Camelia, the Perl 6 bug

IRC log for #perl6, 2005-09-06

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo | Niecza | Specs

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:02 larsen has quit IRC ("later")
00:02 svnbot6 r6762 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/org.perl6.metamodel : updated 10 files to replace tabs with spaces
00:02 svnbot6 r6763 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/Perl6-Container : updated Changes file to replace tabs with spaces
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00:08 svnbot6 r6764 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/Perl6-MetaModel : in 7 files, replaced all tabs with spaces
00:08 svnbot6 r6765 | iblech++ | t/01-sanity/:
00:08 svnbot6 r6765 | iblech++ | * Renamed 07-test.t to 08-test.t.
00:08 svnbot6 r6765 | iblech++ | * Added new 07-tests testing for misc. other features needed by Test.pm and not
00:08 svnbot6 r6765 | iblech++ |   already covered by 01-06 (suggested by putter++ IIRC):
00:08 svnbot6 r6765 | iblech++ |   split, range, defined, binding, ref, isa, try, simple-multisubs, end-blocks,
00:08 svnbot6 r6765 | iblech++ |   substr, tailcall, for.
00:08 svnbot6 r6766 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/Perl6-MetaModel2.0 : replaced a single tab with 4 spaces in metamorph.pl
00:08 svnbot6 r6767 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/Perl6-Value : replaced 3 tabs with spaces in the Changes file
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00:11 Juerd ~/last juerd 3
00:11 Juerd argh
00:14 svnbot6 r6768 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/Perl6.MetaModel : replaced 7 tabs with spaces in Builder.js
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00:20 svnbot6 r6769 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/PIL-Run : in 7 files, replaced all tabs with either 4 or 8 spaces each
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00:24 dduncan and with r6771, all /perl5 files are detabbed ... and most of them did mix tabs and spaces
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00:26 svnbot6 r6770 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/PIL2JS : updated 3 files to replace tabs with spaces
00:26 svnbot6 r6771 | Darren_Duncan++ | /perl5/T2-Perl6 : replaced tabs with spaces in 3 files
00:26 evalbot_6771 has joined #perl6
00:26 geoffb iblech: Your "slow svnbot" FAQ answer did not explain why it is slow lagged that several minutes *AND* several messages can occur before it shows an update.  For instance, when I whined earlier, svnbot didn't post until almost 3 minutes and several messages after evalbot had recompiled and reloaded.
00:26 geoffb Simple waiting for IRC to return doesn't sufficiently account for that
00:30 geoffb iblech: also, why did you number all of the new tests in 01-sanity 07-*?  Are they all completely independent, with no ordering required?
00:33 iblech has joined #perl6
00:34 iblech geoffb: There have to be two conditions fulfilled to trigger a check for new commits: (time - $last_check) >= $interval *and* out_of_blocking_readline
00:35 iblech geoffb: Right, this is the very reasion. There is no clear ordering between the new 07-tests, i.e. 07-for.t is independent of 07-substr.t
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00:38 svnbot6 r6772 | Darren_Duncan++ | updated ChangeLog file to account for my recent actions
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00:51 svnbot6 r6773 | iblech++ | * New t/operators/binding/subs.t: Tests for binding the return value of
00:51 svnbot6 r6773 | iblech++ |   subroutines (normal ones and "is rw" subs) as LHS and RHS.
00:51 svnbot6 r6773 | iblech++ | * New t/operators/binding/nested.t: Many tests for binding elements of complex
00:51 svnbot6 r6773 | iblech++ |   structures as LHS and RHS (and this way creating abbreviations, infinite
00:51 svnbot6 r6773 | iblech++ |   structures, etc.). (PIL2JS passes 43/43 :)).
00:52 iblech ok, really need to sleep now. Night all! :)
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01:03 dduncan fyi, I'm starting on /modules now
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01:10 svnbot6 r6774 | Darren_Duncan++ | /modules/Class-Events : updated Events.pm to replace 159 tabs with spaces
01:10 svnbot6 r6775 | Darren_Duncan++ | /modules/Date : replaced tabs with spaces in 3 files
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01:15 dduncan as with r6778, all /modules are done
01:15 svnbot6 r6776 | Darren_Duncan++ | /modules/Grammars : replaced 35 tabs with spaces in MatchX.pm
01:15 svnbot6 r6777 | Darren_Duncan++ | /modules/JavaScript-FrontEnd : replaced 46 tabs with spaces in ARuntime.pm
01:15 svnbot6 r6778 | Darren_Duncan++ | /modules/Perl-MetaModel : replaced tabs with spaces in Class.pm, Trig.pm, Basic.pm
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01:21 svnbot6 r6779 | Darren_Duncan++ | /modules/* : detabbed 2 more Date files and 1 more Perl-MetaModel file
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02:16 svnbot6 r6780 | Darren_Duncan++ | detabbed 3 root dir files: debian/rules, AUTHORS, Makefile.PL; but, Makefile.PL retains its literal tabs in its output to the generated Makefile
02:22 svnbot6 r6781 | Darren_Duncan++ | reversed the changes made to lib/Perl6/MakeMaker.pm in r6760, since it appears that 'make' actually needs those literal tabs in Makefiles; reverted 3 space-runs into tabs
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02:28 svnbot6 r6782 | Darren_Duncan++ | updated ChangeLog re my recent updates
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02:30 dduncan okay, that's all I'm going to do for the next few hours, or today
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02:58 luqui wakawakawakawakawakawakawakawakawakawikiwa​kawakawakawakawakawakawakaspamwakawakawaka
02:58 imperator has left "[76, 101, 97, 118, 105, 110, 103].pack("C*")"
02:59 luqui ?eval [76, 101, 97, 118, 105, 110, 103].pack("C*")
02:59 evalbot_6782 Error: No compatible subroutine found: "&pack"
03:00 luqui ?eval (76, 101, 97, 118, 105, 110, 103).pack("C*")
03:00 evalbot_6782 Error: No compatible subroutine found: "&pack"
03:00 luqui ?eval pack 'C*', 76, 101, 97, 118, 105, 110, 103
03:00 evalbot_6782 Error: No compatible subroutine found: "&pack"
03:00 luqui huh
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03:38 QtPlatypus luqui: We don't have a pack yet, or a speficiation for pack.
03:38 * luqui grepped pugs and noticed
03:39 luqui I note that much of pack will be done through class declarations
03:39 luqui but there should still probably be a lower level version
03:40 * QtPlatypus wrote up a spec for pack posted to p6l "And when we get rawstrings I'll implement it"
03:40 luqui can you give me a messageid?
03:42 * luqui found it
03:42 QtPlatypus <slrndeg0be.600.dformosa@dformosa.zeta.org.au>
03:47 luqui QtPlatypus, what are you blocking on in order to implement this?
03:48 QtPlatypus luqui: The ability to create raw strings.
03:49 QtPlatypus pugs current "Everything is utf8 encoded unicode" would mean that most of pack's test would fail.
03:49 luqui ahh
03:49 luqui bbiab
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04:10 putter prolog p5 regex engine now 95% passes re_tests, with no skips.  a few more tests I care about, a cleanup pass, and p6 starts getting added.  
04:10 putter *weary smile*
04:10 * luqui contemplated porting PGE to perl 6
04:10 luqui after this prolog exercise, what kind of work do you think that would be?
04:12 putter after pugs oo works... no problem at all.  the problem with doing "large"-scale things in p6 at the moment, is piljs doesnt have objects, and pugs is buggy.
04:12 putter so you architect something, and find yourself in a corner of design space where "if only simple thing foo was working, we'd be all set, but since not..." and unable to back out.
04:13 * luqui can hack pugs now though, so maybe that would get some things fixed
04:14 putter hmm...  well... since you mention it... pil p6 tree is lightly hung up on, let me see if I can dig it up...
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04:15 putter class C{}; class C::D{method new($d){...}}; sub f($d,$cls){ ::C::($cls).new($d) } say f(3,"D");
04:15 luqui "pil p6 tree is lightly hung up on"  # parse error
04:15 putter for some ...
04:16 putter ext/Perl-Compiler/lib/Perl/​Compiler/PIL/Node_pm_gen.pl
04:16 luqui uh, what is sub f() supposed to be doing?
04:16 * luqui doens't think that is valid p6
04:17 putter pugs -CPerl5 ouputs bless( X, Y)  and one wants to define bless().
04:17 putter ::C::($y).new(*$x)
04:18 luqui oh I get it
04:18 luqui symbolic deref
04:19 luqui ?eval class C{}; class C::D{method new($d){...}}; sub f($d,$cls){ ::C::($cls).new($d) } say f(3,"D");
04:19 evalbot_6782 Error: Must only use named arguments to new() constructor
04:19 putter the tripple of ("is leading :: present", "doing ($y)", "*$x works")  doesnt play well together (my fuzzy recollection).
04:19 putter thats the *$x not working
04:20 luqui ?eval class C{}; class C::D{submethod BUILD($x) { say "$x" }}; sub f($d,$cls){ ::C::($cls).new( x=> $d) } say f(3,"D");
04:20 evalbot_6782 3 <obj:C::D> bool::true
04:20 luqui I don't quite understand what you are asking... if anything
04:21 putter ?eval class C{}; class C::D{submethod BUILD($x) { say "$x" }}; sub f($d,$cls){ ::C::($cls).new(*$d) } say f([3],"D")
04:21 evalbot_6782 Error: Must only use named arguments to new() constructor
04:21 putter bless gets array and hash refs passed as X.
04:22 putter f here is bless
04:22 putter the first case was too simple a reduction
04:22 luqui o...kay.  so what are you asking?
04:24 luqui new() does not support positionals yet, that's the only thing about this that I can see
04:24 putter the ability to write a sub bless()  which works for bless([3,...],"Foo")  bless({mumble=>frotz,...},"Bar")
04:25 luqui and how is this not possible currently?
04:25 luqui the examples above seem to be working how they should
04:27 putter ?eval class C{}; class C::D{method new($d){...}}; sub f($d,$cls){ ::C::D.new($d) } say f(3,"D");
04:27 evalbot_6782 Error: Must only use named arguments to new() constructor
04:27 putter ?eval class C{}; class C::D{method new($d){...}}; sub f($d,$cls){ C::D.new($d) } say f(3,"D");
04:27 evalbot_6782 Error: *** ... - not yet implemented     at <eval> line 1, column 38-41  
04:28 luqui is there a reason you cannot pass named arguments to new?
04:30 putter that's why its only lightly stuck.  the classes are all autogenerated.  so mumble.new().now_init($d) and they do their own unpacking.
04:31 luqui what is wrong with:  mumble.new(init => $d)
04:32 * luqui is beginning to contemplate the correctness of the "named only" constraint on new, though
04:32 putter two thoughts
04:33 putter re new, note it actually worked above, without the leading ::.  which are unfortunately needed for the $cls case.
04:33 luqui right...
04:35 putter re why, I guess because I had a very low "pugsbug workaround" threshold for that project.  its only really useful if folks can then build big things on it.  and having had other things lost in layered workaround space, I put a low threshold cut off on this one.
04:36 luqui fair enough
04:36 putter "if I run into problems just creating the objects, then that should be taken as a sign that I'm biting off more than the system is ready for again"
04:38 putter regards other things on pause, the regexp stuff in pugs is wating on objects returned by functions not being mis-typed.
04:38 luqui for example?
04:39 putter but that's also been a, "well if that gets fixed, I get to see what the next obsticle is".
04:39 luqui well you have to get past the obstacles sometime
04:39 luqui you can't just magically make them all go away
04:39 * putter notes a "putter is burned out" tone to this... sorry ;)
04:39 putter let's see...
04:40 putter ?eval class C{has $.v} sub f(){C.new}  f().v
04:40 evalbot_6782 Error: No compatible subroutine found: "&v"
04:41 luqui hmm
04:42 putter but not to worry about this stuff.  p5 will soon have a p6 rules engine, and iblech is adding objects, and piljs runs fine linked with perl5, so there is now a path for the regexp stuff to progress...
04:43 luqui ?eval class C { has $.v } sub f () { C.new }  my $x = f;  $x.v
04:43 evalbot_6782 \undef
04:43 luqui hmm, i wonder what the trouble here is
04:43 luqui that's cool
04:44 putter autrijus has described it as a "known problem" with the type inferencer
04:44 luqui there's a type inferencer?
04:45 * putter looks guilty at having intended to do a more thourough look at pugs internals... for half a year now...
04:46 putter I think that's what autrijus said.  something must be providing type info for the multimethods...
04:48 luqui hmm
04:48 luqui well, I need to do homework
04:49 putter basically on the  parse->compile-(pil)->emit->runtime   parse and compile are all pugs, and emit and runtime are all p5/native.
04:50 putter end of day for me
04:51 putter err, no, pugs|p5/native
04:51 luqui yeah,
04:51 luqui and the pugs runtime is completely kludgy
04:51 luqui thus pil2, right?
04:51 putter yes
04:51 luqui make a new pil, and write a runtime from scratch?
04:52 putter my impression is the necessary changes have been described as highly localized
04:52 luqui hmm
04:52 luqui like findSub
04:52 * luqui did a little hacking on findSub the other day
04:52 luqui what a mess
04:53 putter nada->p6 in 6 months.  ;)
04:53 putter growing pains inevitable
04:53 luqui true
04:53 luqui it's nice to step back and notice the amazing progress of this project every once in a while :-)
04:54 putter indeed :)
04:54 putter neat mix of cultures too
04:54 luqui pugs forced me to learn haskell
04:54 putter :)
04:54 luqui and learning haskell has really chaned the way i think about a lot of problems
04:56 putter yeah.  that's the argument for learning languages with unfamiliar approaches - leaves your brain with that fresh scrubbed feeling
04:56 putter changes the way you think about hings
04:57 smith100 hings think about you
04:57 mugwump leaves you more prepared for questions like, "yeah, but aren't all turing complete languages equivalent anyway?  what's the point in learning a langauge like that?"
04:57 * luqui has thought doing a "real project" in prolog
04:57 luqui but prolog is so yucky
04:57 luqui so I have been considering curry
04:57 putter awww
04:57 luqui except I can't find a curry compiler!
04:57 luqui maybe it's just because I don't understand
04:58 luqui but I find I need to know too much about prolog's execution strategy to write code that doesn't infinite loop
04:58 luqui which then just seems to be a convoluted procedural code that I'm writing
04:59 putter yes to the first part, no to the second
04:59 autrijus luqui: cyc is a nice curry compiler danae.uni-muenster.de/~lux/curry/user.html
04:59 autrijus and my experience is that cyc feels more modern than prolog by far
05:00 autrijus but maybe that's because I'm brainwashed by haskell first :)
05:00 putter you do have to be up close and personal with engine.  the "usual logic programming intro" claim of write blind and it works is, well, if not a lie then quite misleading.
05:01 putter but the fun of prolog is intimite with the engine, and collaborating to write the engine you need for your problem (because prolog's is invariably not what you need;).  for that, prolog has historically been one of the best.
05:01 putter s/is/is being/
05:02 autrijus mm the MRT car starts moving. ciao :)
05:02 putter &
05:02 autrijus public wireless at high velocity is still an unsolved problem
05:02 putter lol
05:02 luqui :-p
05:02 putter planes seem to work...
05:02 putter ...sometimes
05:03 putter arguably not wireless in the sense of original comment
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05:05 putter some of the modern prolog like things leave me with a "baby out with bathwater" feeling... they may have a nice corner of language design space, but its one a bit divorced from the strengths and mindspace of prolog.
05:07 luqui though some people say the same thing about perl after they come from C++
05:07 luqui "sure, it's good at text processing"
05:09 putter perl _is_ rather distant from C++.  its just that C++ is used for sooooo many things for which it is technically (rather than socially) ill suited...
05:09 luqui yep
05:09 luqui but a lot of times C++ers don't like perl because they don't understand it yet
05:09 luqui even though perl has a much larger problem space that C++
05:10 luqui s/has/covers
05:10 luqui well, I'm going to log off irc new
05:10 luqui now
05:10 luqui because I'm being distracted
05:10 luqui :-)
05:10 luqui adios
05:10 putter me too.  its late
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05:10 putter bye &
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06:21 brentdax I wrote a new module for Perl 6.  (Basically it's `trace "message", :tag`, plus the infrastructure to make it work.)  Should it be called Trace.pm?  Devel::Trace?  Debug::Trace?  Something else entirely?
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06:53 dduncan now working on /examples
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07:12 svnbot6 r6783 | Darren_Duncan++ | /examples/* : converted tabs to spaces in these files under [advocacy, algorithms]: motd-i.p6, lambda-calculus.p6, Newton.pm, shuffle.p6
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07:17 svnbot6 r6784 | Darren_Duncan++ | /examples/* : replaced tabs with spaces for these files: network/hangmanbot.p6, network/seenbot.p6, network/bot_irc.p6, network/http-server.p6, games/wizard.p6, irclog2html.p6, graphics/make_swatch.p6, functional/length.p6, functional/monads.p6, functional/fp.p6, life.p6
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07:23 svnbot6 r6785 | Darren_Duncan++ | /examples/* : replaced tabs with spaces for these files: cookbook/test.pl, p6explain/p6explain, sendmoremoney.p6, ppt/cat.p6, perl5/cpan-upload.p6
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07:35 dduncan and with r6786, /examples is done
07:35 svnbot6 r6786 | Darren_Duncan++ | /examples/* : replaced tabs with spaces in 8 files under 'cookbook'; updated changelog
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07:39 dduncan that's all I'm doing today ... good night
07:42 dduncan moreover, thats probably all the mass detabbing I'm going to do in pugs at all ... if any of you find more that can be safely removed, handle them as you will
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07:54 dduncan okay, I just did /util too
07:55 dduncan at this point, it is just the /src and /docs directories that I haven't done; with /src, I don't know if I might break something, so I'll leave those; with /docs, any changes are also dubious
07:56 dduncan so as with my previous comment, the detabbing is basically done ...
07:56 dduncan try not to add any more tabs in your future work, unless they are essential as literal tabs
07:56 dduncan good night
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07:58 svnbot6 r6787 | Darren_Duncan++ | /util/* : replaced tabs with spaces in 14 files
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08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ | * An (X)Emacs mode for editing Perl6 files.
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ | * Forked from cperl-mode and extended with Perl6 syntax situations
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |   primarily for correct indenting and highlighting.
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ | * Current features:
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |    - font-lock highlighting for
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |        class, has, say, returns, multi sub(method), gather, take, try
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |    - indentation recognizes extended sub syntax, especially traits
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |    - regexes via rx// as quote operator
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |    - m// and s// similiar to new rx//
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |    - recognize if/elsif/unless-conditions without parens
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ | * documentation inside file
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08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ | * Call for help: feel free to help if you program Emacs Lisp,
08:04 svnbot6 r6788 | renormalist++ |   some things in this mode and/or Perl6 syntax are non-trivial
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08:09 svnbot6 r6789 | renormalist++ | added myself as requested
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10:22 rafl_ How to revert a single file to a given version?
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10:52 svnbot6 r6790 | rafl++ | * Reverted dducan's tab replacement for debian/rules. It's a Makefile. It needs
10:52 svnbot6 r6790 | rafl++ |   tabs!
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10:58 svnbot6 r6791 | rafl++ | * Added tailing slashes for debian/*.dirs for consistency.
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11:10 svnbot6 r6792 | Stevan++ | Perl6::MetaModel 2.0 -
11:10 svnbot6 r6792 | Stevan++ | * added $::Module into the hierarchy, now:
11:10 svnbot6 r6792 | Stevan++ |     $::Class->isa($::Module) && $::Class->isa($::Object)
11:10 svnbot6 r6792 | Stevan++ | * moved name, version, authority and identifier methods
11:10 svnbot6 r6792 | Stevan++ |   to $::Module
11:10 svnbot6 r6792 | Stevan++ |     - adjusted tests and files appropriately
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12:17 svnbot6 r6793 | autrijus++ | * massive retab for src/, expanding all tabs into spaces,
12:17 svnbot6 r6793 | autrijus++ |   except for the generated PIL1.hs.
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13:04 svnbot6 r6794 | rafl++ | Debian:
13:04 svnbot6 r6794 | rafl++ | * Added smoker.yml to be able to identify smoke results from the buildds.
13:04 svnbot6 r6794 | rafl++ | * Added dpatch build-dependency.
13:04 svnbot6 r6794 | rafl++ | * Adjusted rules file to work with dpatch.
13:04 svnbot6 r6794 | rafl++ | * Added patches/10smoker.dpatch to change the path to smoker.yml for the build.
13:04 svnbot6 r6795 | rafl++ | Debian:
13:04 svnbot6 r6795 | rafl++ | * Removed patches/10smoker.diff which was a temp file.
13:05 evalbot_6795 has joined #perl6
13:06 stevan good morning boys and girls
13:06 rafl_ Hello stevan
13:06 fglock hi all
13:06 * stevan $work project has now launched, so it's back to Pugs hacking :)
13:06 stevan hey rafl_, fglock
13:08 rafl_ Do you guys know if I can make ghc use ccache?
13:09 stevan rafl_: sorry, no idea
13:09 stevan fglock: have you done any work on Package or Module implementations
13:10 fglock no, all 'namespace' code is in PIL-Run, and it reuses p5
13:11 stevan hmm
13:11 stevan I just added Module to the metamodel 2.0 this morning
13:11 stevan cause I was reading Apoc 12
13:11 stevan which stated that Role and Class will likley inherit from Module
13:12 stevan we will have to address namespace in PIL-Run thouh
13:12 stevan in order to account for names like "Foo-0.0.1-cpan:JRANDOM"
13:12 stevan the package management for Perl 6 is going to me much more complex then in Perl 5
13:12 fglock do you think we should have p6 pads instead of reusing p5?
13:13 stevan I would expect we will need too eventually
13:13 fglock I currently have a problem, I need to clone a closure and I don't have easy access to the lexicals
13:14 fglock being able to manage the pads would make that easier
13:14 stevan I imagine that p6 pads are more sophisticated then p5 pads
13:18 fglock I think a tree of hashes would do - with some extra accessors for short/long names
13:19 stevan for pads?
13:19 fglock yes
13:20 stevan sounds sane to me
13:21 fglock then, you may want to add support for continuations, coroutines, etc - a lot of work ahead :)
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13:34 svnbot6 r6796 | iblech++ | t/var/constant.t: luqui confirmed the existance of "my constant" and "our
13:34 svnbot6 r6796 | iblech++ | constant", so I removed =for discussion and added some more tests (see
13:34 svnbot6 r6796 | iblech++ | http://www.nntp.perl.org/grou​p/perl.perl6.language/23003).
13:34 svnbot6 r6797 | fglock++ | * PIL-Run - commented out grep() and uniq(), because they break PrimP6 compilation
13:35 fglock stevan: I think we can think of pads the same way we do 'super' methods
13:35 evalbot_6795 has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection)
13:36 fglock and 'caller'
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13:58 svnbot6 r6798 | fglock++ | * PIL-Run - logic value of 'undef' is false
13:58 svnbot6 r6799 | fglock++ | * PIL-Run - uniq() works - but only once, because the %seen is global
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14:07 nothingmuch hah! I knew it! rafl++
14:07 nothingmuch for 6790
14:07 nothingmuch (massive mindless changes)--
14:07 nothingmuch what I don't know is why it's been massively revertec
14:08 rafl_ nothingmuch: Err?
14:08 nothingmuch wait, re 6793 - what was actually done?
14:08 nothingmuch rafl_: well, i thought that making everything spaces was very stupid
14:09 nothingmuch because there is no real point in fixing what isn't broken
14:09 nothingmuch especially when in some people's opinion the fixing is actually breaking
14:09 nothingmuch and the makefile issue is a good example of why it was a bad idea
14:09 nothingmuch so thanks for fixing it =)
14:10 rafl_ nothingmuch: Well, I also like tabs more than spaces, but being consistent is good imho. Use tabs or spaces, not both.
14:10 masak rafl_: there are also ways of being consistent using both
14:10 nothingmuch i think this project is too spaced out to care about that
14:11 nothingmuch imho it should be 'use whatever this file is in'
14:11 rafl_ nothingmuch: That's probably a good point.
14:11 nothingmuch for new files I prefer tabs for block indenting
14:11 nothingmuch and spaces for arbitrary indenting
14:11 nothingmuch like my $foo    = $moose;\nmy $gorch = $bing;
14:11 nothingmuch so that tab stops never make a difference
14:12 nothingmuch i wouldn't mind spaces except that to delete them you need to press the delete key N times
14:12 nothingmuch and inserting them "manually" is sometimes annoying
14:12 rafl_ Well, I actually don't care that much about what's used for indenting as long as it doesn't break something, of course. :-)
14:12 nothingmuch right
14:13 nothingmuch anyway, my opinion remains that the conversion did more harm than good, but whatever. too late.
14:13 nothingmuch food time
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14:22 svnbot6 r6800 | fglock++ | * PIL-Run - grep() compiles - it still doesn't work, but this works:
14:22 svnbot6 r6800 | fglock++ |    (1,2,3).map:{ if $^a != 2 { $^a } else { () } }
14:22 svnbot6 r6800 | fglock++ |    The error is related to calling the grep sub inside map()
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15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ | * Usual svn props.
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ | * t/var/constant.t: Minor fixes.
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ | * Pugs.PIL1, Pugs.Compile: PSub and PCode contain a p[Sub]?IsMulti field now,
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ |   so PIL2JS and PIL-Run can know which subs are multis and which subs are not.
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ | * Pugs.CodeGen.PIR: Accomodate for the above change.
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ | * PIL2JS: (Simple) multi subs!
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ |   * PIL2JS.js: If necessary, try to call all .variants of a multi to find out
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ |     whether the parameters match the sub signature. (Hack)
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ |   * PIL::Subs: Emit appropriate code for multis --
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ |       multi foo {...}  # is compiled as
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ |       our &foo ::= PIL2JS.new_multi(); &foo.add_variant({...});
15:04 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ | * Test.pm: Removed the skip_rest_anti_multi-hack which was previously needed
15:05 svnbot6 r6801 | iblech++ |   for PIL2JS. :)
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15:10 nothingmuch luqui: ping
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15:14 rafl_ The MIME-Base64 tests block infinitely for me if parrot is installed. Can someone reproduce that?
15:18 dada rafl_: IIRC, QtPlatypus was working on that
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15:22 nothingmuch rafl_: i can
15:22 joepurl has quit IRC (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
15:22 nothingmuch as do Net-IRC/t/basic.t, and something in Set
15:22 caomu_ has joined #perl6
15:23 caomu_ ?eval $PUGS_VERSION
15:23 evalbot_6801 Error: Undeclared variable: "$PUGS_VERSION"
15:23 integral ?eval $?PUGS_VERSION
15:23 evalbot_6801 \'Perl6 User\'s Golfing System, version 6.2.9, August 3, 2005 (r6801)'
15:23 integral of course, the nick is a bit of a giveaway ;-)
15:23 caomu_ hmm, I need to buy a notebook, so, Anyone here can give me a suggestion? As It seems It's not easy to choose one fit my needs. :-S
15:24 caomu_ oops. I am xinming, I was now in Beijing
15:24 rafl_ caomu_: I can recommend the IBM X-Series.
15:24 caomu_ is now known as xinming_BeiJing
15:24 xinming_BeiJing that xinming is the one which I sshed to my home computer. :-P
15:24 xinming_BeiJing rafl_, hmm, Which one, Could you please give me a url?
15:25 xinming_BeiJing ping autrijus ~~~ :-)
15:25 rafl_ I have an X41. Boguth at nofost.de
15:26 * integral likes spiralbound, good for laying flat on a desk
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15:31 wolverian ?eval class Foo { method bar ($x) { 1 } } Foo.new.bar (1)
15:31 evalbot_6801 Error:  unexpected "(" expecting operator, postfix conditional, postfix loop, postfix iteration, ";" or end of input
15:31 wolverian is method (args) illegal? (compare to method(args))
15:31 xinming_BeiJing wolverian, Foo.newbar(1)
15:31 xinming_BeiJing ?eval class Foo { method bar ($x) { 1 } } Foo.new.bar (1)
15:31 evalbot_6801 Error:  unexpected "(" expecting operator, postfix conditional, postfix loop, postfix iteration, ";" or end of input
15:31 xinming_BeiJing ?eval class Foo { method bar ($x) { 1 }; } Foo.new.bar ( 1 )
15:31 evalbot_6801 Error:  unexpected "(" expecting operator, postfix conditional, postfix loop, postfix iteration, ";" or end of input
15:31 xinming_BeiJing oops...
15:32 xinming_BeiJing ?eval class Foo { method bar ($x) { 1 }; } Foo.new.bar( 1 )
15:32 evalbot_6801 1
15:32 wolverian right, I know it works that way
15:32 dada but why?
15:32 xinming_BeiJing wolverian, In synopsis, It told you.
15:32 xinming_BeiJing dada, hold on please.
15:33 wolverian xinming_BeiJing, it told me what? I don't remember reading about _method_ parentheses whitespace rules, but maybe I missed it
15:33 dada you mean that you can _never_ have spaces before ( in function calls?
15:33 xinming_BeiJing dada, hmm, In fact, I think It's for the problem of the ignorance of the parenthesis.
15:34 xinming_BeiJing just like, you can use `sub fun( $x ) { ... }; fun 1;`
15:34 xinming_BeiJing ou don't need the parenthesis to do the sub call.
15:34 dada but you can't do "fun (1);"?
15:35 * dada sees whitespaces mattering all around and flees in panic
15:35 xinming_BeiJing But There is a special case, which is, If you need to pass an "ARRAY" to the function, You have to distinguish the "WHOLE" parameters and the parameter which with "ONLY" an "ARRAY"
15:35 wolverian dada, sure you can. it's just in methods, where parens are _required_ that it is different.
15:36 wolverian at least pugs thinks so
15:36 dada this is not encouraging
15:36 xinming_BeiJing so, If there is space between `fun` and `(`
15:36 wolverian and it is consistent with '%foo {1}' being illegal
15:36 wolverian but that is because of 'if %foo { ... }', and parens have nothing to do with that
15:37 dada I _hate_ whitespace rules
15:37 xinming_BeiJing the later (1) will be come a array in fact, and pass the (1) to the function, But the function need a argument which is a "SCALAR"
15:37 dada boo
15:38 xinming_BeiJing dada, neither do I. :-) But In fact, you have no choice... Perl 6 is complex to confuse many people. :-)
15:38 xinming_BeiJing dada, hmm, In fact, you can use `fun      .(1)` format
15:38 xinming_BeiJing pay attention to the "DOT"
15:39 wolverian that works with {} too
15:39 wolverian %foo .{1} # legal
15:39 xinming_BeiJing wolverian, yes. `.` becomes like a "grammar" connector. :-)
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15:41 wolverian dada, note: print (1+2)*3; # this is extremely non-obvious in perl5
15:42 xinming_BeiJing Parentheses are required on the dot notation if there are any arguments (not counting adverbial arguments). There may be no space between the method name and the left parenthesis unless you use the dot form of parentheses:
15:42 xinming_BeiJing    .doit       # okay, no arguments
15:42 xinming_BeiJing    .doit()     # okay, no arguments
15:42 xinming_BeiJing    .doit ()    # ILLEGAL (two terms in a row)
15:42 xinming_BeiJing    .doit.()    # okay, no arguments, same as .doit()
15:42 xinming_BeiJing    .doit .()   # okay, no arguments, same as .doit()
15:42 xinming_BeiJing read S12 carefully please. :-)
15:43 xinming_BeiJing ?eval print(1+2)*3;
15:43 evalbot_6802 33.0
15:43 xinming_BeiJing ?eval print (1+2)*3;
15:43 evalbot_6802 9bool::true
15:43 wolverian xinming_BeiJing, ah, of course. thanks :)
15:44 dbrock what about .doit . ()?
15:46 xinming_BeiJing dbrock, hmm, I think, the "DOT" must be strictly standing before the `(`
15:46 svnbot6 r6802 | rafl++ | Debian:
15:46 svnbot6 r6802 | rafl++ | * Added libtest-tap-model-perl and libtest-tap-htmlmatrix-perl to
15:46 svnbot6 r6802 | rafl++ |   Build-Depends. They are needed for smoking. The packages are currently in NEW
15:46 svnbot6 r6802 | rafl++ |   and will soon be in the archive.
15:46 svnbot6 r6803 | Stevan++ | Perl6::MetaModel 2.0 -
15:46 svnbot6 r6803 | Stevan++ | * is_a() now expects a class instance, and not a string
15:46 svnbot6 r6803 | Stevan++ |     - fixed a number of tests to reflect
15:46 svnbot6 r6803 | Stevan++ | * cleaned up isa() handling between $::Class and $::Object
15:46 svnbot6 r6803 | Stevan++ |     - added some tests for this
15:46 svnbot6 r6803 | Stevan++ | * more tests in relation to $::Module being added
15:46 svnbot6 r6803 | Stevan++ | * added docs/misc_drawings.txt for misc. ASCII art
15:46 xinming_BeiJing seen autrijus
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15:47 dada .doit . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .()
15:48 dbrock would that work?
15:49 wolverian no.
15:49 dada why not!?
15:49 wolverian why would it?
15:49 stevan well it all depends on what language you are writing in ;)
15:49 xinming_BeiJing If in a dialect of perl 6, It might work. ;-)
15:49 dada ?eval sub doit { 42 } doit();
15:49 wolverian . . is almost certainly a typo of ..
15:49 evalbot_6803 42
15:50 dada ?eval sub doit { 42 } doit .();
15:50 evalbot_6803 42
15:50 dada ?eval sub doit { 42 } doit . .();
15:50 evalbot_6803 Error: cannot cast from VInt 42 to Pugs.AST.Internals.VCode (VCode)
15:50 wolverian hm
15:50 wolverian ?eval sub doit { return { 42 } } doit . .()
15:50 evalbot_6803 42
15:50 wolverian haha. that is evil.
15:50 dada ?
15:50 xinming_BeiJing you can even write a rule to alter the default perl 6 pharser... :-P  Just like...  make "DOT" equal to fun DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT() :-P
15:51 wolverian I'm thinking that's illegal though
15:51 wolverian ?eval sub doit { 42 } doit .
15:51 evalbot_6803 42
15:51 dada ?eval sub doit { 42 } doit. ();
15:51 evalbot_6803 Error:  unexpected "(" expecting operator, postfix conditional, postfix loop, postfix iteration, ";" or end of input
15:51 svnbot6 r6804 | Stevan++ | Perl6::MetaModel 2.0 -
15:51 svnbot6 r6804 | Stevan++ | NOTE: is_a() now checks the $obj.id and not $obj.name
15:51 svnbot6 r6804 | Stevan++ | I forgot to mention that in the last checkin
15:51 svnbot6 r6804 | Stevan++ | * $::Class no longer has a $:name field until it is
15:51 svnbot6 r6804 | Stevan++ |   inherited from $::Module (in genesis.pl)
15:51 svnbot6 r6804 | Stevan++ |     - same with $::Object as well
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15:52 dada woo, I like the phoenix effect :-)
15:53 wolverian hmm, someone should ask p6l if 'doit .' should be legal :)
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16:29 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, you there please? :-/
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16:51 svnbot6 r6805 | Stevan++ | Perl6::MetaModel 2.0 -
16:51 svnbot6 r6805 | Stevan++ | * added $::Package, so now:
16:51 svnbot6 r6805 | Stevan++ |     $::Class isa $::Module isa $::Package isa $::Object
16:51 svnbot6 r6805 | Stevan++ |   see http://article.gmane.org/gmane.co​mp.lang.perl.perl6.language/4599
16:51 svnbot6 r6805 | Stevan++ |   for more details.
16:51 svnbot6 r6805 | Stevan++ |     - adjusted and added some test to accomidate this change
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16:57 svnbot6 r6806 | fglock++ | * PIL-Run - fixed @a=()
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17:16 svnbot6 r6807 | iblech++ | * Usual svn props.
17:16 svnbot6 r6807 | iblech++ | * t/junction/junction_functions.t: Substituted (1|2|3) by any(1,2,3) so
17:16 svnbot6 r6807 | iblech++ |   PIL2JS and PIL-Run have a chance of passing this test.
17:16 svnbot6 r6807 | iblech++ | * New t/junction/chained_operators.t: New test testing that (1|2|3) is the same
17:16 svnbot6 r6807 | iblech++ |   as any(1,2,3) (passes 7/7 in normal Pugs).
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17:28 svnbot6 r6808 | iblech++ | Test.pm: Put skip_rest_anti_multi-hack in again (I removed it in r6801).
17:28 svnbot6 r6808 | iblech++ | PIL2JS's handling of multisubs needs some more work until we can get rid of the hack.
17:28 svnbot6 r6809 | fglock++ | * perl5/Array - $array.store() preserves cell binding
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17:33 xinming_BeiJing seen autrijus
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17:37 stevan iblechbot: does PIL2JS handle packages at all?
17:40 svnbot6 r6810 | iblech++ | t/operators/repeat.t: Fixed the test so fglock++ can test his work :)
17:40 evalbot_6809 has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection)
17:40 fglock checking repeat.t ...
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17:51 svnbot6 r6811 | fglock++ | * perl5/Array - fixed autovivification in slices
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18:15 svnbot6 r6812 | rafl++ | Debian:
18:15 svnbot6 r6812 | rafl++ | * Added libwww-perl to Build-Depends. Needed by smokeserv-client.
18:15 svnbot6 r6812 | rafl++ | * Clean config.yml properly.
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18:26 rafl_ Grr. Would someone please stop that evalbot maddness?
18:27 rafl_ Is there an other way than precompiling Test.pm to speed up smoking a bit?
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18:28 stevan rafl_: not running the rules test will usually cut smoking time down some
18:28 geoffb Why is the evalbot bothering you, rafl_ ?
18:28 rafl_ stevan: Ah, OK.
18:29 rafl_ geoffb: Because it keeps parting and joining. That's annoying.
18:29 stevan rafl_: it is updating itself
18:29 geoffb rafl_, causing your chat client to beep at you?
18:30 rafl_ An update for a change in the debian packaging? Hrm..
18:30 rafl_ geoffb: No, but it's line noise I don't like that much.
18:30 geoffb Someone mentioned that there is a way to make the bot be invisible WRT part/join messages
18:30 geoffb ah.
18:31 geoffb I'm used to P/J line noise because this channel has so many people going in and out anyway.
18:31 stevan maybe it should only re-compile when src/ changes
18:31 geoffb And my client colorizes those lines so they fade out of the mess
18:31 geoffb stevan, that way lie edge cases and other dragons.
18:32 geoffb Like, what about changes to Makefile.PL, or util/?
18:32 stevan geoffb: true dat
18:32 stevan maybe evalbot could just change it's nick?
18:32 stevan I am not really sure the details of what exactly is happening anyway
18:33 * stevan pleeds IRC ignorance and goes back meta-model stuff
18:34 xinming has quit IRC (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:34 geoffb Well, since the helper respawns pugs children every time, theoretically just changing nick would work, but someone has to do that.  Since luqui is running evalbot these days, I guess him, but who knows if he has tuits that he wants to spend on that.  :-)
18:34 geoffb Which of course leads to: rafl_, you can always fix it and run it from you box.  ;-)
18:34 * stevan thinks it might be running on feather
18:34 vkon has quit IRC ("Chatzilla 0.9.68.5 [Firefox 1.0.6/20050716]")
18:35 stevan but I am not sure of that
18:35 geoffb stevan++ # Devoting so many non-work cycles to the MM
18:35 xinming has joined #perl6
18:36 stevan geoffb: who said it wasn't $work related :)
18:38 rafl_ geoffb: It's running on feather. I don't want to change evalbot. /ignore fixes the problem for me.
18:41 rafl_ I hope /ignore -regexp -pattern 'evalbot_[:alnum:]+' JOINS will work..
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18:51 svnbot6 r6813 | iblech++ | PIL2JS: pugs-smokejs.pl: Skip all rules tests for now (they exhaust far too
18:51 svnbot6 r6813 | iblech++ | much RAM) -- smoking PIL2JS should be safe now.
18:51 svnbot6 r6814 | fglock++ | * PIL-Run - ($a,\undef,$b)=(1,2,3) and ($a,$b)=($b,$a) work
18:51 svnbot6 r6815 | autrijus++ | * Add space-loving settings for Emacs in pugs::hack, following
18:51 svnbot6 r6815 | autrijus++ |   iblech++'s paragraph on Vim settings.
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18:51 rindolf Hi all!
18:51 dduncan Hi one
18:51 rindolf autrijus: here?
18:51 dduncan seen autrijus
18:51 stevan hey rindolf, autrijus just commited, but he has not been around much lately
18:51 rindolf Actually it may be too late for him.
18:52 stevan rindolf: he regularly IRCs in his sleep, so you might be able to access his unconcious mind
18:52 rindolf perlbot: karma autrijust
18:52 perlbot autrijust doesn't have any karma
18:52 rindolf perlbot: karma autrijus
18:52 perlbot Karma for autrijus: 46
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18:53 rindolf OK.
18:53 dduncan I notice the brand-new /util/cperl6-mode.el has almost 10,000 tabs in it, and they are mixed in with spaces
18:53 rindolf has left "Client Exiting"
18:53 stevan dduncan: I wouldn't mess with that one
18:54 evalbot_6813 has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection)
18:54 dduncan oh?
18:54 stevan well actually eLISP shouldnt be too whitespace sensitive
18:54 dduncan well, I know that some file types need tabs
18:54 stevan dduncan: yes, the makefiles do
18:54 dduncan the hint here is that the tabs and spaces are mixed
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18:54 dduncan apparently the haskell files don't, since autrijus converted those
18:55 stevan dduncan: I think tab consistency is more important in p6 source files
18:55 dduncan yes
18:56 dduncan I was mainly going after the perl 5 and perl 6 files anyway
18:56 svnbot6 r6816 | autrijus++ | * Change all `is readonly` to either `my constant` or `is constant` .
18:56 svnbot6 r6817 | autrijus++ | * lambda-calculus.p6 - Port the $VERSION line to Perl6:
18:56 svnbot6 r6817 | autrijus++ |     our $VERSION = sprintf "%d.%02d", q$Revision: 0.1 $ ~~ m:P5:g/(\d+)/;
18:56 svnbot6 r6817 | autrijus++ |   Also made some minor fixes to make the program more perl6ish.
18:56 dduncan and c and java, since I understand those languages
18:58 dduncan stevan, have a look at cperl6-mode and see if you think those tabs are necessary, and if not then how many cols the author saw when using them
18:58 dduncan with my editor, that uses 4 cols, various sections don't seem to line up right now
18:59 dduncan or I suppose I could ignore the file and let the emacs folks worry about understanding it
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19:01 stevan dduncan: my concern with that file is that it might have some code-reformatting stuff in it
19:01 geoffb stevan, MM is $work related for you?  Wunderbar!
19:01 stevan which means it could be whitespace sensitive in select areas
19:01 stevan dduncan: so my suggestion is let the emacs people deal with it ;)
19:01 dduncan so I'll leave it alone then
19:01 stevan geoffb: loosely $work related
19:02 integral ]/window 23
19:02 stevan geoffb: $work uses a lot of OSS, so any time we are without an active $project we contribute to OSS :)
19:03 stevan my co-worker is over on #jsan doing the same as I am here :)
19:03 geoffb stevan, good for you guys!  Who is $work, if you don't mind saying?
19:03 stevan geoffb: http://www.iinteractive.com
19:03 * geoffb is a consultant and writer, so considers pugs as "continuing education"  :-)
19:03 stevan we are a small consultancy,.. the website is not terribly up to date right now
19:04 geoffb nodnod
19:04 stevan mostly we do LAMP apps for various clients
19:05 stevan I am hoping I can get the MM stable enough to use in prod
19:06 stevan that way I can use p6 OO in p5 :)
19:06 * stevan is not a fan of the current crop of p5 class-generation modules
19:06 dduncan fyi, following recent changes, over 90% of all the literal tab characters are gone from the distros, where about 2000 of 25000 or so remain; but that the new cperl6-mode file adds almost 10000 more, bringing it to 11,822
19:06 xinming has quit IRC (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
19:06 geoffb stevan, :-)
19:06 dduncan s/the distros/pubs/
19:06 dduncan s/pubs/pugs/
19:07 stevan geoffb: but the real reason I am doing this is because its fun ;)
19:08 xinming has joined #perl6
19:08 geoffb Well, of course.  You could have chosen *any* OSS project to throw cycles at.
19:08 geoffb Thanks for picking this one.  ;-)
19:08 autrijus yeah, apparently our optimizer is pretty good on this one :)
19:09 geoffb autrijus, yep, best choice for optimization, if you ask me.
19:09 geoffb -Of
19:09 autrijus :D
19:10 * autrijus starts thinking t-shirt ideas based on -Ofun
19:10 stevan :)
19:10 dduncan autrijus, I noticed you did the /src last night
19:10 geoffb Did you do the Just Fear | Nothing one?
19:10 stevan hey autrijus, got DSL?
19:10 autrijus geoffb: yup, did that
19:10 geoffb schweet
19:10 autrijus stevan: yeah, finally
19:10 stevan nice
19:10 autrijus but then begineth the long strectch of $work that will extend to at least thursday
19:10 geoffb (faster connection)++
19:11 autrijus :-/
19:11 stevan autrijus: we need to find you some funding
19:11 autrijus stevan: MM2 is making more and more sense every day
19:11 stevan this $work thing is no good
19:11 stevan autrijus: thanks :)
19:12 geoffb autrijus, are you ready to accept TPF funds, or still no?
19:12 autrijus geoffb: er it's said on TPF website that I am
19:12 geoffb sorry, hadn't checked recently
19:13 stevan autrijus: did you see the recent $Package and $Module additions to MM2?
19:13 * geoffb gets lazy when multitasking
19:13 autrijus but I'm $work'ing now on the premise of no fundings -- at this rate I'll need to work another two weeks before ICFP, then for another two to three months, before I can cover a year's worth of erdosing
19:13 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, are you awake now? :-P
19:13 stevan I am debating whether to add $Package symbol tables accessing and such
19:14 autrijus xinming_BeiJing: barely. a long day today -- and need to up early tomorrow, which means I need to sleep soon
19:14 autrijus stevan: I think they obviously belong to ::Package
19:14 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, I need a suggestion on buying a laptop, I know It's not a good to ask here. But I think I willl buy an laptop in BeiJing, But I don't know much on Laptop, So, I wish some one could give me some suggestions.
19:14 autrijus since ultimately the interop with underlying OS -- I mean runtime -- will base on that API
19:14 stevan autrijus: yes, but do they belong in the MM? or should I assume it is there?
19:15 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, Or, I will ask for your laptop "version" So that I might get the one "close" as yours. :-P
19:15 stevan in the underlying runtime that is
19:15 autrijus stevan: I think it's best to settle on a API and have a p5 impl, as part of Perl6-Package or something, or just part of PILrun
19:15 evalbot_6817 has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection)
19:16 autrijus xinming_BeiJing: okay... I'm using Asus M2C, on the ground that it's got excellent support and very cheap, so I can break it freely without feeling guilty.
19:16 evalbot_6818 has joined #perl6
19:16 xinming_BeiJing thanks.
19:16 svnbot6 r6818 | Darren_Duncan++ | updated ChangeLog re other peoples' detabbing work; added /src/* re autrijus++, removed /debian/rules re rafl++ as it has a net zero change
19:17 autrijus stevan: also, I wonder how the ChangeLog thing shoudl be handled for this release
19:17 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, maybe It's cheap to you, But not to me, hmm, I will consider it for following the talent hacker. ;-)
19:17 autrijus which I hope to start relenging this weekend
19:18 autrijus xinming_BeiJing: er it's cheap compared to Toshiba or IBM.
19:18 stevan autrijus: I was thinking about that too (Changelog)
19:18 stevan perhaps PILRun and PIL2JS should have their own changelogs?
19:18 autrijus stevan: maybe have you, iblech and fglock summarize the major areas
19:19 autrijus I think a single ChangeLog is still good, but probably difference section layout than the previous ones
19:19 elmex has quit IRC ("leaving")
19:19 stevan autrijus: ok
19:19 autrijus but I'm too fried to think clearly
19:19 autrijus so maybe tomorrow :)
19:19 stevan I will slate some extra time this weekend to do that
19:20 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, 你的那个东西会不会漏电啊。ã​€‚。怎么网络上有个消息说è¿​™ä¸ªäº§å“æœ‰ä¸€æŠ«ä¼šæ¼ç”µã€‚。。
19:20 autrijus xinming_BeiJing: my laptop doesn't leak electricity
19:20 rafl_ dduncan: I don't really understand what your commit message want's to say to me.
19:20 autrijus stevan: you rocketh
19:20 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, thanks. I will consider it. ;-)
19:20 autrijus geoffb: wrt tpf funding url: http://www.perlfoundation.or​g/news/2005/allisonpugs.html
19:20 stevan autrijus: :)
19:21 autrijus alright, journal up, I'll zzz now
19:21 autrijus ciao. :)
19:21 * autrijus waves &
19:21 geoffb ciao
19:21 stevan nite
19:21 dduncan rafl, I just acknowledged that you fixed something I broke; my changelog update concerned what files were detabbed and what weren't
19:21 nnunley has joined #perl6
19:22 rafl_ dduncan: Ah, OK.
19:23 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, Is your CPU 1.6 G
19:23 dduncan in your specific case, since the changelog is for the benefit of people switching up distros and don't care about the intermediate steps, I removed the mention of a changed file because it was reverted between the same 2 distros it was changed
19:23 autrijus xinming_BeiJing: yes, dothan 1.6g. but I'll sleep now -- please direct further questions to my mail or something :)
19:23 autrijus &
19:24 xinming_BeiJing autrijus, well, I won't trouble you more, I'd rather like to see the finish of pugs faster. ;-)
19:24 xinming_BeiJing sleep well, night.
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19:41 svnbot6 r6819 | Stevan++ | Perl6::MetaModel 2.0 - fixed up the ASCII art
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19:53 svnbot6 r6820 | fglock++ | * PIL-Run - %ENV is tied
19:54 fglock autrijus: done :)
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19:56 rafl_ Juerd: ping
20:03 rafl_ I see there's already a changelog entry for 6.2.10. Is there also a release shedule yet?
20:04 Juerd I have no idea.
20:04 Juerd I know nothing.
20:04 geoffb rafl_, autrijus mentioned something about releng an hour or so ago, sound like will occur this weekend, perhaps beginning of next week
20:04 geoffb but that's just reading the tea leaves
20:05 geoffb (and that autrijus has work through Thursday and stevan is planning to do changelog work this weekend)
20:05 rafl_ geoffb: Cool. I think that will be the first version to be in Debian officially.
20:06 geoffb w00t!
20:06 * geoffb can't wait for 'apt-get pugs' everywhere he touches
20:07 rafl_ We only need to wait for ghc6 to be updated to 6.4-4.1 on all architectures (hppa ia64 m68k sparc missing) and for libtest-tap-model-perl and libtest-tap-htmlmatrix-perl to be approved by the ftp-masters.
20:11 Juerd 22:09  * geoffb can't wait for 'apt-get pugs' everywhere he touches
20:11 Juerd +install
20:12 evalbot_6820 has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection)
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20:13 rafl_ Juerd: How about moving the pugs installation on feather to the debian package?
20:14 dduncan I added a template changelog entry for 6.2.10 but left the revision and date XXd out ... that way, people can add to it while they are making changes and best understand the nature of those changes, rather than trying to figure it out later ... this is also standard practice with my own distros
20:14 dduncan that's in response to rafl_'s question of a half hour ago
20:17 svnbot6 r6821 | iblech++ | * t/builtins/math/: log.t, exp.t: Added abs(...) <= EPSILON guards.
20:17 svnbot6 r6821 | iblech++ | * PIL2JS:
20:17 svnbot6 r6821 | iblech++ |   * Prelude::JS::Array: sum() returns undef now.
20:17 svnbot6 r6821 | iblech++ |   * PIL2JS: Added $*OUT.
20:17 dduncan oh, and the pugs release schedule is about once per month, shortly after each monthly parrot release
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20:29 svnbot6 r6822 | Stevan++ | Perl6::MetaModel 2.0 -
20:29 svnbot6 r6822 | Stevan++ | * added a number of tests from MM 1.0
20:29 svnbot6 r6822 | Stevan++ | * fixed DESTROY to work correctly
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20:39 Juerd rafl_: If that can be done automatically, without too much breakage, sure, I'm all for it.
20:42 elmex has quit IRC (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:43 rafl_ Juerd: For sure, it can be automated.
20:43 rafl_ Juerd: Who run's the automated updates at the moment?
20:44 Juerd /me, but if you want totake over, please so
20:44 Juerd I have very little time and health to do feather stuff
20:45 rafl_ How do you do it? Do you trigger a recompile with every commit? Or maybe via cron?
20:45 Juerd See ~juerd
20:45 Juerd It's all readable
20:45 Juerd It's done via cron
20:45 Juerd The script autobuild.sh
20:45 rafl_ Ok, I think I'll do that this night.
20:47 svnbot6 r6823 | Darren_Duncan++ | updated lib/pugs/hack.pod to specify how to configure BBEdit to auto-expand tab key-presses, complementing the Vi and Emacs instructions for the same
20:48 * rafl_ wonders if this information is really pugs specific..
20:48 evalbot_6822 has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection)
20:48 Juerd Which information?
20:48 evalbot_6823 has joined #perl6
20:49 rafl_ Juerd: How to configure $your_favourite_editor.
20:50 Juerd rafl_: It is.
20:50 Juerd (not really.)
20:50 Juerd (but who really cares?)
21:02 rafl_ Juerd: Hm. I see that you also compile parrot yourself. I think I'll preparea Debian package for it before.
21:05 jakx has joined #perl6
21:05 jakx hello
21:06 jakx when is perl 6 coming out
21:06 xinming has quit IRC (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:07 wolverian jakx, when it's done.
21:07 dduncan or, you could say its out right now!
21:07 dduncan but just not all of its pieces
21:07 wolverian right :)
21:08 wolverian jakx, pugscode.org has a in-development perl6 implementation that we are collectively hacking on
21:08 wolverian jakx, you are more than welcome to join in :)
21:09 rantanplan Pugs is really a good thing. Just startet coding in perl 6 with pugs the last weekend. Before i was coding perl 5 like 10 years. But i like the changes of perl 6. :)
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21:11 wolverian rantanplan, wow, that's oldschool. :) did you ever use perl4?
21:11 jakx i have little experience in perl
21:11 jakx does anyone here write object oriented code in perl
21:12 integral sure.  And functional code too :)
21:12 rantanplan not really, i was only using perl 5. i also had some perl breaks to do other languages as well. but in perl 4 i never coded.
21:12 jakx when i bless a reference what really happens?
21:13 buu jakx: Why are you asking about perl5.. in perl6?
21:14 rantanplan jakx: i dont even know if in perl 6 is blessing still available.
21:14 jakx how do i create a constructor in perl6
21:14 integral bless is still in perl6, but your "new" function is automatically created basically
21:14 integral jakx: bless just takes a wee sticky label and sticks in on your data structure
21:15 jakx ok
21:15 integral Things later on can then look bemusedly at your handwriting on the label and find the right code to run
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21:17 rantanplan jakx: Look at nr. 12: http://dev.perl.org/perl6/docs/synopsis.html
21:17 jakx it says file not found
21:18 rantanplan Sorry, my bad. s/docs/doc/
21:18 jakx wow
21:18 jakx a class keyword is in perl6
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21:20 buu YES
21:20 jakx rantanplan:does the pugs offer this functionality
21:20 buu All hail the mighty.
21:20 wolverian jakx, read all the synopses :)
21:20 Qiang_ has quit IRC ("home")
21:20 wolverian ?eval class Foo { method bar { 42 } } Foo.new.bar
21:20 evalbot_6823 42
21:20 wolverian jakx, there you go. evalbot runs pugs. :)
21:20 rantanplan I ve printed out the synopsis today :)
21:23 jakx nice
21:24 jakx the python people are getting competion
21:25 jakx *competition
21:27 jakx perl has it all now ,OOP,speed and a big comunity
21:29 jakx can the pugs be installed on windows using active perl
21:30 rantanplan jakx, look at the pugscode hp.
21:30 rantanplan there is a windows installer. afaik.
21:30 integral speed?  Pugs itself isn't that speedy,  and the PIR isn't brilliant yet
21:30 integral Pugs is included in PXPerl which is a Windows Perl distribution.
21:32 dduncan jakx, I write all my non-trivial perl in object oriented form
21:32 jakx ok
21:33 jakx is there a site to get PXPerl from
21:33 rantanplan http://www.pugscode.org -> Binary Builds
21:36 jakx the pxperl linkis saying the lik canot be found
21:37 jakx is there another site
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21:47 buu ?eval (1,2,3)[1]
21:47 evalbot_6823 \2
21:47 buu That's weird.
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21:47 buu ?eval sub z { (1,2,3) } z()
21:47 evalbot_6823 (1, 2, 3)
21:47 buu ?eval sub z { (1,2,3) } z()[0]
21:47 evalbot_6823 \1
21:47 buu ?eval sub z { (1,2,3) } z()[2]
21:47 evalbot_6823 \3
21:47 jakx is there another site to get pxperl
21:47 nothingmuch has joined #perl6
21:49 buu I bet google knows!
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21:52 svnbot6 r6824 | fglock++ | * TODO updates
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22:16 svnbot6 r6825 | rafl++ | * Updated documentation for the Debian package.
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22:50 svnbot6 r6826 | vkon++ | fix logical typo in Types.hs in cxtSlurpy definition
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23:40 mosnene has joined #perl6
23:40 mosnene hello
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23:40 mosnene what are you doig?
23:47 buu I am aborting small children.
23:48 buu is now known as buubot
23:48 lscd congradulations
23:48 buubot is now known as buu
23:49 buu Thank you.
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