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| Time | Nick | Message |
|---|---|---|
| 03:29 | contingencyplan joined #parrotsketch | |
| 05:14 | cotto joined #parrotsketch | |
| 07:30 | tcurtis joined #parrotsketch | |
| 11:24 | contingencyplan joined #parrotsketch | |
| 12:13 | bluescreen joined #parrotsketch | |
| 13:04 | mikehh joined #parrotsketch | |
| 17:09 | tcurtis joined #parrotsketch | |
| 18:08 | eternaleye joined #parrotsketch | |
| 18:14 | NotFound joined #parrotsketch | |
| 18:58 | ash_ joined #parrotsketch | |
| 19:10 | khairul joined #parrotsketch | |
| 19:31 | chromatic joined #parrotsketch | |
| 19:32 | chromatic | I worked on the new STRING API for Rakudo, but it's no performance improvement as far as I can see. |
| 19:32 | I will... do not much, as I am moving offices this week. | |
| 19:34 | wknight8111_ joined #parrotsketch | |
| 19:42 | Chandon joined #parrotsketch | |
| 19:59 | tcurtis | What I did: |
| 19:59 | * Implemented min_depth and descend_until options for Tree::Pattern.transform. | |
| 19:59 | - Wrote tests and docs for this. | |
| 19:59 | * Updated some of the docs for my GSoC project. | |
| 19:59 | * Worked on more constant folding for PIRATE. | |
| 20:00 | * Blog post: | |
| 20:00 | - http://parrot.org/content/seve[…]eepattern-hacking | |
| 20:00 | * Fixed some bugs in Tree::Pattern. | |
| 20:00 | * Wrote a tail-call elimination optimization for the simple case where there's a "return" statement. | |
| 20:00 | - Doesn't work because Tree::Transformer doesn't yet traverse attributes, so my top priority is to add traversal of some attributes. | |
| 20:00 | - I would prefer to not add traversal of all attributes because that would require some cycle-detection logic that would complicate things a bit and require modifying the API. | |
| 20:00 | What I will do: | |
| 20:00 | * Implement traversal of at least some attributes. | |
| 20:00 | * Get the tail-call optimization working. | |
| 20:00 | * Continue to work on optimizations for PIRATE. | |
| 20:00 | * Continue to work on docs. | |
| 20:00 | * Possibly make Tree::Transformer no longer derive from Tree::Walker. | |
| 20:00 | - It defines its own versions of the Tree::Walker multi-subs anyway. | |
| 20:00 | * Other refactoring. | |
| 20:00 | * Improve tests. | |
| 20:00 | * Another blog post. | |
| 20:00 | eor. | |
| 20:00 | q1q | |
| 20:01 | NotFound | What I did: |
| 20:01 | -parrot | |
| 20:01 | * Deprecated is_tty methods in favour of isatty | |
| 20:01 | * Added function Parrot_dlsym_str | |
| 20:01 | * Some more PMC tests | |
| 20:01 | -winxed | |
| 20:01 | * Heredocs | |
| 20:01 | * Simplify sub params handling | |
| 20:01 | * More tailcall optimization | |
| 20:01 | * Evaluate some predefs at compile time when arguments are const | |
| 20:01 | * Some fixes and improvements in example Mysql | |
| 20:01 | * Minor fixes and cleaning | |
| 20:01 | What I will do: | |
| 20:01 | No plan | |
| 20:01 | EOR | |
| 20:01 | particle | reminder: next week is mid-terms for gsoc. students and mentors, get your reports in |
| 20:13 | plobsing_work joined #parrotsketch | |
| 20:14 | plobsing_work | What I Did: |
| 20:14 | * minor fixes on dynop_mapping | |
| 20:14 | What I Plan: | |
| 20:14 | * get testing on dynop_mapping (more platforms, HLLs) | |
| 20:14 | * create PackfileBytecode pmc (PackfileRawSegment no longer valid for bytecode segments) | |
| 20:14 | * use PackfileBytecode pmc to fix make_hello_pbc.pir example | |
| 20:14 | Blockers: | |
| 20:15 | * life | |
| 20:15 | EOR | |
| 20:16 | darbelo joined #parrotsketch | |
| 20:20 | cotto_work | .#did: |
| 20:20 | - not much (4th of July FTW) | |
| 20:20 | #will do: | |
| 20:20 | - finish linear scan register allocator in PIRATE | |
| 20:20 | - deprecation policy work | |
| 20:20 | - lots of other random stuff | |
| 20:20 | #eor | |
| 20:20 | Chandon | Done: |
| 20:20 | -gsoc_threads | |
| 20:20 | * Got alarms and timers working. | |
| 20:20 | * Implemented version of pre-emptive green thread scheduling that is both wrong *and* broken. | |
| 20:20 | Will do: | |
| 20:20 | END | |
| 20:21 | ash_ | What I Did: |
| 20:21 | * Started wider testing of NCI updates | |
| 20:21 | * Found and fixed a pointer related bug in my NCI changes | |
| 20:21 | What I Plan: | |
| 20:21 | * Start work on a proof of concept llvm-ir run core by doing some basic translation of bytecode to llvm-ir | |
| 20:21 | Blockers: | |
| 20:21 | * Understanding parrot bytecode | |
| 20:21 | END | |
| 20:22 | eternaleye_ joined #parrotsketch | |
| 20:22 | khairul | did: |
| 20:22 | .finished up instrumenting gc. | |
| 20:22 | .added tests for EventDispatcher. | |
| 20:22 | .added tests for InstrumentGC. | |
| 20:22 | .initial cut of InstrumentVtable. | |
| 20:22 | .blog post @ http://parrot.mangkok.com/?p=122 | |
| 20:22 | will do: | |
| 20:22 | .finish up InstrumentVtable. | |
| 20:22 | .add support for methods. | |
| 20:22 | .start on usage documentation. | |
| 20:22 | eor | |
| 20:23 | bubaflub joined #parrotsketch | |
| 20:24 | darbelo | DONE |
| 20:24 | - Freeze/thaw support. | |
| 20:24 | - Added some documentation. | |
| 20:24 | - Hated the packfile code. | |
| 20:24 | TODO | |
| 20:24 | - Get the transcoding issues sorted out. | |
| 20:24 | - Add tests. | |
| 20:24 | EOR. | |
| 20:27 | Util | ## Done: |
| 20:27 | * Nothing material | |
| 20:27 | # Plan to do: | |
| 20:27 | * Perl6book examples | |
| 20:27 | * Fix Win32 Rakudo problems | |
| 20:27 | # Blockers: | |
| 20:27 | * $WORK | |
| 20:27 | * Roof.new | |
| 20:27 | .end | |
| 20:30 | allison joined #parrotsketch | |
| 20:32 | allison | - Reviewed chromatic's security plans for Lorito. |
| 20:32 | - Discussed Lorito and future parrot plans with chromatic. | |
| 20:32 | - Drafted 20 ops for lowest level of Lorito. | |
| 20:32 | EOR | |
| 20:32 | chromatic won't make it today (wedding preparations) | |
| 20:32 | who's here today? | |
| 20:33 | cotto_work | hi |
| 20:33 | darbelo | o/ |
| 20:33 | tcurtis | Hi. |
| 20:33 | Chandon | Hi |
| 20:33 | Util | Hi |
| 20:34 | allison | let's get started |
| 20:34 | how did we do on weekly priorities? | |
| 20:35 | how is gc_massacre doing? | |
| 20:36 | * Coke | ~~ |
| 20:37 | allison | how about deprecations? |
| 20:37 | ticket closing? | |
| 20:38 | Coke | I would like to go through DEPRECATED.pod this week for the next (supported) release in 2weeks and figure out which experimental stuff is getting promoted. |
| 20:38 | don't need to do it now. Will probaly send out a separate email for each one to track any feedback. | |
| 20:38 | NotFound | BTW closing some tickets depends on experimental things. |
| 20:39 | allison | then for next week, I suggest a weekly priority of "review experimental features for promotion or removal" |
| 20:39 | Coke | (though there is a lot of them, may just encourage comments on tickets instead.) |
| 20:41 | allison | are there any other items we'd like to have as weekly priorities for next week? |
| 20:41 | Coke | I need to fix 'make html' |
| 20:41 | anyone wants to pitch in, great, ping me. | |
| 20:42 | tcurtis | Documentation for users of Parrot perhaps? |
| 20:42 | Or just docs in general. | |
| 20:42 | allison | ah, yeah, I saw your post to pod-people (I'm assuming that's related), need to reply |
| 20:42 | Coke | tcurtis: yes. |
| 20:42 | allison | I'll add 'make html' to weekly priorities |
| 20:42 | Coke | I think we're pretty much at the cutoff for anything major going in. |
| 20:43 | allison | yes, very true |
| 20:43 | Coke | (only 2 weeks left to get things tested before a supported release.) |
| 20:43 | I'll send out an email to the list tonight. | |
| 20:44 | wknight8111_ | agreed |
| 20:44 | Util | Coke, is there a ticket or wiki page you are using for your `make html` bugs? |
| 20:44 | Coke | Util: no, because I'm the only one working on it. =-) |
| 20:44 | (there are tickets that are driving it, but I'm in the middle of rewriting the mechanism entirely) | |
| 20:45 | Util | ok, thanks |
| 20:45 | Coke | if folks are interested, I can spend time divvying up tasks. |
| 20:45 | otherwise it's not a good use of my time. | |
| 20:47 | allison | it's easy enough for you to give someone who asks a task without spending time writing up a task list |
| 20:47 | (which is to say, if anyone wants to help Coke, just talk to him) | |
| 20:48 | Coke | ;) |
| 20:48 | allison | how about questions? |
| 20:48 | Coke | please, lots of testing in anticipation of release. now's a great time to setup a smoke server if youhaven't already. |
| 20:48 | allison | q1c |
| 20:48 | Coke | (client, I mean.) |
| 20:48 | allison | good point |
| 20:49 | on as many platforms as possible | |
| 20:49 | tcurtis | q1q |
| 20:49 | allison | tcurtis: go ahead |
| 20:52 | tcurtis: what's your question? | |
| 20:52 | (or any other questions?) | |
| 20:52 | tcurtis | bacek has asked chromatic and myself about merging my branch into trunk soon for pirate. Alternately, he also suggested moving it to a separate repo and using it as an external project(like we do with NQP, if I understand what he means correctly). Can I do that? If we merge it before 2.6, I would like it marked experimental, though, since there are still some API changes that might be necessary. |
| 20:53 | allison | When you say "can I do that?" do you mean move it to an external repo? |
| 20:53 | talk a little more about pirate and how it integrates with current Parrot | |
| 20:53 | is it pretty independent? | |
| 20:54 | and, how fast is it changing? | |
| 20:54 | and how much does it depend on a particular release of Parrot? | |
| 20:54 | tcurtis | "Can I do that?" was referring to either merge it into to trunk or move it to an external repository. |
| 20:54 | Coke | I don't mind if we add something experimental and mostly unused-currently to trunk, but : see also pirc. |
| 20:54 | allison | yes, you can certainly do one or the other |
| 20:54 | wknight8111_ | +1 |
| 20:55 | allison | (i.e. will people always have to update pirate when they update to a new version of Parrot?) |
| 20:55 | tcurtis | My question was asking about merging my GSoC branch, not PIRATE. |
| 20:55 | wknight8111_ | (I would prefer mergeback to an extern repo) |
| 20:56 | allison | merging your branch so pirate can use it? |
| 20:56 | not merging a branch that contains pirate? | |
| 20:56 | cotto_work | PIRATE as Parrot's primary PIR compiler is still a ways off. |
| 20:56 | tcurtis | allison: Right. |
| 20:57 | allison | tcurtis: then review my questions, substituting "your branch" for "pirate" |
| 20:57 | it's the same basic problem | |
| 20:58 | tcurtis | It is pretty independent of Parrot. It doesn't depend particularly much on particular versions of Parrot, although changes to PCT might necessitate changes in it. |
| 20:59 | cotto_work | We can ask bacek to post his long-term plans to parrot-dev. |
| 20:59 | tcurtis | It still changes frequently, but less so than earlier on, and most of these are now bugfixes. |
| 21:00 | allison | sounds like it's changing fast enough that the parrot deprecation policy wouldn't be appropriate |
| 21:00 | (hence the desire for labeling it "experimental") | |
| 21:00 | * cotto_work | goes afk |
| 21:01 | allison | would it be easy to install as a module? |
| 21:01 | wknight8111_ | the optimizers are an optional tool that people using NQP-based compilers can easily make use of if they opt in |
| 21:01 | Coke | I don't know that /anything/ is currently easy to install as a module, izzit? |
| 21:01 | wknight8111_ | plumage is back up and running again, I think. But I don't think many people use it |
| 21:02 | NotFound | plumage is working well right now. |
| 21:02 | wknight8111_ | (as obvious from nobody noticing when plumage broke horribly) |
| 21:02 | tcurtis | It would probably be easy to install as a module, yes. |
| 21:02 | japhb | <rez>SIGH ...</rez> |
| 21:03 | NotFound | wknight8111_: too much things were horribly broken to have time to worry about plumage. |
| 21:03 | allison | okay, then the last and most important question is: which would you prefer? |
| 21:03 | particle | i don't think we should a gsoc branch into a supported release halfway through the gsoc program |
| 21:03 | wknight8111_ | NotFound: true |
| 21:03 | particle | i'm not certain it's had enough eyes |
| 21:04 | tcurtis | particle: I'd agree with that. |
| 21:04 | Coke | bacek is the only one that's asking for this. |
| 21:04 | particle | let's target pre-2.9 for potential gsoc branch merges |
| 21:04 | Coke | I'll add this to the list of release issues and let him champion it if he wants. |
| 21:04 | allison | particle: definitely after 2.6 if it merged |
| 21:04 | wknight8111_ | particle: it's hit a stable point, and it's being used (at least experimentally) by several projects already |
| 21:04 | particle | aye, i meant post-2.6. silly me |
| 21:05 | allison | tcurtis: I'd lean toward external module, really, it gives you the most flexibility |
| 21:05 | Coke | I gotta run. Any concerns about the release this month, you know where to find me. |
| 21:06 | allison | we can talk about it more in #parrot or on the mailing list |
| 21:06 | tcurtis | allison: I would like that better, as well. |
| 21:06 | wknight8111_ | I would like to see tcurtis' work available immediately. If we can't merge it back to trunk for whatever reason I think it should be made available as an external module (and then I suggest we include it in ext/ for the 2.6 release) |
| 21:07 | allison | other questions? |
| 21:09 | then food for thought for the week: | |
| 21:09 | In my report I mentioned talking with chromatic about "Lorito and future Parrot". We started talking about refactor plans for Lorito, OO, MMD, GC, etc. and I had a) a sinking feeling thinking about another 3 years of refactors, and b) a realization that they're really all just one refactor, Lorito. | |
| 21:10 | so, rather than starting a host of refactors for 3.0, I'm suggesting that we focus on Lorito, and build the lessons we've learned into it from the start. | |
| 21:10 | wknight8111_ | no |
| 21:10 | (I think my client has a lot of delay. That "no" was in response to "other questions?") | |
| 21:10 | allison | wknight: elaborate as you have time, I'll keep typing too |
| 21:10 | ah, right | |
| 21:11 | The most painful parts of the past 3 years of refactors, and also the most horrible code left in Parrot is at the junctions between old and new. | |
| 21:11 | where we can't rip out X because Y depends on it, and the chain of dependencies is too great | |
| 21:12 | So we treat Lorito like another system refactor, where both can coexist for a while, and then we eventually drop the old. | |
| 21:13 | But, instead of a partial subsystem refactor, it's a main.c refactor. | |
| 21:13 | i.e. a wholesale replacement for the parrot executible | |
| 21:13 | starting with a tiny prototype executable with 20 opcodes | |
| 21:13 | something we can develop quickly, and start experimenting with | |
| 21:14 | I started drafting that list of 20 opcodes, I'll send it to the list today. | |
| 21:14 | wknight8111_ | It may be worthwhile to get back to defining exactly what Lorito is then. I was under the impression it was basically a microcode layer. If you're suggesting it will encompass changes to GC, OO, and MMD, etc, maybe it's more than that |
| 21:15 | allison | Lorito is whatever we make it. But yes, what we're talking about here is a total replacement. |
| 21:15 | tcurtis | wknight8111_: I think the plan is to be able to rewrite at least some of what's currently in the core of Parrot in C in the microcode layer. |
| 21:16 | allison | yes, the Lorito plans already had ops and PMCs moving to being written in the microcode layer |
| 21:16 | which is, effectively, the whole interpreter | |
| 21:18 | Think about it for a week, save up your thoughts and well talk about them more. | |
| 21:18 | Particularly in the next virtual developer summit. | |
| 21:20 | any more thoughts, comments, questions before we wrap up for the week? | |
| 21:23 | Call it a week then. Thanks everybody! | |
| 21:28 | NotFound left #parrotsketch | |
| 21:36 | Chandon left #parrotsketch | |
| 22:03 | chromatic joined #parrotsketch | |
| 22:14 | chromatic left #parrotsketch | |
| 22:18 | darbelo left #parrotsketch |
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