Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2006-11-04

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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Time Nick Message
00:19 svnbot6 r14612 | Darren_Duncan++ | removed my in-progress docs/talks/rdbms_tutorial_draft.txt ... something analagous may or may not be added later
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01:07 digitalice joined perl6
01:07 digitalice hey
01:07 digitalice !listo
01:07 digitalice > cos 9
01:07 lambdabot -0.9111302618846769
01:07 digitalice :D
01:07 digitalice > www.google.com
01:08 lambdabot Not in scope: `com'
01:08 digitalice > @google www.google.com
01:08 lambdabot Parse error
01:08 digitalice > @google
01:08 lambdabot Parse error
01:08 digitalice @google
01:08 lambdabot Empty search.
01:08 digitalice @google mvd shuffle
01:08 lambdabot http://www.mvdshuffle.com/
01:08 lambdabot Title: Cargando...
01:08 digitalice @google foro mvd shuffle
01:08 lambdabot http://www.mvdshuffle.com/
01:08 lambdabot Title: Cargando...
01:08 digitalice @google foro.mvd shuffle
01:08 lambdabot http://dodeca.org.uy/foro/viewtopic.php?pid=1580
01:08 lambdabot Title: Dodecá // Foro / MVD Shuffle!
01:08 digitalice @google foro.mvdshuffle.com
01:09 lambdabot http://www.teatromagico.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=8102
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01:47 lichtkind when filling an capture it is possible to do my |car_cap = \("Model T", doors => 2);
01:49 audreyt there's no | sigil anymore
01:49 audreyt it existed for exactly one day and one revision
01:49 Limbic_Region for some definitions of "day"
01:50 TreyHarris urgh.... i'm so confused when i try to do Perl 5 now.... sometimes I confuse it with Perl 6, sometimes I confuse Perl 6 with Perl 5, and sometimes I just go off in some wild direction that is neither...
01:50 TreyHarris in Perl 5, should "if (my $value = bar() and $value ne 'bad thing') { ... }" do what I expect?  i.e., go into the block iff both: a) bar() returned something true, and b) that same call to bar() did not return 'bad thing'?
01:51 lichtkind audreyt but i read it still in http://svn.openfoundry.org/pugs/docs/Perl6/FAQ/Capture.pod
01:51 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/y5x48u
01:52 lichtkind so now captures are just skalars?
01:52 audreyt hm?
01:52 audreyt the Capture.pod has no car_cap
01:52 audreyt no |car_cap that is
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01:53 audreyt  my $car_cap = \("Model T", doors => 2);
01:53 audreyt  my $car = make_car(|$car_cap);
01:53 lichtkind yes
01:53 audreyt you can also say
01:53 audreyt my $cap_cap := \(...)
01:53 lichtkind and thatswhy it seemed to me that $car_cap is reference to capture
01:54 audreyt but yeah, there's no special sigil anymore
01:54 audreyt well, it's a Scalar containing a Capture object
01:54 audreyt if you say
01:54 audreyt my $c_c = \(...)
01:54 audreyt hm, c_c is a cute face
01:54 TimToady Trey_Harris: yes, it should do what you expect.
01:54 audreyt to interpolate the capture into the arguments
01:55 audreyt you need to |$c_c
01:55 audreyt because otherwise it's passing in the Capture itself
01:55 audreyt not interpolating its contents
01:55 TreyHarris TimToady: thanks for the sanity check :)
01:55 TimToady er, wait, no.
01:55 TimToady P5 doesn't introduce the new variable that soon.
01:55 lichtkind thanks audreyt makes sense so is this only meaning of | ?
01:55 TimToady now you're confusing me...
01:55 * TreyHarris snaps his fingers
01:55 TreyHarris *that's* what I thought
01:55 TreyHarris :)
01:56 TreyHarris you see?
01:56 audreyt with MP6 emitter looking good, tomorrow will be PCR-port-to-MiniPerl6, which will finish MP6 bootstrap
01:56 audreyt and then if we have a emitter to js, then you can eval"" MP6 in your browser
01:56 TimToady been in P6-land too long, and not long enough...
01:56 audreyt if we have an emitter to C, then we have libp6re
01:56 audreyt and so on and so forth.
01:57 audreyt but p5 and hs will still be the first two emitters we'll work on.
01:57 audreyt lichtkind: correct
01:57 lichtkind audreyt thanks your very kind
01:57 TimToady only meaning of unary | anyway
01:58 TimToady infix | is of course junctional OR
01:58 audreyt unless it's in type option, where it denotes a type union
01:58 audreyt s/option/position/
01:58 TimToady It's a junctional OR that gets coerced to a set.  :)
01:59 audreyt well, it's really a different syntax there, much like its use in grammars
01:59 audreyt to denote a choice
01:59 TimToady yah
02:01 TimToady so what's the js emitter gonna do with 'use v5'  :)
02:01 audreyt we take out "use v5" already :)
02:01 audreyt in the MP6 boot chain
02:01 TreyHarris so it just gets run optimistically as if it were Perl 6 code? :)
02:02 audreyt or maybe it assumes it's running inside Inline::SpiderMonkey...
02:02 audreyt er JavaScript::SpiderMonkey
02:02 audreyt rgs: how far away (by plane or car) is your currennt meatspace position from Nice, France?
02:03 audreyt POPL'07 people (the SIGPLAN conference for lambdafolk language designers) just agreed to fly me there for opening keynote.
02:03 audreyt January 2007
02:04 audreyt rgs: so I wonder if we can have a couple days of minihackathon on unified perl runtime
02:04 lichtkind audreyt and due the module of Perl6::Doc ....im now member of perldoc2.0 project, its all starting just and we sorting ideas and aim no will smash out a prototype app but i gladly will help adopt this system for perl6 if it will become standart
02:04 audreyt "aim no will smash out"?
02:05 lichtkind im mean now smash out hm a german term  im mean throw together
02:05 audreyt but cool, we need a perl6doc viewer very much
02:05 audreyt cool!
02:05 lichtkind but hold on its more complicated :)
02:06 lichtkind im about to write article for perl.com and the example code of this lession will be the building of a multi tab pod viewer
02:07 lichtkind that can easily be extended for perl6 needs i think
02:07 audreyt nice
02:07 * audreyt nods happily
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02:07 lichtkind the app for the perldoc2 project is more a tool for translators because perldoc2 is about to have centralized translated perldocs
02:09 * audreyt ponders the curoius fact that there's both marsneedswomen.pm.org and women.pm
02:09 lichtkind audreyt so throw me just some lines with what you think you need for features  to [email@hidden.address] or right here in channel so that i can copy the text in my dev dir as todo list
02:11 audreyt sure. I'd like to have "perldoc -f keyword Some::Module"
02:11 audreyt where keyword searches into sections and indices
02:12 lichtkind yeah but would be command line tool better that gui app?
02:12 audreyt I think it can invoke a gui app...
02:13 audreyt I like gui apps that can be invoked by smart commandline options
02:14 lichtkind yes but i think many like vi because they can work with it text based
02:14 audreyt I have to admit my preferred gui interface is html
02:14 audreyt but I'm biased :)
02:14 loumz hello, small question about filetest operators... if I have sub w {} and I write - w("some-arg") with a space between "-" and "w" then it still executes the -w filetest
02:14 loumz is this behavior correct?
02:15 audreyt no that's utterly wrong. please write a test
02:15 TimToady no
02:15 audreyt in filetest.t or other places
02:15 audreyt do you have a commit bit?
02:15 audreyt if not, what's your email address? :)
02:15 loumz no, I don't
02:15 loumz william99 at myrealbox.com
02:16 * eviltwin_b prefers command line for stuff like this:  a properly written command line app can be guified easily enough, plus I can run it in emacs  :)
02:16 lichtkind so we make first command line version
02:16 pasteling "loumz" at 125.164.185.231 pasted "filetest operators question" (17 lines, 476B) at http://sial.org/pbot/20869
02:17 loumz there's some code that demonstrates it
02:17 audreyt loumz: welcome aboard, please add yourself to AUTHORS :)
02:17 loumz audreyt: thanks
02:17 lichtkind audreyt what you mean with "perldoc -f keyword Some::Module" are there current modules in perl6?
02:17 audreyt t/operators/filetest.t is a fine place for it, as is making a new file under t/syntax/parsing/
02:18 audreyt lichtkind: sure, there's plenty of modules under ext/
02:18 audreyt but I mean the -f keyword would be nice to work with modules not only perlfunc
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02:18 lichtkind ok but i thougt that module ist firstly for the synopses
02:18 audreyt synopses are modules too
02:19 lichtkind ah :)
02:19 audreyt Perl6::Spec::Operator
02:20 TreyHarris i'm a module, you're a module, wouldn't you like to be a module too?
02:21 lichtkind no
02:21 eviltwin_b he's a module...
02:21 lichtkind im special :)
02:21 eviltwin_b so you're a pragma?
02:22 lichtkind hihi no even stranger, stranger than fiction
02:22 lichtkind ok just wanted show my goodwill need some sleep before down, keep up the good work @ all here
02:23 audreyt goodwill is appreciated :)
02:23 audreyt have fun hunting
02:23 audreyt I mean sleeping
02:24 [particle] audreyt: see parrot's shiny new src/pmc/capture.pmc
02:24 [particle] (it's missing an invocant slot, but not for long)
02:24 audreyt cool!
02:25 [particle] soon we'll have subclasses for match, past, and maybe signature
02:26 lichtkind gnight
02:26 audreyt sure, that's how it's supposed to be used. nice!
02:26 [particle] yes, indeed. this should speed up pge a bit, too :)
02:27 audreyt will be nice to benchmark the capture-enabled pge with the native-code p6re thing fglock++ and I am working on :)
02:27 [particle] then we need to convert the emitter from pir to c... that'll make it really fast
02:28 [particle] yes, it will. hopefully soon i'll be implementing your miniperl6 grammar in pir
02:28 audreyt implement in pir?
02:28 audreyt I thought PGE already handles it?
02:29 [particle] it doesn't handle everything there 'does', 'of'
02:29 audreyt I mean, if you ignore the first paragraph
02:29 [particle] 'where'
02:29 audreyt http://svn.openfoundry.org/pugs/v6/v6-MiniPerl6/lib/MiniPerl6/Grammar.pm
02:29 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/y6j9yc
02:29 audreyt should be totally PGE friendly
02:29 audreyt so all you need is to write a MP6->PIR emitter
02:29 audreyt and then you have MP6 working inside PGE as transformation language
02:29 audreyt all bootstrapped for free.
02:30 audreyt i.e. change the perl5 bits in  http://svn.openfoundry.org/pugs/v6/v6-MiniPerl6/lib/MiniPerl6/Emitter.pm to pir bits.
02:30 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/wrq2p
02:30 [particle] hrmm
02:31 audreyt the idea is the emitter is first run with pugs
02:31 audreyt then you have entire MP6 chain emitted to PIR
02:31 audreyt afterwards you save those .pir inside parrot treee
02:31 audreyt and then you don't need pugs anymore, since you effectively have a MP6 language in native PIR
02:32 [particle] right, but we can't bootstrap ourselves
02:32 audreyt hm?
02:32 audreyt you can
02:32 audreyt after that you just use the MP6-in-PIR to run modified perl6 code
02:32 audreyt it's not handwritte PIR
02:32 [particle] ah, ok
02:32 audreyt but why should you care? the master source is in perl6.
02:32 [particle] so we use pugs once-and-once-only
02:32 audreyt which I hope is still the goal for PGE :)
02:32 audreyt yes.
02:32 [particle] yes, it is the goal
02:33 [particle] then we get shared spec, shared tests, and (mostly) shared implementation :)
02:33 [particle] whee!
02:33 audreyt the only bit not shared is the emitter
02:33 audreyt but that's as it should be
02:33 [particle] right, totally appropriate
02:34 [particle] however, we may have an ast transformation before emitting
02:34 audreyt if you look in Grammar.pm
02:34 audreyt there's AST transformation right there
02:34 audreyt written in MP6 :)
02:34 audreyt which is a tree transformation language.
02:34 [particle] right. we'll likely have to write one for perl6 ast to parrot ast
02:34 audreyt that again is just the emitter.
02:35 audreyt instead of emitting pir you emit past calls
02:35 [particle] this is true.
02:35 audreyt hopefully this can let us conveniently obsolete PGE, Parsec and PCR.
02:35 audreyt which is #1 diverging part so far.
02:36 audreyt the idea is the new p6re is written in MP6
02:36 audreyt compiles rules to MP6
02:37 audreyt which is emitted via whatever emitter to efficient native code that matches stuff.
02:37 audreyt it's currently living in http://svn.openfoundry.org/pugs/perl5/Pugs-Compiler-Rule/lib/Pugs/Emitter/Rule/Perl6/Ratchet.pm
02:37 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/ydzvqn
02:37 audreyt will be updated to MP6 and moved to v6/ space tomorrow.
02:38 [particle] great, i look forward to it
02:39 audreyt :)
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02:59 pasteling "loumz" at 125.164.185.231 pasted "proposed t/syntax/parsing/filetest.t, does this look right?" (19 lines, 361B) at http://sial.org/pbot/20870
03:01 TimToady looks pretty good to me.
03:02 TimToady go ahead and check it in.  we operator on the forgiveness-rather-than-permission principle around here.
03:02 loumz TimToady: thanks for the review
03:03 TimToady *operate
03:03 eviltwin_b operator:<forgiveness> > operator:<permission>
03:04 loumz all I have to do for the test to work in "make test" is create a new .t file right?
03:05 TimToady I believe so
03:05 TimToady might run util/add-svn-props.sh on it too
03:08 loumz TimToady: OK, I guess I should read the Pugs/Doc/Hack.pod first
03:09 TimToady that would probably be more than most of us have done. :)
03:10 TimToady we just don't use the word "should" around here terribly often...
03:14 svnbot6 r14613 | loumz++ | Add my name to the AUTHORS file.
03:14 svnbot6 r14613 | loumz++ | Add filetest parsing tests for "- f(...)".
03:15 loumz hopefully that will work :)
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03:51 audreyt didn't quite finish the MP6-bootstrap-katamari journal, so I posted something from earlier draft instead
03:51 audreyt commitbit ACL transition is done, so we jut need a flag day or something. sleep, see you tomorrow :)
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03:54 audreyt s/or something/to relocate master repo to svn.pugscode.org on feather/
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04:53 gnuvince Good morning, afternoon and evening depending on your timezone
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06:20 wolverian whoa - nice news about popl07. congratulations, audreyt :)
06:34 clkao ,
06:34 clkao
06:43 nothingmuch hola homies
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06:59 seano um... word, g.
07:00 nothingmuch you know what i'm sayin
07:00 seano true dat.
07:00 seano I mean, fo sheezy.
07:00 nothingmuch maybe you'd like to participate
07:00 nothingmuch http://avva.livejournal.com/1673636.html
07:00 lambdabot Title: avva: geek rap contest (англ.)
07:02 seano verily, ma neezy
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08:04 rgs audreyt: Paris <-> Nice is 6 or 7 h by train, 1 h by plane, lots by car.
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13:49 fglock audreyt: PCR-in-Mp6 is under way - now writing a few tests
13:50 audreyt fglock: where are you? and when is lightning talks
13:54 fglock I'm at the Perl booth - don't know about the l-t yet
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14:29 audreyt fglock: coming to Perl booth in 15mins
14:30 clkao zz
14:31 audreyt greetings clkao. is there a way to make hiveminder and comitbit share auth?
14:31 audreyt or do you think separate auth makes more sense?
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14:32 integral a bitcard Jifty plugin would be handy...
14:32 fglock audreyt: ok
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14:45 fglock ruoso: hi
14:45 ruoso hi fglock
14:45 * ruoso just sad for not being in CONISLI
14:46 fglock CONISLI++
14:46 ruoso how is it going?
14:47 fglock the main talks are going pretty well, and we have a nice booth thanks to Segula :)
14:47 ruoso :)
14:49 ruoso are there video/audio streamings?
14:51 the_dormant Hi, is there any tutorial to Perl6 rules ?
14:53 fglock ruoso: no, but the video will be available later
14:54 ruoso fglock, at least :)
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16:52 audreyt visiolization: http://pugs.blogs.com/photos/visiolization/mp6bootstrap.png
16:52 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/yzjxzo
16:53 audreyt bold-black-lined boxes are the components written in mp6 that we produce in this hackathon
16:54 [particle] you produced the regex source too, no?
16:54 audreyt hm?
16:54 audreyt it goes like this
16:55 audreyt MP6 source containing both sub{...} and token{...} gets parsed
16:55 audreyt for the token{...} part the content goes into a subcompilation cycle
16:55 audreyt and then spliced back so it becomes just another sub{...}
16:55 audreyt so one MP6 source produces one MP6 AST
16:55 TimToady I think the regex part was mostly already there due to :ratchet emitter
16:55 audreyt which is then emitted
16:56 audreyt actually the only vapourware part now is emitter
16:56 audreyt and emitter-specific prelude
16:56 audreyt which we're working on now :)
16:56 audreyt note the vapour cloud around "backends"
16:56 TimToady I was wondering last night whether we need to partition out t/ into MP6 and non-MP6
16:56 audreyt otoh MP6 uses no assignment
16:57 audreyt so it warrants its own t/03- or something
16:57 * audreyt is also working on a formal operational semantics for MP6
16:57 [particle] is Test.pm valid MP6?
16:57 audreyt not at all
16:57 audreyt not by far!
16:58 TimToady not without running it through the P6-to-MP6 translator.  :)
16:58 audreyt but that is like, slow :)
16:59 audreyt emulating P6 on MP6 is prolly not wise
16:59 audreyt the plan is to make MP6 AST a proper subset of P6 AST
16:59 audreyt not only the surface syntax
16:59 audreyt once the MP6 boot completes
16:59 audreyt and so we can reuse the emitters
16:59 audreyt and gradually add P6 nodes to it
16:59 audreyt I think that's the plan, anyway. still sketching madly with fglock
16:59 audreyt ENOPAPER at the moment, so going to hunt for some
16:59 audreyt bbiab
17:01 [particle] i didn't realize mp6 ast wasn't a subset of p6 ast
17:01 TimToady more like p6 ast isn't yet a proper superset of mp6 ast.  :)
17:05 TimToady I predict someone will eventually write P6-to-MP6 just so that they can run P6 on their nanobots.  Who cares if it's "slow" if there's quadrillions of 'em running at molecular speeds....
17:05 TimToady It's possible the gray goo catastrophe will be programmed in Perl...
17:06 TimToady talk about disruptive technologies...
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17:07 audreyt fglock: should we perhaps go back checking for lightning talk schedule first so we don't miss it?
17:08 fglock audreyt: sure
17:09 Limbic_Region pugs is like a box of chocolates - you never know what you're gonna get
17:09 audreyt fglock: also do you know if there's a better place to get your new laptop other than shopping centre norde?
17:10 Limbic_Region I thought we were going to get 6.28 (objects) but instead we look like we are gonna be getting bootstrapping
17:10 Limbic_Region woot
17:10 fglock audreyt: I'll ask
17:10 anatolyv S02:2327 says, "in case of a "tie"  the grammatical category that is notionally "first" in the grammar wins." But is the ordering of the categoris specified? (in the list that follows, statement_control comes *after* prefix, so it doesn't seem to be it).
17:10 audreyt Limbic_Region: we're getting 6.28. from the Haskell side this means we're getting a Rules engine _without_ requiring embed perl5
17:10 audreyt and that runs on native haskell speed
17:10 audreyt which will be like much faster.
17:10 anatolyv unless the list in S02 is meant to specify categories from "last" to "first".
17:10 fglock Limbic_Region: 6.28 might happen at both Haskell and Perl, who knows :)
17:11 fglock Perl5, that is
17:11 audreyt that requires another visiolization picture
17:11 audreyt to include MO and fullperl6 AST's places
17:13 TimToady anatolyv: the ordering in question is supposed to be how the magical hashes are ordered within the <%foo|%bar|%baz> construct
17:14 Limbic_Region audreyt - neato
17:14 TimToady S02 is obviously not terribly clear on that point.
17:14 Limbic_Region fglock - super neato
17:15 anatolyv TimToady: oh, I see.
17:15 fglock Limbic_Region: we are accelerating so time slows down - audreyt++ only has a few days left here
17:16 anatolyv TimToady: is the way they're ordered going to be constant - that is, category X will always come before category Y, no matter which context they both appear inside the category list for the lexer - or are there cases when one category is more important than the other in one context and vice versa in another context?
17:16 Limbic_Region fglock - but the distortion in the space-time continuum is localized.  The few of us in IRC land are witnessing what is supposed to be impossible
17:17 audreyt we need a singularity emitter
17:17 * Limbic_Region just watched a StarGate SG1 episode in which the gate was connected to a world being sucked into a black hole and this very same phenomina was being experienced
17:18 fglock Limbic_Region: we are avoiding to observe it so that it doesn't collapse
17:18 * Limbic_Region wanders off to go grocery shopping
17:18 fglock the vapourware seems to be densifying however
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17:20 fglock audreyt: are you getting to the lobby?
17:21 audreyt yes, give me another 5min or so
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17:24 svnbot6 r14614 | fglock++ | MiniPerl6 - added initial Regex->MP6AST parser, Token->MP6 emitter
17:28 TimToady anatolyv: that will be up to whoever writes the grammar.  the specified mechanism is local, so global ordering would be by policy, not by technological requirement.
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17:39 audreyt back with more paper and design
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18:09 audreyt full-p6 boot plan sketched
18:09 audreyt with run- and compile-time MO protocols
18:09 audreyt more details later
18:09 audreyt but we'll go laptop shopping now :) bbl
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18:57 eggzeck Limbic_Region: Audrey just spoke in #perl6, heehee
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19:16 cmarcelo @tell audreyt audrey and flavio: will you be at the lobby around 18h? im watching mongers talks. the lightinings are scheduled for tomorrow.
19:16 lambdabot Consider it noted.
19:17 cmarcelo lambdabot: tks
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20:23 xinming audreyt: where to see the full plan of bootstraping perl 6 please? :-)
20:28 Limbic_Region xinming - in her head
20:29 wolverian audreyt, yay!
20:38 audreyt @tell cmarcelo we are in the lobby and I'm rsync'ing my entire /Applications/ to fglock. come join us!
20:38 lambdabot Consider it noted.
20:40 gnuvince audreyt: have you had hardware problems with your MacBook?
20:41 audreyt no...
20:41 lambdabot audreyt: You have 8 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them.
20:42 wolverian heh
20:42 wolverian someone should fix that bug
20:42 wolverian where lambdabot doesn't realise @tell means the person is present
20:42 gnuvince audreyt: my iBook died, I want to buy a MacBook, but I keep hearing horror stories
20:43 audreyt it all works for me
20:43 gnuvince Great
20:43 gnuvince Thanks for the info
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21:15 audreyt fglock: hi :)
21:15 fglock hey
21:16 audreyt fglock: "svk pull" instead of "svn up"
21:16 audreyt otherwise all commands are same
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21:20 clkao audreyt: so commitbit-p?
21:23 audreyt clkao: a sec. setting up things for fglock's all new macbook
21:23 audreyt you'll find him running tests before commit now :)
21:23 clkao yay
21:23 audreyt and also svk won't take 1min to just startup
21:24 fglock :)
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21:44 svnbot6 r14615 | fglock++ | MP6 - added a Regex parser test
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22:21 clkao is this comit from new laptop? :)
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22:32 audreyt yes :)
22:32 audreyt trying to find him an editor
22:32 audreyt surprisingly hard to find one for ultraedit addict
22:32 audreyt (you remember how you took two weeks to brainwash me into vim?)
22:32 audreyt so TextMate for now
22:33 Limbic_Region TextPad perhaps
22:33 audreyt textpad is for mac?
22:33 Limbic_Region oh
22:33 audreyt (context: I just helped fglock buying a new macbook)
22:33 Limbic_Region forgot that part
22:33 audreyt well there is CrossOver
22:34 obra TextMate is likely the most right thing
22:34 audreyt worst case I can get fglock working with UltraEdit on Wine
22:34 audreyt but that's like insane
22:34 audreyt yeah. it even has svk support
22:34 wolverian does textmate have vim keybindings?
22:34 wolverian (or even vi)
22:34 obra possibly jedit
22:36 * obra has been finally getting around to actually configuring vim himself
22:38 clkao audrey-vim is insanely slow
22:39 audreyt doesn't feel slow in my macbook here...
22:39 wolverian what's audrey-vim? :)
22:40 eviltwin_b remember that brainwashing she mentioned? :)
22:40 obra audreyt: it does on my mbookpro. I think it had to do with the buffer-scanning code
22:41 jrockway doesn't emacs have the best haskell and perl6 modes ATM? that sounds like the right editor choice :)
22:41 audreyt obra: aw. disable them then...
22:41 gnuvince hmmm...
22:41 wolverian hm, what buffer-scanning code? now I'm intrigued
22:42 gnuvince ?eval 1538 / 60
22:42 evalbot_r14615 769/30
22:42 gnuvince ?eval (1538 / 60).fmt("%f")
22:42 evalbot_r14615 \"25.633333333333333"
22:42 obra audreyt: I have. it's behaving better.
22:43 obra I'm starting to play with minibufexplorer and taglist
22:43 gnuvince fib(28) (recursive) on my PC with Pugs took 25 minutes :-)
22:43 * gnuvince considers using a loop
22:44 wolverian ghc is a bit faster there...
22:45 obra but now -> hackerkitchen
22:45 Limbic_Region gnuvince - with or without memoization?
22:49 wolverian the lazy list method doesn't work yet :/ (flattening is eager)
22:50 svnbot6 r14616 | audreyt++ | * MP6::Grammar - Parse for escaped chars inside quoted strings.
22:53 svnbot6 r14617 | fglock++ | MP6 - Grammar::Regex compiles
23:00 Limbic_Region gnuvince - first perl 6 I have written in months
23:00 Limbic_Region recursive but with memoization
23:00 svnbot6 r14618 | audreyt++ | * v6.pm - change env knob V6NOTIDY to V6TIDY -- that is to say we
23:00 svnbot6 r14618 | audreyt++ |   don't run tidy by default. it slows down compilation 4x.
23:00 Limbic_Region good stuff
23:00 Limbic_Region perlbot nopaste
23:00 perlbot Paste your code at http://sial.org/pbot/perl and #perl will be able to view it
23:00 lambdabot Title: sial.org Pastebot - pasteling
23:00 pasteling "Limbic_Region" at 24.35.57.240 pasted "recursive fibonacci with memoization via state variables" (25 lines, 444B) at http://sial.org/pbot/20890
23:01 Limbic_Region fib(28) is pretty much instantaneous (minus pugs overhead)
23:02 Limbic_Region (state variables)++
23:05 pasteling "Limbic_Region" at 24.35.57.240 pasted "recursive fibonacci with memoization version 2 (more succinct)" (15 lines, 281B) at http://sial.org/pbot/20891
23:06 audreyt Limbic_Region: examples/algorithms please :)
23:07 audreyt I mean, add to
23:08 pasteling "Limbic_Region" at 24.35.57.240 pasted "recursive fibonacci with memoization (even more succinct but still too perl 5ish)" (10 lines, 187B) at http://sial.org/pbot/20892
23:08 Limbic_Region audreyt - will do
23:08 Limbic_Region would you mind suggesting how to make it more Perl 6ish?
23:09 audreyt Int $n
23:09 audreyt not Integer
23:09 audreyt don't need $fib1 $fib2
23:09 Limbic_Region yeah
23:09 audreyt %seen{$n - $_} //=
23:09 Limbic_Region look at 20892
23:10 * gnuvince is back from food
23:10 audreyt that's it
23:10 Limbic_Region ok
23:10 gnuvince Limbic_Region: and no memoization; I took the Perl 5 code from shootout.alioth.debian.org and I am converting some of those programs to Perl 6, and the recursive fibonacci took a long, long, long time
23:12 audreyt yes, becasue subroutine call is extremely expensive in our evaluator.
23:12 gnuvince audreyt: gotcha
23:13 gnuvince If I get enough examples ported, I might commit them in examples/
23:15 Limbic_Region gnuvince - the memoization returns fib(42) almost instantaneously as well
23:15 Limbic_Region ;-)
23:15 Limbic_Region waiting for the commit to show up now
23:16 Limbic_Region felt good to write some Perl 6 again but can't get sucked in
23:16 gnuvince Limbic_Region: I'm sure it does, however the "rules" of the alioth shootout is that all examples must be implemented the same way
23:16 svnbot6 r14619 | Limbic_Region++ | Recursive implementation of fibonacci using state %seen for memoization.  Inspired by gnuvince++
23:17 Limbic_Region gnuvince - sure
23:18 Limbic_Region gnuvince - as long as a shootout has a comprehensive set of benchmarks to fully test the strengths and weaknesses of the language it is fine
23:18 Limbic_Region the trouble begins when all the examples favor the strengths of 1 language and everyone else has to follow suit
23:19 gnuvince Limbic_Region: the shootout has about 15 "problems" to solve
23:28 svnbot6 r14620 | audreyt++ | * MiniPerl6::Emitter::Token - Change __END__ to =begin END.
23:28 svnbot6 r14620 | audreyt++ | * MiniPerl6::Grammar::Regex - Change assignment (=) to binding (:=).
23:36 pasteling "anatolyv" at 89.0.235.26 pasted "even more succint and less perl5-ish" (9 lines, 145B) at http://sial.org/pbot/20894
23:36 anatolyv Limbic_Region: see paste
23:36 anatolyv anatolyv: not sure it's clearer though!
23:42 Limbic_Region yeah, I am looking now
23:44 Limbic_Region anatolyv - feel free to update the example in examples but I find my version easier to understand
23:44 anatolyv Limbic_Region: it probably is.
23:45 Limbic_Region it is odd watching what happens when you type fib(1000) since ghc offers arbitrary precision
23:47 anatolyv it's nice, indeed.
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