Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6-dev, 2017-11-15

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Time Nick Message
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00:15 tbrowder MasterDuke: Mike Muuss died in 2000.
00:16 tbrowder nov 20, right around Thanksgiving.
00:28 dugword joined #perl6-dev
00:32 MasterDuke_ i forgot it was quite that long ago
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00:59 travis-ci Rakudo build passed. Jonathan Worthington 'Set no_inline when the dispatcher is needed'
00:59 travis-ci https://travis-ci.org/rakudo/rakudo/builds/302045518 https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/compare/b366859817a5...0ff32c7f8e4a
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01:33 Geth ¦ roast: 1ba17759b9 | (Samantha McVey)++ | S32-str/utf8-c8.t
01:33 Geth ¦ roast: Check that regex works with adjacent utf8-c8 graphemes
01:33 Geth ¦ roast:
01:33 Geth ¦ roast: This is a test for the bug that was fixed in MoarVM commit a0dc2747c.
01:33 Geth ¦ roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/1ba17759b9
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02:05 tbrowder another npq question: where is $*W defined?
02:06 tbrowder *nqp
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02:13 timotimo the actual variable or what's in it?
02:14 timotimo what's in it is in World.nqp
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02:57 Topic for #perl6-dev is now Perl 6 language and compiler development 2.0 | Logs at http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6-dev/today | For toolchain/installation stuff see #perl6-toolchain | For MoarVM see #moarvm
03:12 Zoffix "mi.cro.services took too long to respond." :(
03:12 Zoffix No HTTPS? Boo, what century is this :)
03:15 Zoffix (to clarify: the "too long to respond" error is when trying to access the site via HTTPS, but works fine over HTTP)
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05:56 Geth ¦ nqp: 0bea6888c3 | usev6++ | src/vm/jvm/QAST/Compiler.nqp
05:56 Geth ¦ nqp: [jvm] Fix bug in frugal quant
05:56 Geth ¦ nqp:
05:56 Geth ¦ nqp: Similiar fix as in 854baa6795 for the js backend, pmurias++.
05:56 Geth ¦ nqp:
05:56 Geth ¦ nqp: Fixes RT #125021 and GH#1248 for Rakudo.
05:56 Geth ¦ nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/0bea6888c3
05:56 synopsebot RT#125021 [open]: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=125021 [JVM] Failing test in S05-modifier/perl5_5.t for regex with lazy quantifier on alternation
05:56 synopsebot GH#1248 [open]: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/1248 [JVM] Fix frugal quant on the JVM
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06:48 Topic for #perl6-dev is now Perl 6 language and compiler development 2.0 | Logs at http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6-dev/today | For toolchain/installation stuff see #perl6-toolchain | For MoarVM see #moarvm
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09:49 AlexDaniel` releasable6: next
09:49 releasable6 AlexDaniel`, Next release in 3 days and ≈9 hours. No blockers. 0 out of 196 commits logged
09:49 releasable6 AlexDaniel`, Details: https://gist.github.com/07af778d8aef4defd2a9d581714e434e
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11:38 astj joined #perl6-dev
11:38 lizmat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8stPrG1rDo  # Superglue for the 21st Century
11:42 astj joined #perl6-dev
12:00 tbrowder timotimo: the actual variable
12:01 tbrowder i’m looking in nqp src now...
12:04 lizmat tbrowder: $*W is available at compile time
12:04 lizmat m: my $world := BEGIN $*W; dd $world.^name
12:04 camelia rakudo-moar fff43fd70: OUTPUT: «"Perl6::World"␤»
12:04 lizmat *BUT* is of no use in a precomp environment:
12:04 lizmat ===SORRY!===
12:04 lizmat Serialization Error: missing static code ref for closure '' (src/Perl6/World.nqp:2241)
12:05 tbrowder thnx
12:05 lizmat which makes sense as Perl6::World only really exists when you're compiling
12:05 lizmat and running a precomped module isn't compiling  :-)
12:05 lizmat Files=1228, Tests=75835, 316 wallclock secs (15.12 usr  5.36 sys + 2185.71 cusr 213.53 csys = 2419.72 CPU)
12:07 Geth ¦ roast: 9274b5c31f | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | S32-str/utf8-c8.t
12:07 Geth ¦ roast: Unfudge now passing test
12:07 Geth ¦ roast: review: https://github.com/perl6/roast/commit/9274b5c31f
12:08 tbrowder i’m trying to understand the flow from Pod.nqp into creating the Perl 6 Pod classs...
12:08 tbrowder *classes
12:09 astj joined #perl6-dev
12:11 tbrowder looks like table cells need to be a class so formatting is handled like other pod blocks
12:11 tbrowder thus grammar would need changing i think...
12:12 astj joined #perl6-dev
12:17 [Tux] Rakudo version 2017.10-196-gfff43fd70 - MoarVM version 2017.10-80-ga0dc2747c
12:17 [Tux] csv-test-xs-20      0.420 -  0.466
12:17 [Tux] csv-ip5xs           1.107 -  1.110
12:17 [Tux] test-t --race       1.292 -  1.352
12:17 [Tux] test-t              3.197 -  3.228
12:17 [Tux] test               11.741 - 11.752
12:17 [Tux] csv-parser         12.036 - 12.254
12:17 [Tux] csv-ip5xs-20       12.809 - 12.878
12:17 [Tux] test-t-20 --race   20.245 - 20.700
12:17 [Tux] test-t-20          58.923 - 59.824
12:17 [Tux] sorry for being late
12:23 DrForr I've noticed some of my stuff go up in performance over the last few days too.
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12:31 Geth ¦ rakudo: 92c8f321e7 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog
12:31 Geth ¦ rakudo: Add Telemetry related commits to ChangeLog
12:31 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/92c8f321e7
12:44 Geth ¦ rakudo: 15eb4f68c1 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog
12:44 Geth ¦ rakudo: Some more ChangeLog entries
12:44 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/15eb4f68c1
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12:53 tbrowder ...or, do some magic in Pod.npq to build the new table cell class structure and send it on to Perl 6 land...
12:53 tbrowder *Pod.nqp
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13:26 Geth ¦ rakudo: 2c84f77e74 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | 2 files
13:26 Geth ¦ rakudo: Move the ThreadPoolScheduler data collection logic
13:26 Geth ¦ rakudo:
13:26 Geth ¦ rakudo: - to make a similar API to Thread.usage
13:26 Geth ¦ rakudo: - allowing other modules access to the data without needing to know internals
13:26 Geth ¦ rakudo: - no change in functionality
13:26 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/2c84f77e74
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: ca521e9ee7 | pmurias++ | src/vm/js/Compiler.nqp
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: [js] Fix order in which named arguments are taken
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/ca521e9ee7
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: 08c36bd1e7 | pmurias++ | src/vm/js/Operations.nqp
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: [js] Fix bug when an container is passed incorrectly as this
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/08c36bd1e7
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: eea1c6aafe | pmurias++ | src/vm/js/Operations.nqp
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: [js] Register atomic ops without implementing them
13:27 Geth ¦ nqp: review: https://github.com/perl6/nqp/commit/eea1c6aafe
13:44 Geth ¦ rakudo: ad2008d1c0 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog
13:44 Geth ¦ rakudo: Some more ChangeLog additions I know about
13:44 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/ad2008d1c0
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14:21 Geth ¦ rakudo: 0b35c4adcc | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog
14:21 Geth ¦ rakudo: Another set of ChangeLog additions
14:21 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/0b35c4adcc
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15:32 tbrowder i know everyone is busy here, but i would appreciate at least a quick look at rakudo PR #1240 (fix for 5 documented pod bugs) to see if i’m heading in the right direction. (note there is a companion roast PR for associated tests.) if it looks fundamentally ok, i will piggy-back off it to investigate pod table cell formatting.
15:41 * lizmat tries
15:45 tbrowder lizmat: thnx
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15:49 tbrowder .tell timotimo you mentioned you worked on tables but TT didn’t like the two-pass-parsing. is that code available to see?
15:49 yoleaux tbrowder: I'll pass your message to timotimo.
15:50 pmurias joined #perl6-dev
15:54 lizmat tbrowder: I'm seeing test 42 fail in S26-documentation/07-tables.t , is that to be expected ?
15:54 lizmat also: I see no TODO tests passing, is that also expected ?
15:55 timotimo is that with the roast pr tb mentioned?
15:55 yoleaux 15:49Z <tbrowder> timotimo: you mentioned you worked on tables but TT didn’t like the two-pass-parsing. is that code available to see?
15:55 timotimo i think that code lived in a gist a long time ago
15:56 timotimo tbrowder: https://gist.github.com/timo/6132249 - this may be it?
15:56 timotimo m: https://gist.github.com/timo/6132249
15:56 camelia rakudo-moar 0b35c4adc: OUTPUT: «Superhero, 4␤Secret, 38␤Identity, 20␤Superpower, 38␤[["Superhero"], "Identity", ["Secret"]]␤2␤The Shoveller, 4␤[Any]␤0␤Eddie Stevens, 20␤[["The Shoveller"],]␤1␤King Arthur's, 38␤[["The Shoveller"], ["Eddie Stevens"]]␤2␤si…»
15:57 timotimo i don't see the formatting code support there though
16:00 tbrowder lizmat: it’s not real clear, but you also need the roast PR...
16:01 tbrowder PR #353
16:04 lizmat tbrowder: wouldn't that also need a change in t/spectest.data ?
16:05 tbrowder hm, i don’t know—i didn’t think to look at that, i was just looking at the S26 tests...
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16:06 tbrowder let me see...
16:07 brrt left #perl6-dev
16:10 tbrowder yes, sorry, back to the drawing board...i just ran the S26 tests alone without the whole harness. i’ll update the spectest.data and try the whole thing.
16:11 tbrowder in rakudo PR #1240
16:25 tbrowder i've made the changes to PR #1240 and running the whole spectest suite now.
16:26 lizmat tbrowder: if that is clean, I'm ok with putting it in
16:27 lizmat but I must admit perhaps someone with more domain knowledge should also have a look
16:27 lizmat because it's noob territory for me mostly
16:29 japhb What org needs money to continue funding Perl 6 dev?  I went to look for available organizations to company-match, and the only one registered at my company with "Perl" in the title is the Perl 5 Core Maintenance Fund.  Which is worthy and all, but I want to specifically give to Perl *6* dev, and donating to TPF in general seems likely to miss the mark too.
16:29 japhb (Has to be a charitable org in the US, if that matters.)
16:30 tbrowder ok, i'll report test results here momentarily.  ref more current domain knowledge, i defer to your expertise, but timotimo worked on tables in the bowels of the grammar so maybe he can look, too.  also, Zoffix was new here when the problem was first reported, but he was involved a bit.
16:31 lizmat japhb: maybe you should talk to [Coke] about that
16:32 lizmat I mean, if TPF is not about Perl 6 as well anymore, we have some changes to make
16:33 moritz what about the Perl 6 development fund, or whatever the thing that pays or paid jnthn++?
16:35 AlexDaniel` releasable6: status
16:35 releasable6 AlexDaniel`, Next release in 3 days and ≈2 hours. No blockers. 106 out of 201 commits logged
16:35 releasable6 AlexDaniel`, Details: https://gist.github.com/7720819e9747c6425a796d17d9467dd6
16:36 tbrowder timotimo: thnx, code is helpful even if there is no explicit formatting code handling.
16:36 * lizmat wonders: do we actually have an idiomatic way of taking elements of a Seq until/while a condition is met ?
16:37 lizmat other than .map: { if condition { last } }
16:37 AlexDaniel` Oh wow. Lizmat++
16:37 lizmat AlexDaniel`: yeah, I've been busy :-)
16:40 ilmari japhb: http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl_6_core_development_fund ?
16:40 moritz lizmat: gather for theseq { last if condition; take $_ }
16:40 lizmat yuck :)
16:40 ilmari is that not still operating?
16:41 moritz lizmat: though I wouldn't object to a .while method on seqs and lists
16:41 AlexDaniel` lizmat: at first I thought the bot has a bug and reports incorrect numbers :D
16:41 lizmat moritz: yeah, was thinking the same thing
16:41 moritz maybe also run it by jnthn or TimToady or so
17:02 lizmat hmmm... I'm also surprised now that we don't have a .batch on Seq
17:03 * lizmat clearly hasn't done enough Perl 6 application programming
17:04 Zoffix m: ().Seq.batch: 42
17:04 camelia rakudo-moar 0b35c4adc: ( no output )
17:04 Zoffix lizmat: we do
17:05 Zoffix s: ().Seq,
17:05 SourceBaby Zoffix, Something's wrong: ␤ERR: Cannot resolve caller sourcery(Seq); none of these signatures match:␤    ($thing, Str:D $method, Capture $c)␤    ($thing, Str:D $method)␤    (&code)␤    (&code, Capture $c)␤  in block <unit> at -e line 6␤␤
17:05 Zoffix s: ().Seq, 'batch', \(42)
17:05 SourceBaby Zoffix, Sauce is at https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/blob/4fca94743/src/core/Any-iterable-methods.pm#L1895
17:05 lizmat hmm... then we have a doc bug
17:05 Zoffix Looks like all Anys have it
17:06 tbrowder lizmat: got some spectest  failures, but not in S26 (looks like stuff that has been fixed since; "This is Rakudo version 2017.10-66-ge13d5b6 built on MoarVM version 2017.10-29-g116c7a1")
17:07 tbrowder moar used almost 5 Gb during the tests (growing all the time). took 37 min on my  4 Gb laptop (lots of paging)
17:11 Geth ¦ rakudo: 9096dafb4c | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | docs/ChangeLog
17:11 Geth ¦ rakudo: Document changes for GH #1226
17:11 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/9096dafb4c
17:11 Geth ¦ rakudo: 99f38f9fe4 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | tools/build/missing-commits.pl6
17:11 Geth ¦ rakudo: A tool for finding out which commits haven't been documented yet
17:11 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/99f38f9fe4
17:11 synopsebot RAKUDO#1226 [open]: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/issues/1226 Broken default value assignment on shaped array attributes
17:13 lizmat AlexDaniel`: ^^^ thought would be nice to have such a tool
17:13 jnthn tbrowder: The tests spawn many instances of moar (one per test file); lowering TEST_JOBS may give a speedup if it lowers memory use sufficient to avoid swapping
17:14 tbrowder jnthn: thnx
17:14 lizmat jnthn: thoughts about Seq.while and Seq.until ?
17:14 tbrowder i need to pay more attention to extant docs
17:18 lizmat afk for a few hours&
17:32 releasable6 joined #perl6-dev
17:37 Zoffix …^ op is kinda like Seq.until (or at least how I imagine Seq.until is to be)
17:37 Zoffix m: say 1, *.succ …^ 42
17:37 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «(1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41)␤»
17:37 Zoffix m: say 1, *.succ …^ { $++ > 5 }
17:37 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «(1 2 3 4 5 6)␤»
17:37 Zoffix m: say {say "generating stuff"; rand} …^ { $++ > 5 }
17:37 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «generating stuff␤generating stuff␤generating stuff␤generating stuff␤generating stuff␤generating stuff␤generating stuff␤(0.465865302345503 0.932493070960178 0.0401501641579721 0.236832596153431 0.84680654660632 0.763167124876054)␤»
17:38 Zoffix Still need to write a good article about it :(
17:38 jnthn m: my @a = 1, 3, 9, 5, 7; say @a ... 9
17:38 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «(1 3 9)␤»
17:39 jnthn m: my @a = 1, 1, 3, 9, 5, 7; say @a ... * != 1
17:39 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «(1 1 3)␤»
17:39 jnthn m: my @a = 1, 1, 3, 9, 5, 7; say @a ...^ * != 1
17:39 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «(1 1)␤»
17:39 jnthn :)
17:40 Zoffix Yeah, I love that feature.
17:45 jnthn I think I prefer that to a .while/.until methods, especially as it gives you the ^ endpoint option as a bonus :)
17:50 jnthn home time o/
17:57 masak m: say ([\+] rand xx Inf) ... * > 1
17:57 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «(0.647021356833719 1.50077952849024)␤»
17:58 masak m: say (([\+] rand xx Inf) ... * > 1).elems
17:58 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «3␤»
17:58 masak m: say (([\+] rand xx Inf) ... * > 1).elems xx 10
17:58 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «(2 5 3 3 2 2 2 2 2 2)␤»
17:58 [Coke] https://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6-dev/2017-11-15#i_15453027 - whoa, whoa, whoa.
17:59 masak m: constant N = 100; say ([+] (([\+] rand xx Inf) ... * > 1).elems xx N) / N
17:59 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «2.66␤»
17:59 masak approximation of e :)
18:00 samcv good *
18:00 masak \o
18:01 Zoffix masak++
18:02 masak m: say e
18:02 camelia rakudo-moar 99f38f9fe: OUTPUT: «2.71828182845905␤»
18:02 [Coke] japhb: in general, if you want to donate to TPF, the treasurer is the person to talk to. I have already mentioned to dan that I can see a donate link for the p5 fund, but not the p6 fund; haven't seen a response on that yet.
18:03 [Coke] On the matching side; I don't know anything about why something other than just "TPF" would show up in your list of orgs to donate to; that's something else that would probably have to be coordinated with Dan. I'm happy to proxy these questions if you like.
18:04 [Coke] but TPF is very much about all the perls.
18:04 samcv [Coke]: does the perl foundation have an amazon smile thing?
18:04 samcv then they'd get 1% of purchases i think when you buy at smile.amazon.com
18:05 [Coke] I don't know. *I* personally have an amazon referrer link I'd be happy to share, though. :)
18:05 [Coke] (Seriously, I'll ask the Treasurer about that as well)
18:06 samcv just searched and don't see it there. i'd happily add them as an org if they set that up!
18:07 samcv i mean select them on my amazon smile profile that is
18:07 [Coke] ah. I missed Dan++'s reply: they are working on setting up the links so that there will be a direct link on the site we can use to donate to the individual funds. "the complexity of the CRM is somewhat daunting"
18:11 [Coke] samcv: pinged him on the smile question.
18:11 [Coke] japhb: do you have any more details of where you found the p5 link?
18:11 [Coke] was it an employers list of orgs they match with?
18:11 [Coke] Or was it via some tpf site?
18:15 japhb Yeah, the employer'
18:15 japhb s list
18:15 japhb FEK
18:16 japhb The deal is that I'm happy to do the paperwork to add to the employer's list ... but I need to know what to actually request.
18:16 japhb In particular, I want 100% of my donation *and* 100% of the company's match (sent separately) to end up going to Perl 6 work.
18:30 [Coke] if you can msg me the details you see for the p5 fund, that will probably help.
18:45 japhb [Coke]: Done for the overview info, but I didn't post all the tax/contact info in the details.
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19:01 [Coke] samcv: http://news.perlfoundation.org/2014/03/tpf-is-now-participating-on-am.html
19:02 [Coke] so, yes, since 2014
19:04 [Coke] (The Perl Foundation is a d.b.a. (doing business as) for Yet Another Society.
19:04 [Coke] )
19:19 dogbert17 [Coke], do you think anyone would be upset if we fixed the missing words on the type.html page by removing the non-working links, e. g. 'BackTrace::Frame     Class     Single Frame of a <missing word here>' ?
19:21 dogbert17 here's the non working code from the pod:  =SUBTITLE Single frame of a L<Backtrace>
19:22 [Coke] dogbert17: i need more context.
19:22 [Coke] URL?
19:23 [Coke] I assume this is the doc site
19:23 dogbert17 https://docs.perl6.org/type.html
19:23 dogbert17 another example from the same page is 'Supplier'
19:45 perlpilot_ joined #perl6-dev
19:50 samcv [Coke]: oh it's not listed under The Perl Foundation that's why
19:53 [Coke] dogbert17: I mean, ideally, we should make those links work, but I'd rather have a missing feature than broken text.
19:58 Zoffix FWIW it's D#209
19:58 synopsebot D#209 [open]: https://github.com/perl6/doc/issues/209 [POD] L<>s in =SUBTITLE do not work
20:02 [Coke] I think one commit that removed them for now tagged to the ticket, and another later to undo that and fix the underlying issue would be fine.
20:02 [Coke] dogbert17++ Zoffix++
20:06 dogbert17 ok, I'll fix it a little later unless someone beats me to it
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23:50 Geth ¦ rakudo: 6db51f9753 | (Elizabeth Mattijsen)++ | tools/build/missing-commits.pl6
23:50 Geth ¦ rakudo: Simplify helper script through the power of set operators
23:50 Geth ¦ rakudo: review: https://github.com/rakudo/rakudo/commit/6db51f9753
23:54 AlexDaniel Does anybody know what's going on with RT#132441?
23:54 synopsebot RT#132441 [new]: https://rt.perl.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=132441 [SEVERE] Windows REPL cannot handle «, » characters
23:55 AlexDaniel or is it simply the nature of whatever terminal was used?

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