Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #parrotsketch, 2010-05-11

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
04:31 tcurtis joined #parrotsketch
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14:33 plobsing joined #parrotsketch
14:34 plobsing might not make #ps, nopasted report at  "Tuesday at 20:30 UTC"
14:34 plobsing 07:23 -!- plobsing [~pitr@199.247.190.36] has joined #parrotsketch
14:34 plobsing 07:23 -!- Topic for #parrotsketch: "Tuesday at 20:30 UTC"
14:34 plobsing 07:23 -!- Topic set by Coke [~coke@cpe-72-228-52-192.nycap.res.rr.com] [Tue Apr 20 11:58:37 2010]
14:34 plobsing 07:23 [Users #parrotsketch]
14:35 plobsing 07:23 [ ascent    ] [ dukeleto  ] [ japhb   ] [ pmichaud] [ TimToady]
14:35 plobsing 07:23 [ bluescreen] [ eternaleye] [ particle] [ sorear  ] [ Util    ]
14:35 plobsing 07:23 [ Coke      ] [ ilbot2    ] [ PerlJam ] [ spinclad] [ wagle   ]
14:35 plobsing 07:23 [ cotto     ] [ integral  ] [ plobsing] [ tewk    ]
14:35 plobsing 07:23 -!- Irssi: #parrotsketch: Total of 19 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 19 normal]
14:35 plobsing 07:23 -!- Channel #parrotsketch created Sun Sep 18 22:54:01 2005
14:35 plobsing 07:23 -!- Irssi: Join to #parrotsketch was synced in 1 secs
14:35 plobsing oops.
14:35 plobsing trying again.
14:35 plobsing might not make #ps, nopasted report at  http://nopaste.snit.ch/20528
14:35 particle better!
14:57 Coke Here is plobsing's inlined report:
14:57 Coke What I Did:
14:57 Coke * fixed performance of string reverse lookup in IMCC (with help from bacek++)
14:57 Coke * closed tickets (1209, 1244, 1073, 1030, 1152, 1201, 1035, 1570, 162)
14:57 Coke What I Plan (not in any particular order, not all to be done immediately):
14:57 Coke * IMCC
14:57 Coke * use PMCs internally
14:57 Coke * restructure to not use interp as a god object
14:57 Coke * syntax for constants (would fix some instances of broken PASM)
14:57 Coke * more dead code elimination
14:57 Coke * more ticket/bug fixes
14:58 Coke * NCI
14:58 Coke * struct PMCs
14:58 Coke * move libjit_framebuilder to github
14:58 Coke Questions:
14:58 Coke * tickets requiring advice: (1323, 1610, 132)
14:58 Coke END_REPORT
14:58 Coke (again, that was plobsing's report, not mine.)
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17:39 cotto_work #did:
17:39 cotto_work * helped bacek++ make progress on ops_pct
17:39 cotto_work - fixed dynop support, Parrot's internal dynops currently pass all tests
17:39 cotto_work - opsc (nqp ops compiler) still needs to be installed and integrated with existing build tools
17:39 cotto_work - opsc appears to cause no new test failures when used to build Rakudo's dynops
17:39 cotto_work - making it work without an installed opsc is a bit hacky though
17:39 cotto_work #will do:
17:39 cotto_work * make opsc installable, improve documentation, get ops_pct ready to merge (before 2.4 is possible, before 2.5 is certain)
17:39 cotto_work #closed TTs:
17:39 cotto_work #eor
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19:11 smash joined #parrotsketch
19:17 Coke Did:
19:17 Coke * Got (old) partcl to compile against parrot-trunk. Segfaults immediately.
19:17 Coke * poked at branches/codestring - trunk got faster faster than we did, so
19:17 Coke unless we get some better benchmarks soon, we probably need to consider
19:17 Coke it a failed experiment.
19:17 Coke * added some text to trac.parrot.org/languages so folks trying to checkout
19:17 Coke the source can find it.
19:17 Coke * fixed more make dependencies.
19:17 Coke EOR
19:22 mikehh What I did since my last report:
19:22 mikehh * building and testing parrot on amd64/i386, with gcc/g++
19:22 mikehh * codetest and ASSERT_ARGS fixes
19:22 mikehh * branch testing and some fixes
19:22 mikehh * ops_pct branch passes all tests except perlcritic fails on 9 nqp files
19:22 mikehh What I intend to do in the next week:
19:22 mikehh * testing and fixing
19:22 mikehh * look at ways to incorpotate nqp-rx files into codetest properly,
19:22 mikehh *   particularly geting perlcritic to ignore them, but other tests as well
19:22 mikehh * documentation
19:22 mikehh .eor
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19:35 darbelo DONE
19:35 darbelo - Finished up with the various forms submissions for Google.
19:35 darbelo - Removed #if 0 code from various places.
19:35 darbelo - Added some code to prevent the "*_provisional" Config keys from ending up in config_lib.pir
19:35 darbelo - Did some experimenting for future string cleanups.
19:35 darbelo - Read and re-read PDD28.
19:35 darbelo - Blogged some more about NFG.
19:35 darbelo TODO
19:35 darbelo - Keep up the blogging.
19:35 darbelo - Clean up strings/io a bit more.
19:35 darbelo - Maybe start with the NFG coding.
19:35 darbelo END.
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20:05 NotFound 2010-may-11
20:05 NotFound What I did:
20:05 NotFound -parrot
20:05 NotFound * Update and fix example pbc_checker.
20:05 NotFound * Improve memory usage in packfile annotations pack/unpack.
20:05 NotFound * Improve PackfileAnnotations PMC.
20:05 NotFound * Sanitize Parrot_str_length, Parrot_str_byte_length and its
20:05 NotFound corresponfing opcodes.
20:05 NotFound * Added experimental function Parrot_str_unescape_string.
20:05 NotFound * Minor fixes and cleanups.
20:05 NotFound -winxed
20:05 NotFound * Escape non-ascii chars in generated PIR strings in stage 1
20:05 NotFound What I will do:
20:05 NotFound No plan
20:05 NotFound EOR
20:07 Tene What I did:
20:07 Tene * Compiled and installed Parrot and Rakudo on my new laptop, made vague allusions to possibly working again someday
20:07 Tene KTHXBAI
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20:20 Util # Done:
20:20 Util * Investigated pbc_to_exe speed issues on 64-bit Linux
20:20 Util # Plan to do:
20:20 Util * Answer outstanding issue on TT#1302 (PIR todo() is frequently misused).
20:20 Util = ++bubaflub for code effort, ++kid51 for recovering my dropped ball.
20:20 Util * Refactor pbc_to_exe for direct-to-filehandle emit of c-encoded PBC
20:20 Util * *or* add a Linux-only codepath to pbc_to_exe for direct linking of PBC
20:20 Util = (just like Win32 .res files; `ld -r -b binary -o foo.o foo.pbc`)
20:20 Util = this is a GCC-only solution; will not work with Darwin's linker.
20:20 Util * Brain-dump pbc_to_exe knowledge into a Wiki page.
20:20 Util # Blockers:
20:20 Util * $WORK
20:20 Util .end
20:21 allison joined #parrotsketch
20:22 tcurtis What I did:
20:23 tcurtis * Worked on the design of my GSoc project some.
20:23 tcurtis * Posted a blog post about PAST::Walker at http://parrot.org/content/past-optimization
20:23 tcurtis * Submitted my CLA(actually did this the week before this last one, but I missed last #ps).
20:23 tcurtis What I will do:
20:23 tcurtis * Work on the design of PAST::Pattern or whatever I'll call it.
20:23 tcurtis * Post a blog post about PAST::Pattern
20:23 tcurtis * Finish high-school so that I'll have more time to work on Parrot.
20:23 tcurtis * Possibly start coding.
20:23 tcurtis End of report.
20:24 chromatic I... am blocking on work.
20:24 allison What I did:
20:24 allison - Took a bit of a tangent this week and wrote a PEG parser. http://www.bitbucket.org/allison/spix. An experiment partly inspired by working on GC, reading up on PEG parsers, and a stray comment from chromatic about the number of objects created by PGE/NQP-rx. It's like a simplified PGE, enough for parsing computer languages, but not the full power of regular expressions.
20:24 allison - At the Ubuntu Developer Summit this week.
20:24 allison EOR
20:32 chromatic Hello, everyone.
20:32 cotto_work hi
20:32 Util Hello
20:32 mikehh hello
20:32 allison hi
20:32 NotFound Hola
20:33 japhb o/
20:34 chromatic Let's review last week's milestones.
20:34 chromatic Deprecations?
20:36 chromatic Branch merges?
20:37 Coke not as many this week.
20:37 Coke branches/codestring wasn't merged. needs more benchmarking, but it looks like trunk leapfrogged us.
20:38 cotto_work ops_pct will be ready for merging soon
20:38 Coke I think cotto & bacek are doing a final push on the ops_pct rewrite.
20:38 chromatic What happens after ops_pct?
20:38 mikehh codestring and ops_pct mostly test ok except for perlcritic in ops_pct
20:38 allison do we have some branches that are no longer active?
20:39 chromatic Off the top of my head, the tt389 and avl_cache
20:39 allison some of them are 7-11 months since the last change
20:41 plobsing_work libjit_framebuilder2 is inactive. I intent to mine the useful stuff out of it and then delete it relatively soon.
20:41 Tene Didn't we almost get tt389 done?
20:42 allison Tene: it wasn't the right fix
20:42 Tene Ah.
20:43 allison the right fix went into trunk already
20:43 allison but, we kept the branch for a bit, just in case something useful could be pulled from it
20:43 chromatic There's a lot of cleanup we need in that code.
20:44 chromatic We have a 2.4 release in a week.  What should we work on in this week?
20:44 cotto_work sounds like a good weekly task
20:44 allison clean up the namespace PMC?
20:45 allison maybe the week after the release?
20:45 allison how about ticket sprint or documentation?
20:45 chromatic I'm all for a ticket sprint.
20:47 allison sounds good
20:47 chromatic Roadmap review?
20:47 allison How do we split GC into smaller chunks?
20:48 chromatic I don't think we do.
20:48 darbelo Smaller code chunks?
20:48 allison smaller tasks
20:49 chromatic I don't know a way to break up the separate marking system for sweep-free such that you can replace it piecemeal.
20:49 allison Or, how do we make it an interesting thing to work on.
20:49 allison the dogpile approach has worked well in the past
20:50 darbelo Get someone qualified to do the big changes and the farm out the smaller fixed to the community?
20:50 allison basically, how do we get people to work on it
20:50 chromatic The dogpile last week was speeding up Rakudo and dropping its memory usage after a couple of branch merges.
20:50 allison that was good
20:50 Util Document/braindump everything about GC, current design and ultimate thoughts. Some tasks on research, benchmarking, and instrumenting will probably come clear during the writing.
20:51 allison we just added the 3-month roadmap type of task in the last development summit
20:51 allison so, we're still working out the practical details of how it integrates with our daily development
20:52 allison Util: that's a good starting point
20:52 allison I've been thinking about doing a parrot.org blog post
20:52 chromatic I can put some tasks on the sweep-free page.
20:53 allison there are also tasks on the GC page
20:53 allison Is the best way to get people working on them to just dive in myself?
20:53 chromatic I think the GC scares almost everyone.
20:54 allison yeah, I think you're right
20:54 allison okay, that's my usual job of clearing away nastyness to make the way for others
20:54 allison I can handle that
20:54 allison end of roadmap review
20:54 chromatic If you and bacek can fix up the documentation on how to make a new GC core, that's a good start.
20:55 allison that's a nice concrete starting point, I'll work on that and a GC blog post this week
20:57 chromatic Other questions, concerns, or discussion items?
20:57 allison git migration volunteers
20:58 chromatic Timeline?
20:58 allison I figure find the volunteers first and let them discuss the timeline.
20:59 chromatic cotto's already looking at Git/Trac.
20:59 allison there are some intertwined factors
20:59 chromatic dukeleto has volunteered to do training.
20:59 darbelo After Rakudo Star, maybe after GSoC, form minimal disruption.
20:59 allison well, I didn't want to volunteer them, but yes, that's who I suspected
20:59 chromatic After GSoC is the earliest I like too.
21:00 allison and, that gives us time to plan our dev practices on the new system
21:01 allison do we have an updated timeline for rakudo star?
21:01 chromatic My guess is by YAPC::NA.
21:01 allison okay, so before GSoC is over anyway
21:03 allison do we have a volunteer to write the revised development practices?
21:04 chromatic What are you thinking needs revision?
21:05 allison well, the currently give the best practices for svn
21:06 allison committer_guide.pod, branching_guide.pod, metacommitter_guide.pod
21:07 chromatic Those'll probably need more discussion.
21:07 allison release_manager_guide.pod
21:07 allison right, what I'm looking for is someone willing to drive the discussion
21:07 allison raise the questions, resolve them in a new form of the document
21:09 Coke dukeleto and I can do that.
21:09 allison awesome, thanks!
21:10 Coke (he said, volunteering him.)
21:10 allison do we have a wiki page yet for the git migration?
21:12 chromatic Looks like a no.
21:14 allison creating one now and adding those roles
21:15 allison end of q
21:15 chromatic Anything else to discuss today?
21:15 mikehh I was looking at native_pbc last week - those tests have been skipped for at least 15 months (TT #357) - anything being done there?
21:16 mikehh also we have signals currently disabled, anything there?
21:16 chromatic Not to my knowledge.
21:17 mikehh should we be doing something?
21:18 chromatic I think signals depend somewhat on concurrency.
21:18 chromatic Portable bytecode is a ways off.
21:19 allison which is to say, yes, but not immediately
21:21 chromatic I expect post-Lorito bytecode to get a lot more portable.
21:23 allison we'll at least have fewer ops to port
21:29 Tene I'm also available for handling git training/questions/headaches at any time.
21:29 allison thanks
21:31 chromatic Anything else?
21:31 mikehh I was also going to bring up shebang line consistancy, but I will leave that until I investigate further
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21:41 Whiteknight joined #parrotsketch
21:41 mikehh hey bacek, Whiteknight, you have been volunteered for ...
21:42 Whiteknight ...?
21:42 * Whiteknight starts backlogging
21:54 cotto_work The meeting seems to be over.
21:56 Coke we kind of petered out there. See everyone next week. =-)
21:59 allison http://trac.parrot.org/parrot/wiki/GitMigration
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22:44 NotFound left #parrotsketch

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