Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #parrotsketch, 2011-03-29

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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19:40 kid51 kid51's report
19:40 kid51 * DONE
19:40 kid51 ** Some work on configuration probes for auto::llvm.  Brought the results of this work directly into master.
19:40 kid51 ** Saw some refactoring opportunities in lib/Parrot/Git/Describe.pm, lib/Parrot/SHA1.pm and corresponding config/auto*.pm files and t/configure/*.t tests.  Refactored.
19:40 kid51 ** Cage-cleaning: Reviewed about 20 tickets, which led to about 4 TTs being closed.
19:40 kid51 *** (There was no significant change in number of outstanding Trac tickets this week.)
19:40 kid51 ** Communicated with other Parrot directors and OSUOSL re spamming of Trac.
19:40 kid51 * WILL DO
19:40 kid51 ** Start to poke people about preparations for Apr 30-May 1 Parrot Developer Summit, including:
19:40 kid51 *** Identification of Roadmap Goals needed.
19:40 kid51 *** Identification of teams to work on those Roadmap Goals.
19:41 kid51 *** Identification of areas where GSOC can feed into Roadmap Goals.
19:41 kid51 * Will only be paying half-attention to #parrotsketch today, due to $job needs.
19:41 kid51 * OPINIONS re GSOC PROJECTS/CANDIDATES
19:42 kid51 ** Cet. par., if a project is concerned with building something *on top of* Parrot, that should be something like Python, that's already in our scope, rather than something like Java, which is not in our current scope.
19:43 kid51 ** Cet. par., project slots should go to people who are not waiting for GSOC to start to contribute to Parrot but who are already contributing patches, documentation, tests, etc.  (Merely talking on #parrot for months does not qualify here.)
19:44 kid51 ** Cet. par., projects that take a documentation- and test-driven approach to ones that do not.
19:44 kid51 ** Mis dos centavos
19:44 kid51 **EOR
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19:57 NotFound -parrot
19:57 NotFound * Testing
19:57 NotFound -winxed
19:57 NotFound * instanceof allows more types of class specifiers.
19:57 NotFound * Fix for without initializer bug in stage 0.
19:57 NotFound * New target type --target=include to generate parrot include files.
19:57 NotFound * Minor fixes, refactors and cleanups.
19:57 NotFound What I will do:
19:57 NotFound No plan
19:57 NotFound EOR
19:57 mikehh What I did since my last report:
19:57 mikehh * building and testing parrot on amd64/i386, with gcc/g++
19:57 mikehh * some fixes
19:57 mikehh * branch testing and fixes
19:57 mikehh * removing warnings
19:57 mikehh What I intend to do in the next week:
19:57 mikehh * testing and fixing
19:57 mikehh .eor
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20:04 atrodo .did
20:04 atrodo * started a opsc_lasm branch to test outputting lasm from ops
20:04 atrodo .todo
20:04 atrodo * wrap up isparrotfastyet changes
20:04 atrodo * lorito/m0
20:04 atrodo .blockers
20:04 atrodo * SEGFAULT
20:26 dukeleto joined #parrotsketch
20:26 Util # Done:
20:26 Util * Worked on Parrot Coverity issue on #include recursion
20:26 Util # Plan:
20:26 Util * Finish Coverity issue
20:26 Util * Publish Rakudo Star .dmg
20:26 Util .end
20:27 dukeleto What I did:
20:27 dukeleto * Various GSoC stuff
20:28 dukeleto * Some M0 spec work
20:28 dukeleto What I will do:
20:28 dukeleto * GSoC
20:28 dukeleto Blocking on:
20:28 cotto_work *did:
20:28 cotto_work - M0 roadmap progress
20:28 cotto_work -- specified semantics for all ops
20:28 cotto_work -- called the spec "final", got several holes from atrodo++
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20:28 cotto_work *will do:
20:28 cotto_work - M0 research/implementation
20:28 cotto_work -- look at cyclone and steal the good bits
20:28 cotto_work -- fill in the gaps in the spec
20:28 cotto_work -- start on a prototype assembler
20:28 cotto_work *blockers:
20:28 cotto_work - none
20:28 cotto_work *eor
20:28 cotto_work Hmm.  That didn't all go through.
20:29 cotto_work *did:
20:29 cotto_work - M0 roadmap progress
20:29 cotto_work -- specified semantics for all ops
20:29 cotto_work -- called the spec "final", got several holes from atrodo++
20:29 cotto_work -- got suggestions from lucian++ about imitating Cyclone's pointer safety
20:29 cotto_work --- will dig in and see if it can be done without a heavy runtime cost
20:29 cotto_work - profiling runcore progress
20:29 cotto_work -- none
20:29 cotto_work *will do:
20:29 cotto_work - M0 research/implementation
20:29 cotto_work -- look at cyclone and steal the good bits
20:29 cotto_work -- fill in the gaps in the spec
20:29 cotto_work -- start on a prototype assembler
20:29 cotto_work *blockers:
20:29 cotto_work - none
20:29 cotto_work *eor
20:29 * dukeleto still hasn't gotten access to Coverity
20:30 Util I will poke Coverity.
20:30 cotto_work Howdy.
20:30 mikehh hi there
20:30 Util Hello
20:30 NotFound Hola
20:30 dukeleto Jolly good day, fine parrot hackers.
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20:31 * lucian waves
20:31 dukeleto cgaertner: welcome
20:31 dukeleto cotto_work: are you running this show?
20:31 cotto_work dukeleto: I am.
20:32 cotto_work How'd we do this week?  No specific goals were set, but general comments are welcome.
20:33 bubaflub hello
20:33 tadzik hello
20:33 bacek ~~
20:34 soh_cah_toa joined #parrotsketch
20:34 cgaertner hello
20:34 * bacek is barely here
20:34 cotto_work Trac spam was an issue.  Is anyone looking into a better solution than requiring manual admin intervention?
20:35 soh_cah_toa has anyone seen this? http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/SpamFilter
20:35 soh_cah_toa it's a spam filter for trac
20:36 cotto_work soh_cah_toa: we're running the .11 series
20:36 soh_cah_toa really? and it's still getting through? hmmm...
20:36 cotto_work Someone was looking into upgrading, iirc.
20:36 dukeleto i asked OSL to help us, created a ticket, never heard back
20:36 cotto_work soh_cah_toa: trac v .11.x, not that plugin
20:37 dukeleto if someone else can go into #osuosl on freenode and coordinate with them, that would be awesome
20:37 soh_cah_toa oh okay
20:37 cotto_work dukeleto: if that starts moving, let me know and I'll update the github plugin
20:37 * dukeleto simply doesn't have time to mess with trac
20:38 dukeleto cotto_work: nothing will happen unless a parrot person goes into their irc channel and asks for help and spends time working with them
20:38 dukeleto cotto_work: they are totally overloaded and understaffed
20:38 dukeleto cotto_work: and I can't be that person
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20:38 dukeleto cotto_work: we need a person that is our OSL liason
20:38 cotto_work dukeleto: ok.  If someone wants to volunteer for that, I'll take care of the github plugin.
20:39 lucian_ is now known as lucian
20:40 soh_cah_toa i'd volunteer but i'm still kinda new here
20:40 cotto_work soh_cah_toa: don't let that stop you.
20:40 soh_cah_toa okay, well what would need to be done?
20:41 mikehh soh_cah_toa: you have been volunteered
20:41 * kid51 arrives, able to pay only slight attention
20:41 soh_cah_toa yay :)
20:42 cotto_work soh_cah_toa: we have a handful of trac plugins.  Looking into the upgrade path for those and the general upgrade process for trac would be a good start.
20:42 cotto_work also, soh_cah_toa++
20:42 kid51 soh_cah_toa: dukeleto, I and you can coordinate interfacing with OSUOSL off channel
20:43 kid51 ... so we don't need to discuss it much more here
20:43 soh_cah_toa kid51: sure
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20:43 cotto_work Are there any other points for discussion?
20:44 * lucian_ hates his ISP
20:44 kid51 soh_cah_toa: /q aloha msg kid51 -- your email address and human name so that I can follow up with you later this evening
20:45 dukeleto kid51: i sent an email to parrot-dev about it
20:45 dukeleto GSoC is going to a lot of fun this year.
20:45 cotto_work GSoC is going to be nuts.
20:45 dukeleto We have some very awesome proposals already, and I am sure lots will be submitted at the last possible second (just as melange crashes, no doubt)
20:45 cotto_work (in a good way)
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20:47 cgaertner I have some question re my gsoc proposal, if there's nothing else left to discuss...
20:47 mikehh what I have seen so far is good
20:47 dukeleto smolder is still not working very reliably
20:47 dukeleto it needs to be restarted every few hours in a cron job to prevent memory leaks
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20:48 lucian__ is now known as lucian
20:48 * dukeleto is slightly concerned that chromatic++ has vanished
20:49 dukeleto cotto_work: do we want to discuss gsoc proposals in here?
20:49 benabik Quick comment, re kid51's preference for students to contribute pre-GSoC:  I know my school workload is pretty heavy this quarter, so people who might be able to do awesome things this summer might not be able to do much beforehand.  </My $0.02>
20:49 cotto_work dukeleto: I don't see any reason not to, if there's nothing more pressing.
20:50 * lucian selfishly agrees with benabik
20:51 cgaertner right, so I'll go ahead, then
20:51 allison dukeleto: chromatic has had a lot of consulting work lately
20:51 cotto_work cgaertner: go for it.
20:51 cgaertner my problem is figuring out a timeline
20:51 dukeleto benabik: that will definitely be taken into account
20:52 cgaertner the project has two parts: getting GObject to talk to parrot and getting Parrot to talk to gobject
20:52 cgaertner however, the first part seems pretty trivial (just wrapping libparrot's C API)
20:52 cgaertner so the bulk of the time should be taken for the second part
20:52 lucian cgaertner, in vala, or something?
20:53 cgaertner however, I don't know enough about parrot guts to make an educated guess how long that will take...
20:53 cgaertner lucian: once you have GObject binding, vala follows trivially...
20:54 lucian cgaertner: i mean about embedding libparrot in gobject apps. vala's easier
20:55 tadzik Vala on Parrot wouldn't be that great if it doesn't enable the seamless C libs usage, as current Vala does
20:55 tadzik seamless Parrot libs in current Vala: that'd be Awesome, imho
20:56 lucian no, i meant consuming parrot from gobject. vala is an easier implementation language
20:56 lucian consuming gobject from parrot, that's gobject-introspection + NCI or libffi
20:56 tadzik yeah
20:58 cgaertner using a simple perl-script, I'm halfway to getting access to all PMC vtable functions through a GObject wrapper class
20:58 cgaertner once that's done, vapi files can probably auto-generated
20:58 lucian ah, nice
20:58 dukeleto cgaertner: very exciting to hear
20:58 lucian well, you could conceivably generate gir data eventually
20:58 lucian so that g-i works on the parrot proxies
20:59 cgaertner the problem is that it seems too simple for gsoc - I might finish it before coding even starts...
20:59 lucian and then parrot can consume gobjects (that are parrot objects themselves)
20:59 dukeleto cgaertner: i think writing proper tests and docs will take some time
20:59 cgaertner so I need something else as a fallback if a get g-i to work too soon...
20:59 lucian well, look at what pygobject-introspection folks are doing
20:59 dukeleto cgaertner: and once you start writing tests, little corner cases start popping out of the woodwork
20:59 lucian they've been working for a few years on that
21:00 bubaflub cgaertner: having a plan in your proposal if you finish early is good - perhaps some advanced examples, even examples from other HLLs on parrot
21:00 dukeleto cgaertner: writing a simple "introduction to using gobject from parrot" would make a great thing to work on if you finish early
21:01 benabik cgaertner: Reference and Introductory documentation is excellent, as are very thorough tests.
21:01 tadzik maybe rewrite some Vala internals to use Parrot instead of Glib?
21:02 cgaertner I should probably get in touch with the python guys to find out what problems they encountered
21:02 lucian cgaertner: i'd be very impressed with a Gtk app on parrot at the end of gsoc
21:02 lucian cgaertner: you can find them on gimpnet #python
21:02 cgaertner tadzik: that was actually one of my first ideas: get valac to output pir instead of C
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21:03 lucian it can already output js, can't it?
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21:03 cgaertner back
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21:06 lucian i would also have some object system questions, not sure if appropriate for #ps
21:06 cotto_work lucian: probably best in #parrot
21:07 cgaertner I'll do some more thinking and will start to draft a formal proposal during the next few days so I can get some more feedback before the deadline
21:09 dukeleto cgaertner: sounds like a good plan
21:09 cotto_work Would anyone like to propose goals for the coming week?
21:10 tadzik I want to finish DaD once for all
21:10 tadzik preferably in weekendtime
21:10 dukeleto Reach out to prospective gsoc students
21:10 cotto_work tadzik: what will make you consider it "done"?
21:11 dukeleto tadzik: i see DaD as an ongoing thing
21:11 * cotto_work too
21:11 dukeleto tadzik: what feature of DaD are you trying to "complete" ?
21:13 tadzik well, what's on my tasklist :)
21:13 tadzik the wiki page, and matching by a string, not only by a regex
21:14 tadzik the most important thing is filling the patterns in api.yaml, but no one seems to be interested about that
21:14 cotto_work tadzik: file a ticket
21:14 tadzik will do
21:14 tadzik added to todo
21:15 tadzik ETOOTIRED today
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