Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #parrotsketch, 2011-08-02

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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18:00 kid51 kid51's report
18:01 kid51 * DONE
18:01 kid51 ** Will miss first 30 min of #ps today.
18:01 kid51 ** Participated in online PDS Sat July 30.  Posted summary with new roadmap goals.
18:01 kid51 ** Favorable test results enabled closing of TT #2096.
18:01 kid51 ** Overall count (Trac report #10): 511 (it was 510 one week ago).
18:01 kid51 * WILL BE DOING
18:02 kid51 ** Planning Parrot Foundation annual meeting and election.
18:02 kid51 ** Hope to find some time to think about the benchmarking goal.
18:02 kid51 ** Taking additional look at docs/project/release_manager_guide.pod.
18:02 kid51 * EOR
18:02 kid51 left #parrotsketch
18:04 lucian Report
18:04 lucian Done:
18:04 lucian - fixed a horrible object system __getattribute__ bug
18:04 lucian - minor cleanups
18:04 lucian - some incremental improvements in the compiler
18:04 lucian Todo:
18:04 lucian - make all object system tests pass again
18:05 lucian - refactor compiler to handle scopes better (with a general Codegen class)
18:05 lucian EOR
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18:48 NotFound What I did:
18:48 NotFound -parrot
18:48 NotFound * Fixed a test and added a missing vtable pod doc.
18:48 NotFound * Worried about NCI and string encodings.
18:48 NotFound -winxed
18:48 NotFound * Added __CLASS__ and __NAMESPACE__ predefined constants.
18:48 NotFound * Resurrected winxed.org website after some problems with my hosting.
18:48 NotFound Thanks to my friend Luis Villaverde for his free hosting, BTW.
18:48 NotFound What I will do:
18:48 NotFound * Keep looking for NCI and string encodings.
18:48 NotFound EOR
18:50 lucian joined #parrotsketch
18:56 Util # Done: Attended Parrot Developer Summit.
18:56 Util # Plan to do: Nothing ($WORK).
18:56 Util .end
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19:19 whiteknight WHAT I DID
19:19 whiteknight * Moved. Huge pain in the butt. Still have more to do. Have very little free time and shoddy internet access
19:19 whiteknight * Couldn't be at PDS. Backscrolled. Seemed like a good, productive meeting.
19:19 whiteknight * Trying to help soh_cah_toa with his debugger. Did some testing, need to meet with him more to start moving forward. Looked at IMCC line numbers and other horrors.
19:19 whiteknight * Lots of fixes to Rosella. I had pushed a lot of disruptive changes to master instead of a branch, and got lots of bug reports.
19:20 whiteknight * Some parrot branchwork. Added a cache for load_bytecode_p_s, and some other fixes. Worked more on whiteknight/imcc_tag branch, and got some feedback from several people. Wrote a few quick tests for the new syntax, need more.
19:20 whiteknight WHAT I WILL DO
19:20 whiteknight * Help soh_cah_toa with debugger. Look more at IMCC line numbers
19:20 whiteknight * Preparations for 6model work with NotFound++ and other interested volunteers
19:20 whiteknight * Some Rosella work.
19:20 whiteknight EOR
19:20 tcurtis DID:
19:20 tcurtis * Worked on DPDA interpreter.
19:20 tcurtis * Committed stuff.
19:20 tcurtis * Tests.
19:20 tcurtis * Start on epsilon-transition elimination.
19:20 tcurtis WILL DO:
19:20 tcurtis * Blog.
19:20 tcurtis * Fix bugs.
19:20 tcurtis * Finish LR(0) parser generation and DPDA interpreter.
19:20 tcurtis * Comments/tests.
19:20 tcurtis EOR
19:20 bubaflub DID:
19:21 bubaflub * Finished moving
19:21 bubaflub * Emailed GMP people about licensing stuff
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19:21 bubaflub * Some docs
19:21 bubaflub WILL DO:
19:21 bubaflub * Finish docs for project
19:21 bubaflub EOR
19:22 benabik DID:
19:22 benabik * Separated out PIR and PBC generation
19:22 benabik * Decided to test each step of making PBC separately
19:22 benabik * Immediatly discoverd bugs in newPOST
19:22 benabik WILL DO:
19:22 benabik * Debug newPOST
19:22 benabik * Blog (honest)
19:22 benabik BLOCKERS:
19:22 benabik * Subtle differences between newPOST and existing POST classes
19:22 benabik * newPOST not generating PIR
19:22 benabik * newPOST not generating PBC
19:22 benabik EOR
19:24 kid51 afk; will backscroll
19:26 cotto_work *did:
19:26 cotto_work - PDS - kid51++ for leading
19:26 cotto_work -- got a goodly batch of new items on my todo list
19:26 cotto_work - started organizing soh_cah_toa's project based on issues he's run into with imcc
19:26 cotto_work - M0/mole progress:
19:26 cotto_work -- got M0 tests passing on all platforms
19:26 cotto_work -- tightened some loose ends of the spec (still needs review though)
19:26 cotto_work - profiling
19:26 cotto_work -- nothing
19:26 cotto_work *todo
19:26 cotto_work - turn docs/dev/profiling.pod into some we can point users at
19:26 cotto_work - M0 spec, Mole planning
19:26 cotto_work - help soh_cah_toa figure out a good path forward
19:26 cotto_work - YAPC::EU prep
19:26 cotto_work .end
19:30 whiteknight hello
19:31 cotto_work hi
19:31 benabik hi
19:32 bubaflub hello
19:32 * lucian waves
19:32 cotto_work How this week go?  PDS looked good from my perspective.
19:33 tcurtis ~~
19:34 Util Hello
19:34 NotFound Hola
19:35 cotto_work any comments on the past week, PDS-related or not?
19:37 whiteknight no
19:37 cotto_work I guess not.
19:38 whiteknight PDS was good. I'm sorry I missed it
19:38 cotto_work I don't see any questions queued.  This might be a very short #ps.
19:38 NotFound q1q
19:38 cotto_work NotFound: go ahead
19:39 NotFound https://www.parrot.org/content/we-need-better-way-get-strings-nci
19:39 bubaflub NotFound++
19:39 NotFound Someone object to the addition of a get_string method to UnManagedStruct?
19:39 whiteknight UnManagedStruct is where it probably needs to go right now, but I don't like it as a long-term solution
19:40 cotto_work whiteknight: +1
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19:40 whiteknight UnManagedStruct is deprecated, after all, even if we're not moving fast about removing it
19:40 NotFound Yeah, but I'm not aware of what willbe its replacement. The same method can be added toit.
19:42 NotFound Its replacement as the value returned in NCI 'p' return type, I mean.
19:43 whiteknight as a temporary solution, +1. Add an experimental note
19:44 NotFound Well, the point of asking is to not make it experimental.
19:44 NotFound I think we need that as a supported feature.
19:46 NotFound Temporary, the fact of being in UnManagedStruct. Supported, having that method in whatever 'p' returns.
19:47 whiteknight right
19:47 whiteknight UnManagedStruct is temporary
19:47 whiteknight the replacement will be supported
19:48 NotFound As long as UnManagedStruct is deprecated, an experimental note about one method on it is redundant.
19:49 moritz does anybody have a vision on how interaction with NCI should look like?
19:49 NotFound var p = some_call_that_return_p(); string result = p.get_string('utf8');
19:49 mikehh We are quite entitled to change our minds about something being deprecated
19:50 whiteknight I've been kicking around a few ideas, I'll have to put some stuff to paper eventually
19:50 * kid51 is back, > or <
19:50 whiteknight mikehh: sure, but I think many people want to see UnManagedStruct and ManagedStruct destroyed
19:51 mikehh yeah, but if we find a use for it :-}
19:51 whiteknight better question is, what do we want NCI to look like in the long term, not just what our temporary solutions to current problems are going to look like
19:51 whiteknight a good redesign of the subsystem might obviate all these issues
19:52 NotFound I want to show how a good use of NCI will look like. That's why I want that functionality.
19:52 mikehh well that is the purpose of good design
19:52 bubaflub i've talked briefly with plobsing++ about the future of NCI - i think most of it is still in his head
19:53 NotFound whiteknight: a good redesign will benefit a lot from real use cases. I can't write the use cases I have in mind because of that problem.
19:53 mikehh we seriously need to consider bus numbers there
19:53 lucian NotFound++
19:54 NotFound Well, I can'r write them... and see lots of errors test in lots of platforms, user locale variants...
19:54 cotto_work Let's go with a method on UnmanagedStruct for the time being.
19:56 NotFound The method name I plan to use is get_string because is what ByteBuffer uses for the same.
19:56 cotto_work -1 to the name because of the collision with the VTABLE function
19:57 whiteknight as_string
19:57 cotto_work but that's not a hard fix
19:57 NotFound No, but if want to make it a feature supported, will be good to fix the name now.
20:00 NotFound Or at least before the next release.
20:00 cotto_work NotFound: are you happy with "as_string"?
20:00 benabik as_encodign?
20:01 NotFound cotto_work: yes
20:01 whiteknight +1
20:01 cotto_work NotFound: great.  I'll look forward to reviewing your branch.
20:03 NotFound EOQ then
20:04 cotto_work any other questions or suggestions for goals for the next week?
20:04 whiteknight make code
20:04 cotto_work make: *** No rule to make target `code'.  Stop.
20:06 cotto_work Do we have any deprecations in need of removing now that we're past the supported release?
20:09 NotFound Maybe we need a deprecation control team.
20:10 cotto_work NotFound: what would that team do?
20:10 cotto_work wield the deprecation chainsaw to make sure that the policy is followed?
20:12 NotFound Don't know... I wish I had a good answer.
20:12 cotto_work if you do, please blog about it
20:14 cotto_work any other questions?
20:18 whiteknight nope
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20:27 cotto_work Let's call it a wrap.
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