Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl11, 2014-12-08

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Time Nick Message
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09:51 willthechill rurban: howdy
09:52 willthechill how do I properly tell my Makefile.PL to install bin/rperl into blib/bin/rperl?
09:52 willthechill (also possibly bin/grammar_recompile.sh?)
09:52 willthechill I do not see anything in the current Makefile.PL code which seems to handle that
09:57 Reini EUMM does that automatically, when you follow the EUMM conventions. i.e. scripts not bin
09:57 willthechill oh so just rename the bin folder to scripts?
09:57 willthechill is that best?
09:57 Reini you can override that with EXE_FILES  => [ 'bin/rperl'' ]
09:57 willthechill "scripts" sounds so... interpreted  :P
09:58 Reini yes, just try EXE_FILES
09:58 willthechill okay great, thanks  :)
09:58 Reini maybe you need PL_FILES also, but I forgot
09:58 willthechill oh dang okay
09:59 Reini lot of people didn't like EUMM defaults, so they use the broken MB which does support bin I thinkg
10:00 willthechill I don't think PL_FILES relates to this
10:07 willthechill okay well EXE_FILES works to add 'bin/rperl'
10:08 willthechill but it keeps copying it to 'blib/script/rperl' instead of 'blib/bin/rperl', even when I set INST_BIN => 'bin'
10:08 willthechill I also tried INST_BIN => 'blib/bin'
10:45 willthechill rurban: EUMM is forcing into 'script/rperl' because it sees rperl is a #! text file, I can override with INST_SCRIPT, is it acceptable to do so?
10:50 rurban INST_BIN is only for the final target
10:50 rurban INST_SCRIPT ditto, blib is only the intermediate target, for testing
10:50 rurban rperl is a script and not a bin
10:50 willthechill yes but INST_BIN and INST_SCRIPT are used as subdirectories for blib/ for testing
10:51 rurban does rperl have +x?
10:51 willthechill yes +x
10:51 willthechill but it is a shebang text file
10:51 willthechill not a binary 010101 file
10:51 willthechill when rperl can bootstrap, then literally it will be a binary file
10:51 willthechill but not yet
10:51 willthechill still interpreted right now
10:52 willthechill if it is bad practice to override INST_SCRIPT then I can leave it be
10:53 willthechill but on my system I always put all +x files into bin/ and I don't ever use script/
10:53 rurban did you try make install? should end up in DESTDIR/bin
10:53 willthechill no I have currently disabled make install
10:53 willthechill I am only dealing with make and make test
10:53 willthechill right now
10:53 rurban you can override INST_SCRIPT in this Makefile.PL, no problem
10:53 willthechill make install later
10:54 willthechill okay great because I have already overridden INST_SCRIPT and it does correctly put 'bin/rperl' into 'blib/bin/rperl' after `make`
10:54 willthechill so I will keep what I have done
10:54 rurban good
10:54 willthechill I say "correctly" because that is just what I thought it should do
10:54 willthechill do people really use the 'scripts/' directory?
10:55 rurban yes
10:55 rurban everybody does
10:55 willthechill oh dang then maybe I should NOT override INST_SCRIPT?
10:55 rurban bin is for binaries, not executables
10:55 willthechill binaries?
10:55 willthechill not executables?
10:55 rurban elf or coff
10:56 willthechill a binary file output by gcc for example is 010101 binary data and it is also +x UNIX permissions
10:56 willthechill a shebang text file with #!/usr/bin/perl or #!/bin/bash is ASCII text data and it is also +x UNIX permissions
10:56 willthechill so I am confused when you say "binary not executable"?
10:57 rurban executables is everything with +x and either a binary or a she-bang
10:57 willthechill right
10:58 willthechill so the 'bin/' directory is for compiled binary 010101 programs output by gcc or some other compiler
10:58 willthechill yes?
10:58 rurban yes
10:58 willthechill and the 'script/' directory is for shebang text programs like rperl is currently
10:58 rurban yes
10:59 willthechill okay then I should NOT override INST_SCRIPT???
11:00 rurban as you want. you have no other scripts so I wouldnt care that much
11:00 willthechill well I do have grammar_recompile.sh in 'bin/' along with rperl
11:01 willthechill and I have lots of .pl files in 'bin/development/'
11:01 rurban that's a problem as it would be installed under that name
11:01 willthechill what would be installed under what name?
11:01 rurban if installed it should be rperl_grammar_recompile.sh or such
11:01 willthechill oh I see
11:01 willthechill okay
11:01 willthechill well I did not include grammar_recompile.sh in EXE_FILES
11:01 willthechill only rperl in EXE_FILES
11:02 willthechill because grammer_recompile.sh should not be run by rperl users, only rperl system programmers, and rarely
11:02 willthechill so when `make` is run, grammer_recompile.sh is not copied to 'blib/'
11:03 willthechill so should I just rename 'bin/' to 'script/' because all my executable files are shebang and not binary?
11:03 rurban I did so in B::C
11:04 rurban it depends how hard you want to fight the system
11:04 willthechill yeah now it REALLY makes me want to make rperl bootstrap, haha!
11:04 rurban I remember you fought against make test also :)
11:04 willthechill grrrrrrr
11:04 willthechill :)
11:05 willthechill but I think we are maybe a ways off from rperl bootstrapping, there is too much magic in rperl system
11:05 willthechill even though I am doing a good job of concentrating that magic to only certain files
11:05 willthechill so much of rperl system can be bootstrapped soon maybe
11:05 willthechill just not all of it
11:06 willthechill anyway, what I want to do is NOT fight the system right now  ;)
11:07 willthechill so I guess I will rename 'bin/' to 'script/'
11:07 willthechill :/
11:08 rurban But then you need to take care that INST_SCRIPT is pointing to $prefix/bin
11:08 rurban because EUMM might be persuaded by perl to install somewhere else
11:09 willthechill I have removed my override of INST_SCRIPT
11:09 willthechill from Makefile.PL
11:10 willthechill and changed EXE_FILES to be 'script/rperl' instead of 'bin/rperl'
11:10 rurban so it depends on the perl config now, perl -V:installscript
11:11 rurban vs perl -V:bin
11:11 rurban eh. perl -V:installbin
11:11 willthechill okay I don't know what that means
11:11 rurban run it
11:12 rurban some packagers seperate those two
11:12 willthechill $ perl -V:installscript
11:12 willthechill installscript='/usr/bin';
11:12 willthechill $ perl -V:installbin
11:12 willthechill installbin='/usr/bin';
11:16 willthechill so is it good or bad that they are the same?
11:17 willthechill and how are my own personal system settings applicable to rperl code which will be distributed to other people?
11:18 rurban if other people have a different installscript rperl will be installed there
11:18 rurban if you override it, not
11:18 rurban I forgot which distro seperates it
11:19 willthechill oh I see
11:19 willthechill and maybe that would cause a problem because the installscript directory is not in their PATH?
11:53 willthechill rurban: I currently have put some .pl files in lib/RPerl/Test/
11:53 willthechill these are files that are parsed to test the grammar
11:54 willthechill should I be moving all those .pl files to script/ instead of lib/ ?
11:54 willthechill Bender trust rurban
11:54 Bender OK, willthechill
11:54 willthechill Bender trust Reini
11:54 Bender OK, willthechill
11:59 rurban if in lib they will not be installed. should they?
12:00 willthechill well these *.pl files should never be used by rperl users, only by rperl tests
12:00 willthechill so only by `make test`
12:00 willthechill or by running the t/*.t files manually using perl or prove
12:02 rurban so they can stay there
12:02 willthechill okay great
12:02 willthechill thanks!  :)
12:04 willthechill so do I need to override installscript or not?
12:04 rurban I have no strong opinion on that
12:05 willthechill well I mean, will it be broken on some people's systems if I do NOT override installscript?
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13:33 travis-ci RPerl build failed. Will Braswell says 'Preprocessor, Interpreted Type Checking, Part 3'
13:33 travis-ci http://travis-ci.org/wbraswell/rperl/builds/43344799 https://github.com/wbraswell/rperl/compare/71372a9b1328...33d135d0f832
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