Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2006-09-20

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
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02:47 mugwump_ hmm, where did class XXX is Tuple { } come from?
02:52 TimToady I give up.
02:53 mugwump_ ok, darren did make it up :)
02:53 mugwump_ I see Tuple as a parametric role
02:53 mugwump_ eg: class XXX does Tuple[ Int, Str ] { ... }
02:54 mugwump_ Pair should subclass it
02:55 TimToady in that case a Pair would be unordered, according to the relational def of Tuple.
02:55 mugwump_ Then, Pair also has .key, .value and .kv methods that are RW methods to self.[0], self.[1] and self.[0,1]
02:55 mugwump_ oh, that seems odd - I would have thought that tuples were strictly ordered
02:56 TimToady depends on which def of Tuple you're using.
02:56 TimToady we renamed tuples to Seq in Perl 6 to avoid the problem
02:56 mugwump_ Oh yeah
02:57 TimToady so I don't care if Darren uses Tuple for what he wants.
02:57 mugwump_ I'm note sure what I'd use a Tuple for in that case, why it would be different from a Set, and how you'd apply its type constraints
02:57 TimToady well, gotta run &
02:58 mugwump_ ok, seeya
03:00 svnbot6 r13464 | audreyt++ | * Source file expandtab.
03:05 mugwump_ oh, tuple is not a real perl6 type
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04:06 svnbot6 r13465 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.cabal.in: Oops, accidentally left a -debug in there
04:06 svnbot6 r13466 | audreyt++ | * PCR: Add HsBridge to MANIFEST.
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04:09 svnbot6 r13467 | audreyt++ | * "if $x -> $y {...}" now evaluates $x in rvalue context,
04:09 svnbot6 r13467 | audreyt++ |   such that "if $x -> $y is rw {...}" still cannot modify
04:09 svnbot6 r13467 | audreyt++ |   the original $x.  (I think that's the correct semantic,
04:09 svnbot6 r13467 | audreyt++ |   though it's not really specced.)
04:09 svnbot6 r13468 | audreyt++ | * Now that t/xx-uncategorized/use_import_not_found.t passes, remove it
04:09 svnbot6 r13468 | audreyt++ |   as instructed by putter++.
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04:12 svnbot6 r13469 | audreyt++ | * PCR Match dump_hs: Fix named match result dumping.
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04:33 svnbot6 r13470 | audreyt++ | * De-macroise Pugs::Internals::pi so it can be called normally.
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04:48 audreyt @tell putter preulude_test now all passes.
04:48 lambdabot Consider it noted.
04:49 audreyt @tell putter see r13471; your original syntax was a bit off -- in particular "our $*x" doesn't work yet, and s better written as $*x
04:49 lambdabot Consider it noted.
04:51 svnbot6 r13471 | audreyt++ | * Allow binding to fully-qualified, uninitialized variables:
04:51 svnbot6 r13471 | audreyt++ |     &foo::bar ::= sub { ... };
04:51 svnbot6 r13471 | audreyt++ | * Reorganize t/xx-uncategorized/prelude_test.t and Prelude.pm a bit
04:51 svnbot6 r13471 | audreyt++ |   so that they all pass now.
04:51 svnbot6 r13472 | audreyt++ | * Remove a bogus "die" in rule_recursive.t.
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05:04 clkao @tell fglock the overloaded & data::bind bug was fixed
05:04 lambdabot Consider it noted.
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05:21 Sal what is "JQL"?
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05:24 svnbot6 r13473 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Lexer: Massive source code cleanup and warning avoidance.
05:25 Aankhen`` joined perl6
05:26 clkao Jabberwocky Query Language?
05:27 TimToady Just Quack Loudly?
05:29 audreyt Junctional Quantum Library?
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05:50 svnbot6 r13474 | lwall++ | A few remaining holdouts on .as -> .fmt
05:59 svnbot6 r13475 | audreyt++ | * PCR: Pugs::Grammar::Base::prior: avoid a stack frame push, and disallow
05:59 svnbot6 r13475 | audreyt++ |   infinite recursion on <?prior>.
05:59 svnbot6 r13474 | lwall++ | A few remaining holdouts on .as -> .fmt
06:08 TreyHarris TimToady: i just heard something from a friend who's recently immersed herself in Perl, and i think it will either amuse or disturb you: "did I mention that I had a weird dream last night? I dreamed that in the hands/voice of some person, perl regexp were The Word made manifest, and when spoken would change the world."
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06:15 svnbot6 r13476 | lwall++ | use @() where .[] doesn't work yet.
06:18 svnbot6 r13477 | audreyt++ | * prior.t: unTODO.
06:23 svnbot6 r13478 | lwall++ | Changing splat to [,] in splat.t
06:37 TimToady audreyt: currently .[] are id, but I think they should do the same as @().
06:38 TimToady that is, %HoA{$x}[] should flatten in list context like @(%HoA{$x})
07:06 TreyHarris why does Test.pm use &Test::ok.goto?
07:07 TreyHarris ok, i see why
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07:22 dduncan fyi, I've decided for the near future to name the relational data model concepts of "tuple" and "relation" as Set::Tuple and Set::Relation ... among other things, having the Set:: prefix for both should make it unambiguous that I am talking about unordered types, each of which .does(Set) or a restricted version thereof
07:22 dduncan and Seq already covers the ordered concept of a tuple
07:23 dduncan the 2 Set:: types .does(Set) in a fashion resembling how I conceive that Mapping also .does(Set)
07:24 TreyHarris ?eval sub ($a) { say "$a" }.("hi")
07:24 evalbot_r13433 is now known as evalbot_r13478
07:24 evalbot_r13478 OUTPUT[hi ] Bool::True
07:24 TreyHarris is that correct behavior?  seems a little *too* dwimmy to me
07:26 dduncan similarly, if Perl 6 never has a built-in type simply named Tuple, we can avoid all confusion and be happy
07:26 TimToady ?eval (1..100).grep: { /1/ }.say
07:26 evalbot_r13478 Error eval perl5: "use lib '/home/audreyt/pugs/perl5/Pugs-Compiler-Rule/lib'; use Pugs::Runtime::Match::HsBridge; 'Pugs::Runtime::Match::HsBridge'" *** 'require' trapped by operation mask at (eval 31) line 1.  *** Cannot parse regex: 1 *** Error: Error: Can't call method "__RUN__" on an undefined value.
07:26 TimToady ?eval (1..100).grep: { m:P5/1/ }.say
07:27 evalbot_r13478 pugs: internal error: startTask: Can't create new task     Please report this as a compiler bug.  See:     http://www.haskell.org/ghc/reportabug
07:27 lambdabot Title: 1.2. Reporting bugs in GHC
07:27 TimToady ?eval 42
07:27 evalbot_r13478 42
07:27 TimToady ?eval (1..100).grep:{ m:P5/1/ }.say
07:27 evalbot_r13478 pugs: internal error: startTask: Can't create new task     Please report this as a compiler bug.  See:     http://www.haskell.org/ghc/reportabug
07:27 lambdabot Title: 1.2. Reporting bugs in GHC
07:28 TimToady ?eval (1..100).grep:{ not $_ % 7 }.say
07:28 evalbot_r13478 OUTPUT[714212835424956637077849198 ] Bool::True
07:29 TimToady ?eval (1..100).grep: { not $_ % 7 }.join(' ').say
07:29 evalbot_r13478 OUTPUT[7 14 21 28 35 42 49 56 63 70 77 84 91 98 ] Bool::True
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07:48 TreyHarris should macros introduce a new CALLER frame?
07:49 TreyHarris ?eval \()
07:49 evalbot_r13478 CCall "perl" CaptMeth {c_invocant = VPure (CaptSub {c_feeds = []}), c_feeds = [MkFeed {f_positionals = [], f_nameds = {}}]}
07:50 TreyHarris ?eval sub foo { say "hi!" }; &foo.call(\())
07:50 evalbot_r13478 Error: No compatible subroutine found: "&call"
07:53 svnbot6 r13479 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/Set-Relation/ : renamed, reduced the member classes to just Set::Tuple and Set::Relation
07:54 dduncan as a side-effect, there should not be any test failures with my modules left
07:56 dduncan question: is Perl's big-num support open-ended, to be limited only by hardware, or is there program-defined explicit maximum size, which just happens to be very large ?
07:57 dduncan so to make the numerical types into a finite domain type?
07:57 dduncan not that they wouldn't be finite anyway, due to hardware limits
07:57 dduncan or never minde
08:04 dduncan fyi, the Pugs build process remains without errors for me ... reported version is r13479
08:04 dduncan that is all
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08:10 TreyHarris ?eval macro saaay (Str $foo) { q:code { say $foo } }; saaay "hi"
08:10 evalbot_r13478 is now known as evalbot_r13479
08:10 evalbot_r13479 Error: Undeclared variable: "$foo"
08:10 TreyHarris how does one refer to $foo?  i've read S06/Macros, Quasiquoting, Splicing several times but I'm still not sure
08:12 TreyHarris ?eval macro saaay (Str $foo) { q:code { say {{{ $foo }}} } }; saaay "hi"
08:12 evalbot_r13479 OUTPUT[<SubBlock(<anon>)> ] Bool::True
08:13 TreyHarris oh, i'm confused.
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08:19 bsb TreyHarris: the spec and the implementation of macros are from different realities
08:21 TreyHarris bsb: ah.  ok.  *sigh*
08:22 TreyHarris i just got Test.pm working with macro versions of Test::eval_*, which is nice because then the eval can happen in the calling scope.
08:22 TreyHarris but the line number diags are wrong
08:22 TreyHarris and i was trying to find a workaround
08:23 TreyHarris but I guess this isn't going to be a fruitful line of pursuit if macros don't work as specced...
08:23 bsb I'm not sure of the current state of macros, I should confess
08:23 bsb but I don't think they've been worked on in a while
08:24 audreyt indeed
08:24 audreyt TreyHarris: nopaste a small example of line number brokage?
08:24 TreyHarris audreyt: ok, one moment so i can produce a 'small' example :-)
08:25 svnbot6 r13480 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Parser: dummyParam seems unused; prepend it with _ for now.
08:25 svnbot6 r13480 | audreyt++ |   (gaal++: Are you planning to use it?)
08:25 bsb hi audreyt
08:25 audreyt heya
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08:27 svnbot6 r13481 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Embed.Perl5: In safe mode, allow PCR to be invoked
08:27 svnbot6 r13481 | audreyt++ |   more than once.
08:29 pasteling "TreyHarris" at 207.171.180.101 pasted "test 4 fails, new CALLER introduced" (40 lines, 743B) at http://sial.org/pbot/19815
08:29 audreyt timbunce: hi!
08:30 timbunce audreyt: hi! Just passing through... rebooted my laptop and my irc client starts automattically.
08:31 gaal audreyt: yes, it should be used when a param is just a siglet.
08:31 gaal (er, dummyParam)
08:31 audreyt timbunce: aha. hadn't noticed there's a #perl6dbi now
08:31 audreyt timbunce: what's your email addr of choice so I can send you a metacommitter bit?
08:31 TreyHarris audreyt: paste above
08:31 audreyt gaal: *nod*
08:31 timbunce audreyt: [email@hidden.address]
08:32 audreyt TreyHarris: looking
08:32 audreyt I think we want a caller frame
08:32 TreyHarris timbunce: hi timbunce, you probably don't remember me but we had lunch when you spoke at amazon (earlier this year?)
08:33 TreyHarris audreyt: in every case, or just that one
08:33 timbunce For a perl6dbi channel should I use irc.perl.org or freenode.net?
08:33 kane-xs greetings tim
08:33 audreyt timbunce: welcome aboard :)
08:34 timbunce TreyHarris: hi Trey. kane-xs: hi! everyone: hi! audreyt: Thanks, I think!
08:34 gaal audreyt: I'm looking at your reply to the Unpacking tree node parameters thread (sorry for the slowness); am I correct that the implication of your answer is that there is never any ambiguity in omitting the top node? in that case siglets are only required for passing over invocants.
08:36 TreyHarris audreyt: i can agree with the closure case creating a new caller frame, but the string and AST ones can't require a new frame, can they?
08:36 audreyt right
08:37 audreyt what I was saying is that the as-working thing is not wrong
08:37 audreyt so the final is() is in err
08:37 audreyt imvvho
08:37 audreyt gaal: there's no ambiguity inside a :() notation, aye.
08:38 audreyt siglet is also usefun it
08:38 audreyt :($, $, $)
08:38 audreyt s/usefun it/useful it/
08:38 audreyt s/usefun it/useful in//
08:38 * audreyt evidentaly can't type.
08:38 TreyHarris audreyt: yep, makes sense, so i'll change that test before committing it.  but with Code.call unimpl, and no way to get at the args of the macro from within an ast, i don't know how to get Test::eval_ working, since i must avoid creating a new caller frame
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08:39 gaal audreyt: that's okayeverybody likes a creative typo
08:39 audreyt TreyHarris: you can use the &moose.goto(1) notation
08:39 audreyt it does what you think it does
08:40 TreyHarris but i need a goto that returns :-)
08:40 TreyHarris otherwise the first test to use eval_is will also be the last
08:40 gaal do we perhaps need some sort of pragma or other mechanism to bless some call chain into using one stack frame generally?
08:43 audreyt TreyHarris: .call will land in 2min
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08:44 TreyHarris audreyt++: *grin* cool.  i need to go to bed but i will make and smoke overnight and look in the morning.  thanks!
08:46 audreyt np :) just note .goto() is actually just .call()
08:46 audreyt except the name got changed in Tokyo
08:46 audreyt and I forgot to update it :)
08:46 audreyt thanks for the reminder
08:46 Juerd .call replaces current sub, like exec replaces proces?
08:46 TreyHarris eh?
08:46 Juerd process
08:47 audreyt yes.
08:47 audreyt well, not really
08:47 audreyt .call returns, as TreyHarris observes.
08:47 arhuman joined perl6
08:47 arhuman hi
08:47 Juerd Ah
08:47 Juerd Then it's not goto-ish.
08:47 audreyt right.
08:48 audreyt which is why the name gets changes.
08:48 audreyt changed.
08:48 Juerd Good idea then :)
08:48 svnbot6 r13482 | audreyt++ | * Argumentless POD introducer can now be followed by =cut correctly.
08:48 svnbot6 r13482 | audreyt++ |     =foo
08:48 audreyt arhuman: greetings!
08:48 svnbot6 r13482 | audreyt++ |     =cut
08:48 svnbot6 r13482 | audreyt++ |     say "This gets run";
08:48 svnbot6 r13483 | trey++ | [t/macros/caller.t]
08:48 svnbot6 r13483 | trey++ | Tests for CALLER frame introduction in macros.
08:48 TreyHarris then goto &sub has no methodish form?
08:48 Juerd Hello, arhuman
08:48 Juerd TreyHarris: I don't think we should want that.
08:48 audreyt arhuman: arnaud dot assad at free dot fr? :) may I send a commit bit your way?
08:49 Juerd TreyHarris: Because it probably already works :)
08:49 arhuman Mu god is this that fast !
08:49 arhuman s/Mu/My/
08:49 TreyHarris audreyt: if you're just renaming .goto to .call, then i don't think it works, because in my current build, &subname.goto does not return
08:50 arhuman audreyt: yes, I have to practice my Perl to be useful, but I'm planning to contribute, so : yes thanks
08:51 audreyt TreyHarris: worry not :)
08:52 audreyt arhuman: cool -- add yourself to AUTHORS to test commit
08:52 audreyt welcome aboard :)
08:52 * audreyt has improved her commit-bit-handing-fu
08:52 TreyHarris audreyt: no kidding... do i want to know how you get people's email addresses seemingly out of thin air?
08:53 audreyt TreyHarris: whois followed by google
08:54 TreyHarris ok.  i was afraid it was going to be something very audreyt-like and scary. ;-)
08:55 Juerd audreyt++  # good people grabbing skills
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08:57 svnbot6 r13484 | trey++ | [t/macros/caller.t]
08:57 svnbot6 r13484 | trey++ | Corrected test description text.
09:00 audreyt .call lands
09:00 svnbot6 r13485 | audreyt++ | * Implement &foo.call() as specced in S06.
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09:00 TreyHarris yowza.  now that i'm about ready to go to bed, my tooth i had the emergency root canal on today is really starting to hurt :-/
09:00 TreyHarris audreyt++
09:02 Juerd audreyt: What's the diff between .() and .call()?
09:02 obra morning
09:02 TreyHarris Juerd: .call doesn't introduce a new caller stack
09:02 Juerd Hi
09:02 Juerd But it does return?
09:02 audreyt Juerd: .call erases the current frame
09:03 audreyt .call calls on behalf of its caller
09:03 audreyt yes.
09:03 Juerd Weird :)
09:03 audreyt useful though :)
09:03 Juerd Very! I've often wanted this
09:03 integral the same as "goto &" though?
09:03 audreyt in p5 the alternative is to redefine CORE::caller
09:03 audreyt integral: no, that does not return
09:03 Juerd And then usually fixed it by pushing a coderef onto @_, and then goto'ing.
09:03 integral oh, wow, that's cooler
09:04 Juerd ... or by adding stuff to %Carp::Internal :)
09:04 gaal we need an examples/network/send-commit-bit!
09:04 Juerd I hope .call gets documented much like audreyt's explaining it now.
09:05 TreyHarris audreyt: lovely.  one could read S06 as saying that .call can only take a Capture, not a bare set of arguments, but I think allowing either is nice... though not, i suppose useful except as sugar
09:05 Juerd gaal: Write it? :)
09:05 gaal maybe! :)
09:07 TreyHarris ooogh.  i'm now 40 commits behind on readinng pugs diffs.  there's been a *lot* of activity this week!
09:08 TreyHarris everyone++
09:09 nothingmuch yay! karma for everyone!
09:12 audreyt TreyHarris: hm, well, hm, I misread the spec
09:12 audreyt indeed it only accepts a capture
09:13 TreyHarris audreyt: can't it take either?
09:13 svnbot6 r13486 | trey++ | [src/perl6/Prelude.pm]
09:13 svnbot6 r13486 | trey++ | corrected pathname to test in comment
09:14 TreyHarris oh, i guess for subs whose sig actually contain Capture, that would be ambiguous
09:14 audreyt yeah.
09:15 ruoso joined perl6
09:15 TreyHarris but hey, people have been writing Perl 5 accessors that can't take 'undef' for years and years, we need to have *something* like that in Perl 6 ;-)
09:15 * TreyHarris ducks
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09:20 TreyHarris reading between the lines, there seems to be a 0-ary form (or is an argumentless method 1-ary?) that passes on the arguments of the current sub call
09:23 audreyt TreyHarris: where is it mentinoed?
09:26 TreyHarris audreyt: it isn't.  i was confusing .call with call.  but this greatly bothers me; this is worse than select/select, because the two do very similar things
09:27 audreyt well, .grep and grep does similar things too...
09:27 TreyHarris ... and .call must always be equivalent to .call(), whereas call is different from call().  yuck.
09:28 audreyt actually not sure .call should be same to .call().
09:28 TreyHarris audreyt: yes, but they take similar arguments.  .call(Capture) versus call, call(), and call(*), which doesn't take Capture...
09:29 audreyt yeah. point
09:29 TreyHarris audreyt: oh?  that would be great (except for string interp, you have to terminate the method name somehow)
09:29 audreyt easiest way is to rule that call() also takes Capture only.
09:29 audreyt more concsistent, and avoids ambiguity
09:31 TreyHarris yes... can we have a thingie (or do we already have one and i missed it) for "the capture of the current arg list" so you don't have to spell out your called args again?
09:32 mdiep joined perl6
09:32 TreyHarris $?ARGS or somesuch?
09:33 TreyHarris $?_ maybe?
09:33 audreyt or maybe eliminate the call; form...
09:33 audreyt I'm not sure, actually.
09:34 TreyHarris well, for .wrap, it will be the most common form, i think
09:34 audreyt that was the motivation, yes
09:35 TreyHarris and i'd hate for the most expeditious thing to be to change your nice self-documenting arglist to (\$capture)...
09:35 TreyHarris just because you don't want to type your 20 arguments twice in three lines...
09:37 TreyHarris audreyt: shall i post to p6-l on this?
09:37 audreyt sure! please do
09:37 audreyt note that .call() has to take capture
09:38 audreyt because otherwise you cannot pass in an invocant into a method
09:38 audreyt &meth(\($inv:))
09:38 audreyt would work but
09:38 audreyt er
09:38 audreyt &meth.call(\($inv:))
09:38 audreyt would work but
09:38 audreyt &meth.call($inc:)
09:38 audreyt is double-invocant
09:38 audreyt and is explicitly syntax error
09:39 TreyHarris yes
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09:48 TreyHarris incidentally, if .goto(*@args) is gone, then Test.pm will need to be refactored.  unless goto &sub(ARGS) has suddenly become legal...
09:48 TreyHarris er... s/legal/special syntax/...
09:49 audreyt it's not gone
09:49 audreyt it's not specced either :)
09:50 TreyHarris *grin*
09:52 TreyHarris i guess you could walk your callers until you find one not in the current package... but i suspect that that's not something we want to have to do in a tight loop during smoketests....
09:52 audreyt well, .goto is just return .call
09:52 audreyt I think.
09:52 audreyt though I'd like to keep it that way for now for this release
09:53 TreyHarris *nod* yes, probably not a good idea to break Test.pm massively right before release :-)
09:55 svnbot6 r13487 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Types: Add Capture and Signature to the type tree.
09:55 svnbot6 r13488 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Val: asStr instance for PureInt.
09:55 svnbot6 r13488 | audreyt++ | * Also make Feed a Monoid.
09:55 audreyt gaal: capture is back into our callconv :)
09:56 audreyt (via .call(\())
09:56 svnbot6 r13489 | audreyt++ | * Implement &sub.call(\(...capture...)) correctly.
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09:58 svnbot6 r13490 | audreyt++ | * oops, typo
10:00 TreyHarris ?eval multi moose () { say "0-ary" }; multi moose (Capture $capt) { say "unary" }; moose(); moose(\())
10:00 evalbot_r13479 is now known as evalbot_r13489
10:00 evalbot_r13489 OUTPUT[0-ary ] "CCall \"moose\" CaptMeth \{c_invocant = VPure (CaptSub \{c_feeds = []}), c_feeds = [MkFeed \{f_positionals = [], f_nameds = \{}}]}"
10:01 svnbot6 r13491 | audreyt++ | * PugsConfig.pm: Further expandtab.
10:01 TreyHarris ?eval multi moose () { say "0-ary" }; multi moose (Capture $capt) { say "unary" }; moose(); moose(\3)
10:01 evalbot_r13489 OUTPUT[0-ary unary ] Bool::True
10:01 TreyHarris erm.  is \() not a legal capture to express an empty arglist?
10:02 audreyt it is
10:02 audreyt same as [] a legal Array to express an empty list
10:02 svnbot6 r13492 | audreyt++ | * coro.t: unbreak two tests.
10:02 audreyt but still, you can't mix them.
10:02 audreyt if you really want the canonical syntax is
10:02 TreyHarris so why didn't that work?
10:02 audreyt moose([,] =(\()))
10:02 TreyHarris \3 worked, but \() didn't
10:02 audreyt oh but \() worked just fine
10:03 audreyt it's invoking the "moose" method :)
10:03 audreyt as currently specced, moose($x) is always $x.moose first
10:03 audreyt though that's going to go away anytime now
10:03 audreyt TimToady is going to add in "method is export" I think
10:03 audreyt but in any case.
10:03 TreyHarris oh... capture has a .moose method?
10:04 audreyt it doesn't, but at the moment all method calls into newland values
10:04 audreyt including \() literals
10:04 audreyt is instead dumped as a string
10:04 audreyt because it doesn't have a metaobject yet
10:04 audreyt it will probably get that this weekend
10:04 audreyt "under construction" etc :)
10:05 TreyHarris ok.  fine.  just so long as i can conjecture that call; could be reasonably replaced by call(), and call() by call(\())
10:05 Juerd TreyHarris: .moose is audreyt's new foo :)
10:05 TreyHarris moose is the new camel, and .moose is the new foo
10:06 ludan does moose belong to the camel family?
10:09 ludan uhm no.. it belongs to the Cervidae family
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10:17 TreyHarris I assume that S06:2121 should have a [,] reduction, and not the splat star it currently does?
10:21 audreyt yeah, though I really think maybe call($args) is simpler
10:22 TreyHarris except call() takes an arglist.  hence my post to p6-l i'm writing :-)
10:22 audreyt right.
10:22 audreyt I think call() vs call(\())
10:22 audreyt is much better than
10:23 audreyt call; vs call();
10:24 TreyHarris i agree
10:26 TreyHarris audreyt: read your last diff, you missed one:  "It can then be passed to C<call> as C<*$args>:"
10:27 audreyt fixed too
10:27 audreyt TreyHarris: how's your tooth?
10:29 TreyHarris audreyt: ouch :-/  root canal is no fun.
10:30 TreyHarris audreyt: now i just need a commit bit to the synopses, I just went to merge your changes into my p6-l post so there would be no discrepancy before posting, and there was no diff :-)
10:31 audreyt commit bit to the synopses is handed by $Larry not me :)
10:31 SamB audreyt: what!
10:31 SamB hot-swappable Larries?
10:32 SamB or even cold-swappable?
10:32 audreyt the declarator for that is "constant" I'm afraid
10:32 SamB oh
10:32 SamB well.
10:32 SamB you have such odd syntax!
10:32 TreyHarris lol
10:33 SamB in almost any other channel, that would be an env var...
10:33 audreyt you mean contextual...
10:42 TreyHarris audreyt: contextual subs?  do they exist?  you can do "my sub foo is context" but you can't use &+context...
10:43 audreyt my &foo is context := {... }
10:43 audreyt &+context(moose)
10:43 audreyt sure you can.
10:46 TreyHarris ?eval sub bar { &+foo() }; my sub foo is context { say "moose!" }; bar();
10:46 evalbot_r13489 is now known as evalbot_r13492
10:46 evalbot_r13492 Error: No compatible subroutine found: "&ENV::foo"
10:47 TreyHarris guess i'm doing something wrong.  or is it unimpl?
10:49 audreyt can't say "my sub foo is context" yet
10:49 audreyt have to say
10:49 audreyt my &foo is context := sub {}
10:50 TreyHarris ?eval sub bar { &+foo() }; my &foo is context := sub { say "moose!" }; bar();
10:50 evalbot_r13492 Error: No compatible subroutine found: "&ENV::foo"
10:50 audreyt curiously:
10:51 audreyt ?eval sub bar { &+foo.call } my &foo is context := sub { say "moose!" }; bar();
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10:51 evalbot_r13492 OUTPUT[moose! ] Bool::True
10:51 TreyHarris ?eval my $foo is context = "moose"; say $+foo
10:51 evalbot_r13492 Error: Can't modify constant item: VUndef
10:52 audreyt $+foo doesn't see this sope.
10:52 audreyt scope
10:52 audreyt the errmsg is misleading because %ENV is bound to undef
10:52 TreyHarris ?eval my $foo is context = "moose"; { say $+foo }
10:52 audreyt unde f safemode
10:52 audreyt under safemode, even.
10:52 evalbot_r13492 Error: Can't modify constant item: VUndef
10:52 audreyt still no caller frame.
10:52 audreyt ?eval my $foo is context = "moose"; sub{ say $+foo }.()
10:52 TreyHarris ?eval my $foo is context = "moose"; sub { say $+foo }.()
10:53 evalbot_r13492 OUTPUT[moose ] Bool::True
10:53 evalbot_r13492 OUTPUT[moose ] Bool::True
10:53 TreyHarris lol
10:53 TreyHarris see?  i told you, give me a commit bit and I'll do your examples for you ;-)
10:53 TreyHarris ok, i think my fatigue has beaten my pain, so it's sleepytime for me. :-)
10:53 audreyt and I thank $deity for it :)
10:53 * TreyHarris waves
10:53 audreyt sleep well!
10:53 TreyHarris Zzzzz &
10:56 iblechbot joined perl6
11:05 svnbot6 r13493 | audreyt++ | * S29_spec.t: TODO everything.
11:10 eden_c joined perl6
11:12 buetow joined perl6
11:30 svnbot6 r13494 | audreyt++ | * Prettyprinting for signature default expressions.
11:30 svnbot6 r13494 | audreyt++ |   (Doesn't prettyprint back to Perl6 yet.)
11:44 mako132_ joined perl6
11:45 gaal hmm, how'd you get away with r13494 on 6.4? I had a patch waiting for 6.6... :/
11:46 ludan joined perl6
11:46 gaal superficially looking I see yout put the prettyExp function in Exp.hs and not in Pretty.hs, where I'd been getting circularity errors, but I don't yet see why it solved those
11:49 agentzh joined perl6
11:51 agentzh kolibrie: i'll fix the leftover .c file problem for *nix later.
11:51 agentzh that is a fault of judy's own build system.
11:51 agentzh (not mine :))
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11:54 svnbot6 r13495 | agentz++ | [Makefile.PL]
11:54 svnbot6 r13495 | agentz++ | - cleaned up the rev number updating logic.
11:55 agentzh is anyone here on windows?
11:56 agentzh pugs building report on win32 will be appreciated.
12:06 agentzh oh, judy compilation process on my cygwin is terribly slow. so i can expect it's also very slow on *nix.
12:06 agentzh this is really unfortunate for *nix users.
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12:07 agentzh i'm guessing if there's too much magic involved in judy's Makefile, which slows down the building.
12:09 agentzh ajs said yesterday that Judy's Makefile should be removed by distclean. hmm...will add that to realclean.
12:09 agentzh distclean is not under my control...
12:13 svnbot6 r13496 | audreyt++ | * formatQuite for Exp now dumps back into Perl 6 syntax (incomplete);
12:13 svnbot6 r13496 | audreyt++ |   this enables Signature literals with defaults to prettyprinted
12:13 svnbot6 r13496 | audreyt++ |   back correctly.
12:13 audreyt gaal: signature.t all pass, arrr!
12:14 Limbic_Region agentzh - WRT whatever it is you wanted me to test yesterday.  I did a realclean and wiped out third-party and was able to build just fine on Win32
12:14 agentzh Limbic_Region: glad to hear that!
12:14 Limbic_Region audreyt - some of those hiveminder tasks may be moot at this point.  I can't be sure but it seems that some of them have magically fixed on their own.
12:14 audreyt ok :)
12:15 audreyt I like bigs that magickally fix themselves.
12:15 audreyt bugs, even.
12:16 Limbic_Region for instance - the all_parse.t which previously aborted on Win32 under the harness is now working
12:16 Limbic_Region and there is another Win32 smoker who is apparently not having any problems with some of the web related tests in ext hanging
12:17 agentzh audreyt: are you interested in cygwin build failure reports?
12:18 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "Cygwin build failure" (131 lines, 7.2K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19817
12:18 agentzh ingore it in case you're not interested.
12:19 agentzh (in face i'm not very interested.)
12:21 audreyt gaal: sorry, was afk
12:21 audreyt gaal: would you commit the 6.6 branch of yours then?
12:21 audreyt gaal: the trick is prettyExp :: Exp -> Doc
12:25 audreyt agentzh: I'm not uninterested; let me think
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ | [Makefile.PL]
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ | - renamed target "cleanjudy" to "judyclean"
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ | [third-party/judy/Judy-1.0.3/cleanmore.pl]
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ | - added this perl5 script to do extra cleaning work for
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ |   *nix judy. (this should fix the leftover .c issues
12:25 agentzh audreyt++
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ |   reported by kolibrie++)
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ | [util/build_pugs.pl]
12:25 svnbot6 r13497 | agentz++ | - added -e "Makefile" to *nix judy logic.
12:29 svnbot6 r13498 | agentz++ | [third-party/judy/Judy-1.0.3/cleanmore.pl]
12:29 svnbot6 r13498 | agentz++ | - warned "info: Leftover files removed." at the end of
12:29 svnbot6 r13498 | agentz++ |   execution (just to ease debugging of the "judyclean"
12:29 svnbot6 r13498 | agentz++ |   target)
12:29 agentzh kolibrie: with r13498, you should see the output "info: Leftover files removed." at the end of your "make judyclean" run. and there should be no leftover .c files under Judy1/ and JudyL/. :)
12:30 agentzh audreyt: do you think if "realclean" should remove Judy's Makefile?
12:31 agentzh removing Judy's Makefile significantly slows down *nix user's judy building process. :)
12:31 audreyt agentzh: try again?
12:31 agentzh ./configure is very slow, you know.
12:31 agentzh not sure if it's worth it.
12:32 audreyt though realclean is not really part of regular build process
12:32 agentzh audreyt: okay
12:32 agentzh up'ing now
12:32 audreyt I think rm it is fine
12:32 agentzh okay :)
12:33 audreyt r13499
12:33 Sal joined perl6
12:33 svnbot6 r13499 | audreyt++ | * Attempt to fix cygwin build by normalizing monfig_path
12:34 agentzh building r13499...
12:34 agentzh (under cygwin)
12:34 agentzh once cygwin build is working, i'll be able to test *nix logic in my win32 box. yay.
12:36 weinig|away is now known as weinig
12:38 agentzh cmarcelo: why not use src/Makefile in Judy?
12:39 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "audreyt: still failing..." (78 lines, 4.3K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19819
12:39 Daveman hehe, cygwin
12:40 ofer__ joined perl6
12:40 agentzh $ ls /cygdrive/d/ghc/ghc-6.4.2/bin/ghc.exe
12:40 agentzh /cygdrive/d/ghc/ghc-6.4.2/bin/ghc.exe
12:40 agentzh it does exist.
12:40 agentzh Daveman: hey
12:40 ofer__ is now known as ofer1
12:43 agentzh weird.
12:43 audreyt agentzh: rm util/*.exe
12:43 audreyt and svn up
12:43 audreyt and try r13500
12:43 agentzh pugs/util/*.exe?
12:43 audreyt yeah
12:43 agentzh k
12:44 svnbot6 r13500 | audreyt++ | * more cygwin tweaks
12:44 discordja joined perl6
12:44 agentzh oh...judy's configure is slow...i really hate it?
12:44 agentzh s/?/!/
12:44 agentzh s/\?/!/
12:45 agentzh :)
12:45 audreyt :)
12:45 audreyt shower, bbiab
12:47 Limbic_Region audreyt - when you return, those tests in ext/ are still hanging for me so not sure what the difference is
12:51 agentzh audreyt: same error...
12:52 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "cygwin failure" (56 lines, 3.4K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19820
12:53 kolibrie agentzh: ok, will check sometime on .c files
12:53 arhuman left perl6
12:55 Daveman Hi :)
12:55 svnbot6 r13501 | agentz++ | [build_pugs.pl]
12:55 svnbot6 r13501 | agentz++ | - improved the *nix judy building logic.
12:55 gaal audreyt: I had an Exp -> Doc. apparently the trick was putting it in Exp.hs and not Pretty.hs! :-)
12:56 gaal I'm away from my dev env, and it seems like you solved the problem? so i don't know if there's anything worth committing from my branch
12:56 xinming joined perl6
12:56 gaal moose.
12:57 penk joined perl6
12:57 audreyt gaal: well, if you had a good pretty for Exp
12:57 rodi joined perl6
12:57 svnbot6 r13502 | audreyt++ | * another try for cygwin...
12:58 audreyt I started prettyQuite for Exp to essentially become .perl
12:58 audreyt but it's very incomplete
12:58 audreyt what else were in your branch?
12:58 audreyt agentzh: try again
13:00 agentzh joined perl6
13:00 agentzh audreyt: i'll try 502
13:01 vel joined perl6
13:02 agentzh i think judy on *nix should build faster now.
13:02 agentzh not sure if it works since my cygwin...
13:03 svnbot6 r13503 | agentz++ | [Makefile.PL]
13:03 svnbot6 r13503 | agentz++ | - uses gmake for *nix judy (when possible)
13:04 Limbic_Region I can do a cygwin build here locally if absolutely necessary
13:04 eden_c left perl6
13:04 agentzh audreyt: i've gone much further...
13:04 * Limbic_Region would prefer not to though
13:04 audreyt good
13:05 audreyt the key here is that all paths inside .exe must be of the form c:/foo
13:05 audreyt not /cygdrive/c/foo
13:05 agentzh it fails in p5embed.c...
13:05 agentzh i'll paste the errors.
13:05 audreyt ok, nopaste again?
13:06 Limbic_Region audreyt - out of curiosity, did you get the /msg I just sent you?
13:06 audreyt just did
13:07 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "oh, it's incomplete...." (297 lines, 17.1K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19823
13:07 agentzh audreyt: sorry, it's incomplete, i'll paste again.
13:09 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "this time it's complete... :)" (561 lines, 43.3K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19824
13:11 gaal audreyt: oh, not any more detailed than that. prettyQuite's a terrible name really
13:12 gaal the one eventually dispatched in the case of :($x = "this is a val") is the regular pretty
13:12 audreyt k.
13:12 gaal prettyQuite is for .guts
13:12 gaal and is usually just show x
13:12 audreyt ok, so I placed it in the wrong domain apparently
13:13 gaal uh, there may be a redundant layer there
13:13 gaal i can clean up a bit when i get home
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13:14 audreyt cool
13:14 audreyt agentzh: ok, try r13504
13:14 audreyt if it doesn't work, maybe we don't build perl5 embed for cygiwn
13:15 gaal ooh, we're unbreaking cygwin now? cool!
13:15 svnbot6 r13504 | audreyt++ | * one more cygwin kluge.
13:15 agentzh k
13:17 agentzh gaal: well, it's in process. :)
13:17 agentzh *progress
13:17 gaal agentzh: not for the first time ;-)
13:17 dakkar joined perl6
13:17 agentzh *nod*
13:18 agentzh oh...i'm stilling building judy...
13:18 agentzh too slow...
13:21 agentzh audreyt: same error (i did realclean before "make fast" this time)
13:21 audreyt agentzh: oy..
13:22 agentzh i wonder why it says "EXTERN.h: No such file or directory"
13:22 audreyt agentzh: nopaste your pugs.cabal ?
13:22 audreyt well that's because the embed flags had wrong directories in them
13:22 audreyt that much is clear
13:22 agentzh got it.
13:22 agentzh a sec...
13:23 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "my pugs.cabal :)" (23 lines, 2.8K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19826
13:24 audreyt yeah, it's as I feared
13:24 audreyt a sc
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13:25 Limbic_Region should I bother setting up a Cygwin build as well or are the Cygwin problems not specific to agentzh?
13:26 agentzh Limbic_Region: that'll be lovely!
13:26 Limbic_Region and does GHC need to be a cygwin ghc or what?
13:26 agentzh i'm using win32 ghc.
13:26 Limbic_Region is that possibly a problem?
13:26 agentzh it works fine.
13:26 audreyt there's no cygwin ghc
13:26 audreyt agentzh: try r13505
13:26 audreyt don't realclean
13:26 Limbic_Region I thought Pugs wasn't building?
13:26 agentzh k
13:26 audreyt after Makefile.PL ; make
13:26 audreyt nopaste Pugs.cabal
13:27 audreyt don't need to wait till Pugs.Embed
13:27 agentzh or "make fast"?
13:27 audreyt sure, that works too
13:27 agentzh i really hate "make"
13:27 agentzh okay
13:27 svnbot6 r13505 | audreyt++ | * More cygpath.
13:28 Limbic_Region agentzh - I am not going to do the Cygwin build at work.  Too much hassle.  I will set it up at home though and build a cygwin GHC (which should prove to be fun)
13:28 agentzh Limbic_Region: k
13:29 audreyt Limbic_Region: GHC is not known to build on Cygwin since GHC 6.2.
13:29 audreyt although #haskell will consider you a hero if you hacked the build system to do so
13:30 audreyt I suspect it may not be fun.
13:30 Limbic_Region audreyt - I know more about the GHC build system then I do about GHC
13:30 Limbic_Region actually, a considerable amount more
13:31 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "my second pugs.cabal :)" (23 lines, 2.7K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19827
13:31 Limbic_Region and if all else fails, I could use MinGW inside the Cygwin environment.  That should be a comprimise if I can't get it building strictly with Cygwin
13:32 Limbic_Region I never really understood why Cygwin offers  MinGW as a package but I might as well make use of it
13:32 audreyt agentzh: ok, try again
13:33 svnbot6 r13506 | audreyt++ | * yet another try...
13:33 agentzh ack.
13:34 lanny joined perl6
13:35 agentzh have i broken any *nix guy (or gal)'s pugs build?
13:35 agentzh (out of curiosity)
13:35 Limbic_Region as of what build agentzh - you could always check the smoke server
13:36 agentzh Limbic_Region: i hear that. :)
13:36 Limbic_Region linux works at least up to r13478
13:36 agentzh audreyt: nopaste pugs.cabal again?
13:36 Limbic_Region darwin up to  r13500  
13:36 agentzh Limbic_Region: i need reports since r13503.
13:37 rodi agentzh: I'm smoking 13503 right now, but it built fine.
13:37 agentzh rodi: thanks :) that's sufficient to me.
13:37 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "my 3rd pugs.cabal :)" (23 lines, 2.8K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19829
13:38 agentzh src/Pugs/Embed/../../perl5/p5embed.h:5:20: EXTERN.h: No such file or directory
13:38 agentzh same error here...
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13:40 lanny Hi all.  Got sort of a "vision" question.  If there is stuff in Pugs that's Pugs::Internal that could be Perl 6 should I move it over or just leave it alone?  I've read through the "About Pugs" pages but can't make an easy determination.
13:41 Limbic_Region audreyt - WRT p5embed.h, couldn't that be a generated file so that p5 could be queried as to the proper location for the include instead of trying to rely on modifying -I path?
13:41 Limbic_Region I guess that really is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other though
13:42 agentzh audreyt: maybe /usr/lib/perl5/5.8/cygwin/CORE should be converted to D:/cygwin/usr/lib/... or something like that?
13:43 Limbic_Region lanny - (this is just my opinion), at the very least you should write the p6 code so that if it IS a good idea, the work has already been done
13:44 lanny Ok.  Got that far.  :)  I guess drop it in uspecced like sort?  (Although all this stuff is specced so makes me wonder.)
13:44 agentzh audreyt: actually ENTERN.h is in /lib/perl5/5.8/cygwin/CORE instead of /usr/lib/perl5/5.8/cygwin/CORE on my machine.
13:45 Limbic_Region lanny - I would go ahead and put it in Prelude but not activate the code
13:45 Limbic_Region and then ping audreyt again (or gaal) when you have their undivided attention
13:45 Limbic_Region because I think the answer is "it depends"
13:46 Limbic_Region there is some code intentionally not in there because of the effects it has on the build
13:46 Limbic_Region I don't know the specifics though
13:46 lanny Yep.  And that's the caveat I was seeing as well.
13:48 svnbot6 r13507 | arhuman++ | Added myself in the AUTHORS file for my first commit (asked by Audrey)
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13:52 agentzh audreyt: i'll take care of the cygwin issue myself.
13:53 lanny Thanks again, Limbic.
13:55 cjeris joined perl6
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14:09 webmind joined perl6
14:14 * agentzh is busy studying the pugs build system...
14:14 agentzh fortunately it's perl5. :)
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14:33 agentzh audreyt: i've got much further now.
14:33 agentzh win32 ghc under cygwin is really a source of pain!!!
14:34 agentzh i'm looking forward to Limbic_Region's cygwin ghc.
14:34 agentzh in the meantime, i'll have to add some evil magic to the build system...
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14:37 agentzh with luck, cygwin pugs will build tonight. :)
14:39 wilx How can there be Cygwin pugs when there is no Cygwin GHC?
14:40 Limbic_Region wilx - use a Win32 GHC
14:44 agentzh Limbic_Region: is there a way to get the installation path of cygwin in cygwin perl?
14:45 agentzh for example, environment variable...
14:46 agentzh i really don't want to refactor build_pugs.pl too much.
14:47 audreyt agentzh: you want `cygpath`
14:47 audreyt `cygpath -w /usr`
14:47 audreyt gives c:\cygwin\usr
14:47 agentzh ah
14:47 agentzh thanks!
14:48 audreyt np :) see Makefile.PL's usage
14:48 agentzh k
14:48 ajs Am I misunderstanding v6, or is this output wrong: perl -e 'use v6-alpha; ' - 'for (1=>2)->$n,$m{say "$n with $m"}'
14:48 ajs 1 with 2
14:49 audreyt that's likely broken.
14:49 ajs ok
14:49 ajs I'm trying to proof some of my example code from Functions.pod, but nothing can handle it ;)
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14:51 agentzh cygpath is so nice.
15:13 svnbot6 r13508 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Parser: Parse for
15:13 svnbot6 r13508 | audreyt++ |     repeat {
15:13 svnbot6 r13508 | audreyt++ |     }
15:13 svnbot6 r13508 | audreyt++ |     while 1;
15:13 svnbot6 r13508 | audreyt++ |   as specced; the lone-closing-brace rule doesn't apply here.
15:13 svnbot6 r13508 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Eval: Allow "redo" to redo the first repeat loop.
15:13 svnbot6 r13508 | audreyt++ |   (repeat.t now all passes.)
15:13 svnbot6 r13509 | audreyt++ | * repeat.t: Take away an unneccessary eval.
15:14 audreyt agentzh: thanks a lot for the very accurate/comprehensive repeat.t :)
15:14 buetow joined perl6
15:14 audreyt enough triage for today... g'nite lambdacamels :)
15:14 audreyt *wave* &
15:18 Limbic_Region sleep well audreyt
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15:29 ajs night
15:30 justatheory joined perl6
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15:40 weinig is now known as weinig|bbl
15:41 agentzh anyone willing to explain what sub build_lib in build_pugs.pl does?
15:45 agentzh ohhh...i'm now at dirent.h
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15:53 svnbot6 r13510 | ajs++ | Added classify per Damian pointing out that I missed it on p6l
15:58 ajs Is "Lazy of Pair" a valid type for a return value? It seems it should be, but I'm not sure
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16:04 agentzh oh oh oh...anyone can help me with "D:/cygwin/usr/include/sys/dirent.h:62: error: syntax error before "__ino64_t""?
16:04 ludan joined perl6
16:05 ludan WTF
16:06 gaal agentzh: probably an undefined type / incomplete include?
16:06 agentzh not sure...
16:07 Psyche^ joined perl6
16:07 gaal can you pase line 62 and the one above it?
16:08 agentzh sure
16:08 agentzh  __ino64_t __d_dirhash;/* hash of directory name for use by readdir */
16:09 gaal oh, this is inside a struct definition?
16:09 gaal what's the line above this?
16:09 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "sys/dirent.h" (90 lines, 2.1K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19834
16:09 agentzh that is the whole file... ;)
16:10 agentzh yes, it's inside a struct definition.
16:10 integral joined perl6
16:10 gaal by eyeball at least that dosen't look like line 62!
16:11 blibbet left perl6
16:11 gaal what file has typedef .* _off_t ?
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16:11 agentzh looking
16:11 davidfetter hi
16:11 davidfetter anybody seen flavio glock recently?
16:12 mauke_ the error seems to indicate that __ino64_t is undefined
16:12 lumi Does cc just have no idea what sort of token it should get next? What's up with 'syntax error'?
16:12 agentzh D:\cygwin\usr\include/sys/_types.h:typedef long _off_t;
16:12 agentzh D:\cygwin\usr\include/mingw/sys/types.h:typedef long _off_t;
16:13 mauke_ gcc-4 says error: expected specifier-qualifier-list before '...'
16:13 agentzh oh
16:14 agentzh i'm not sure if cygwin and mingw are compatible.
16:15 agentzh the .c and .h sources are from cygwin while the gcc used to compile them is actually from ghc's mingw...
16:15 agentzh that's really evil...
16:15 mauke_ well, the syntax is  specifier-qualifier-list declarator-list ';' and gcc thinks that __ino64_t is part of the declarator-list
16:17 * agentzh dislikes these pieces of ugly C code...
16:19 mauke_ is now known as mauke
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16:23 Psyche^ is now known as Patterner
16:23 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "The latest Cygwin build failure" (73 lines, 5.9K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19835
16:23 agentzh anyone willing to look into this for me?
16:25 agentzh it seems mingw's header is including a cygwin header...oh, no...
16:28 agentzh by putting mingw's include path __before__ cygwin's, i went a bit further:
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16:29 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "Now i'm already at Pugs.Embed.Perl5. (Previous HS modules have been cimpiled.)" (797 lines, 61.8K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19836
16:30 agentzh D:/cygwin/usr/include/cygwin/in.h:27: error: syntax error before numeric constant
16:30 agentzh what does that mean?
16:31 agentzh the line 27 in in.h is:   IPPROTO_IP = 0,/* Dummy protocol for TCP*/
16:32 agentzh this line is in enum { ... };
16:32 agentzh my C knowledge tells me it shouldn't be a syntax error. well...
16:33 theorbtwo Can you give us the prior few lines, up to the start of the enum?
16:33 agentzh theorttwo: i'll nopaste the whole file. :)
16:34 pasteling "agentzh" at 210.22.200.67 pasted "in.h" (201 lines, 6.5K) at http://sial.org/pbot/19837
16:36 mauke agentzh: my guess is double inclusion
16:37 mauke or rather, inclusion of another file that #defines IPPROTO_IP 1234
16:37 agentzh yeah. it's very likely. :)
16:37 [particle] ack --cc IPPROTO_IP
16:39 agentzh what can i do?
16:41 agentzh i believe combining cygwin and mingw is a nightmare...
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16:46 agentzh so maybe i can conclude that perl5 embedding doesn't work on cygwin...
16:46 agentzh i've spent many hours on it...sigh...
16:49 agentzh gaal: do you have any idea on why pugs-fps-0.7 rebuilds everytime Makefile.PL is invoked?
16:49 agentzh iirc, win32 build doesn't have this oddity.
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16:49 agentzh s/rebuilds everytime/rebuilds on cygwin everytime/
16:51 agentzh after disabling p5 embedding, cygwin pugs is now building smoothly... :)
16:52 agentzh to make cygwin p5 embedding a reality, i think we truly need a cygwin ghc instead of a mingw one.
16:52 agentzh Limbic_Region: i'll rely on your work... ;)
16:54 agentzh okay, cygwin pugs without p5 embedding is now built successfully. :)
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17:02 Limbic_Region agentzh - out of curiosity - are you trying to imbed a Cygwin perl 5 or a AS perl 5 or some other perl 5?
17:02 agentzh i've been trying to embed a cygwin perl5.
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17:04 agentzh hi, xinming :)
17:04 Limbic_Region well, audreyt didn't seem to have a whole lot of confidence that I would be able to get a cygwin ghc working
17:04 agentzh Limbic_Region: me too. :)
17:04 agentzh (sorry for that)
17:05 agentzh Limbic_Region: so just go ahead and prove us wrong. :)
17:07 Limbic_Region agentzh - no offense taken
17:08 Limbic_Region I actually am not as motivated to get ghc working on cygwin since I have pretty much abandoned cygwin - MinGW and msys do pretty much everything I need
17:08 agentzh Limbic_Region: *nod*
17:08 ajs heh... v6 translates "my A $x .= new(...);" to "my A; $x .= new(...)"
17:10 ajs more generally, it translates "my A $x" into "my A; $x"
17:10 mauke you should immediately write a japh that abuses this behavior!
17:10 ajs heh
17:11 ajs Well, given that "my A" is a syntax error, I'm not sure how....
17:11 svnbot6 r13511 | agentz++ | - a few progresses toward cygwin pugs
17:11 svnbot6 r13511 | agentz++ | (it builds now if p5 embedding is disabled.)
17:14 [particle] how about my open FH, '<', 'foo'; my FH $x = 'bar';
17:15 [particle] probably not too useful in a japh though
17:18 gaal agentzh: everything in third-party has often exhibited this behavior
17:19 agentzh gaal: okay
17:21 agentzh Limbic_Region: if you could test pugs on cygwin, i'll be delighted. :)
17:21 agentzh (you can use win32 ghc and noperl5)
17:23 Limbic_Region agentzh - will be happy to tonight
17:23 Limbic_Region but it really is a hassle to get things working on my work machine
17:23 agentzh yay
17:24 Limbic_Region As time permits, I will try
17:24 agentzh k
17:24 Limbic_Region cygwin pugs, MinGW GHC, no perl5
17:25 agentzh aye
17:25 Limbic_Region cygwin pugs, MinGW GHC, AS Perl
17:25 Limbic_Region cygwin pugs, MinGW GHC, cygwin perl
17:25 agentzh wow
17:25 Limbic_Region cygwin pugs, cygwin ghc, cygwin perl
17:25 Limbic_Region the last one being a very long shot
17:25 agentzh hehe, cygwin ghc does not exist. :)
17:25 Limbic_Region ^^^^
17:25 agentzh yes
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17:26 Limbic_Region agentzh - any hope of building ghc on cygwin (without bootstrapping which I refuse to do) means installing a bin distro of the last known working version
17:26 Limbic_Region I believe audreyt said that was 6.2
17:26 agentzh people building cygwin ghc == heros
17:28 agentzh once there's a cygwin ghc binary, there will be no need to struggle with win32 ghc under cygwin any more. :)
17:30 Limbic_Region agentzh - small nit, once there is a CURRENT cygwin ghc binary
17:30 agentzh right
17:32 agentzh anyway, i've got a *working* cygwin pugs, though not an ideal one.
17:33 agentzh at least i can use it to test the *nix part of the pugs build system on cygwin.
17:33 agentzh it's good enough for tonight...
17:33 agentzh 1:31 AM here...
17:34 * agentzh waves &
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17:49 nothingmuch 3/w 21
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18:24 putter boston area folks: http://iic.harvard.edu/event1.php Guy Steele on Fortress, at Harvard, Sept 27.
18:24 lambdabot putter: You have 2 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them.
18:24 lambdabot Title: Events
18:24 putter audreyt++: thanks :)
18:25 putter @tell spinclad http://colabti.de/irclogger/irclogger_log/​perl6?date=2006-09-20,Wed&amp;sel=541#l869
18:25 lambdabot Consider it noted.
18:25 putter @tell steven http://colabti.de/irclogger/irclogger_log/​perl6?date=2006-09-20,Wed&amp;sel=541#l869
18:25 lambdabot Consider it noted.
18:25 Limbic_Region steven or stvn ?
18:26 * Limbic_Region gets confused
18:29 putter doh.  thanks LR.
18:29 putter @tell stevan http://colabti.de/irclogger/irclogger_log/​perl6?date=2006-09-20,Wed&amp;sel=541#l869
18:29 lambdabot Consider it noted.
18:30 * putter wonders if lambdabot ever gc's its messages...
18:30 idiotmax joined perl6
18:31 * [particle] hands putter a '/msg lambdabot' or two
18:31 putter is now known as steve1
18:31 steve1 is now known as putter
18:32 putter ah well.
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18:33 putter http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/​Fortress_programming_language http://research.sun.com/projects/plrg/
18:33 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/zl8hn
18:34 putter The rendering layer idea is interesting.  http://research.sun.com/projects/plrg/fortress.pdf  appendix D,E,F.
18:34 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/h36gd
18:36 putter Eg, basically there is a regexp over identifiers which controls face.  font, italics, etc.  based on length, capitalization, underscores, etc.
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18:37 putter I prefer p6's direct use of unicode to the capital word "ALPHA" is rendered as unicode alpha,
18:38 putter but being able to control face too could be interesting.
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18:39 putter Though neither gets you... ooo....
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18:41 putter How about a p6 module / domain specific language, TexMath?  It processes something like... oh, too long since I've done tex, faking it, "\over{x}{y}"  into "$x/$y".  Other conventions for integrals, etc, etc.
18:42 integral hmm, executable maths papers?  handy :)
18:42 putter So one can write a real 2D denotational semantics equation, and it really works (not an original idea, someone did a version in emacs, but I've never been able to find the link again).
18:42 putter :)
18:43 SamB \frac{x}{y} is the one with the fraction bar...
18:43 putter Appendix F goes through unicode chars, and attaches mathematically inspired constraints - eg, this is a x, which can be used with y but not z.
18:43 SamB I'm fairly sure
18:43 integral SamB: \frac is latex, \over is TeX
18:43 putter :) thanks
18:43 integral \frac{x}{y} = x / y = x \over y
18:43 SamB integral: hmm
18:44 SamB people actually use TeX?
18:44 integral sure
18:44 SamB (without LaTeX?)
18:44 putter lol
18:44 SamB people other than Knuth?
18:44 integral If you're replacing most of latex's page macros and fiddling with \output, using (plain) TeX can save some time
18:45 SamB true enough
18:45 putter (a latex preprocessor would be quite nifty too...;)
18:45 SamB why?
18:46 SamB or rather, what do you mean by that?
18:46 TreyHarris SamB: 'TeX, without LaTeX' is referred to as 'plain TeX' ;-)
18:47 SamB TreyHarris: well. depends.
18:47 TreyHarris latex's essentially a macro language (in somewhat the same sense as perl 6's macros, i.e. not just text-substituters) on top of tex.  if you need something not provided by the macros, you have to drop into plain TeX.
18:48 SamB plain TeX is actually a format in its own right, isn't it?
18:48 putter tex is a programming language.  a dsl.  latex is a macro library on top of it.
18:49 putter re why?, so, let's see...
18:50 TreyHarris SamB: well... only if C plus the standard library is actually a language in its own right ;-)  'plan TeX' is TeX plus the standard control characters that every other macro package uses
18:50 TreyHarris s/characters/library/
18:51 TreyHarris s/plan TeX/plain TeX/ #geez
18:51 Patterner dsl?
18:52 Patterner darn stupid language?
18:52 [particle] domain specific language
18:52 Patterner oops
18:52 putter the game is representing math.  level 0 is p5, using words for function names.  this approach can work nicely (eg, Sussman's Structure and Interpretation of Classical Mechanics, which uses scheme).
18:52 [particle] and, generally, darn stupid ;)
18:52 [particle] see sql :)
18:53 putter http://mitpress.mit.edu/SICM/​book-Z-H-5.html#%_chap_Temp_2 preface, example http://mitpress.mit.edu/SICM/book-Z-H-11.html
18:53 lambdabot http://mitpress.mit.edu/SICM/​book-Z-H-5.html#%_chap_Temp_2
18:54 * putter tries to picture laPostScript. ;)
18:55 putter level 1 is unicode characters, but linear text.
18:55 putter s/linear/still linear/
18:55 putter i suppose level next is adding font info, but still being linear.
18:56 putter level next (?) is going 2D
18:56 putter either ascii art,  '$x\n----\n$y' -> $x/$y
18:57 stevan hey putter
18:57 lambdabot stevan: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
18:57 stevan thank lambdabot
18:57 putter or rendering an embedded language (tex example - texemacs did this, but google doesnt find good pointers... project dead?),
18:57 putter hey stevan :)
18:57 stevan putter: looks like it could be a very intersting talk
18:58 putter or... what am I missing, there was another option...?
18:59 putter re talk, yes.  would also be interesting to explore how he perceives the design space.
19:00 stevan putter: are you planning on going to the Boston.pm Damian talk on that monday>?
19:02 putter SamB: so, re why, perhaps representing the domain (math) in it's normal way.  which in some respects is an ambiguous and nighmarish way, and you would be much better off using scheme/p6, but...
19:02 putter stevan: think so, yes
19:03 putter anyway, fortress looks neat.  spec is nearing 1.0.
19:05 justatheory_ is now known as justatheory
19:05 putter stevan: planning on going to either?
19:06 stevan putter: pondering the Boston.pm meeting,... but now the fortress looks interesting too
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19:12 [particle] say "DEBUG: " ~ $?MUNDANE.code;
19:13 putter stevan: 4pm vs 7
19:19 putter SamB: still chewing on that "why?"... I guess the core idea is that when a domain has a notation, it can be adventageous (mostly clarity, I think) to be able to present code in that notation, at least as a secondary representation.  Math notation tends to be unacceptably ambiguous for coding, so a better dsl than latex might
19:19 putter be one of the math interchange standard languages.
19:19 svnbot6 r13512 | ajs++ | Added question about sqrt Unicode alias
19:19 SamB mmm
19:20 integral joined perl6
19:21 putter There are unfortunately(?) several such, but no reason each can't get its own module.
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19:27 putter A takeaway idea might be that rather than p6 code assuming it never sees anything but a text editor, one might be able to set a framework up so a  { use StateMachine;  start -> blah blah blah } bit of code can perhaps result in a pretty diagram on the side, because the StateMachine module did something to declare "my dsl can be alternately rendered as ...".
19:28 putter One could even go further down that path, to read-write alternate representations, and direct manipulation.
19:29 putter s/direct/direct domain-specific&optimized/
19:30 putter the big counter argument to all this is of course "you can't parse p6 without running it".  but perhaps the editor can get not just parse info from it's p6 support backend, but also "can you give me a handle to the dsl on line 62, I'd like to chat with it about rendering...". ;)
19:31 discordja joined perl6
19:32 putter job interview practice &
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19:55 TreyHarris @tell putter actually, I asked TimToady and audreyt a couple weeks ago when the emacs & twigils issue came up, and apparently you *should* still be able to parse p6 without running it, perhaps excluding string-returning macros....
19:55 lambdabot Consider it noted.
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20:05 avar TreyHarris: I asked TimToady about function prototypes & parsing the other day and got the impression that you still needed to run it to parse it..
20:11 PerlJam avar: you only need to run things that munge the grammar, otherwise perl6 is statically analyzable.
20:11 PerlJam avar: Like the macros that TreyHarris mentions
20:11 TreyHarris avar: huh.  don't know how to reconcile that with his saying that editors could use perl to parse perl for their syntax highlighting and indention
20:12 avar I thought function prototypes were still an issue
20:13 avar something akin to BEGIN { time % 2 == 0 ? eval "sub meh () {}" : eval "sub meh (@) {}" } meh "foo", "bar", "mehness"
20:14 SamB isn't it dangerous to have code run when you open something in your editor?
20:15 avar you don't need to run anything to provide a syntax tree, hopefully
20:16 [particle] well, you need a parser to run
20:16 TreyHarris avar: i'm having difficulty seeing where that would result in a compile-time, rather than a runtime, issue.  meh would be a sub call regardless
20:17 TreyHarris sub <-> meth fallback means you'll never catch that at compiletime
20:19 avar Whether something is a comment can depend on a sub prototype in p5, I was wondering about such cases for editors
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20:25 SamB avar: hmm?
20:25 avar SamB: http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node=44722
20:25 lambdabot Title: On Parsing Perl
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21:05 gaal * can't work as a capture sigil?
21:06 BooK joined perl6
21:07 [particle] how about <
21:08 [particle] or ?
21:08 gaal I think that would require backtracking to disambiguate from <moose elk>
21:08 [particle] this is going to be fun writing the parser for
21:08 gaal and ? is already boolean context.
21:09 [particle] well, we're changing one thing, why not a zillion others? (i'm joking, of course)
21:09 * [particle] wishes he had an apl keyboard for perl 6 programming
21:10 * gaal hands [particle] U+2336 and then some
21:11 [particle] i've been thinking about writing apl tests in apl. i thought i'd use the check symbol from smartlinks for ok.
21:11 gaal whee
21:12 [particle] i need symbols for is, like, and plan
21:12 [particle] perhaps i'll go shopping later
21:13 * [particle] imagines playing 'unicode wheel of fortune'
21:14 gaal sleepy time for me &
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22:30 nothingmuch why isn't scalarness of captures just $$foo ?
22:30 audreyt what is this scalarness thing?
22:31 nothingmuch what larry raised on the ml
22:31 nothingmuch i'm sure i just misunderstood the problem
22:31 nothingmuch =)
22:31 TimToady that would be the invocant out of the $foo capture
22:31 nothingmuch ah
22:31 nothingmuch so what does [,] =$capture yield?
22:32 TimToady the = expands the $capture to a "list", and the [,] makes it look like it was part of the original call.
22:32 TimToady I'm proposing a sigil to do all of that.
22:32 nothingmuch oh, for .call etc?
22:32 TimToady yes.
22:32 nothingmuch the flatten a capture into another?
22:32 nothingmuch ahh... now everything is clicking
22:33 TimToady a capture sigil would autoflatten like @, only even further.
22:33 nothingmuch *nod*
22:33 nothingmuch why a sigil,  and not e.g. a circumfix operator or something like that?
22:33 nothingmuch that namespace is pretty hard to avoid collisions in
22:33 nothingmuch that said, |foo does look pretty nice
22:33 TimToady could use it as a prefix operator
22:33 audreyt I like |foo.
22:33 TimToady but then you can do that with the other sigils too, kinda
22:34 TimToady it "draws a line in the sand", er, in the argument list.
22:34 nothingmuch *nod*
22:34 Qiang__ joined perl6
22:34 nothingmuch and it looks pretty
22:34 nothingmuch ^_^
22:34 nothingmuch oh
22:34 nothingmuch i discovered the scarlett johansen smiley:
22:34 nothingmuch ^-^
22:35 TimToady the who?
22:35 nothingmuch compare: ^_^ ^-^
22:35 audreyt d(-_-)b
22:35 nothingmuch http://fatbackandcollards.com/wp-content/upl​oads/2006/03/Scarlett-Johansson-BW-smile.jpg
22:35 TreyHarris |($inv: $pos1, $pos2, :name($arg)) etc?
22:35 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/h9dvh
22:35 nothingmuch |\( ) looks kinda crookid though
22:36 TreyHarris TimToady: in t/macros/caller.t, I hypothesized that macros don't introduce a new CALLER frame except in the case of closure-returning macros.  Sane?  audreyt thought so, but I wanted to check with you, as I'm about to check regression on macro forms of Test::eval_*, so if not, I should hold off
22:36 nothingmuch crapx00r spilled tea
22:36 nothingmuch good thing the laundry basket is full =)
22:37 TimToady TreyHarris: no we still use \(...) to make them.  |(...) would deref one.
22:37 TimToady like [...] is the opposite of @(...)
22:38 rodi joined perl6
22:38 nothingmuch hmm
22:38 TreyHarris *nod* yep, that's what I was thinking, just thinko'd
22:38 TimToady I think macros should not introduce a CALLER frame if they can help it.
22:39 audreyt "use re 'PGE'" seems like a good-enough switch to reenable parrot behaviour.
22:39 TimToady oh, the place you quoted from S06 (?) that said that .call throws away the CALLER frame isn't quite right.
22:39 TimToady wrappers have CALLER frames, they're just officially invisible.
22:40 TimToady otherwise how could you return to them?
22:40 TreyHarris yes, hence audreyt saying that .goto is essentiall a return .call
22:40 TimToady audreyt: yes, "use re 'PGE' would be one way to do it.
22:41 audreyt and there'll be more then one way to do it...
22:41 nothingmuch macros are compile time calls, aren't they? in that sense they should have a CALLER Frame but only visible by other macros
22:41 TreyHarris but that's fine, invisible frames == nonexistant frames for my purposes (making Test::proclaim think I called it directly rather than from the macro)
22:41 audreyt nothingmuch: the thing returning by macros.
22:41 TimToady assuming that "return call" can throw optimize away the CALLER
22:41 audreyt nothingmuch: not themselves
22:42 nothingmuch ah
22:42 audreyt TimToady: sure, as it's in tail call position
22:43 * nothingmuch looked for backlog, but appearantly not far enough
22:43 nothingmuch what about *{ } ?
22:43 nothingmuch is that taken by anything right now?
22:44 nothingmuch (as in circumfix, not flatten rv of block)
22:44 TimToady that's Whatever.{ }
22:44 nothingmuch ah
22:45 plural joined perl6
22:45 nothingmuch anymoose, ENOBRANE
22:45 nothingmuch i wasted it all on beurocrats
22:45 nothingmuch good night =)
22:45 TimToady g'night.
22:46 nothingmuch audreyt: is MO still on for fri/sat?
22:46 audreyt nothingmuch: yes
22:46 audreyt sat most likely it seems
22:46 TreyHarris well... if you have macro foo { outerSub1(); return q:code { innerSub(); } }, would outerSub()'s CALLER:: be the macro, and innerSub()'s CALLER:: the macro's caller?
22:47 TreyHarris or would both be the macro's caller?
22:47 audreyt outerSub1's caller should be the macro, I think.
22:47 TreyHarris yes... for die() to work sanely without funny stuff in both places, it would have to
22:48 TreyHarris (for example, die isn't special)
22:48 nothingmuch audreyt: okies, i'll have it ready by then
22:48 audreyt nothingmuch++
22:48 nothingmuch nothingmuch--; # it's not ready yet
22:48 nothingmuch premature karma is the root of all guilt ;-)
22:49 TreyHarris audreyt: is there an easy way for me to check for regression between two local smokes?  squirreling away the yaml file before the second smoke and comparing them is easy enough, but i can't believe somebody hasn't rolled something before to do this...
22:50 azr|elious joined perl6
22:50 audreyt TreyHarris: smoke diff? see on
22:50 audreyt TreyHarris: smoke diff? see nothingmuch
22:50 * TreyHarris looks at nothingmuch
22:50 audreyt havn't used it myself though, but iirc he has that code somewhere.
22:52 nothingmuch yes, i do
22:52 nothingmuch would you like me to finish it?
22:52 nothingmuch i could do that on tuesday ish
22:52 TreyHarris well, i haven't tried it yet, but i'd be astounded if changing Test::eval_* in this way doesn't cause a lot of spurious regression and promotion
22:52 TreyHarris nothingmuch: asleep yet?
22:52 nothingmuch no, copying files
22:52 nothingmuch but supposed to be
22:53 TreyHarris nothingmuch: smoke diff would be useful, but don't knock yourself out, i can swag at the yaml easily enough.
22:53 svnbot6 r13513 | audreyt++ | * Pugs.Prim.Match: Allow selection of PGE instead of PCR by
22:53 svnbot6 r13513 | audreyt++ |   setting an environment variable, PUGS_REGEX_ENGINE, to "pge"
22:53 svnbot6 r13513 | audreyt++ |   or "PGE".
22:53 nothingmuch it's already implemented
22:53 nothingmuch the diffing
22:53 nothingmuch in Test::TAP::HTMLMatrix
22:53 nothingmuch just the smoke server has rough edges
22:53 TreyHarris oh, so what's for tuesday?
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22:54 nothingmuch on monday i have a $work deadline
22:54 nothingmuch on tuesday i could spare some cycles
22:54 nothingmuch and finish it off
22:54 TimToady I think it'd be cool if the differing boxes got a heavy border in the old color, or some such.  Don't know if that's feasible in html though.
22:55 nothingmuch i'll whip up an example
22:55 nothingmuch sections which are the same are folded
22:55 nothingmuch sections which are different are darkened
22:55 nothingmuch and expaneded
22:55 nothingmuch sections == single .t files
22:56 nothingmuch with some Test::TAP::Model based filtering code we should be able to easily remove uninteresting chunks, too
22:56 nothingmuch as discussed with Trey previously
22:56 nothingmuch ok, copy complete
22:56 TimToady k, anything will be better that two side-by-side browser windows. :)
22:56 nothingmuch i'm off to bed
22:56 TreyHarris nothingmuch: *grin*  sounds eerily like my javascript thingy that you never actually saw to show 'user-oriented failures' instead of developer-oriented ones
22:56 nothingmuch TreyHarris: what i'm brain dumping is based on your input =)
22:57 nothingmuch i think you're forgetting our conversatio
22:57 nothingmuch n
22:57 nothingmuch i just want this stuff less dependant on Test::TAP::HTMLMatrix, and more in the Test::TAP::Model layer
22:57 nothingmuch becasue TTH should be just a dumb presentation layer
22:57 TreyHarris i remember the convo, but since it didn't work in safari, you never actually saw my prototype :-)
22:57 nothingmuch link me again
22:57 nothingmuch i've reinstalled FF since
22:58 TreyHarris http://ibiblio.org/harris/smoke.new.html
22:58 lambdabot Title: TAP Matrix - Tue Sep 12 00:37:56 2006 GMT
22:58 TreyHarris there's a hard-to-see button right above the matrix
22:58 TreyHarris and it doesn't toggle, just flips once.  but it was just a quick swag at a prototype
22:58 nothingmuch TreyHarris: that's almost precisely what I had in mind
22:59 nothingmuch but more reusable (not js based)
22:59 TreyHarris yup.  cool cool, nothingmuch++.  now go to bed :-)
22:59 nothingmuch aye
22:59 nothingmuch *poof*
23:01 TreyHarris yay, my mac mini is on its way... i look forward to order-of-magnitude quicker smokes within a few days :-)
23:02 avar Someone need a ppc smoker?
23:03 audreyt $job calls... bbl :)
23:03 svnbot6 r13514 | audreyt++ | * Makefile.PL: Remove the obsolete syck/cbits build flags.
23:03 svnbot6 r13514 | audreyt++ | * INSTALL/Makefile.PL: Document the ways to use parrot/pge as
23:03 svnbot6 r13514 | audreyt++ |   the alternate regex engine, and tweak build messages.
23:05 TreyHarris avar: have you done one lately?
23:05 avar TreyHarris: No, but if they need to be done I might as well set up a cron job
23:07 TreyHarris well, I'll probably continue to do them, as my laptop's what i'm using now.
23:08 TreyHarris but i've been very hesitant to touch much except for tests so long as a full smoke-compile-smoke regression cycle takes me 12 hours :-)
23:09 Limbic_Region audreyt - you b0rk Makefile.PL
23:09 * Limbic_Region attempts to fix it
23:17 Limbic_Region grr - fixed, but apparently I have never checked in something using svn from this machine
23:17 Limbic_Region so I have to remember how to do that
23:17 TreyHarris Limbic_Region: new file or mod?
23:17 TreyHarris if mod, just svn commit $filename
23:18 Limbic_Region no, the authentication
23:18 Limbic_Region username and pass
23:18 Limbic_Region I figured it out
23:18 Limbic_Region checkin on its way
23:18 svnbot6 r13515 | Limbic_Region++ | Makefile.PL changed line 468 from print @warn << '.'; to push @warn, << '.';
23:19 TreyHarris Limbic_Region: oh... hm.  I'm going to need to know the same info when my new computer arrives tomorrow ;-)
23:19 Limbic_Region TreyHarris svn help ci
23:19 TreyHarris clue? :-)
23:19 Limbic_Region --username
23:19 Limbic_Region there is also an option for password but it goes interactive if you don't provide one
23:20 TreyHarris ah, and then it remembers both from then on?
23:20 Limbic_Region I think so - if not, there is a way to setup a .svn something or other to remember it
23:20 Limbic_Region I so seldom need to do it - I forget
23:21 TreyHarris i'll figure it out :-)
23:22 Aankhen`` joined perl6
23:23 Limbic_Region fwiw - I am not sure I fixed Makefile.PL correctly
23:33 Qiang_ joined perl6
23:38 TimToady well, left shifting @warn by '.' bits can't be right...
23:38 TimToady all you'd end up with is printing the length of @warn.
23:39 TimToady pushing, rather
23:40 TimToady hmm, I'm surprised it even parsed.
23:40 TimToady oh, it was a print, no wonder I'm confused.
23:40 TimToady nm
23:43 Limbic_Region well I knew print was wrong but I wasn't positive the intention was to push it unconditionally as there was no conditional
23:43 Limbic_Region that's the part I am still unsure of
23:44 TimToady it's inside an "if ($whichparrot)" conditional
23:45 TimToady or rather:
23:45 TimToady    if ($ENV{PUGS_EMBED} and $ENV{PUGS_EMBED} =~ /\bparrot\b/i) {
23:45 Limbic_Region the if ($whichparrot) was further down
23:45 Limbic_Region this particular one may have already been in a conditional - as you pasted
23:46 Limbic_Region but it wasn't on my screen so it was action at a distance AFAIWC
23:46 Limbic_Region or influence at a distance rather
23:46 Limbic_Region *shrug* I think it is right
23:46 Limbic_Region audrey will change it if it isn't
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23:53 Qiang joined perl6

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