Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #parrot, 2011-02-02

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:03 bacek_at_work cotto, let's switch to own dog food instead :)
00:04 bacek_at_work My YAML::Tiny is good enough already. We just have to decide where is should go "./ext" or "./runtime/parrot/library"
00:05 cotto_work bacek_at_work: +1 if it's feasible
00:05 bacek_at_work cotto_work, it should be. And I ported show_experimental to nqp already.
00:06 cotto_work It looks like it'd be a 15 second job for you or a 15 minute job for a normal person.
00:06 bacek_at_work Multi-line scalars aren't parseable yet
00:06 bacek_at_work afk # meeting for nex 6 hours
00:06 cotto_work yuck
00:07 whiteknight what we really need is a set_pointer VTABLE on the PackFile PMC
00:08 cotto_work bacek_at_work: can you nopaste your port or show_experimental?
00:08 whiteknight and then we need to actually mark the PackFile* in PackFile.mark
00:09 cotto_work dukeleto: is there a nice way to move an external project into parrot.git while preserving history?
00:10 sheant left #parrot
00:10 whiteknight cant you use a submodule?
00:10 * cotto_work decommutes
00:24 dalek parrot: 78d1638 | NotFound++ | t/op/stringu.t:
00:24 dalek parrot: set_addr -> set_label, TT #1857
00:24 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/78d1638ef9
00:29 knewt left #parrot
00:30 knewt joined #parrot
00:30 kid51_at_dinner is now known as kid51
00:33 knewt left #parrot
00:33 knewt joined #parrot
00:34 tcurtis joined #parrot
00:34 tcurtis left #parrot
00:37 dalek parrot: 8f3e664 | NotFound++ | compilers/pct/src/PAST/Compiler.pir:
00:37 dalek parrot: set_addr -> set_label in PAST, TT #1857
00:37 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/8f3e664459
00:40 cotto ~~
00:41 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: efd80f0 | NotFound++ | tools/dev/show_deprecated.pl:
00:41 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: show something meaningful for deprecation notices without eligible or ticket fields
00:41 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/efd80f03b4
00:41 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: 2cdf5dd | nwellnhof++ | / (2 files):
00:41 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: Add some debug output to IPv6 test
00:41 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/2cdf5dd565
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: a35f817 | nwellnhof++ | / (5 files):
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: Remove support for deprecated charset:encoding:"" literals
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc:
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: TT #1808
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/a35f817a34
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: 693ddea | pmichaud++ | compilers/pct/src/POST/Node.pir:
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: [pct]:  TT #821 -- Allow POST::Sub to handle parameters :slurpy + :optional and :slurpy + :named + :optional (by treating them as though :optional is not present, as recommended in the ticket).
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/693ddea46e
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: d774533 | pmichaud++ | / (5 files):
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: Merge branch 'master' of github.com:parrot/parrot
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/d77453355e
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: 78d1638 | NotFound++ | t/op/stringu.t:
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: set_addr -> set_label, TT #1857
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/78d1638ef9
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: 4a37c23 | Whiteknight++ | / (113 files):
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: merge in from master
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/4a37c23015
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: 0d3be41 | Whiteknight++ | compilers/imcc/pbc.c:
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: update some uses of interp in imcc to imcc->interp
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/0d3be41cd0
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: acf50a1 | Whiteknight++ | compilers/imcc/pbc.c:
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: fix a boo-boo I just made
00:42 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/acf50a12e2
00:42 whiteknight ...I hope it doesn't list every commit in the merge
00:52 extreme left #parrot
00:56 bacek_at_work cotto, http://nopaste.snit.ch/29613
00:57 cotto bacek_at_work, thanks.  I'll add that later tonight
00:58 whiteknight ha, as soon as I send out that email I fix it so the test suite runs again
00:59 whiteknight it's a massacre, but it runs
00:59 cotto wfm
00:59 cotto ;)
01:00 whiteknight all the tests for IMCC, which expect very specific types of behaviors, are all broked
01:00 cotto maybe they need a hug
01:05 whiteknight a big, angry, violent hug
01:06 cotto yeah, one of those
01:06 whiteknight minus the hug
01:12 dalek parrot: 1b1f6f7 | nwellnhof++ | / (3 files):
01:12 dalek parrot: Work around GC problem in embed API
01:12 dalek parrot:
01:12 dalek parrot: Cherry-picked from branch gc_dynamic_threshold on bacek's request.
01:12 dalek parrot: See TT #1990
01:12 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/1b1f6f7019
01:12 dalek parrot: 0d912d7 | nwellnhof++ | src/pmc/sockaddr.pmc:
01:12 dalek parrot: Fix GCC warning
01:12 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/0d912d7b13
01:14 extreme joined #parrot
01:15 nwellnhof parrot compiles for me without any warnings, bacek++
01:24 bacek_at_work nwellnhof, :)
01:24 bacek_at_work cotto, it should be "//" instead of "||" in show_experimental.nqp
01:24 bacek_at_work cotto, %e<note> || '';
01:25 cotto noted
01:25 cotto bacek_at_work, is pirate self-hosting?
01:25 * cotto forgot
01:26 cotto and is there a nice way to build a self hosted version
01:32 dalek winxed: r769 | NotFound++ | trunk/winxed.winxed:
01:32 dalek winxed: refactor options handling and some other minor changes in non installed driver
01:32 dalek winxed: review: http://code.google.com/p/w​inxed/source/detail?r=769
01:32 dmalcolm left #parrot
01:33 dalek tracwiki: v15 | nwellnhof++ | BuildWarnings
01:33 dalek tracwiki: Resolved by bacek++
01:33 dalek tracwiki: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/Bui​ldWarnings?version=15&amp;action=diff
02:05 bacek_mobile joined #parrot
02:05 bacek_mobile Cotto, not yet
02:06 cotto bacek_mobile, ok
02:07 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: 9efe75c | Whiteknight++ | frontend/parrot/main.c:
02:07 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: Fix pasm files and preprocessing
02:07 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc:
02:07 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: Differentiate between .pasm files and other input files. Call the PASM compiler for the first set, PIR compiler for everything else. Also, implement preprocessing with the -E option
02:07 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/9efe75c705
02:11 whiteknight I can't wait till this branch works
02:11 whiteknight it's going to be awesome
02:11 whiteknight AWESOME I say
02:15 mikehh All tests PASS (pre/post-config, make corevm/make coretest, smoke (#6859) fulltest) at 3_0_0-371-g0d912d7 - Ubuntu 10.10 i386 (g++-4.5)
02:16 mikehh whiteknight: think it will be ready for 3.1?
02:17 whiteknight mikehh: It's ready now, if you don't mind ~200 test failures, and a failure to complete the build, and codestd failures which would be dubbed a "crime against C"
02:18 mikehh whiteknight: ha, I will give it a go a bit later
02:18 whiteknight I always appreciate it
02:19 whiteknight I've been moving so fast just to get the code prototyped and reprototyped that I've been cutting corners
02:25 cotto is there any reason to use YAML::Tiny as a submodule rather than moving it into runtime/parrot/library ?
02:26 nwellnhof left #parrot
02:29 bacek_mobile Cotto, flip the coin :)
02:29 cotto what's tails mean?
02:29 cotto ;)
02:30 cotto dukeleto, ping
02:32 bacek_mobile Tails for import into :)
02:33 cotto I suppose I should install git-achievements before attempting this.
02:35 bacek_mobile Achivement unlocked :)
02:37 cotto You currently have: 1 achievements
02:40 whiteknight left #parrot
02:41 Kristaba left #parrot
02:41 KaeseEs now all that remains is to write a git plugin for steam
02:48 bacek_mobile left #parrot
02:49 cotto is there a better way to merge the projects than pulling and moving the files into the right places?
03:05 kid51 left #parrot
03:11 extreme left #parrot
03:11 extreme joined #parrot
03:21 plobsing cotto: you could graft the other project's history into parrot's. that only really makes sense if we are going to be absorbing in stead of referencing it (not sure where we're going with this)
03:22 cotto I'm leaning toward absorbing.
03:22 bacek_at_work plobsing, consume :)
03:22 adu left #parrot
03:32 cotto the test seems to be going into an infinite loop
03:32 bacek_at_work cotto, "make reconfig" usually helps.
03:34 cotto magic fiddling fixed it
03:34 cotto go figure
03:38 * cotto wonders what passover has to do with roadmap goals
03:40 plobsing there may be fewer available tuits due to religious observances and family gatherings?
03:41 KaeseEs does a tuit ~~ a developer-hour?
03:41 cotto KaeseEs, it comes from the expression "when I get around to it"
03:42 cotto it's essentially usable hacker time
03:42 KaeseEs oh ho ho
03:42 cotto now you know
03:43 plobsing KaeseEs: however there are different grades. do not get ripped off with the square ones. only round tuits are good.
03:43 KaeseEs i'm torn between the nbc "the more you know" and the bill nye "now you know" sfx playing in my head
03:44 dalek Heuristic branch merge: pushed 30 commits to parrot/yaml-tiny-import by cotto
03:44 cotto 30?
03:45 cotto ah.  That includes bacek's history too
03:45 cotto stupid commit-stealing bot
03:48 plobsing heuristic branch merged saved this channel's remaining shards of sanity
03:49 bacek left #parrot
03:49 cotto plobsing, that too
04:14 KaeseEs looks like i can get a fair amount of work done in 750us, hooray! now to read some more of bacon's stuff
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: ed5319a | cotto++ | tools/dev/show_experimental.nqp:
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: add show_experimental.nqp from bacek++
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/ed5319afc6
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: d775ac6 | cotto++ | t/library/yaml_tiny.t:
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: add a test to parse api.yaml
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/d775ac6e5e
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: b04920b | cotto++ | api.yaml:
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: fix eligibility good in api.yaml
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/b04920bbdd
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: 78dfa4d | cotto++ | tools/dev/show_experimental.nqp:
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: add a fix mentioned by bacek++
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/78dfa4daf2
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: 87a5cc1 | cotto++ | tools/dev/show_deprecated.nqp:
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: add nqp port of show_deprecated
04:15 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/87a5cc11e6
04:16 KaeseEs bacek_at_work: is there a branch that has a partial implementation of the sweepless gc bit from the wiki?  (don't wanna step on anyone's toes)
04:18 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: 96eb8d0 | cotto++ | t (4 files):
04:18 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: remove perl versions of show_* and tests
04:18 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/96eb8d0634
04:18 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: 86347b1 | cotto++ | MANIFEST:
04:18 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: manifix
04:18 dalek parrot/yaml-tiny-import: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/86347b1355
04:26 plobsing msg whiteknight: the current build failures in imcc_compreg are due to no longer setting up a context (IMCC abused the current context for constant folding) our alternatives, as I see them, are restore the IMCC context manipulation you've removed OR us constant unfolding (for which there is a prototype waiting in a branch) so that we no longer need the context-abusive constant folder
04:26 aloha OK. I'll deliver the message.
04:27 cotto It makes me sad that I know the opsc tests by how slowly they run.
04:27 plobsing it makes me sad that I know the opsc tests by how frequently I have to update their ops counts.
04:27 dalek parrot: afda976 | cotto++ | / (5 files):
04:27 dalek parrot: Merge branch 'master' of git://github.com/bacek/YAML--Tiny into yaml-tiny-import
04:27 dalek parrot:
04:27 dalek parrot: Conflicts:
04:27 dalek parrot: README
04:27 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/afda976d5e
04:27 dalek parrot: 1429108 | cotto++ | / (7 files):
04:27 dalek parrot: shuffle files around, move yaml_ok into yaml_tiny.t
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/1429108956
04:28 dalek parrot: d3f8921 | cotto++ | config/gen/makefiles/root.in:
04:28 dalek parrot: update makefile template for YAML::Tiny
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/d3f892122a
04:28 dalek parrot: ee1f42b | cotto++ | / (2 files):
04:28 dalek parrot: fix makefile template, add magic to make test pass
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/ee1f42bd2b
04:28 dalek parrot: ed5319a | cotto++ | tools/dev/show_experimental.nqp:
04:28 dalek parrot: add show_experimental.nqp from bacek++
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/ed5319afc6
04:28 dalek parrot: d775ac6 | cotto++ | t/library/yaml_tiny.t:
04:28 dalek parrot: add a test to parse api.yaml
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/d775ac6e5e
04:28 dalek parrot: b04920b | cotto++ | api.yaml:
04:28 dalek parrot: fix eligibility good in api.yaml
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/b04920bbdd
04:28 dalek parrot: 78dfa4d | cotto++ | tools/dev/show_experimental.nqp:
04:28 dalek parrot: add a fix mentioned by bacek++
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/78dfa4daf2
04:28 dalek parrot: 87a5cc1 | cotto++ | tools/dev/show_deprecated.nqp:
04:28 dalek parrot: add nqp port of show_deprecated
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/87a5cc11e6
04:28 dalek parrot: 96eb8d0 | cotto++ | t (4 files):
04:28 dalek parrot: remove perl versions of show_* and tests
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/96eb8d0634
04:28 dalek parrot: 86347b1 | cotto++ | MANIFEST:
04:28 dalek parrot: manifix
04:28 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/86347b1355
04:28 cotto Where's that heuristic, again?
04:29 plobsing heuristic is just a fancy way of saying it doesn't work
04:32 dalek parrot: b7cf765 | cotto++ | MANIFEST.generated:
04:32 dalek parrot: add YAML/Tiny.pbc to MANIFEST.generated
04:32 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/b7cf765f3c
04:32 cotto that's enough out of me
04:32 cotto for now
04:36 cotto msg pmichaud Your build should be back to normal now.
04:36 aloha OK. I'll deliver the message.
04:38 cotto seen gerd
04:38 aloha gerd was last seen in #parrot 3 days 8 hours ago joining the channel.
04:42 dalek TT #1993 closed by cotto++: New api.yaml tests require YAML.pm and List::MoreUtils.pm
04:42 dalek TT #1993: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1993
05:06 bacek_at_work cotto, ping
05:07 ttbot Parrot 99576e15 MSWin32-x86-multi-thread make error http://tt.taptinder.org/file/cmdout/4137.txt (http://tt.taptinder.org/buildstatus/pr-Parrot)
05:08 dalek parrot: 9df28c8 | cotto++ | lib/Parrot/Pmc2c/ (2 files):
05:08 dalek parrot: avoid a rare VTABLE struct leak, fixing tt #898
05:08 dalek parrot:
05:08 dalek parrot: When a dynpmc calls a dynpmc parent's VTABLE function via SUPER, don't
05:08 dalek parrot: leak a VTABLE struct.  This doesn't happen very often.
05:08 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/9df28c8152
05:08 cotto bacek_at_work, pong
05:09 bacek_at_work cotto, what is new policy to remove items from api.yaml?
05:09 bacek_at_work pmichaud++ closed quite few tickets
05:09 bacek_at_work And we probably can create automated tools to clean up api.yaml
05:09 cotto bacek_at_work, mark them as "old"
05:10 bacek_at_work cotto, ok.
05:10 cotto bacek_at_work, that's the point.
05:10 cotto It'll be great.
05:12 cotto It feels good to finally get that ticket closed.
05:12 cotto chromatic++ for the suggestion
05:15 dalek TT #898 closed by cotto++: r40313 introduces a memory leak
05:15 dalek TT #898: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/898
05:32 dalek TT #276 closed by cotto++: t/dynpmc/foo fails
05:32 dalek TT #276: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/276
05:42 cotto Wow.  Adding a pir-level backtrace to Parrot_confess is a pretty huge yak.
05:43 cotto Step 2: add INTERP to every use of PARROT_ASSERT, PARROT_ASSERT_ARG, PARROT_FAILURE and PARROT_ASSERT_MESSAGE.
05:46 cotto That code doesn't get to make as many assumptions as I'd like.
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06:00 rurban_ is now known as rurban
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06:13 bacek_at_work cotto, still around?
06:14 bacek_at_work bacek@illusion:~/src/parrot$ ./parrot-nqp tools/dev/resolve_deprecated.nqp
06:14 bacek_at_work Ticket https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/843 is closed and can be marked ad 'old'
06:14 bacek_at_work Ticket https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1628 is closed and can be marked ad 'old'
06:14 bacek_at_work Ticket https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/103 is closed and can be marked ad 'old'
06:14 bacek_at_work Ticket https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/868 is closed and can be marked ad 'old'
06:14 bacek_at_work Ticket https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1628 is closed and can be marked ad 'old'
06:14 bacek_at_work Ticket https://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1635 is closed and can be marked ad 'old'
06:14 dalek parrot: 26d115c | bacek++ | tools/dev/resolve_deprecated.nqp:
06:14 dalek parrot: Semi-automated deprecations resolver.
06:14 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/26d115c30f
06:14 bacek_at_work Right after my latest commit :)
06:14 bacek_at_work Meh, typo...
06:17 dalek parrot: 8bf4af9 | bacek++ | tools/dev/resolve_deprecated.nqp:
06:17 dalek parrot: Fix typo and add commented out YAML::Dumper sample.
06:17 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/8bf4af96f2
06:20 cotto bacek_at_work, yup
06:20 cotto shiny
06:20 bacek_at_work cotto, we do need YAML::Tiny.dump
06:20 cotto bacek++
06:21 cotto I like your laziness
06:22 cotto though before that spreads too far, I want to use "completed" or something more intuitive than "old"
06:22 bacek_at_work *
06:22 cotto If only there were a way to do that through some sort of automatic conversion.
06:22 cotto *?
06:23 bacek_at_work "whatever" (old vs completed) :)
06:23 bacek_at_work map( -> $_ { $_ eq 'old' ?? 'completed' !! $_ }, @tags)
06:23 bacek_at_work right after implementing YAML::Tiny.dump
06:24 bacek_at_work .write_string actually
06:26 sorear bacek_at_work: how essential is POST going to become?
06:26 bacek_at_work sorear, in my dreams? Official way of generating PBC.
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06:31 cotto sounds fun
06:31 cotto What about YAML::Dumper?
06:32 jsut left #parrot
06:32 bacek_at_work It puts types into yaml.
06:32 bacek_at_work E.g. "!Hash { ... }"
06:32 bacek_at_work which is legal YAML.
06:32 bacek_at_work But useless for api.yaml
06:34 cotto ok
06:34 dukeleto ~~
06:34 cotto hio dukeleto
06:35 cotto dukeleto, does the gcc compile farm have any ppc machines?  We have some pcc-specific bugs.
06:35 dukeleto cotto: well, there is one under my desk
06:36 cotto is it smoking?
06:37 dukeleto cotto: nope, turned off
06:37 cotto too depressing?
06:37 dukeleto cotto: nah, it has a loud fan but otherwise is a decent machine. it is my old work desktop G5
06:38 * dukeleto presses the ON button
06:38 cotto BOOM
06:39 dukeleto cotto: also, i saw on the farm mailing list that they are buying some darwin machines, but they currently don't have any operational
06:39 cotto ok
06:41 dukeleto cotto: is there a TT ?
06:41 dukeleto cotto: it will take some time to get the machine in smoking order
06:42 cotto http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1813 for one
06:42 * dukeleto remembers that he unplugged the keyboard/mouse/monitor and all that jazz
06:43 cotto I'll start tagging them as I see them.  Trac's search is braindead.
06:44 dukeleto cotto: you can assign ppc stuff to me, if you want
06:44 cotto wfm
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06:53 cotto This is probably insane, but I thought I'd bounce it off someone.
06:53 cotto There's a ticket open to get pir backtraces when a assertion failure is triggered.  This is tricky because an interp isn't always available and there's none being passed to ASSERT_*().
06:53 cotto What about adding a static INTERP* variable, initializing/clearing it in make_interpreter/Parrot_really_destroy and using that static variable for backtraces if it's non-null?
06:54 cotto I'm inclined not to do it, but I thought I'd give the idea some air before putting it down.
06:56 dalek parrot: a65c158 | bacek++ | runtime/parrot/library/YAML/Tiny.pm:
06:56 dalek parrot: Quick hack to write_string from YAML::Tiny.
06:56 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/a65c158bf3
06:56 dalek parrot: 161effc | bacek++ | tools/dev/resolve_deprecated.nqp:
06:56 dalek parrot: Update api.yaml and write it back.
06:56 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/161effc661
06:56 dalek parrot: e46cb83 | bacek++ | runtime/parrot/library/YAML/Tiny.pm:
06:56 dalek parrot: Remove debug output from YAML::Tiny._dump
06:56 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/e46cb831d5
06:56 dalek parrot: d674bf5 | bacek++ | runtime/parrot/library/YAML/Tiny.pm:
06:56 dalek parrot: Quote string dumped from YAML::Tiny
06:56 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/d674bf57b1
06:56 dalek parrot: 70a9039 | bacek++ | runtime/parrot/library/YAML/Tiny.pm:
06:56 dalek parrot: Format yaml without extra spaces.
06:56 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/70a9039232
06:56 dalek parrot: deb1231 | bacek++ | api.yaml:
06:56 dalek parrot: First self-hosted api.yaml
06:56 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/deb123171e
06:56 dalek parrot: fbfc2a8 | bacek++ | tools/dev/resolve_deprecated.nqp:
06:56 dalek parrot: Add some progress indication.
06:57 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/fbfc2a8be6
06:57 bacek_at_work cotto, hooray :)
06:57 cotto Is that an actual port of write_string?
06:57 * cotto looks
06:58 cotto I love multis
06:58 cotto bacek_at_work, how complete is that?
06:59 sorear cotto: it's totally reasonable to stash the current interp in TLS.  Mono does that.
07:00 sorear bacek_at_work: Yeah I've read some of your notes... wondering if there is any sane possibility of bypassing POST and directly calling into packfiles
07:02 cotto sorear, that's what make_hello_pbc.pir does.
07:07 cotto especially as the packfile pmcs mature, there's no reason why that wouldn't work.  POST is just a nice interface for describing what to do with the pmcs.
07:13 bacek_at_work cotto, "complete"? Good enough for api.yaml turn-around :)
07:14 cotto That's probably what I was asking.
07:16 bacek_at_work <dalek> parrot: deb1231 | bacek++ | api.yaml:
07:16 bacek_at_work <dalek> parrot: First self-hosted api.yaml
07:16 bacek_at_work parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/deb123171e
07:16 bacek_at_work :)
07:16 cotto I saw.  Nice work.
07:16 bacek_at_work It's parsed-and-dumped api.yaml via YAML::TIny
07:19 cotto this opens up whole new worlds of laziness for us
07:19 bacek_at_work Indeed :)
07:19 cotto dukeleto will be quite happy, I'm sure
07:19 dukeleto bacek_at_work: nice work
07:20 cotto I
07:20 cotto I'd better change "old" to "completed" while it's still possible.
07:21 dukeleto bacek_at_work: my tools had tests, and you delete them and don't write tests for yours? Bad form, mate.
07:21 dukeleto (even if they were horribly simple tests)
07:21 bacek_at_work dukeleto, it wasn't me. Blame cotto, mate :)
07:22 dukeleto bacek_at_work: i just want tests that will fail if api.yaml isn't valid yaml. is that so much to ask?
07:23 cotto dukeleto, the current test fails if api.yaml is bad
07:23 cotto I figured that was all you cared about.
07:23 dukeleto cotto: what test?
07:24 cotto t/library/yaml_tiny.t
07:24 dukeleto t/library/yaml_tiny.t ?
07:24 dukeleto ah, ok
07:24 dukeleto just saw that
07:24 dukeleto cotto: ok, i retract my sarcasm :)
07:25 dukeleto it is nice to see the deprecation data being used
07:25 cotto dukeleto, is api.yaml documented anywhere?
07:26 dukeleto cotto: a few files name it as the place that deprecated/experimental stuff lives, but nothing documents the policy of how to update it
07:26 dukeleto cotto: we need those docs
07:26 cotto yup
07:26 dukeleto cotto: which describe to change a dep to "completed" instead of removing it
07:27 dukeleto cotto: feel free to write the docs, or assign me a TT to do it. But you have to decide where the docs live, because that is too hard :)
07:28 dalek parrot: 644b7ad | cotto++ | / (4 files):
07:28 dalek parrot: change "old" to "completed" in api.yaml.
07:29 dalek parrot:
07:29 dalek parrot: We have lots of old deprecations that aren't completed.  Hopefully this
07:29 dalek parrot: is more intuitive.
07:29 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/644b7ad3a6
07:29 cotto dukeleto, exactly.  bacek_at_work asked about that earlier this evening.
07:30 cotto dukeleto, right next to our docs on debugging Parrot.
07:30 ingy hi dukeleto
07:30 ingy what's shakin?
07:32 dukeleto ingy: howdy!
07:33 dukeleto ingy: we just got a YAML::Tiny in Parrot, which is probably the disturbance in the force that you sensed with your Ingy-sense
07:33 ingy nice!
07:34 dukeleto ingy: what brings you around these parts?
07:34 ingy my irssi-sense more like it :)
07:34 dukeleto ingy: ah, yes
07:34 ingy i blink on terms like yaml
07:34 ingy just happened to have a problem that needed irc
07:34 dukeleto ingy: what have you been hacking on lately?
07:35 ingy Cog
07:35 dukeleto ingy: is this related to Cobol on Cogs?
07:35 ingy :P
07:35 ingy no
07:35 ingy it's a futuristic app/webapp framework
07:36 ingy really an information framework
07:36 ingy but one step at a time
07:36 ingy as a nice aside it is turning out to be the world's fastest webapp framework
07:37 ingy I have never been keen on speed
07:37 ingy but it's cool
07:37 * ingy is a speed freak
07:37 dukeleto ingy: i have been using django lately, and i am impressed at the automatically generated admin interface for database elements
07:37 dukeleto ingy: i don't think and perl web framework has that
07:38 ingy mmm
07:38 ingy that's a big part of cog actually
07:40 ingy data is typed objects. objects have cog schema class-like definitions. schema objects can generate perl code, python code, js code or admin interfaces :)
07:41 dukeleto ingy: i like it
07:41 bacek_at_work what about generating on ponies? It's last bit in my World Domination project!
07:41 bacek_at_work :)
07:41 dukeleto bacek_at_work: ponies are generated dynamically at run-time
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07:42 dukeleto bacek_at_work: via pony-passing-style
07:42 bacek_at_work Hey, are ponies enclosed? How you can implement pps without proper enclosure???
07:42 dukeleto ingy: what is Cog written in?
07:42 bacek_at_work dukeleto, perl. http://search.cpan.org/~ingy/Cog-0.05/lib/Cog.pm
07:42 dukeleto bacek_at_work: well, assume that a pony is a frictionless sphere. The proof is trivial.
07:44 dukeleto ingy: which confs will you be at this year?
07:48 cotto nice to see something from austin_hastings
07:52 ingy dukeleto: OSDC::Taiwan and probably YAPC::NA
07:56 dukeleto ingy: cool. i will hopefully see you at YAPC::NA. I am still thinking about YAPC::EU
08:04 dukeleto for those into Javascript: http://javascriptweekly.com/
08:05 cotto dukeleto, looks interesting
08:07 dukeleto cotto: i am a sucker for free, useful, curated info
08:07 cotto +1
08:18 dalek TT #1995 created by gerd++: building a new release is broken; seem to be: "ops2c" is broken
08:18 dalek TT #1995: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1995
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09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 847eb47 | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Allocate/free work_list for each collecting cycle.
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc:
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: work_list can grow dramatically when we collect very old generation.
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/847eb47bbf
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: eeba54f | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Reorder stats/checks to provide stats before check.
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/eeba54f5de
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: fc8aa8d | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: One more fix for manipulating Pointer_Arrays
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/fc8aa8d057
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 704ee69 | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Stylish changes of variable name for consistency.
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/704ee69f9f
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 54a464b | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Switch from assert to condition in seal_object.
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc:
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: We can call seal_object for already sealed objects. E.g. when we
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: propogate from gen1 to gen2.
09:52 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/54a464b1bf
10:44 dalek parrot: 29d2c10 | mikehh++ | MANIFEST:
10:44 dalek parrot: re-generate MANIFEST
10:44 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/29d2c10d79
10:44 dalek parrot: fbe4dd5 | mikehh++ | runtime/parrot/library/YAML/Tiny.pm:
10:44 dalek parrot: missing copyright and fix cuddled else failure
10:44 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/fbe4dd5056
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11:40 dalek parrot: 393bb6d | mikehh++ | t/library/yaml_tiny.t:
11:40 dalek parrot: change shebang line so it does not require an installed nqp
11:40 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/393bb6da84
11:40 dalek parrot: 9a5e8bb | mikehh++ | t/codingstd/perlcritic.t:
11:40 dalek parrot: modify ingnore of nqp shebang
11:40 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/9a5e8bbbb3
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11:44 mikehh bah - s/ingnore/ignore/ in last commit
11:54 whiteknight good morning, #parrot
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13:16 Coke (git submodules) I keep hearing how much these suck.
13:23 atrodo I find them useful, but not quite as awesome as I think they should be
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15:03 * Coke TL;DR's kid51's post.
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15:28 whiteknight good morning, #parrot
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15:32 pmichaud good morning
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15:42 plobsing ping whiteknight
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15:45 whiteknight pong
15:45 plobsing how do you want to resolve the constant folder contexts issue?
15:46 whiteknight I'm not sure what that issue is
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15:47 plobsing it is the segfault building library/Archive/Zip.pbc. the context doesn't have the appropriate registers because IMCC is no longer creating and pushing its own context
15:48 plobsing the constant folder is "clever" and executes individual ops with registers it populates manually
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15:51 whiteknight oh, constant folding ops. Right
15:51 whiteknight I thought you were talking about a filesystem folder
15:52 whiteknight I was trying to add context-building wrappers to the IMCCompiler invoke vtable, and the Parrot_compile_file function
15:52 whiteknight so they were building wrapper context with 3,3,3,3 registers
15:52 whiteknight so either I'm not building those contexts like I thought I was, or they are not being found by IMCC
15:53 whiteknight as a sanity check, can we disable the constant folder? If so, does the build/test suite fair any better?
15:54 plobsing the constant folder is required to compile PIR. all-const-inputs ops don't get generated by opsc (because they don't really make sense).
15:54 whiteknight right, that's what I thought
15:55 whiteknight okay. I'm firing up my VM now. I think I am definitely creating contexts for IMCC to use. We need to make sure those are the right ones being found by IMCC
15:55 plobsing I created a constant UNfolder which fills the same role (it is slightly more general), without playing games with contexts
15:55 whiteknight where is that?
15:55 plobsing in constant_unfolding branch
15:56 plobsing the intent was to cut back on the ops required (by eliminating some const-variants), but I got pushback on that, so it never got merged
15:57 whiteknight that's a shame
15:58 plobsing not really, it wasn't much work
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15:58 whiteknight still, it sounds like it could have had nice benefit
15:59 plobsing nah. after dynops_mapping, ops cost less.
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16:00 plobsing and there's the issue of going through all the ops and determining which const-variant ops are not much of a win
16:01 plobsing labour intensive, for little gain.
16:01 plobsing but it does provide a nice alternative to the constant folder, whose context-games I've never been fond.
16:02 whiteknight okay, it looks like I never added in the code to push a new context in IMCCompiler.invoke
16:02 whiteknight I definitely was playing with it last night, I might not have pushed it
16:06 dukeleto ~~
16:08 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: 99e9640 | Whiteknight++ | src/pmc/imccompiler.pmc:
16:09 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: create a new context for IMCC to use
16:09 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/99e9640699
16:11 whiteknight plobsing: either that doesn't fix it, or that exposes a different problem.
16:11 pmichaud ...that's very strange, I received kid51's message as a private message to me from kid51, not as a parrot-dev post.
16:12 whiteknight plobsing: no, definitely different problem. This is a segfault I was seeing yesterday in PCC for some reason
16:14 whiteknight raw_sig, an FIA, has a null ->data field coming in to fill_params
16:15 cotto_work ~~
16:15 plobsing that is odd. I don't think IMCC fiddles with the internals of FIAs
16:16 cotto_work seen gerd
16:16 aloha gerd was last seen in #parrot 3 days 19 hours ago joining the channel.
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16:16 pmichaud and apparently kid51's isp is blocking email from my servers... :(
16:16 whiteknight plobsing: It's a signature FIA, those are generated and stored as constants, right?
16:16 whiteknight maybe the PMCs in the PackFile are getting collected
16:17 plobsing whiteknight: that is entirely possible
16:17 plobsing we could attach mark routines to the structs we use to pass those around
16:17 whiteknight imcc is returning raw PackFile* structures. the IMCC compreg is wrapping them up int Eval PMCs, which should be marking I think
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16:19 whiteknight and I am disabling GC before entering IMCC, and reenabling it after we exit IMCC
16:19 plobsing whiteknight: before or after those are rooted in the eval PMC?
16:19 whiteknight I unblock GC after building the Eval PMC with the PackFile
16:21 whiteknight https://github.com/parrot/parrot/blo​b/99e9640699a5f0bf1d55a5e6433e8f5b12​c56183/src/pmc/imccompiler.pmc#L31
16:22 whiteknight it's ugly now while I'm getting the logic in place. It will be refactored eventually
16:25 plobsing I'm still having the context issue
16:29 plobsing IMCCompiler.compile_file() does not do the appropriate amount of setup
16:29 plobsing nor does IMCCompiler.eval() it would seem.
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16:31 dukeleto cotto_work: pong
16:37 * cotto_work tries to remember when he pinged
16:38 dukeleto cotto_work: i think it was about putting yaml-tiny in a submodule
16:38 cotto_work dukeleto: that seems to be the case.  I just pulled it directly in.
16:40 dukeleto cotto_work: simpler, for now
16:40 dukeleto cotto_work: does that mean i should get rid of the parrot/yaml-tiny repo ?
16:40 whiteknight plobsing: No, those other methods are very rough prototypes and are not used yet.
16:40 cotto_work yes
16:41 plobsing whiteknight: I see that method in my backtrace. it *is* being used
16:41 whiteknight oh wait, yes. compile_file is used during the frontend
16:41 whiteknight the other methods are not
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16:42 whiteknight let me add in the context nonsense to that method
16:43 whiteknight the interface between IMCC and the rest of libparrot was far too messy, clearly
16:44 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: c8f4100 | Whiteknight++ | src/pmc/imccompiler.pmc:
16:44 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: add context setup/teardown in IMCCompiler.compile_file
16:44 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/c8f4100679
16:44 whiteknight looks like we're getting a similar segfault still
16:44 whiteknight yep, same segfault
16:46 plobsing are we looking at the same thing? it built for me.
16:47 whiteknight I am getting a segfault in ops2c
16:49 whiteknight ./ops2c --dynamic src/dynoplibs/trans.ops --quiet
16:49 plobsing wfm
16:50 whiteknight well, blah
16:51 whiteknight what platform you on?
16:53 plobsing x86_64 linux
17:01 whiteknight that's where I am
17:02 whiteknight ./ops2c --dynamic src/dynoplibs/trans.ops --quiet
17:02 whiteknight make: *** [src/dynoplibs/trans_ops.c] Segmentation fault
17:02 whiteknight that's what I get after a realclean and a make
17:04 plobsing realcleaning now
17:09 plobsing make -j3 realclean; parrot-config; make -j3 # completes no issues here
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17:13 whiteknight major wtf
17:13 whiteknight do you have any uncommitted changes?
17:13 whiteknight or any unpushed ones?
17:15 plobsing not anything beyond what lex/yacc did on their own
17:16 plobsing I have an update for some tests (because I see a bunch of them failing)
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17:17 plobsing any idea why imcc->frames would not be populated? that seems to be related a number of segfaulty tests.
17:18 sorear once you figure out why imcc is scrambling memory, you might be able to get rid of the GC disable calls
17:19 plobsing nope, that's still pretty far off. the reason IMCC disables GC is that there are a number of places where it keeps PMCs under hash-allocated structs.
17:19 plobsing s/hash-allocated/heap-allocated/
17:29 tadzik ~~
17:29 whiteknight I call the new imcc_reset function a lot to reset the imcc info struct to after it's been used for a compilation
17:29 whiteknight doing that seems to fix some failures
17:32 whiteknight probably not the best for reentrancy
17:37 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: f9fff95 | plobsing++ | t/pmc/pmc.t:
17:37 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: skip arg-less-init IMCCompiler test (requires int for init)
17:37 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/f9fff95350
17:37 whiteknight I definitely fixed that same test last night
17:37 whiteknight I must not have pushed a whole batch of commits
17:38 plobsing imcc_reset() would definitely precipitate the issues I am seeing
17:38 cotto_work Is there a simple way to purposefully trigger an assertion failure from pir?
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17:39 plobsing cotto_work: that would be a bug in parrot. assertions are only active in debug builds. if it were possible to violate the assumptions in the assertion from PIR, it should be a runtime check, not an assertion.
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17:40 dukeleto cotto_work: do something wrong :)
17:41 plobsing you could NCI a function which uses ASSERT_ARGS and call it with nulls where they shouldn't go
17:41 plobsing but such a test would segfault on debug builds
17:41 pmichaud you could add an assert dynop :-)
17:42 plobsing whiteknight: could you make sure you have all of your work pushed before I make any more duplicated efforts?
17:42 pmichaud maybe even add it to debug.ops
17:43 cotto_work pmichaud: that doesn't strike me as a bad idea.
17:43 pmichaud it doesn't?  Sorry about that.  :)
17:43 pmichaud I'll try to come with badder ideas in the future :)
17:43 pmichaud *come up with
17:44 cotto_work My idea was much worse.  I added a special case to sleep so that sleep 1234 asserts 0,
17:45 NotFound The ASSERT_ARGS is supposed to check that the functions are never called that way. Calling such functions via NCI from random places defeat that purpose.
17:45 pmichaud Since we have dynops, we might as well make good use of them :-)
17:45 cotto_work or bad use
17:45 pmichaud or that :)
17:46 NotFound If the invalid call comes from valid pir, either the assertion is wrong or the code that uses the function should check before.
17:47 plobsing I agree with NotFound. PIR should not be able to trigger assertions.
17:47 NotFound wrong -> non null decorating mistake.
17:48 cotto_work In this case I'm just using it to check code for tt #1273,
17:48 sorear can't PIR currently trigger segfaults?
17:48 NotFound sorear: supposig that bugs doesn't exist, never.
17:49 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: 6421774 | cotto++ | / (3 files):
17:49 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: first shot at pir backtraces for assertion failures
17:49 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash:
17:50 NotFound We uses to have the hcf opcode to abort, but we got rid of it because of misinterpretations.
17:50 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: There are no guarantees about these since assertion failures by
17:50 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: definition result from some kind of unexpected internal state.  In the
17:50 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: worst case this won't provide less debugging information than we already
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17:50 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: do, and I try to ensure that an infinite loop isn't possible either.
17:50 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/6421774863
17:51 NotFound For debugging purposes, you can write a dynamic op that does an invalid call on purpose.
17:52 NotFound But please don't put that in the parrot repo.
17:52 cotto_work NotFound: sure.  I can do a lot of things if I don't intend on pushing.
17:53 whiteknight plobsing: everything is as pushed as it's going to be now.
17:54 dukeleto NotFound: atrodo's lorito has an hcf :)
17:54 atrodo dukeleto> just in case
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17:55 NotFound I'm tempted to add a PLEASE opcode, and a runloop that checks the frequency of PLEASEs and throws excpetions 'Programmer is not polite' and 'Programer is too polite'
17:56 atrodo Isn't that a intercal feature?
17:56 NotFound atrodo: yeah
17:56 cotto_work NotFound: PLEASE REFRAIN
18:01 sorear NotFound: hrm.  I thought I saw a bug once where somebody used set_addr on a hash, and Parrot crashed, and it was closed WONTFIX "set_addr on hashes is a deeply internal interface and you shouldn't touch it unless you know what you're doing"
18:01 pmichaud truly stable systems don't arise from saying "failures (segfaults) never occur".  Stable systems arise from being robust enough to handle them when they inevitably occur.
18:01 kid51 joined #parrot
18:02 NotFound sorear: that is one of the reasons for redoing set_addr and the like.
18:03 pmichaud Providing optional support for a programmer to investigate "What happens when a segfault occurs?" seems entirely valid to me.  But that's just me.
18:03 NotFound Some of the set_ vtables shouldn't be directly invokable from pir.
18:04 NotFound pmichaud: IMO the support for that thing are denuggers.
18:04 NotFound debuggers
18:05 NotFound If we provide direct support someone will insist that it should be tested, and when the tests segfault as expected we'll get "parrot segfaults in test" reports.
18:06 plobsing left #parrot
18:06 nopaste "kid51" at 192.168.1.3 pasted "t/distro/manifest_generated.t: new test failure" (25 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/30069
18:06 kid51 left #parrot
18:07 whiteknight that becomes more of an option if Parrot attempted to handle segfaults
18:07 whiteknight it currently does not attempt to handle it at all
18:10 NotFound Calling abort trigger the same alarms and log reports than a segfault.
18:21 dukeleto cotto_work: http://www.codesimplicity.com/post​/open-source-community-simplified/
18:22 dukeleto cotto_work: that is a very cool document that i think we (and others) should discuss
18:30 nwellnhof joined #parrot
18:31 plobsing joined #parrot
18:32 Eclesia joined #parrot
18:32 Eclesia hi
18:33 cotto_work dukeleto: looking now
18:35 nopaste "NotFound" at 192.168.1.3 pasted "Error loading YAML/Tiny module" (10 lines) at http://nopaste.snit.ch/30073
18:36 atrodo dukeleto++
18:39 cotto_work dukeleto: that's a good reaffirmation of our method of closing master for no more than a few days.
18:40 cotto_work I'm don't usually realize how accustomed I am to assuming an monthly release schedule.
18:40 NotFound Maybe will be better to not close it at all. Crate a branch for the release and do only bugfixes on that branch.
18:42 cotto_work NotFound: a concern I have about that approach is that the release branch wouldn't get as much testing and attention.
18:44 cotto_work Responding quickly to contributions is something that we really need to be better about.  GSoC will be a good place to make that happen, if not before.
18:47 contingencyplan joined #parrot
18:57 dukeleto cotto_work: we could freeze master a few days before a release, only allowing bugfixes, and create a branch called 'integration' that all other work goes on in, then merge integration into master when the release is tagged
18:57 dukeleto cotto_work: so by default, smokers will be testing the master branch
18:58 dukeleto cotto_work: and developers would be running tests manually in the integration branch
18:58 dukeleto cotto_work: commits to the 'integration' branch should only be made when master is frozen
18:58 dukeleto cotto_work: and we just branch 'integration' from the commit that freezes master
19:00 dukeleto cotto_work: people that know about integration, use it. Others can just wait for master to unfreeze.
19:00 dukeleto cotto_work: i am not sure it is really necessary, though.
19:00 dukeleto cotto_work: just about anything bigger than a breadbox should be in a branch
19:00 dukeleto cotto_work: so people should just work in branches when master is frozen => dead simple
19:01 PerlJam if people always work in branches, that wouldn't change when master is frozen.
19:03 whiteknight For the 3.3 release, if it isn't tried before then, I'm planning on a similar idea
19:04 whiteknight About a week in advance I'm going to freeze master, cut a release candidate, and allow work to continue on some other branch
19:04 whiteknight then we can slowly merge in bugfixes or cherry-pick in other commits as needed, but in a limited and controlled way
19:05 cotto_work whiteknight: I'm interested in seeing how that works.
19:05 whiteknight me to. it will be a fun experiment
19:08 cotto_work My instinct says it won't work as well as a straight freeze a couple days before the release, but we won't know without trying it.
19:08 cotto_work Besides, most work will still be happening in topic branches.
19:08 cotto_work It could have no effect at all.
19:09 whiteknight What I like most about the idea is putting out that release candidate, so we can identifiy release-related issues a week before we actually cut the release
19:09 whiteknight there is always a spate of "the release parrot is missing X" or "the release parrot has this problem on platform X"
19:10 dukeleto whiteknight: we could attempt to setup a "release smoker" on the compile farm
19:11 whiteknight that may be overkill, if we can identify all the problems with a single candidate
19:11 dukeleto whiteknight: also, OSUOSL just got funding from facebook and are building a fancier version of the gcc compiler farm, and giving access to open source projects
19:11 dukeleto whiteknight: automated work vs. manual work
19:11 whiteknight right, i heard about that
19:11 dukeleto whiteknight: can't value them the same
19:12 dukeleto whiteknight: yes, it is very exciting, called "Supercell"
19:12 dukeleto whiteknight: it will have a few OS choices as well
19:12 whiteknight dukeleto: it's as much work to set up the automated release smoker as it would be to just put out a candidate. Plus, if the candidate is strong, I can reuse much of that on release day
19:12 dukeleto whiteknight: i ain't stopping you from doing work :)
19:12 Eclesia left #parrot
19:13 dukeleto whiteknight: but there is the other side, where we have a release smoker build releases, and then we just "choose" one and the release manager blesses it, adds his awesome release message and a few other errata, and BAM. A parrot release,....
19:13 dukeleto where the release manager doesn't have to follow 50 steps to release
19:13 whiteknight yes, there are benefits to the technique
19:14 dukeleto also, Dist::Zilla
19:14 dukeleto we can probably automate our release process 80% with dzil
19:15 whiteknight dukeachoo: I choose you
19:15 cotto_work left #parrot
19:16 PerlJam I did a proof-of-concept for automating Rakudo Star releases using dzil.  It worked quite nicely.
19:16 PerlJam dzil++
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19:28 pmichaud cotto: +2 on your "Attempting to get backtrace...no guarantees"  I really like that.
19:28 fperrad left #parrot
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19:29 pmichaud cotto: +2 on your "Attempting to get backtrace...no guarantees"  I really like that.
19:31 cotto_work pmichaud: thanks.
19:31 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: df0c2ce | plobsing++ | compilers/imcc/main.c:
19:31 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: can't clean up before error message output
19:31 dalek parrot/whiteknight/imcc_compreg_pmc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/df0c2cee8c
19:31 cotto_work bacek, atrodo, dukeleto: does any time within the next week sound like a good time to start on the M0 spec?
19:31 dukeleto PerlJam: i would like to see that code
19:31 dukeleto cotto_work: i have been thinking about it for a while, we all need to have a brain meld, though
19:32 cotto_work If only we had a concall line available.
19:32 dukeleto cotto_work: ;)
19:33 dukeleto cotto_work: i've looked at atrodo's lorito and our spec will have maybe a 70% correspondence with those ops
19:34 dukeleto cotto_work: the M0 should not have any opcodes that push or pop anything. Everything calls the current continutation with their arguments
19:34 cotto_work dukeleto: sure.  the other 30% is the tricky part
19:34 dukeleto cotto_work: atrodo's lorito has a stack for argument parsing
19:34 dukeleto cotto_work: which we won't have
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19:34 dukeleto cotto_work: i think M0 will be fewer ops than we expect
19:36 dukeleto cotto_work: one that he doesn't have it altering the intstruction pointer, or whatever we call it
19:36 dukeleto cotto_work: program counter ?
19:36 dukeleto cotto_work: basically, "advance the bytecode one unit"
19:36 nwellnhof dukeleto: atrodo's lorito doesn't have a (global) stack for arguments
19:36 PerlJam dukeleto: well, there's not actually much to it. https://github.com/perlpilot/rakudo-dist   Like I said, it was a proof-of-concept.  I did enough that I could see how to proceed if I wanted to continue with it.  But then my tuit supply dried up
19:36 dukeleto nwellnhof: yes, but it has a stack
19:36 nwellnhof dukeleto: i wouldn't call it a stack
19:37 dalek winxed: r770 | NotFound++ | trunk/ (2 files):
19:37 dalek winxed: refactor option handling in installed driver
19:37 dalek winxed: review: http://code.google.com/p/w​inxed/source/detail?r=770
19:37 dukeleto nwellnhof: what is it?
19:37 PerlJam dukeleto: But I agree with your assessment that you could probably automate 80%
19:37 nwellnhof it's an array inside the context struct: https://github.com/atrodo/lor​ito/blob/master/lorito.h#L238
19:37 dukeleto nwellnhof: it doesn't use call-with-current-continuation style
19:38 dukeleto nwellnhof: but it is close
19:39 nwellnhof dukeleto: yes, continuation passing wouldn't require many modifications
19:40 dukeleto nwellnhof: we need to make M0 use CPS, and it will probably have to know how to interact with the GC
19:40 dukeleto mark, sweep as well as thaw/freeze
19:40 nwellnhof we should plan for a GC that can be implemented (mostly) in M0
19:41 dukeleto but we don't need those for our first iteration
19:41 dukeleto nwellnhof: interesting idea, but that isn't going to happen before 3.3
19:41 cotto_work nwellnhof: I'd love to have that be where we head.
19:41 dukeleto nwellnhof: we should concentrate on producing something useful for 3.3, but i like that direction. We should definitely keep that in mind.
19:42 nwellnhof dukeleto: i know we're far away from that, but we should keep it in mind.
19:46 dukeleto nwellnhof: +1
19:49 dukeleto This is a great introduction to continuations and continuation passing style, with example code in Perl 5: http://billhails.net/Book/v10.html
19:49 dukeleto cotto_work: ^^^
19:49 dukeleto cotto_work: you might like that, since almost everything else uses something lispy
19:49 cotto_work I might have seen that.  lemme look
19:50 cotto_work yup.  very helpful
19:50 cotto_work It's an odd experience writing cps perl
19:50 dukeleto the book implements a Scheme interp in Perl 5. And M0 is not that different from a scheme interp...
19:50 cotto_work I actually have a hand-written post-it of cps-style fact on my monitor.
19:50 jsut joined #parrot
19:50 dukeleto cotto_work: i think we can write code that rewrites code to be written in CPS style
19:51 dukeleto cotto_work: we just need to write code in a way that can be transformed
19:52 dukeleto cotto_work: i am not against having a dedicated DSL for M0, which is processed into C code, like parrot internals
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19:54 cotto_work dukeleto: what do you mean "for M0"?
19:54 dukeleto cotto_work: M0 will be implemented in a DSL which gets processed into C
19:55 dukeleto cotto_work: generating M0 code that is implemented with dynops
19:55 dukeleto cotto_work: from some easier-to-use DSL
19:55 jsut_ left #parrot
19:55 dukeleto cotto_work: when converting from the DSL to the actual code, all the CPS tranformations can be done
19:55 cotto_work dukeleto: I see what you're saying.
19:56 dukeleto cotto_work: so the dev doesn't have to remember to do crazy CPS shenanigans
19:56 cotto_work no reason that won't work
19:56 dukeleto cotto_work: might be worth thinking about. Writing CPS by hand is quite time-consuming and error-prone
19:57 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: 429f7fb | cotto++ | / (2 files):
19:57 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: add perdoc to new functions, hopefully with sufficiently scary warnings
19:57 dukeleto cotto_work: but writing code that transforms normal code into CPS style, that seems like a better solution
19:57 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/429f7fbb4f
19:57 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: 67af9e4 | cotto++ | src/interp/inter_create.c:
19:57 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: add an assert_args macro to make codingstds happy
19:57 dalek parrot/pir-bt-on-crash: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/67af9e4f8a
19:57 cotto_work dukeleto: wikipedia agrees
19:57 plobsing M0 should be distasteful. make easy things easy, make hard things possible, make evil/magical things hard.
19:57 cotto_work plobsing: yes
19:58 dukeleto plobsing: M0 *will* be distasteful, without having to hand-code CPS in low-level ops
19:58 plobsing M0 = magic-0. no magic. PERIOD.
19:58 dukeleto plobsing: define magic.
19:59 particle side effects and dwimmery
19:59 plobsing translating code so you don't have to worry about calling conventions is magic
19:59 cotto_work dukeleto: anything remotely surprising or complicated
19:59 dukeleto plobsing: magic at compile time or magic at runtime ?
19:59 plobsing anywhere
19:59 dukeleto plobsing: everything i am talking about is pre-compile time
20:00 plobsing pre-processing? that's fine, so long as it is completely separated from the compiler.
20:00 dukeleto plobsing: yes
20:01 dukeleto plobsing: everything i am talking about is something akin to pmc2c
20:01 dukeleto plobsing: just ease boilerplate stuff from the devs
20:02 dukeleto basically, come up with some C macros that expand into the proper continuation passing style
20:02 dukeleto i guess it can be as simple as that
20:02 dalek parrot: 6421774 | cotto++ | / (3 files):
20:02 dalek parrot: first shot at pir backtraces for assertion failures
20:02 dalek parrot:
20:02 dalek parrot: There are no guarantees about these since assertion failures by
20:02 dalek parrot: definition result from some kind of unexpected internal state.  In the
20:02 dalek parrot: worst case this won't provide less debugging information than we already
20:02 dalek parrot: do, and I try to ensure that an infinite loop isn't possible either.
20:02 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/6421774863
20:02 dalek parrot: 429f7fb | cotto++ | / (2 files):
20:02 dalek parrot: add perdoc to new functions, hopefully with sufficiently scary warnings
20:02 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/429f7fbb4f
20:02 dalek parrot: 67af9e4 | cotto++ | src/interp/inter_create.c:
20:02 dalek parrot: add an assert_args macro to make codingstds happy
20:02 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/67af9e4f8a
20:03 cotto_work So much for that heuristic.
20:06 ttbot Parrot 67af9e4f i386-linux-thread-multi make error http://tt.taptinder.org/file/cmdout/4756.txt (http://tt.taptinder.org/buildstatus/pr-Parrot)
20:08 cotto_work cl is not a linux tool
20:11 nwellnhof tt machines 7 and 8 are windows although the archname says linux: http://tt.taptinder.org/cwm/machine/
20:17 cotto_work What's the right way to decorate a non-pure function that takes no arguments and returns no values so that headerizer will pick it up?
20:20 NotFound cotto_work: maybe the best way is not to write it that way.
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20:22 dalek TT #1273 closed by cotto++: Provide a parrot 'backtrace' with assertion failures.
20:22 dalek TT #1273: http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/ticket/1273
20:23 cotto_work NotFound: it's an unusual function.
20:24 NotFound I'd like an option to configure without that thing.
20:25 AndChat| left #parrot
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20:28 cotto_work NotFound: the backtrace thing?
20:28 NotFound cotto_work: aye
20:30 NotFound But I'm not worried to enough to implement that option, son NM.
20:30 NotFound s/son/so
20:35 vmspb left #parrot
20:44 whiteknight cotto_work: PARROT_WHARRGARBL
20:45 whiteknight PARROT_WHARRGARBL void Parrot_zomg_wharrgarble(void)
20:45 whiteknight headerizer will be cool with it
20:49 dalek winxed: r771 | NotFound++ | trunk/ (4 files):
20:49 dalek winxed: drop -c options from stages, it was ignored since it started to be handled in
20:49 dalek winxed: the drives many moons ago
20:49 dalek winxed: review: http://code.google.com/p/w​inxed/source/detail?r=771
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20:58 Psyche^ is now known as Patterner
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 49e1cb2 | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Fix small memory leak.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/49e1cb2147
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 6c7af5b | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Sweep pool starting from older generation.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc:
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Otherwise we are sweeping freshly moved objects from younger generation.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/6c7af5bb6c
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 0a38586 | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Paint objects moved from dirty_list back to generation white.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc:
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Otherwise they will not be processed correctly.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/0a385864ba
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 22d25b8 | bacek++ | / (3 files):
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Introduce pcc_set_context function to avoid direct poking into interp.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/22d25b80f7
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 12c257e | bacek++ | src/ (4 files):
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Use pcc_set_context function.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/12c257e3aa
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 85173f3 | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Print total number of collect runs in stats.
21:07 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/85173f3589
21:09 dalek parrot/generational_gc: 39b4af6 | bacek++ | include/parrot/context.h:
21:09 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Fix set_context macro
21:09 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/39b4af6c9a
21:10 whiteknight bacek++
21:26 whiteknight as if he needs the little karma boosts from me
21:29 whiteknight left #parrot
21:29 plobsing why does PMCNULL.get_pointer return PMCNULL?
21:29 plobsing that doesn't make sense
21:31 bluescreen joined #parrot
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21:33 dalek winxed: r772 | NotFound++ | trunk/winxedst1.winxed:
21:33 dalek winxed: operator %= in stage 1
21:33 dalek winxed: review: http://code.google.com/p/w​inxed/source/detail?r=772
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21:38 gg411 left #parrot
21:52 mj41 cotto_work: TapTinder machine table copy-paste error fixed. http://tt.taptinder.org/cwm/machine
21:57 plobsing left #parrot
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22:00 rurban left #parrot
22:00 rurban_ is now known as rurban
22:06 mikehh cotto_work: ping
22:07 mikehh couple of g++ errors in last commits
22:17 dalek winxed: r773 | NotFound++ | trunk/ (2 files):
22:17 dalek winxed: more meaningful error message for some operators not implemented in stage 0
22:17 dalek winxed: review: http://code.google.com/p/w​inxed/source/detail?r=773
22:18 cotto_work mj41: thanks
22:18 cotto_work mikehh: pong
22:19 dalek parrot/generational_gc: e757db7 | bacek++ | src/gc/gc_gms.c:
22:19 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Clean on_dirty_list flag when we move object out of dirty_list.
22:19 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/e757db7687
22:20 mikehh cotto_work: couple of g++ errors in last commits
22:23 * mikehh nedd to do some updates/backups bbl
22:23 mikehh need
22:23 mikehh bbl
22:24 mikehh left #parrot
22:25 cotto_work msg mikehh Thanks for noticing.  I'll see what the g++ build does for me.
22:25 aloha OK. I'll deliver the message.
22:27 wknight-phone joined #parrot
22:29 cotto_work NotFound: what's your concern about the backtrace code?
22:32 dalek parrot: bc265ee | cotto++ | / (2 files):
22:32 dalek parrot: fix the cl and g++ builds
22:32 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/bc265eee33
22:34 cotto_work apart from it being hacky
22:38 cosimo joined #parrot
22:39 dalek parrot: 7d35f56 | jkeenan++ | MANIFEST.generated:
22:39 dalek parrot: Re-alphabetize to get a test to pass.
22:39 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/7d35f565ca
22:40 cotto_work msg mikehh c++ should be "happy" now.  (If I were a C++ compiler, I don't think I could ever really be happy.)
22:40 aloha OK. I'll deliver the message.
22:41 wknight-phone left #parrot
22:43 atrodo cotto_work> (delayed response) I should be good for sometime in the next week
22:51 dalek parrot/generational_gc: b8deafe | bacek++ | src/call/context_accessors.c:
22:51 dalek parrot/generational_gc: Add more asserts.
22:51 dalek parrot/generational_gc: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/b8deafe8ed
22:52 nwellnhof joined #parrot
22:55 nwellnhof i'm about to merge nwellnhof/gc_dynamic_threshold now
22:57 mikehh joined #parrot
22:59 tadzik \o/
23:06 dalek parrot: 0d519eb | nwellnhof++ | src/gc/api.c:
23:06 dalek parrot: Change GC names to lowercase
23:06 dalek parrot:
23:06 dalek parrot: Print error message if name is invalid.
23:06 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/0d519ebc84
23:06 dalek parrot: d34ec47 | nwellnhof++ | src/gc/gc_ (2 files):
23:06 dalek parrot: Add #define for GC_DEFAULT_MIN_THRESHOLD
23:06 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/d34ec47ead
23:06 dalek parrot: 715b2ea | nwellnhof++ | / (29 files):
23:06 dalek parrot: Merge branch 'master' into nwellnhof/gc_dynamic_threshold
23:06 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/715b2ea148
23:06 dalek parrot: be26ad5 | nwellnhof++ | / (23 files):
23:06 dalek parrot: Merge branch 'nwellnhof/gc_dynamic_threshold'
23:06 dalek parrot: review: https://github.com/parrot/parrot/commit/be26ad51c6
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23:07 Themeruta is now known as NotFound_b
23:08 NotFound_b cotto_work: my concern is exposed in the ticket
23:10 cotto_work ok
23:19 cotto_work NotFound_b: The way I see it is that once Parrot_confess is called, things can't get too much worse.  At that point, we might as well try to spit out some more useful info as Parrot dies.  If something it depends on is broken, it'll just trigger another assertion failure and die anyway.
23:20 cotto_work We'll see.  It's a nice feature but it also has a non-zero chance of unintended side-effects.
23:22 NotFound_b cotto_work: things always can get much worse, is a law of nature ;)
23:23 NotFound_b Or a law of Murphy, at least.
23:23 sheant left #parrot
23:34 cotto_work NotFound_b: Most indeededly.  PDB_get_continuation_backtrace is a sizable bit of code and I shouldn't be too unimaginative about how it could break.
23:35 cotto_work bacek++ for the highly atomic commits
23:36 mikehh clock?
23:36 cotto_work aloha: clock?
23:36 aloha cotto_work: LAX: Wed, 15:36 PST / CHI: Wed, 17:36 CST / NYC: Wed, 18:36 EST / UTC: Wed, 23:36 UTC / LON: Wed, 23:36 GMT / BER: Thu, 00:36 CET / TOK: Thu, 08:36 JST / SYD: Thu, 10:36 EST
23:37 cotto_work good evening, mikehh
23:37 mikehh hi cotto_work
23:38 mikehh bacek: bacek_at_work ping
23:38 bacek_at_work mikehh, barely here
23:39 mikehh I think runtime/parrot/library/YAML/Tiny.pir needs to be in .gitignore
23:39 cotto_work mikehh: I'll add it
23:39 cotto_work good catch
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