Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2007-08-30

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

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01:05 DarkWolf84 ?eval say localtime(time);
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01:06 pugsbot_r17185 OUTPUT[<obj:Time::Local>␤] Bool::True
01:06 DarkWolf84 I found a bug
01:07 DarkWolf84 why this is just capture
01:13 DarkWolf84 maybe my mistake again
01:13 DarkWolf84 :(
01:23 nipotaway changed the nick to nipotan
01:30 pugs_svnbot r17497 | sunnavy++ | added tests for the equivalence of .123 and 0.123
01:30 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17497
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04:25 cj lar lar lar
04:26 cj anything fun happening here?
04:26 masak cj: 'lar', is that Singaporean English?
04:26 masak and yes, we always have fun :)
04:27 masak right now, there is some development around kp6, nqp and the grammar, I think
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04:27 masak moritz_ has deployed a new bot
04:30 cj hurm... no Perl::Critic in etch :(
04:31 cj masak: it could be Singaporean English :)
04:31 cj what's kp6?
04:33 masak cj: you'll just have to go through CPAN, like the rest of us
04:34 masak cj: kp6 is Kinda Perl 6
04:34 masak it's a subset of Perl 6 developed in mp6, Mini Perl 6
04:35 masak increasingly feature-complete, it's to be bootstrapped and implemented in itself
04:37 masak see http://svn.pugscode.org/pugs/v6/v6-KindaPerl6/docs/kindaperl6-spec.pod
04:37 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/yt5pg2
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05:30 cj masak: that sounds pretty neato
05:31 pugs_svnbot r17498 | sunnavy++ | fixed an invalid comment for smartlink
05:31 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17498
05:31 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17498 - Pugs - Trac
05:32 masak cj: yes. furthermore, I gather there's a YAPC and a corresponding hackathon going on
05:32 masak many of the regulars are involved in that IRL, so this channel seems eerily quiet
05:33 cj where's the current YAPC?
05:33 masak good question
05:33 masak Vienna, apparently
05:33 sunnavy from s02: Variables with native types do not support undefinedness: it is an error to assign an undefined value to them.
05:33 masak http://vienna.yapceurope.org/ye2007/
05:33 lambdabot Title: YAPC::Europe 2007 in Vienna | YAPC::EU | 2007 | Vienna | 28th to 30th August 200 ...
05:34 sunnavy anybody knows why?
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05:34 masak sunnavy: a guess would be that native types are tied somewhat to hardware, and may not support such a value
05:36 rfordinal_ changed the nick to rfordinal
05:37 sunnavy masak: what about `my int $x;', what's the value of $x now? not undef?
05:37 masak sunnavy: 0?
05:38 masak seems reasonable to me
05:38 masak p'haps because I come from the Java direction, where this is the case with instance int variables
05:39 sunnavy pugs -e 'say my int $x'
05:39 sunnavy we get a ``int\n"
05:40 * masak too
05:40 masak that's likely wrong
05:41 sunnavy I wish I can find answers when I get through syn, hehe.
05:43 masak as far as I can see, there's no test for setting my int $x to 0
05:43 masak maybe one of us should add one? that's usually the best way to codify questions for posterity :)
05:44 jisom make it a todo test and people will think it used to be "broken"
05:44 masak jisom: they will?
05:45 sunnavy but we are not quite sure if that's right.
05:45 jisom if they're actually checking what tests are failing and what's succeeding that used to fail
05:45 masak jisom: ah. a todo test sounds like a good idea
05:46 masak sunnavy: true, but a test is easy to change after the fact
05:46 jisom I'm halfway joking, most people just report tests and don't delve further
05:46 masak it's better to add the test and forget about it, than not to add the test and forget about it
05:48 sunnavy masak, it's not a sigle test, how about other native types?
05:49 masak sunnavy: they too, I suppose
05:49 masak are all native types numerical? even without checking S02, i guess not
05:49 masak what should the default values be for the non-numerical types?
05:49 jisom you know of a computer that knows anything but bits?
05:50 masak jisom: that's not the point
05:50 wolverian masak, the prototype? :)
05:51 masak wolverian: you lost me. what do you mean?
05:51 jisom if they're native types, a computer really only has ints and floats, and sort of pointers
05:51 masak ok
05:51 masak so 0 all the way, then
05:52 sunnavy We'd better keep this confusion till it's clear :-)
05:52 sunnavy maybe bother to ask TimToday, hehe
05:53 sunnavy s/TimToday/TimToady/
05:53 jisom btw, to complicate things, the equivalent of undef for a float is nan so should floats default to nan? :-p
05:53 masak @ask TimToady whether all native types are 0 at first
05:53 lambdabot Consider it noted.
05:54 masak sunnavy: there. asking is easy when lambdabot is around
05:54 masak @thx
05:54 lambdabot you are welcome
05:54 * masak pats lambdabot on the head
05:54 sunnavy so cool ;-)
05:54 masak ;)
05:55 masak yes, ph3ar the p0wer of haskell
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06:10 moritz_ re
06:10 moritz_ g'morning
06:19 masak moritz_: good morning
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07:17 pugs_svnbot r17499 | fglock++ | [kp6] updated Junction
07:17 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17499
07:17 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17499 - Pugs - Trac
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07:20 moritz_ I didn't know that kp6 implements return'ing from an inner scope
07:20 moritz_ I thought I tried it lately, and it gave a "not implemented" message
07:22 TimToady masak: after talking it over with TheDamian, we'd probably go with int = 0 and num = NaN, perhaps with pragmatic control, though it's easy enough to = 0 xx *
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07:25 masak TimToady: I love it how you guys talk things over based on stuff we discuss here on IRC
07:25 masak you're better than the Swiss government!
07:27 masak so... add tests for it?
07:29 pugs_svnbot r17500 | moritz++ | [kp6]
07:29 pugs_svnbot r17500 | moritz++ |  * Junctions: corrected true() for 'one'
07:29 pugs_svnbot r17500 | moritz++ |  * EmitPerl5: more newlines in generated p5 output
07:29 pugs_svnbot r17500 | moritz++ |  * Array:     a stub min() implementation
07:29 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17500
07:29 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17500 - Pugs - Trac
07:29 moritz_ masak: I'd wait until it's in the specs
07:33 masak moritz_: good idea
07:56 pugs_svnbot r17501 | ruoso++ | [kp6] new test. new with parameter is still a syntax error
07:56 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17501
07:56 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17501 - Pugs - Trac
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08:05 sunnavy TimToady: how about the other native types? be initialized to what?
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08:22 moritz_ I'd suggest bool with false...
08:22 moritz_ buf with empty buffer
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08:22 moritz_ complex... NaN?
08:23 moritz_ my humble suggestions
08:23 moritz_ but most are pretty straight forward ;)
08:27 moritz_ #kp6 say 2+4*5
08:27 exp_evalbot r17501: OUTPUT[22␤]
08:30 xinming #kp6 (2+4*5).say
08:30 exp_evalbot r17501: OUTPUT[22␤]
08:30 sunnavy In fact, I like undef, but I don't know exactly why there are no undef in native types.
08:30 xinming my @a = qw/a b c/; @a.perl.say
08:30 xinming #kp6 my @a = qw/a b c/; @a.perl.say
08:30 exp_evalbot r17501: OUTPUT[Syntax Error␤DISPATCH: calling APPLY on invalid object:$VAR1 = {};␤␤ at lib5/KindaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 31␤  main::DISPATCH('undef', 'APPLY') called at - line 19␤]
08:30 moritz_ sunnavy: because "native" is what is implemented in hardware...
08:30 moritz_ sunnavy: and hardware doesn't know undef
08:31 moritz_ xinming: the p6 syntax for qw/ .. / is < .. >
08:31 moritz_ #kp6 my @a; @a=<a b c>;
08:31 exp_evalbot r17501: OUTPUT[Syntax Error␤]
08:31 xinming #kp6 my @a = <a b c>; @a.perl.say
08:31 exp_evalbot r17501: OUTPUT[Syntax Error␤]
08:31 moritz_ but it's NYI it seems
08:33 ruoso fglock, did you notice the new 43 test?
08:33 ruoso when running with --ast, it indeed shows a parse error...
08:34 sunnavy moritz: gotcha, though still not very comfortable with it. :-)
08:36 pugs_svnbot r17502 | moritz++ | [irclog] ilbot2.pl, a POCOIRC-based irc log bot works now
08:36 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17502
08:36 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17502 - Pugs - Trac
08:36 moritz_ sunnavy: well, nobody is forced to use it - if you want the comfort, use Int instead of int ;)
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08:37 moritz_ I think native types are meant for situations where you really have to know what you are doing - for example if you want to implement a bigint lib in perl, you'd use native types
08:37 moritz_ but for "normal" variables the "normal" types are preferred
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08:40 sunnavy Before I thought native types are a lot like the variables in Perl 5, this misled me much. ;-)
08:42 meppl good morning
08:43 moritz_ good morning meppl ;)
08:43 meppl good morning moritz
08:43 pugs_svnbot r17503 | moritz++ | [irclog] fixed previous commit (hopefully)
08:43 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17503
08:43 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17503 - Pugs - Trac
08:46 topic for #perl6 is: http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
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09:08 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
09:08 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
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09:09 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
09:09 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
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09:11 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
09:11 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
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09:13 moritz_ #perl6, #cdk and #bioclipse are now logged by a single bot
09:14 moritz_ I hope it works ;)
09:21 masak moritz_: seems to work over at #bioclipse at least
09:23 moritz_ masak: Aye, same here... I just don't understand why the bot insists on naming itself "test", I told it to take the name "ilbot2" ;)
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10:11 Blwood woaw
10:11 Blwood ?eval [*] 1..5
10:12 Blwood where is the bot :(
10:12 pugsbot_r17185 120
10:12 Blwood oh :)
10:12 pugs_svnbot r17504 | moritz++ | svn-search: added search hints to template.
10:12 pugs_svnbot r17504 | moritz++ | URL is http://moritz.faui2k3.org/svn-search/
10:12 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17504
10:12 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17504 - Pugs - Trac
10:12 moritz_ Blwood: gone :(
10:12 lambdabot Title: Pugs SVN search
10:13 moritz_ #pugs [*] 1..5
10:13 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[120␤]
10:13 Blwood :)
10:13 moritz_ it's a new, different bot
10:13 moritz_ I don't know what diakopter++ did to the old one
10:13 Blwood #pugs [+] split "", [*] 1..5
10:13 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[3.0␤]
10:13 Blwood this one is good too, isn't it :o ?
10:14 moritz_ it supports different implementations
10:14 moritz_ #kp6 "hello".say
10:14 exp_evalbot r17503: OUTPUT[hello␤]
10:14 Blwood ah nice :)
10:15 moritz_ additionally there are #p6 (p6 on parrot) and nqp
10:15 Blwood perl6 is kind of magic
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10:16 moritz_ indeed ;I
10:16 Blwood how to compute the factorial of a number and add all its digits ?
10:16 Blwood [+] split "", [*] 1..5 does it :o
10:17 Blwood even in Haskell it's harder
10:17 Blwood (I may be wrong)
10:17 Blwood sum . map digitToInt .  show . product $ [1..5] does it in Haskell
10:20 moritz_ would you like help a bit with perl6?
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10:22 Blwood yeah I would like to, but I'm don't know if I'm enough competent
10:22 moritz_ there are complicated and easy tasks
10:22 moritz_ just /msg me your email address and your desired username, and I'll send you a commit bit
10:23 Blwood okay :)
10:24 moritz_ http://dev.pugscode.org/wiki/Overview gives an overview of the haskell source
10:24 lambdabot Title: Overview - Pugs - Trac
10:25 moritz_ damned, feather has a load of 13, and commitbit doesn't respond
10:27 moritz_ Blwood: I hope the email is out (sender: audrey tang), if you don't receive one in the next 15 minutes please ask again
10:27 Blwood okay :)
10:28 Blwood thank you
10:28 moritz_ you're welcome ;)
10:28 moritz_ there are many things that can be done without knowlodge of compiler construction, like writing tests
10:28 moritz_ in t/ there are ~20,000 test, but we need more
10:29 Blwood yeah the more, the best :p
10:29 moritz_ aye
10:29 moritz_ and some features and builtins are not tested yet
10:30 moritz_ of course if you like haskell, pugs hacking is the best you can do
10:30 moritz_ but I have to admit I don't know how easy or complex the pugs source code is... I managed to contribute about two lines so far ;)
10:31 Blwood haha :), so I'll have a deeper look inside /src/
10:33 moritz_ aye ;)
10:33 moritz_ best thing might be to run a smoke and look at a simple bug, and try to fix that
10:37 Blwood I've just received the mail :)
10:37 renormalist joined #perl6
10:38 moritz_ YaY
10:43 Blwood I don't know if it's me but commitbit is not responding :(
10:44 moritz_ it tags ages, really
10:44 moritz_ the server it runs has a load avg. of 15 atm :(
10:48 moritz_ Blwood: btw it's a custom to add yourself to the AUTHORS file in the first commit, to test the commit bit
10:49 Blwood all right :)
10:50 Blwood I come back in 30min it's nearly 1pm and my stomach hurts :(
10:50 Blwood 13pm*
10:51 moritz_ 1pm was right... seems we're in the same time zone ;)
10:52 moritz_ and lunch is a very good idea ;)
10:55 pugs_svnbot r17505 | renormalist++ | - a minimalistic all-in-one call of kp6
10:55 pugs_svnbot r17506 | renormalist++ | - without perltidy
10:55 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17506
10:55 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17506 - Pugs - Trac
10:56 moritz_ renormalist: are you on the wsorga mailing list?
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11:59 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
11:59 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
11:59 test joined #perl6
11:59 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
11:59 Topic for #perl6is now http://pugscode.org/ | nopaste: http://sial.org/pbot/perl6 | ?eval [~] <m oo se> | We do Haskell, too | > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*) [1..4] | irclog: http://irc.pugscode.org/
12:05 pugs_svnbot r17508 | moritz++ | [irclog] remove trailing punctuation from URLs
12:05 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17508
12:05 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17508 - Pugs - Trac
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12:12 pugs_svnbot r17509 | fglock++ | [mp6] set svn props
12:12 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17509
12:12 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17509 - Pugs - Trac
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12:18 fglock back at kp6 hackathon
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12:27 pugs_svnbot r17510 | ruoso++ | [kp6] marking test 43 as TODO, as the grammar doesnt support new with args...
12:27 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17510
12:27 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17510 - Pugs - Trac
12:28 moritz_ svn up
12:28 moritz_ svn: PROPFIND request failed on '/pugs'
12:28 moritz_ svn: PROPFIND of '/pugs': 403 Forbidden (http://svn.pugscode.org)
12:29 moritz_ that's not good :/
12:29 moritz_ now it works again...
12:32 moritz_ ruoso: I think it's token exp_seq that needs hacking if you want to allow argument pairs...
12:33 moritz_ you'd have to replace it with something that parses anything that returns a list or a hash or a pair
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12:47 pugs_svnbot r17511 | fglock++ | [kp6] updated IDEAS-HACKATHON
12:47 pugs_svnbot r17511 | fglock++ | fixed none(...) stringification
12:47 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17511
12:49 fglock moritz_: re exp_seq, we are adding support for named params (Runtime::Perl6::Capture), but it still needs some integration work
12:50 pugs_svnbot r17512 | fglock++ | [kp6] fixed last commit
12:50 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17512
12:50 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17512 - Pugs - Trac
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13:09 Blwood moritz_, are you here ?
13:10 Blwood I'll be back in 2h
13:10 fglock [particle]: ping
13:10 pugs_svnbot r17513 | fglock++ | [kp6] updated roadmap
13:10 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17513
13:10 Blwood (I have some questions about the tests)
13:10 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17513 - Pugs - Trac
13:12 moritz_ Blwood: depends on your notion of "here" ;)
13:14 bloonix I really missing a dumper vor structes :/
13:14 bloonix like Data::Dumper
13:14 moritz_ Blwood: use .perl
13:15 moritz_ sorry, bloonix ;)
13:15 bloonix is there a temporary dumper way for p6 structures?
13:16 [particle] fglock: pong
13:16 moritz_ #pugs my %a = b => [c,d], e => f; say %a.perl
13:16 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[*** No such subroutine: "&c"␤    at /tmp/RIhcxjIxHF line 1, column 15-18␤]
13:16 fglock [particle]: i'm working with Jonathan in the mp6-parrot emitter
13:17 fglock we think is reasonably possible to have mp6 bootstrapped in parrot
13:17 moritz_ #pugs my %a = b => <c d>, e => f; say %a.perl
13:17 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[*** No such subroutine: "&f"␤    at /tmp/Hi5F0HyrqD line 1, column 26-27␤]
13:17 fglock so that we can compile kp6 to parrot using it
13:17 [particle] ok, great!
13:17 moritz_ #pugs my %a = b => <c d>, e => 3; say %a.perl
13:17 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[{("b" => ("c", "d")), ("e" => 3)}␤]
13:18 moritz_ bloonix: that's your Data::Dumper ;)
13:18 [particle] fglock: hopefully we have enough of the new object model for that
13:18 bloonix grml
13:18 [particle] (jonathan should know) :)
13:18 fglock [particle]: we've been discussing several other options, but this seems to be the most simple
13:18 fglock he said any parrot problems should be fixed anyway
13:19 [particle] fglock: i'm still going to pursue serialized past and ast-past translation as i think it's of use
13:19 bloonix moritz_: but all in one line :)
13:20 fglock [particle]: yes, that's one of the ideas - it would be nice to have that working
13:20 fglock do you think it would be difficult to have a past parser for parrot?
13:21 [particle] fglock: i talked to pmichaud and ingy and we'll use a json++ subset of yaml
13:21 fglock i thougt about emitting parrot code that would build the tree
13:21 [particle] basically json with types
13:21 fglock ok
13:21 [particle] ...and using blocks instead of indent levels
13:21 fglock so we could make kp6 emit that, right?
13:21 [particle] yes indeed
13:22 moritz_ is there a PAST definition somewhere?
13:22 [particle] fglock: http://rafb.net/p/qqJLjn69.txt
13:23 [particle] moritz_: there's plenty of comments in the source
13:23 [particle] i'll get you a link
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13:23 [particle] fglock: this syntax is true yaml, but it shows the hierarchy of past.
13:24 fglock [particle]: i wonder if it would be possible to have a parenthesis-delimited version, that's a bit easier to emit
13:24 [particle] the syntax we want would look a bit different (like i said, blocks instead of indents, and more json-like)
13:24 fglock oh, that's what blocks instead of indents means
13:24 [particle] yep, {
13:25 [particle] it's easier to parse, too :)
13:26 [particle] moritz_: http://svn.perl.org/parrot/trunk/compilers/past-pm/PAST/Node.pir
13:26 moritz_ [particle]: thanks
13:26 fglock do i have to figure out the 'pirop' codes, or is this already implemented elsewhere?
13:27 [particle] fglock: that's in the language grammar, i'll post an example
13:28 [particle] http://svn.perl.org/parrot/trunk/languages/nqp/src/Grammar.pg /pirop
13:28 [particle] also see http://svn.perl.org/parrot/trunk/languages/nqp/src/Grammar/Actions.pir
13:28 lambdabot http://tinyurl.com/2zvwah
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13:33 [particle] past nodes all have a type, a hash, and an array
13:36 fglock [particle]: is there already a version of the past parser?
13:36 [particle] fglock: no, but it shouldn't be hard to write
13:37 [particle] i'm looking at the yaml and json specs now
13:37 [particle] we already have a json parser, so it's not much of a stretch to get what we need
13:38 [particle] we'll use this as a base and modify from there: http://svn.perl.org/parrot/trunk/compilers/json/JSON/grammar.pg
13:39 [particle] of course, it needs to be updated to current S05 syntax
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13:43 pugs_svnbot r17514 | renormalist++ | - [kp6] started to fill IO module with mkdir, rmdir and tests for this
13:43 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17514
13:43 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17514 - Pugs - Trac
13:45 renormalist moritz_: I implemented some unsafe operations in kp6, do we have to handle that in any way ?
13:45 pugs_svnbot r17515 | dakkar++ | *very* simple tree transformation engine, with similar semantics to XSLT.
13:45 pugs_svnbot r17515 | dakkar++ | Needs lots of cleanup
13:45 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17515
13:45 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17515 - Pugs - Trac
13:46 renormalist moritz_: fglock said, u asked for such nusafe operations, therefore I ask
13:47 fglock coffee break! &
13:48 ruoso TimToady, take a look at this ideas for the Tree Transformation Language
13:48 pugs_svnbot r17516 | ruoso++ | [pX] Simple syntax mockup in the tree transformation language
13:48 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17516
13:48 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17516 - Pugs - Trac
13:48 ruoso pX/Common/Data-Transform-Trivial
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14:17 bloonix ?eval my $foo = 1; my $bar = $foo.WHAT; say "true" if $foo;
14:17 pugsbot_r17185 OUTPUT[true␤] Bool::True
14:18 bloonix ?eval my $foo = 1; my $bar = $foo.WHAT; say "true" if $bar;
14:18 pugsbot_r17185 undef
14:18 bloonix why that?
14:18 bloonix ?eval my $foo = 1; my $bar = $foo.WHAT; say $bar;
14:18 pugsbot_r17185 OUTPUT[Int␤] Bool::True
14:19 bloonix ?eval my $foo = 1; my $bar = $foo.WHAT; say "true" if ~$bar;
14:19 pugsbot_r17185 OUTPUT[true␤] Bool::True
14:19 bloonix *hmpf*
14:19 moritz_ ?eval my $foo = 1; say $foo.WHAT
14:20 moritz_ #pugs my $foo=1; say $foo.WHAT
14:20 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[Int␤]
14:20 pugsbot_r17185 OUTPUT[Int␤] Bool::True
14:20 moritz_ #pugs my $foo=1; say ?$foo.WHAT
14:20 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[␤]
14:20 bloonix ?eval my $foo = 1; my $bar = $foo.WHAT; if $bar { say "TRUE" } else { say "FALSE" }
14:20 pugsbot_r17185 OUTPUT[FALSE␤] Bool::True
14:21 moritz_ that should be fixed when audreyt merges her MO branch
14:21 moritz_ like so many other things ;)
14:22 bloonix ?eval my $foo = 1; my $bar = $foo.WHAT; if ~$bar { say "TRUE" } else { say "FALSE" }
14:22 pugsbot_r17185 OUTPUT[TRUE␤] Bool::True
14:22 bloonix "if ~$bar" works
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14:42 TimToady Int is a kind of Undef, so it's not clear that it should be true...
14:43 TimToady it's not even defined...
14:44 fglock #kp6 my $foo = 1; my $bar = $foo.WHAT; if $bar { say "TRUE" } else { say "FALSE" }
14:44 exp_evalbot r17516: OUTPUT[FALSE␤]
14:46 stevan_ joined #perl6
14:46 moritz_ #pugs 1.WHAT.WHAT
14:46 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[::Int␤]
14:46 moritz_ #pugs (1.WHAT).WHAT
14:46 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[::Int␤]
14:47 fglock #kp6 (1.WHAT).WHAT
14:47 exp_evalbot r17516: OUTPUT[␤]
14:47 moritz_ I expected something like Type
14:47 fglock #kp6 say (1.WHAT).WHAT
14:47 exp_evalbot r17516: OUTPUT[Int␤]
14:47 fglock it only prints if stringified
14:48 moritz_ #kp6 say (1.WHAT).perl
14:48 exp_evalbot r17516: OUTPUT[Str␤]
14:48 moritz_ #kp6 say ((1.WHAT).WHAT).perl
14:48 exp_evalbot r17516: OUTPUT[Str␤]
14:48 TimToady no, the protoobject is the exact same type as the real object, except undefined
14:48 TimToady so .WHAT is the identity operation on a protoobject
14:49 moritz_ ok
14:49 TimToady .HOW is the metaobject
14:49 TimToady ?eval 1.HOW
14:49 pugsbot_r17185 ^Int
14:49 TimToady note the ^
14:49 moritz_ and .WHY is 42 ;)
14:49 DarkWolf84 ?eval "hello".HOW.Methods
14:49 TimToady ?eval 1.WHY
14:50 pugsbot_r17185 Error: No such subroutine: "&Methods"
14:50 pugsbot_r17185 Error: No such method in class Int: "&WHY"
14:50 TimToady should probably return "Why not?"
14:50 DarkWolf84 :)
14:50 moritz_ or some documentation
14:50 DarkWolf84 or just 42
14:50 DarkWolf84 :)
14:50 fglock #kp6 say (1.HOW).methods
14:50 exp_evalbot r17516: OUTPUT[perl str true HOW WHAT␤]
14:51 moritz_ #pugs say 1.HOW.methods
14:51 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[["LIST","ITEM","bless"]␤]
14:51 DarkWolf84 #kp6 ("hello".HOW).methods
14:51 exp_evalbot r17516: OUTPUT[[ 'perl', 'str', 'true', 'HOW', 'WHAT',  ]␤]
14:52 DarkWolf84 ?eval ("hello".HOW).methods
14:52 pugsbot_r17185 ["reverse","chop","index","quotemeta","join","chars","bytes","split","LIST","ITEM","bless"]
14:52 TimToady ?eval "hello".^methods
14:52 pugsbot_r17185 ["reverse","chop","index","quotemeta","join","chars","bytes","split","LIST","ITEM","bless"]
14:52 DarkWolf84 :)
14:53 DarkWolf84 thanks
14:53 DarkWolf84 my version of pugs had problem last time I checked
14:53 DarkWolf84 in .HOW.methods
14:58 fglock ? eval [1,"2",3].>>.^HOW
14:58 fglock ?eval [1,"2",3].>>.^HOW
14:59 pugsbot_r17185 Error: ␤Unexpected "^"␤expecting ".", "=", operator name, qualified identifier, variable name, "...", "--", "++", "i", array subscript, hash subscript or code subscript
14:59 bloonix hmmm I wrote a very little dumper that could help me a bit if I develop. it calls Dumper.pm. is it okay to upload to the repos?
14:59 bloonix it
15:00 moritz_ of course
15:01 DarkWolf84 I really have to learn the grammar
15:01 pasteling "bloonix" at 87.230.108.20 pasted "module Dumper-0001; use v6-alp" (105 lines, 1.8K) at http://sial.org/pbot/27200
15:01 bloonix very simple. but enough for me first
15:02 moritz_ bloonix: $foo.WHAT eq "Array" should be replaced with $foo ~~ Array
15:03 moritz_ bloonix: because it takes inheritance into account
15:04 bloonix okay
15:04 bloonix done
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15:12 cj morning folks
15:13 moritz_ hi cj ;)
15:15 pugs_svnbot r17517 | nothingmuch++ | blah
15:15 pugs_svnbot r17518 | nothingmuch++ | blah
15:15 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17518
15:15 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17518 - Pugs - Trac
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15:36 DarkWolf84 how to set a var in scalar context
15:36 DarkWolf84 ?
15:36 moritz_ DarkWolf84: assign it to a scalar
15:37 moritz_ DarkWolf84: or with ~, +, ? in string, numeric or boolean context
15:37 DarkWolf84 ?eval scalar time
15:37 pugsbot_r17185 Error: No such subroutine: "&scalar"
15:37 moritz_ ?eval item time
15:37 pugsbot_r17185 120901733228183/500000
15:37 moritz_ #pugs say +time
15:37 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[241803470.353283␤]
15:38 moritz_ item() seems to work, as well as + for numerical context
15:38 moritz_ #pugs say ~time
15:38 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[241803498.519021␤]
15:38 DarkWolf84 ?eval @foo=time
15:38 pugsbot_r17185 Error: ␤Unexpected "="␤expecting "::"␤Variable "@foo" requires predeclaration or explicit package name
15:39 DarkWolf84 ?eval my @foo=time
15:39 pugsbot_r17185 [241803554019773/1000000,]
15:39 DarkWolf84 hm
15:39 DarkWolf84 the same
15:39 moritz_ #pugs say time.perl
15:39 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[120901784716771/500000␤]
15:39 moritz_ #pugs say &time.perl
15:39 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[\:() {}{Prim ([Pugs.AST.Internals.Val] -> Pugs.AST.Eval.Eval Pugs.AST.Internals.Val)}␤]
15:39 DarkWolf84 the magic localtime(time) not work
15:40 DarkWolf84 :)
15:40 DarkWolf84 :(
15:40 DarkWolf84 ?eval localtime(time)
15:40 pugsbot_r17185 \Time::Local.new(("day" => 30), ("hour" => 17), ("is_dst" => Bool::True), ("min" => 40), ("month" => 8), ("picosec" => 0), ("sec" => 37), ("tz" => 7200), ("tzname" => "CEST"), ("wday" => 5), ("yday" => 241), ("year" => 2007))
15:40 DarkWolf84 yes
15:40 DarkWolf84 works
15:41 DarkWolf84 mine vesion just prints {obj:Time::Local}
15:42 moritz_ #pugs print localtime(time)
15:42 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[<obj:Time::Local>]
15:42 moritz_ DarkWolf84: because you don't say .perl
15:42 moritz_ #pugs print localtime(time).tz
15:42 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[0]
15:42 DarkWolf84 yeah
15:42 DarkWolf84 #pugs localtime(time).month
15:43 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[\8␤]
15:43 fglock moritz_: we added a few possible unsafe operators to kp6 today - what should we do to keep #kp6 safe?
15:43 moritz_ fglock: which op?
15:44 moritz_ fglock: the best would be a --unsafe option that prevents the compilation or execution
15:45 fglock moritz_: i think renormalist didn't upload yet - things like mkdir()
15:45 fglock ok, we could just prevent loading the IO module if --unsafe
15:46 moritz_ fglock: the evalbot runs in a chroot with a user id that has no permissions to write to any important place...
15:46 moritz_ fglock: so it's not too urgent, but it would be a good idea anyway
15:46 fglock ok, good to know :)
15:48 moritz_ perhaps just set a global variable and make IO die() if this is set
15:49 kcwu_ joined #perl6
15:49 pugs_svnbot r17519 | bloonix++ | Added Dumper.pm and fixed a lot of code of Sys::Statistics::Linux*
15:49 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17519
15:49 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17519 - Pugs - Trac
15:50 fglock moritz_: will do
15:50 fglock brb &
15:58 pugs_svnbot r17520 | bloonix++ | add pod to Dumper.pm
15:58 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17520
15:58 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17520 - Pugs - Trac
16:05 bloonix improvements for Dumper.pm are welcome
16:05 [particle1 joined #perl6
16:06 moritz_ I think when pugs' MMD works reliably it you could rename dump() to perl() with an additional argument
16:06 moritz_ so that perl($foo) calls the builtin perl, and perl($foo, :nice) the version newlines
16:12 bloonix ok feierabend :)
16:12 pugs_svnbot r17521 | bloonix++ | Add an example output to SYNOPSIS.
16:12 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17521
16:13 bloonix quitting time
16:15 bloonix it do a little bit more and shows the type of each value
16:16 bloonix does
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17:00 pugs_svnbot r17522 | jnthn++ | [mp6] Dummy main sub and class variables sub should be :anon.
17:00 pugs_svnbot r17523 | moritz++ | perl6.vim: rounding up is 'ceil', not 'ceiling'
17:00 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17523
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17:06 moritz_ 3D3
17:07 moritz_ damn keyboard
17:08 Psyche^ joined #perl6
17:32 obra hey folks
17:34 moritz_ hey obra ;)
17:34 moritz_ there's something I wanted to ask you, but I forgot it :(
17:49 obra aw
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18:00 moritz_ #pugs for "foo" ~~ m/./ -> $match { say $match.from }
18:00 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[undef␤]
18:00 moritz_ #pugs for "foo" ~~ m/./ -> $match { say $match }
18:00 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[undef␤]
18:00 moritz_ #pugs for "foo" ~~ m/./g -> $match { say $match }
18:00 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[*** ␤    Unexpected "g"␤    expecting term postfix, operator or block construct␤    at /tmp/Ib4Zl09uqm line 1, column 18␤]
18:00 moritz_ #pugs for "foo" ~~ m:g/./ -> $match { say $match }
18:00 exp_evalbot OUTPUT[*** Cannot parse regex: .␤*** Error: ␤]
18:03 moritz_ #kp6 "foo" ~~ m/./
18:03 exp_evalbot r17523: OUTPUT[Syntax Error␤DISPATCH: calling APPLY on invalid object:$VAR1 = {};␤␤ at lib5/KindaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 31␤  main::DISPATCH('undef', 'APPLY') called at - line 15␤]
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19:43 Blwood moritz_, how can I write tests ? I mean, I have to follow the synopsis or there's a list of tests that need to be written ?
19:51 moritz_ Blwood: in the synposis as http://perlcabal.org/syn/ there are "smartlinks" from the tests, ie you see for which parts of the synopsis there are tests already...
19:51 lambdabot Title: Official Perl 6 Documentation
19:51 moritz_ Blwood: so you can go through the synopsis, you'll find sections without these smartlinks - then you know where more tests are needed
19:51 [particle] is there a utility to figure out which tests don't have smartlinks?
19:51 Blwood okay :)
19:52 Blwood oh yeah it would be nice :)
19:52 moritz_ [particle]: probably not.. .but you could combine find(1) and util/smartlinks.pl
19:55 [particle] paste?
19:56 moritz_ I thought of something like find t/ -name '*.t' -exec perl  util/smartlinks.pl --check {} \;
19:56 moritz_ but it seems too slow
19:57 pasteling "[particle]" at 24.22.165.145 pasted "ack -L "L\<.*\>" t -- test files without smartlinks" (442 lines, 14.6K) at http://sial.org/pbot/27203
19:57 thoughtpolice joined #perl6
19:57 [particle] it's a first pass--not entirely accurate, but it's a start :)
19:58 moritz_ it is indeed
19:58 moritz_ [particle]++
19:58 kjwcode joined #perl6
19:58 [particle] ack++
19:59 moritz_ what's ack?
20:00 moritz_ I'd do that with grep
20:00 [particle] cpan App::Ack
20:00 buubot [particle]: App::Ack: , by Andy Lester, P/PE/PETDANCE/ack-1.64.tar.gz
20:00 [particle] hrmm, i thought 1.66 was released....
20:01 [particle] ack is a pure-perl better-than-grep
20:01 [particle] parrot developers *love* ack
20:01 moritz_ sometimes I miss perl's look(ahead|behind) assertions in grep
20:01 moritz_ I bet they do
20:02 [particle] ack supports full p5 regexes
20:05 pasteling "moritz_" at 84.148.0.223 pasted "Test files worth looking at" (286 lines, 9.6K) at http://sial.org/pbot/27204
20:07 [particle] should be simple enough to add L<S05> to all of t/regex/ and L<S12> to all of t/oo/
20:08 [particle] eventually, the search can be refined to "L<S\d\d\/.+>" or whatever
20:13 mykhal joined #perl6
20:17 moritz_ I don't get it...
20:17 moritz_ why is # L<S05/Return values from matches/Accessing captured subpatterns> not a valid smartlink=
20:17 moritz_ s/=/?/
20:17 moritz_ ERROR: t/regex/capture_rollback.t: line 9: pattern ``Accessing captured subpatterns'' failed to match any paragraph in L<S05/Return values from matches>.
20:18 moritz_ but there is a paragraph with that title in 'Return values from matches', isn't there?
20:18 moritz_ I always feel dump when I can't get smartlinks working
20:19 rhr does it need quotes?
20:20 moritz_ doesn't help
20:28 kcwu joined #perl6
20:29 pugs_svnbot r17524 | moritz++ | smartlink for t/regex/from_perl6_rules/anchors.t
20:29 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17524
20:29 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17524 - Pugs - Trac
20:35 pugs_svnbot r17525 | moritz++ | smartlink for t/regex/from_perl6_rules/array_cap.t
20:35 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17525
20:35 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17525 - Pugs - Trac
20:35 marmic joined #perl6
20:35 moritz_ assert.t isn't up to date
20:38 kcwu joined #perl6
20:41 pugs_svnbot r17526 | moritz++ | smartlink for t/regex/from_perl6_rules/assert.t
20:41 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17526
20:41 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17526 - Pugs - Trac
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21:16 bloonix damian and domm did arm wrestling?
21:16 bloonix and I wasnt there :/
21:16 TimToady bare chested
21:17 daxim_ joined #perl6
21:18 bloonix okay, I think that scene will be published on youtube :)
21:18 bloonix I will see it :)
21:19 bloonix they did it to "collect gift" for the next yapc?
21:20 TimToady it was one of the "items" that were auctioned off
21:22 bloonix what a pitty that I wasnt there.
21:24 bloonix I would spend a bit as well
21:28 Blwood joined #perl6
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21:41 bloonix hmmm I dont know what is wrong... in downloaded pugs over svn and install it but some modules are not installed
21:44 mugwump left #perl6
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21:45 bloonix *ARG*
21:49 pugs_svnbot r17527 | bloonix++ | Fixed typo Makefile.pl -> Makefile.PL
21:49 pugs_svnbot r17528 | bloonix++ | Fixed typo Makefile.pl -> Makefile.PL
21:49 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/17528
21:49 lambdabot Title: Changeset 17528 - Pugs - Trac
21:58 bloonix good night @all
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22:44 pmurias good evening
22:44 pmurias i'm back home :)
22:47 DarkWolf84 hi
22:47 DarkWolf84 :)
22:47 DarkWolf84 and maybe good night
22:48 pmurias good night
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23:02 meppl good night
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