: when you say Parrot_PMC, do you mean Parrot_<NAME OF PMC>_ ?
12:32 dalek rakudo: 19e7264 | moritz++ | src/core/CallFrame.pm:
12:32 dalek rakudo: fix typo in CallFrame.pm, moritz--
12:32 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​9e72646422f568e1f017eaca1032beb20e8d01f
12:32 dalek rakudo: f17fe96 | moritz++ | docs/ChangeLog:
12:32 dalek rakudo: extend ChangeLog a bit
12:32 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f​17fe961c7906b9b870ab09322cd53918fac4998
12:32 dalek rakudo: 17e43e8 | moritz++ | t/spectest.data:
12:32 dalek rakudo: turn on the series tests; those that fail are regressions from the "list" merge,
12:32 dalek rakudo: and should be fixed before the release
12:32 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​7e43e86eedaa241a9f282372aa6db476216df5f
12:38 JimmyZ joined #parrot
13:12 ambs joined #parrot
13:15 whiteknight good mornin, #parrot
13:22 gbacon joined #parrot
13:28 atrodo joined #parrot
13:35 bluescreen joined #parrot
13:56 plobsing joined #parrot
13:57 bacek aloha, whiteknight
13:57 bubaflub joined #parrot
13:58 whiteknight good morning bacek
13:58 mikehh howdy whiteknight
13:58 whiteknight hello mikehh
13:59 mikehh whiteknight: no complaints for you at the moment :-}
14:02 whiteknight mikehh: I don't mind if you do. Somebody has to keep an eye on the crap code I write :)
14:02 dalek pir: 3c2550f | bacek++ | src/PIR/Actions.pm:
14:02 dalek pir: Remove debug output.
14:02 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/3c2​550f045069a0c42e59379246629880a9f1eff
14:02 dalek pir: 6f53e70 | bacek++ |  (4 files):
14:02 mikehh whiteknight: hey, it's much better than most, no complaints on that score
14:03 dalek pir: Factor out common POST::Value
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/6f5​3e704d8f10a5db224b01c1384d47fb45973f4
14:03 dalek pir: 7f320bd | bacek++ | t/post/subs.txt:
14:03 dalek pir: More tests.
14:03 purl i think more tests is trivial.
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/7f3​20bd8c0bd22201713b33d94c946cfd1ce76ce
14:03 dalek pir: 35e344b | bacek++ |  (3 files):
14:03 dalek pir: Implement POST::Sub.symbol similar to PAST::Sub.symbol
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/35e​344bad5f007f5bf8fbfb16e078f463341ff01
14:03 dalek pir: f9aa791 | bacek++ |  (3 files):
14:03 dalek pir: Store .param in symtable
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/f9a​a7913214b736b4ce8be76eb50c669ec2c7b05
14:03 dalek pir: 0da913b | bacek++ |  (4 files):
14:03 dalek pir: Implement proper handling of undeclared named registers
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/0da​913bbcffd938b7d4d3bf50c26f1a2a827735a
14:03 dalek pir: 9bf18ef | bacek++ | src/PIR/Actions.pm:
14:03 dalek pir: Remove debug, fix typo.
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/9bf​18efee772728a7a7198a20285f00d30a24f75
14:03 dalek pir: 318b524 | bacek++ | t/test_post.pir:
14:03 dalek pir: Handle fail_like adverb in test_post for validating error messages.
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/318​b52469d76c5e1faae1d9e76e7ed93fe69b706
14:03 dalek pir: 2e19911 | bacek++ | t/ (2 files):
14:03 dalek pir: Add test for not predeclared registers.
14:03 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/2e1​9911599bdb1047a28a992b7e041d4b6ca940c
14:05 mikehh whiteknight: and i really enjoy your blog _1 there or more
14:05 mikehh that should hve been +1 - whiteknight++
14:05 whiteknight thanks! I've been lazy with writing new posts lately
14:05 patspam joined #parrot
14:06 bacek ok, on this positive note I'm departing to bed
14:06 mikehh I don't spend much time on television these days - fully sympathise on that score
14:07 whiteknight good night bacek
14:07 mikehh see you later
14:07 nopaste "bacek" at 192.168.1.3 pasted "PIRATE rocks!" (7 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/21327
14:08 bacek Good night, humans
14:08 dalek parrot: r47671 | khairul++ | branches/gsoc_instrument/s​rc/dynpmc/instrument.pmc:
14:08 dalek parrot: Cleanup hook list on destroy.
14:08 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47671/
14:08 dalek pir: 65d4cd7 | bacek++ | t/post/subs.txt:
14:08 dalek pir: Add test for declared params usage.
14:08 dalek pir: review: http://github.com/bacek/pir/commit/65d​4cd73efdb2df9acfcd8c1b6f85898b9c1eb59
14:23 whiteknight bacek++ # PIRATE is getting quite impressive!
14:24 atrodo So now that there's Pirate, which project is going to be Ninja?
14:26 bubaflub ninja should be the name of the next  nqp
14:27 whiteknight nqp isn't sneaky enough
14:27 moritz perl 6, the language of ninjas and pirates alike!
14:27 moritz even chuck norris uses it
14:32 atrodo moritz++
14:34 whiteknight Code that Chuck Norris writes is valid input to all compilers, and always solves the halting problem
14:51 particle what is this pirate you speak of?
14:52 particle because it's not the pirate of old... python on parrot
14:52 Coke bacek stole the name.
14:52 particle for what?
14:52 purl for fun.
14:52 Coke pirate?
14:52 purl pirate is, like, a career that is washed up these days...and raping and pillaging just doesn't have a good reputation these days.... or http://www.eff.org/IP/DRM/piratead/CEA_ad.png or http://www.wired.com/politics/securi​ty/magazine/17-07/ff_somali_pirates or PIR parser (and compiler) implemented in NQP http://github.com/bacek/pir
14:52 Coke the last one.
14:52 particle ah
14:53 particle is that on the road to lorito?
14:53 Coke I imagine it could be.
14:53 Coke if iI knew where lorito was, I could google map it.
15:05 Andy Morning all
15:05 purl morning, Andy
15:05 Andy I haven't done anyting in Parrot for weeks.  It's very sad.
15:11 ash_ joined #parrot
15:28 whiteknight good morning Andy
15:28 whiteknight Andy: don't feel bad. I've been slacking too
15:30 dalek parrot: r47672 | NotFound++ | trunk/t/pmc/stringiterator.t:
15:30 dalek parrot: fix StringIterator out of bounds tests that were passing for wrong reasons
15:30 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47672/
15:31 Coke Andy: if you want some LHF, you could prove tools/*/checkdepend.pl and fix a makedepend or two.
15:32 particle s/prove/run/ ?
15:33 Andy Oh, didn't mean that I had time for any F, LH or not.
15:34 Coke particle: , no prove.
15:34 Coke (it's a test.)
15:35 Andy added to my task list
15:35 Andy FWTW
15:35 Coke Andy: ah well. going to yapc:na 2010?
15:35 Andy nope
15:35 Coke but I so miss you yelling at me!
15:36 mikehh rakudo (17e43e8) builds on parrot r47670 - make test PASS, spectest_smolder -> #34457 (pugs r31332) FAIL - Ubuntu 10.04 amd64 (g++ with --optimize)
15:37 mikehh rakudo: t/spec/S32-io/IO-Socket-INET.rakudo reports a failure, but when i run it separately (4 times) it passes
15:37 mikehh also t/spec/S09-typed-arrays/arrays.rakudo fails
15:38 mikehh bunch of TODO passes
15:41 particle a test that lives in tools/ and ends in .pl?
15:43 Andy When have I yelled at you, Coke?
15:43 Andy COME ON, WHEN?
15:43 Andy I'd be tempted to go just for a good hackathon.
15:44 Andy Did I really yell at you at some YAPC past? I apologize.
15:46 Coke Andy: the first Chicago, I think.
15:46 Coke I think you were just goofing around and speaking in ALL CAPS, though.
15:47 Coke you are hard to read, both online and in person.
15:47 Coke particle: yes. it's not intended to be run as part of the test suite. it's more of a guide.
15:47 Coke and will eventually be part of a "make depend" step.
15:48 Coke but since it was test like, I made it act like a test.
15:49 ambs joined #parrot
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16:02 dalek parrot: r47673 | NotFound++ | trunk/src/pmc/string.pmc:
16:02 dalek parrot: drop pointless check for PMC_data
16:03 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47673/
16:03 Coke Andy: no worries.
16:03 purl Ha!
16:03 Coke no worries, mate?
16:14 Andy Back
16:14 Andy Coke: Yeah, no worries.  I'm mostly goofing at any given point in time.
16:15 Andy Is there indeed a post- or pre-YAPC hackathon?
16:19 Coke we have a room for perl6 & parrot the run of the con. nothing schedule, just as you drop in.
16:19 dalek parrot: r47674 | NotFound++ | trunk/t/pmc/arrayiterator.t:
16:19 dalek parrot: test for ArrayIterator wrong direction
16:19 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47674/
16:20 Andy oh crud, it's next week.  I can't go.
16:21 Coke ugh. why did java go with single dash for long options? no wonder I can't ever find the version of the damn jvm.
16:25 Coke would anyone care if http://docs.parrot.org/parrot/latest/html/pmc.html did not distinguish beteen abstract and concrete?
16:28 Coke eh. I'll leave it for now. easier to verify I haven't borked anything.
16:35 ambs joined #parrot
16:40 dukeleto Coke: no, Parrot_PMC_* is the prefix for embedd API functions that deal with PMC's
16:43 cotto_work happy Thursday
16:45 Coke dukeleto: ah, ok. don't know what hte wrapper in that func is doing, butit is calling the right vtable.
16:48 dukeleto cotto_work: happy $day
16:48 Essobi joined #parrot
16:48 dukeleto Coke: yeah, i think i am dealing with a Rakudo issue involving return values
16:49 ash_ dukeleto: did you get your issue figured out?
16:50 ruoso joined #parrot
16:52 dukeleto ash_: not really. I can't seem to get a Rakudo return value from PIR
16:53 jnthn dukeleto: I think Rakudo may always return a Parcel.
16:54 jnthn If which case you can look inside it.
16:54 NotFound Can someone tell me what's the difference between src/nci/extra_thunks.c and src/extra_nci_thunks.c and what is used for whatever?
16:55 Coke I think that was... plobsing?
16:55 Coke ISTR one is for core, and one is for embedding.
16:55 * Coke finds code for generating HTML pages that is never run.
16:56 dukeleto jnthn: when I use dumper.pbc to dump the return value I get, it is: "VAR1" => undef with-properties: Hash { "rw" => PMC 'Bool' { ... } }
16:56 NotFound I think both are for annoying dvelopers.
16:56 ash_ I don't have a src/extra_nci_thunks.c ... is that a left oer?
16:56 ash_ over*
16:56 dukeleto jnthn: is that a Parcel in disguise? Or an actual undef ?
16:56 Coke it's generated.
16:57 jnthn dukeleto: That looks like a real undef.
16:57 jnthn dukeleto: Which is a tad odd.
16:57 jnthn What's your Perl 6 code look like?
16:57 Coke dumper can't dump a Bool?
16:57 Coke oh,that's a p6 bool. nevermind.
16:58 dukeleto jnthn: http://github.com/leto/plparrot/commit/4​09644c140fc919445a05f91a9f946d539feb0cf
16:58 dukeleto jnthn: you can see in the diff what I wrap code in. I have just been trying to get a function body with a simple integer to work.
16:58 dukeleto jnthn: I know the code is running, because if I put a "say" in the function body, it shows up in my logs
16:59 NotFound The question really is: how should be the src/nci/extra_thunks.c regenerated?
16:59 dukeleto jnthn: try { my $r = eval ' 42 '; return $r };
17:00 Coke ... holy crap is make html broken.
17:00 jnthn dukeleto: havign just tried in evalbot...erm...something looks broken. :-S
17:01 dukeleto jnthn: yeah, returning values from Rakudo to PIR has some wonkiness
17:01 ash_ will return do something useful there?
17:01 ash_ doesn't return throw a control exception?
17:01 dukeleto ash_: i have tried with just a plain $r as well
17:01 ash_ (and won't try catch that?)
17:02 dukeleto jnthn: if you can point me in the direction of a test, I can write some
17:02 dukeleto jnthn: i am guessing t/02-embed can use a few more tests :)
17:03 Coke ash_: try doesn't eat CONTROL exceptions, I don't think.
17:03 dalek rakudo: 96af91d | pmichaud++ | src/Perl6/Actions.pm:
17:03 dalek rakudo: Remove fossil:  'for' should use &flat on its source, not &eager.
17:03 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/9​6af91db7fc9c3cdbbd43fa7a392d1054503d96a
17:04 ash_ Coke: rakudo: sub foo { try { return 13213 }; return 1 }; say foo;
17:04 ash_ [12:03pm] <p6eval>
17:04 ash_ rakudo 17e43e: OUTPUT«1␤»
17:04 ash_ maybe i am misunderstanding return there, but try seems to have caught it
17:05 Coke ash_: certainly does, ja.
17:05 ash_ i wouldn't expect try to catch CONTROL exceptions, but i think it might be
17:07 tcurtis joined #parrot
17:08 ambs Coke: next week, don't forget schwern.
17:09 clinton joined #parrot
17:09 Coke ambs: I will endeavor to remember.
17:10 ambs Coke: if I find you, I will remember :)
17:10 ambs thank you
17:15 dalek rakudo: 7df145b | jimmy++ | src/core/metaops.pm:
17:15 dalek rakudo: removed unused code
17:15 dalek rakudo: Signed-off-by: Moritz Lenz <moritz@faui2k3.org>
17:15 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7​df145bb759732790b15400f17afc6c148b0ad1c
17:15 dalek rakudo: 1cfec1c | moritz++ | src/Perl6/Actions.pm:
17:15 dalek rakudo: Merge branch 'master' of github.com:rakudo/rakudo
17:15 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/1​cfec1cbdc4e7e0af8baa7c8a529466096a12fab
17:40 Coke seen jhorwitz?
17:40 purl jhorwitz was last seen on #parrot 282 days, 1 hours, 4 minutes and 39 seconds ago, saying: Tene: not at all.  i should have the tuits this week to work on your compile issue  [Sep  8 16:35:38 2009]
17:40 Tene Coke: I find he's often responsive on aim
17:41 dalek parrot: r47675 | NotFound++ | trunk (3 files):
17:41 dalek parrot: use STRING_IS_NULL instead of NULLness checks in STRING * to char * NCI thunks
17:41 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47675/
17:41 Coke he would have seen the email I just got. no worries.
17:41 Tene 'k
17:42 dalek winxed: r504 | julian.notfound++ | trunk/examples/Mysql.winxed:
17:42 dalek winxed: stop using deprecated 'v' arguments NCI signature in example Mysql
17:42 dalek winxed: review: http://code.google.com/p/w​inxed/source/detail?r=504
17:42 NotFound At least!
17:47 patspam1 joined #parrot
17:57 dalek parrot: r47676 | dukeleto++ | trunk/t/op/sprintf2.t:
17:57 dalek parrot: [docs][TT# 1667] Get rid of wrong documentation
17:57 dalek parrot: review: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/changeset/47676/
17:57 cotto_work We need to start GPG signing our releases.  Maybe I'll take that on while I wait for OSUOSL to get the trac/git test site working.
18:01 cotto_work I can't complain about the cost, but their speed leaves me unimpressed.
18:02 dukeleto cotto_work: i would like to see md5/sha1s of Parrot releases as well
18:04 cotto_work Happily we've trained our release managers to follow the documentation, so a patch to that should be sufficient.
18:06 dalek TT #1667 closed by dukeleto++: t/op/sprintf2.t:  Misleading documentation
18:06 dalek TT #1667: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1667
18:07 dalek rakudo: 7a230d9 | pmichaud++ | docs/spectest-progress.csv:
18:07 dalek rakudo: spectest-progress update through 06-14; still waiting on later dates to be
18:07 dalek rakudo: generated.
18:07 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7​a230d9c027706354b38a0b8d096e9ac6803354d
18:32 Coke I recall needing the sums for making the macport release.
18:33 cotto_work ooc, has anyone tried cutting a release on windows?
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18:58 dukeleto Coke:  yes, many packaging systems require a md5 or sha1. We should provide those.
19:06 dalek rakudo: fdb5ca4 | (Solomon Foster)++ | src/core/operators.pm:
19:06 dalek rakudo: Unify the infix:<...>($lhs, $rhs) case with the main infix:<...> code.  Add
19:06 dalek rakudo: support for the single-character endpoints special case.
19:06 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/f​db5ca4f6c1d8259a90a0cee12efafbe10f9618c
19:50 whiteknight it bugs the hell out of me when a big fancy IDE doesn't have some of the basic capabilities built-in that my shitty notepad-replacement software does
19:51 Tene What is it this time, and which fancy IDE are you using?
19:52 Tene One of my co-workers has started renaming programs in our subversion repo to add .pl and .sh suffixes, because he says Eclipse can't figure out the syntax hilighting without it.
19:54 whiteknight I'm using VisualStudio, and it doesn't have some things like guide lines, decent syntax highlighting for some languages, etc
19:57 whiteknight yeah, being able to autodetect those kinds of things would be nice, but I've never seen an editor do that properly
19:57 whiteknight even just detecting the shebang line would be nice, though incomplete
19:57 dalek rakudo: 2be1d04 | (Solomon Foster)++ | src/core/operators.pm:
19:57 dalek rakudo: Handle the infix:<@lhs, @rhs> case we forgot about last time.
19:57 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/2​be1d04165735fb754817e08cc363000b085ebf7
20:03 davidfetter joined #parrot
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20:06 silug joined #parrot
20:10 davidfetter oh hai
20:15 Chandon joined #parrot
20:18 whiteknight hello davidfetter
20:18 whiteknight ...and goodbye davidfetter
20:18 davidfetter i hope it wasn't something i said
20:19 darbelo I doubt he finds 'oh hai' offensive.
20:20 cotto_work I dunno.  He's killed people for less.
20:20 cotto_work Though I might be thinking of someone else.
20:27 cotto_work Could someone going to YAPC::NA make sure that good notes get taken at the Lorito meeting?
20:32 atrodo When is the Lorito meeting?
20:32 kthakore atrodo: now!
20:33 kthakore atrodo: you are missing it! OMG RUN!
20:33 kthakore atrodo: no time for that youtube video! RUN! RUN!
20:33 atrodo !  I forgot to drive to Columbus this morning!
20:33 kthakore OH NO!
20:33 atrodo Srsly, can everyone wait two hours while i get there?
20:33 kthakore I will.
20:34 kthakore atrodo: I will wait in canada
20:35 silug joined #parrot
20:38 dalek rakudo: af53808 | pmichaud++ | docs/spectest-progress.csv:
20:38 dalek rakudo: spectest-progress.csv update: 489 files, 33280 (83.4% of 39887) pass, 37 fail
20:38 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/a​f53808f18d0a8cc5fbbc81e06371f7fa7063871
20:38 * davidfetter tries to figure out how quickly he could get to columbus
20:39 kthakore davidfetter: 20 hr by count
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21:16 kthakore wow ...
21:16 kthakore updating parrot repo after a couple months
21:17 cotto_work yeah.  We've got some changes.
21:17 kthakore cotto_work: I saw that ... I wonder if parrotSDL broke
21:18 kthakore cotto_work: isn't NCI scheduled for workage next?
21:18 darbelo Probably.
21:18 kthakore yay!
21:18 kthakore \o/
21:18 kthakore |o/
21:18 darbelo It's one of our gsoc projects.
21:18 kthakore \o?
21:18 cotto_work no idea
21:18 kthakore darbelo: cool
21:18 kthakore darbelo: where is the guys blog so I can cyber stalk him
21:19 cotto_work It is if it becomes a pain point or if someone feels like working on it.
21:19 whiteknight joined #parrot
21:19 kthakore cotto_work: darbelo just said it was a gsoc
21:19 cotto_work That's true.
21:19 kthakore whiteknight: hola! just finished my exam finally! so I am tracking the NCI gsoc guy
21:19 darbelo I think ash_ is doing that one.
21:20 whiteknight kthakore: nice
21:20 kthakore whiteknight: and updating git-svn repo of parrot
21:20 darbelo And plobsing is mentoring him.
21:20 kthakore oh cool
21:20 whiteknight ash_ is doing it, yes.
21:20 kthakore I wonder is parrotSDL will be broke again
21:20 kthakore but then I didn't even release it yet
21:20 kthakore or get much done
21:20 cotto_work only one way to find out
21:21 kthakore cotto_work: yeah I am exploring today
21:23 kthakore s/win 2
21:33 kthakore wow
21:33 kthakore still going
21:33 kthakore did you guys rewrite all of it?
21:38 kthakore whiteknight: so ... where is ash_'s blog on NCI ?
21:38 kthakore whiteknight: also where can I learn how NCI works and junk and sutff
21:39 darbelo We have junk and suff all over the place. Pick a direction and start digging >(
21:40 darbelo ;)
21:40 * darbelo curses at his misconfigured keyboard.
21:40 kthakore darbelo: ok but where is this guys blog! ash_'s NCI gsoc stuff
21:41 cotto_work ash's blog?
21:41 kthakore yeah
21:42 cotto_work I was seeing if purl knew.
21:42 kthakore oh ok
21:43 kthakore FAIL! http://bit.ly/b4B2GP
21:43 kthakore how are people supposed to know what is being done?
21:43 kthakore man that site sucks
21:43 kthakore google should know better
21:45 kthakore is he submitting directly to trunk?
21:45 kthakore or a branch or something
21:45 GeJ Bonjour everyone.
21:46 kthakore hi GeJ
21:46 kthakore nci?
21:46 purl nci is Native Call Interface or the National Cancer Institute, a part of the NIH or national cancer institute
21:46 kthakore wowo ..
21:46 cotto_work ash's blog is http://www.parrot.org/ash
21:46 kthakore am I stupid today or waht
21:46 kthakore that should have been ovious
21:47 kthakore oh he is using libffi
21:47 kthakore cool
21:47 kthakore now where is da code!
21:48 dalek rakudo: 736bef8 | masak++ | docs/ChangeLog:
21:48 dalek rakudo: [docs/ChangeLog] some further updates
21:48 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/7​36bef8098e574f4b8067759a9d711ee6da85427
21:48 kthakore h mmm ...
21:48 darbelo I think his code is on github.
21:49 kthakore darbelo: any search terms to narrow it down?
21:49 darbelo His github id escapes me now.
21:49 cotto_work eriku iirc
21:49 darbelo Let me check in the irclogs.
21:49 kthakore wow this should really be on his blog or a wiki
21:49 kthakore or something
21:49 purl something is, like, really wrong out there :)
21:50 darbelo http://github.com/ashgti/parrot
21:50 purl http://github.com/ashgti/parrot are in there
21:50 kthakore darbelo: wow thanks
21:50 kthakore darbelo: lot harder then it should be to find this info
21:50 cotto_work ash's code?
21:50 purl ash's code is a circle
21:51 cotto_work no, ash's code is http://github.com/ashgti/parrot
21:51 purl okay, cotto_work.
21:51 darbelo The gsoc_nci branch is the one you want.
21:51 darbelo I think.
21:51 kthakore cotto_work: heh. well I was refering to a page
21:53 kthakore darbelo: how does one do multiple parrot installs
21:53 kthakore multiple parrots?
21:53 kthakore maybe a parrot brew is in order
21:54 darbelo Never tried it, but as long as you install them to different dirs, you should be fine.
21:54 kthakore darbelo: he is commiting to master
21:54 kthakore darbelo: I think I can follow most of what was done
21:55 kthakore jeez you guys have a like a million tests
21:55 kthakore darbelo: cotto_work thanks
21:58 cotto_work dukeleto, ping
21:58 eternaleye joined #parrot
21:59 cotto_work kthakore, np
22:00 dukeleto cotto_work: pong
22:00 kthakore hola dukeleto
22:00 cotto_work dukeleto, could you write a version of docs/project/branching_guide.pod for git?
22:01 dukeleto cotto_work: yes
22:01 kthakore yay! tests pass
22:01 cotto_work thanks
22:01 kthakore cotto_work: almost to finding out if parrotSDL is broken
22:01 dukeleto cotto_work: can you make a TT and assign it to me?
22:01 cotto_work not only can I, but I will
22:01 dukeleto kthakore: hello
22:01 purl what's up, dukeleto.
22:02 dukeleto kthakore: managing multiple parrots would be useful for me as well
22:03 kthakore oh yay! ... SUPER SUPER SUPER FAIL :(
22:04 kthakore dukeleto: yeah parrot-brew would be sooo nice
22:04 cotto_work http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1681
22:05 kthakore printerr changed?
22:06 kthakore printerr "Hint: create a link from libSDL-1.2..."
22:06 kthakore we need a ( now?
22:07 cotto_work It's a dynop now.
22:08 dukeleto kthakore: printerr is not loaded by default now
22:08 cotto_work .loadlib 'io_ops' #take one of these and call me in the morning
22:08 dukeleto kthakore: you can use getstderr to get the proper filehandle without loading dynops, if you want
22:08 kthakore ???
22:08 kthakore wow I am so lost now
22:09 dukeleto kthakore: .loadlib 'io_ops' is probably what you want
22:09 dukeleto kthakore: but in the case where you don't want to use dynops, there is a core op to get the stderr file handle
22:10 kthakore great! all cmod are no dynops too ...
22:10 kthakore wow
22:10 dukeleto kthakore: .loadlib 'bit_ops'
22:10 cotto_work do you use those?
22:10 kthakore it is in StopWatch.pir
22:11 kthakore dukeleto: I have a feeling I might have to start parrotSDL from scratch now
22:11 dukeleto kthakore: why so?
22:11 kthakore dukeleto: is this stuff likely to change again?
22:11 kthakore dukeleto: stopwatch.pir is pointless for a core SDL library
22:12 kthakore dukeleto: frankly the SDL pirs in parrot core are a joke
22:12 kthakore dukeleto: they expose nothing of SDL for a parrot end user
22:12 kthakore button.pir .... um no
22:12 kthakore dukeleto: and there is no configure to find SDL libraries
22:13 kthakore you can't even do export SDL_LIBS_HERE_MON
22:13 kthakore dukeleto: so that the NCI can find them
22:13 kthakore *sigh* ...
22:13 kthakore dukeleto: I need to learn PIR from scratch the new one again
22:13 dukeleto kthakore: hard to say. More things will become dynops, I highly doubt that any dynops will ever become core ops, but it could happen
22:13 kthakore right that stuff is fine
22:14 kthakore dukeleto: but the SDL/*.pir being a joke are unrelated
22:14 kthakore dukeleto: I mean you can't do anything with them right now ...
22:15 kthakore dukeleto: I might use Rect.pir and so on but the other stuff Button.pir and Stopwatch.pir are going
22:15 kthakore dukeleto: I would suggest you guys get rid of them in the trunk too
22:16 dalek TT #1681 created by cotto++: git version of branching guide
22:16 dalek TT #1681: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1681
22:16 dukeleto kthakore: if you create a TT with an explanation, we can do that stuff
22:17 kthakore dukeleto: better yet I update parrotSDL new API shortly in http://github.com/kthakore/parrotSDL and bug you guys then
22:17 kthakore dukeleto: meanwhile I should take a break after a 5 hr exam and 6 hrs of work ....
22:18 kthakore dukeleto: peace out
22:18 purl Yeah homey.. I'm outtie
22:18 kthakore cotto_work: cya thanks
22:18 kthakore whiteknight: bye
22:19 kthakore ps is there a new guide for PIR and NCI for the new parrot some place?
22:21 kthakore http://bit.ly/9LIBzS seems 15 months oldie
22:21 kthakore cotto_work: ?? doc.parrot.org is at 2.4.0 ?
22:22 kthakore no 2.5.0 doc yet?
22:22 dukeleto kthakore: bug Coke about that
22:22 dukeleto yeah, that PIR guide is pretty hoary
22:23 kthakore *sigh* ... perl6 SDL just got longer ...
22:23 cotto_work I'm capable of fixing it now.  I'll try to remember to do it when I get home tonight.
22:23 kthakore cotto_work: oh thx!
22:23 kthakore is there a section of NCI somewhere?
22:24 cotto_work docs/pdds/draft/pdd16_native_call.pod may be useful
22:24 kthakore ... ok
22:25 kthakore wow ... that was short
22:25 cotto_work the key word being "may"
22:26 * kthakore adds getting some real docs done for NCI to the list
22:26 kthakore cotto_work: I will try to doc my misadventures in perldoc format
22:27 kthakore cotto_work: do people do Doc work for parrot or am I just in a sparse land of parrot?
22:35 dalek rakudo: 22b71e0 | masak++ | docs/announce/2010.06:
22:35 dalek rakudo: [docs/announce/2010.06] added
22:35 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/2​2b71e0f33c9c0135fb7fbff849ba3ddad877709
22:42 cotto_work joined #parrot
22:43 cotto_work kthakore: people write docs when they write docs.  More is better.
22:43 kthakore cotto_work: actually more of outdated docs is never better IMO
22:43 kthakore cotto_work: more of actually updated docs for each release makes sense
22:43 cotto_work sure, but hopefully docs aren't out of date while they're being written
22:44 kthakore cotto_work: which is the point many perl5 guys make about parrot and perl6
22:44 kthakore cotto_work: you guys seem to change the syntax so often that when are we going to be sure an app written now won't work in 4 months
22:45 kthakore cotto_work: I made parrotSDL work 3 months ago .. and now it is all broken in so many ways
22:45 cotto_work That's a fair criticism.
22:45 kthakore when do you guys just say ok this is the syntax for a long term release
22:45 kthakore cotto_work: are you guys even close to that?
22:46 dalek rakudo: 8a1a1a5 | masak++ | docs/ (2 files):
22:46 dalek rakudo: [ChangeLog, announce] improvements
22:46 dalek rakudo: pmichaud++, jnthn++ for the suggestions.
22:46 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/8​a1a1a57aa50d0a44fa28bbf9b19bdf2ed9465b9
22:48 kthakore oh well it is as it is
22:48 kthakore may in another 10 years it would have stablized
22:48 kthakore cotto_work: night for now
22:50 bubaflub joined #parrot
22:50 cotto_work kthakore: night
22:52 dalek rakudo: 6b12f89 | masak++ | docs/announce/2010.06:
22:52 dalek rakudo: [announce] more fixes
22:52 dalek rakudo: jnthn++ for suggestions.
22:52 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6​b12f89d7b6defc9434fff160e994d6a70faeb59
22:55 eternaleye joined #parrot
22:58 dalek rakudo: 5eb3875 | masak++ | docs/announce/2010.06:
22:58 dalek rakudo: [announce] more recent passing-tests figure
22:58 dalek rakudo: pmichaud++ contributed it.
22:58 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/5​eb38753c19ca0bc284955019ee4a701b61904cf
23:00 cotto_work kthakore, I'd encourage you to be noisy (especially on parrot-dev) when you get bitten by backwards-incompatibility.  The better we know how our changes cause pain for users, the better we can be at avoiding that pain.
23:03 davidfetter joined #parrot
23:03 mikehh joined #parrot
23:04 dukeleto cotto_work: maybe it would be nice if we could provide a document with each release geared towards helping people update their code after deprecations
23:04 dukeleto cotto_work: for instance, DEPRECATED.pod only lists *future* deprecations, and such, it totally useless after the fact
23:05 cotto_work I was thinking something similar.  Drupal did something like that that made migrating modules between versions minimally painful.
23:10 cotto_work http://drupal.org/update/modules
23:11 eternaleye_ joined #parrot
23:11 cotto_work http://drupal.org/node/244569 is a decent example
23:14 dukeleto yeah, Parrot really needs "how to upgrage" documents. That is a big sore point with HLL devs
23:20 d4l3k_ joined #parrot
23:20 kthakore cotto_work: will do. I hope I can be noisy without being considered rude
23:21 cotto_work We'll understand if you're annoyed.
23:22 dukeleto kthakore: you are not alone, it is just that nobody has been squeaky yet
23:22 dukeleto kthakore: i will back you up on parrot-dev, no worries :)
23:23 kthakore ok
23:23 snarkyboojum joined #parrot
23:23 * kthakore feels like a goat lead to the slaughter house
23:24 cotto_work Don't.  You're developing on top of Parrot.  We want you to be happy.
23:24 kthakore then wear are my hookers?
23:25 kthakore where*
23:27 cotto_work They must have the wrong address.
23:27 cotto_work This could get awkward in a hurry.
23:28 kthakore heh
23:28 * kthakore waits patiently at his mailbox
23:29 kthakore I will make an email tonight.
23:32 darbelo I-ll start thinking up excuses.
23:51 dalek rakudo: cbff7d0 | masak++ | docs/release_guide.pod:
23:51 dalek rakudo: [docs/release_guide.pod] updates and improvements
23:51 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/c​bff7d0ccad461d51679b39ab7f04b5691e47716
23:56 * whiteknight has to merge his branch soon, now that rakudo is out
23:57 dalek rakudo: 30db218 | masak++ | build/Makefile.in:
23:57 dalek rakudo: [Makefile.in] added missing '.' in error message
23:57 dalek rakudo: review: http://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/3​0db218e6eeeb6cc56c25e6b916dbc34a524e4ee

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