Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2007-05-01

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:02 metaperl joined #perl6
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00:22 mugwump darcs has revisions, there is the currently checked out revision, plus "tags"
00:26 etaylor joined #perl6
00:26 cmarcelo mugwump: sorry,probably I made a mistake. by revision I meant a (short) way to point to a specific situation|moment of the repository. SVN has rNNN numbers, Monotone has SHA-1 of the revision. How do you point to a specific "situation" in a darcs repo?
00:27 metaperl cmarcelo: maybe ask on #darcs
00:27 metaperl left #perl6
00:27 cmarcelo metaperl: ok
00:35 mdiep joined #perl6
00:46 nipotan changed the nick to nipotaway
01:01 Khisanth joined #perl6
01:09 mugwump cmarcelo: with a tag
01:12 SubStack joined #perl6
01:13 cmarcelo mugwump: (I've just find that in darcs manual, tks)
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02:18 Salzh joined #perl6
02:24 Salzh what does the word "Apocalyse" mean in the following sentence:
02:24 Salzh People get scared when they hear the word Apocalypse, but here I mean it in the good sense: a Revealing.
02:25 allbery_b an apocalypse is a revelation.
02:25 allbery_b the "usual" meaning is tied to Christian notions of the Second Coming, hence lovely things like a world-shattering war
02:26 Salzh why people will scared to hear the word
02:26 allbery_b right
02:26 avar they better, jesus is back and he's *pissed*!
03:03 elmex_ joined #perl6
03:07 spinclad look busy
03:07 offby1 spinclad: that's my favorite one but I was too timid to mention it here
03:09 spinclad why cater to outside apocalypticists?  we've got our own, and they're much better!
03:10 spinclad the Apocalypses of Larry
03:15 coke joined #perl6
03:15 coke Oooh, I found a bug in S03.
03:16 Coke changed the nick to coke
03:16 Coke seen TimToady ?
03:16 Coke gah. different bot semantics!
03:16 allbery_b @seen TimToady
03:16 lambdabot TimToady is in #perl6. I last heard TimToady speak 3h 57m 24s ago.
03:17 Coke ... and as I type out the bug to @tell him, I see it's not a bug at all! curses.
03:18 justatheory joined #perl6
03:20 allbery_b heh
03:23 offby1 shucks, I hate it when there is no bug.
03:46 Coke 'twas merely the ^ syntax, which I hadn't taken into account when converting the tests to a more parrot-like form.
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04:56 fglock my local v6.pm now parses 1/3 of Perl-6.0.0-STD-cheat
04:56 offby1 hmm
04:57 TimToady fglock++
04:57 fglock it is doing just 4 lines/second
04:58 fglock probably backtracking a lot
05:00 TimToady well, hey, that's only about 15 minutes
05:01 Salzh joined #perl6
05:07 fglock the parser may get finished before the end of the week
05:07 fglock the only usable backend is perl5, currently - it may take some weeks to get it debugged
05:09 fglock later &
05:09 TimToady night
05:09 fglock TimToady: good night
05:10 fglock left #perl6
05:11 geoffb Wow, fglock is just rocking.
05:11 offby1 I think it's all the beer
05:12 geoffb Does he have a $day_job?
05:12 avar $day_job--
05:12 iblechbot joined #perl6
05:13 offby1 just in case it's not been pointed out many times before -- $day_job-- is pronounced "day job double-plus ungood"
05:14 geoffb $day_job++ # Feeding and housing family
05:14 geoffb $day_job-- # Limiting hacking
05:15 avar $day_job-- # part of the capitalist conspiracy
05:16 geoffb If I got uber-rich from something like a mega-lottery or such, I'd probably start a business and hire a bunch of the Perl 6 people, so we'd all have cool @day_jobs
05:17 geoffb Sadly, I have not won a lottery yet.  Somebody get working on that.  ;-)
05:17 avar @lottery_numbers.pick(8)
05:17 lambdabot Unknown command, try @list
05:22 avar left #perl6
05:23 avar joined #perl6
05:23 avar argh
05:29 devogon joined #perl6
05:33 dduncan ?eval @lottery_numbers.pick(8)
05:34 evalbot_r16148 ()
05:34 dduncan I seem to recall that used to complain about @lottery_numbers not being defined ... or maybe its following one-liner (strict off) rules?
05:35 avar probably the latter
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07:20 topic for #perl6 is:
07:21 agentzh moose
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07:24 svnbot6 r16150 | agentz++ | util/testgraph.pl - worked around the number interpretation problem on the smoke server
07:25 agentzh A   v6/v6-MiniPerl6/lib/MiniPerl6/Python/Runtime.pm
07:25 agentzh svk is still problematic...
07:25 agentzh r16149 maybe a bogus commit.
07:29 agentzh MiniPerl6/Python/Runtime.pm has actually been removed by karhu in  r16126
07:29 agentzh sigh. my svk automatically readded that back.
07:30 VanilleBer1 joined #perl6
07:30 agentzh i think i should not use svk with pugs repos at least :(
07:31 BooK_ joined #perl6
07:33 svnbot6 r16151 | agentz++ | reverted back the bogus commint (r16149). my svk was misbehaving. :(
07:35 * agentzh reconstructs a pugs tree using svn.
07:36 miyagawa joined #perl6
07:36 topic for #perl6 is:
07:44 agentzh ?eval 1+2
07:44 evalbot_r16148 3
07:44 agentzh everything is working now, cool.
07:47 Salzh joined #perl6
07:47 agentzh Salzh: hi
07:47 agentzh Salzh == Sal Zhong ?
07:51 Alias_ Is YAML::Tiny good enough to handle the smoking data?
07:51 Alias_ :)
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07:53 agentzh Alias_: YAML:Tiny is more light-weight than syck?
07:55 Alias_ Depends on what light-weightness you need
07:55 Alias_ It's about the same size in memory
07:55 agentzh and the speed?
07:55 Alias_ It's a little slower, and can't support streams or braced mode structures and circular deps
07:55 Alias_ But it doesn't need a compiler
07:55 agentzh k
07:55 Alias_ And it's easily embeddable
07:55 Alias_ TAP::Parser has it embedded already
07:56 Alias_ And of course, pure perl
07:56 agentzh fair enough :)
07:56 Alias_ Of course, if you use streams or complex stuff (tags, directives, circulars) it's of no real use
07:56 Alias_ Basically, it's ideal for things like META.yaml
07:56 mtve joined #perl6
07:56 Alias_ And other light-weight uses
07:57 agentzh i'll try YAML::Tiny to parse my smoke.yml produced by pugs.
07:57 Alias_ In fact, not having to have CPAN depend on Syck or YAML.pm was my main driver
07:57 Alias_ If you have samples of smoke.yml I can include on in the YAML::Tiny test suite
07:57 agentzh really?
07:57 Alias_ The tests ONLY consist of parsing of sample YAML fragments and comparing the results (optionally) with YAML.pm and YAML::Syck
07:57 agentzh it's already an auto-updated one on the web.
07:57 Alias_ It does very little actual struct vs content tests
07:58 agentzh Alias_: http://perlcabal.org/smoke.yml
07:58 agentzh Alias_: it's produced by the feather daily auto-smoke using YAML::Syck
07:58 Alias_ ok
07:58 * agentzh believes TINY is a good thing.
07:59 Alias_ hmm
07:59 Alias_ nope, not gunna work
07:59 agentzh why?
07:59 Alias_ exclude_re: !!perl/scalar:Regexp ~
07:59 Alias_ Directives aren't supported
07:59 Alias_ And things like object embedding
07:59 agentzh oh
08:00 Alias_ objects aren't supported either
08:00 agentzh what do you mean by "directives" please?
08:00 Alias_ The !! stuff
08:00 Alias_ Maybe I'm using the wrong term there
08:00 agentzh k
08:00 Alias_ Basically, it supports what you might call the "JSON" subset of structs
08:00 Alias_ comments, scalar, array, hash
08:01 agentzh no circular data structures and no objects
08:01 Alias_ yup
08:01 agentzh fair enough
08:02 agentzh the pugs smoke mechanism blesses the data tree with appropriate class names.
08:02 Alias_ Other than the objects for the results and the regexp in there, it looks like it should be ok
08:03 Alias_ Large file though
08:03 agentzh *nod*
08:03 Alias_ It's probably somewhat out of the scope of YAML::Tiny :)
08:03 agentzh even syck takes quite a while to handle that on my new machine.
08:03 Alias_ But if you wanted to make the serialize/deserialize flatten those objects/regexp to struct equivalents, and then convert them back on deserialize, it would handle it
08:03 Alias_ I think
08:04 Alias_ I'd want to check those error messages work ok
08:04 agentzh blessing is not that hard to handle, it seems.
08:05 offby1 gesundheit
08:06 avar bless you
08:09 * agentzh is testing the smoke-server
08:13 agentzh cool, the smokeserver no longer reports weird smoke durations like "0.45 min"
08:13 agentzh although such figures may excite some people who are not watching closely.
08:14 * offby1 throws a glass of cold water on himself
08:14 agentzh well, time unit calculation issues.
08:17 agentzh heh, lanny has a very fast machine according to his smoke report for win32.
08:17 avar offby1: weren't you spreading propaganda about porting sbcl to parrot some time ago?
08:18 wilx joined #perl6
08:21 agentzh TimToady++ # submitting regular smoke reports from both linux and win32
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08:52 svnbot6 r16152 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/QDRDBMS/ : added more pod sections to AST.pm and QDRDBMS.pm
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09:49 * Alias_ frets
09:49 Alias_ I really need to get the PITA code integrated :(
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11:34 nipotaway changed the nick to nipotan
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11:37 coke @seen chromatic?
11:37 lambdabot I haven't seen chromatic?.
11:37 coke @seen chromatic
11:37 lambdabot I haven't seen chromatic.
11:38 coke (stupid bot)
11:38 cmarcelo ?seen chromatic
11:38 lambdabot I haven't seen chromatic.
11:38 cmarcelo (I thought another bot would reply for ?seen command)
11:39 agentzh chromatic was last seen on 2006-11-09
11:40 agentzh (saying "You need at least 5.6 if you want the warnings pragma too. ")
11:40 * agentzh is not a bot.
11:41 agentzh oh, that was an unpleasant day.
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11:43 cmarcelo agentzh: but... do you keep logs, right?
11:44 agentzh cmarcelo: log search
11:44 agentzh that's all.
11:46 cmarcelo I mean, old logs from colabti are still up or do you keep your own logging?
11:46 agentzh the former.
11:48 agentzh it's has been down for a while, but still good enough :)
11:48 agentzh (i mean the completeness)
11:52 cmarcelo agentzh: are you hacking something on Perl 6 these days?
11:53 agentzh cmarcelo: nothing much. just setup up the auto-smoke on feather lately :)
11:54 agentzh want to have another look on PCR and rewrite some of my compilers.
11:54 cmarcelo cool. it auto-uploads the smoke to smokeserv too?
11:55 agentzh sure :)
11:55 cmarcelo :)
11:55 agentzh daily smoke :)
11:56 agentzh the auto-smoking results are also used to mark the synopses on feather as well.
11:56 agentzh see http://perlcabal.org/syn/S04 as an example :)
11:56 lambdabot Title: S04
11:58 cmarcelo agentzh++
11:58 agentzh thanks :)
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12:21 * coke finishes most of a Range object in parrot.
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14:39 Zaba joined #perl6
14:39 Zaba moin guys
14:39 Zaba if i install pugs, will it break perl5 which i'd like to use most of time?
14:40 agentzh Zaba: no.
14:40 dmq joined #perl6
14:40 Zaba or does it depend on distro?
14:41 agentzh i think pugs only installs p6 modules to a separate directory
14:41 * dmq pokes avar
14:41 agentzh and some p5 modules to your perl5 installation.
14:41 Zaba hm
14:41 Zaba and about the executable?
14:42 agentzh on Win32, pugs.exe installs into perl\bin
14:42 agentzh on linux, maybe /usr/local/bin
14:42 agentzh or something like that.
14:43 Zaba oh
14:43 Zaba is it pugs not perl6?
14:43 agentzh pugs is a perl6 implementation.
14:43 Zaba and does it affect the /usr/bin/perl symlink?
14:43 Zaba agentzh, i know
14:43 Zaba i thought the executable is perl6 not pugs
14:44 agentzh the executable is pugs.
14:44 Zaba (as perl5 is perl5.8.8 w/ symlink perl
14:44 Zaba and does the symlink exist/being modified?
14:44 agentzh not "perl" or "perl6"
14:44 Zaba ok
14:44 agentzh i don't think so.
14:44 * Zaba installs pugs
14:45 Zaba pugs has native OO support right?
14:45 Zaba oh
14:45 Zaba does it require parrot?
14:45 agentzh afaik, pugs's OO support is incomplete.
14:45 agentzh by default, pugs doesn't depend on parrot.
14:45 Zaba hm
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14:46 Zaba [ebuild  N    ] dev-lang/parrot-0.4.6  USE="gdbm python -gmp -test" 3,368 kB
14:46 Zaba [ebuild  N    ] dev-lang/pugs-6.2.13  6,679 kB
14:46 agentzh if you can enable parrot embedding via an environment specified in the INSTALL file.
14:46 * Zaba dies cause of heat and hot tea
14:47 Zaba hmm
14:47 Zaba i hoped pugswould resolve my problem..
14:47 Zaba I like perl, i dislike python/ruby, but i *need* good complete OO
14:48 agentzh Zaba: maybe you would like to take a look at http://perlcabal.org/syn to check out what works and what does not work in pugs in terms of the specs.
14:48 lambdabot Title: Official Perl 6 Documentation
14:49 agentzh Zaba: we're currently working on it. pugs 6.28 will give you real OO support.
14:49 Zaba oh
14:49 Zaba nice
14:49 agentzh currently a lot of OO features have already been implemented.
14:49 Zaba nice
14:49 agentzh but the MO stuff is not ready at this moment.
14:50 agentzh MO == MetaObject
14:50 Zaba agentzh, when will pugs be released?
14:50 agentzh you mean 6.28?
14:50 Zaba no, the release
14:50 agentzh there are already many Pugs releases on CPAN.
14:50 Zaba maybe .28 too
14:50 Zaba agentzh, but it's alpha isn't it?
14:51 agentzh true
14:51 Zaba well
14:51 agentzh you mean perl 6.0.0?
14:51 Zaba yes
14:51 agentzh by christmas :)
14:51 Zaba hm
14:51 * Zaba looks where christmas is
14:51 Zaba doh.
14:51 Zaba ._.
14:52 Zaba agentzh, too bad.. i hope betas/rcs will be usable too
14:52 agentzh why not contribute to perl 6 and make it happen *sooner*?
14:52 Zaba because i don't know haskell
14:53 agentzh Zaba: you can contribute to pugs by writing Perl 6 and Perl 5 code.
14:53 Zaba orly?
14:53 Zaba how?
14:53 agentzh our test suite is written in pure Perl 6 :)
14:53 Zaba aha
14:53 agentzh and there're perl6-on-perl5 compilers in the pugs tree.
14:54 agentzh it's another Perl 6 implementation which does *NOT* depend on pugs.
14:54 Zaba o'rly??
14:54 Zaba which?
14:54 agentzh see v6.pm on CPAN :)
14:55 agentzh http://search.cpan.org/~fglo​ck/v6-alpha-0.016/lib/v6.pm
14:55 lambdabot Title: v6 - An experimental Perl 6 implementation - search.cpan.org
14:55 Zaba aha
14:55 agentzh and there're perl6-on-perl6 compilers too.
14:56 agentzh see v6/ in the pugs tree.
14:56 agentzh they're mini-perl6 and kinda-perl6 compilers.
14:56 agentzh these implementations are written in a subset of Perl 6 themselves.
14:57 Zaba agentzh, i actually liked that perl5 had one official release
14:57 Zaba here you don't know what to use, appears that there's both pugs and parrot :p
14:57 agentzh in terms of completeness, pugs is the best of these efforts right now.
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14:58 Zaba i understand
14:58 agentzh parallel efforts are good for finding the best way of doing things.
14:58 Zaba still, there isn't 'official' perl6
14:58 agentzh we believe they'll eventually converge some time in the future.
14:59 agentzh larry has clarified in the spec that there won't be an official perl 6 implementation but there will be an official Perl 6 language.
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15:00 agentzh Zaba: see http://perlcabal.org/syn/S01
15:00 lambdabot Title: S01
15:01 agentzh "Perl 6 is anything that passes the official test suite."
15:01 agentzh the official test suite "defines" the official language somehow.
15:02 Zaba but there's no official implementation - won't that end up like HTML did?
15:02 Zaba ;-)
15:02 agentzh we hope that will end up like Haskell did.
15:03 agentzh so we need to do it *right*
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15:03 agentzh that's what the test suite and specs are for.
15:04 agentzh Zaba: would you like a commit bit? ;)
15:04 Zaba ?
15:04 agentzh a commit bit to the pugs subversion repos.
15:04 veritos Zaba: the right to push your changes to the central repository so you can change it how you will.
15:04 Zaba i know
15:05 pack|pizza joined #perl6
15:05 Zaba but i don't have anything to :p
15:05 veritos Zaba: nor i but i have one ;p
15:05 agentzh maybe polishing the test suite?
15:05 agentzh and adding smartlinks?
15:05 agentzh learning Perl 6 by writing tests is fun :)
15:06 Zaba heh
15:06 Zaba wait
15:06 agentzh (and also reading and tweaking existing tests)
15:06 Zaba (3+6+3)/7
15:06 agentzh ?
15:07 Zaba nvm
15:07 agentzh ?eval (3+6+3)/7
15:07 evalbot_r16152 changed the nick to evalbot_r16148
15:07 evalbot_r16152 12/7
15:07 Zaba ?eval 12/7
15:07 evalbot_r16152 12/7
15:08 agentzh it's a rational number. :)
15:08 Zaba but wcalc can do it
15:08 Zaba and octave cat
15:08 Zaba can*
15:08 agentzh ?eval 12./7
15:08 evalbot_r16152 Error: ␤Unexpected "/"␤expecting ".", "\187", ">>", "=", operator name, qualified identifier, variable name, "...", "--", "++", "i", array subscript, hash subscript or code subscript
15:08 agentzh ?eval 12.0/7.0
15:09 evalbot_r16152 12/7
15:09 agentzh it's just too clever.
15:09 veritos ?eval sin(2)
15:09 Zaba if pugs itself says the same, i can say it is a bug :p
15:09 agentzh a behavior inherited from the haskell simantics.
15:09 evalbot_r16152 0.9092974268256817
15:09 rgs ?eval 1/0
15:09 veritos Inf
15:10 Zaba 0_o
15:10 evalbot_r16152 Error: Illegal division by zero
15:10 Zaba ah
15:10 Zaba lol
15:10 veritos vb.net can do it ;)
15:10 agentzh evalbot == pugs
15:10 Zaba so what am i doing: eating supper
15:10 Zaba nvm
15:10 Zaba so what am i doing: an irc perl bot (not new)
15:10 Zaba but i want it completely modular
15:10 Zaba which is sane to do with OO
15:11 Zaba and is hard to do w/o OO
15:11 agentzh there're already many Perl 6 modules runnable by pugs
15:11 agentzh see ext/
15:11 Zaba IO::Socket is all i need in perl5 for communications
15:12 Zaba but the problem is, perl5 has no pure OO
15:13 agentzh Zaba: i think you should give Moose a shot.
15:13 agentzh Moose provides really wonderful OO to perl 5.
15:13 Zaba hm
15:13 veritos Zaba: it's really easy to use. feels like perl6 with perl5 syntax.
15:13 Zaba i thought of ruby for a while, and it just proved it sucks and my opinion of it is _right_
15:14 agentzh and it's now production ready.
15:15 Zaba hm
15:15 Zaba (IRC bots in C++ are dumb, otherwise i'd make one already ._.)
15:16 agentzh there is a irc bot in Perl 6.
15:16 agentzh *an
15:16 Zaba oh dude
15:16 Zaba there are irc bots in perl5 too
15:16 Zaba and i still write one :p
15:16 agentzh that is evalbot6 you are talking to.
15:16 Zaba the point is writing
15:16 Zaba actually
15:17 Zaba releasing it to the world it very rare
15:17 Zaba ?eval print 10**100
15:17 Zaba it's sloow
15:17 evalbot_r16152 OUTPUT[100000000000000000000000000000​0000000000000000000000000000000000000​0000000000000000000000000000000000] Bool::True
15:17 veritos yep, hashkell supports bignums iirc
15:18 Zaba ?eval print 10**(10**100)
15:18 Zaba >:-D
15:18 evalbot_r16152 OUTPUT[Inf] Bool::True
15:18 Zaba googolplex is TOO large i suppose
15:19 Zaba even for haskell
15:19 Zaba i fail on haskell =(
15:19 Zaba just fail
15:20 Zaba woot
15:20 Zaba g-cpan rules
15:22 * Zaba never thought it would be SO easy.
15:22 laye left #perl6
15:22 Zaba hm ok
15:23 laye joined #perl6
15:23 * Zaba needs to rewrite his bot from scratch, now using Moose. AGAIN!!
15:23 Zaba oh
15:24 agentzh Zaba: have fun :)
15:24 Zaba agentzh, fun, this version is fifth! x(
15:28 Zaba all previous were zbots
15:28 Zaba now i need a better name >_>
15:30 [particle] moosebot
15:30 Zaba no
15:30 Zaba i don't want to tell everyone i use moose, or they will clone my bot in their implementations >_>
15:42 * Zaba calls it SCRAM
15:44 * TimToady unscrams
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16:11 Zaba agentzh, is there any tutorial on Moose?
16:11 marmic joined #perl6
16:12 [particle] zaba: the documentation is quite good, including many examples
16:12 Zaba Oh
16:13 * Zaba forgot about perldoc
16:13 Zaba thanks
16:13 [particle] Moose::Cookbook
16:13 agentzh Zaba: look for the cookbook here: http://search.cpan.org/~stevan/Moose-0.20/
16:13 lambdabot Title: Stevan Little / Moose-0.20 - search.cpan.org
16:14 Zaba ok
16:16 agentzh &
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16:36 Zaba #!C:\\Program Files\\Microsoft Perl\\6\\1031\\PERL.EXE /W <-- would be my worst nightmare
16:36 Zaba glad i'm not using windows anymore :p
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16:49 svnbot6 r16153 | lwall++ | print and say default to $*DEFOUT.
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17:01 davidfetter hello
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17:03 davidfetter has anybody here gotten v6 running on fc6 using fc6's packaging system?
17:05 chris2 changed the nick to chris2_
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17:20 TimToady davidfetter: I would be inclined to doubt it.
17:21 * davidfetter is not worthy :)
17:22 TimToady none of us are...would davidfetter like a commit bit?
17:22 davidfetter i really don't know enough about perl6
17:22 TimToady none of us do.  :)
17:23 davidfetter i'd want to talk with the fedora packagers about how best to introduce the underlying perl packages to fedora
17:23 TimToady they're probably waiting for "real" Perl 6 before they think about it.
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17:24 TimToady and redhat currently has a bit of a python bias
17:24 davidfetter they may be, or may not. i notice that a lot of perl modules with version < 1.0 are there, at least in -extras
17:24 [particle] somehow deadrat and python just seem to go together....
17:26 TimToady anyway, don't let me discourage you!  :)
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17:26 TimToady after all, I use fc6...
17:26 TimToady though I just get v6 directly from pugs/
17:28 TimToady must admit I haven't played much with v6 lately, but that may change now that fglock is making v6 understand src/perl6/Perl-6.0.0-STD.pm
17:29 avar davidfetter: <1.0 in perl modules generally doesn't mean the same thing as it does elsewhere
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17:53 rindolf Hi all.
17:53 rindolf Hi TimToady, avar
17:53 rindolf Hi [particle]
17:53 diakopter who wants to implement Perl 6 in Microsoft's DLR
17:56 jrockway who wants another partial perl 6 implementation?
17:58 Patterner changed the nick to Psyche^
17:58 svnbot6 r16154 | lwall++ | More IO spec whackage
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18:02 TimToady diakopter: at this point I'm thinking much more about getting the frontend fully implemented than any particular backend.  If the frontend is there, the backends will follow along naturally, in sort of a mammalian locomotive way.
18:04 Yaakov When your backend isn't following your frontend you have serious problems.
18:04 [particle] luge.
18:05 Yaakov If I was on a luge, I would have serious problems.
18:05 SamB that reminds me of how GHC parses the syntax for associated type synonyms, but the typechecker chokes on it...
18:05 gnuvince TimToady: Pugs doesn't yet run STD.pm, right?
18:08 matsi q
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18:08 [particle] gnuvince: nothing parses it completely yet afaik
18:09 gnuvince [particle]: thank you
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18:16 TimToady pugs can parse the cheated version, but doesn't run it yet
18:17 [particle] oh, i thought there were still parsing bugs... that's good news.
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18:23 TimToady there are still parsing bugs--that's what the cheating is for
18:29 oZ_ Hey, guys. Forgive the n00b, but what exactly am I doing wrong when I do a make install of pugs and it pretty much nukes my core perl 5 modules with perl 6 versions?
18:30 wolverian make install seems to be broken. none of us really use it.
18:30 integral You may be the only person who uses 'make install'...
18:30 wolverian (which is probably the reason why it is broken.)
18:30 integral Someone should give you a commitbit to fix it :-)
18:30 oZ_ It's possible. ;)  It worked on the last make install I did on that box, which was about 3 months ago.
18:30 offby1 geez, it should be deleted if it doesn't work and isn't going to be fixed
18:30 offby1 otherwise it's an "attractive nuisance"
18:31 oZ_ I'm just happy I archived my library directory.
18:31 integral Well, feel free to "fix" it by deleting it.
18:31 oZ_ Those of you who develop against pugs, do you make, symlink.. and then what with the lib directories?
18:31 integral you just configure pugs to load from them, -I, use lib, etc
18:32 oZ_ That was my first inclination, just seeing if there were any other tricks. ;)
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18:49 svnbot6 r16155 | lwall++ | Put in $*DEFERR too.
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22:46 svnbot6 r16156 | lwall++ | More IO and Functions whackage
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23:13 rhr TimToady: should IO *io have a sigil?
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23:15 rhr also, can we get a spec on Pipe.to/Pipe.from or whatever you decide it should be?
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23:19 svnbot6 r16157 | lwall++ | typo noted by rhr++
23:25 TimToady rhr: what do you think the pipe spec should say, and do you have a commit bit? :)
23:26 TimToady IO.pod is still under pugs so that anyone can hack on it...
23:30 TimToady this time feather is slow because two people are running ghc at the same time
23:31 [particle] maybe 'ghc' should be wrapped in a script which sets nice and ulimit
23:35 SamB joined #perl6
23:35 avar .oO( distcc for ghc )
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23:36 avar TimToady: I just implemented what's needed for :rw on p5
23:38 rhr TimToady: not sure I'm confident enough to break new ground on the spec :)
23:38 TimToady given the history of lvalue strings in p5, I think I can confidently predict that someone will figure out a way to break it accidentally.  :)
23:39 TimToady but that says more about p5 than about you...
23:39 TimToady rhr: doesn't take confidence, just foolhardiness
23:39 rhr and I don't have a commit bit, you can send one to ryan@tau.solarneutrino.net
23:42 rhr I assume they'd just be variants of open
23:42 TimToady I will, but at the moment it looks like commitbit is down on svn.pugscode.org for some reason
23:43 TimToady Yeah, they're just strange constructors, or factories, or something
23:43 TimToady strange in that a single call is returning two new entangled objects
23:44 rhr how's that?
23:45 TimToady see man pipe(2), which returns two fds, one for reading, one for writing
23:45 rhr oh, ok.  I was just thinking about the aut-fork case
23:45 rhr *auto-fork
23:45 [particle] filesystem entanglement
23:45 TimToady on the other hand, if you're looking more at the "|..." commands, then... right
23:47 rhr cooking dinner &
23:48 offby1 drinking wine spo-de-o
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23:55 TimToady hmm, my work firewall seems to be plugging port 9999.  can someone else send rhr a commitbit?
23:55 TimToady otherwise I'll have to wait till I get home
23:55 [particle] commitbit.pugscode.org isn't responding, seems
23:58 TimToady strange, I can telnet svn.pugscode.org 9999 which is where I think commitbit redirects to
23:58 TimToady but only from home, not from work
23:59 TimToady loadavg is 13, so maybe it's just slow for you...
23:59 [particle] svn.pugscode.org:9999 works
23:59 TimToady dns wackiness maybe

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