Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2007-10-01

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

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02:52 adorablepuppy hello
02:54 Tene Hi!
02:57 adorablepuppy I need regex help. :) Though I am currently asking in #regex.
02:58 Tene I can help you with Perl 6 Rules, which are the replacement for regexes.
02:58 adorablepuppy ok
02:59 Tene If you want regex help, though, #regex or #perl are better places.
03:00 adorablepuppy thanks
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04:03 pugs_svnbot r18252 | Darren_Duncan++ | ext/Muldis-DB/ : the Muldis DB API now has users specify the AST language of interaction
04:03 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/18252
04:03 lambdabot Title: Changeset 18252 - Pugs - Trac
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09:47 pugs_svnbot r18253 | Aankhen++ | [kp6-lisp]
09:47 pugs_svnbot r18253 | Aankhen++ | * don't explicitly specify package of MAIN function in generated code.
09:47 pugs_svnbot r18253 | Aankhen++ | * implemented `our` variables.
09:47 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/18253
09:47 lambdabot Title: Changeset 18253 - Pugs - Trac
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09:56 pugs_svnbot r18254 | Aankhen++ | * [kp6-lisp] implemented truth for hashes.
09:56 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/18254
09:56 lambdabot Title: Changeset 18254 - Pugs - Trac
09:59 pugs_svnbot r18255 | Aankhen++ | * [kp6-lisp] more robust (DECLARE (IGNORABLE ...)) handling in WITH-KP6-{PAD,PACKAGE}.
09:59 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/18255
09:59 lambdabot Title: Changeset 18255 - Pugs - Trac
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11:57 fglock I was reading about efficient threads, and I thought how about using BerkeleyDB (and C) as a backend
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12:20 avar Aankhen``: boo
12:20 avar fglock: why use bdb for threads?
12:26 Aankhen`` avar: Eek.
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12:37 avar echo '%hash.elems' | perl kp6-mp6-perl5.pl --lisp
12:37 avar I guess that's object methods for ya:)
12:37 Aankhen`` Indeed.
12:38 Aankhen`` I'm working on signatures right now.
12:38 Aankhen`` Then I'll turn to subs.
12:38 avar :)
12:39 Aankhen`` Why did the metamodel-in-Perl 6 die out?
12:39 * Aankhen`` wanders off for a while.
12:40 allbery_b andrea vanished
12:40 allbery_b er, audrey.  /me thwaps brain
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12:49 Aankhen`` allbery_b: Ah, I didn't realize audrey was also working on it. Looks like you're not the only one whose brain is malfunctioning. ;-)
12:49 * allbery_b just isn't fully awake yet
12:50 avar also? who else?
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12:56 fglock avar: re bdb, because it seems to do it right
13:02 fglock or maybe not - http://www.oracle.com/technology/document​ation/berkeley-db/db/ref/program/mt.html
13:02 lambdabot Title: Berkeley DB Reference Guide: Multithreaded applications, http://tinyurl.com/2ekxq3
13:03 allbery_b bdb seems to crap itself a lot, in my experience
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13:20 * fglock goes read about erlang again
13:23 Juerd http://lwn.net/Articles/252073/
13:23 lambdabot Title: To Sir, with Love: How To Get More Women Involved in Open Source (O'ReillyNet) [ ...
13:24 Juerd Oh my...
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13:38 avar fglock: What does bdb have to do with /threads/?
13:38 avar Use it to store something related to them
13:38 avar ?
13:38 allbery_b several packages use bdb's locking specifically for thread synchronization, ignoring the actual database foo
13:39 fglock avar: I don't know yet, I'm reading about it
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13:41 fglock i'm not particularly interested on bdb, just fast threads
13:43 ferreira hi folks! I invite you to take a look at the next article on Perl 6 operators: http://feather.perl6.nl/~ferreir​a/perl6-operators/compare2.html
13:43 lambdabot Title: compare2.pod6
13:48 fglock ferreira: @values.sort( { $^b cmp $^a } )  # don't need the arrow
13:49 fglock @values.sort: { $^b cmp $^a }   # don't need paren
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13:57 ferreira fglock: ok. This is much prettier ;-) That means placeholders are not only for -> { } things ?
13:57 rhr in fact I think placeholder vars are illegal in pointy blocks by S06:1402
13:57 ferreira oops
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13:59 Gothmog_ But you could write -> $a, $b { $b cmp $a } iirc
13:59 Gothmog_ That of course isn't as nice as { $^b cmp $^a }. :)
13:59 ferreira now fixed.
13:59 rhr TimToady: should S04:293 have the -> removed because of the $^thing ?
14:00 ferreira Gothmog_: that's exactly what I thought ;-)
14:00 Juerd ferreira: Comments like "0 before 1" are vague. Do they describe the code? the return value?
14:02 ferreira hum, not really, I just thought of that as anterior to introducing Order::Increase, etc.
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14:04 masak ferreira: nice article
14:04 ferreira maybe some extra words would convey the intented meaning, without having to repeat Order::Increase, ::Same, ::Decrease thrice. What do you think of "answers 0 before 1" instead of just "0 before 1" and so on?
14:04 ferreira masak: thanks, you're very kind
14:05 masak in a real-life app, @values.sort: { $^b cmp $^a } should probably be just @values.sort.reverse or similar, because of higher readability
14:05 masak but as a proof-of-concept, your example code is just fine
14:06 Juerd ferreira: Operators don't "answer"... They return or evaluate. A full sentence may be in order if you want to avoid the classes
14:10 ferreira masak: got that. I prefered the redundancy that causes 'cmp' to be used. The last example as well would be better written with KeyExtractor's, but I don't even know how to write them, but I think it would be something like:
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14:11 ferreira @values.sort: ( { $^h<name> }, {$^h<id> } )    but that would be too much (I mean, explaining all these in a light article on <=>, leg and cmp)
14:11 lambdabot Unknown command, try @list
14:17 Juerd ferreira: Maybe "returns that 0 is before 1"
14:18 Juerd ferreira: Maybe explain cmp more, like that it does numbers, strings, and objects
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14:22 pmurias hi
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15:06 fglock pmurias: hi
15:09 avar fglock: isn't there some abstraction for {_value}->{_array} and {_hash} in the p5 runtime?
15:09 fglock avar: not sure what you mean, that's the low-level representation
15:11 avar just wondering why it wasn't say ::DISPATCH($foo, "array")
15:11 avar Just wondering how best to implement stuff like ' ( @{ ' ~ $cond.emit_perl5 ~ '->{_value}{_array} } )' in CL
15:11 pmurias avar you want to get to p5landish value
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15:12 fglock ::DISPATCH($foo, "array") works, but it returns an Array object; you need {_array}  (or p5landish) to get to the p5 data
15:12 pmurias i get it its perl->cl
15:13 pmurias fglock: what tests are supposed to fail?
15:14 avar so stuff like ' ( ' ( @{ ' ~ $cond.emit_perl5 ~ '->{_value}{_array} } )'@{ ' ~ $cond.emit_perl5 ~ '->{_value}{_array} } )' can be abstracted but the EmitPerl5 emitter is just peeking at internals since it's old code?:)
15:14 fglock avar: maybe, can you get an iterator object from lisp Array
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15:15 fglock i think 'for' will end up being implemented as a method on Array/List/Range
15:15 fglock pmurias: re tests - none :)
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16:12 Aankhen`` fglock: No iterators in CL, AFAIK.
16:13 avar no, but you can roll your own in any language
16:13 Aankhen`` Sure,
16:13 Aankhen`` s/,/./
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17:06 pinskian xml is arghhh
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17:09 pmurias pinskian: Captures are a sort of xml
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17:13 pinskian i want to put digital sig of a file inside xml file, a field will be file name, another will be file signature (for example)
17:13 pinskian how i do not know of
17:15 pmurias <file sig="" filename=""/>
17:15 pmurias what's the problem?
17:16 pinskian BUT
17:16 pinskian newline-free text string
17:16 pmurias pinskian: it it ASCII?
17:16 pinskian no
17:17 pmurias uuencode it
17:17 pmurias or base64 it
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17:18 pinskian exactly base 64 encoding
17:18 pinskian thought xml supported newline
17:19 pmurias "exactly base 64 encoding" means?
17:19 pinskian there is no work aorund than having to base64 encode t
17:19 pinskian it
17:20 pinskian like within xml it self a newline-free txt string
17:27 * Aankhen`` didn't understand the problem.
17:28 pmurias how to store binary data in a xml file
17:28 Aankhen`` Why use XML for binary data?
17:28 Aankhen`` (ignoring "why use XML at all?" for now.)
17:29 Aankhen`` /\(i/(I/
17:29 Aankhen`` s/^/s/, too. :-P
17:29 pmurias the binary data is a checksum
17:29 Aankhen`` Ah.
17:29 pmurias a digital signature
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17:35 pmurias a script to check in which of the last revision in kp6 a test work would be helpfull
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17:37 pmurias * revisions,worked
17:37 pugs_svnbot r18256 | pmurias++ | [kp6] Match isa Capture
17:37 pugs_svnbot diff: http://dev.pugscode.org/changeset/18256
17:38 lambdabot Title: Changeset 18256 - Pugs - Trac
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17:39 * pmurias hates typoes
17:40 pmurias fglock: test 50 fails
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17:43 fglock pmurias: looking
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17:44 ludan hi
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17:52 fglock home &
17:57 fglock /home - not yet
17:57 fglock pmurias: it's broken for some time
17:57 fglock now home &
18:03 pmurias fglock: autothreading on method calls broke it
18:04 pmurias the $.type should be specified in the constructor rather the by calling an attribiute
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18:11 TimToady fglock: fwiw the semantics of for are currently defined to be equivalent to map.
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23:01 ludan goodnight
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Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo