Perl 6 - the future is here, just unevenly distributed

IRC log for #perl6, 2008-07-20

Perl 6 | Reference Documentation | Rakudo

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All times shown according to UTC.

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01:41 Auzon rakudo: say 1.true
01:41 p6eval rakudo 29623: OUTPUT[1␤]
01:41 Auzon rakudo: say 0.true
01:41 p6eval rakudo 29623: OUTPUT[0␤]
01:52 pugs_svn r21400 | Auzon++ | [gsoc_spectest] moved given.t to spec/, cleaned up syntax, fudged for rakudo.
01:53 Auzon rakudo committers: t/spec/S04-statements/given.t is ready for spectest_regression:
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03:20 pugs_svn r21401 | lwall++ | [STD] successfully parses heredocs and trims leading whitespace.
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05:04 pugs_svn r21402 | lwall++ | [STD] list all expectations, not just ones matching first letter
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05:43 TimToady STD successfuly parses about 2/30 of t/spec
05:44 TimToady *2/3
05:49 pugs_svn r21403 | lwall++ | [kv.t] must have space before -> and {
05:49 Auzon TimToady++: Very impressive!
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05:50 Auzon How do you convince STD.pm to check it?
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06:57 pugs_svn r21404 | lwall++ | [teststd] program to run STD over t/spec
07:12 pugs_svn r21405 | lwall++ | [Cursor] short circuit some () returns
07:12 pugs_svn r21405 | lwall++ | [next.t] fix some malformed for loops
07:18 pugs_svn r21406 | lwall++ | [ord_and_chr.t] some malformed double-quoted strings
07:30 pugs_svn r21407 | lwall++ | three more malformed tests spotted by STD
07:30 pugs_svn r21407 | lwall++ | (remember that if() and for() are function calls!)
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10:22 pugs_svn r21408 | fglock++ | [v6.pm] implemented string interpolations \x[99] and \c[FOUR TEARDROP-SPOKED ASTERISK]
10:26 pmurias v6: say 4
10:26 pmurias moritz_: we don't have v6.pm in the evalbot?
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11:00 pmurias (lex poisoning)--
11:08 pugs_svn r21409 | pmurias++ | [pixie] code vanishing protection
11:09 pugs_svn r21410 | pmurias++ | [STD5_dump_match] added an option to mark arrays with a circumfix []
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11:14 pugs_svn r21411 | pmurias++ | [smop]
11:14 pugs_svn r21411 | pmurias++ | s1p handles integers and multiple parameters now
11:14 pugs_svn r21411 | pmurias++ | + SMOP__S1P__Array_create()
11:14 pugs_svn r21411 | pmurias++ | + Str.perl
11:14 pmurias is adding a use v6; to switch to perl6 in C a sane idea?
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11:23 pmurias is there a p6 C grammar somewhere?
11:26 pugs_svn r21412 | pmurias++ | [elf] converted the elf AST description into perl6
11:32 pugs_svn r21413 | pmurias++ | fixed teststd to work on systems without . in $PATCH
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13:43 pugs_svn r21414 | pmurias++ | [teststd] added use strict
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13:48 pugs_svn r21415 | rhr++ | [ord_and_chr.t] typo - '{' is 123
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14:14 pmurias TimToady: i'm trying to inline tryfile into teststd (wraping it in eval), so far i have found problems with $::HIGHWATER and $::HIGHEXPECT, but when even when resetting them manualy the subsequent parses don't work
14:15 pmurias are you aware of things which might be causing that?
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14:41 TimToady pmurias: well, anything declared our that isn't re-initialized in either Cursor.pm or STD.pmc
14:41 TimToady also, anything declared my at file scope
14:41 TimToady (that isn't functioning as constant)
14:42 TimToady in theory %lexers could get poisoned, but it shouldn't happen
14:42 TimToady it's most likely one ours at the front of STD.pmc
14:43 TimToady s/on/one of the/
14:43 TimToady gah, can't tipe this morning
14:44 TimToady (will be afk for a couple days starting in an hour or so)
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15:02 pmurias TimToady: the lex/ directory gets poisoned often
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15:15 pmurias i'll check all globals (not only directly in main::) and lexicals than
15:20 lumi joined #perl6
15:25 pmurias * then
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15:49 TimToady lex/ poisoning would affect separate tests as well
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15:51 TimToady it's only semantic changes to STD and Cursor that can affect lex/; otherwise it's immutable data
15:51 TimToady 'k, heading out for OSCON now...
15:55 TimToady bbl &
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16:45 pugs_svn r21416 | fglock++ | fixed char class with spaces
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18:29 pugs_svn r21417 | Auzon++ | [gsoc_spectest] testing that block eval is not implemented. also cleaned up eval.t. (added 1 test)
18:38 pugs_svn r21418 | fglock++ | [PCR] unicode fixes
18:39 pmurias fgl
18:39 pmurias sorry
18:39 Auzon pmurias: Are you a rakudo committer?
18:41 pmurias Auzon: no
18:41 pmurias i'm not even a rakuo harcker
18:41 pmurias * rakudo hacker
18:42 Auzon ah, ok
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18:47 rindolf Hi all.
18:48 Auzon Hi.
18:49 pugs_svn r21419 | fglock++ | [v6.pm] version 0.022  # 827 tests pass
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18:53 pmurias rindolf: hi
18:53 rindolf Hi Auzon , pmurias
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18:57 pmurias rindolf: want to do some perl6 hacking or looking for casual discussion?
18:57 rindolf pmurias: just discussion.
18:58 rindolf pmurias: still didn't really start with Tucan or Spark.
18:58 rindolf pmurias: email to @perl.org works now.
18:58 rindolf There was an email I wanted to write.
18:58 rindolf Should I blog about the OSDClub "puts ruby" meeting on use.perl.org?
18:59 rindolf OSDClub Tel Aviv == Tel Aviv Linux Club + Perl-IL etc.
18:59 pmurias "puts ruby" = ?
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19:05 * rindolf is watching the Gilmore Girls.
19:05 rindolf 4th Season.
19:05 rindolf pmurias: a presentation about Ruby.
19:05 rindolf By ik_5
19:05 * pmurias dosn't watch tv
19:06 pmurias * doesn't
19:08 pmurias rindolf: why is it called "puts ruby"?
19:08 rindolf pmurias: it's from torrent.
19:08 rindolf pmurias: because puts is like say in Ruby.
19:08 rindolf I think.
19:08 pugs_svn r21420 | fglock++ | [PCR] unicode fix
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19:13 pmurias real time html rendering while editing code in firebug is cool
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20:03 pmurias what is the recommended way to ask for an AST review?
20:06 pmurias should i mail p6-compiler, it seems to contain mostly rakudo patches and bug reports
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20:16 pmurias nothingmuch: should the metainformation for an object be stored using a special API provided by the object representation or is it dependend on the metaclass and should be stored using the API for normal attributes?
20:18 nothingmuch what kind of meta information?
20:19 pmurias nothingmuch: the methods an object has
20:19 nothingmuch that's altering the metaclass
20:19 nothingmuch it has it's own API
20:19 nothingmuch its
20:20 nothingmuch or if you're editing the object's proto
20:20 nothingmuch then it's still the same metaclass api
20:20 pmurias hm
20:20 nothingmuch it isn't the representation though
20:20 pmurias and in prototype based oo?
20:21 nothingmuch the best answer I have for that is "it depends"
20:21 nothingmuch but technically I would say since the meta and the repr and the object in prototype oo *can* be different in the pure sense
20:21 nothingmuch then still not the same
20:21 nothingmuch by different I mean it might be the same data, the same object, but a different responder
20:22 pmurias ruoso sketch the api like this http://www.perlfoundation.org/perl6/index.cgi?smop_oo_api
20:22 lambdabot Title: SMOP OO API / Perl 6
20:22 pmurias * sketched
20:22 nothingmuch yeah
20:22 nothingmuch note the '^'
20:22 nothingmuch this denotes it is a meta call
20:23 nothingmuch also, this is specific to perl 6 prototype OO
20:23 nothingmuch it's useful as a base API
20:23 pmurias the ^! is an object representation call
20:23 nothingmuch but for some models it doesn't make sense
20:23 nothingmuch in SMOP land repr is the meta
20:24 nothingmuch if your question was about some hypothetical object viewable from perl 6 then the answer is that they may be different
20:24 nothingmuch if you're asking about SMOP, check with ruoso but in general meta calls are made on the repr
20:24 pmurias i was asking because i want to implement this
20:25 nothingmuch implement where?
20:25 pmurias in SMOP ;)
20:25 nothingmuch oh
20:25 nothingmuch definitely ask ruoso
20:25 nothingmuch i'm not your guy =
20:25 nothingmuch =)
20:27 pmurias i just want to know what you think
20:27 nothingmuch IIRC i agreed with ruoso
20:27 nothingmuch but I'm not fully up to date on the model
20:28 nothingmuch i don't know if it diverged since the PTP
20:28 nothingmuch W
20:29 pmurias what do you mean by the meta in "in SMOP land repr is the meta"
20:29 pmurias the metaobject instance is different from the object representation
20:30 nothingmuch i meant that all meta calls are goverened by the repr IIRC
20:30 nothingmuch the confusing bit is that we use 'meta' to mean one of two things
20:30 nothingmuch well, one of like 432 things
20:31 nothingmuch but mainly it's either the instance of the metaclass, or the concept of what governs the object's interface
20:31 nothingmuch i meant the second in this case
20:31 nothingmuch i hope that clarifies instead of confuses ;-)
20:32 pmurias it mostly generalised ;)
20:32 nothingmuch at any rate, conceptually the representation type and the object interface stuff don't need to be the same
20:32 pmurias there are 3 things which govern the interface the RI,the repr and the metaclass instance
20:32 nothingmuch typically the representation is a product of the meta stuf
20:33 nothingmuch define govern ;-)
20:33 nothingmuch as I see it there is only one:
20:33 pmurias influence
20:33 nothingmuch at runtime it's the RI
20:33 nothingmuch at compile time it's the meta class instance, for creating the repr and the RI
20:33 nothingmuch and the repr kinda ties the knot
20:34 pmurias different the way the ruoso's previous attempt in smop tried to do it
20:34 nothingmuch well, again, i'm not 100% up to date
20:34 pmurias the metaclass instance is also used in the runtime
20:34 nothingmuch that's the RIs business though
20:35 nothingmuch nobody except the RI knows that the RI is delegating to the metaclass
20:35 nothingmuch so on the outside looking in only the RI is responsible
20:36 pmurias aren't the object representations supposed to be indistinguishable from the outside?
20:36 nothingmuch at some point the RI has to be consulted
20:37 nothingmuch the repr is kind of a meta meta
20:37 nothingmuch since it contains enough info to locate the RI
20:37 nothingmuch or maybe I'm being confused
20:37 nothingmuch anyway, i'm sorry but I have to get back to $real_work, and my brain is not fully functional today
20:37 nothingmuch so I can't multitask
20:37 nothingmuch hunt down ruoso, he'll be much more helpful
20:38 pmurias i would have to track him down ;)
20:38 pmurias i anybody else responsible for the meta stuff?
20:39 nothingmuch i dunnop
20:39 nothingmuch i only ever discussed this stuff with ruoso/audreyt/TimToady to my recollection
20:39 nothingmuch i'm pretty out of the loop
20:40 pmurias i'll implement it the way i would like it to be than ;)
20:41 nothingmuch at any rate run it by ruoso
20:41 pmurias ok
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21:35 * zamanfou is now away: In the rain my tears are forever lost.
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