Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #pdl, 2014-08-14

| Channels | #pdl index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
06:07 mohawk joined #pdl
11:16 mohawk #london.pm is talking about "state of the perl market"
11:17 mohawk comparing it to python, which is doing well in financial institutions because eg numpy
11:18 mohawk i am certain TPF would grant a grant if one could improve PDL towards making perl be more relevant for finance etc
13:49 vicash mohawk there is already PDL::Finance::Talib for Technical analysis but more than that what is needed is examples on how to use it and various other things such as proper financial plotting "made easy"...
13:49 vicash also the fact that most university grads are learning Python as their first or primary language makes them continue using python everywhere just like 10 years ago folks learned Java and were using Java for everything
13:51 Mithaldu yeah, this is not a case of "tools are lacking"
13:51 Mithaldu this is a case of "python has better marketing and better learning materials"
13:52 mohawk so perl would need to improve outreach and docs
13:52 * vicash nods
13:52 Mithaldu it has always needed that
13:52 mohawk i wonder how much professional marketers would charge for that
13:52 Mithaldu modern perl and ovid's beginning perl are the first perl books that are not actually shit for newbies
13:52 vicash professional marketing will not change it much unless jobs that pay Perl programmers more than Python ones will
13:52 Mithaldu and it took until 2012 for them to appear
13:53 Mithaldu yet people are STILL recommending learning perl
13:53 mohawk vicash, i think those are separate problems
13:53 mohawk the swine
13:54 Mithaldu can't tell if you think that is a joking matter or not
13:54 mohawk i have never read any of those books
13:54 mohawk i assume that recommendation is a bad idea, since i trust your judgement
13:55 Mithaldu learning perl still largely ignores strict/warnings, consistent use of my and introduces bareword filehandles as the default tool to use
13:56 mohawk vicash, i'm thinking the good marketing will raise the chance of making companies use perl which creates demand for programmers
13:56 Mithaldu http://perl-tutorial.org/r​ejected/learning_perl_6th/
13:56 mohawk Mithaldu, gack
13:56 vicash i guess so...
13:56 Mithaldu look at the example
13:56 Mithaldu that should remove any doubt as to why python is being used in schools and perl isn't
13:57 mohawk vicash, otherwise even technical whizkids like me recommending perl will just get the response "oh but that's just for CGIs"
13:57 Mithaldu relatedly: it's hard to get competent perl programmers
13:58 Mithaldu (surprise surprise)
13:58 vicash that's true.. most folks who started using perl used it to things that bash couldn't do and that led to countless instances of bad programming  giving perl a bad reputation
13:59 mohawk so
13:59 mohawk professional marketing
13:59 mohawk outreach
13:59 Mithaldu i doubt that'd help much
13:59 Mithaldu it's a roots problem
14:00 Mithaldu figure out how newbies get perl resources and funnel them into useful resources
14:00 vicash attacking areas of application aka "verticals" makes more sense.. for example, astronomy folks use PDL + Perl a lot because it solves their problem and they can get help
14:00 Mithaldu not sure if companies do that kind of research
14:00 Mithaldu then again, perl.org needs to admit that it carries a lot of shit too
14:00 vicash majority of perl users are web developers
14:01 vicash on the scientific side of things the numbers of those who use perl to do the scientific portion maybe in 100s
14:02 mohawk vicash, not much money in astronomy so far as i know
14:04 vicash i think i remember reading on Perldl mailing list that there was some guy from Orbital Sciences who was using Perl+PDL for their work
14:05 vicash Orbital Sciences is a competitor of SpaceX and one of the 2 newer satellite launching companies in the USA.
14:05 vicash but again, that is just one anecdotal example
14:06 mohawk nice
16:15 dj joined #pdl
16:16 sivoais yeah, when I started learning Perl, I found that reading Learning Perl wasn't getting me anywhere fast, so I went ahead and read Intermediate Perl followed a year later by Modern Perl.
17:00 vicash it would be cool to apply PDL to Andrew Ng's machine learning class on Coursera
17:02 sivoais that would give me a reason to finish that course. I've taken several data analysis courses, but I've just written the simplest algorithms: k-means, EM-GMM, Q-learning, etc.
17:03 sivoais all in MATLAB (oh and one in Prolog)
17:42 vicash sivoais: Andrew Ng's voice always puts me to sleep
17:44 sivoais I find it easier to follow a video lecture from workshops <http://videolectures.net/>. They go a bit faster most of the time
18:30 vicash interesting
20:09 cbmuser joined #pdl
23:47 [1]mohawk joined #pdl

| Channels | #pdl index | Today | | Search | Google Search | Plain-Text | summary