Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2008-06-25

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:18 diakopter yap6 is no longer a mere lexer/tokenizer that also syntax checks.  Now it's a lexer/parser/scanner that syntax checks.
00:18 pugs_svnbot r21003 | diakopter++ | [yap6]
00:18 pugs_svnbot r21003 | diakopter++ | * yap6 now generates (and outputs only) the match tree
00:19 diakopter evalbot control svnup
00:20 * diakopter taps his fingers
00:24 pugs_svnbot r21004 | diakopter++ | [yap6] braino..
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00:28 diakopter yap6: say $a;
00:28 p6eval yap6 r21004 OUTPUT[tree: {program => [{func_call => ["say"," ",{expr => {sVari => ["\$",{id => "a"}]}}]},";"]}␤]
00:28 pugs_svnbot r21005 | diakopter++ | [yap6] cleanup of both()
00:28 Auzon diakopter: I'd kinda like to make it possible for evalbot to control that.
00:29 diakopter evalbot control svnup parrot
00:29 diakopter evalbot control svnup pugscode
00:29 diakopter evalbot control rebuild parrot
00:31 dolmen perl6: my $a = 1..5; $a.perl.say; say $a.shift; $a.perl.say;
00:31 p6eval kp6 r21005: OUTPUT[syntax error at position 10, line 1 column 10:␤my $a = 1..5; $a.perl.say; say $a.shift; $a.perl.say␤          ^ HERE␤]
00:31 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[[1, 2, 3, 4, 5]␤1␤[2, 3, 4, 5]␤]
00:31 p6eval ..rakudo r28692: OUTPUT[1..5␤1␤2..5␤]
00:31 p6eval ..elf r21005: OUTPUT[Can't call method "shift" without a package or object reference at (eval 117) line 5.␤ at ./elf_f line 3854␤"1E0"␤]
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00:34 dolmen perl6: my $a = 1..1; $a.perl.say; $a.shift.say; $a.perl.say;
00:34 p6eval kp6 r21005: OUTPUT[syntax error at position 10, line 1 column 10:␤my $a = 1..1; $a.perl.say; $a.shift.say; $a.perl.say␤          ^ HERE␤]
00:34 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[[1,]␤1␤[]␤]
00:34 p6eval ..rakudo r28692: OUTPUT[1..1␤1␤2..1␤]
00:34 p6eval ..elf r21005: OUTPUT[Can't call method "shift" without a package or object reference at (eval 115) line 5.␤ at ./elf_f line 3854␤"1E0"␤]
00:34 dolmen perl6: my $a = 1..1; $a.perl.say; $a.shift.say; $a.perl.say; $a.perl.say;
00:34 p6eval kp6 r21005: OUTPUT[syntax error at position 10, line 1 column 10:␤my $a = 1..1; $a.perl.say; $a.shift.say; $a.perl.say; $a.perl.say␤          ^ HERE␤]
00:34 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[[1,]␤1␤[]␤[]␤]
00:34 p6eval ..rakudo r28692: OUTPUT[1..1␤1␤2..1␤2..1␤]
00:34 p6eval ..elf r21005: OUTPUT[Can't call method "shift" without a package or object reference at (eval 115) line 5.␤ at ./elf_f line 3854␤"1E0"␤]
00:34 diakopter what did rakudo do with [1..1].shift ?
00:35 dolmen [1..1] is not (1..1)
00:35 dolmen rakudo: (1..1).WHAT.say
00:35 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Range␤]
00:36 dolmen rakudo: [1..1].WHAT.say
00:36 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Array␤]
00:37 diakopter rakudo: my $a = 1..1; $a.shift; say $a.perl
00:37 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[2..1␤]
00:38 diakopter I don't understand that
00:39 dolmen what is the process to submit test cases por Perl6?
00:39 bacek_ diakopter: bug in range.
00:39 diakopter dolmen: you get a commit bit, and add 'em
00:39 bacek_ (is was about [2..1]
00:40 dolmen not a bug
00:40 diakopter dolmen: do you already have subversion commit access to pugs (where the tests are)?
00:40 dolmen not yet
00:40 diakopter msg me your email address and desired username and I'll add you
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00:58 pugs_svnbot r21006 | lwall++ | [STD] revisions to endstmt memoization
00:58 pugs_svnbot r21006 | lwall++ | faststopper is now gone
00:58 pugs_svnbot r21006 | lwall++ | statement parsing is a bit simpler
00:58 pugs_svnbot r21006 | lwall++ | various other buglets fixed
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01:21 dolmen can I create spec/S29-range/ ?
01:22 * dolmen is a new commiter on Pugs...
01:22 diakopter commit first; ask questions later
01:22 diakopter Auzon: you around to elaborate/specify?
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01:25 diakopter <sigh> netsplits.
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01:39 dolmen how can test a new test with rakudo?
01:39 dolmen I don't want to run the full spectest
01:40 bacek_ dolmen: create t/localtest.data and run make localtest
01:40 bacek_ format for file is same as t/spectest_regression.data
01:41 Auzon diakopter: ping
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01:41 diakopter Auzon: gnop
01:42 Auzon What did you want me to elaborate on?
01:43 diakopter about dolmen's question about spec/S29-range
01:44 Auzon Sure, it fits well
01:44 diakopter there were so many netsplits; who knows who got which messages
01:45 Auzon I thought you were asking about evalbot or something
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02:13 pugs_svnbot r21007 | dolmen++ | First commit.
02:13 pugs_svnbot r21007 | dolmen++ | A few simple Range tests.
02:18 diakopter dolmen: also, add yourself to AUTHORS
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02:30 Auzon whois moritz_
02:32 Auzon moritz_: I was thinking for evalbot that we could combine all the exec_whatever subs, and just pass them the command to execute. We can also get rid of the filtering code so that it just trims by length (which I think I have just under one message).
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03:17 buu Auzon: Sounds complicated.
03:18 Auzon buu: the evalbot stuff? It'll have to be careful where we decide to do things, but it'll reduce the amount of things needed for a new implementation down to one line or so.
03:19 pugs_svnbot r21008 | audreyt++ | * INSTALL: Document the "cabal install Pugs -fOptimize" flag.
03:19 pugs_svnbot r21008 | audreyt++ |   As of Pugs-6.2.13.4, "pugs -e1" time is much shorter than
03:19 pugs_svnbot r21008 | audreyt++ |   before (<0.3s user time), thanks to a new Prelude compilation
03:19 pugs_svnbot r21008 | audreyt++ |   technique using Data.Binary instead of Data.Yaml.Syck.
03:19 buu Auzon: You should look at mine =]
03:19 Auzon buu: Where is it?
03:19 buu buubot: hi
03:19 buubot buu: leave me the fuck alone
03:19 buu =[
03:20 Auzon That'd be a lot simpler to implement :P
03:20 buu eval: 2+2
03:20 buu Oh
03:20 buu buubot: eval: 2+2
03:20 buubot buu:  4
03:21 Auzon I've seen your bot used occasionally... but p6eval is more complicated due to the need to support multiple Perl 6 implementations
03:21 buu How do you access each perl6 implementation?
03:21 Auzon rakudo: say "hi"
03:22 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[hi␤]
03:22 buu I mean programatically.
03:22 Auzon p6eval: help
03:22 p6eval Auzon: Usage: <(nqp|perl6|pugs|pixie|elf|rakudo|yap6|kp6): $perl6_program>
03:22 bacek_ pixie?
03:22 Auzon bacek: Elf variant based on STD
03:24 Auzon buu: code is separated into two parts, the main bot and the executer. The Executer handles the forking and such. The main bot has a dispatch table and a bunch of if statements for each implementation
03:24 buu Auzon: The only real limitation is that bb only talks to thinks that can be embedded in perl.
03:24 pugs_svnbot r21009 | lwall++ | [LazyMap] looping bug in iter()
03:24 pugs_svnbot r21009 | lwall++ | [Cursor5] stop * match when it matches null string
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04:30 Auzon perl6: say Rat ~~ Num
04:31 p6eval kp6 r21009: OUTPUT[no method 'APPLY' in Class 'Undef'␤ at compiled/perl5-kp6-mp6/lib/Ki​ndaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 345␤
04:31 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[1␤]
04:31 p6eval ..rakudo r28692: OUTPUT[0␤]
04:31 p6eval ..elf r21009: OUTPUT[Can't call method "Str" on an undefined value at ./elf_f line 649.␤ at ./elf_f line 3854␤]
04:32 Auzon pugs: 1.1.WHAT
04:32 p6eval RESULT[::Rat]
04:32 Auzon pugs: say 1.1 ~~ Num
04:32 p6eval OUTPUT[1␤]
04:41 Auzon rakudo: sub returntype as Str {'foo'}; say returntype;
04:41 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "{'foo'}; s"␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤
04:41 Auzon rakudo: sub returntype of Str {'foo'}; say returntype;
04:41 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[foo␤]
04:41 Auzon rakudo: Str sub returntype {'foo'}; say returntype;
04:41 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "sub return"␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤
04:42 Auzon rakudo: my Str sub returntype {'foo'}; say returntype;
04:42 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Null PMC access in type()␤current instr.: 'parrot;Perl6;Grammar;Actions;scoped' pc 110447 (src/gen_actions.pir:6647)␤
04:42 Auzon rakudo: sub returntype (--> Str) {'foo'}; say returntype;
04:42 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Statement not terminated properly at line 1, near "(--> Str) "␤current instr.: 'parrot;PGE::Util;die' pc 120 (runtime/parrot/library/PGE/Util.pir:82)␤
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05:03 pugs_svnbot r21010 | Auzon++ | [gsoc_spectest] S02: Added some parameter type and return type tests (added 12 tests)
05:03 Auzon This may not be 100%, but it's a good start. self.sleep;
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07:10 pugs_svnbot r21011 | moritz++ | [spec] added Ovid++'s type check regressioin test
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07:18 pugs_svnbot r21012 | moritz++ | fixed intendation and curlies in type.t
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07:27 pugs_svnbot r21013 | moritz++ | [spec] types.t: more fudging, and rewrote some tests in terms of dies_ok
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07:58 pugs_svnbot r21014 | moritz++ | [spec] started to fudge pair.t - still a long way to go
08:07 pugs_svnbot r21015 | moritz++ | [spec] started to fudge lists.t
08:08 moritz_ fudging is a bit frustrating if rakudo dies unspecifically with "Method 'lvalue' not found for invocant of class 'PAST::Stmts'" or "null PMC access in type()" or some such
08:09 bacek_ moritz_: -G?
08:10 bacek_ even adding new empty lines can help...
08:11 moritz_ bacek_: -G doesn't help for incorrectly generated PAST (and -G isn't well supported in the testing tool chain)
08:12 moritz_ the frustrating thing is that these errors don't map to location in the file
08:12 pugs_svnbot r21016 | moritz++ | [spec] some more fudging of lists.t
08:15 bacek_ moritz_: ho! nice bug.
08:17 moritz_ bacek_: which one? #56330 ?
08:17 bacek_ Method 'lvalue' not found for invocant of class 'PAST::Stmts'
08:17 moritz_ ah, this one
08:18 bacek_ rakudo: my $a=24;my $b=2; ($b,$a) = $(a,$b)
08:18 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Method 'lvalue' not found for invocant of class 'PAST::Stmts'␤current instr.: 'parrot;PAST::Compiler;as_post' pc 2787 (src/PAST/Compiler.pir:718)␤
08:19 moritz_ it never gets around to actually evaluating the RHS
08:20 moritz_ if it would, It would complain about sub a() not being found
08:20 bacek_ rakudo: my $a=24;my $b=2; ($b,$a) = ($a,$b)
08:20 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Method 'lvalue' not found for invocant of class 'PAST::Stmts'␤current instr.: 'parrot;PAST::Compiler;as_post' pc 2787 (src/PAST/Compiler.pir:718)␤
08:21 bacek_ rakudo: my $a;my $b;  my @l=(1..2); ($b,$a) = @l;
08:21 p6eval rakudo r28692 OUTPUT[Method 'lvalue' not found for invocant of class 'PAST::Stmts'␤current instr.: 'parrot;PAST::Compiler;as_post' pc 2787 (src/PAST/Compiler.pir:718)␤
08:21 bacek_ LHS :)
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08:24 pmurias pixie: say "hello world"
08:24 p6eval OUTPUT[Can't locate STD5.pm in @INC (@INC contains: ../../src/perl6 /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.8.8 /usr/local/share/perl/5.8.8 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.8 /usr/share/perl/5.8 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at pixie line 4.␤BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at pix...
08:27 moritz_ pmurias: chroot not yet updated, it'll take some time :(
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09:07 moritz_ anybody had any success building pugs on debian etch?
09:07 moritz_ s/etc/lenny/
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09:36 * moritz_ notices with pleasure that ghc6's memory usage seems a bit lower than before
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09:52 moritz_ where does 'cabal install Pugs' place the pugs binary?
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10:07 masak and where does it place the source tree?
10:08 moritz_ seems to be all in ~/.cabal/$somewhere
10:14 masak hm, yes
10:14 masak but I don't find pugs there
10:14 masak what's pugs-DrIFT?
10:14 moritz_ ~/.cabal/bin/pugs for me
10:15 masak yes, but that's just the binary
10:15 masak what if I want to change something and rebuild?
10:16 moritz_ dunno
10:16 masak being able to do that would be a boon
10:17 moritz_ diakopter: would you be fine with removing the ||| hack from evalbot and instead use two separate targets?
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10:31 pugs_svnbot r21017 | moritz++ | [evalbot] assemble all needed data for different executers in a large hash.
10:31 pugs_svnbot r21017 | moritz++ | Planned steps:
10:31 pugs_svnbot r21017 | moritz++ |  0) move to appropriate package
10:31 pugs_svnbot r21017 | moritz++ |  1) use this data in a single executer sub
10:31 pugs_svnbot r21017 | moritz++ |  2) use it also to assemble output for 'perl6:' evaluation
10:32 pugs_svnbot r21017 | moritz++ |  3) get rid of the exec_$stuff subs
10:32 pugs_svnbot r21017 | moritz++ |  4) clean up sub said()
10:36 moritz_ what svn revision does 6.2.13.1 correspond to?
10:38 audreyt it's all HEAD as there has been no src/ checkins
10:39 audreyt once I've got the new Cabal procedure sorted out (still working with the Cabal team) I'll check it in.
10:39 audreyt but no promises as of when :)
10:43 moritz_ audreyt: sounds great. When you do, could you please notify me? Then I'll update pugs on evalbot's server
10:44 audreyt ok.
10:44 audreyt can you point the binary to it for now?
10:45 moritz_ what do you mean?
10:46 audreyt i.e. use the ~/.cabal/bin/pugs for evalbot's pugs:
10:47 moritz_ (I'm currenlty working on a copy of the chroot in which evalbot runs, and I'm updating that to Debian Lenny + cabal-installed pugs. In this new chroot (not yet in "production) I'll use the ~/.cabal/bin/pugs)
10:48 audreyt thanks!
10:48 moritz_ I don't plan to do touch the pugs in the current chroot because it's too painful, and it'll shortly be substituted anyway
10:48 audreyt k
10:48 audreyt bbiab...
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11:56 pugs_svnbot r21018 | moritz++ | [evalbot] continued refactoring. Be impressed if this works.
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11:56 moritz_ rakudo: say "hi"
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11:58 moritz_ rakudo: say "hi"
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11:59 pugs_svnbot r21019 | moritz++ | [evalbot] fixed first stupid thinko - more to follow
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11:59 moritz_ rakudo: say "hi"
11:59 p6eval rakudo 28692: No output (you need to produce output to STDOUT)
12:02 pugs_svnbot r21020 | moritz++ | [evalbot] also commit changes to the module ... :/
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12:02 moritz_ rakudo: say "hi"
12:02 p6eval rakudo 28692: No output (you need to produce output to STDOUT)
12:03 pugs_svnbot r21021 | moritz++ | [evalbot] confused variables
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12:03 moritz_ sometimes I wish I had a test suite
12:03 moritz_ rakudo: say "hi"
12:03 p6eval rakudo 28692: OUTPUT[hi␤]
12:04 moritz_ pugs: say "hi"
12:04 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[sh: /home/evalenv/.cabal/bin/pugs: No such file or directory␤]
12:04 moritz_ kp6: say("hi")
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12:05 bacek Generating precompiled Prelude, Math::Basic... pugs: Internal error:
12:05 bacek Invalid grammatical category: "Bool"
12:05 bacek Debian/lenny...
12:05 moritz_ bacek: try the 'cabal update; cabal install Pugs -fOptimize' approach described in INSTALL
12:06 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:06 bacek moritz_, thanks
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12:06 bacek cabal: command not found
12:06 moritz_ bacek: "described in INSTALL" ;)
12:06 moritz_ nqp: say("hi")
12:06 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT[hi␤]
12:08 bacek yeah... But what about compiling from sources? :)
12:08 pugs_svnbot r21022 | moritz++ | [evalbot] more confusion
12:08 moritz_ bacek: cabal does compile from source
12:08 p6eval joined #perl6
12:09 moritz_ rakudo: say "hi"
12:09 p6eval rakudo 28692: OUTPUT[hi␤]
12:09 moritz_ rakudo: "hi"
12:09 p6eval rakudo 28692: RESULT["hi"]
12:09 moritz_ rakudo: 1/0
12:09 p6eval rakudo 28692: OUTPUT[Divide by zero␤current instr.: 'infix:/' pc 11355 (src/gen_builtins.pir:7547)␤]
12:09 moritz_ ok, filtering works
12:09 moritz_ nqp: say(1/0)
12:09 p6eval nqp: OUTPUT[float division by zero␤current instr.: '_block11' pc 6 (EVAL_4:6)␤]
12:09 moritz_ same here
12:10 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:10 p6eval joined #perl6
12:13 pugs_svnbot r21023 | moritz++ | [evalbot] it helps to use correct sub names
12:13 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:13 p6eval joined #perl6
12:13 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:13 p6eval elf 21023: OUTPUT[hi␤]
12:18 p6eval joined #perl6
12:18 moritz_ pugs: say "Hi"
12:18 p6eval OUTPUT[./pugs: error while loading shared libraries: libperl.so.5.8: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory␤]
12:19 p6eval joined #perl6
12:20 moritz_ rakudo: say "hi from new chroot"
12:20 p6eval rakudo 28687: OUTPUT[hi from new chroot␤]
12:20 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:20 p6eval elf 21023: OUTPUT[Can't locate autobox.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.10.0 /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.10 /usr/share/perl/5.10 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at ./elf_f line 7.␤BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at ./elf_f
12:20 p6eval ..li...
12:21 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:21 p6eval elf 21023: OUTPUT[Can't locate Class/Multimethods.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.10.0 /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.10 /usr/share/perl/5.10 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at ./elf_f line 10.␤BEGIN failed--compilation aborted
12:21 p6eval ..a...
12:22 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:22 p6eval elf 21023: OUTPUT[/usr/bin/env: ruby: No such file or directory␤Parse failed.␤ at ./elf_f line 3824␤]
12:23 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:23 p6eval elf 21023: OUTPUT[/home/evalenv/pugs/mi​sc/STD_red/prelude.rb:462:in `require': no such file to load -- readline (LoadError)␤     from /home/evalenv/pugs/misc/STD_red/prelude.rb:462:in `<top (required)>'␤       from /home/evalenv/pugs/misc/STD_red/std.rb:10:in `require'␤      from
12:23 p6eval ../home/evalenv/pugs/misc/STD_red/...
12:23 diakopter moritz_: no, not really, b/c I need to be able to add grammars very easily
12:23 FurnaceBoy joined #perl6
12:23 moritz_ diakopter: ok, I'll see what I can do
12:24 diakopter there can't be a special case for yap6 in the command line builder?
12:24 moritz_ elf: say "hi"
12:24 p6eval elf 21023: OUTPUT[hi␤]
12:24 moritz_ yap6: say "hi"
12:24 diakopter hee
12:24 p6eval joined #perl6
12:24 diakopter I still don't know why things like that crash evalbot
12:24 moritz_ Not a HASH reference at evalbot.pl line 103.
12:25 moritz_ that was my fault
12:25 diakopter oh
12:26 moritz_ diakopter: I don't know why evalbot crashes sometimes. Only this case is clear to me ;
12:26 pugs_svnbot r21024 | moritz++ | [evalbot] hopefully yap6 works again
12:26 * diakopter waits 3 minutes
12:26 p6eval joined #perl6
12:26 moritz_ yap6: say "hi"
12:26 p6eval joined #perl6
12:26 diakopter well, it still hasn't learned "
12:27 moritz_ I should actually svn up in the right chroot
12:27 p6eval joined #perl6
12:27 moritz_ yap6: say 1
12:28 p6eval joined #perl6
12:29 pugs_svnbot r21025 | moritz++ | [evalbot] import Scalar::Util into the right namspace
12:30 p6eval joined #perl6
12:30 moritz_ yap6: say 1
12:30 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[tree: {program => [{func_call => ["say"," ",{expr => {bareInt => 1}}]}]}␤]
12:30 moritz_ YaY
12:30 diakopter \o/
12:30 diakopter moritz_: note the actual match tree
12:31 moritz_ diakopter: I did notice it. Cool.
12:31 moritz_ yap6: say 1 ||| 1
12:31 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[Can't locate Perl6in5/Grammar/say.pm in @INC (@INC contains: ../lib lib /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.10.0 /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.10 /usr/share/perl/5.10 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at (eval 1) line 1.␤BEGIN failed--compilat...
12:31 moritz_ what should I do to enable that?
12:31 moritz_ pixie: say "hi"
12:31 diakopter oh; yippee; Perl 5.10
12:31 p6eval pixie: OUTPUT[Can't locate STD5.pm in @INC (@INC contains: ../../src/perl6 /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.10.0 /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.10 /usr/share/perl/5.10 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at pixie line 4.␤BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at...
12:32 diakopter yap6: ltm||| food
12:32 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[syntax error at line 1 col 1 near " food"␤Expected: "unknown".␤[]]
12:32 diakopter yap6: ltm|||food
12:32 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[Odd number of elements in anonymous hash at lib/Perl6in5/Compiler/Parser.pm line 98.␤tree: {program => undef}␤]
12:32 diakopter heh
12:32 diakopter that grammar is broken
12:32 diakopter Grammar/ltm.pm
12:33 diakopter yap6: ltm |||food
12:33 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[Odd number of elements in anonymous hash at lib/Perl6in5/Compiler/Parser.pm line 98.␤tree: {program => undef}␤]
12:33 diakopter yap6: ltm |||foodie
12:33 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[Odd number of elements in anonymous hash at lib/Perl6in5/Compiler/Parser.pm line 98.␤tree: {program => undef}␤]
12:33 diakopter yap6: ltm |||foodies
12:33 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[Odd number of elements in anonymous hash at lib/Perl6in5/Compiler/Parser.pm line 98.␤tree: {program => undef}␤]
12:34 pbuetow joined #perl6
12:34 * moritz_ installs YAML::XS for gimme5
12:34 moritz_ pixie: say "hi"
12:34 p6eval pixie: OUTPUT[Can't create pixie.log: Permission denied at ../../src/perl6/Cursor5.pm line 59.␤BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at ../../src/perl6/Cursor5.pm line 62.␤Compilation failed in require at ../../src/perl6/STD5.pm line 28.␤BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at ../../src/perl6/STD5.pm...
12:34 diakopter yay; with 5.10 I can use lots of neat new re features
12:34 diakopter how convenient
12:34 diakopter ;)
12:35 moritz_ pugs: say "hi"
12:35 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[hi␤]
12:35 diakopter wow; fast
12:35 moritz_ ok, evalbot status summary: everything but pixie: and perl6: works again
12:35 diakopter audreyt++
12:36 diakopter moritz_++
12:36 moritz_ pugs will be updated via 'cabal install' as soon as audreyt++ pushes the new version
12:36 * moritz_ will ask pmurias if can add a --nolog option, I don't want to allow write access for evalbot
12:37 moritz_ perl6: should be a smop
12:39 diakopter moritz_: oh, I thought you meant implementing Perl 6 for a minute there.
12:40 moritz_ lol
12:40 moritz_ well, if you believe ruoso++ it is a smop ;)
12:40 pugs_svnbot r21026 | moritz++ | [evalbot] re-added perl6: target
12:40 moritz_ evalbot control restart
12:41 p6eval joined #perl6
12:41 moritz_ perl6: say "hi again"
12:41 p6eval elf: RESULT[{}␤]
12:42 diakopter yap6: today I work on your opep (operator precedence expression parser)
12:42 pugs_svnbot r21027 | moritz++ | [evalbot] fixed previous commit
12:43 p6eval joined #perl6
12:43 moritz_ diakopter: sorry, just killed p6eval the second you said that ;)
12:43 moritz_ perl6: say "hi"
12:43 p6eval elf 21027: RESULT[{}␤]kp6 21027: RESULT[DISPATCH: calling  on invalid object:$VAR1 = 'perl';␤␤ at compiled/perl5-kp6-mp6/lib/Ki​ndaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 128␤        main::DISPATCH('perl') called at - line 11␤]pugs: RESULT[undef]rakudo 28687: RESULT[Null PMC access in find_method()␤current
12:43 p6eval ..instr.: '_block11' pc 38 (EVAL_13:18)␤]
12:44 diakopter wow
12:44 moritz_ or in other words, I screwed up
12:46 p6eval joined #perl6
12:46 moritz_ elf: say 1
12:46 p6eval elf 21027: OUTPUT[1␤]
12:46 moritz_ perl6: say 1
12:47 p6eval elf 21027: RESULT[{}␤]
12:47 p6eval ..kp6 21027: RESULT[DISPATCH: calling  on invalid object:$VAR1 = 'perl';␤␤ at compiled/perl5-kp6-mp6/lib/Ki​ndaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 128␤    main::DISPATCH('perl') called at - line 11␤]
12:47 p6eval ..pugs: RESULT[undef]
12:47 p6eval ..rakudo 28687: RESULT[Null PMC access in find_method()␤current instr.: '_block11' pc 38 (EVAL_13:18)␤]
12:48 cmarcelo joined #perl6
12:48 moritz_ it seems to pass an empty (?) string to each implementation
12:49 pugs_svnbot r21028 | moritz++ | [evalbot] more debugging aids
12:49 Lunchy joined #perl6
12:49 moritz_ perl6: say 1;
12:50 p6eval joined #perl6
12:50 moritz_ perl6: say 1;
12:50 p6eval elf 21028: RESULT[{}␤]
12:50 p6eval ..kp6 21028: RESULT[DISPATCH: calling  on invalid object:$VAR1 = 'perl';␤␤ at compiled/perl5-kp6-mp6/lib/Ki​ndaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 128␤    main::DISPATCH('perl') called at - line 11␤]
12:50 p6eval ..pugs: RESULT[undef]
12:50 p6eval ..rakudo 28687: RESULT[Null PMC access in find_method()␤current instr.: '_block11' pc 38 (EVAL_13:18)␤]
12:51 pugs_svnbot r21029 | moritz++ | [evalbot] hopefully passing the right program now
12:51 p6eval joined #perl6
12:51 moritz_ perl6: say 1;
12:51 p6eval elf 21029: OUTPUT[1␤]
12:51 p6eval ..kp6 21029: OUTPUT[1␤]
12:51 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[1␤]
12:51 p6eval ..rakudo 28687: OUTPUT[1␤]
12:51 moritz_ YaY
12:54 p6eval joined #perl6
12:54 pugs_svnbot r21030 | moritz++ | [evalbot]: cosmetic changes
12:55 moritz_ ok, enough evilbot changes today, gotta do something productive
12:57 drbean /lastlog altgr
13:06 alester joined #perl6
13:19 DietCoke left #perl6
13:25 diakopter now this is just weird
13:28 pmurias joined #perl6
13:30 diakopter or perhaps I'll put off the opep and instead create the handler model
13:31 * diakopter goes back to reading Engineering a Compiler
13:31 pmurias moritz_: i could change the Cursor5 not to insist on a log
13:31 pmurias diakopter: hi
13:31 diakopter pmurias: yo
13:31 moritz_ pmurias: that would be nice
13:31 diakopter pmurias: yap6 makes match trees now
13:32 pmurias good
13:33 diakopter now if only strawberry 5.10 gave the same results as 5.10 on my mac and the 5.10 used by p6eval.
13:33 diakopter oddness
13:33 diakopter svn status on the strawberry one shows nothing modified
13:33 diakopter oddities ** of
13:35 diakopter so I read the language spec for reia (reia-lang.org) - it seems to have a very similar smart match as well as capture-ish constructs.
13:37 zeno__ joined #perl6
13:37 zeno__ > reverse . show $ foldl1 (*)
13:38 pmurias diakopter: re 5.10 , debian is easy to use so it wouldn't be hard to for you to get the exactlly the same perl
13:38 pmurias ;)
13:38 diakopter but is debian easy to use on a windows machine that doesn't allow vmware
13:39 zeno__ odd ubuntu doesnt have a pugs package
13:39 diakopter <sigh> I guess I'll build 5.10 on my linux vps.
13:40 diakopter oh yeah, I forgot; I can use winscp to make editing easy.
13:41 rdice joined #perl6
13:45 pmurias diakopter: the match trees aren't really matches
13:45 jhorwitz joined #perl6
13:46 pmurias s/matches/Matches
13:47 TJCRI joined #perl6
13:49 pmurias moritz_: you could symlink pixie.log to /dev/null
13:49 moritz_ pixie: say "hi"
13:49 p6eval pixie: OUTPUT[Can't locate re/engine/TRE.pm in @INC (@INC contains: ../../src/perl6 /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.10.0 /usr/local/share/perl/5.10.0 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.10 /usr/share/perl/5.10 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at ../../src/perl6/Cursor5.pm line 428.␤BEGI...
13:49 moritz_ pmurias: ah, different error now (ln -s was a good idea)
13:50 diakopter pmurias: :P what else do they need to be matches?
13:50 pmurias .from .to
13:50 moritz_ I think they are not the standard perl6 match objects
13:51 moritz_ but they're nice and compact for IRC output ;)
13:51 diakopter ok; .from and .to are easy... what else
13:51 zeno__ joined #perl6
13:51 moritz_ pixie: say 1
13:51 p6eval pixie: OUTPUT[Subroutine from redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 741.␤Subroutine to redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 742.␤mkdir lex: Permission denied at ../../src/perl6/Cursor5.pm line 246␤]
13:51 BinGOs joined #perl6
13:51 moritz_ oh dammit
13:51 pmurias moritz_: getting rid of lex would be hard
13:51 moritz_ I suppose, yes
13:52 pmurias diakopter: you have read the Match object section of S05?
13:52 ispy_ joined #perl6
13:52 moritz_ pmurias: is a writable lex/ subdir somewher enough?
13:52 diakopter yes, at some point.  I can hardly claim to remember it.
13:52 moritz_ and if yes, where
13:52 pmurias moritz_: yes
13:52 moritz_ in src/perl6/ ?
13:53 pmurias moritz_: in misc/pixie
13:53 diakopter pmurias: the Match objects at http://www.perlcabal.org/s​yn/S05.html#Match_objects won't be useful for yap6 for a long time..
13:54 moritz_ pixie: say 1
13:54 p6eval pixie: OUTPUT[Subroutine from redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 741.␤Subroutine to redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 742.␤cp: cannot stat `lex/Perl/expect_term': No such file or directory␤]
13:54 moritz_ sh: line 1: 32051 File size limit exceeded/usr/bin/perl pixie --quiet /tmp/0ATKHStvSX >> /tmp/kXvEdKlcHt 2>&1
13:54 moritz_ how much space does it need?
13:55 pmurias ~2.0M
13:55 diakopter .from .to .chars .orig .text (their equivalents actually) are all available *while* yap6 is running, so they're there.  but the default output doesn't include that info
13:56 diakopter but my main point is that since yap6 is not written in Perl 6, it doesn't need to use Match object semantics internally.
13:56 diakopter and especially since it doesn't use STD.pm to generate its parsers...
13:56 diakopter the match objects wouldn't be useful to any other implementation.
13:58 pugs_svnbot r21031 | moritz++ | [evalbot] bump up size limit for temp files to 5MB
13:59 p6eval joined #perl6
13:59 pugs_svnbot r21032 | moritz++ | forgot semicolon
13:59 diakopter pmurias: also, if yap6 continues to progress, it will follow the steps documented in ROADMAP
13:59 moritz_ pixie: say 1
13:59 p6eval pixie: OUTPUT[Subroutine from redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 741.␤Subroutine to redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 742.␤cp: cannot stat `lex/Perl/expect_term': No such file or directory␤1␤]
14:00 moritz_ pmurias: do I have to clean up old lex/ dir?
14:01 moritz_ pixie: say 1
14:01 p6eval pixie: OUTPUT[Subroutine from redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 741.␤Subroutine to redefined at ElfCore5.pm line 742.␤cp: cannot stat `lex/Perl/expect_term': No such file or directory␤1␤]
14:04 pmurias food&
14:04 zeno__ left #perl6
14:04 pugs_svnbot r21033 | diakopter++ | [yap6] document unreadines of Makefile.PL
14:07 pugs_svnbot r21034 | diakopter++ | [yap6]
14:07 pugs_svnbot r21034 | diakopter++ | updated README
14:08 ggoebel joined #perl6
14:17 Jedai joined #perl6
14:26 diakopter yap6: package Foo; say 3;
14:26 p6eval yap6: OUTPUT[Syntax error in /tmp/VpRDwBWUCu at line 1 col 8 : Input file is Perl 5, not Perl 6!␤]
14:36 edpratomo joined #perl6
15:00 zostay joined #perl6
15:03 moritz_ how should isa_ok been called? isa_ok($obj, Type) or isa_ok($obj, 'Type')?
15:06 rakudo_svn r28694 | moritz++ | [rakudo] Test.pm: added three-arg form of isa_ok()
15:06 diakopter anyone seen this?  http://www.chrisseaton.com/katahdin/
15:08 ludan joined #perl6
15:11 pugs_svnbot r21035 | moritz++ | [spec] fixed nested_pairs.t - ready for spectest_regression
15:14 diakopter aha.  stealing the precedence generator from Katahdin...
15:15 moritz_ diakopter: yes, I saw it. And he's doing it (the parsing) wrong
15:15 pugs_svnbot r21036 | moritz++ | [spec] fudged array_extending.t
15:15 diakopter moritz_: wrong how?
15:16 moritz_ diakopter: he's basically doing precedence parsing with backtracking
15:16 diakopter and that's wrong?
15:16 moritz_ I read one of his papers from front to back, and he has ridicoulusly high startup times (20s or a minute or so)
15:16 moritz_ diakopter: that's very inefficient
15:17 moritz_ diakopter: that's O(2^n) in the worst case, where you can have polynomial time
15:17 moritz_ open that paper, search for his discussion on speed
15:18 diakopter his thesis is pretty short
15:18 moritz_ man, he even JIT'ed the parser to make it faster
15:19 jfredett_ joined #perl6
15:20 diakopter oh; his alternation does longest-match
15:26 Limbic_Region joined #perl6
15:28 alanhaggai joined #perl6
15:28 diakopter moritz_: this is interesting; yap6 does an analogous JIT... parser objects/rules/patterns aren't built until they are used the first time
15:29 moritz_ diakopter: lazynes != JIT
15:29 diakopter I didn't say ==; I said analogous.
15:31 moritz_ the big difference is that JIT speeds up every execution, whereas lazyness only speeds up one
15:31 vixey joined #Perl6
15:31 Limbic_Region lazy not necessarily equal to late binding either - but we sometimes use them as synonyms
15:33 diakopter moritz_: I guess I'm not seeing how yap6's parser generators aren't analogous to JIT, since they are both lazy and memoized.
15:34 moritz_ diakopter: you're probably right, it's a very high-level JITting
15:34 moritz_ I always associated JIT with bytecode -> machine code
15:34 Limbic_Region because at the low level, JITing is saying - don't execute this byte code - execute this machine code
15:34 moritz_ perhaps that's why I failed to see the connection
15:35 diakopter I suppose it could go a step further and generate each parser as a .pmc which is eval-loaded upon first-demand
15:36 diakopter moritz_: I don't understand why you call Seaton's approach to parsing "wrong"...?
15:36 moritz_ diakopter: not really wrong, just very inefficient
15:38 moritz_ the last compiler I know of that had different startup times mostly died because of it
15:38 diakopter which was that
15:38 moritz_ kp6
15:38 moritz_ the bootstrapped version
15:39 diakopter oh; you meant the last Perl 6 compiler
15:39 moritz_ I don't know any other compiler with similar startup times ;)
15:39 moritz_ even EiffelStudio seemed faster to me
15:39 diakopter I would include gimme5's run duration in STD5's startup time...
15:40 diakopter (since it's STD.pm that you care about, on input)
15:44 diakopter moritz_: I don't understand why you say Seaton's approach is worst-case O(2^n), since all the papers on packrat parsing say that it guarantees linear?
15:46 moritz_ diakopter: I just remeber that he wrote in one of his papers that his parser backtracks to get precedence and associativity right (which sounds very time consuming), and that he had huge speed problems. Maybe I made the wrong connection, but to me that seemed to be the obvious explanation
15:46 diakopter his paper says that it has large startup times
15:47 diakopter which means that it is slow...
15:47 diakopter but doesn't say anything about how it slows with bigger input
15:48 moritz_ well, n is the number of tokens in an expression, not input size
15:48 moritz_ big input doesn't necessarily mean longer expressions
15:49 diakopter of course, but in general, it does.
15:49 diakopter it does mean more tokens, I mean.
15:49 diakopter wait, what is your point?  by "bigger input", of course I meant more tokens....
15:49 pugs_svnbot r21037 | moritz++ | [spec] more fudging in S02-builtin_data_types/ - some if it successful
15:50 moritz_ diakopter: per expression?
15:50 moritz_ diakopter: I'm pretty sure that it won't do a precedence parse of a whole file without sequence points where it stops
15:50 diakopter oh
15:50 diakopter now I fully read your definition of n
15:51 diakopter I haven't seen that definition...
15:52 moritz_ computer scientists don't think in such terms I guess, but it seems to make sense to me
15:53 diakopter I agree; that's an interesting measure
15:54 awwaiid diakopter, yap6 that you're doing is in the pugs svn? what directory? I see pugs/v6/yap6/ but that claims to be SMOP now
15:54 diakopter awwaiid: it's in pugs/misc/yap6
15:55 awwaiid thanks
15:55 diakopter moritz_: after thinking about it a bit, I think the tokens-per-expression omega should correspond to the graphemes-per-input..
15:56 diakopter (because you can have an input with 1 expression)
15:56 moritz_ diakopter: you can, but it's not the typical use case
15:57 diakopter but my point is that that language can have arbitrarily large expressions, and there's nothing in the theory about packrat parsing that indicates that expressions have different parse omegas than series of expressions...?
15:57 moritz_ that would be a wort case. I'm not sure he tried to construct an input string for which his parser took maximal time, to demonstrate that his already-slow software could be even slower ;)
15:57 TimToady when you talk about "startup time" up above, I don't know whether you're talking about typical user-process startup time, or the time necessary to get the bot to say something
15:58 TimToady gimme5 is fair to count in the latter, but not the former
15:58 TimToady it's just part of the "compilation" of STD to STD5
15:58 TimToady which reminds me, I should make a real Makefile for STD5 soonish
15:59 moritz_ diakopter: you're 100% right, I just wanted to tell you that a t(n) (t: time, n: characters) curve isn't sufficient to measure if that parser is O(2^n) or not
15:59 moritz_ unless you first try to find an input string that takes maximal time
16:00 diakopter moritz_: (which would be different per-language, so perhaps some languages have a lot less-concave curve)
16:00 diakopter (or more-concave)
16:01 moritz_ aye
16:01 moritz_ I think it's hard to write large expressions in postscript
16:01 rakudo_svn r28695 | moritz++ | [rakudo] three more test files for spectest_regression
16:08 Grrrr joined #perl6
16:17 iblechbot joined #perl6
16:23 pugs_svnbot r21038 | diakopter++ | [yap6] * more inlined 'manual' memoization because apparently I can't figure out how to use Memoize.pm, or it doesn't work in these nested closures.
16:25 diakopter moritz_: upon further reflection, I don't think it (yap6 and the STD_hand grammar) is using sequence points.  This is due to the nature of the Kleene star, which is inherently right recursive.  at one point I did some thinking about how to rewrite star() so it inlined the recursion, but didn't finish.
16:26 moritz_ diakopter: so you never know if an expression is parsed correctly until you reach end of input?
16:26 moritz_ that would be very bad for handling BEGIN blocks and such
16:27 diakopter no; there still is the notion of ->{fated} in a "Match", but I haven't determined how to annotate patterns in the grammar as such
16:28 diakopter stealing the 'fate' term from STD5 of course
16:28 diakopter or Cursor5
16:31 diakopter b/c how such a sequence point would be implemented in the packrat parsing paradigm is to make an alternating parser detect when a successful result was 'fated', so just return it, instead of continuing with other options.  Obviously such an annotation enabled important/necessary optimization (lack of total wasted effort) opportunities.
16:31 TreyHarris is this right: / ( (\d) { $0 < 256 or fail } ** '.' ) ** 4 / matches an IP address?  is that how you'd combine separator and quantifier **?
16:31 moritz_ TreyHarris: no, it's wrong
16:32 TreyHarris moritz_: and correct would be?
16:32 moritz_ TreyHarris: the inner regex means (0 up to 255) separated by '.'
16:32 TreyHarris (i see how to do it in two rules, i mean in a single one)
16:32 moritz_ and then you do that four times
16:32 TreyHarris oops... i meant (\d+)
16:33 moritz_ (\d+) { $0 < 256 or fail } [ \. (\d+) { $0 < 256 or fail ] ** 3
16:33 TreyHarris and i don't want to capture, so...
16:33 TreyHarris but that's P5-ish... are you saying you can't use separator-** for this purpose?
16:33 moritz_ of course that's a bit ugly, bbecause the (\d+) { $0 < 256 or fail  part is repeated
16:34 moritz_ TreyHarris: you can use it either for delimited or for counted repetition
16:34 TreyHarris moritz_: but not boh.
16:34 moritz_ TreyHarris: I don't see how you can use it for both at the same time
16:34 TreyHarris both
16:34 moritz_ other than  '<delimited> & <repeated>' of course
16:34 diakopter (){} **4** '.'
16:35 moritz_ diakopter: is that valid p6 regex, and dwim?
16:35 diakopter moritz_: no :P I made it up
16:35 TreyHarris ** 4&'.'
16:36 diakopter TreyHarris: but that seems to indicate that there will be 4 of '.', which of course could be decremented internally.. but still
16:37 TreyHarris /'x' ** 4|'.'/ would match x, x.x, x.x, x.x.x... and also xxxx :)
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16:37 [particle] istr a **{...} incantation
16:37 * [particle] checks S05
16:38 moritz_ sorry, I'll be missing #perl6-soc again today
16:38 moritz_ I'll write my report now, probably
16:41 [particle] ah, rats. gotta prep for a concall &
16:42 diakopter 'x' ** 4 ** '.' makes sense to me, because there's no alternative (sane) interpretation.  I mean, if ** is right-associative..
16:42 diakopter eh, I take that back; I guess there is.
16:44 moritz_ ** would be left associative in regexes I guess
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16:51 diakopter actually that would make it chaining, of sorts.
16:52 moritz_ which seems useful to me
16:53 diakopter yeah, me too.  you could have  (\d+) { $0 < 255 } ** 4 ** '.' ** 5 ** ','
16:55 diakopter or  (\d+) { $0 < 255 } ** 4 ** '.' ** 0..63 ** ','      0..63 ip addresses sep by commas
16:57 diakopter or  [**] (\d+) { $0 < 255 }, 4, '.', 0..63, ','
16:58 diakopter that works b/c the quantifier is an implied 1..* when it's a literal, so the explicit quantifier is a modifier of the literal's op.
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17:03 diakopter I don't think so... I was again imagining :D
17:03 moritz_ I think that would be very confusing because people tend not to think about precedence levels in regexes
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17:03 moritz_ and they would be surprised where the boundaries of single tokens are
17:03 moritz_ s/tokens/precedence levels/
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17:22 TimToady wow, brown.freenode.net seems really flakey of late
17:23 TimToady ** in regex is right associative too
17:23 TimToady because the ** rule looks for a quantified atom on its right
17:23 TimToady so you have to use brackets to be left associative, which is probably a feature
17:43 pmichaud pugs:  say (1..5).WHAT
17:43 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[Array␤]
17:43 pmichaud pugs:  say (1..5).pick
17:43 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[1␤]
17:43 pmichaud pugs:  say (1..5).pick
17:43 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[4␤]
17:51 pmichaud pugs:  say (1..5).pick(3)
17:51 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[345␤]
17:51 pmichaud pugs:  say (1..5).pick(3)
17:51 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[234␤]
17:51 pmichaud pugs:  say (1..5).pick(3)
17:51 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[325␤]
17:51 pmichaud pugs:  say (1..5).pick(7)
17:51 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[53124␤]
17:51 moritz_ pugs: say (1..5).pick(*)
17:51 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[12435␤]
17:52 pmichaud should pick/grep/cat/keys/kv/pairs/values be methods of the Positional role?
17:53 pmichaud or should Range and List each provide their own methods for these?
17:53 pmichaud or is there some relation between Range and List that I'm unaware of?
17:54 moritz_ I think that implementing a iterator should be enough for grep and cat, for example
17:54 pmichaud moritz:  what about   (1..5).grep    ... ?
17:54 pmichaud (1..5).grep would imply a 'grep' method on Range objects
17:55 TimToady grep only requires an iterator for its input, since it's lazy, I think
17:55 pmichaud I'm asking more about dispatch
17:55 pmichaud how does (1..5).grep get dispatched
17:55 moritz_ having a common role for such things (Positional and Iteratable) could solve some trouble
17:55 pmichaud or (1..5).pick
17:55 TimToady grep is probably one of those methods that is forced to mean the same thing everywhere via Any
17:56 pmichaud okay.
17:56 pmichaud that works for me.
17:56 TimToady like join
17:56 pmichaud thanks.
17:56 moritz_ should I update S29 to add Any multis?
17:56 TimToady then the Any implementation really decides which class or role it really uses
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17:57 TimToady moritz_: don't see much harm in it
17:57 TimToady (they aren't multis, they're just methods)
17:57 TimToady (of Any)
17:57 TimToady single dispatch
17:58 TimToady no magical syntax right now, just Prelude defining methods in Any that refer to the real class/role
18:00 pmichaud TimToady++  # simple implementations :-)
18:00 pmichaud I'll update Rakudo to match also.
18:00 pugs_svnbot r21039 | diakopter++ | [yap6] \o/ successfully converted plus()/star() to iterative instead of recursive.  speed/memory improvements ensue.
18:01 * moritz_ somhow still doesn't like the idea - why should the List methods be so special that they are anchored in Any, and many others aren't?
18:04 TimToady because they're defined by the language
18:05 [particle] pugs: 1.pick
18:05 p6eval pugs: OUTPUT[*** pick not defined: VInt 1␤    at /tmp/9ESTHIbncN line 1, column 1 - line 2, column 1␤]
18:05 TimToady they're as close to "built-ins" as p6 gets
18:09 pugs_svnbot r21040 | diakopter++ | [yap6] eliminated unnecessary deep_copy
18:51 spinclad .oO {   <ipoctet> ** '.' :n(4)     <ipoctet> ** 4 :sep<.>    <ipoctet> ** ('.' but 4)   }
18:52 * spinclad wonders, am i netsplit?
18:52 diakopter if you are, it's w/ me
18:53 spinclad just hadn't seen any talk for 40 minutes
18:53 spinclad (thought it a bit anomalous)
18:55 spinclad re **, i think something like the above is needed: i see only one repetition operation, with both a separator and quantifier.
18:56 spinclad but it doesn't fit in the regex sublanguage well.
18:57 TimToady we're just all off hacking in another window...
18:58 spinclad if #parrot, i'm still backlagged there
19:00 pugs_svnbot r21041 | lwall++ | [perl6] add Makefile
19:00 pugs_svnbot r21041 | lwall++ | [STD etc.] memoization via lang-specific positional array of memos
19:00 pugs_svnbot r21041 | lwall++ | [STD] the ws_* attributes are now gone
19:00 pugs_svnbot r21041 | lwall++ | [Cursor5] much cleanup of match tree
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19:01 TimToady (not real memoization, just position-specific data)
19:01 Auzon perl6: package A {our $B = 42;}; say $A::B;
19:02 p6eval elf 21041: OUTPUT[42␤]
19:02 p6eval ..kp6 21041: OUTPUT[no method 'APPLY' in Class 'Undef'␤ at compiled/perl5-kp6-mp6/lib/Ki​ndaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 345␤     ]
19:02 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[␤]
19:02 p6eval ..rakudo 28687: OUTPUT["load_bytecode" couldn't find file 'PGE.pbc'␤current instr.: 'parrot;Grammar;onload' pc 8434 (src/gen_builtins.pir:5462)␤]
19:02 spinclad (re doesn't fit regex sublang): i take it back, i see :adverbs used in regexes...
19:03 TimToady but in general adverbs are used in regexen to modify what's coming, not what came before
19:03 spinclad (at least free-floating at the start of a bracket-group; what do those attach to?)
19:03 spinclad yeah
19:04 spinclad so quite different from the main language
19:04 TimToady except see also s:g:i/.../ for instance
19:04 TimToady it's in front there too
19:05 spinclad i see those as still in the main language, applying to the 's'
19:05 TimToady the adverbs on operators only works that way because there's no other place to look for them.
19:05 spinclad could they possibly be made to work the same in regexes?
19:06 TimToady don't wanna
19:06 spinclad good nuff
19:06 spinclad (but WHY???)
19:07 TimToady because it's often better if adverbs can come before the thing they modify, just because you read left-to-right
19:08 diakopter ... grammar RTLPerl { ...
19:08 TimToady that's why s///g turned into s:g///
19:08 spinclad grammar BiDiPerl
19:09 TimToady it's particularly necessary for an adverb like :lang to come before the language it switches to
19:09 spinclad well, yes, especially if the modifier modifies prior parsing
19:09 spinclad yes
19:09 TimToady 1..10:by(2) doesn't have to modify the parse of ..
19:10 TimToady and it's relatively close by (usually)
19:10 spinclad i don't quite see that applying to ** though, it's not modifying its parse either
19:10 spinclad so similar to ..
19:12 spinclad and i'm starting to think of ** as :($left, :$n, :$sep) or some such
19:12 spinclad (if i'm not mangling the syntax too grossly)
19:13 spinclad anyway, made my case, your call
19:14 TimToady you're not the first person to ask for combining sep and counting, actually
19:14 TimToady will think about it s'more
19:15 spinclad TreyHarris earlier today, even
19:15 diakopter zounds
19:15 spinclad and diakopter
19:15 spinclad and now me
19:16 spinclad with pitchforks
19:16 spinclad and torches
19:17 diakopter TimToady: see above for my idea about making the chaining behavior do a composition instead of two applications...
19:19 diakopter zounds: caching of the heretofore AST results constitutes 96% of the yap6 processing time. hrm :/
19:19 diakopter er, theretofore
19:21 diakopter (multiplies time by 25)
19:22 TimToady actually, Morris Siegel beat you all to it.  :)
19:24 diakopter 25x is enough to warrant adding a 2nd pass (to build the ast) upon reaching an ltm-stopper or end-of-input...
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19:47 mst where does pugs svn live now?
19:47 * mst wanted to poke at STD5.pm
19:47 Auzon http://svn.pugscode.org/pugs/
19:48 [particle] std5 is under src/perl6/
19:48 mst right.
19:48 mst thanks very much all
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19:54 diakopter oooo  (continued from above) ... and during that special-mode second pass, the parsing tree would be fated forward (down into the tree as opposed to in reverse)
20:01 [particle] i'm going to be late for the phone call
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20:42 moritz_ re
20:54 pugs_svnbot r21042 | lwall++ | [Cursor5] didn't propagate memo array correctly
20:54 pugs_svnbot r21042 | lwall++ | [STD] list and chain operators also want deadwood removed
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21:01 diakopter moritz_: you're still awake? :)
21:02 moritz_ diakopter: yes
21:04 moritz_ diakopter: it's 11pm here, and still too warm to sleep
21:04 moritz_ and know that the football match is over (Germany won btw) I can enjoy life again ;)
21:06 moritz_ s/know/now/
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21:20 gbacon where is the source for svnbot?
21:22 diakopter gbacon: it's under examples/network
21:22 diakopter iirc
21:22 diakopter yes
21:22 diakopter it's in Perl 6
21:23 Auzon actually, I don't think the source is in the repo
21:23 moritz_ some of the svn bots here (rakudo_svn most notably) is in perl5, using SVN::Log and Bot::BasicBot
21:24 moritz_ (and specbot is the same perl 5 based thingy)
21:25 diakopter Auzon: yeah it is...
21:25 diakopter examples/network/svnbot.pl
21:25 diakopter pugs_svnbot
21:25 diakopter er
21:25 Auzon That's not what's running here
21:26 diakopter oh.  it was a couple of months ago
21:26 moritz_ Auzon: I thnk pugs_svnbot is powered by examples/network/svnbot.pl, and running on feather
21:26 moritz_ (timtowtdi.org hosts only two svn bots atm)
21:27 diakopter whew; I'm not crazy
21:27 Auzon I only see one running on timtowtdi.org...
21:28 * moritz_ sees two. /me wins ;-)
21:28 moritz_ one is the specbot, don't know what its nick is ;)
21:29 diakopter perlbot: what do you do
21:29 moritz_ and with scarce 117 nicks in here I'm not too fond on figuring out which one it is ;)
21:29 diakopter buubot: how many bots are you
21:29 buubot diakopter: Stored how many bots
21:30 Auzon I thought it was speckbot, but I don't see it. and a 'ps -A | grep svnbot' only returned one
21:30 moritz_ Auzon: btw if you want to change something in p6eval's env, it's now in /newchroot, not /chroot anymore
21:30 Auzon ok
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21:31 diakopter there it is
21:31 moritz_ speckbot, there you go
21:32 moritz_ only the svn bots are in the old chroot
21:32 * diakopter 's not looking forward to refactoring yap6's parser() again for two-passes
21:32 Auzon moritz_: Any objections to me moving the up to date tests in t/packages to t/spec/S10-packages?
21:32 moritz_ I should clean up the rest to avoid confusion
21:32 Auzon moritz_: we could commit the svnbot code to the pugs repo if you want
21:32 moritz_ Auzon: re moving, do as you want
21:33 moritz_ Auzon: re svnbot code, I wouldn't mind, but perhaps we should change the hardcoded configuration first ;)
21:33 Auzon yeah, I was thinking that we could generalize it
21:34 moritz_ shouldn't be too hard
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21:55 pugs_svnbot r21043 | moritz++ | [spec] rand.t: unfudged one test, changed fudge message of other
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22:14 Auzon perl6: my $hyphen-name = 5; say $hyphen-name;
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22:14 p6eval elf 21043: OUTPUT[Useless use of subtraction (-) in void context at (eval 123) line 3.␤Undefined subroutine &GLOBAL::prefix__61 called at (eval 123) line 3.␤ at ./elf_f line 3854␤]
22:14 p6eval ..kp6 21043: OUTPUT[no method 'APPLY' in Class 'Undef'␤ at compiled/perl5-kp6-mp6/lib/Ki​ndaPerl6/Runtime/Perl5/MOP.pm line 345␤     ]
22:14 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[*** No such subroutine: "&name"␤    at /tmp/83mHeZFOzx line 1, column 1-20␤]
22:14 p6eval ..rakudo 28687: OUTPUT[get_iter() not implemented in class 'Integer'␤current instr.: 'prefix:=' pc 11123 (src/gen_builtins.pir:7336)␤]
22:15 Auzon I'm guessing that only \w is allowed as a variable or package name without being quoted.
22:16 moritz_ yes
22:16 moritz_ but IMHO - is just more readable as a word separator
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22:17 Auzon I really have no preference, but this means I have to quote the package tests for S10 if I move them
22:17 moritz_ or use CamelCase
22:20 Auzon it does 'use t::packages::FileName' which would translate to 'use t::spec::S10-packages::FileName' which isn't allowed. I'm trying to think of ways around this.
22:22 moritz_ hurm
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22:22 Auzon an equivalent to 'use lib' would get around this nicely.
22:22 moritz_ yes
22:22 moritz_ or a t/spec/modules/ or some such
22:25 diakopter offline for 9 days&
22:25 Auzon see you, diakopter.
22:25 moritz_ have fun, and see you diakopter ;)
22:33 rakudo_svn r28698 | bernhard++ | Remove trailing space.
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23:07 pugs_svnbot r21044 | dolmen++ | Moving range.t with built-ins datatypes.
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23:19 pugs_svnbot r21045 | gbacon++ | Make svnbot.pl run with pugs v6.2.13.5.
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23:43 dolmen rakudo: say (3 == 1..5).perl
23:43 p6eval rakudo 28687: OUTPUT[get_number() not implemented in class 'Range'␤current instr.: 'infix:==' pc 8852 (src/gen_builtins.pir:5763)␤]
23:44 dolmen perl5: say (3 == 1..5).perl
23:44 dolmen perl6: say (3 == 1..5).perl
23:44 p6eval elf 21045: OUTPUT[␤]
23:44 p6eval ..kp6 21045: OUTPUT[syntax error at position 4, line 1 column 4:␤say (3 == 1..5).per␤    ^ HERE␤]
23:44 p6eval ..pugs: OUTPUT[Bool::False␤]
23:44 p6eval ..rakudo 28687: OUTPUT[get_number() not implemented in class 'Range'␤current instr.: 'infix:==' pc 8852 (src/gen_builtins.pir:5763)␤]
23:49 pugs_svnbot r21046 | dolmen++ | More ranges tests.
23:56 bacek joined #perl6

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