Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6-toolchain, 2016-05-13

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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07:49 nine MadcapJake: my refactoring is mostly done :) It should be reasonably safe now to write a CompUnit::Repository.
07:51 nine Having an alternative CompUnit::PrecompilationStore has become more possible, too now. I moved much of the file access into CompUnit::PrecompilationStore::File. But there are still a couple of loose ends.
07:52 nine However I think the most pressing issue is now to finally get ugexe's Distribution overhaul merged and get a much more reasonable interface for installers.
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14:27 ugexe i can go over things again and fix conflicts, but we should probably figure out a few details first. 1. what/how to break meta spec (i.e.  auth/authority/author) 2. special handling of version * (if something with version '*' gets installed you cannot install that module with any other version without force). Maybe when installing version '*' in the meta should mean A. installed but always update or
14:27 ugexe B. installed but only *string* matches '*' (again, only for meta and during installation) 3. CURI API or something to get the revdeps to uninstall distributions 4. Figure out a way/api for resources to install non-mangled names (seems to be OS specific cases, so these things should already be named safely: see windows dlls that cant be renamed)
14:30 ugexe to clarify point 4 see this commit to openssl that was needed because nativecall said it could not find the dll with the mangled name (the real error must be something else, because the file actually exists) https://github.com/sergot/openssl/commit/91efa8c4f53e86501f23b3a6aeb4184cfedbfa9f
14:33 jdv79 oh lovely.  nqp::sha1 being used outside.  should be fun to change that to a human readable form then.
14:35 ugexe well if you ever get a change to look in a windows $*TMPDIR you'll see it fits right in
14:35 ugexe but yeah its a giant hack that needs to die asap
14:38 nine I'd totally be up for 123456789abcdef/foo.so instead of 123456789abcdef.so
14:39 nine To be safe we could use punycode for the file name. foo.so should stay untouched this way and we're still fine with Unicode.
14:39 nine Using Unicode dll names and expecting it to work on Windows will just be too much
14:41 ugexe why does renaming the dll affect it anyway? you can move the dll to different folders just fine, so i can only guess the base name gets baked into the symbol names or something?
14:45 ugexe Cannot locate native library 'C:\rakudo\share\perl6\site\resources\5AC8B407FC19FF40B94E90605A758D6AF872EF83.dll': error 0x7f in method setup at sources\24DD121B5B4774C04A7084827BFAD92199756E03 (NativeCall) line 279 # this is the exact error; the file mentioned does actually exist
14:52 nine Maybe it's not even Windows but NativeCall that tries to be smart somehow?
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14:56 ugexe could be. i traced it to nqp::buildnativecall (which appears to get passed all the correct arguments) but looking at that code was greek to me
15:28 nine With my latest commits we should be good for building as unpriviledged user and installing system wide now.
15:29 nine Successfully created rpm packages that work :)
15:38 jdv79 is punycode better than simple uri style encoding of higher than ascii?
15:38 jdv79 i think that's what CHI uses and i believe its cross platform
15:42 nine Oh yes, that may work just as well
15:42 jdv79 i'm sure there is way better material but this is what i remember from last $work: https://github.com/jonswar/perl-chi/blob/master/lib/CHI/Driver.pm#L737-L742
15:43 jdv79 fairly boring
15:43 nine I'd say any simple encoding that leaves plain ASCII intact is good
15:44 jdv79 yeah.  punycode just seems uncommon to me but maybe that's just me.  i know uri-ish encoding pretty well cause its very common (again to me)...:)
15:44 jdv79 almost anything is better than the opaqueness that exists now
15:46 nine Though I've read much fewer complaints since backtraces are readable again
15:56 mst honestly, people putting clever things in file names can enjoy whatever happens to them
15:56 mst I just want 'locate' to work rather than the mad sha thing ;)
15:57 mst I like punycode better than URL-ish encoding, I think
15:57 mst for many reasons, but 'fits into DNS sort of for people wanting java-style fdqn based hierarchies' strikes me as neat
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17:14 jdv79 what is the dns-ness valueable for?  does a dns parser of some sort need to be able to parse namespaces?
17:15 mst jdv79: org.people.kill.me.now type package naming
17:15 mst does have its value
17:17 jdv79 and where is punycode's advantage?  is that actually used in a dns-ish way?  i know next to nothing about the finer details of java or that naming scheme.
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17:18 jdv79 well, ok.  i guess.  yeah, anything but ascii doesn't need to be super easy to read i guess.
17:29 jdv79 though i would still argue against punycode simply on grounds of human readability.
17:29 mst Punycode is used to encode internationalized domain names
17:30 jdv79 can you decode it in your head?
17:30 [Coke] jdv79: punycode is more readable than url encoding. YMMV.
17:31 [Coke] punycode++ from me.
17:31 jdv79 maybe i just haven't seen enough of it then
17:32 [Coke] Not for detranslating, necessarily. Here's an example:
17:32 jdv79 sounds like we have a quasi-winner then
17:32 [Coke] minimal ünicode -> xn--minimal nicode-nsb
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17:36 mst that requires a lot less escaping to paste around than URL encoding IME
17:40 jdv79 cool.  thanks for the help with that.
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19:23 lizmat ping
19:27 nine pong
19:32 lizmat :-)
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20:51 jdv79 ding
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