Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6-toolchain, 2017-08-03

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01:52 Topic for #perl6-toolchain is now Fire is step THREE! | https://github.com/perl6/toolchain-bikeshed | Channel logs: http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6-toolchain/today | useful prior art: https://metacpan.org/pod/CPAN::Meta::Spec
03:28 camelia joined #perl6-toolchain
03:59 ugexe nine: i'm getting the feeling that everywhere $dist<source> (.meta<source> in my pr) could instead be referring to a CompUnit attribute. For instance, consider https://gist.github.com/ugexe/c31932c2c4b2e991c59a3a239f28d63c
04:02 ugexe if we do this, that means .candidates could return CompUnit instead of Distribution. and this is actually good because it means CompUnit's attributes (name/auth/ver) keep from reaching into its :$distribution (which would parse json) *and* that $dist<source> becomes more like $comp-unit<source> which actually makes sense
04:06 ugexe the only problem then is you could not query directly for a distribution by name that did not have a provides by the same name
04:11 ugexe will have to try and see how it feels i suppose
04:14 ugexe nine: what do you think about a CompUnit $.version alias to $.ver? (otherwise we could change all the Distribution stuff to use version instead of ver)
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07:11 nine ugexe: the not being able to query for a distribution by name bothers me a bit. Maybe we'd need an additional interface for querying distro info? Have a clean separation between those two.
07:12 nine I imagine zef will be much more interested in distros than in compunits
07:12 nine ugexe: I'm not big on aliases unless they are required for backwards compatibility.
15:10 ugexe well, you'd still be able to query for a distribution. my gripe is that it would be like it is *currently*, where `use DistName-Thats-Not-Module-Name` tries to load something instead of failing to find such a module
15:11 ugexe a separate interface would work, but also seems like overkill
15:11 nine Yep that's quite unpretty
15:12 ugexe the non-clean part here is that in the case of searching for a *distribution* there is no single file to reference (like with .script referencing bin/foo, or .resolve referencing Some::Module)
15:13 nine But there's the meta data file?
15:14 ugexe well, thats true. but thats available through $dist.meta - an actual file need not exist
15:14 nine I mean when you are looking for a distribution, you'll be looking for its name
15:14 nine and expect to be able to get ethe meta data
15:16 nine Anyway I think slow progress on this is a good thing. We already have a rushed API. Let's get it right on the second try
15:18 ugexe a problem with that is that every day in #perl6 there are reports of new perl6 installs not allowing people to update their zef due to .script always choosing the first repo
15:21 mspo zef is bundled with star, I thought
15:22 ugexe yea, but that doesn't mean its the first one that gets seen when you do `zef` command
15:23 ugexe before .06 or .07 the bin wrapper would sort based on version. after it started resolving like a module (highest version *inside first repo that has any version*)
15:24 ugexe so if you have an old zef in ~/.perl6 you forgot about it'll probably still get chosen
15:26 mspo yeah the whole loading and precomp and repo path thing is crazy complex
15:27 ugexe its not really so much complex as its hard to build a mental model in your head when everything is Jj8u98u92fji2fu38li2u8fi
15:27 mspo overall perl6 has been incredibly ... nitpicky?  pedantic semantics?  I don't know it's hard to describe
15:28 mst I'm not sure it could be made any simpler without losing at least one of the important features it provides over simple approaches
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15:31 mspo I'm not necessarily complaining about anything
15:31 mspo just sharing some impressions
15:32 mst oh, yes, the thing is, I agree, but what's really needed is to make it easier to get your head around how it works, I think
15:32 ugexe if we switched to puny encoding instead of sha1 it would be easier to reason with. we just have to con someone into doing it
15:33 jdv79 ugexe: do you have nightmares about random strings?
15:33 mspo like I'm starting to put together packages and am not even sure if I should include the source (.pl/.pm) files somewhere!
15:33 mspo or just the precomp/ dirs
15:34 mspo and, of course, precomp/ dirs aren't deterministic so that's another complexity :)
15:35 mspo which, thankfully, you guys are changing
15:35 mspo there probably needs be to a Moar Runtime From The Ground Up paper or something
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