Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2007-07-21

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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01:31 pugs_svnbot r17110 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/Muldis-DB/ : updated Literal.pm and PhysType.pm to rename collection-type classes from Sel|NQ|AQ suffixes
01:31 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17110
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03:10 TimToady bloonix: currently works as follows:
03:10 TimToady ?eval my %a = a => 1; my %b = b => 2; sub foo (*%hash) { say %hash.keys }; foo(|%a,|%b)
03:10 evalbot_r17041 OUTPUT[ab␤] Bool::True
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03:12 TimToady thud &
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03:47 pugs_svnbot r17111 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/Muldis-DB/ : this is the Perl 6 equivalent of what will end up on CPAN as Muldis::DB version 0.2.0 for Perl 5
03:47 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17111
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08:19 meppl good morning
08:20 masak meppl: morning
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08:24 meppl good morning masak
08:28 masak meppl: are you in Germany?
08:29 masak (as opposed to Asia or the US, as some of this channel's residents)
08:29 meppl yes yes
08:29 masak that would be why our mornings occur at the same time :)
08:29 meppl ;)
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08:52 xerox Is it here where a bot yells on svn commits?
08:52 xerox How is it called/where can I get it/how do I configure it? :-D
08:57 * integral points at pugs_svnbot
08:57 integral it's in the pugs source tree somewhere
08:57 xerox it runs on pugs?
08:57 integral I believe so
08:57 bloonix morning
09:00 masak bloonix: morning
09:02 bloonix a really nice day to sit on the balcony and do a bit p6 :)
09:02 xerox ok thanks integral
09:07 xerox integral: do you know if the bot must reside on the same server as the repo is?
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09:09 integral I'm pretty sure not.
09:09 xerox cool
09:10 xerox what's the pipeline of commands to get pugs nowadays?
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09:13 _moritz_ wolverian: it's not yet automatically updated
09:14 _moritz_ xerox: do you want to build it, or just use it?
09:14 xerox I want to use it for the pubs_svnbot thing
09:15 xerox (on FreeBSD)
09:17 xerox _moritz_: any idea? (:
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09:23 xerox _moritz_: I think you were going on to suggest something... ? (:
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09:24 _moritz_ xerox: sorry, was afk...
09:24 xerox no problem
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09:25 _moritz_ I don't think there are binaries for freebsd, you have to get the repository and follow INSTALL
09:26 xerox okay
09:31 xerox thanks _moritz_
09:34 masak this morning's discussion question: what, in your view, makes sigils worth their weight
09:35 masak python and ruby has dropped them
09:35 masak and php uses it without understanding why
09:35 masak perl uses it to distinguish scalars, arrays, hashes
09:35 masak and also to make interpolation of vars possible
09:36 masak (with no extra syntax)
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09:49 xerox integral: find . -iname ".*bot.*" doesn't find anything, where is the svn_pugsbot'
09:49 xerox ?
09:49 xerox pugs_svnbot either
09:50 _moritz_ in examples/network/ iirc
09:50 xerox yes! svnbot.pl okay
09:54 xerox how do you turn on the debug messages?
09:56 _moritz_ I don't know... it's turned on for me by default
09:58 xerox maybe you know how to install Net/IRC.pm on freebsd?
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10:19 _moritz_ if you type "make" on the top level directory, it is built into blib6/ somewhere
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10:25 _moritz_ and then you can run it with pugs -I$path_to_lib
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10:40 bloonix *** Must only use named arguments to new() constructor
10:40 bloonix dont understand it
10:40 bloonix submethod BUILD (*$var) {
10:40 bloonix ...
10:41 bloonix Test.new('foo');
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10:57 pasteling "bloonix" at 87.79.229.74 pasted "#!/usr/bin/pugs module Foo; su" (16 lines, 250B) at http://sial.org/pbot/26430
11:15 TimToady bloonix: positional args aren't composable.  BUILD is required to be named, and the default new can only understand named, but you are free to write your own new in any order you like.
11:15 bloonix TimToady: I dont understand what "named" means :/
11:16 TimToady well, first, you can't put a submethod into a module, because it needs a class instead, presumably with some attributes
11:16 TimToady it's the names of the attributes that you use
11:18 TimToady class Point { has $.x; has $.y; }; Point.new(x => 1, y => 2)
11:18 bloonix http://svn.pugscode.org/pugs/ext/File-Find/lib/File/Find.pm
11:19 bloonix I look into this mod for example and though its possible
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11:21 TimToady fixed
11:21 TimToady bloonix++
11:21 pugs_svnbot r17112 | lwall++ | s/module/class/ in File::Find
11:21 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17112
11:23 bloonix I have to read S12 again do understand the difference between modules | classes !
11:24 bloonix or maybe another synopsis is better?
11:25 TimToady @tell masak two other reasons for sigils: to distinguish nouns from verbs (the absence of the sigil indicating either a verb or a type) and finally sigils open up an extensible namespace for twigils, in case you want to add more weirdly scoped variables
11:25 lambdabot Consider it noted.
11:25 TimToady bloonix: yes, the synopses tend to be long on what and short on why
11:26 TimToady biab
11:27 bloonix synopsis => what, apocalype => why ?
11:27 bloonix what and why
11:27 bloonix where can I look for a description "why" class and "why" module ?
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11:32 pasteling "bloonix" at 87.79.229.74 pasted "#!/usr/bin/pugs module Test; h" (27 lines, 362B) at http://sial.org/pbot/26431
11:32 TimToady a module is really just a package with a different name so that we can 1) distinguish p5 from p6 and 2) have a different export mechanism
11:32 bloonix why is that possible?
11:33 bloonix it shouldn't, or?
11:33 TimToady shouldn't I think
11:34 TimToady sec, have to check if taxi is here for airport
11:34 bloonix :)
11:36 TimToady no, not yet
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11:39 TimToady basically, p5 didn't distinguish packages from classes, and it turned out to be very confusing, along with not distinguishing subs from methods.
11:40 TimToady arguably, since a class can also be used as a module, modules are redundant
11:40 TimToady and since we fixed sub vs method, less confusing
11:41 TimToady but I think it's useful to be able to group non-OO subs in a place that explicitly indicates no constructors need be autogenerated
11:41 TimToady package is the same as module, but doesn't support "is export"
11:42 TimToady taxi here &
11:42 bloonix have a good fly
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13:30 pmurias hi,
13:31 pmurias what is the syntax for changing the metaclass for a class?
13:32 pmurias i meant specifing
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13:45 pmurias not nessesarly one which works in pugs, as i mean to implement it in kp6
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14:29 pugs_svnbot r17113 | pmurias++ | kp6:
14:29 pugs_svnbot r17113 | pmurias++ | fixed test plans
14:29 pugs_svnbot r17113 | pmurias++ | one can now specify the metaclass with the nonstandard
14:29 pugs_svnbot r17113 | pmurias++ | class Foo meta Bar {...} syntax
14:29 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17113
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15:02 bloonix Bool will be 1 or 0 ? or any char as well?
15:03 bloonix ?eval my Bool $bool; say $bool.WHAT
15:03 evalbot_r17041 OUTPUT[Bool␤] Bool::True
15:03 bloonix ?eval my Bool $bool; $bool = 1; say $bool.WHAT
15:03 evalbot_r17041 OUTPUT[Int␤] Bool::True
15:05 bloonix when is $bool Bool?
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15:12 pmurias bloonix: hi
15:12 pmurias Bool is a false or true value
15:13 bloonix that means that Bool is all about 0 and undef?
15:13 bloonix no
15:14 pmurias Bool can be either Bool::True or Bool::False
15:14 pmurias 0 and undef get convered to Bool::False
15:15 pmurias 1 and 'a' and [1,2,3] get converted to Bool::True
15:15 pmurias clear?
15:15 pmurias ;)
15:16 bloonix yes
15:16 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /[01]/;
15:16 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:16 bloonix whats wrong here?
15:17 wolverian [] doesn't do what you think it does
15:18 wolverian see S05 :)
15:18 bloonix wtf :)
15:21 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /<[01]>/;
15:21 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::True, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:21 pmurias RTFM ;), seriously the regex are totaly changed
15:21 wolverian isn't it reat :)
15:21 pmurias http://perlcabal.org/syn/S05.html
15:21 lambdabot Title: S05
15:21 wolverian +g
15:21 pmurias i was too slow :(
15:22 pmurias wolverian: reat means?
15:22 wolverian see the +g :)
15:23 bloonix pmurias: until now I though p5 regexes are compliant with p6 regexes.
15:23 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^<[01]>\z/;
15:23 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:24 pmurias ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^<[01]>\z/;
15:24 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:24 bloonix lol
15:24 pmurias ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ :p5/01/
15:24 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^<[01]>/;
15:24 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::True, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:24 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^<[01]>$/;
15:24 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:25 bloonix # no more \A or \z
15:25 pmurias ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ m:p5/01/
15:25 pmurias ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ m:p5/[01]/
15:25 wolverian uh..
15:25 wolverian try without the space
15:25 pmurias ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ m:p5/[01]/
15:25 evalbot_r17041 *** Cannot parse regex: [01]␤*** Error: Error: Error in rule: unknown parameter 'p5' at /home/audreyt/pugs/perl5/Pugs-Compiler-Rule/lib/Pugs/Runtime/Match/HsBridge.pm line 37␤␤Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:25 wolverian I think it's :perl5
15:26 pmurias ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ m:perl5/[01]/
15:26 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::True, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 1, ␤  str => "1", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:26 pmurias ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ m:Perl5/[01]/
15:26 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::True, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 1, ␤  str => "1", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:26 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^<[01]>?$/;
15:26 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:27 pmurias the synopsis mentions :Perl5/:P5
15:27 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^1?$/;
15:27 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::True, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 1, ␤  str => "1", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:27 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^1$/;
15:27 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::True, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 1, ␤  str => "1", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:27 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^<[01]>?$/;
15:27 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:27 bloonix dont understand that
15:28 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^<[01]>$/;
15:28 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:28 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^ <[01]> $/;
15:28 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:28 bloonix I hate try and error :)
15:29 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^ <[0-1]> $/;
15:29 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
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15:34 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; $bool ~~ /^ \d $/;
15:34 evalbot_r17041 Match.new(␤  ok => Bool::False, ␤  from => 0, ␤  to => 0, ␤  str => "", ␤  sub_pos => (), ␤  sub_named => {}␤)
15:41 bloonix ?eval my $bool = 1; say "ok" if $bool ~~ /^<[01]>$/;
15:41 evalbot_r17041 undef
15:42 bloonix thats confusing. in my script it prints ok
15:46 rhr I've heard it said that character classes are broken in evalbot for some reason...
15:49 rhr I like the "Error: Error: Error" message though :)
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15:53 bloonix 'Cos Perl patterns induce complete brain overload
15:53 bloonix (Bob Dylan)++
15:53 bloonix :)
16:12 bloonix ?eval my $s = 'bar'; say 'ok' if $s ~~ /^[foo|bar|baz]$/;
16:13 evalbot_r17041 OUTPUT[ok␤] Bool::True
16:33 pmurias @seen fglock
16:33 lambdabot Last time I saw fglock was when I left #perl6 22d 22h 4m 40s ago, and .
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16:37 * pmurias has a couple of things to discuss with fglock
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17:51 pugs_svnbot r17114 | pmurias++ | kp6: $::Foo = Class->new(); in emitted code
17:51 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17114
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19:23 pmurias _moritz_: ruby uses sigils a bit
19:24 pmurias although their meaning is different
19:25 masak pmurias: that's true. ruby uses the sigils for OO purposes
19:25 lambdabot masak: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
19:25 masak @messages
19:25 lambdabot TimToady said 8h 53s ago: two other reasons for sigils: to distinguish nouns from verbs (the absence of the sigil indicating either a verb or a type) and finally sigils open up an extensible
19:25 lambdabot namespace for twigils, in case you want to add more weirdly scoped variables
19:26 masak good reasons.
19:29 pmurias i was blinded a bit by the lack of sigils when i looked the first few times at ruby code
19:29 masak :)
19:30 masak habit is an important part of language comprehension. that's why it's difficult for me nowadays to remember how little Esperanto people can understand before they've learned it
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22:16 meppl good night
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23:21 pugs_svnbot r17115 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/Muldis-DB/ : fixed a few documentation bugs
23:21 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17115
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23:39 fglock hi
23:39 lambdabot fglock: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it.
23:41 fglock @tell moritz re unsafe operations in kp6, not yet i think
23:41 lambdabot Consider it noted.
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